Meaning when single word is set off by quotation marks?

[Richard Owlett]

In a recent personal(informal) email I wrote:
It wasn't considered "kosher".

I thought that putting "kosher" in quotation marks would
indicate that my usage figurative rather than literal. My
recipient didn't see that at all even though neither of us
have any Jewish heritage.

I'm wondering if this particular instance may be more about
our differing linguistic backgrounds. I didn't realize just
how much Yiddish I was familiar with until I moved to rural
SW Missouri after growing up in urban Upstate New York. My
parents had lived/worked in NYC in the 1920's and 30's. My
correspondent had grown up in rural Vermont.

TIA

[Don Phillipson]

"Richard Owlett" <row...@pcnetinc.com> wrote in message
news:AtadnVLQw97K5h3T...@supernews.com...

> In a recent personal(informal) email I wrote:
> It wasn't considered "kosher".
>
> I thought that putting "kosher" in quotation marks would indicate that my
> usage figurative rather than literal.

This intuition is not standard (i.e. is not recommended in manuals
of style etc.) If we want to say something is unfair, we do not write:
"The Conrad Black prosecution is "not cricket." We write simply
"The Conrad Black prosecution is not cricket." We do not need
quotation marks to document that this is a figure of speech.

Whatever its roots or route into English, kosher entered the
language as a synonym for authentic several decades ago.
Secondly, although we know the word was borrowed from
Yiddish or Hebrew ritual language, its function in English
is not figurative. It is simply an extra synonym for authentic.

An extra problem is superadded by the late 20th century fashion
for using quotation marks to indicate either emphasis or disbelief.
In other words, if we put kosher within quotation marks we risk
naive readers' supposing disbelief is imputed.
--
Don Phillipson
Carlsbad Springs
(Ottawa, Canada)

[Richard Owlett]

Thank you. Guess I'm going to have to eat some crow.

[Joel Olson]

"Richard Owlett" <row...@pcnetinc.com> wrote in message

news:EI2dnU02HJxQjRzT...@supernews.com...

So what's the difference between "kosher" and 'kosher',
for arbitrary values of kosher?

[Frederick Williams]

Richard Owlett wrote:

>
> Thank you. Guess I'm going to have to eat some crow.

Prepared according to halakha?

--
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by
this sign, that the dunces are all in confederacy against him.
Jonathan Swift: Thoughts on Various Subjects, Moral and Diverting

[Daniel James]

In article <AtadnVLQw97K5h3T...@supernews.com>, Richard

Owlett wrote:
> I thought that putting "kosher" in quotation marks would
> indicate that my usage figurative rather than literal.

In most contexts I would not have thought that you needed to signpost
non-literal usage of the word kosher, but if you do feel that need then
I would say that placing quote marks around it is the way to do it.

> My recipient didn't see that at all even though neither of us
> have any Jewish heritage.

It might help if you told us how your recipient did understand your use
of those quotation marks.

Cheers,
Daniel.

[Richard Owlett]

Her response was "You are not Jewish. That term is
meaningless." She ignored
the quotation marks completely.

For context - being from a mainline Protestant denomination,
growing up in
urban Upstate New York, later working in NYC and Boston I
was always in some
contact with some aspects of Jewish culture. In my 40's I
opted to spend a
couple of years at a small Bible college in the Buckle of
the Bible Belt. Now,
20 years further on, she had asked if I'd seen any good
movies lately.
My response was:
No, when I first came down here it wasn't considered
"kosher". Afterwards the ads never attracted my
interest.
I thought I saw a distinct parallel between the idea of
keeping kosher and
the time I had spent following the explicit and implicit
rules of a
specific community.

[Bill McCray]

Probably the difference is whether it is British or American kosher.

Bill in Kentucky

[Ian Jackson]

In message <npmdnQMIIP0Msx_T...@earthlink.com>, Bill McCray
<billm...@mindspring.com> writes

BrE "kosher" was "pukka". These days, I doubt if anyone not of Indian
origin would ever have heard of the word.
--
Ian

[Daniel James]

In article <4uudnZWn-5zFcBzT...@supernews.com>, Richard

Owlett wrote:
> Her response was "You are not Jewish. That term is
> meaningless." She ignored the quotation marks completely.

Ah ... so the issue goes beyond the use of quotation marks and into the
heart of the non-literal usage of the word "kosher" itself.

[Note that I use quotation marks in that last sentence (and here)
around "kosher" to show that that's the word I'm discussing, not as any
indication of a non-literal meaning.]

> ... she had asked if I'd seen any good movies lately.

> My response was:
> No, when I first came down here it wasn't considered
> "kosher". Afterwards the ads never attracted my interest.
> I thought I saw a distinct parallel between the idea of keeping
> kosher and the time I had spent following the explicit and
> implicit rules of a specific community.

I don't think I'd have bothered with quote marks in that context ...
but they're certainly not wrong. They're not your problem, though, the
person you're dealing with evidently doesn't understand that "kosher"
could have any useful meaning other than the original and specifically
Jewish one.

I wonder how she would have responded to "pukka"?

Cheers,
Daniel.

