Those vile canards
chrissy
most here will know that in English usage a "canard" is a false and
typically scurrilous story, but from exactly when does this usage
date? Why was it considered at all?
Just curious, as the English nusage section of bartleby seems not to
mention it.
cheers
chrissy
Dena Jo
> Those of us who are familiar with french know of canards as ducks,
> and most here will know that in English usage a "canard" is a
> false and typically scurrilous story, but from exactly when does
> this usage date?
According to M-W Online, from 1851.
Main Entry: ca·nard
Pronunciation: k-närd also -när
Function: noun
Etymology: French, literally, duck; in sense 1, from Middle French
vendre des canards à moitié to cheat, literally, to half-sell ducks
Date: 1851
1 a : a false or unfounded report or story; especially : a fabricated
report b : a groundless rumor or belief
2 : an airplane with horizontal stabilizing and control surfaces in
front of supporting surfaces; also : a small airfoil in front of the
wing of an aircraft that increases the aircraft's stability
--
Dena Jo
Email goes to denajo2 at the dot com variation of the Yahoo domain.
Have I confused you? Go here:
http://myweb.cableone.net/denajo/emailme.htm
meirman
chrissy...@yahoo.com (chrissy) posted:
Nusage is usage with nuance, nu?
>mention it.
>
>cheers
>
>chrissy
s/ meirman If you are emailing me please
say if you are posting the same response.
Born west of Pittsburgh Pa. 10 years
Indianapolis, 7 years
Chicago, 6 years
Brooklyn NY 12 years
Baltimore 20 years
sand
>On 12 Mar 2004, chrissy posted thus:
>
>> Those of us who are familiar with french know of canards as ducks,
>> and most here will know that in English usage a "canard" is a
>> false and typically scurrilous story, but from exactly when does
>> this usage date?
>
>According to M-W Online, from 1851.
>
>
>Main Entry: ca·nard
>Pronunciation: k-närd also -när
>Function: noun
>Etymology: French, literally, duck; in sense 1, from Middle French
>vendre des canards à moitié to cheat, literally, to half-sell ducks
>Date: 1851
>1 a : a false or unfounded report or story; especially : a fabricated
>report b : a groundless rumor or belief
>2 : an airplane with horizontal stabilizing and control surfaces in
>front of supporting surfaces; also : a small airfoil in front of the
>wing of an aircraft that increases the aircraft's stability
As per 2, the US experimental aircraft the Curtiss Ascender had an
interesting pun as a name.
S&
Donna Richoux
> On 12 Mar 2004, chrissy posted thus:
>
> > Those of us who are familiar with french know of canards as ducks,
> > and most here will know that in English usage a "canard" is a
> > false and typically scurrilous story, but from exactly when does
> > this usage date?
>
> According to M-W Online, from 1851.
>
>
> Main Entry: ca·nard
> Pronunciation: k-närd also -när
> Function: noun
> Etymology: French, literally, duck; in sense 1, from Middle French
> vendre des canards à moitié to cheat, literally, to half-sell ducks
> Date: 1851
> 1 a : a false or unfounded report or story; especially : a fabricated
> report b : a groundless rumor or belief
> 2 : an airplane with [snip]
The last time we discussed this, we found it was not clear whether the
French had created that particular journalistic meaning before the
English. They probably did, but it appeared to show up in English
dictionaries before French ones. (Maybe the French ones were more
reluctant to document, and thereby "approve," slang?). See thread:
Subject: Re: Why a Duck?
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Date: 2003-09-12
"Canard" is/was also French slang for a newspaper, in the derogatory
sense of "tabloid" or "fishwrap."
--
Best -- Donna Richoux
Steve Hayes
>Those of us who are familiar with french know of canards as ducks, and
>most here will know that in English usage a "canard" is a false and
>typically scurrilous story, but from exactly when does this usage
>date? Why was it considered at all?
The first time I saw it used was in an electronic conference. One user used it
frequently, and I misunderstood it, because I thought it *was* a duck. Perhaps
that was because he was also given to saying "if it walks like a duck and
quacks like a duck..." I took it to be a metaphor for an old wives' tale.
--
Steve Hayes from Tshwane, South Africa
http://www.geocities.com/Athens/7734/stevesig.htm
E-mail - see web page, or parse: shayes at dunelm full stop org full stop uk
John Dean
Also slang for a sugar lump dipped in coffee or spirits. Which has nothing
to do with our sheep.
But it's also the term for a bum note, musically speaking, which may.
