Re: MYSTERIOUS TIME DILATION IN DREAMS ?
George Hammond
<nowh...@notspam.org> wrote:
MYSTERIOUS TIME DILATION IN DREAMS ?
Many people have had the experience of being startled
and amazed when suddenly awakened by a loud noise while
dreaming and then realizing that the noise was actually the
logically outcome of the dream they were having!
One of the best known examples is the dream of being
Guillotined by the famous French doctor Maury as reported
by Sigmund Freud in his book Interpretation of Dreams:
"The following dream of Maury's has become celebrated: He
was ill in bed; his mother was sitting beside him. He
dreamed of the Reign of Terror during the Revolution. He
witnessed some terrible scenes of murder, and finally he
himself was summoned before the Tribunal. There he saw
Robespierre, Marat, Fouquier-Tinville, and all the sorry
heroes of those terrible days; he had to give an account of
himself, and after all manner of incidents which did not fix
themselves in his memory, he was sentenced to death.
Accompanied by an enormous crowd, he was led to the place of
execution. He mounted the scaffold; the executioner tied him
to the plank, it tipped over, and the knife of the
guillotine fell. He felt his head severed from his trunk,
and awakened in terrible anxiety, only to find that the
head-board of the bed had fallen, and had actually struck
the cervical vertebrae just where the knife of the
guillotine would have fallen."
=====================================
The obvious question of course is HOW did the dreamer have
enough time to dream such an elaborate story in the fraction
of a second between the time the head board struck his neck
and the time he woke up?
====================================
It turns out this phenomenon is VERY WELL KNOWN and is
popularly known as an "Alarm Clock Dream" because a number
of dreams have been published whereby dreamers are awakened
by a loud culminating event in one of their dreams only to
discover that their alarm clock had gone off!
Freud recounts a number of these.... for instance one
dreamer dreamed that he was in a churchyard and saw the
preacher climb a long ladder to the belfry and grasp hold of
the bell rope and toll the bell. He instantly awoke to find
his alarm clock going off.
Another dreamer watched a waitress walk down the middle
of a restaurant balancing a stack of dishes on one hand. As
she went thru the kitchen door the plates suddenly slipped
and crashed to the floor... again the dreamer awoke to find
his alarm clock going off.
Modern research has shown that for the most part dreams
actually occur in real time.... but in fact since there is
no way of monitoring specific events in a dream and
comparing them with real time, no one actually knows whether
or not their might be "sudden mysterious compressions" of
dreams... "time dilations" as it were... and that is the
question involved in explaining the ubiquitious occurance of
so called "alarm clock dreams".
Freud himself actually studied the problem in 1900 (of
course this was before Einstein had even discovered much
less popularized the term "time dilation").
According to Freud the well known effect was actually
caused by the brain seizing on a "ready made dream" that
would explain the noise and then the dreamer knowing the
story already would simply "presume" that he had actually
experienced the dream when in fact he hadn't.. he simply
recalled the story.
Well... I can tell you from my own experience that I have
had several of these events happen to me (many years ago,
when I was a more alert and much lighter sleeper) and was so
startled by them... that never in a thousand years would I
believe that Freud's explanation is the simple answer.
In fact, now 40 years later, I'm here to tell you that
Freud is probably WRONG about his explanation of the "alarm
clock dreams".... however, he may BE RIGHT about the
existence of a "ready made dream".... and in fact.... his
theory may be involved in the explanation of "Life After
Death" so called!
In other words, I believe that there is in fact, in
ordinary nocturnal dreams, a "panic time dilation
mechanism", which can under extraordinary conditions of
fright or panic (such as being awakened by a loud noise)
cause the mental process to undergo an ACTUAL RELATIVISTIC
TIME DILATION, and this is in fact the explanation of the
well known "ALARM CLOCK DREAM PHENOMENON"!
Now, admittedly, you can't prove this, on the other hand
you can't DISPROVE IT either, which means it is a viable
conjecture!
