......
jan...@mailexcite.com
punctuation....i keep running across it lately....i don't know
where it comes from....it seems to be getting increasingly
common....it drives me nuts
jane
Pk2222
I've been known to use (or misuse) elipses and dashes, but I've found them to
be the punctuation of choice among illiterate persons (especially in ng posts)
who cannot write a complete sentence. Intolerant, I know, but it bugs me too.
pk
ps: Where'd u lern to do the small i thing?
Daniel
jan...@mailexcite.com wrote in message
<3678271A...@mailexcite.com>...
Absolutely. By the way, if one was to use an ellipsis in a sentence, would
one be correct in using 3 dots, separated at each end with a space, for
example:
yadda yadda yadda ... oh.
This is how I have been taught to use it; however in newspapers and other
publications I see many variations, with different numbers of dots, spaces
etc.
Have nice days
daniel
Adam Newbold
convenient way by which one can spout out a bunch of ideas that are somewhat
related, but don't really belong within the same breath. Another theory is
that when we think as we type, we think in little "clumps." These are
typed, and separated with a bunch of periods. Sort of an unconscience
thing, I guess.
Whatever. I could be wrong. Oh well. Good of you to point it out, anyhow.
Adam
jan...@mailexcite.com wrote in message
<3678271A...@mailexcite.com>...
>Is it just me....or has anyone else noticed this style of
>punctuation....i keep running across it lately....i don't know
>where it comes from....it seems to be getting increasingly
>common....it drives me nuts
>
>jane
JB
> <3678271A...@mailexcite.com>...
> >Is it just me....or has anyone else noticed this style of
> >punctuation....i keep running across it lately....i don't know
> >where it comes from....it seems to be getting increasingly
> >common....it drives me nuts
>
Yep...specialty of the late Herb Caen, SF Chron...he called it 3-dot
journalism...item item hoosegotta item. --JB
jan...@mailexcite.com
>
>
> ps: Where'd u lern to do the small i thing?
The kids.
Opinicus
jan...@mailexcite.com wrote in message
<3678271A...@mailexcite.com>...
>Is it just me....or has anyone else noticed this style of
>punctuation....i keep running across it lately....i don't know
>where it comes from....it seems to be getting increasingly
>common....it drives me nuts
I suspect it correlates highly with that annoying end-of-statement question
rise we talked about a while ago?
Bob
Istanbul
---
To reply by email, dot the dash in doruk-net.
Kanyak's Doghouse <http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Ithaca/5309/>
jan...@mailexcite.com
>
> jan...@mailexcite.com wrote in message
> <3678271A...@mailexcite.com>...
> >Is it just me....or has anyone else noticed this style of
> >punctuation....i keep running across it lately....i don't know
> >where it comes from....it seems to be getting increasingly
> >common....it drives me nuts
> >jane
>
> I suspect it correlates highly with that annoying end-of-statement question
> rise we talked about a while ago?
>
> Bob
> Istanbul
>
I wish it did. Around here, rising inflection, "I'm all like,"
"i think u r gr8," and the inability to distinguish between much
and many seem to go with the 10 to 20 age group. Using only the
period for punctuation seems to be a 20 to 30 thing.
Pk2222
>"i think u r gr8," and the inability to distinguish between much
>and many seem to go with the 10 to 20 age group. Using only the
>period for punctuation seems to be a 20 to 30 thing.
OH LORD. Here I thought I was hiding my age! <not.>
pk
M Wells
>Is it just me....or has anyone else noticed this style of
>punctuation....i keep running across it lately....i don't know
>where it comes from....it seems to be getting increasingly
>common....it drives me nuts
Isn't the example you provide above just the lazy person's form of
all-purpose punctuation?
I use ellipses too, but usually to indicate that the sentence has an
implied continuation or to indicate a pause more integral to the
thought process than can otherwise be evoked using other punctuation.
I have no idea if this is grammatically sanctioned.
