Were Monica and Linda agents for Israel's right wing?
Secret Squirrel
March 1998 _ Media Bypass http://www.4bypass.com/stories/bombo.html
President "Schmucko" and the Bombo
Eruptions
By Gerald Carroll
President Bill Clinton's highly publicized and incendiary entanglements with former White
House intern Monica Lewinsky can be summed up in a single word: "Schmucko."
"Schmucko" is the word Lewinsky used to describe Clinton in taped conversations with
a friend, Linda Tripp. These tapes are proving to be the most damaging evidence against
the president, who is accused of not only engaging in sexual acts with Lewinsky but
persuading her to file a misleading, if not outright false, version of events in a sworn
affidavit she was ordered to give as part of the related Paula Jones sexual harassment law
suit against the president.
"Schmucko" is derived from the Yiddish word, "schmuck," which means "penis."
"Schmuck" is also the German word for "ornament." When someone is referred to as a
"schmucko," it is usually meant to be derogatory, and directly related to that person's
moral and ethical conduct.
Since Lewinsky and Tripp are both of Jewish extraction and familiar with the use and
meaning of such terms, it would appear that from all indications, something of a sexual
nature did occur between President Clinton and the former intern, now 24 years old and
an instant international celebrity because of her alleged "involvement" with the president.
On Feb. 5, it was announced that Lewinsky did indeed admit to having some sort of
sexual activity with the President in a document called a "proffer," which Lewinsky and
her attorney, William H. Ginsburg, filed with White House Special Prosecutor Kenneth
Starr in an attempt to earn immunity from prosecution in exchange for the "truth" about her
relationship with the president.
Since the story broke, other former intern colleagues of Lewinsky have testified that she
told them of sexual dalliances with the president in the privacy of the Oval Office. It has
been a slowly moving, painful disclosure with the president's closest advisors fighting an
intense public relations battle against Starr and his determined staff.
Lewinsky started as an intern at the White House in June of 1995 and stayed on after
that experience to work full-time in the White House Office of Legisla-tive Affairs in
December 1995. Her primary duties involved delivery of materials to the President's
office. Criticized by supervisors for "hanging out" around the White House one too many
times, she was "transferred" to the Pentagon where she hooked up with Tripp, a veteran
Washington bureaucrat and former White House staffer with more than a few axes to
grind with the current administration. During her tenure at the Pentagon, Lewinsky is
reported to have been cleared for direct visits into the White House by President Clinton's
personal secretary, Betty Currie, no less than 37 times for undisclosed purposes. Such
frequency of visits from such a low-level employee is considered quite rare in Washington
circles.
And, indeed, this Pentagon connection continues to be the least explored aspect of this
convoluted tangle. Two issues surface as paramount: 1) Israel's military marriage to the
Pentagon, and 2) U.S. military leadership's total contempt for this current president.
Let's take a serious look at this bigger picture, the latter point first. President Clinton was
elected in 1992 and immediately tried to wrangle a deal that would permit open
homosexuals in the military. The president's track record with regard to the military is
dubious at best, having admitted to "loathing" the military, engaging in a heavy-handed
overseas opposition to the Vietnam War, dancing around the military draft, and so on.
Further, since he was elected, President Clinton has been "commander in chief" during
some questionable military commitments.
The never-ending troop deployment in Bosnia-Herzegovina is the most glaring example.
Over 8,500 U.S. military personnel are acting as the only peacekeeping force of any
consequence (heavens, it was obvious that the United Nations "peacekeepers" had no
idea how to intervene during the 1991-94 civil war there) and must remain there
"indefinitely," according to the president and his treacherous Secretary of State,
Madeleine Albright, who has a tendency to throw around U.S. military might overseas at
the slightest sign of "unrest."
Other examples are plentiful. The Somalia debacle, actually started by the outgoing Bush
administration in December of 1993, led to a disgraceful U.S. withdrawal in 1994 after a
dead U.S. soldier's body was dragged through the streets of Mogadishu. Likewise, the
mess in the Caribbean nation of Haiti still exists, albeit to a lesser degree.
Collectively, Pentagon brass generally disagree with these "peacekeeping" actions and
the resources they drain from domestic U.S. defense. With military expenditures at
historic lows in terms of percentage of budget, with base closings, with severe cutbacks in
troop numbers and recruitment, the U.S. armed forces cannot even defend the sovereign
borders of the United States, let alone "defend" the rest of the world.
