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HOW DO ATHEISTS EXPLAIN POLTERGEIST LEVITATION?

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Emmett Till

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Jul 10, 2012, 9:35:15 AM7/10/12
to
HOW DO ATHEISTS EXPLAIN POLTERGEIST LEVITATION?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDjwQIneBks&noredirect=1

Sylvia Else

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Jul 10, 2012, 9:44:59 AM7/10/12
to
On 10/07/2012 11:35 PM, Emmett Till wrote:
> HOW DO ATHEISTS EXPLAIN POLTERGEIST LEVITATION?
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDjwQIneBks&noredirect=1
>

You can even see part of the supporting frame.

Sylvia.

Waldo Tunnel

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Jul 10, 2012, 9:50:04 AM7/10/12
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On Jul 10, 6:35 am, Emmett Till <etill1...@gmail.com> wrote:
> HOW DO ATHEISTS EXPLAIN POLTERGEIST LEVITATION?

Bill O'Reilly.

irob...@verizon.net

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Jul 10, 2012, 12:20:20 PM7/10/12
to
On Jul 10, 9:35 am, Emmett Till <etill1...@gmail.com> wrote:
> HOW DO ATHEISTS EXPLAIN POLTERGEIST LEVITATION?
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDjwQIneBks&noredirect=1

I've seen David Copperfield live on stage do tricks that put that half-
assed attempt at stage magic to shame. Nothing there to see or
explain.
Rob B

Bob Casanova

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Jul 10, 2012, 12:59:41 PM7/10/12
to
On Tue, 10 Jul 2012 06:35:15 -0700 (PDT), the following
appeared in sci.skeptic, posted by Emmett Till
<etil...@gmail.com>:

>HOW DO ATHEISTS EXPLAIN POLTERGEIST LEVITATION?
>
>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDjwQIneBks&noredirect=1

I'm curious... Exactly what do religious beliefs, or lack of
them, have to do with poltergeists?

Aside from that, the answer is probably, "Exactly the same
as do religious believers: They look at the video and
conclude it's faked, therefore there's nothing to explain".
--

Bob C.

"Evidence confirming an observation is
evidence that the observation is wrong."
- McNameless

MarkA

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Jul 10, 2012, 3:20:41 PM7/10/12
to
On Tue, 10 Jul 2012 06:35:15 -0700, Emmett Till wrote:

> HOW DO ATHEISTS EXPLAIN POLTERGEIST LEVITATION?
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDjwQIneBks&noredirect=1

We explain it without invoking a god, of course.

--
MarkA
Keeper of Things Put There Only Just The Night Before
About eight o'clock

Ben Kaufman

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Jul 10, 2012, 3:23:01 PM7/10/12
to
On Tue, 10 Jul 2012 06:35:15 -0700 (PDT), Emmett Till <etil...@gmail.com>
wrote:

>HOW DO ATHEISTS EXPLAIN POLTERGEIST LEVITATION?
>
>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDjwQIneBks&noredirect=1


How do you know it was a poltergeist and not the Invisible Man?

Ben

Waldo Tunnel

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Jul 10, 2012, 3:32:44 PM7/10/12
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Why in the fuck do supposedly rational atheists respond to Mr. Till as
if he were serious?

Mike Lovell

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Jul 10, 2012, 3:34:09 PM7/10/12
to
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

On 2012-07-10, Waldo Tunnel <waldo...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Why in the fuck do supposedly rational atheists respond to Mr. Till as
> if he were serious?

Satire-radar malfunction?

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kni...@baawa.com

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Jul 10, 2012, 8:36:45 PM7/10/12
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On Tue, 10 Jul 2012 06:35:15 -0700 (PDT), Emmett Till
<etil...@gmail.com> wrote:

So simple. It's obviously an anti-gravity Duckagator flying over
his house on it's way to Alpha Ceti IV. This the mating season.

Warlord Steve
BAAWA

Cujo DeSockpuppet

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Jul 10, 2012, 9:17:29 PM7/10/12
to
Emmett Till <etil...@gmail.com> wrote in news:edcedc39-894e-4ed4-8041-
324a3e...@i11g2000yqo.googlegroups.com:

> HOW DO ATHEISTS EXPLAIN POLTERGEIST LEVITATION?

How the fuck do you explain something that never happened?

--
Cujo - The Official Overseer of Kooks and Trolls in dfw.*,
alt.paranormal, alt.astrology and alt.astrology.metapsych. Supreme Holy
Overlord of alt.fucknozzles. Winner of the 8/2000, 2/2003 & 4/2007 HL&S
award. July 2005 Hammer of Thor. Winning Trainer - Barbara Woodhouse
Memorial Dog Whistle - 12/2005 & 4/2008. COOSN-266-06-01895.
"Would you translate that into K00KSPEKE so I can understand it?" -
Raytard Murphy admits his failure to communicate.
This signature was made by SigChanger.
You can find SigChanger at: http://www.phranc.nl/

Heyduke Lives

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Jul 10, 2012, 10:15:11 PM7/10/12
to
Emmett Till <etil...@gmail.com> wrote:

>HOW DO ATHEISTS EXPLAIN POLTERGEIST LEVITATION?

Shitting cultist insanity.

---
Email address: k.chel...@yahoo.com http://www.skeptictank.org/
And a varmint will not quit, ever.

Uncle Vic

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Jul 10, 2012, 10:24:30 PM7/10/12
to
Emmett Till <etil...@gmail.com> wrote in news:edcedc39-894e-4ed4-8041-
324a3e...@i11g2000yqo.googlegroups.com:

> HOW DO ATHEISTS EXPLAIN POLTERGEIST LEVITATION?

By laughing at you and walking away.

--
Uncle Vic
aa# 2011
Matthew 6:5-6
"Keep thy religion to thyself"

Visit my You Tube Channel!
http://www.youtube.com/user/Vicman6311?feature=mhee

Dakota

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Jul 10, 2012, 11:36:40 PM7/10/12
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You beat me to it. It's amazing that these trolls have never heard of
the giant flocks of anti-gravity Duckagators.

skye...@yahoo.com

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Jul 11, 2012, 4:27:58 AM7/11/12
to
On Jul 10, 6:35 am, Emmett Till <etill1...@gmail.com> wrote:
> HOW DO ATHEISTS EXPLAIN POLTERGEIST LEVITATION?
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDjwQIneBks&noredirect=1

Here's how: somebody was smoking some of that gnarly Purple Train
Wreck cannabis, and hey. The rest is history.

Brenda Nelson, A.A.#34
BAAWA Knight of the Golden Litterbox
EAC Professor of Feline Thermometrics and Cat-Herding
skyeyes nine at cox dot net OR
skyeyes nine at yahoo dot com

Bob Casanova

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Jul 11, 2012, 1:12:48 PM7/11/12
to
On Wed, 11 Jul 2012 01:17:29 +0000 (UTC), the following
appeared in sci.skeptic, posted by Cujo DeSockpuppet
<cu...@petitmorte.net>:

>Emmett Till <etil...@gmail.com> wrote in news:edcedc39-894e-4ed4-8041-
>324a3e...@i11g2000yqo.googlegroups.com:
>
>> HOW DO ATHEISTS EXPLAIN POLTERGEIST LEVITATION?
>
>How the fuck do you explain something that never happened?

I think you just did...

Bob Casanova

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Jul 11, 2012, 1:13:45 PM7/11/12
to
On Tue, 10 Jul 2012 09:59:41 -0700, the following appeared
in sci.skeptic, posted by Bob Casanova <nos...@buzz.off>:

>On Tue, 10 Jul 2012 06:35:15 -0700 (PDT), the following
>appeared in sci.skeptic, posted by Emmett Till
><etil...@gmail.com>:
>
>>HOW DO ATHEISTS EXPLAIN POLTERGEIST LEVITATION?
>>
>>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDjwQIneBks&noredirect=1
>
>I'm curious... Exactly what do religious beliefs, or lack of
>them, have to do with poltergeists?

Well, Emmett?

Bob Casanova

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Jul 11, 2012, 1:23:45 PM7/11/12
to
On Tue, 10 Jul 2012 14:34:09 -0500, the following appeared
in sci.skeptic, posted by Mike Lovell <dev....@b0h0.com>:

>-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
>Hash: SHA1
>
>On 2012-07-10, Waldo Tunnel <waldo...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Why in the fuck do supposedly rational atheists respond to Mr. Till as
>> if he were serious?
>
>Satire-radar malfunction?

To provide contrast, perhaps?

And what makes you think he's posting satire, since it's
nearly impossible, absent other evidence, to distinguish
satire, or a well-crafted Loki post, from an actual loon?

Bob Casanova

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Jul 11, 2012, 1:24:48 PM7/11/12
to
On Tue, 10 Jul 2012 12:32:44 -0700 (PDT), the following
appeared in sci.skeptic, posted by Waldo Tunnel
<waldo...@gmail.com>:

>Why in the fuck do supposedly rational atheists respond to Mr. Till as
>if he were serious?

I'm curious; what's your basis for deciding he isn't
serious?

Bob Casanova

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Jul 14, 2012, 1:52:33 PM7/14/12
to
On Wed, 11 Jul 2012 10:13:45 -0700, the following appeared
in sci.skeptic, posted by Bob Casanova <nos...@buzz.off>:

>On Tue, 10 Jul 2012 09:59:41 -0700, the following appeared
>in sci.skeptic, posted by Bob Casanova <nos...@buzz.off>:
>
>>On Tue, 10 Jul 2012 06:35:15 -0700 (PDT), the following
>>appeared in sci.skeptic, posted by Emmett Till
>><etil...@gmail.com>:
>>
>>>HOW DO ATHEISTS EXPLAIN POLTERGEIST LEVITATION?
>>>
>>>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDjwQIneBks&noredirect=1
>>
>>I'm curious... Exactly what do religious beliefs, or lack of
>>them, have to do with poltergeists?
>
>Well, Emmett?

And yet another loon runs away...

Waldo Tunnel

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Jul 19, 2012, 3:00:10 AM7/19/12
to
On Jul 10, 6:17 pm, Cujo DeSockpuppet <c...@petitmorte.net> wrote:
> Emmett Till <etill1...@gmail.com> wrote in news:edcedc39-894e-4ed4-8041-
> 324a3e27d...@i11g2000yqo.googlegroups.com:
>
> > HOW DO ATHEISTS EXPLAIN POLTERGEIST LEVITATION?
>
> How the fuck do you explain something that never happened?