I find I use ellipses with greater frequency to evoke speech patterns
if I am writing creative dialogue. Sometimes this spills over into
ordinary internet correspondence if I am unconsciously attempting to
emulate the dialogue of a spoken conversation. Such as, "Let me think
about that... Yes, I see your point."
Regards,
M "Don't look at me -- I'm just coming to grips with transitive and
intransitive verbs" Wells
---
"Der Aberglaube ist die | "Superstition is the
Poesie des Lebens" | poetry of life"
-Johann Wolfgang von |
Goethe |
jan...@mailexcite.com
>
> On 16 Dec 1998 21:34:01 GMT, jan...@mailexcite.com wrote:
>
> >Is it just me....or has anyone else noticed this style of
> >punctuation....i keep running across it lately....i don't know
> >where it comes from....it seems to be getting increasingly
> >common....it drives me nuts
>
> Isn't the example you provide above just the lazy person's form of
> all-purpose punctuation?
>
finger on the period than it is to hit the period, space and
shift keys, right? I wonder, though. I think that this
punctuation style is supposed to convey some other impression
than laziness.
> I use ellipses too, but usually to indicate that the sentence has an
> implied continuation or to indicate a pause more integral to the
> thought process than can otherwise be evoked using other punctuation.
>
> I have no idea if this is grammatically sanctioned.
>
I don't know either. I have always used this punctuation to
indicate lacunae. I can see that on rare occasions ellipsis
could be useful to indicate a pause in thought process. Maybe
that is what annoys me so much. People who write in the style I
mentioned appear to be typing then leaving a string of periods
whenever they stop to think. I really don't want or need to
know when they stopped to think. I expect them to do what I do:
type in their thoughts, then clean up what they have written.
Generally, I don't want to read jumbled thoughts that someone
has dashed off then posted.
Maybe the impression the style is meant to convey is something
like, "I'm just writing this quickly as think. Don't hold me to
it." I've got it! This is the written equivalent of the rising
inflection. I didn't get it when Bob said it, but he's right.
It's like tag questions.
jane
JMichaeI
sentences/phrases/sections/items not start with Walter Winchell's newspaper
column. I've encountered this type of punctuation since the early days of
online life (i.e., the BBS world that began in the late 70's and the old
ARPANet). It is usually used by more technical types or functionally
illiterate persons who don't understand how punctuation works. In a lot of
cases, too, it's an artifact of online composition -- punctuation isn't
important, immediacy is.
As for pinning down how ellipses are supposed to be written, good luck! I was
taught to do them as three dots with a space after each dot -- no leading
space. Others have told me that they were taught to use three dots with spaces
all 'round. Yet other uses I've seen are four dots, no spaces at all, four
dots with a trailing space, four dots with both leading and trailing spaces. I
think the important thing here is to be consistent, and settle with something
that looks good to you.
------------------------------
<A HREF="http://members.aol.com/jmichaei/">Catch 23</A><BR>
http://members.aol.com/jmichaei/
<P>
<I>The devil loves nothing more than the intolerance of reformers. . ." James
Russell Lowell
</B></I><BR>
David Wright
>As for pinning down how ellipses are supposed to be written, good luck! I was
>taught to do them as three dots with a space after each dot -- no leading
>space. Others have told me that they were taught to use three dots with spaces
>all 'round. Yet other uses I've seen are four dots, no spaces at all, four
>dots with a trailing space, four dots with both leading and trailing spaces. I
>think the important thing here is to be consistent, and settle with something
>that looks good to you.
Associated Press style treats ellipses as three-letter words: three
dots with no spaces between but with leading and trailing spaces. An
ellipsis at the end of a sentence has four dots, one being the
sentence-ending period. As you say, it is important to be consistent,
but ....
David
Relentless Quadrapuss
> I wish it did. Around here, rising inflection, "I'm all like,"
> "i think u r gr8," and the inability to distinguish between much
> and many seem to go with the 10 to 20 age group. Using only the
> period for punctuation seems to be a 20 to 30 thing.