Funding shortages and ensuing maintenance cutbacks seem to have coincided with the
wingtips of multibillion-dollar Stealth bombers falling off in mid-air. In fact, the rash of
U.S. military plane crashes over the past year has been epidemic and unprecedented. The
latest incident occurred in early February when a low-flying U.S. military jet fighter
severed a support cable that sent a ski tram full of 20 winter sports enthusiasts
plummeting to their deaths in Italy.
The Clinton administration's "progressive" policies that led to women training alongside
men -- and living in adjacent barracks -- during military basic training infuriated top
military brass. The ensuing problems were easily predictable. Men and women began
having sexual liaisons, and an explosion of sexual harassment and sex abuse charges were
filed by women against men. The charges were clearly racially charged and occurred
during the drawn-out and equally racist O.J. Simpson murder trial. The accused enlisted
men and officers -- including the top enlisted man in the U.S. Army, the heavily decorated
Sgt. Maj. Gene C. McKinney. He has been court-martialed and has been put on trial on
those charges.
Increasing animosity between Clinton and the U.S. military was the angst resulting from
the downing of TWA Flight 800 on July 17, 1996, by some sort of errant projectile, most
likely a missile and most likely fired by the U.S. Navy.
The Clinton administration engineered a clumsy, transparent cover-up, using the FBI as
its primary front. The cover-up, exacerbated by highly public disputes between the FBI
and NTSB, was filled with yawning holes quickly plugged by alternative media and
independent researchers -- along with the French intelligence community (France lost 60
of its citizens among the 230 passengers and crew who perished).
It is safe to say that the Pentagon would have more than a good reason to stage a coup
and get someone else -- anyone else -- in as president. Vice President Al Gore is an
improved alternative as far as the Pentagon is concerned, and the same goes for the
Israelis and their stalwart and hyperconservative leader, Prime Minister Benjamin
Netanyahu.
It was Netanyahu who just happened to fly into Washington the very day that the
Lewinsky story broke big. Is it mere coincidence? Consider the following e-mail entry
from the "alt.conspiracy" newsgroup filed Jan. 23 by Troy Laws, which states:
"Monica Lewinsky and Linda Tripp are both Jewish Sayanim ["assistants" to Israel]
who were recruited to use Clinton's voracious appetite for sex to set him up. If so, Bill
Clinton sure gave them his full cooperation."
Similar views were expressed on the "alt.rush-limbaugh" newsgroup by an individual with
the e-mail address "rdb...@aol.com:"
"Here we have a young Jewish woman [Lewinsky] in the 'confidence' of the
president. Top-secret government clearance [at her Pentagon job, along
with Tripp]. Intern [gets job] after a very large "donation" to the "Clinton
Cause." Could there have been any intelligence gathering going on in the
offices of the Commander-in-Chief?
"Has anyone considered the monumental breach of security? Could it be that
Monica Lewinsky is an agent for Israel? What a great cover! Secret agent
for Israeli intelligence going undercover as a 'bimbo' to gather info on
Clinton." Israel's largest newspaper, Yediot Ahar-onot, quoted Lewinsky
attorney Ginsburg as saying, translated from Hebrew: "We are fans of
President Clinton and admire his positions and policies concerning Israel.
Clinton is very positive toward Israel and the Jews, and Monica and I are
Jews.
"I am torn because I fear for the fate of the presidency in our democracy,
and I don't want the president to resign. Who knows who will come after
Clinton and how he will deal with Israel?"
Response was immediate.
"This is a big red flag, gang," responded Carl F. Worden on "alt.conspiracy." "Anyone
stupid enough to believe Clinton is a supporter of Israel is stupid enough to try to protect
the bastard. This one really worries me."
Chicago-based researcher Sherman Skolnick, himself Jewish, has been exploring
whether the Lewinsky affair is connected in any way to the Mossad, the Israeli intelligence
agency. Skolnick cautions that, just as the CIA does not represent all Americans, so too
the Mossad does not represent all Israelis. Nonetheless, he finds it intriguing that,
according to his information, Monica Lewinsky, Linda Tripp, and Lucianne Goldberg
[Tripp's literary agent who persuaded Tripp to secretly tape Lewinsky] are all Jewish.