How would you know it never happened unless you know everything that
has happened?

Virgil

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Jul 19, 2012, 3:59:25 AM7/19/12
to
In article
<895dedae-c2c4-4eeb...@n9g2000pbi.googlegroups.com>,
Have you any OBJECTIVE PHYSICAL EVIDENCE that any such alleged events
have ever happened?

Until you do, and it has been vetted and accepted by non-theists,
it is a non-event.
--


Waldo Tunnel

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Jul 22, 2012, 1:49:08 AM7/22/12
to
On Jul 19, 12:59 am, Virgil <vir...@ligriv.com> wrote:
> In article
> <895dedae-c2c4-4eeb-b3d1-21355ae7b...@n9g2000pbi.googlegroups.com>,
>  Waldo Tunnel <waldotun...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > On Jul 10, 6:17 pm, Cujo DeSockpuppet <c...@petitmorte.net> wrote:
> > > Emmett Till <etill1...@gmail.com> wrote in news:edcedc39-894e-4ed4-8041-
> > > 324a3e27d...@i11g2000yqo.googlegroups.com:
>
> > > > HOW DO ATHEISTS EXPLAIN POLTERGEIST LEVITATION?
>
> > > How the fuck do you explain something that never happened?
>
> > How would you know it never happened unless you know everything that
> > has happened?
>
> Have you any OBJECTIVE PHYSICAL EVIDENCE that any such alleged events
> have ever happened?

Tsk, tsk, tsk. You are avoiding my question ["How would you know it
never happened..."] and shifting the burden of proof. I didn't make
any claims. You did.

> Until you do, and it has been vetted and accepted by non-theists,
> it is a non-event.

My goodness! I just asked you to back up your claim. You claim
inflicts no burden upon me to disprove it. Did you think it did?
> --

Father Haskell

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Jul 22, 2012, 1:51:57 AM7/22/12
to
On Jul 10, 9:35 am, Emmett Till <etill1...@gmail.com> wrote:
> HOW DO ATHEISTS EXPLAIN POLTERGEIST LEVITATION?
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDjwQIneBks&noredirect=1

How do atheists explain poltergeist levitation, or how do
they explain believers' gullibility?

Devils Advocaat

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Jul 22, 2012, 2:49:16 AM7/22/12
to
You asked how do atheists explain poltergeist levitation, and you were
asked for evidence that such things occurred. Seems to me you are
avoiding your responsiblity of confirming such a thing happens.
>
>
>
>
>
> > --

Waldo Tunnel

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Jul 22, 2012, 3:55:42 AM7/22/12
to
On Jul 21, 11:49 pm, Devils Advocaat <mankygo...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Jul 22, 6:49 am, Waldo Tunnel <waldotun...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Jul 19, 12:59 am, Virgil <vir...@ligriv.com> wrote:
>
> > > In article
> > > <895dedae-c2c4-4eeb-b3d1-21355ae7b...@n9g2000pbi.googlegroups.com>,
> > >  Waldo Tunnel <waldotun...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > > On Jul 10, 6:17 pm, Cujo DeSockpuppet <c...@petitmorte.net> wrote:
> > > > > Emmett Till <etill1...@gmail.com> wrote in news:edcedc39-894e-4ed4-8041-
> > > > > 324a3e27d...@i11g2000yqo.googlegroups.com:
>
> > > > > > HOW DO ATHEISTS EXPLAIN POLTERGEIST LEVITATION?
>
> > > > > How the fuck do you explain something that never happened?
>
> > > > How would you know it never happened unless you know everything that
> > > > has happened?
>
> > > Have you any OBJECTIVE PHYSICAL EVIDENCE that any such alleged events
> > > have ever happened?
>
> > Tsk, tsk, tsk. You are avoiding my question ["How would you know it
> > never happened..."] and shifting the burden of proof. I didn't make
> > any claims. You did.
>
> > > Until you do, and it has been vetted and accepted by non-theists,
> > > it is a non-event.
>
> > My goodness! I just asked you to back up your claim. You claim
> > inflicts no burden upon me to disprove it. Did you think it did?
>
> You asked how do atheists explain poltergeist levitation,

Bullshit. Please retract this false accusation.

and you were
> asked for evidence that such things occurred. Seems to me you are
> avoiding your responsiblity of confirming such a thing happens.

Incorrect.

My correspondent said (to someone else) "How the fuck do you explain
something that never happened?"

And I asked him the obvious (to me) question: "How would you know 'it'
never happened unless you know everything that has happened?"

Instead of answering that question, my correspondent tried to shift
the burden of proof, as pointed out above.

Ok?

Devils Advocaat

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Jul 22, 2012, 5:36:42 AM7/22/12
to
I stand corrected.

My apologies.

Waldo Tunnel

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Jul 22, 2012, 9:08:17 AM7/22/12
to
On Jul 22, 2:36 am, Devils Advocaat <mankygo...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Jul 22, 8:55 am, Waldo Tunnel <waldotun...@gmail.com> wrote:

[...]

> My apologies.

Thank you.

Perseus

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Jul 22, 2012, 8:50:04 AM7/22/12
to
With this argument, we would never be able to dismissed old gods,
exterminated by Christians. How do you know that those gods were not
real, if you do not know how many god exist?

Then, for normal people like us, we do not need to be 100% sure of
something. It is enough to consider that something is unlikely for
the simple reason that you never had watched it. Not even in the
movies of Hollywood. But, beware; for not all that you can see in the
movies or in the TV is real.

Then, this shit of of "levitation" I have heard off, but I never
watched it.
I have never observed anyone levitating, then this story is more or
less like UFOS or aliens or to watch angels flying.
"Look, up there! There is angel up there flying! Look!"
"No, this is not angel, it's Superman!"
"Superman?"
"Yeah! Look at his cloak fluttering in the wind!"
"Well, in this case, it must be Superman."

Then, we do not need to prove anything.
If you see Superman flying? You do not need to prove it.
You are watching Superman flying, or someone that looks like Superman.

Perseus

Waldo Tunnel

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Jul 22, 2012, 11:19:44 AM7/22/12
to
On Jul 22, 5:50 am, Perseus <leopoldo.perd...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Jul 22, 8:55 am, Waldo Tunnel <waldotun...@gmail.com> wrote:

[...]
>
> > My correspondent said (to someone else) "How the fuck do you explain
> > something that never happened?"
>
> > And I asked him the obvious (to me) question: "How would you know 'it'
> > never happened unless you know everything that has happened?"
>
> With this argument,

What argument? Read what I wrote. I asked a question. Got an answer?

>we would never be able to dismissed [sic] old gods,
> exterminated by Christians.  How do you know that those gods were not
> real, if you do not know how many god exist?

I think you need to read the thread a bit closer.
>
> Then, for normal people like us, we do not need to be 100% sure of
> something.

But you *do* need to claim to be 100% certain.

> It is enough to consider that something is unlikely for
> the simple reason that you never had watched it.

LOL! Do you grok the difference between something "unlikely" to have
happened and "something that never happened"?

> Not even in the
> movies of Hollywood.  But, beware; for not all that you can see in the
> movies or in the TV is real.

I'll keep that in mind.

> Then, this shit of of [sic] "levitation" I have heard off [sic], but I never
> watched it.

> I have never observed anyone levitating, then this story is more or
> less like UFOS or aliens or to watch angels flying.

You never observed levitation so it has to be fake.

> "Look, up there!  There is angel up there flying!  Look!"
> "No, this is not angel, it's Superman!"
> "Superman?"
> "Yeah!  Look at his cloak fluttering in the wind!"
> "Well, in this case, it must be Superman."

That's very entertaining.
>
> Then, we do not need to prove anything.

'We"?

Try again.

Bob Casanova

unread,
Jul 22, 2012, 1:21:49 PM7/22/12
to
On Sat, 21 Jul 2012 22:49:08 -0700 (PDT), the following
appeared in sci.skeptic, posted by Waldo Tunnel
<waldo...@gmail.com>:

>On Jul 19, 12:59�am, Virgil <vir...@ligriv.com> wrote:
>> In article
>> <895dedae-c2c4-4eeb-b3d1-21355ae7b...@n9g2000pbi.googlegroups.com>,
>> �Waldo Tunnel <waldotun...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> > On Jul 10, 6:17�pm, Cujo DeSockpuppet <c...@petitmorte.net> wrote:
>> > > Emmett Till <etill1...@gmail.com> wrote in news:edcedc39-894e-4ed4-8041-
>> > > 324a3e27d...@i11g2000yqo.googlegroups.com:
>>
>> > > > HOW DO ATHEISTS EXPLAIN POLTERGEIST LEVITATION?
>>
>> > > How the fuck do you explain something that never happened?
>>
>> > How would you know it never happened unless you know everything that
>> > has happened?
>>
>> Have you any OBJECTIVE PHYSICAL EVIDENCE that any such alleged events
>> have ever happened?
>
>Tsk, tsk, tsk. You are avoiding my question ["How would you know it
>never happened..."] and shifting the burden of proof. I didn't make
>any claims. You did.

Wrong. You made the claim; he merely stated that he believes
the event never happened. It's now up to you to provide
evidence that it did.

>> Until you do, and it has been vetted and accepted by non-theists,
>> it is a non-event.
>
>My goodness! I just asked you to back up your claim. You claim
>inflicts no burden upon me to disprove it. Did you think it did?

You have an interesting idea regarding the burden of proof.
Here's a hint: If I say "There are fairies dancing on my
bedroom ceiling every night" and you say you don't believe
me, the burden of proof doesn't shift from me to you; it's
always the positive claim which requires support. In this
case, that's the implied claim that poltergeists exist.

HTH.