--
John Dean
Oxford
Lars Eighner
In our last episode,
<c2v6kp$7q2$1...@news6.svr.pol.co.uk>,
the lovely and talented John Dean
broadcast on alt.usage.english:
I see. Hence the infamous "bass canard."
--
Lars Eighner -finger for geek code- eig...@io.com http://www.io.com/~eighner/
"The very essence of the creative is its novelty, and hence we have no
standard by which to judge it." --Carl R. Rogers, On Becoming a Person
chrissy
> On 12 Mar 2004, chrissy posted thus:
>
> > Those of us who are familiar with french know of canards as ducks,
> > and most here will know that in English usage a "canard" is a
> > false and typically scurrilous story, but from exactly when does
> > this usage date?
>
> According to M-W Online, from 1851.
>
>
> Main Entry: ca·nard
> Pronunciation: k-närd also -när
> Function: noun
> Etymology: French, literally, duck; in sense 1, from Middle French
> vendre des canards à moitié to cheat, literally, to half-sell ducks
> Date: 1851
> 1 a : a false or unfounded report or story; especially : a fabricated
> report b : a groundless rumor or belief
> 2 : an airplane with horizontal stabilizing and control surfaces in
> front of supporting surfaces; also : a small airfoil in front of the
> wing of an aircraft that increases the aircraft's stability
Thanks "Jane". It's still a bit of a leap thopugh from cheating
someone to a false story, though isn't it? Surely there were some
bridging usages that brought the two together?
cheers
chrissy
chrissy
> In alt.english.usage on 12 Mar 2004 20:45:54 -0800
> chrissy...@yahoo.com (chrissy) posted:
>
> >Those of us who are familiar with french know of canards as ducks, and
> >most here will know that in English usage a "canard" is a false and
> >typically scurrilous story, but from exactly when does this usage
> >date? Why was it considered at all?
> >
> >Just curious, as the English nusage section of bartleby seems not to
>
> Nusage is usage with nuance, nu?
>
Nu, but maybe it should be.
Is this an example of a nusage garnered through serendipity?
chrissy
> On 12 Mar 2004 20:45:54 -0800, chrissy...@yahoo.com (chrissy) wrote:
>
> >Those of us who are familiar with french know of canards as ducks, and
> >most here will know that in English usage a "canard" is a false and
> >typically scurrilous story, but from exactly when does this usage
> >date? Why was it considered at all?
>
> The first time I saw it used was in an electronic conference. One user used it
> frequently, and I misunderstood it, because I thought it *was* a duck. Perhaps
> that was because he was also given to saying "if it walks like a duck and
> quacks like a duck..." I took it to be a metaphor for an old wives' tale.
But that would nearly be the opposite wouldn't it? The "walks like a
duck" formulation is about showing that things that display the
propoerties and attributes of something are tantamount to the thing in
question, whereas the canard refers to stories having some popualr and
superficial plausibility, but which are false and scurrilous.
One might say that just because it walks like a duck doesn't mean it
will fly ...
cheers
Chrissy
John Dean
> meirman <mei...@invalid.com> wrote in message
> news:<kn7550t8p5pofgh92...@4ax.com>...
>> In alt.english.usage on 12 Mar 2004 20:45:54 -0800
>> chrissy...@yahoo.com (chrissy) posted:
>>
>>> Those of us who are familiar with french know of canards as ducks,
>>> and most here will know that in English usage a "canard" is a false
>>> and typically scurrilous story, but from exactly when does this
>>> usage date? Why was it considered at all?
>>>
>>> Just curious, as the English nusage section of bartleby seems not to
>>
>> Nusage is usage with nuance, nu?
>>
>
> Nu, but maybe it should be.
> Is this an example of a nusage garnered through serendipity?
You found it in Sri Lanka?
--
John Dean
Oxford
meirman
chrissy...@yahoo.com (chrissy) posted:
>Re: Those vile canards
Stop maligning ducks.
Christopher Green
I know of two often-repeated, but not very convincing, stories: one,
that it's from a French saying "vendre un canard a moitie" [apologies
for the lack of accent marks], roughly "to half-sell a duck", maybe to
claim to have sold the listener a duck without actually selling him
anything at all. The other, that there was a certain Cornelissen who
minced up one duck and fed it to another, repeating the process until
he exhibited the twenty-first duck under the claim that it had eaten
twenty ducks.
So the idea that there is some tall tale involving a duck behind
"canard" is at least plausible.