On or about Jan. 20, Netanyahu was reportedly furious about something Clinton did as
his visit approached, although it is not clear exactly what form "snub" took. It was Jan. 21,
the day, of the meeting between Clinton and Netanyahu -- a much-heralded "photo
opportunity" to show off Clinton's "statesmanship" -- that the Lewinsky tapes became
public.
Could a revenge motive, then, be the source of the president's current troubles? Could
Bubba be caught in a crossfire between conservative Israelis and more liberal,
peace-minded Israelis?
Rich Martin, editor of online magazine Slick, independently offers a correlating thesis on
the "misc.activism.militia" newsgroup:
"It is logical that a liberal Democrat is the only one who could put pressure
on Israel to compromise [on a peace agreement with the Palestinians and
Yasser Arafat] just as only a conservative like Reagan could negotiate with
the USSR. If a liberal negotiated the same deal Reagan did, the plan would
be suspect, and would not be supported by Congress, the press or the
people.
"Same is true in reverse in Israel's case. A conservative would get chopped
to pieces if he asked Israel to give up one square inch of Lebanon. It is a job
that can only be accomplished by a liberal such as Clinton.
"If the Jewish community sees it this way, given the current negotiations with
PLO's Arafat and Israel's Netanyahu, it could go a long way to the media's
about-face in protecting their man. It may not be coincidence that both
[CNN talk-show host] Larry King (who recently interviewed Gen-nifer
Flowers) and Monica Lewinsky are of the Jewish faith. Admittedly, this is
speculation on my part, but the pieces do fit, and I have yet to hear a more
likely hypothesis."
Jan George Frajkor, a professor at the School of Journalism at Carleton University in
Ottawa, Ontario, Canada, reflects a widely held overseas view, and e-mailed his feelings
as follows:
"I believe we are not seriously looking at the real issue in the Clinton
scandal. It is not about sex, it is about placing a sexual partner [who is a
subordinate], in a job requiring top secret clearance because of her favors.
This is not about sex, it is closer to treason.
"This is the most sensible point I have heard anyone make in this case. And I
am surprised our high-powered journalism colleagues have never made it."
(Incidentally: Carleton University is where Peter Jennings, long-time ABC-TV news
anchor, claimed on his early rÚsumÚs that he graduated from in the 1960s. Later, after his
TV career was well along, he admitted to taking only a few courses there and never
graduating. Heck, he barely got through high school.)
In an excellent piece published electronically by Exegesis, a forum encouraging "moral
excellence" based in Washington and long a Clinton watchdog, concludes by outlining the
moral and spiritual horror opened by this sordid case:
"Mr. Clinton is precisely what Monica Lewinsky called him. He is a
schmucko and much more. The word has Hebrew origins in the male
genitalia and has come to mean, in Yiddish, a pitiful case, an idiot, a fool or a
lovable clown. As William Rees-Mogg wrote this week in The Times [of
London]: 'The nickname given him by Miss Lewinsky was Schmucko; it fits
him rather well. There will probably never be another President Schmucko.'
"He [Clinton] is a complex character, unsure whether to charm or to
threaten others in order to get his way. He operates from a position of
chronic weakness, always scheming to cover up his previous misdeeds. By
thus preoccupying himself, he has neglected the best interests of his nation
and wasted billions of taxpayers' dollars perpetuating failed programs to
purchase votes, both for his reelection in 1996 and for Al Gore in 2000. He
has weakened and corrupted America.
"The Wall Street Journal put it this way:
'Whenever and however Mr. Clinton leaves office, we will spend a long time
discovering what damage his mores have done to our institutions, and a
longer time repairing them.'
"To dismiss Bill Clinton as merely a lovable clown is to underestimate that
damage. There is a pause as events unfold. Hopes that Mr. Clinton might
resign quickly or quietly are still there, but he never fails to disappoint.
Nonetheless, this is no time to be downcast or discouraged; the truth will
prevail. It always does. And it may come suddenly. William Rees-Mogg
once again: 'If Kenneth Starr proves the Lewinsky case, and Paula Jones
proves her case in May, then most Americans will come, however
regretfully, to the conclusion that their president is a habitual liar. Yet once
the chain of denial loses a link, the whole chain ceases to hold. If we believe
Miss Lewinsky, then why not believe Mrs. Jones and Miss Flowers, or the
many other women? Even the president now admits that Miss Flowers was
telling the truth. If we believe the women, why not believe the men who
testify to even more serious matters? If the president lies about sex, then
may he not also have been lying about campaign contributions, or assisting
the cover-up of the Foster suicide? Should one not take another look at the
suicide note? A system of mutually reinforced denials, led by the president,
with the press looking the other way and the public not wanting to know, is
like a dam. Once the water gets through, the whole dam is likely to
collapse.'