Bob Casanova

unread,
Jul 22, 2012, 1:26:23 PM7/22/12
to
On Sun, 22 Jul 2012 10:21:49 -0700, the following appeared
in sci.skeptic, posted by Bob Casanova <nos...@buzz.off>:

>On Sat, 21 Jul 2012 22:49:08 -0700 (PDT), the following
>appeared in sci.skeptic, posted by Waldo Tunnel
><waldo...@gmail.com>:
>
>>On Jul 19, 12:59�am, Virgil <vir...@ligriv.com> wrote:
>>> In article
>>> <895dedae-c2c4-4eeb-b3d1-21355ae7b...@n9g2000pbi.googlegroups.com>,
>>> �Waldo Tunnel <waldotun...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> > On Jul 10, 6:17�pm, Cujo DeSockpuppet <c...@petitmorte.net> wrote:
>>> > > Emmett Till <etill1...@gmail.com> wrote in news:edcedc39-894e-4ed4-8041-
>>> > > 324a3e27d...@i11g2000yqo.googlegroups.com:
>>>
>>> > > > HOW DO ATHEISTS EXPLAIN POLTERGEIST LEVITATION?
>>>
>>> > > How the fuck do you explain something that never happened?
>>>
>>> > How would you know it never happened unless you know everything that
>>> > has happened?
>>>
>>> Have you any OBJECTIVE PHYSICAL EVIDENCE that any such alleged events
>>> have ever happened?
>>
>>Tsk, tsk, tsk. You are avoiding my question ["How would you know it
>>never happened..."] and shifting the burden of proof. I didn't make
>>any claims. You did.
>
>Wrong. You made the claim; he merely stated that he believes
>the event never happened. It's now up to you to provide
>evidence that it did.

Oops; my error. Emmett made the claim, and it's up to him to
provide the evidence supporting that claim (although he
seems to have run away). You merely posted an incorrect idea

Free Lunch

unread,
Jul 22, 2012, 1:30:05 PM7/22/12
to
On Sun, 22 Jul 2012 10:21:49 -0700, Bob Casanova <nos...@buzz.off> wrote
in alt.talk.creationism:

>On Sat, 21 Jul 2012 22:49:08 -0700 (PDT), the following
>appeared in sci.skeptic, posted by Waldo Tunnel
><waldo...@gmail.com>:
>
>>On Jul 19, 12:59�am, Virgil <vir...@ligriv.com> wrote:
>>> In article
>>> <895dedae-c2c4-4eeb-b3d1-21355ae7b...@n9g2000pbi.googlegroups.com>,
>>> �Waldo Tunnel <waldotun...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> > On Jul 10, 6:17�pm, Cujo DeSockpuppet <c...@petitmorte.net> wrote:
>>> > > Emmett Till <etill1...@gmail.com> wrote in news:edcedc39-894e-4ed4-8041-
>>> > > 324a3e27d...@i11g2000yqo.googlegroups.com:
>>>
>>> > > > HOW DO ATHEISTS EXPLAIN POLTERGEIST LEVITATION?
>>>
>>> > > How the fuck do you explain something that never happened?
>>>
>>> > How would you know it never happened unless you know everything that
>>> > has happened?
>>>
>>> Have you any OBJECTIVE PHYSICAL EVIDENCE that any such alleged events
>>> have ever happened?
>>
>>Tsk, tsk, tsk. You are avoiding my question ["How would you know it
>>never happened..."] and shifting the burden of proof. I didn't make
>>any claims. You did.
>
>Wrong. You made the claim; he merely stated that he believes
>the event never happened. It's now up to you to provide
>evidence that it did.

But he clearly does not want to, that is why he tried to mislead people
about who has the burden of proof.

>>> Until you do, and it has been vetted and accepted by non-theists,
>>> it is a non-event.
>>
>>My goodness! I just asked you to back up your claim. You claim
>>inflicts no burden upon me to disprove it. Did you think it did?
>
>You have an interesting idea regarding the burden of proof.
>Here's a hint: If I say "There are fairies dancing on my
>bedroom ceiling every night" and you say you don't believe
>me, the burden of proof doesn't shift from me to you; it's
>always the positive claim which requires support. In this
>case, that's the implied claim that poltergeists exist.

Does anyone think he does not realize that? It's pure dishonesty on his
part to whine about not being able to ignore his own failure to produce
evidence.

The Chief Castrator Of The Jews

unread,
Jul 22, 2012, 2:19:58 PM7/22/12
to
On Jul 11, 4:27 am, "skyey...@yahoo.com" <skyey...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On Jul 10, 6:35 am, Emmett Till <etill1...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > HOW DO ATHEISTS EXPLAIN POLTERGEIST LEVITATION?
>
> >http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDjwQIneBks&noredirect=1

Don't you have better things to do with your time? You seem to have
plainty of that
in your hands

Bob Casanova

unread,
Jul 23, 2012, 1:20:50 PM7/23/12
to
On Sun, 22 Jul 2012 12:30:05 -0500, the following appeared
in sci.skeptic, posted by Free Lunch <lu...@nofreelunch.us>:
Yep. But I should note that I reposted, with the correction
that Emmett actually made the claim and Waldo was only an
enabler.

>>>> Until you do, and it has been vetted and accepted by non-theists,
>>>> it is a non-event.
>>>
>>>My goodness! I just asked you to back up your claim. You claim
>>>inflicts no burden upon me to disprove it. Did you think it did?
>>
>>You have an interesting idea regarding the burden of proof.
>>Here's a hint: If I say "There are fairies dancing on my
>>bedroom ceiling every night" and you say you don't believe
>>me, the burden of proof doesn't shift from me to you; it's
>>always the positive claim which requires support. In this
>>case, that's the implied claim that poltergeists exist.
>
>Does anyone think he does not realize that? It's pure dishonesty on his
>part to whine about not being able to ignore his own failure to produce
>evidence.

Dunno. I suspect that *Emmett* may not realize it. Of
course, Emmett was apparently only a drive-by poster, so it
may be a moot point.

And I suspect that Waldo may indeed realize it, and on whom
the burden of proof rests, but enjoys trolling.

Mike Painter

unread,
Jul 23, 2012, 4:18:45 PM7/23/12
to
Wires and off camera throwers.

And God.
And devils.
And ghosts.
And cats.

Free Lunch

unread,
Jul 23, 2012, 6:48:11 PM7/23/12
to
On Mon, 23 Jul 2012 10:20:50 -0700, Bob Casanova <nos...@buzz.off> wrote
I noticed that after posting, but wasn't sure what was going on at that
point.

Bob Casanova

unread,
Jul 24, 2012, 12:49:37 PM7/24/12
to
On Mon, 23 Jul 2012 17:48:11 -0500, the following appeared
You're still ahead of Emmett...

And neither Emmett nor Waldo has chosen to address the basic
point regarding the burden of proof, which says quite a bit.

>>>>>> Until you do, and it has been vetted and accepted by non-theists,
>>>>>> it is a non-event.
>>>>>
>>>>>My goodness! I just asked you to back up your claim. You claim
>>>>>inflicts no burden upon me to disprove it. Did you think it did?
>>>>
>>>>You have an interesting idea regarding the burden of proof.
>>>>Here's a hint: If I say "There are fairies dancing on my
>>>>bedroom ceiling every night" and you say you don't believe
>>>>me, the burden of proof doesn't shift from me to you; it's
>>>>always the positive claim which requires support. In this
>>>>case, that's the implied claim that poltergeists exist.
>>>
>>>Does anyone think he does not realize that? It's pure dishonesty on his
>>>part to whine about not being able to ignore his own failure to produce
>>>evidence.
>>
>>Dunno. I suspect that *Emmett* may not realize it. Of
>>course, Emmett was apparently only a drive-by poster, so it
>>may be a moot point.
>>
>>And I suspect that Waldo may indeed realize it, and on whom
>>the burden of proof rests, but enjoys trolling.

Waldo Tunnel

unread,
Jul 24, 2012, 2:09:25 PM7/24/12
to
On Jul 22, 10:21 am, Bob Casanova <nos...@buzz.off> wrote:
> On Sat, 21 Jul 2012 22:49:08 -0700 (PDT), the following
> appeared in sci.skeptic, posted by Waldo Tunnel
> <waldotun...@gmail.com>:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> >On Jul 19, 12:59 am, Virgil <vir...@ligriv.com> wrote:
> >> In article
> >> <895dedae-c2c4-4eeb-b3d1-21355ae7b...@n9g2000pbi.googlegroups.com>,
> >>  Waldo Tunnel <waldotun...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >> > On Jul 10, 6:17 pm, Cujo DeSockpuppet <c...@petitmorte.net> wrote:
> >> > > Emmett Till <etill1...@gmail.com> wrote in news:edcedc39-894e-4ed4-8041-
> >> > > 324a3e27d...@i11g2000yqo.googlegroups.com:
>
> >> > > > HOW DO ATHEISTS EXPLAIN POLTERGEIST LEVITATION?
>
> >> > > How the fuck do you explain something that never happened?
>
> >> > How would you know it never happened unless you know everything that
> >> > has happened?
>
> >> Have you any OBJECTIVE PHYSICAL EVIDENCE that any such alleged events
> >> have ever happened?
>
> >Tsk, tsk, tsk. You are avoiding my question ["How would you know it
> >never happened..."] and shifting the burden of proof. I didn't make
> >any claims. You did.
>
> Wrong.

I'm surprised you wish to take an obvious joke seriously. But hey,
why not?

>You made the claim;

Please quote my "claim."

> he merely stated that he believes
> the event never happened.

He doesn't believe in POLTERGEIST LEVITATION? What about you?

> It's now up to you to provide evidence that it did.

Because....?


>
> >> Until you do, and it has been vetted and accepted by non-theists,
> >> it is a non-event.
>
> >My goodness! I just asked you to back up your claim. You claim
> >inflicts no burden upon me to disprove it. Did you think it did?
>
> You have an interesting idea regarding the burden of proof.

Or you don't read very closely.

> Here's a hint: If I say "There are fairies dancing on my
> bedroom ceiling every night" and you say you don't believe
> me, the burden of proof doesn't shift from me to you;

Because you haven't made a claim in this softball hypothetical you
threw to yourself. But if you said "It is impossible to see fairies of
any definition dancing on my bedroom ceiling every night" then the
burden might very well shift to you.

> it's always the positive claim which requires support.

Baloney. Got a reference you can quote on this subject? Or is it just
too obviously true for you to bother backing up?

If I say "No God exists" it doesn't fall to anyone who disagrees with
me to prove me wrong. And if they do not, it doesn't prove no god
exists.


In this
> case, that's the implied claim that poltergeists exist.