--
Chris Green
Donna Richoux
> chrissy...@yahoo.com (chrissy) wrote
> > Dena Jo <m...@privacy.net> wrote
> > > On 12 Mar 2004, chrissy posted thus:
And, to address chrissy's question about a bridge, it seems pretty
plausible to me that if French (or English?) people once said things
like "You're trying to sell me a duck" and "There he goes again, always
trying to half-sell a duck" that the "duck" part would logically get
assigned to the lie or fraud itself. Even if originally it was the whole
saying, not the specific part, that carried that meaning.
There must be other cases where terms, especially informal slangy ones,
came about because they were were part of a longer proverb or saying.
But naturally I can't think of any right now. People saying "Kettle --
pot" is as close as I can come at the moment. That doesn't carry the
same shift in role, though.
Making up an example, suppose the jokey punchline "Drop the other shoe!"
were to be shortened to where "shoe" alone conveyed the idea of "the
long-awaited news, the missing info." It hasn't, yet, although "the
other shoe" has reached that status. "So what's the other shoe?" makes
sense, although "So what's the shoe?" doesn't.
I just reviewed the archives to see what historical info had already
been presented about "canard."
> The Trésor de la langue française informatisé attests from 1584 the
> expression, "bailler un canard à moitié" (to give a duck [to someone]
> half-way), with the meaning "to deceive someone". A similar
> expression, "bailler le lièvre à l'oreille" (to give [someone] a hare
> by the ear) meant (past tense, "bailler" is listed as "archaic" and
> "regional") "to trick someone through false promises".
(Harlan Messinger, sci.lang.translation, 2003)
| The German "Ente" for unreliable statements was already used by
| Luther. Etymologists believe the root for this could be that ducks are
| known to be not very reliable regarding brooding.
(Steffen Buhler, 2003)
> the French use of "canard" to mean
> "cheat" deriving in turn from the Middle French phrase "vendre des
> canards a moitie". No connection with Vaucanson's canard of 1738.
(Chris Malcolm, 1996)
So, so far, we haven't seen a totally complete history of citations.
--
Best - Donna Richoux
CyberCypher
[...]
> So, so far, we haven't seen a totally complete history of
> citations.
Is it possible for something to be "complete" without being "totally
complete"? Seems to me anything less than "totally complete", or
"complete" to say it without being verbose, is "incomplete", ne?
--
Franke: EFL teacher & medical editor.
Daniel James
> It's still a bit of a leap thopugh from cheating
Not really ... in the "selling half a duck" scam [1] the "canard"
isn't the scam, it is the falsehood upon which it is based.
[1] Why can't I shake off the feeling that this probably originated
from a scam in which same duck was sold to two people -- which is
broadly similar to the English "selling a pig in a poke".
The true(TM) origin is, of course, that the victims of such a scam,
on discovering that they had been duped, would traditionally beat
their brows and cry "I canardly believe it!".
Cheers,
Daniel.
Donna Richoux
> tr...@euronet.nl (Donna Richoux) wrote on 14 Mar 2004:
>
> [...]
>
> > So, so far, we haven't seen a totally complete history of
> > citations.
>
> Is it possible for something to be "complete" without being "totally
> complete"? Seems to me anything less than "totally complete", or
> "complete" to say it without being verbose, is "incomplete", ne?
Okay, "totally complete" is the same as "complete." Have your lawyer
call my lawyer.
That's three times lately you've used "verbose." Is there a reason?
--
Puzzled -- Donna Richoux
CyberCypher
> CyberCypher <cybercypher2...@NOSPAM.net> wrote:
>
>> tr...@euronet.nl (Donna Richoux) wrote on 14 Mar 2004:
>>
>> [...]
>>
>> > So, so far, we haven't seen a totally complete history of
>> > citations.
>>
>> Is it possible for something to be "complete" without being
>> "totally complete"? Seems to me anything less than "totally
>> complete", or "complete" to say it without being verbose, is
>> "incomplete", ne?
>
> Okay, "totally complete" is the same as "complete." Have your
> lawyer call my lawyer.
>
> That's three times lately you've used "verbose." Is there a
> reason?
>
I suppose it's because I think you're being unnecessarily and, perhaps,
unforgivably -- well, that might be a bit strong, of course, so I'll
say it in a slightly softer way --- verbose in such a manner that it
warrants comment from the likes of me, or me specifically, whichever
the case may be.
The Grammer Genious
> <...>
> Not really ... in the "selling half a duck" scam [1] the "canard"
Not meaning to start a whole new thing, but I think this topic is a fiasco.
\\P. Schultz
David Berkeley
> tr...@euronet.nl (Donna Richoux) wrote on 14 Mar 2004:
>
> [...]
>
> > So, so far, we haven't seen a totally complete history of
> > citations.