But in the meantime, Hammond has PROVEN and published the
fact that Mathematical Psychometry is causally identical to
Linearized Relativity... and therefore that a Relativistic
Time Dilation IS INVOLVED IN ORDINARY MENTAL FUNCTION.
In fact Hammond is investigating whether LIFE AFTER DEATH
could actually be a "ready made dream" (to use Freud's
terminology) which is slowly written over the lifetime of an
individual, and then which is "instantly read out" at the
moment of death (at the "last trump" as St. Paul put it in I
Cor. 15) and then is played back in a Time dilated form
(similar to the alarm clock dreams) and thus "Life After
Death" is actually "life before death" which only APPEARS to
be Life After Death because of the (twins Paradox) type of
well known "Loss of Simultaneity" between the two observers
(the survivors and the dying dreamer in this case).
At any rate, if ANYONE has ever experienced one of these
uncanny "alarm clock type of dream awakenings", I would
appreciate hearing about it here..... the phenomenon is
still not explained and now seems to have a very interesting
and relevant application!!!!
========================================
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Anima Rising
outside noises in dreams. For example, I remember very clearly a dream
I had when I was sleeping at a resort that had Saturday night
fireworks. I was deep into a dream and the fireworks started going
off. One loud bang got incorporated in my dream as me getting shot in
the back. I remember this very clearly because although I was face
down on the ground in my dream, I felt my etheric body raise my head
and tell my neice (who was also a character in the dream) to "Call
911." Then, of course, since I was lucid, I remember thinking - "Well,
now I know that that old myth about if you die in your dream, that
you'll really die is wrong." And then I pretty much woke myself up
because of all the fireworks.
George Hammond
<Nowh...@notspam.com> wrote:
"Scaly Lizard" <scaly...@nospampleaseyho.com> wrote in
message
news:17qsf2hcst94438v1...@4ax.com...
> On Tue, 05 Sep 2006 03:40:56 GMT, "George Hammond"
> <Nowh...@notspam.com> wrote:
>
>>
>>"Scaly Lizard" <scaly...@nospampleaseyho.com> wrote in message
>>news:gfdnf2t5jj1gjkba8...@4ax.com...
<SNIP citation of research on "lengths of dreams">
[Hammond]
Thanks Lizard for your legwork on the "length of dreams",
but
I still say "6 seconds" is an underestimate.
HOWEVER.... I would like to tell you WHAT it is that has
touched off this thread.... and that is a DIRECT EXPERIENCE
OF A TIME DILATION IN A DREAM.
OK... here's what happened:
When I was about 20... very healthy, a successful college
student in Physics, I had a weird "dream incident" one night
when staying at a friends house while home on a school
vacation..
I was slumbering and having a rather unremarkable or
"average"
type dream of some kind which then became more noticeable
because it led up to some situation which involved a loud
noise.
However, the noise was so loud that I immediately woke up
(I was a light sleeper in those days) and in fact awoke so
fast that
I actually heard the tail end of the "real" noise which was
the
sound of somthing clattering to the floor knocked off a
table
in the living room by a cat.
I remember clear as a bell laying there in the semidark
early dawn propped up on one elbow in bed staring thru
the bedroom door out into the living room in STUNNED
AMAZEMENT...!
What amazed me is this: The duration of the sound must
have been 1-2 seconds.... which means that I clearly heard
it
(sounding like something else by the way) in the dream...
and then I awoke so fast that I also heard the same sound
in the "real" world also...... and what AMAZED me was
that since the entire sound only lasted for say 1.5 seconds
and I obviously woke up say in 3/4 of a second (after the
sound had commenced in the dream but before it stopped
in reality)... it was obvious that I had heard (nearly) the
same
sound in BOTH WORLDS (i.e. in "dream spacetime"
and in "real spacetime")... and of course sounding like
two different things. YET, OBVIOUSLY because
I could immediately recall at least the last 10 SECONDS of
the dream action leading up to the (fully predictable))
noise..... it was OBVIOUS TO ME at the time that
the IMPOSSIBLE had just occured..... that the short
sequence of dream that I remembered (say 5 to 10
seconds) must have been dreampt in 3/4 of a
second... WHICH WAS CLEARLY IMPOSSIBLE!!