Ah. The "implied" claim. Well, I think I implied somewhere that you
were wrong.

Bob Casanova

unread,
Jul 25, 2012, 1:13:20 PM7/25/12
to
On Tue, 24 Jul 2012 11:09:25 -0700 (PDT), the following
appeared in sci.skeptic, posted by Waldo Tunnel
<waldo...@gmail.com>:

>On Jul 22, 10:21�am, Bob Casanova <nos...@buzz.off> wrote:
>> On Sat, 21 Jul 2012 22:49:08 -0700 (PDT), the following
>> appeared in sci.skeptic, posted by Waldo Tunnel
>> <waldotun...@gmail.com>:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> >On Jul 19, 12:59�am, Virgil <vir...@ligriv.com> wrote:
>> >> In article
>> >> <895dedae-c2c4-4eeb-b3d1-21355ae7b...@n9g2000pbi.googlegroups.com>,
>> >> �Waldo Tunnel <waldotun...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> >> > On Jul 10, 6:17�pm, Cujo DeSockpuppet <c...@petitmorte.net> wrote:
>> >> > > Emmett Till <etill1...@gmail.com> wrote in news:edcedc39-894e-4ed4-8041-
>> >> > > 324a3e27d...@i11g2000yqo.googlegroups.com:
>>
>> >> > > > HOW DO ATHEISTS EXPLAIN POLTERGEIST LEVITATION?
>>
>> >> > > How the fuck do you explain something that never happened?
>>
>> >> > How would you know it never happened unless you know everything that
>> >> > has happened?
>>
>> >> Have you any OBJECTIVE PHYSICAL EVIDENCE that any such alleged events
>> >> have ever happened?
>>
>> >Tsk, tsk, tsk. You are avoiding my question ["How would you know it
>> >never happened..."] and shifting the burden of proof. I didn't make
>> >any claims. You did.
>>
>> Wrong.
>
> I'm surprised you wish to take an obvious joke seriously. But hey,
>why not?

Indeed. It's become a cliche that it's
difficult-to-impossible to distinguish a Loki from a genuine
loon.

>>You made the claim;
>
>Please quote my "claim."

I posted a correction, in which I noted that I'd gotten the
claimant wrong; perhaps you missed it. It was Emmett's
claim, not yours.

Perseus

unread,
Jul 25, 2012, 1:18:32 PM7/25/12
to
On Jul 22, 4:19 pm, Waldo Tunnel <waldotun...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Jul 22, 5:50 am, Perseus <leopoldo.perd...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > On Jul 22, 8:55 am, Waldo Tunnel <waldotun...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> [...]
>
>
>
> > > My correspondent said (to someone else) "How the fuck do you explain
> > > something that never happened?"
>
> > > And I asked him the obvious (to me) question: "How would you know 'it'
> > > never happened unless you know everything that has happened?"
>
> > With this argument,
>
> What argument? Read what I wrote. I asked a question. Got an answer?
>
>  >we would never be able to dismissed [sic] old gods,
>
> > exterminated by Christians.  How do you know that those gods were not
> > real, if you do not know how many god exist?
>
> I think you need to read the thread a bit closer.
>
>
>
> > Then, for normal people like us, we do not need to be 100% sure of
> > something.
>
> But you *do* need to claim to be 100% certain.
>
> > It is enough to consider that something is unlikely for
> > the simple reason that you never had watched it.
>
> LOL! Do you grok the difference between something "unlikely" to have
> happened and "something that never happened"?

Not any need. We only can argue rationally on things that occurred,
not on things that someone says it happened.
If were were to worry about all the shit stories people said it had
occurred, we would had not any time to worry about things real, that
are occurring.

It is a nonsense attitude to worry about things some people said "had
occurred" unless they are very likely, for they are similar to events
that had occurred for sure.

Perseus

felix_unger

unread,
Dec 7, 2013, 8:25:49 AM12/7/13
to
On 10-July-2012 11:35 PM, Emmett Till wrote:
> HOW DO ATHEISTS EXPLAIN POLTERGEIST LEVITATION?
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDjwQIneBks&noredirect=1

The same way they respond to everything that doesn't fit their
beliefs... "It doesn't exist!"

--
rgds,

Pete
-------
�People sleep peacefully in their beds only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf�

Les

unread,
Dec 7, 2013, 10:37:19 AM12/7/13
to
On Sun, 08 Dec 2013 00:25:49 +1100, felix_unger <m...@nothere.biz>
wrote:

>On 10-July-2012 11:35 PM, Emmett Till wrote:
>> HOW DO ATHEISTS EXPLAIN POLTERGEIST LEVITATION?
>>
>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDjwQIneBks&noredirect=1
>
>The same way they respond to everything that doesn't fit their
>beliefs... "It doesn't exist!"

Is this part of our 'atheist beliefs system' we keep hearing
vague rumour about?

The ones that are so secret even we are not not permitted
to know what they are?


--
Les Hellawell
Greeting from:
YORKSHIRE - Europe's top Destination 2013
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-23930147

"In our more diverse and secular society, the place of religion has
come to be a matter of lively discussion. It is rightly acknowledged
that people of faith have no monopoly of virtue and that the wellbeing
and prosperity of the nation depend on the contribution of individuals
and groups of all faiths and of none. "

- Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth II
- from a speech to the Synond of the Church of England in 2010

Bob Casanova

unread,
Dec 7, 2013, 12:12:54 PM12/7/13
to
On Sat, 07 Dec 2013 15:37:19 +0000, the following appeared
in sci.skeptic, posted by Les <l...@sharnt.tell>:

>On Sun, 08 Dec 2013 00:25:49 +1100, felix_unger <m...@nothere.biz>
>wrote:
>
>>On 10-July-2012 11:35 PM, Emmett Till wrote:
>>> HOW DO ATHEISTS EXPLAIN POLTERGEIST LEVITATION?
>>>
>>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDjwQIneBks&noredirect=1
>>
>>The same way they respond to everything that doesn't fit their
>>beliefs... "It doesn't exist!"
>
>Is this part of our 'atheist beliefs system' we keep hearing
>vague rumour about?
>
>The ones that are so secret even we are not not permitted
>to know what they are?

I'm just curious to know the connection between disbelief in
poltergeists and atheism...

Are poltergeists supposedly deities of some sort?
--

Bob C.

"The most exciting phrase to hear in science,
the one that heralds new discoveries, is not
'Eureka!' but 'That's funny...'"

- Isaac Asimov

Freedom Man

unread,
Dec 7, 2013, 1:01:39 PM12/7/13
to
"felix_unger" <m...@nothere.biz> wrote in message
news:bgglv6...@mid.individual.net...
> On 10-July-2012 11:35 PM, Emmett Till wrote:
>> HOW DO ATHEISTS EXPLAIN POLTERGEIST LEVITATION?
>>
>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDjwQIneBks&noredirect=1
>
> The same way they respond to everything that doesn't fit their beliefs...
> "It doesn't exist!"

No, the fact that science has not yet explained some phenomena does not
justify the ignorant assumption that it cannot.
Myth and superstition always fade in the light shed by true knowledge.
That's why the religious idiots oppose scientific progress!


felix_unger

unread,
Dec 7, 2013, 5:50:13 PM12/7/13
to
On 08-December-2013 4:12 AM, Bob Casanova wrote:

> On Sat, 07 Dec 2013 15:37:19 +0000, the following appeared
> in sci.skeptic, posted by Les <l...@sharnt.tell>:
>
>> On Sun, 08 Dec 2013 00:25:49 +1100, felix_unger <m...@nothere.biz>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> On 10-July-2012 11:35 PM, Emmett Till wrote:
>>>> HOW DO ATHEISTS EXPLAIN POLTERGEIST LEVITATION?
>>>>
>>>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDjwQIneBks&noredirect=1
>>> The same way they respond to everything that doesn't fit their
>>> beliefs... "It doesn't exist!"
>> Is this part of our 'atheist beliefs system' we keep hearing
>> vague rumour about?
>>
>> The ones that are so secret even we are not not permitted
>> to know what they are?
> I'm just curious to know the connection between disbelief in
> poltergeists and atheism...

it seems that atheists don't accept the existence of anything
supra-normal, para-normal, supernatural, etc.,

>
> Are poltergeists supposedly deities of some sort?


--

felix_unger

unread,
Dec 7, 2013, 5:51:48 PM12/7/13
to
On 08-December-2013 5:01 AM, Freedom Man wrote:
> "felix_unger" <m...@nothere.biz> wrote in message
> news:bgglv6...@mid.individual.net...
>> On 10-July-2012 11:35 PM, Emmett Till wrote:
>>> HOW DO ATHEISTS EXPLAIN POLTERGEIST LEVITATION?
>>>
>>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDjwQIneBks&noredirect=1
>> The same way they respond to everything that doesn't fit their beliefs...
>> "It doesn't exist!"
> No, the fact that science has not yet explained some phenomena does not
> justify the ignorant assumption that it cannot.

correct

> Myth and superstition always fade in the light shed by true knowledge.
> That's why the religious idiots oppose scientific progress!
>
>


Jeanne Douglas

unread,
Dec 7, 2013, 6:52:29 PM12/7/13
to
In article <bgglv6...@mid.individual.net>,
felix_unger <m...@nothere.biz> wrote:

> On 10-July-2012 11:35 PM, Emmett Till wrote:
> > HOW DO ATHEISTS EXPLAIN POLTERGEIST LEVITATION?
> >
> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDjwQIneBks&noredirect=1
>
> The same way they respond to everything that doesn't fit their
> beliefs... "It doesn't exist!"


What beliefs?

--

JD

"If our country is going broke, let it be from
feeding the poor and caring for the elderly.
And not from pampering the rich and fighting
wars for them."--Living Blue in a Red State (seen on Facebook)

Jeanne Douglas

unread,
Dec 7, 2013, 6:53:34 PM12/7/13
to
In article <fll6a95ug3b9nq6gl...@4ax.com>,
Bob Casanova <nos...@buzz.off> wrote:

> On Sat, 07 Dec 2013 15:37:19 +0000, the following appeared
> in sci.skeptic, posted by Les <l...@sharnt.tell>:
>
> >On Sun, 08 Dec 2013 00:25:49 +1100, felix_unger <m...@nothere.biz>
> >wrote:
> >
> >>On 10-July-2012 11:35 PM, Emmett Till wrote:
> >>> HOW DO ATHEISTS EXPLAIN POLTERGEIST LEVITATION?
> >>>
> >>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDjwQIneBks&noredirect=1
> >>
> >>The same way they respond to everything that doesn't fit their
> >>beliefs... "It doesn't exist!"
> >
> >Is this part of our 'atheist beliefs system' we keep hearing
> >vague rumour about?
> >
> >The ones that are so secret even we are not not permitted
> >to know what they are?
>
> I'm just curious to know the connection between disbelief in
> poltergeists and atheism...
>
> Are poltergeists supposedly deities of some sort?