>
> Is it possible for something to be "complete" without being "totally
> complete"? Seems to me anything less than "totally complete", or
> "complete" to say it without being verbose, is "incomplete", ne?
Point taken, but perhaps it's an emphatic. It's a little like the
phrase "A more perfect day one could hardly imagine". Of course
perfection isn't gradeable -- and even the phrase implies this
ultimately. Yet we still choose such phrases in our desire to give
vent to our enthusiasm.
Sometimes it's cliche of course. All those players giving "110%", but
language is as much about feelings as semantic precision. An
expression that suffices may arguably be inferior to one that also
conveys our sentiments.
Berko60
CyberCypher
> CyberCypher <cybercypher2...@NOSPAM.net> wrote in
> message news:<Xns94ACC6A4D...@130.133.1.4>...
>> tr...@euronet.nl (Donna Richoux) wrote on 14 Mar 2004:
>>
>> [...]
>>
>> > So, so far, we haven't seen a totally complete history of
>> > citations.
>>
>> Is it possible for something to be "complete" without being
>> "totally complete"? Seems to me anything less than "totally
>> complete", or "complete" to say it without being verbose, is
>> "incomplete", ne?
>
> Point taken, but perhaps it's an emphatic. It's a little like the
> phrase "A more perfect day one could hardly imagine".
With this I would not argue, of course. The only other way to say it
without the necessary verbosity is "Today is perfect". But that doesn't
convey the emotional content of the original, I agree.
> Of course
> perfection isn't gradeable -- and even the phrase implies this
> ultimately. Yet we still choose such phrases in our desire to give
> vent to our enthusiasm.
>
> Sometimes it's cliche of course. All those players giving "110%",
> but language is as much about feelings as semantic precision. An
> expression that suffices may arguably be inferior to one that also
> conveys our sentiments.
I can't argue with this. We agree on this point. I would, however,
modify the second line to read "but language is often as much about
feelings as semantic precision." I think that's more accurate.
Technical writing can rarely be said to be about feelings.
sand
<cybercypher2...@NOSPAM.net> wrote:
.
>Technical writing can rarely be said to be about feelings.
Nevertheless, a good deal of the technical writing describing computer
software usage frequently does inspire strong feelings.
S&
Skitt
> (chrissy) posted:
>> Re: Those vile canards
>
> Stop maligning ducks.
How else can you get them in a row?
--
Skitt (in Hayward, California)
www.geocities.com/opus731/
J. J. Lodder
> CyberCypher <cybercypher2...@NOSPAM.net> wrote:
>
> > tr...@euronet.nl (Donna Richoux) wrote on 14 Mar 2004:
> >
> > [...]
> >
> > > So, so far, we haven't seen a totally complete history of
> > > citations.
> >
> > Is it possible for something to be "complete" without being "totally
> > complete"? Seems to me anything less than "totally complete", or
> > "complete" to say it without being verbose, is "incomplete", ne?
>
> Okay, "totally complete" is the same as "complete." Have your lawyer
> call my lawyer.
Let him sue the authors of the over 400 hits for
"Almost Totally Complete"
Jan
Don Phillipson
news:f8f1b420.04031...@posting.google.com...
> Those of us who are familiar with french know of canards as ducks, and
> most here will know that in English usage a "canard" is a false and
> typically scurrilous story, but from exactly when does this usage
> date? Why was it considered at all?
I think this is simply borrowed from French,
where as well as meaning a duck canard
= rumour (meaning no. 5 in my Petit Robert.)
There is a Paris newspaper called Le Canard
Enchaine which I think means Rumours Galore.
--
Don Phillipson
Carlsbad Springs (Ottawa, Canada)
meirman
<ski...@comcast.net> posted:
>meirman wrote:
>> (chrissy) posted:
>
>>> Re: Those vile canards
>>
>> Stop maligning ducks.
>
>How else can you get them in a row?
That's very very good. Much more clever than mine.
Skitt
> "Skitt" posted:
>> meirman wrote:
>>> (chrissy) posted:
>>>> Re: Those vile canards
>>>
>>> Stop maligning ducks.
>>
>> How else can you get them in a row?
>
> That's very very good. Much more clever than mine.
Aww, shucks ...
--
Skitt
CAUTION: My veracity is under a limited warranty
CyberCypher
Compile a list of their names and addresses and I'll have my litigators
contact them immediately. The nerve of some people wrioting like that.
Donna Richoux
>
> I think this is simply borrowed from French,
> where as well as meaning a duck canard
> = rumour (meaning no. 5 in my Petit Robert.)
>
> There is a Paris newspaper called Le Canard
> Enchaine which I think means Rumours Galore.