"Truth is not as expendable as the U.S. media want us to think. It is a
balance to God's grace. Mr. Clinton is always keen to be photographed
with a Bible in his hand. It would be a great day for America if he read it and
decided to follow its teachings. He wants to be called a child of God, yet
gives his allegiance to the works of the devil. He cannot have it both ways:
there is a world of difference between pretense and the practice of gives his
allegiance to the works of the devil. He cannot have it both ways: there is a
world of difference between pretense and the practice of the Christian faith."
j...@inxpress.net
Secret Squirrel wrote:
>
> March 1998 _ Media Bypass http://www.4bypass.com/stories/bombo.html
>
> President "Schmucko" and the Bombo
> Eruptions
>
> By Gerald Carroll
>
> President Bill Clinton's highly publicized and incendiary entanglements with former White
> House intern Monica Lewinsky can be summed up in a single word: "Schmucko."
Good description, I think. However, there are *two* words,
not one. The other used by Lewinsky, to describe the
scumbag's adoring wife, is "Booba".
Red Herring
On 22 May 1998 21:43:11 -0000, Secret Squirrel
<Use-Author-Address-Header@[127.1]> wrote:
> Since Lewinsky and Tripp are both of Jewish extraction
Linda Rose Carotenuto of Jewish extraction?
j...@inxpress.net
her...@my-dejanews.com wrote:
>
> > according to his information, Monica
> Lewinsky, Linda Tripp, and Lucianne Goldberg
> > [Tripp's literary agent who persuaded Tripp
> to secretly tape Lewinsky] are all Jewish.
> >
Tripp is not Jewish.
Ray Heizer
In article <3568DB...@inxpress.net>, j...@inxpress.net wrote:
< her...@my-dejanews.com wrote:
< >
<
< > > according to his information, Monica
< > Lewinsky, Linda Tripp, and Lucianne Goldberg
< > > [Tripp's literary agent who persuaded Tripp
< > to secretly tape Lewinsky] are all Jewish.
< > >
<
< Tripp is not Jewish.
-- Goldberg is also not Jewish. Her husband is.
j...@inxpress.net
Ray Heizer wrote:
>
> In article <3568DB...@inxpress.net>, j...@inxpress.net wrote:
>
> < her...@my-dejanews.com wrote:
> < >
> <
> < > Lewinsky, Linda Tripp, and Lucianne Goldberg
> < > > [Tripp's literary agent who persuaded Tripp
> < > to secretly tape Lewinsky] are all Jewish.
> < > >
> <
>
> -- Goldberg is also not Jewish. Her husband is.
So much for "his information."
Wayne Mann
j...@inxpress.net wrote:
>her...@my-dejanews.com wrote:
>>
>
>> > according to his information, Monica
>> Lewinsky, Linda Tripp, and Lucianne Goldberg
>> > [Tripp's literary agent who persuaded Tripp
>> to secretly tape Lewinsky] are all Jewish.
>> >
>
>Tripp is not Jewish.
So what if they are, _ONLY_ anti-Semites would care!
nob...@nsm.htp.org
On Tue, 26 May 1998 10:59:19 GMT, "Wayne Mann" <tpdN...@callamerica.net> (Wayne Mann) wrote:
>j...@inxpress.net wrote:
>
>>her...@my-dejanews.com wrote:
>>>
>>
>>> > according to his information, Monica
>>> Lewinsky, Linda Tripp, and Lucianne Goldberg
>>> > [Tripp's literary agent who persuaded Tripp
>>> to secretly tape Lewinsky] are all Jewish.
>>> >
>>
>>Tripp is not Jewish.
>
How does JQP *know* this? If the author of the article, Gerald Carroll,
couldn't even get Tripp's ethnicity right, then his entire thesis has
disintegrated. Surely Carroll and the editors at Media Bypass
would have enough sense to verify this essential piece of
information before releasing the article.
>
> So what if they are, _ONLY_ anti-Semites would care!
