Google Groups no longer supports new Usenet posts or subscriptions. Historical content remains viewable.
Dismiss
help with the meaning of a small sentence written by H.H.Munro
33 views
Skip to first unread message
bubuna
May 7, 2013, 8:15:34 PM5/7/13
to
Hello,
The following sentence is an extract from the famous story 'the open window written by Saki[H.H.Munro]
"My aunt will be down presently, Mr. Nuttel," said a very self-possessed young lady of fifteen; "in the meantime you must try and put up with me."
I am stuck with two expressions in the above sentence. One is 'self possessed'[I know it refers to one who is composed and matured.] And then the second one is 'put up with' which means tolerate. I need to know more about these two expressions.
1.can anyone please show me a couple of situations which show that a person is self possessed?
2. What is the mood in the phrase 'try and put up with me'? Does it mean that the girl knows that she is difficult to put up with and says that to Mr. Nuttel,in a matter of fact way, to help him adjust with her? Or does it show the she uses her sense of humour [perhaps a wry one]as a kind of social lubrication. Can you please let me know how often this tone is used in social interaction in western society [If the second one is correct]
I hope I have explained my problem correctly.
Thank you in advance.
The following sentence is an extract from the famous story 'the open window written by Saki[H.H.Munro]
"My aunt will be down presently, Mr. Nuttel," said a very self-possessed young lady of fifteen; "in the meantime you must try and put up with me."
I am stuck with two expressions in the above sentence. One is 'self possessed'[I know it refers to one who is composed and matured.] And then the second one is 'put up with' which means tolerate. I need to know more about these two expressions.
1.can anyone please show me a couple of situations which show that a person is self possessed?
2. What is the mood in the phrase 'try and put up with me'? Does it mean that the girl knows that she is difficult to put up with and says that to Mr. Nuttel,in a matter of fact way, to help him adjust with her? Or does it show the she uses her sense of humour [perhaps a wry one]as a kind of social lubrication. Can you please let me know how often this tone is used in social interaction in western society [If the second one is correct]
I hope I have explained my problem correctly.
Thank you in advance.
Tony Cooper
May 7, 2013, 11:03:05 PM5/7/13
to
On Tue, 7 May 2013 17:15:34 -0700 (PDT), bubuna
<perfe...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>Hello,
>The following sentence is an extract from the famous story 'the open window written by Saki[H.H.Munro]
>
>"My aunt will be down presently, Mr. Nuttel," said a very self-possessed young lady of fifteen; "in the meantime you must try and put up with me."
>
>I am stuck with two expressions in the above sentence. One is 'self possessed'[I know it refers to one who is composed and matured.] And then the second one is 'put up with' which means tolerate. I need to know more about these two expressions.
>
>1.can anyone please show me a couple of situations which show that a person is self possessed?
It's usually a visual thing that you pick up when meeting the person.
<perfe...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>Hello,
>The following sentence is an extract from the famous story 'the open window written by Saki[H.H.Munro]
>
>"My aunt will be down presently, Mr. Nuttel," said a very self-possessed young lady of fifteen; "in the meantime you must try and put up with me."
>
>I am stuck with two expressions in the above sentence. One is 'self possessed'[I know it refers to one who is composed and matured.] And then the second one is 'put up with' which means tolerate. I need to know more about these two expressions.
>
>1.can anyone please show me a couple of situations which show that a person is self possessed?
There's often nothing tangible that indicates this. You just get the
feeling that the person is self-possessed. The person will not go out
of their way to impress you, and seems content to let you take them as
they are.
>2. What is the mood in the phrase 'try and put up with me'? Does it mean that the girl knows that she is difficult to put up with and says that to Mr. Nuttel,in a matter of fact way, to help him adjust with her? Or does it show the she uses her sense of humour [perhaps a wry one]as a kind of social lubrication. Can you please let me know how often this tone is used in social interaction in western society [If the second one is correct]
and is suggesting that you adapt to her because she is not going to go
out of her way to please you.