Not really -- "Enchainé" means "chained." That title has been discussed
several times on a.u.e. For example, from our Parisian correspondent:
From: Isabelle Cecchini (Isabelle...@wanadoo.fr)
Subject: Re: The word 'Canard'
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Date: 2000/07/29
>> ... I found a history of that newspaper at:
>> http://www.chez.com/lecanard/80ANS.HTM
>>
>> When it was first published, in 1915, censorship was all-powerful.
>> The word "canard" already meant "false news", and was a slang word
>> for a newspaper. The editors chose "Canard" and promised never to
>> tell the truth.
>>
>> They added "Enchaîné", because they wanted to poke fun at Clemenceau,
>> who, as a journalist, had been a fierce opponent of censorship and
>> had published a newspaper called "L'Homme Enchaîné", but now that he
>> was Prime Minister had changed his mind about it.
>>
>> Nowadays, "Le Canard Enchaîné" is a satirical newspaper, well-known
>> for its investigations of political and financial scandals, and also
>> for dreadful and very rude puns and spoonerisms.
Robert Bannister
> On 12 Mar 2004, chrissy posted thus:
>
>
>>Those of us who are familiar with french know of canards as ducks,
>>and most here will know that in English usage a "canard" is a
>>false and typically scurrilous story, but from exactly when does
>>this usage date?
>
>
> According to M-W Online, from 1851.
>
>
> Main Entry: ca·nard
> Pronunciation: k-närd also -när
> Function: noun
> Etymology: French, literally, duck; in sense 1, from Middle French
> vendre des canards à moitié to cheat, literally, to half-sell ducks
> Date: 1851
> 1 a : a false or unfounded report or story; especially : a fabricated
> report b : a groundless rumor or belief
> 2 : an airplane with horizontal stabilizing and control surfaces in
> front of supporting surfaces; also : a small airfoil in front of the
> wing of an aircraft that increases the aircraft's stability
>
Meanings 1a and 1b are exactly what I find in French dictionaries
(except it's written in French, and of course it is not meaning 1).
Oddly enough, I though 'canard' meant 'pun' in French, but this seems to
be wrong.
--
Rob Bannister
Donna Richoux
Excellent example of what I was talking about. Bottle, disaster, and a
metaphorical connection that has been lost over time, but not quite
forgotten.
In case anyone doesn't know, you can quickly locate histories of
colorful words by entering them into the Search field at the AUE
website. That brings you to articles by Michael Quinion, Evan Morris,
and more. The website's at:
http://www.alt-usage-english.org/
Robert Bannister
Rem. Sens attest? ds LITTR?, GU?RIN 1892, Lar. 19e-20e.
C. Fausse nouvelle souvent imagin?e de toutes pi?ces et enfl?e jusqu'au
m?lodrame dans des journaux de seconde cat?gorie. Mme X. m'avait annonc?
le mariage de Sabine, mais il para?t que c'est un canard (M?RIM?E,
Lettres ? la comtesse de Montijo, t. 2, 1870, p. 16) :
6. De toutes les esp?ces de canards, la plus dangereuse pour les
journaux de l'opposition, c'est le canard officiel. Quelque rus?s que
soient les journalistes, ils sont parfois les dupes, volontaires ou
involontaires, de l'habilet? de ceux d'entre eux qui, de la presse, ont
pass?, comme Claude Vignon, dans les hautes r?gions du pouvoir.
BALZAC, La Cousine Bette, 1846, p. 310.
Arg. Mauvais journal; p. ext., journal quelconque :
7. Tous ces ouvriers communistes ou communisants dont je vous parlais,
ils ach?tent volontiers en m?me temps que L'Huma un journal
d'information, mais pas un autre canard politique.
Sorry about all the Cyrillic characters (if that's what comes out on
your computer). I can see the original text perfectly if I "view" in
Unicode, but I don't seem to be able to paste it here properly.
http://frantext.inalf.fr/Dendien/scripts/tlfiv5/visusel.exe?12;s=3108413025;r=1;nat=;sol=1;
(If that doesn't work, try 'enter' and then type in 'canard' in the page
below:
http://frantext.inalf.fr/tlf.htm
--
Rob Bannister
david56
> Don Phillipson <nos...@nospam.tnx> wrote:
>
> >
> > I think this is simply borrowed from French,
> > where as well as meaning a duck canard
> > = rumour (meaning no. 5 in my Petit Robert.)
> >
> > There is a Paris newspaper called Le Canard
> > Enchaine which I think means Rumours Galore.
