has been changed many times
paa1...@anet.net.tw
"the teacher has been changed" means that the old teacher left, and a new
teacher comes.
But what does "the teacher has been changed many times" actually mean?
Sentence like "the plan has been changed many times" is easy to understand.
It means that the PLAN has been modified over and over again.
But when the Subject becomes "human", what does it mean when
a "teacher" has been CHANGED many times??
Does it mean that, for example, a person constantly changes his teacher ?
So it is equivalent to saying that (his teacher has been changed many
times?)
Or it is a wrong way to say it.
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Chris Croughton
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>
> "the teacher has been changed" means that the old teacher left, and a new
> teacher comes.
>
> But what does "the teacher has been changed many times" actually mean?
The same as you describe, many teachers have left and been replaced.
> Sentence like "the plan has been changed many times" is easy to understand.
> It means that the PLAN has been modified over and over again.
>
> But when the Subject becomes "human", what does it mean when
> a "teacher" has been CHANGED many times??
The position of 'teacher' is not human, the people who fill that
position are human, so there is no conflict. Yes, there is a slight
ambiguity but since you understand the single case there is no
difference when it happens "many times".
> Does it mean that, for example, a person constantly changes his teacher ?
The use of "has been changed" implies that it may not have been the
student's choice (it may have been, as in "the person changes his
teacher", but it may also have been the teachers who left and were
replaced by a school).
> So it is equivalent to saying that (his teacher has been changed many
> times?)
Except for the above (that one implies that it was the student's choice
and in the other it was probably not their choice), yes.
Note followups.
Chris C
paa1...@anet.net.tw
now I know that anglophones actually will not comprehend this sentence as "a
teacher who has been repeatedly MODIFIED", like a "PLAN".
That was what had bothered me in the beginning.
"Chris Croughton" <ch...@keristor.net> 在郵件
news:slrnd8rg33...@ccserver.keris.net 中撰寫...
> On Fri, 20 May 2005 14:31:49 +0800, <paa1...@anet.net.tw>
> <paa1...@anet.net.tw> wrote:
> > "the teacher has been changed" means that the old teacher left, and a
new
> > teacher comes.
> The position of 'teacher' is not human, the people who fill that
> position are human, so there is no conflict. Yes, there is a slight
> ambiguity but since you understand the single case there is no
> difference when it happens "many times".
> The use of "has been changed" implies that it may not have been the
> student's choice (it may have been, as in "the person changes his
> teacher", but it may also have been the teachers who left and were
> replaced by a school).
> Except for the above (that one implies that it was the student's choice
> and in the other it was probably not their choice), yes.
> Note followups.
> Chris C
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Robert Lieblich
paa1...@anet.net.tw wrote:
> [ ... ]
> now I know that anglophones actually will not comprehend this sentence as "a
> teacher who has been repeatedly MODIFIED", like a "PLAN".
> That was what had bothered me in the beginning.
English is full of idioms that make no sense if taken literally. Consider a
sentence of the form "The ______ has been changed many times." As you realize,
if you're talking about a plan the changing is of the contents of the plan. But
if you put "baby" in the blank, the sentence means that the baby's *diaper* has
been changed many times. And if you put "teacher" in the blank, it means that
several different people have held the position of teacher -- usually a specific
position, as in "The teacher of the third grade has been changed many times."
It's even possible to put "dollar" in the blank, in which case it means that a
given dollar has been converted into "change" (coins) many times (unlikely, but
that's the most plausible meaning of that sentence).
Native English speakers do not deliberately spout nonsense. If the superficial
meaning of a sentence makes no sense, there's probably an alternate meaning, or
idiom, at work. Sometimes, unfortunately, people get careless and really do say
illogical things, but most of the time what they're saying is readily understood
by most other native speakers. EFL students simply have to work their way
through this minefield, accumulating idioms as they go.
Good luck.
--
Bob Lieblich
Adopting a temporary sig in honor of his new computer
Chris Croughton
<robert....@verizon.net> wrote:
> English is full of idioms that make no sense if taken literally. Consider a
> sentence of the form "The ______ has been changed many times." As you realize,
> if you're talking about a plan the changing is of the contents of the plan. But
> if you put "baby" in the blank, the sentence means that the baby's *diaper* has
> been changed many times. And if you put "teacher" in the blank, it means that
> several different people have held the position of teacher -- usually a specific
> position, as in "The teacher of the third grade has been changed many times."
> It's even possible to put "dollar" in the blank, in which case it means that a
> given dollar has been converted into "change" (coins) many times (unlikely, but
> that's the most plausible meaning of that sentence).
Interesting, I would have understood "the dollar has been changed many
times" to refer to changing the format of the banknote. Or does that
not happen with (US) banknotes? The UK ones have been through a number
of format changes in my lifetime, getting smaller, changing colour and
pattern (with pictures of different people), that's true for (at least
some) European currency as well.
Chris C
Miss Elaine Eos
> now I know that anglophones actually will not comprehend this sentence as "a
> teacher who has been repeatedly MODIFIED", like a "PLAN".
> That was what had bothered me in the beginning.
This is a completely different sentence, both for plan and teacher.
First, to your original question: If you re-read the sentence as "the
teacher of this class has been changed many times" and then as "the
person who sits at the head of the class has changed many times" and
then "there have been several different people who have sat at the head
of this class", it starts to make more sense.
Back to your "modified" question, consider these two alternatives:
"The plan has been changed several times."
vs
"The plan has been modified several times."
To me, the first means that there have been several distinctly different
plans -- that each has been tossed and replaced with the next. The
latter means that we're still using the original plan, although it's
evolved quite a bit, in several passes. The current plan may no longer
be anything like the original, but the change didn't happen in a "toss
plan-A, use plan-B" way but, rather, in a "good plan, but let's change
this bit here", "...and this bit here", "...and also this bit" way.
So, yes -- a teacher that had been modified several times might have a
strange appearance, but one who has been changed several times, would
just be a new name to learn.
See the difference?
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