Well, I use the ellipsis thang quite a lot and I just turned 30. What am
I going to be using for the next 10 years? Maybe I'll become one of
those annoying people who insist on using lots of exclamation marks
after anything vaguely amusing!!!!!
And they also do the same with question marks, don't they??? I wonder
why?????
The trouble is, once they've made one statement like "God, I'm
tired!!!!", they then really have to pull out the stops if they think of
something genuinely funny or exclamatory to say... "I saw an alien in
the supermarket today!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"
Anyway... this ellipsis thing... (sorry, must stop that; I *was*
deliberately exaggerating there, by the way). I don't really see any
problem as long as it's not used to escess. For me, it's just an
extension to normal punctuation which allows me to express myself. When
I talk, I tend to use lots of pauses for effect, nested parentheses etc,
so I use them in written communication whenever I want to transmit that
"extra li'l bit of me" through the ether.
Adrian
--
____________________________________________
http://www.zappa.u-net.com/legends/
Technology and shite in perfect harmony
____________________________________________
Ellen Mizzell
> >
> I don't know either. I have always used this punctuation to
> indicate lacunae. I can see that on rare occasions ellipsis
> could be useful to indicate a pause in thought process.
>
Am I the only person here who remembers when dot dot dot
was code for sex?
--
Ellen Mizzell
Pk2222
>Am I the only person here who remembers when dot dot dot
>was code for sex?
>
Perhaps. Were the dots accompanied by crashing waves?
pk
Ellen Mizzell
Not in the paperback edition.
--
Ellen Mizzell
M Wells
[snip]
>> Isn't the example you provide above just the lazy person's form of
>> all-purpose punctuation?
>>
>It might be that. You mean that it's easier to hold your index
>finger on the period than it is to hit the period, space and
>shift keys, right? I wonder, though. I think that this
>punctuation style is supposed to convey some other impression
>than laziness.
More than that -- I think it's easier, for some, to provide a row of
dots in all circumstances than it is to work out which punctuation
symbol is applicable.
Oddly enough, a friend of mine brought this up in conversation last
night. He uses ellipses in exactly this way -- as all-purpose,
applicable-everywhere punctuation.
[snip]
>I don't know either. I have always used this punctuation to
>indicate lacunae. I can see that on rare occasions ellipsis
>could be useful to indicate a pause in thought process. Maybe
>that is what annoys me so much. People who write in the style I
>mentioned appear to be typing then leaving a string of periods
>whenever they stop to think. I really don't want or need to
>know when they stopped to think. I expect them to do what I do:
>type in their thoughts, then clean up what they have written.
>Generally, I don't want to read jumbled thoughts that someone
>has dashed off then posted.
I tend to get more annoyed when people adopt what is clearly a
deliberately grating affectation in posting style than by such
examples as we are discussing.
I also enjoy a well-presented post and often go to great lengths to
make certain my posts are as presentable as I can shape them with my
limited skills.
>Maybe the impression the style is meant to convey is something
>like, "I'm just writing this quickly as think. Don't hold me to
>it." I've got it! This is the written equivalent of the rising
>inflection. I didn't get it when Bob said it, but he's right.
>It's like tag questions.
I think I understand what you are saying, although I wasn't 'here' for
that particular conversation. In less annoying terms (I hope), I
sometimes use ellipses to indicate a question I am asking myself or to
which I am not expecting a response. As in when you are delivering
what would otherwise be a question with the inflection of a statement.
Regards,
M Wells
jan...@mailexcite.com
>
> snip
>
> More than that -- I think it's easier, for some, to provide a row of
> dots in all circumstances than it is to work out which punctuation
> symbol is applicable.
>
> Oddly enough, a friend of mine brought this up in conversation last
> night. He uses ellipses in exactly this way -- as all-purpose,
> applicable-everywhere punctuation.