>
> Not really -- "Enchainé" means "chained." That title has been discussed
> several times on a.u.e. For example, from our Parisian correspondent:
If you're going to go to the trouble of putting on one of the
accents, you might as well do the whole job: Enchaîné.
--
David
=====
Donna Richoux
Right, sorry. That tiny smudge on the screen did not register in my
brain as being significant.
What's odd, though, is that Isabelle has it two different ways in her
post, which is not like her. That shows up when looking at the archives
on screen, but it fixed itself during the copy-paste. One of those odd
technical problems, probably.
...I figured out what it was. Google highlights and bold-faces the
search terms, and in doing so it stops the accent mark from displaying.
I had to save the ID, quit Explorer and find the page afresh to get it
to display without the highlights.
david56
The i-circumflex is admittedly difficult to distinguish from a plain
I in some fonts. Why it's there in enchaîné is a mystery, at least
to me; I suppose the English have no right to complain about other
languages' idiosyncratic spelling.
--
David
=====
meirman
chrissy...@yahoo.com (chrissy) posted:
>
>> According to M-W Online, from 1851.
They had airplanes in 1851!
>>
>> Main Entry: ca·nard
>> Pronunciation: k-närd also -när
>> Function: noun
>> Etymology: French, literally, duck; in sense 1, from Middle French
>> vendre des canards à moitié to cheat, literally, to half-sell ducks
>> Date: 1851
>> 1 a : a false or unfounded report or story; especially : a fabricated
>> report b : a groundless rumor or belief
>> 2 : an airplane with horizontal stabilizing and control surfaces in
>> front of supporting surfaces; also : a small airfoil in front of the
>> wing of an aircraft that increases the aircraft's stability
>
>Thanks "Jane". It's still a bit of a leap thopugh from cheating
>someone to a false story, though isn't it?
When I cheat someone I usually use a duck.
I used to use the AFLAC duck, but he left when he got a better job.
> Surely there were some
>bridging usages that brought the two together?
Daniel James
wrote:
> I though 'canard' meant 'pun' in French, but this seems to
> be wrong.
I vaguely remember one of my school French books punning on "gens
bons" and "jambon" - ISTRT it was called /un calembour/ then.
There is a French political-satirical newspaper called /Le Canard
Enchainé/ (that last is an e+acute, if it doesn't come out) - a bit
like /Private Eye/, I'm told, only less funny and more political --
and more French, of course. The name literally means "the duck in
chains" (and it's logo depicts one such) but the real meaning is
that of lies tied down, and the "truth" set free.
Cheers,
Daniel
Raymond S. Wise
news:ckrb50h83onhnogs5...@4ax.com...
> In alt.english.usage on 13 Mar 2004 15:45:02 -0800
> chrissy...@yahoo.com (chrissy) posted:
>
> >
> >> According to M-W Online, from 1851.
>
> They had airplanes in 1851!
The date 1851 is, of course, the date of first use of the term in English,
"canard" referring to an airplane coming much later. However, your comment
inspired me to look up the date for "airplane" (1907, according to MWCD11)
and "aeroplane" (1873). Here's what *The Century Dictionary* has to say
about it:
From
www.century-dictionary.com
[quote, with "E" for eta, "O" for omega]
*aëroplane*1 [...] _n._ [< Gr. < áEr (áer-), air, + _plane,_ q. v.] A
plane placed in the air
for aërostatical experiments. _N. E. D._
*aëroplane*2 [...] _n._ [= F. _aéroplane,_
< Gr. aerOplanos, wandering in air, < áEr (áer-),
air, + _planos,_ wandering : see _planet._] A flying-
machine invented by Victor Tatin and success-
fully tried at the French experiment-station of
Chalais-Meudon in 1879. It consists of a cylindrical
receiver for compressed air used to drive two air-propel-
lers, two laterally extended wings, and a tail for steering.
The velocity obtained was 8 meters per second.
[end quote]
> >>
> >> Main Entry: ca·nard
> >> Pronunciation: k-närd also -när
> >> Function: noun
> >> Etymology: French, literally, duck; in sense 1, from Middle French
> >> vendre des canards à moitié to cheat, literally, to half-sell ducks
> >> Date: 1851
> >> 1 a : a false or unfounded report or story; especially : a fabricated
> >> report b : a groundless rumor or belief
> >> 2 : an airplane with horizontal stabilizing and control surfaces in
> >> front of supporting surfaces; also : a small airfoil in front of the
> >> wing of an aircraft that increases the aircraft's stability
> >
> >Thanks "Jane". It's still a bit of a leap thopugh from cheating
> >someone to a false story, though isn't it?