Did you happen to read any part of the original post, Wayne? If you
had, you would know that in this particular case the ethnicity of these
women *is* relevant. You were probably too busy writhing on the floor
with the hard rubber bit between your teeth mumbling...Killfile 'em...Killfile "em.
GLC1173
Nobody wrote:
>Did you happen to read any part of the original post, Wayne? If >you
>had, you would know that in this particular case the ethnicity of >these
>women *is* relevant.
I'm Jewish - and I see the Kneepad Kid as too stupid to be any kind of
intelligence operative for anybody. Her attorney is also a dim bulb, if you
ask this Jewish lawyer.
If the Kneepad Kid is any kind of intelligence operative for Israel, then
why is her lawyer dumb enough to go on national television and tell the world
that the Kneepad Kid wants Clinton to stay in power because he's pro-Israel?
Face it, the Kneepad Kid is not your stereotypical bright Jew; she's an
idiot who had to go to junior college - and not because she lacked the money to
go to any college that would accept her.
================================================
1 of every 83 students from kindergarten through 12th grade
is *currently* on probation in Maryland for crimes ranging from
car theft to sex offenses.
WONDER WHY PUBLIC SCHOOLS ARE VIOLENT?
Wayne McGuire
nob...@nsm.htp.org wrote:
>On Tue, 26 May 1998 10:59:19 GMT, "Wayne Mann" <tpdN...@callamerica.net> (Wayne Mann) wrote:
>
>>j...@inxpress.net wrote:
>>
>>>her...@my-dejanews.com wrote:
>>>>
>>>
>>>> > according to his information, Monica
>>>> Lewinsky, Linda Tripp, and Lucianne Goldberg
>>>> > [Tripp's literary agent who persuaded Tripp
>>>> to secretly tape Lewinsky] are all Jewish.
>>>> >
>>>
>>>Tripp is not Jewish.
>>
>How does JQP *know* this? If the author of the article, Gerald Carroll,
>couldn't even get Tripp's ethnicity right, then his entire thesis has
>disintegrated. Surely Carroll and the editors at Media Bypass
>would have enough sense to verify this essential piece of
>information before releasing the article.
Michael Osmalov apparently keeps careful track of
the ethnicity and religion of principals in the
Clinton administration scandals.
Perhaps Osmalov will now present the facts about
Linda Tripp's ethnicity and religion since he is
an expert on the subject.
--
Wayne McGuire
http://www.cybercom.net/~wmcguire
Wayne McGuire
glc...@aol.com (GLC1173) wrote:
>Nobody wrote:
>>Did you happen to read any part of the original post, Wayne? If >you
>>had, you would know that in this particular case the ethnicity of >these
>>women *is* relevant.
>
> I'm Jewish - and I see the Kneepad Kid as too stupid to be any kind of
>intelligence operative for anybody. Her attorney is also a dim bulb, if you
>ask this Jewish lawyer.
> If the Kneepad Kid is any kind of intelligence operative for Israel, then
>why is her lawyer dumb enough to go on national television and tell the world
>that the Kneepad Kid wants Clinton to stay in power because he's pro-Israel?
> Face it, the Kneepad Kid is not your stereotypical bright Jew; she's an
>idiot who had to go to junior college - and not because she lacked the money to
>go to any college that would accept her.
Intelligence agencies often use dummies without
their knowledge or cognizance.
Look into the people who placed Monica Lewinsky in
close proximity to Bill Clinton and who
manipulated her: Walter Kaye, Marcia Lewis, Linda
Tripp, Lucianne Goldberg, Jonah Goldberg....
Do you think any of them are fools? Look into
their political backgrounds.
Wayne McGuire
rayh...@value.net (Ray Heizer) wrote:
>In article <3568DB...@inxpress.net>, j...@inxpress.net wrote:
>
>< her...@my-dejanews.com wrote:
>< >
><
>< > > according to his information, Monica
>< > Lewinsky, Linda Tripp, and Lucianne Goldberg
>< > > [Tripp's literary agent who persuaded Tripp
>< > to secretly tape Lewinsky] are all Jewish.
>< > >
><
>< Tripp is not Jewish.
>
>-- Goldberg is also not Jewish. Her husband is.
How about her son, Jonah, who has dangled the
Lewinsky tapes over the Clinton administration as
blackmail material?