--
Tony Cooper - Orlando FL
micky
May 8, 2013, 3:37:43 AM5/8/13
to
humor, even by someone who is easy to get along with. It's the kind
of line Simon Templar uses with a pretty girl who, when running from a
killer, is forced into the same room with him. From a child though,
choice two might be less likely.
And of course "try and put up" is wrong and it should be "try to put
up". The first is very common and children are even more likely not
to avoid it.
Anton Shepelev
May 8, 2013, 4:28:04 AM5/8/13
to
micky:
> And of course "try and put up" is wrong and it
> should be "try to put up".
Should it?
http://icame.uib.no/ij31/ij31-page45-64.pdf
To me, "try and" is stronger than "try to", having
an effect similar to that of "Veni, vidi, vici":
I came and won --- I tried and did it
I'd interpret the phrase "try and put up with me"
thus: I wish you to muster:
1. (try and...) enough boldness to attempt
putting up with my conduct (instead of panick-
ing, running away, complaining, demanding to
behave myself, e.t.c.) and
2. (put up) enough perseverance to succeed in
this attempt.
--
() ascii ribbon campaign - against html e-mail
/\ www.asciiribbon.org - against proprietary attachments
> And of course "try and put up" is wrong and it
> should be "try to put up".
http://icame.uib.no/ij31/ij31-page45-64.pdf
To me, "try and" is stronger than "try to", having
an effect similar to that of "Veni, vidi, vici":
I came and won --- I tried and did it
I'd interpret the phrase "try and put up with me"
thus: I wish you to muster:
1. (try and...) enough boldness to attempt
putting up with my conduct (instead of panick-
ing, running away, complaining, demanding to
behave myself, e.t.c.) and
2. (put up) enough perseverance to succeed in
this attempt.
--
() ascii ribbon campaign - against html e-mail
/\ www.asciiribbon.org - against proprietary attachments
Don Phillipson
May 8, 2013, 7:46:10 AM5/8/13
to
"bubuna" <perfe...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:e3d7d9e3-1294-474a...@googlegroups.com...
(quoting)>
. . . from the famous story 'the open window written by Saki[H.H.Munro]
"My aunt will be down presently, Mr. Nuttel," said a very self-possessed
young lady of fifteen; "in the meantime you must try and put up with me." .
. .
1.can anyone please show me a couple of situations which show that a person
is self possessed?
2. What is the mood in the phrase 'try and put up with me'?
(end quote)
This is explained by details of British polite behavior one century ago (and
partly but not so much by linguistic details.)
1. "Self-possessed" = self-confident. We know that many 15-year-olds are
not
self-confident, so the minority that are self-possessed are easily
recognized.
2. "Put up with" is a standard British expression meaning "tolerate."
Its use here is joking or ironical, suggesting that Mr. Nuttel's waiting in
company with the girl is a burden, but one he must bear.
--
Don Phillipson
Carlsbad Springs
(Ottawa, Canada)
news:e3d7d9e3-1294-474a...@googlegroups.com...
(quoting)>
. . . from the famous story 'the open window written by Saki[H.H.Munro]
"My aunt will be down presently, Mr. Nuttel," said a very self-possessed
. .
1.can anyone please show me a couple of situations which show that a person
is self possessed?
2. What is the mood in the phrase 'try and put up with me'?
This is explained by details of British polite behavior one century ago (and
partly but not so much by linguistic details.)
1. "Self-possessed" = self-confident. We know that many 15-year-olds are
not
self-confident, so the minority that are self-possessed are easily
recognized.
2. "Put up with" is a standard British expression meaning "tolerate."
Its use here is joking or ironical, suggesting that Mr. Nuttel's waiting in
company with the girl is a burden, but one he must bear.
--
Don Phillipson
Carlsbad Springs
(Ottawa, Canada)
Whiskers
May 8, 2013, 9:33:37 AM5/8/13
to
On 2013-05-08, Tony Cooper <tonyco...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Tue, 7 May 2013 17:15:34 -0700 (PDT), bubuna <perfe...@hotmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>>Hello, The following sentence is an extract from the famous story 'the
>>open window written by Saki[H.H.Munro]
>>
>>"My aunt will be down presently, Mr. Nuttel," said a very self-possessed
>>young lady of fifteen; "in the meantime you must try and put up with me."