I REMEMBER TO THIS DAY, 45 years later, .... laying
there propped up on one elbow with my eyes wide open
staring out into the gray light of early dawn.....
CONFOUNDED
AND PUZZLED LIKE NEVER BEFORE OR SINCE.. IN
MY ENTIRE LIFE.. wondering what in the heck I had just
epxerienced!
WELL..... I'll tell you.... not until recently has the clue
to this mystery finally (accidentally) come my way.
I now SUSPECT, that there is such a thing as a
(Relativistic) TIME DILATION that can actually
occur in a nocturnal dream!
Apparently it only occurs as a last resort, and only
when the mind becomes FRIGHTENED during
sleep... by say.... the occurance of a loud noise!
According to my present "conjecture" the
dreaming brain trys to "protect sleep" by
immediately "changing coordinates" to another
reference frame where time is running MUCH FASTER
relative to reality, and in this OTHER WORLD
the mind dreams up (in local proper time)a lengthy,
say 10 second, scenario which "explains" the noise as
the sound of, say, a car backfiring or something, and
then just as quickly "swiches back" to the original
dream spacetime where the sudden noise now
seems to have a routine explanation and hopefully
the dreamer will not wake up.... UNFORTUNATELY..
in this case it didn't work, and the noise was so loud
that I DID wake up.... and it is then that I NOTICED
THE TIME DILATION.... or more descriptively,
as I recall the event.... I was left with the feeling
that I had seen the same event (the noise) from
"TWO DIFFERENT REALITIES".... in other words.
that the "dream reality" could not simply be a
"dream" but had to (de facto) be an ACTUAL OTHER
WORLD.... since its TIME RATE was NOT
COINCIDENT WITH THE TIME RATE OF
THE REAL WORLD....
There must be TWO DIFFERENT WORLDS
(two unequal, non-coincident, spacetimes)
in other words!!
NOW.... there you have it.... and it turns out that
MANY PEOPLE besides me have experienced the
SAME THING in one form or another... and they
are known generally as "alarm clock dreams",
of which Maury's gullotine dream is perhaps the
most famous.
ANYWAY.... since I have discovered and published
the discovery of a REAL TIME DILATION in
Psychometry..... I am now becoming more and more suspicious
that the explanation of the historic "alarm clock dreams"
IS IN FACT DUE TO THE ACTUAL EXISTANCE OF
A PREVIOUSLY UNRECOGNIZED "RELATIVISTIC
TIME DILATION" IN NOCTURNAL DREAMS...!
And... according to my theory.... the FINAL FRIGHT
of our lives.... which is the moment of death.... MAY
IN FACT.... produce a "super-alarm clock dream"
which is time dilated into years, and which APPEARS
to occur after death because of it.... and THIS is
perhaps the scientific explanation of LIFE AFTER DEATH
SO CALLED. In other words.... Saint Paul in
I Cor 15:35-58 is PERFECTLY CORRECT in his
explanation of LIFE AFTER DEATH....!
--
jesper...@gmail.com
advance when it will ring. You just don't start dreaming about the
sound, until you hear the sound from the alarm. And if you were hearing
the sound for a while in your dream, it just took you some time to wake
up, meaning the alarm was ringing for a while, while you were sleeping.
And you dream fast, so you can actually dream a lot during just a short
period of ringing.
Also just thinking about how many times there happen to be a sound that
fit to your dream is not a base for any scientific analasys. You really
have to also thinkg about all the times that there were not a sound
that fit, wether there was a sound or not. I am sure there are
countless more times like that, but you think no further off them, and
forget them and you don't really see if the times it did fit had any
significance at all.
Perry Justus
wake up to the sound until 15-25 minutes after it'd started ringing!
Perry