How about Jonah Goldberg's boss, Ben Wattenberg,
who has been deeply preoccupied in controlling the
presidency and who was a major player in
Iran-Contra?
How about Victor Lasky and Murray Chotiner, who
established Lucianne Goldberg on her career as a
spy?
Please enlighten us about Linda Tripp's real
ethnicity and religion.
j...@inxpress.net
Wayne McGuire wrote:
>
> nob...@nsm.htp.org wrote:
>
> >On Tue, 26 May 1998 10:59:19 GMT, "Wayne Mann" <tpdN...@callamerica.net> (Wayne Mann) wrote:
> >
> >>
> >>>her...@my-dejanews.com wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>>> > according to his information, Monica
> >>>> Lewinsky, Linda Tripp, and Lucianne Goldberg
> >>>> > [Tripp's literary agent who persuaded Tripp
> >>>> to secretly tape Lewinsky] are all Jewish.
> >>>> >
> >>>
> >>>Tripp is not Jewish.
> >>
> >couldn't even get Tripp's ethnicity right, then his entire thesis has
> >disintegrated. Surely Carroll and the editors at Media Bypass
> >would have enough sense to verify this essential piece of
> >information before releasing the article.
>
> Michael Osmalov apparently keeps careful track of
> the ethnicity and religion of principals
You are truly a goddamned idiot.
Five minutes is all it took for me to come up with
a Tripp bio, including her very Italian maiden name
and several other facts, *none* of which indicate in
the least that she might be Jewish. Of course, she
could be one of those sneaky *stealth* Jews, but
as far as finding any hint of corroboration of his
contention that Tripp is Jewish, I didn't see any.
j...@inxpress.net
Wayne McGuire wrote:
>
> rayh...@value.net (Ray Heizer) wrote:
>
> >In article <3568DB...@inxpress.net>, j...@inxpress.net wrote:
> >
> >< her...@my-dejanews.com wrote:
> >< >
> ><
> >< > Lewinsky, Linda Tripp, and Lucianne Goldberg
> >< > > [Tripp's literary agent who persuaded Tripp
> >< > to secretly tape Lewinsky] are all Jewish.
> >< > >
> ><
> >
> >-- Goldberg is also not Jewish. Her husband is.
>
> How about her son, Jonah,
>
*Jews*. Jews *everywhere*. Hurry up and post a *Jew*
list, Waynes.
So much for Carroll's stupid theory, however, since
he blew it on 2 out of 3.
Wayne McGuire
j...@inxpress.net wrote:
>Wayne McGuire wrote:
>>
>> rayh...@value.net (Ray Heizer) wrote:
>>
>> >In article <3568DB...@inxpress.net>, j...@inxpress.net wrote:
>> >
>> >< her...@my-dejanews.com wrote:
>> >< >
>> ><
>> >< > > according to his information, Monica
>> >< > Lewinsky, Linda Tripp, and Lucianne Goldberg
>> >< > > [Tripp's literary agent who persuaded Tripp
>> >< > to secretly tape Lewinsky] are all Jewish.
>> >< > >
>> ><
>> >< Tripp is not Jewish.
>> >
>> >-- Goldberg is also not Jewish. Her husband is.
>>
>> How about her son, Jonah,
>>
>> How about Jonah Goldberg's boss, Ben Wattenberg,
>
>
>*Jews*. Jews *everywhere*. Hurry up and post a *Jew*
>list, Waynes.
The more interesting question is establishing any
significant ties between Jonah Goldberg, Victor
Lasky, Murray Chotiner, Ben Wattenberg, Walter
Kaye, Marcia Lewis, Lucianne Goldberg, Goldberg's
husband, etc. and Israel, since these are the
important players in Monicagate. The Israeli
right-wing would have a powerful motive to replace
Bill Clinton with Al Gore in the White House as
part of a secret coup. Al Gore is owned lock,
stock and barrel by the Martin Peretz wing of the
Israeli lobby.
Since you are an honest and sincere investigator
into the Clinton administration scandals, you will
be eager to do this -- yes? Are you interested in
ascertaining the facts? Or in burying the facts
when they threaten your tribal interests?