>>
>>I am stuck with two expressions in the above sentence. One is 'self
>>possessed'[I know it refers to one who is composed and matured.] And then
>>the second one is 'put up with' which means tolerate. I need to know more
>>about these two expressions.
>>
>>1.can anyone please show me a couple of situations which show that a
>>person is self possessed?
>
> It's usually a visual thing that you pick up when meeting the person.
> There's often nothing tangible that indicates this. You just get the
> feeling that the person is self-possessed. The person will not go out of
> their way to impress you, and seems content to let you take them as they
> are.
More or less; someone who is self-possessed doesn't need your approval -
> On Tue, 7 May 2013 17:15:34 -0700 (PDT), bubuna <perfe...@hotmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>>Hello, The following sentence is an extract from the famous story 'the
>>open window written by Saki[H.H.Munro]
>>
>>"My aunt will be down presently, Mr. Nuttel," said a very self-possessed
>>young lady of fifteen; "in the meantime you must try and put up with me."
>>
>>I am stuck with two expressions in the above sentence. One is 'self
>>possessed'[I know it refers to one who is composed and matured.] And then
>>the second one is 'put up with' which means tolerate. I need to know more
>>about these two expressions.
>>
>>1.can anyone please show me a couple of situations which show that a
>>person is self possessed?
>
> It's usually a visual thing that you pick up when meeting the person.
> There's often nothing tangible that indicates this. You just get the
> feeling that the person is self-possessed. The person will not go out of
> their way to impress you, and seems content to let you take them as they
> are.
but won't necessarily be so rude as to impose their own preferences on you.
>>2. What is the mood in the phrase 'try and put up with me'? Does it mean
>>that the girl knows that she is difficult to put up with and says that to
>>Mr. Nuttel,in a matter of fact way, to help him adjust with her? Or does
>>it show the she uses her sense of humour [perhaps a wry one]as a kind of
>>social lubrication. Can you please let me know how often this tone is
>>used in social interaction in western society [If the second one is
>>correct]
>
> The girl is saying that she knows that her bearing can be off-putting,
> and is suggesting that you adapt to her because she is not going to go
> out of her way to please you.
("fishing") for a complement. Her words imply that she doesn't think she
is an adequate substitute for the person you've really come to see - but I
don't think she really thinks that at all.
--
-- ^^^^^^^^^^
-- Whiskers
-- ~~~~~~~~~~
bubuna
May 9, 2013, 2:29:27 AM5/9/13
to
On Wednesday, May 8, 2013 5:16:10 PM UTC+5:30, Don Phillipson wrote:
> "bubuna" wrote in message
> Does that mean that both Mr. Nuttel and the young girl tacitly understood that Mr. Nutttel would have to put up with the young lady until her aunt came, but the girl brings the obvious out as a joke?
> "bubuna" wrote in message
Odysseus
May 12, 2013, 10:05:43 PM5/12/13
to
In article <20130508122804.be15...@gmail.com>,
might be more likely to be heard in a 'heated' context.
--
Odysseus
Anton Shepelev <anto...@gmail.com> wrote:
> micky:
>
> > And of course "try and put up" is wrong and it
> > should be "try to put up".
>
> Should it?
>
> http://icame.uib.no/ij31/ij31-page45-64.pdf
>
> To me, "try and" is stronger than "try to", having
> an effect similar to that of "Veni, vidi, vici":
It doesn't seem any stronger to me, but it's certainly less formal, so
> micky:
>
> > And of course "try and put up" is wrong and it
> > should be "try to put up".
>
> Should it?
>
> http://icame.uib.no/ij31/ij31-page45-64.pdf
>
> To me, "try and" is stronger than "try to", having
> an effect similar to that of "Veni, vidi, vici":
might be more likely to be heard in a 'heated' context.
--
Odysseus
0 new messages