If you can believe in a god without evidence, how hard would it be to
believe in other supernatural beings--like ghosts and poltergeists?

Jeanne Douglas

unread,
Dec 7, 2013, 6:54:50 PM12/7/13
to
In article <bghn1g...@mid.individual.net>,
felix_unger <m...@nothere.biz> wrote:

> On 08-December-2013 4:12 AM, Bob Casanova wrote:
>
> > On Sat, 07 Dec 2013 15:37:19 +0000, the following appeared
> > in sci.skeptic, posted by Les <l...@sharnt.tell>:
> >
> >> On Sun, 08 Dec 2013 00:25:49 +1100, felix_unger <m...@nothere.biz>
> >> wrote:
> >>
> >>> On 10-July-2012 11:35 PM, Emmett Till wrote:
> >>>> HOW DO ATHEISTS EXPLAIN POLTERGEIST LEVITATION?
> >>>>
> >>>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDjwQIneBks&noredirect=1
> >>> The same way they respond to everything that doesn't fit their
> >>> beliefs... "It doesn't exist!"
> >> Is this part of our 'atheist beliefs system' we keep hearing
> >> vague rumour about?
> >>
> >> The ones that are so secret even we are not not permitted
> >> to know what they are?
> > I'm just curious to know the connection between disbelief in
> > poltergeists and atheism...
>
> it seems that atheists don't accept the existence of anything
> supra-normal, para-normal, supernatural, etc.,


Precisely. We don't accept the existence of anything that has no
objective and verifiable evidence that it exists.

Thanks for the acknowledgement of our intelligence and sanity.

felix_unger

unread,
Dec 7, 2013, 9:35:40 PM12/7/13
to
On 08-December-2013 10:52 AM, Jeanne Douglas wrote:
> In article <bgglv6...@mid.individual.net>,
> felix_unger <m...@nothere.biz> wrote:
>
>> On 10-July-2012 11:35 PM, Emmett Till wrote:
>>> HOW DO ATHEISTS EXPLAIN POLTERGEIST LEVITATION?
>>>
>>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDjwQIneBks&noredirect=1
>> The same way they respond to everything that doesn't fit their
>> beliefs... "It doesn't exist!"
>
> What beliefs?
>

The ones you just praised me for acknowledging, for example

Jeanne Douglas

unread,
Dec 7, 2013, 9:43:30 PM12/7/13
to
In article <bgi485...@mid.individual.net>,
felix_unger <m...@nothere.biz> wrote:

> On 08-December-2013 10:52 AM, Jeanne Douglas wrote:
> > In article <bgglv6...@mid.individual.net>,
> > felix_unger <m...@nothere.biz> wrote:
> >
> >> On 10-July-2012 11:35 PM, Emmett Till wrote:
> >>> HOW DO ATHEISTS EXPLAIN POLTERGEIST LEVITATION?
> >>>
> >>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDjwQIneBks&noredirect=1
> >> The same way they respond to everything that doesn't fit their
> >> beliefs... "It doesn't exist!"
> >
> > What beliefs?
> >
>
> The ones you just praised me for acknowledging, for example

What did I praise?

What beliefs ?

felix_unger

unread,
Dec 7, 2013, 9:55:03 PM12/7/13
to
On 08-December-2013 1:43 PM, Jeanne Douglas wrote:
> In article <bgi485...@mid.individual.net>,
> felix_unger <m...@nothere.biz> wrote:
>
>> On 08-December-2013 10:52 AM, Jeanne Douglas wrote:
>>> In article <bgglv6...@mid.individual.net>,
>>> felix_unger <m...@nothere.biz> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 10-July-2012 11:35 PM, Emmett Till wrote:
>>>>> HOW DO ATHEISTS EXPLAIN POLTERGEIST LEVITATION?
>>>>>
>>>>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDjwQIneBks&noredirect=1
>>>> The same way they respond to everything that doesn't fit their
>>>> beliefs... "It doesn't exist!"
>>> What beliefs?
>>>
>> The ones you just praised me for acknowledging, for example
> What did I praise?
>
> What beliefs ?
>

(sigh) don't you even know what you post??

> it seems that atheists don't accept the existence of anything
> supra-normal, para-normal, supernatural, etc.,

Precisely. We don't accept the existence of anything that has no
objective and verifiable evidence that it exists.

Thanks for the acknowledgement of our intelligence and sanity.

Jeanne Douglas

unread,
Dec 7, 2013, 10:11:51 PM12/7/13
to
In article <bgi5cg...@mid.individual.net>,
felix_unger <m...@nothere.biz> wrote:

> On 08-December-2013 1:43 PM, Jeanne Douglas wrote:
> > In article <bgi485...@mid.individual.net>,
> > felix_unger <m...@nothere.biz> wrote:
> >
> >> On 08-December-2013 10:52 AM, Jeanne Douglas wrote:
> >>> In article <bgglv6...@mid.individual.net>,
> >>> felix_unger <m...@nothere.biz> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> On 10-July-2012 11:35 PM, Emmett Till wrote:
> >>>>> HOW DO ATHEISTS EXPLAIN POLTERGEIST LEVITATION?
> >>>>>
> >>>>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDjwQIneBks&noredirect=1
> >>>> The same way they respond to everything that doesn't fit their
> >>>> beliefs... "It doesn't exist!"
> >>> What beliefs?
> >>>
> >> The ones you just praised me for acknowledging, for example
> > What did I praise?
> >
> > What beliefs ?
> >
>
> (sigh) don't you even know what you post??

I post a lot, on many subject, both here and elsewhere. That's why it's
polite to leave what you're responding to in the messages you send. It's
necessary to remind me what discussion I'm in.

Now what are these beliefs that you think I have?



> > it seems that atheists don't accept the existence of anything
> > supra-normal, para-normal, supernatural, etc.,
>
> Precisely. We don't accept the existence of anything that has no
> objective and verifiable evidence that it exists.
>
> Thanks for the acknowledgement of our intelligence and sanity.

--

felix_unger

unread,
Dec 7, 2013, 10:26:29 PM12/7/13
to
On 08-December-2013 2:11 PM, Jeanne Douglas wrote:
> In article <bgi5cg...@mid.individual.net>,
> felix_unger <m...@nothere.biz> wrote:
>
>> On 08-December-2013 1:43 PM, Jeanne Douglas wrote:
>>> In article <bgi485...@mid.individual.net>,
>>> felix_unger <m...@nothere.biz> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 08-December-2013 10:52 AM, Jeanne Douglas wrote:
>>>>> In article <bgglv6...@mid.individual.net>,
>>>>> felix_unger <m...@nothere.biz> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On 10-July-2012 11:35 PM, Emmett Till wrote:
>>>>>>> HOW DO ATHEISTS EXPLAIN POLTERGEIST LEVITATION?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDjwQIneBks&noredirect=1
>>>>>> The same way they respond to everything that doesn't fit their
>>>>>> beliefs... "It doesn't exist!"
>>>>> What beliefs?
>>>>>
>>>> The ones you just praised me for acknowledging, for example
>>> What did I praise?
>>>
>>> What beliefs ?
>>>
>> (sigh) don't you even know what you post??
> I post a lot, on many subject, both here and elsewhere. That's why it's
> polite to leave what you're responding to in the messages you send. It's
> necessary to remind me what discussion I'm in.
>
> Now what are these beliefs that you think I have?

these:

>> > it seems that atheists don't accept the existence of anything
>> > supra-normal, para-normal, supernatural, etc.,
>>
>> Precisely. We don't accept the existence of anything that has no
>> objective and verifiable evidence that it exists.


but to save excessive posting, I will cut to the chase:.. you either
believe such things don't exist, or they do exist, or are agnostic about
them ie. believe they may or may not exist. You can't escape the fact
that you have a believe about such things.

>>
>> Thanks for the acknowledgement of our intelligence and sanity.

some atheists are intelligent, some are very intelligent, and some are
very, very stupid, angry, biased and hateful

Jeanne Douglas

unread,
Dec 8, 2013, 3:22:32 AM12/8/13
to
In article <bgi77g...@mid.individual.net>,
That's not a belief. That's absence of a belief.


> but to save excessive posting, I will cut to the chase:.. you either
> believe such things don't exist, or they do exist, or are agnostic about
> them ie. believe they may or may not exist. You can't escape the fact
> that you have a believe about such things.

I have no belief at all in any of those things.

Without evidence, only a fool forms an opinion or belief.

SkyEyes

unread,
Dec 8, 2013, 3:28:48 AM12/8/13
to
felix_unger <m...@nothere.biz> wrote in news:bghn1gFmslcU1
@mid.individual.net:

> it seems that atheists don't accept the existence of anything
> supra-normal, para-normal, supernatural, etc.,

No. Atheists don't accept the arguments for the existence of any god or
gods. That's all. There are atheists who believe in ghosts.