[Richard Owlett]

Actually the problem would be reversed as she worked
regularly with Indians and I've known only a few lifetime.

[Peter Duncanson (BrE)]

??

Just to be clear, are you saying that only those of Indian origin would
have heard of "pukka" these days?

The word was much used by TV chef Jamie Oliver.
He has even used it in the name of a fruit dessert:
http://www.jamieoliver.com/recipes/fruit-recipes/pukka-pineapple-with-bashed-up-mint-suga

pukka pineapple with bashed-up mint sugar

Two months ago:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/david-cameron/8672699/David-Camerons-pukka-holiday-at-Jamie-Olivers-Tuscan-retreat.html

David Cameron's 'pukka' holiday at Jamie Oliver's Tuscan retreat

"pukka" is an English word derived from Panjabi and Hindi.

Apart from its uses in South Asia or South Asian contexts it also has
the sense:

Brit. slang. Excellent, superb; 'cool'.

1991 Sun 13 June 23/6 Hey, man, that shirt's pukka.
1996 Observer 5 May (Review Suppl.) 7/6 Girls mug girls for
jewellery or pukka clothes.
2002 C. Newland Snakeskin xix. 255 'Yuh mum's pukka,' Davey
chimed in, with so much passion I knew he wasn't just being
polite.

From a Dictionary of [British] Slang:
http://www.peevish.co.uk/slang/p.htm

pukka
Adj. Excellent, wonderful. Derived from the s.e. [standard English]
use of pukka, meaning genuine, and in itself derived from the Hindi
pakka, meaning thorough or substantial.

From a collection of London Slang:
http://www.londonslang.com/db/p/

pukka - means 'authentic' or 'first-rate'. Originates from the Hindi
word 'pakka' meaning 'substantial'. This word was originally used in
the Indian colonies.

There may be a reaction to Jamie Oliver's overuse of the word, but it is
still in use.

It is used in the names of business, many of which have no South Asian
connection.

There is an interior designer here in Northern Ireland who trades as
Pukka Interiors:
http://www.pukkainteriors.com/

Pukka Party Planners is based in Manchester:
http://www.pukkapartyplanners.co.uk/

(Note to chocaholic TV viewers: their chocolate fountain has been seen
on TV.)

Pukka Signs Ltd. makes estate agents' boards:
http://www.pukka.uk.com/pukka/corexboards/

Country Products supplies food storage containers named Pukka Pots:
http://www.countryproducts.co.uk/pukka-pots/

An alternative to Post-it notes is Pukka Notes:
http://www.opi.net/file/92829/pukka-notes.html

--
Peter Duncanson, UK
(in alt.english.usage)

[tony cooper]

On Wed, 28 Sep 2011 12:57:25 +0100, "Peter Duncanson (BrE)"
<ma...@peterduncanson.net> wrote:

>Just to be clear, are you saying that only those of Indian origin would
>have heard of "pukka" these days?
>
>The word was much used by TV chef Jamie Oliver.
>He has even used it in the name of a fruit dessert:

This American is quite familiar with "pukka", but hasn't the foggiest
idea of who Jamie Oliver is other than he is a "TV chef" according to
this posting.

Is Oliver as annoying as Peter Brookes?



--
Tony Cooper - Orlando, Florida

[Peter Duncanson (BrE)]

On Wed, 28 Sep 2011 08:26:20 -0400, tony cooper
<tony_co...@earthlink.net> wrote:

>On Wed, 28 Sep 2011 12:57:25 +0100, "Peter Duncanson (BrE)"
><ma...@peterduncanson.net> wrote:
>
>>Just to be clear, are you saying that only those of Indian origin would
>>have heard of "pukka" these days?
>>
>>The word was much used by TV chef Jamie Oliver.
>>He has even used it in the name of a fruit dessert:
>
>This American is quite familiar with "pukka", but hasn't the foggiest
>idea of who Jamie Oliver is other than he is a "TV chef" according to
>this posting.
>

You lucky man!

He is a campaigning TV chef. He wants to inprove the food served in
schools.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jamie_Oliver

Having started in the UK he has invaded your great country:

Jamie Oliver's Food Revolution was a series that aired during 2010
and 2011 on ABC in the United States. In the first season, Oliver
visited Huntington, West Virginia, statistically one of the
unhealthiest cities in the USA to try to improve its residents'
eating habits. In 2010, the show won an Emmy for Outstanding Reality
Programme. In the second season Oliver visited Los Angeles,
California where his crusade to change school meals was met with
resistance. Oliver was ultimately barred from filming at any Los
Angeles public school. The show's cancellation was announced by ABC
in May 2011, two weeks before the final episode of the season had
aired. The program also aired in the United Kingdom on Channel 4
under the title "Jamie's American Food Revolution," and in Australia
on Channel 10 under the original title.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jamie_Oliver%27s_Food_Revolution

>Is Oliver as annoying as Peter Brookes?

I've never seen Peter Brookes on TV.

[Joel Olson]

"Bill McCray" <billm...@mindspring.com> wrote in message
news:npmdnQMIIP0Msx_T...@earthlink.com...

The question was about the quote marks. To me, "..." is likely to be
a direct quote; '...' may mean arch emphasis.