>
> When I cheat someone I usually use a duck.
>
> I used to use the AFLAC duck, but he left when he got a better job.
>
> > Surely there were some
> >bridging usages that brought the two together?
--
Raymond S. Wise
Minneapolis, Minnesota USA
E-mail: mplsray @ yahoo . com
Robert Bannister
> The i-circumflex is admittedly difficult to distinguish from a plain
> I in some fonts. Why it's there in enchaîné is a mystery, at least
> to me; I suppose the English have no right to complain about other
> languages' idiosyncratic spelling.
>
I hope Isabelle can tell us more about this. The dictionary tells me:
"Signe diacritique qui généralement marque la disparition d'une lettre
ou indique la prononciation longue d'une voyelle"
(Diacritic mark that usually signals the disappearance of a letter or
indicates the long pronunciation of a vowel)
As we know, the circumflex in French most usually shows where an S
disappeared somewhere in the transition from Latin to French, but with
"chaîne", the Old French appears to be "chaiene" (from "cadena").
--
Rob Bannister
Raymond S. Wise
news:c35kr0$m8m$1...@enyo.uwa.edu.au...
An example of the long pronunciation of a vowel: "le nôtre," meaning "ours,"
contrasted with "notre," meaning "our." Two examples of the replacement of
other sounds: "soűl" ( = "drunk" ) from Latin "satullus" and "âge" ( =
"age" ) from "aage" and "eage," in which the two initial vowels were
originally separately pronounced.
I first learned of these examples from the *Dictionnaire Historique de
l'Orthographe Française.*
J. J. Lodder
> As we know, the circumflex in French most usually shows where an S
> disappeared somewhere in the transition from Latin to French, but with
> "chaîne", the Old French appears to be "chaiene" (from "cadena").
Which also still survives in 'cadenas', which is a padlock.
So the French put a cadenas on their chaîne to close it,
Jan
Donna Richoux
Well, that fits "the disappearance of a letter," right? The circumflex
over the i could stand for the following "e" that is dropped. That
reminds me of the Muenchen/München thing.
Not that I know what I'm talking about, I'm just guessing.
Raymond S. Wise
news:1gaqksb.usy...@de-ster.xs4all.nl...
Another vagary of etymology: According to the *Trésor de la Langue
Française Informatisé* at http://atilf.inalf.fr/tlfv3.htm the "-as" in
"cadenas" was previously "-at." The same is true in the case of the French
word for cervelat, "cervelas." As MWCD11 puts it, the English spelling
represents a French spelling which is now obsolete.
ESF
Actually, it has nothing to do with it. ü and ue are two German
alternative spellings for the sound /y/ - like the French u.
Donna Richoux
[comment moved below, to preserve tradition of chronological order.]
Donna Richoux had written, in part, in regard to "chaîne/chaiene":
>
> >Well, that fits "the disappearance of a letter," right? The circumflex
> >over the i could stand for the following "e" that is dropped. That
> >reminds me of the Muenchen/München thing.
> >
> >Not that I know what I'm talking about, I'm just guessing.
> Actually, it has nothing to do with it. ü and ue are two German
> alternative spellings for the sound /y/ - like the French u.
>
Yes, that fits with what I said. How is that we know that the
circumflex-i and ie were not two spellings for the same sound in French?
Or were they?
--
Best - Donna Richoux
Skitt
The older form of an umlaut was a small "e" over the vowel. That,
eventually, evolved into the two dots.
Isabelle Cecchini
[...]
> I just reviewed the archives to see what historical info had already
> been presented about "canard."
>
>> The Trésor de la langue française informatisé attests from 1584 the
>> expression, "bailler un canard à moitié" (to give a duck [to someone]
>> half-way), with the meaning "to deceive someone". A similar
>> expression, "bailler le lièvre à l'oreille" (to give [someone] a hare
>> by the ear) meant (past tense, "bailler" is listed as "archaic" and
>> "regional") "to trick someone through false promises".
> (Harlan Messinger, sci.lang.translation, 2003)
>
>> The German "Ente" for unreliable statements was already used by
>> Luther. Etymologists believe the root for this could be that ducks
>> are known to be not very reliable regarding brooding.
> (Steffen Buhler, 2003)
>
>> the French use of "canard" to mean
>> "cheat" deriving in turn from the Middle French phrase "vendre des
>> canards a moitie". No connection with Vaucanson's canard of 1738.
> (Chris Malcolm, 1996)
>
> So, so far, we haven't seen a totally complete history of citations.