--
Brenda Nelson, A.A.#34 and A+ atheist

felix_unger

unread,
Dec 8, 2013, 4:09:19 AM12/8/13
to
You can't escape from the rationality that if you don't believe they do
exist, and don't believe they don't exist, then by default you believe
they may or may not exist, which is what you have said, whether you like
it or not

Les

unread,
Dec 8, 2013, 4:15:49 AM12/8/13
to
On Sun, 08 Dec 2013 09:50:13 +1100, felix_unger <m...@nothere.biz>
wrote:

>On 08-December-2013 4:12 AM, Bob Casanova wrote:
>
>> On Sat, 07 Dec 2013 15:37:19 +0000, the following appeared
>> in sci.skeptic, posted by Les <l...@sharnt.tell>:
>>
>>> On Sun, 08 Dec 2013 00:25:49 +1100, felix_unger <m...@nothere.biz>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 10-July-2012 11:35 PM, Emmett Till wrote:
>>>>> HOW DO ATHEISTS EXPLAIN POLTERGEIST LEVITATION?
>>>>>
>>>>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDjwQIneBks&noredirect=1
>>>> The same way they respond to everything that doesn't fit their
>>>> beliefs... "It doesn't exist!"
>>> Is this part of our 'atheist beliefs system' we keep hearing
>>> vague rumour about?
>>>
>>> The ones that are so secret even we are not not permitted
>>> to know what they are?
>> I'm just curious to know the connection between disbelief in
>> poltergeists and atheism...
>
>it seems that atheists don't accept the existence of anything
>supra-normal, para-normal, supernatural, etc.,
>

Fortunately we are not responsible for your 'seems'

Jeanne Douglas

unread,
Dec 8, 2013, 6:21:39 AM12/8/13
to
In article <bgiraa...@mid.individual.net>,
Now you're getting it. Good.

felix_unger

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Dec 8, 2013, 6:50:01 AM12/8/13
to
You are one greatly confused person. first you deny you have any
beliefs, when I claim you do, then when I explain why you do, you agree!

Jeanne Douglas

unread,
Dec 8, 2013, 7:00:40 AM12/8/13
to
In article <bgj4nk...@mid.individual.net>,
Believing something may or may not exist is not a belief. It's the lack
of a belief.

Sheesh!

Sylvia Else

unread,
Dec 8, 2013, 7:08:28 AM12/8/13
to
On 8/12/2013 12:25 AM, felix_unger wrote:
> On 10-July-2012 11:35 PM, Emmett Till wrote:
>> HOW DO ATHEISTS EXPLAIN POLTERGEIST LEVITATION?
>>
>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDjwQIneBks&noredirect=1
>
> The same way they respond to everything that doesn't fit their
> beliefs... "It doesn't exist!"
>

No, they say "show us one that couldn't have been faked."

Any competent conjuror could stage what was shown in the video.

Sylvia.

felix_unger

unread,
Dec 8, 2013, 7:09:13 AM12/8/13
to
You've just stated that a belief is a lack of belief. That's nonsense!
Let's suppose my coffee cup is empty. I don't say I lack a belief that
it's full, I say I believe it's empty!

linuxgal

unread,
Dec 8, 2013, 8:04:32 PM12/8/13
to
felix_unger wrote:
>
> You've just stated that a belief is a lack of belief. That's nonsense!
> Let's suppose my coffee cup is empty. I don't say I lack a belief that
> it's full, I say I believe it's empty!
>

I say evidence for coffee is not detected.

--
Need a spiritual home? Consider joining us at Mary Queen of the Universe
Latter-day Buddhislamic Free Will Christian UFO Synagogue of Vishnu

http://www.cleanposts.com

linuxgal

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Dec 8, 2013, 8:11:37 PM12/8/13
to
felix_unger wrote:
>
> You can't escape from the rationality that if you don't believe they do
> exist, and don't believe they don't exist, then by default you believe
> they may or may not exist, which is what you have said, whether you like
> it or not

One cannot not say "A four-sided triangle may or may not exist", because
it cannot exist, by definition. The God defined by most theists cannot
exist, simply because an eternal being who can see all of history and
the future as a panoply cannot be conscious of the current time, thus
negating his alleged omniscience. There are other approaches to the
same idea, such as the triple horns of evil, omnibenevolence, and
omnipotence.

Freedom Man

unread,
Dec 8, 2013, 10:29:27 AM12/8/13
to
"felix_unger" <m...@nothere.biz> wrote in message
news:bgglv6...@mid.individual.net...
> On 10-July-2012 11:35 PM, Emmett Till wrote:
>> HOW DO ATHEISTS EXPLAIN POLTERGEIST LEVITATION?
>>
>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDjwQIneBks&noredirect=1
>
> The same way they respond to everything that doesn't fit their beliefs...
> "It doesn't exist!"

No, the fact that science has not yet explained some phenomena does not
justify the ignorant assumption that it cannot.

Bob Casanova

unread,
Dec 8, 2013, 12:19:28 PM12/8/13
to
On Sun, 08 Dec 2013 09:50:13 +1100, the following appeared
in sci.skeptic, posted by felix_unger <m...@nothere.biz>:

>On 08-December-2013 4:12 AM, Bob Casanova wrote:
>
>> On Sat, 07 Dec 2013 15:37:19 +0000, the following appeared
>> in sci.skeptic, posted by Les <l...@sharnt.tell>:
>>
>>> On Sun, 08 Dec 2013 00:25:49 +1100, felix_unger <m...@nothere.biz>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 10-July-2012 11:35 PM, Emmett Till wrote:
>>>>> HOW DO ATHEISTS EXPLAIN POLTERGEIST LEVITATION?
>>>>>
>>>>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDjwQIneBks&noredirect=1
>>>> The same way they respond to everything that doesn't fit their
>>>> beliefs... "It doesn't exist!"
>>> Is this part of our 'atheist beliefs system' we keep hearing
>>> vague rumour about?
>>>
>>> The ones that are so secret even we are not not permitted
>>> to know what they are?
>> I'm just curious to know the connection between disbelief in
>> poltergeists and atheism...

>it seems that atheists don't accept the existence of anything
>supra-normal, para-normal, supernatural, etc.,

Ah, so it's a delusion of Emmett's? OK.

>> Are poltergeists supposedly deities of some sort?
--

Bob Casanova

unread,
Dec 8, 2013, 12:21:59 PM12/8/13
to
On Sat, 07 Dec 2013 15:53:34 -0800, the following appeared
in sci.skeptic, posted by Jeanne Douglas
<hlwd...@NOSPAMgmail.com>:

>In article <fll6a95ug3b9nq6gl...@4ax.com>,
> Bob Casanova <nos...@buzz.off> wrote:
>
>> On Sat, 07 Dec 2013 15:37:19 +0000, the following appeared
>> in sci.skeptic, posted by Les <l...@sharnt.tell>:
>>
>> >On Sun, 08 Dec 2013 00:25:49 +1100, felix_unger <m...@nothere.biz>
>> >wrote:
>> >
>> >>On 10-July-2012 11:35 PM, Emmett Till wrote:
>> >>> HOW DO ATHEISTS EXPLAIN POLTERGEIST LEVITATION?
>> >>>
>> >>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDjwQIneBks&noredirect=1
>> >>
>> >>The same way they respond to everything that doesn't fit their
>> >>beliefs... "It doesn't exist!"
>> >
>> >Is this part of our 'atheist beliefs system' we keep hearing
>> >vague rumour about?
>> >
>> >The ones that are so secret even we are not not permitted
>> >to know what they are?
>>
>> I'm just curious to know the connection between disbelief in
>> poltergeists and atheism...
>>
>> Are poltergeists supposedly deities of some sort?
>
>If you can believe in a god without evidence, how hard would it be to
>believe in other supernatural beings--like ghosts and poltergeists?

Not hard at all, but that seems to have reversed the claim;
(A implies B) does not equal (not-A implies not-B).

mur@.not

unread,
Dec 8, 2013, 2:32:37 PM12/8/13
to
On Sat, 07 Dec 2013 15:37:19 +0000, Les <l...@sharnt.tell> wrote:

>On Sun, 08 Dec 2013 00:25:49 +1100, felix_unger <m...@nothere.biz>
>wrote:
>
>>On 10-July-2012 11:35 PM, Emmett Till wrote:
>>> HOW DO ATHEISTS EXPLAIN POLTERGEIST LEVITATION?
>>>
>>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDjwQIneBks&noredirect=1
>>
>>The same way they respond to everything that doesn't fit their
>>beliefs... "It doesn't exist!"
>
>Is this part of our 'atheist beliefs system' we keep hearing
>vague rumour about?

Apparently you're not aware of different types of atheism.

>The ones that are so secret even we are not not permitted
>to know what they are?

You certainly seem to be completely clueless about something that's common
knowledge to plenty of people. Don't you have any clue at all what the
difference between strong atheism and weak atheism is? Here's a clue for you: If
you don't have any belief about the existence of God you are a weak atheist. If
you have the belief that God does not exist at all or even that no god has ever
had any influence on this planet then you DO have a belief making you a strong
atheist. IF you are a strong atheist, the amount of faith you have that your
belief is correct is what determines how strong an atheist you are.

george152

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Dec 8, 2013, 2:32:53 PM12/8/13
to
On 08/12/13 16:26, felix_unger wrote:

> some atheists are intelligent, some are very intelligent, and some are
> very, very stupid, angry, biased and hateful
>
The very, very stupid, angry, biased and hateful are, in the main,
believers who try to destroy anything not 'theirs' or paret of their
belief system.
Not sceptics

mur@.not

unread,
Dec 8, 2013, 2:33:09 PM12/8/13
to
On Sat, 07 Dec 2013 15:52:29 -0800, Jeanne Douglas <hlwd...@NOSPAMgmail.com>
wrote:

>In article <bgglv6...@mid.individual.net>,
> felix_unger <m...@nothere.biz> wrote:
>
>> On 10-July-2012 11:35 PM, Emmett Till wrote:
>> > HOW DO ATHEISTS EXPLAIN POLTERGEIST LEVITATION?
>> >
>> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDjwQIneBks&noredirect=1
>>
>> The same way they respond to everything that doesn't fit their
>> beliefs... "It doesn't exist!"
>
>
>What beliefs?