>
>
annoying me. Is he aware of the impression the style makes,
though? It's so insulting to the reader. By placing the burden
of deciphering what he meant on the reader, he implies that his
time is more important than hers. For me, life is too short to
bother. If writing isn't clear, I move on. I'm sure I'm not
the only reader who does.
>
> >snip
>
> I tend to get more annoyed when people adopt what is clearly a
> deliberately grating affectation in posting style than by such
> examples as we are discussing.
>
Oh good. Examples please. I'd love a thread on grating
affectations.
> snip remainder
jane
Stepaside
<$news1$@nospam.demon.co.uk> writes
>jan...@mailexcite.com wrote:
>> >
>> I don't know either. I have always used this punctuation to
>> indicate lacunae. I can see that on rare occasions ellipsis
>> could be useful to indicate a pause in thought process.
>>
>
>was code for sex?
>
particular piece of code was first unravelled for me (It had come up* in
a German 19C novella, so I presume that the custom was at one time quite
widely adopted in literary circles)
[*Sorry: this could probably have been better phrased]
--
Stepaside
'Ni ddyfod ond yn ddifalch
Ni bu na gorwag na balch'
Ellen Mizzell
> In article <75ea4r$d...@tictac.demon.co.uk>, Ellen Mizzell
> <$news1$@nospam.demon.co.uk> writes
> >jan...@mailexcite.com wrote:
> >> >
> >> I don't know either. I have always used this punctuation to
> >> indicate lacunae. I can see that on rare occasions ellipsis
> >> could be useful to indicate a pause in thought process.
> >>
> >
> >Am I the only person here who remembers when dot dot dot
> >was code for sex?
> >
> Not at all - and I can even remember the occasion (at school) when this
> particular piece of code was first unravelled for me (It had come up* in
> a German 19C novella, so I presume that the custom was at one time quite
> widely adopted in literary circles)
And even more enthusiastically adopted in sub-literary circles,
where more or less every chapter closed with the pulse-quickening
dots.
>
> [*Sorry: this could probably have been better phrased]
>
I don't think so.
--
Ellen Mizzell
Bill McCray
On 20 Dec 1998 16:50:32 GMT, jan...@mailexcite.com wrote:
>>
>I certainly don't expect your friend to live his life to avoid
>annoying me. Is he aware of the impression the style makes,
>though? It's so insulting to the reader. By placing the burden
>of deciphering what he meant on the reader, he implies that his
>time is more important than hers. For me, life is too short to
>bother. If writing isn't clear, I move on. I'm sure I'm not
>the only reader who does.
A good point well made, Jane. Why should I as a reader do the work the
author should have done and was unwilling to do?
Bill McCray
Lexington, KY
M Wells
[snip]
>> I tend to get more annoyed when people adopt what is clearly a
>> deliberately grating affectation in posting style than by such
>> examples as we are discussing.
>>
>
>Oh good. Examples please. I'd love a thread on grating
>affectations.
[snip]
The best example I can think of is nearly anything posted by j*e1*rbit
(note: replace "*" with "o") in alt.true-crime.
Joe's monomania is child-abuse. Unfortunately, instead of educating
people to the very real problems of child-abuse, Joe uses any relevant
news material he or she can find as a means of arguing that serial
killers, rapists, murderers etc. have a right to inflict harm on
society in revenge for being maltreated as children. In effect, he or
she uses any example of child-abuse he or she can find to defend the
right of dangerous criminals to do whatever horrible thing they
please.
Even if the ideology doesn't offend, the posting style might -- Joe
relies on emotive punch-words when posting: any "Mother" or "Father",
for example, becomes "Mommy" or "Daddy"; any "boy" or "girl" or
"child" etc becomes "Slave."
It may not seem like much, but it is amazing how grating it can become
when consistently applied over a number of years. Particularly when
you consider that Joe has posted almost 12000 messages to
alt-true-crime, of which approx 7900 (according to Dejanews) contain
the words "Mommy" or "Daddy" or "Slave".