Nothing much to add to what's already been said on the suject, really,
unless to point out that Littré's dictionary, quoted by the OED on the
half-sale of ducks, does mention the two meanings of "hoax" and "paper
on which hoaxes are printed". Littré started giving instalments of his
dictionary to the printing press in 1860.
http://abu.cnam.fr/DICO/excent/index.html gives the 1865 edition of a
French slang dictionary entitled /Les Excentricités du langage/. The
entry for "canard" has, among others, a quote by Balzac, from /Les
Illusions perdues/.
I'd say that "canard"=fantastical piece of news" was current in the
first half of the 19th century in France. Gérard de Nerval wrote a
wonderful piece entitled "Histoire véridique du canard", probably in
1844. You can read it here (in French):
http://www.blackmask.com/books62c/anthojourn.htm#1_0_112 . Gérard de
Nerval, by the way, uses the English word "hoax" at one time: "...dans
cette immense hoax méridional..."
This is as good a place as any to mention that Cotgrave's 1611
French-English dictionary, often quoted by Littré and by the OED, can be
found at http://www.pbm.com/~lindahl/cotgrave/
--
Isabelle Cecchini
Isabelle Cecchini
Yes, "cadena" saw its /d/ disappear, its initial /k/ morph into a /S/,
and its final /a/ sink into oblivion, until we had something like
/Saaen/or maybe /Saien/. The vowel in the middle was further horribly
mangled by varied French throats into a diphthong: /Sajn/ which finally
became /Sen/, but with quite a long vowel, which kept the memory of all
the vanished vowel sounds which preceded it.
Scribes trying to keep writing more or less tuned to pronunciation
finally decided that a circumflex was a good way to show that the vowel
was a long one. During the Renaissance they had tried using a <s> to the
same effect: "chaîne" was written as "chaisne", the <s> being here a
diacritic, and not to be pronounced.
--
Isabelle Cecchini
Robert Bannister
> Another vagary of etymology: According to the *Trésor de la Langue
> Française Informatisé* at http://atilf.inalf.fr/tlfv3.htm the "-as" in
> "cadenas" was previously "-at." The same is true in the case of the French
> word for cervelat, "cervelas." As MWCD11 puts it, the English spelling
> represents a French spelling which is now obsolete.
There are a number of those: the most common being connoisseur.
--
Rob Bannister
Robert Bannister
> The older form of an umlaut was a small "e" over the vowel. That,
> eventually, evolved into the two dots.
We've discussed this before. In old German handwriting, an 'e' looks
like a very small, spiky 'n'. What you see in the Umlaut sign are the
two vertical strokes - not the two dots which is the best my computer
can come up with.
--
Rob Bannister
Skitt
Right. When I was still using hadwriting in German, they were little tiny
vertical slashes. I wrote "eventually" for a reason.
Even though I can read it, I never wrote using the old German script.
Here are some samples of it:
http://appling.kent.edu/StudentPages/Graduates_2003/Schaller/Old%20German%20Script.html
Raymond S. Wise
news:c37mtg$24ldhj$1...@ID-68874.news.uni-berlin.de...
[...]
> This is as good a place as any to mention that Cotgrave's 1611
> French-English dictionary, often quoted by Littré and by the OED, can be
> found at http://www.pbm.com/~lindahl/cotgrave/
Interesting for all sorts of reasons. Looking up the word "petard," I also
found the following:
From
http://www.pbm.com/~lindahl/cotgrave/search/717r.html
[quote]
Pet [...]
I'aymeroy autant tirer vn pet d'un Asne mort, que.
_J would as soone undertake to get a fart of a dead
man, as &c._
[...]
Petaud : m. _A farter_ ; _also, a footman._
C' est la Court du Roy Petaud, ou chascun est
maistre : Pro. _Applyable to an Anarchie , or a disor-
dered familie, wherein euerie one may doe what he
listeth._
Pet [...]
I'aymeroy autant tirer vn pet d'un Asne mort, que.
_J would as soone undertake to get a fart of a dead
man, as &c._
[end quote]
"C' est la Court du Roy Petaud, ou chascun est maistre" means "It is the
court of King Farter, where everyone is master."
"I'aymeroy autant tirer vn pet d'un Asne mort, que." means "I would just as
soon pull a fart from a dead ass [that is, a donkey], than."
"I" for "J," "J" for "I" in italics, "&c." for "etc.," "oy" for what in
modern French would be "ai," the silent "s" in "asne," "chascun," and
"maistre"--in modern French, respectively "âne," "chacun," and "maître"--"u"
and "v" to some extent interchangeable, and interesting turns of phrase.
Cool. (Besides that, the "long 's'" is used, which I did not attempt to
represent above.)