If you believe there are no gods in the universe or even that there are none
associated with this planet, then that's probably the belief he was referring
to. He might also take it for granted that if a person believes there is no God
associated with this planet, that person probably also believes there are no
ghosts associated with this planet. Maybe there are people who believe there's
no God associated but that there are ghosts, but they would probably be very
rare imo.

mur@.not

unread,
Dec 8, 2013, 2:40:07 PM12/8/13
to
On Sat, 07 Dec 2013 15:53:34 -0800, Jeanne Douglas <hlwd...@NOSPAMgmail.com>
wrote:

>In article <fll6a95ug3b9nq6gl...@4ax.com>,
> Bob Casanova <nos...@buzz.off> wrote:
>
>> On Sat, 07 Dec 2013 15:37:19 +0000, the following appeared
>> in sci.skeptic, posted by Les <l...@sharnt.tell>:
>>
>> >On Sun, 08 Dec 2013 00:25:49 +1100, felix_unger <m...@nothere.biz>
>> >wrote:
>> >
>> >>On 10-July-2012 11:35 PM, Emmett Till wrote:
>> >>> HOW DO ATHEISTS EXPLAIN POLTERGEIST LEVITATION?
>> >>>
>> >>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDjwQIneBks&noredirect=1
>> >>
>> >>The same way they respond to everything that doesn't fit their
>> >>beliefs... "It doesn't exist!"
>> >
>> >Is this part of our 'atheist beliefs system' we keep hearing
>> >vague rumour about?
>> >
>> >The ones that are so secret even we are not not permitted
>> >to know what they are?
>>
>> I'm just curious to know the connection between disbelief in
>> poltergeists and atheism...
>>
>> Are poltergeists supposedly deities of some sort?
>
>If you can believe in a god without evidence,

How could anyone believe in a god without evidence, when everything that
suggests god exists is evidence? There would be nothing to believe in if there
was no evidence to encourage belief in it. The concept wouldn't even exist if
there was no evidence for the concept at all.

>how hard would it be to
>believe in other supernatural beings--like ghosts and poltergeists?

The same thing is true of them. If there was no evidence for them then the
concept wouldn't even exist and no one would believe in them. How can such an
obvious thing be impossible for you to comprehend?

mur@.not

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Dec 8, 2013, 2:46:55 PM12/8/13
to
On Sun, 08 Dec 2013 04:00:40 -0800, Jeanne Douglas <hlwd...@NOSPAMgmail.com>
wrote:
It's two beliefs. You believe God may exist. You also believe he may not
exist.

>It's the lack of a belief.

You just mentioned two beliefs and then said they are not beliefs. The
"'Believing" part is something that really should clue you in to the fact that
they are beliefs. Do you believe ghosts may exist, or only that God may exist?

mur@.not

unread,
Dec 8, 2013, 2:58:25 PM12/8/13
to
The people who consider the possibility of God's existence that are not
idiots, try to figure out how the things science tells us can go along with the
existence and influence of God. For example the fossils that support evolution
suggest that if God does exist and had/has influence on how things develop, he
made/makes use of the evolutionary method of creation. The fact that humans
aren't aware of any species giving birth to completely different species
suggests that God does exist and had a stronger influece than just letting
evolution take place all by itself, since if it did there would have to be
hundreds of thousands if not millions of examples of species giving birth to
different species. Also if evolution happened completely by random chance all by
itself it seems there should still today and always be examples of things like
species of beings like reptiles gradually transforming into birds, instead of
none in existence at all and the only evidence that it might have ever happened
being a few odd fossils of Archaeopteryx.

Les

unread,
Dec 8, 2013, 3:32:06 PM12/8/13
to
Thank you for your post

I will respond when you calm down and stop hurling insults
and accusation of ignorance at me. OK

felix_unger

unread,
Dec 8, 2013, 4:05:51 PM12/8/13
to
On 09-December-2013 12:11 PM, linuxgal wrote:
> felix_unger wrote:
>>
>> You can't escape from the rationality that if you don't believe they
>> do exist, and don't believe they don't exist, then by default you
>> believe they may or may not exist, which is what you have said,
>> whether you like it or not
>
> One cannot not say "A four-sided triangle may or may not exist",
> because it cannot exist, by definition.

but we're talking about beliefs not facts

> The God defined by most theists cannot exist, simply because an
> eternal being who can see all of history and the future as a panoply
> cannot be conscious of the current time, thus negating his alleged
> omniscience. There are other approaches to the same idea, such as the
> triple horns of evil, omnibenevolence, and omnipotence.
>


--

felix_unger

unread,
Dec 8, 2013, 4:08:13 PM12/8/13
to
On 09-December-2013 4:19 AM, Bob Casanova wrote:
> On Sun, 08 Dec 2013 09:50:13 +1100, the following appeared
> in sci.skeptic, posted by felix_unger <m...@nothere.biz>:
>
>> On 08-December-2013 4:12 AM, Bob Casanova wrote:
>>
>>> On Sat, 07 Dec 2013 15:37:19 +0000, the following appeared
>>> in sci.skeptic, posted by Les <l...@sharnt.tell>:
>>>
>>>> On Sun, 08 Dec 2013 00:25:49 +1100, felix_unger <m...@nothere.biz>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On 10-July-2012 11:35 PM, Emmett Till wrote:
>>>>>> HOW DO ATHEISTS EXPLAIN POLTERGEIST LEVITATION?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDjwQIneBks&noredirect=1
>>>>> The same way they respond to everything that doesn't fit their
>>>>> beliefs... "It doesn't exist!"
>>>> Is this part of our 'atheist beliefs system' we keep hearing
>>>> vague rumour about?
>>>>
>>>> The ones that are so secret even we are not not permitted
>>>> to know what they are?
>>> I'm just curious to know the connection between disbelief in
>>> poltergeists and atheism...
>> it seems that atheists don't accept the existence of anything
>> supra-normal, para-normal, supernatural, etc.,
> Ah, so it's a delusion of Emmett's? OK.

Well apparently some do, I've now been told

>>> Are poltergeists supposedly deities of some sort?


--

felix_unger

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Dec 8, 2013, 4:13:58 PM12/8/13
to
Absolutely correct. I've made this point myself before.

Jeanne Douglas

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Dec 8, 2013, 5:36:25 PM12/8/13
to
In article <r6j9a994qbuvfembh...@4ax.com>, mur@.not
wrote:

> On Sun, 8 Dec 2013 10:29:27 -0500, "Freedom Man" <frees...@4eva.com> wrote:
>
> >"felix_unger" <m...@nothere.biz> wrote in message
> >news:bgglv6...@mid.individual.net...
> >> On 10-July-2012 11:35 PM, Emmett Till wrote:
> >>> HOW DO ATHEISTS EXPLAIN POLTERGEIST LEVITATION?
> >>>
> >>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDjwQIneBks&noredirect=1
> >>
> >> The same way they respond to everything that doesn't fit their beliefs...
> >> "It doesn't exist!"
> >
> >No, the fact that science has not yet explained some phenomena does not
> >justify the ignorant assumption that it cannot.
> >Myth and superstition always fade in the light shed by true knowledge.
> >That's why the religious idiots oppose scientific progress!
>
> The people who consider the possibility of God's existence that are not
> idiots, try to figure out how the things science tells us can go along with
> the
> existence and influence of God. For example the fossils that support
> evolution
> suggest that if God does exist and had/has influence on how things develop,
> he
> made/makes use of the evolutionary method of creation. The fact that humans
> aren't aware of any species giving birth to completely different species
> suggests that God does exist

Complete and total nonsense. That is NOT how evolution works, you dweeb.

Jeanne Douglas

unread,
Dec 8, 2013, 5:37:30 PM12/8/13
to
In article <2hi9a9h5rvahpmao0...@4ax.com>, mur@.not
Okay, then. Will you finally be the person who actually provides the
objective and verifiable evidence? List some of it right here:

1.

2.

3.


....

Jeanne Douglas

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Dec 8, 2013, 5:39:05 PM12/8/13
to
In article <2hi9a9h5rvahpmao0...@4ax.com>, mur@.not
What obvious thing?

Human beings have imaginations and they make up impossible things all
the time. Entire industries are based on just that fact--fiction books,
movies, tv.

Jeanne Douglas

unread,
Dec 8, 2013, 5:39:37 PM12/8/13
to
In article <bgk5on...@mid.individual.net>,
So you believe something completely and totally ridiculous, too?

Jeanne Douglas

unread,
Dec 8, 2013, 5:40:21 PM12/8/13
to
In article <rai9a959a8oo2tmej...@4ax.com>, mur@.not
wrote:

> On Sat, 07 Dec 2013 15:52:29 -0800, Jeanne Douglas <hlwd...@NOSPAMgmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> >In article <bgglv6...@mid.individual.net>,
> > felix_unger <m...@nothere.biz> wrote:
> >
> >> On 10-July-2012 11:35 PM, Emmett Till wrote:
> >> > HOW DO ATHEISTS EXPLAIN POLTERGEIST LEVITATION?
> >> >
> >> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDjwQIneBks&noredirect=1
> >>
> >> The same way they respond to everything that doesn't fit their
> >> beliefs... "It doesn't exist!"
> >
> >
> >What beliefs?
>
> If you believe there are no gods in the universe or even that there are
> none
> associated with this planet, then that's probably the belief he was referring
> to.

But I believe no such thing.




> He might also take it for granted that if a person believes there is no
> God
> associated with this planet, that person probably also believes there are no
> ghosts associated with this planet. Maybe there are people who believe
> there's
> no God associated but that there are ghosts, but they would probably be very
> rare imo.

I'm not responsible for credulous idiots.

felix_unger

unread,
Dec 8, 2013, 6:03:01 PM12/8/13
to
I'm agreeing that concepts are created by evidence

BruceS

unread,
Dec 9, 2013, 11:27:36 AM12/9/13
to
Now, now, there's no need for name calling. Surely he is perfectly
capable of identifying his own nature without your help.

mur@.not

unread,
Dec 9, 2013, 5:29:52 PM12/9/13
to
On Sun, 08 Dec 2013 14:37:30 -0800, Jeanne Douglas <hlwd...@NOSPAMgmail.com>
wrote:
.
1. The Bible itself is evidence, and the fact that it still exists today even
though people have attempted to eliminate it over the centuries during times
before it was easy to reproduce, is more evidence.

2. The fact that there are millions of species of animals even though humans
know of very few if any examples of one species giving rise to a different one
is evidence, as is the fact that not only are there not lots of examples of
things like beings such as reptiles changing into birds as their should be if it
all happened just by chance, but there are NO examples. Try to explain why it
stopped happening if it just happened by accident a LOT for billions of years
but doesn't happen at all any more.

3. All the other evidence including the fact that reproductive and immune
systems etc seem to be designed systems whether they actually are or not.

And again no one would have ever even considered the idea if there was no
evidence at all, meaning that there MUST BE evidence and also meaning that
apparently you can't recognise a single bit of it, much less are you any sort of
respectable authority on what might be strong actual evidence and what is weak
bogus evidence. Since you deny every bit of it you couldn't get anywhere at all
with making distinctions like that.

mur@.not

unread,
Dec 9, 2013, 5:30:02 PM12/9/13
to
On Sun, 08 Dec 2013 14:39:05 -0800, Jeanne Douglas <hlwd...@NOSPAMgmail.com>
wrote:
.
The fact that if there was no reason for anyone to believe in a concept, no
one would believe in the concept.

>Human beings have imaginations and they make up impossible things all
>the time. Entire industries are based on just that fact--fiction books,
>movies, tv.

Those things are all evidence that the fictional beings exist. The
difference is that we know they do not. Children believe in Santa Clause, and
some believe in Superman, because of the evidence that they exist. There is more
evidence that God exists than that Santa and Superman exist whether you can
learn to appreciate that fact or not. We know Santa and Superman don't exist ,
because we know how the evidence came into existence without the beings
themselves actually existing. We don't know that in regards to God. Again you
can't recognise a very significant aspect of the situation, and it appears that
again it's in large part because you can't recognise any evidence much less
distinguish good from bad. To think of the possibility of God's existence and
that of Porky Pig's existence in the same way is absurd, for example.

mur@.not

unread,
Dec 9, 2013, 5:30:24 PM12/9/13
to
On Sun, 08 Dec 2013 20:32:06 +0000, Les <l...@sharnt.tell> wrote:
.
>On Sun, 08 Dec 2013 14:32:37 -0500, mur@.not wrote:
>
>>On Sat, 07 Dec 2013 15:37:19 +0000, Les <l...@sharnt.tell> wrote:
>>
>>>On Sun, 08 Dec 2013 00:25:49 +1100, felix_unger <m...@nothere.biz>
>>>wrote:
>>>
>>>>On 10-July-2012 11:35 PM, Emmett Till wrote:
>>>>> HOW DO ATHEISTS EXPLAIN POLTERGEIST LEVITATION?
>>>>>
>>>>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDjwQIneBks&noredirect=1
>>>>
>>>>The same way they respond to everything that doesn't fit their
>>>>beliefs... "It doesn't exist!"
>>>
>>>Is this part of our 'atheist beliefs system' we keep hearing
>>>vague rumour about?
>>
>> Apparently you're not aware of different types of atheism.
>>
>>>The ones that are so secret even we are not not permitted
>>>to know what they are?
>>
>> You certainly seem to be completely clueless about something that's common
>>knowledge to plenty of people. Don't you have any clue at all what the
>>difference between strong atheism and weak atheism is? Here's a clue for you: If
>>you don't have any belief about the existence of God you are a weak atheist. If
>>you have the belief that God does not exist at all or even that no god has ever
>>had any influence on this planet then you DO have a belief making you a strong
>>atheist. IF you are a strong atheist, the amount of faith you have that your
>>belief is correct is what determines how strong an atheist you are.
>
>Thank you for your post

You're welcome.

>I will respond when you calm down and stop hurling insults
>and accusation of ignorance at me. OK

If you were not ignorant of the fact that strong atheism is a belief, then
you dishonestly pretended to be. So which was it? Were you honestly ignorant, or
deliberately dishonest? Those are the only two possibilities in the situation
YOU created. Are you now going to feel insulted because I pointed out the fact
that YOU created the situation?

mur@.not

unread,
Dec 9, 2013, 5:30:30 PM12/9/13
to
On Sun, 08 Dec 2013 14:40:21 -0800, Jeanne Douglas <hlwd...@NOSPAMgmail.com>
wrote:
.
>In article <rai9a959a8oo2tmej...@4ax.com>, mur@.not
>wrote:
>
>> On Sat, 07 Dec 2013 15:52:29 -0800, Jeanne Douglas <hlwd...@NOSPAMgmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> >In article <bgglv6...@mid.individual.net>,
>> > felix_unger <m...@nothere.biz> wrote:
>> >
>> >> On 10-July-2012 11:35 PM, Emmett Till wrote:
>> >> > HOW DO ATHEISTS EXPLAIN POLTERGEIST LEVITATION?
>> >> >
>> >> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDjwQIneBks&noredirect=1
>> >>
>> >> The same way they respond to everything that doesn't fit their
>> >> beliefs... "It doesn't exist!"
>> >
>> >
>> >What beliefs?
>>
>> If you believe there are no gods in the universe or even that there are
>> none
>> associated with this planet, then that's probably the belief he was referring
>> to.
>
>But I believe no such thing.

IF not then apparently what he referred to doesn't apply to you. Whether it
does or not, in case you're unaware of the fact strong atheism is a belief. It's
the belief that there is no God associated with this planet, and in some cases
that there are none anywhere in the universe. The latter part is not necessary
in order for a person to believe as a strong atheist though...only that they
believe there's no God associated with Earth. If you were unaware of that, it's
good that you now have been exposed to the truth about it.

>> He might also take it for granted that if a person believes there is no
>> God
>> associated with this planet, that person probably also believes there are no
>> ghosts associated with this planet. Maybe there are people who believe
>> there's
>> no God associated but that there are ghosts, but they would probably be very
>> rare imo.
>
>I'm not responsible for credulous idiots.

Do you think anyone is, and if so, what do you think such responsibility has
to do with this particular topic? If not, then why did you even say anything
about such a thing?

mur@.not

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Dec 9, 2013, 5:30:39 PM12/9/13
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On Sun, 08 Dec 2013 14:36:25 -0800, Jeanne Douglas <hlwd...@NOSPAMgmail.com>
wrote:
.
Not unless you can explain how millions of different species came into
existenence with no species giving rise to any other species, and without the
help from a force like God is supposed to be.

>That is NOT how evolution works, you dweeb.

If you want people to believe different species were not responsible for the
beginnings of new species, then what do you want them to think was responsible?
Plants? Rocks? Did they just poof into existence? Or what???

mur@.not

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Dec 9, 2013, 5:30:46 PM12/9/13
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On Mon, 09 Dec 2013 08:13:58 +1100, felix_unger <m...@nothere.biz> wrote:
.
I'm guessing though you've probably been ridiculed for it a number of times,
no one has ever provided a believable way people could develop a belief in
something that there's absolutely no evidence for at all. Maybe someone will do
it now, but I doubt they'll be successful even if someone does try to.

george152

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Dec 9, 2013, 6:13:52 PM12/9/13
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On 10/12/13 11:29, mur@.not wrote:

> 1. The Bible itself is evidence, and the fact that it still exists today even
> though people have attempted to eliminate it over the centuries during times
> before it was easy to reproduce, is more evidence.


The bible is a collection of folk tales, nothing more or less.
It exists because there are more fools than wise men in the world

Dakota

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Dec 9, 2013, 6:19:35 PM12/9/13
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To say "it" still exists today is absurd. No original texts of any of
the books from the Bible exist today. What we have are copies of
copies of copies ....
>
> 2. The fact that there are millions of species of animals even though humans
> know of very few if any examples of one species giving rise to a different one
> is evidence, as is the fact that not only are there not lots of examples of
> things like beings such as reptiles changing into birds as their should be if it
> all happened just by chance, but there are NO examples. Try to explain why it
> stopped happening if it just happened by accident a LOT for billions of years
> but doesn't happen at all any more.
>
The conditions necessary for the formation of fossils are uncommon.
That some fossil evidence has been found demonstrates that the process
of evolution did take place in the past. Drug resistant bacteria, for
example, are evidence that evolution continues to this day. The
evolution of fruit flies under laboratory conditions is another example.

Once again a fool posts that evolution happened by accident.
>
> 3. All the other evidence including the fact that reproductive and immune
> systems etc seem to be designed systems whether they actually are or not.
>
To whom do they "seem" to be designed?
>
> And again no one would have ever even considered the idea if there was no
> evidence at all, meaning that there MUST BE evidence and also meaning that
> apparently you can't recognise a single bit of it, much less are you any sort of
> respectable authority on what might be strong actual evidence and what is weak
> bogus evidence. Since you deny every bit of it you couldn't get anywhere at all
> with making distinctions like that.
>
No one would have ever considered the idea of leprechauns or the Tooth
Fairy if there was no evidence at all meaning that there MUST BE
evidence that apparently you can't recognize.

There is evidence that humans have been considering the idea of gods
throughout recorded history. A very large number of such gods have
been dreamed up and worshiped over the ages. The
Judeo-Christian-Islamic god is just one of the many.


Les

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Dec 9, 2013, 6:28:43 PM12/9/13
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Two points I would like to make here:

1 The belief that gods do not exist, which some of us have (but
not me), is a single belief and not a 'belief SYSTEM'.

2 Those that talk about this mysterious 'belief system' do not
attribute it just to those that have the belief gods do not exists.
If they did it would not be a mystery would it?

As far as I can recall they have never discriminated between us and
have always attributed it to all of us. So it is clearly nothing to do
with the fact that some of us believe gods do not exist.

felix_unger

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Dec 9, 2013, 6:40:45 PM12/9/13
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correct guess :)

> no one has ever provided a believable way people could develop a belief in
> something that there's absolutely no evidence for at all. Maybe someone will do
> it now, but I doubt they'll be successful even if someone does try to.

I wonder how many ppl believe in a flying herbivorous pink spotted mouse
with bad teeth?..

felix_unger

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Dec 9, 2013, 6:45:29 PM12/9/13
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On 10-December-2013 9:30 AM, mur@.not wrote:
You explain things very well

Jeanne Douglas

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Dec 9, 2013, 7:20:35 PM12/9/13
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In article <a4hca99tefehl1pi2...@4ax.com>, mur@.not
Sheesh. I know 8 year olds with a better knowledge of biology than this.

Go take some introductory courses in biology and geology and then,
maybe, we can discuss.

Until then, you're merely repeating nonsense from professional liars.

Jeanne Douglas

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Dec 9, 2013, 7:21:19 PM12/9/13
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In article <34hca9p5vonvithl2...@4ax.com>, mur@.not
wrote:
I agree.

But that's irrelevant to the vast majority of atheists here.

Jeanne Douglas

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Dec 9, 2013, 7:23:17 PM12/9/13
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In article <53hca91ud9fkvjvre...@4ax.com>, mur@.not
wrote:
Wow. Are you really not aware of all the moronic and insane things
people believe in for absolutely no sane reason?
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