Wayne McGuire
j...@inxpress.net wrote:
>Wayne McGuire wrote:
>>
>> nob...@nsm.htp.org wrote:
>>
>> >On Tue, 26 May 1998 10:59:19 GMT, "Wayne Mann" <tpdN...@callamerica.net> (Wayne Mann) wrote:
>> >
>> >>j...@inxpress.net wrote:
>> >>
>> >>>her...@my-dejanews.com wrote:
>> >>>>
>> >>>
>> >>>> > according to his information, Monica
>> >>>> Lewinsky, Linda Tripp, and Lucianne Goldberg
>> >>>> > [Tripp's literary agent who persuaded Tripp
>> >>>> to secretly tape Lewinsky] are all Jewish.
>> >>>> >
>> >>>
>> >>>Tripp is not Jewish.
>> >>
>> >How does JQP *know* this? If the author of the article, Gerald Carroll,
>> >couldn't even get Tripp's ethnicity right, then his entire thesis has
>> >disintegrated. Surely Carroll and the editors at Media Bypass
>> >would have enough sense to verify this essential piece of
>> >information before releasing the article.
>>
>> Michael Osmalov apparently keeps careful track of
>> the ethnicity and religion of principals
>
>
>You are truly a goddamned idiot.
>
>Five minutes is all it took for me to come up with
>a Tripp bio, including her very Italian maiden name....
You think that you can establish the ethnicity and
religion of someone merely by their surname? You
have the mental habits of a bigot.
Again: please present the *facts* about Linda
Tripp's ethnicity and religion, so that this
particular matter can settled.
j...@inxpress.net
> >>
> >> >In article <3568DB...@inxpress.net>, j...@inxpress.net wrote:
> >> >
> >> >< her...@my-dejanews.com wrote:
> >> >< >
> >> ><
> >> >< > Lewinsky, Linda Tripp, and Lucianne Goldberg
> >> >< > > [Tripp's literary agent who persuaded Tripp
> >> >< > to secretly tape Lewinsky] are all Jewish.
> >> >< > >
> >> ><
> >> >
> >> >-- Goldberg is also not Jewish. Her husband is.
> >>
> >> How about her son, Jonah,
> >>
> >> How about Jonah Goldberg's boss, Ben Wattenberg,
> >
> >
> >*Jews*. Jews *everywhere*. Hurry up and post a *Jew*
> >list, Waynes.
>
> The more interesting question is establishing any
> significant ties between Jonah Goldberg, Victor
> Lasky, Murray Chotiner, Ben Wattenberg, Walter
> Kaye, Marcia Lewis, Lucianne Goldberg, Goldberg's
> husband, etc. and Israel, since these are the
> important players in Monicagate. The Israeli
> right-wing would have a powerful motive to replace
> Bill Clinton with Al Gore in the White House
That's something I pointed out several months ago,
while I was picking apart yet another one of your
specious arguments that was nothing more than another
attempt by you to minimize Clinton's criminality
(while getting your Jew licks in, as always).
Hey -- maybe you ought to check out old Vernon, too.
He might be one of them Ethiopian Jews.
j...@inxpress.net
> >>
> >> >On Tue, 26 May 1998 10:59:19 GMT, "Wayne Mann" <tpdN...@callamerica.net> (Wayne Mann) wrote:
> >> >
> >> >>
> >> >>>her...@my-dejanews.com wrote:
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>
> >> >>>> > according to his information, Monica
> >> >>>> Lewinsky, Linda Tripp, and Lucianne Goldberg
> >> >>>> > [Tripp's literary agent who persuaded Tripp
> >> >>>> to secretly tape Lewinsky] are all Jewish.
> >> >>>> >
> >> >>>
> >> >>>Tripp is not Jewish.
> >> >>
> >> >couldn't even get Tripp's ethnicity right, then his entire thesis has
> >> >disintegrated. Surely Carroll and the editors at Media Bypass
> >> >would have enough sense to verify this essential piece of
> >> >information before releasing the article.
> >>
> >> Michael Osmalov apparently keeps careful track of
> >> the ethnicity and religion of principals
> >
> >
> >You are truly a goddamned idiot.
> >
> >Five minutes is all it took for me to come up with
> >a Tripp bio, including her very Italian maiden name....
>
> You think that you can establish the ethnicity
Oops. You appear to have snipped out the rest of it:
> and several other facts, *none* of which indicate in
> the least that she might be Jewish. Of course, she
> could be one of those sneaky *stealth* Jews, but
> as far as finding any hint of corroboration of his
> contention that Tripp is Jewish, I didn't see any.
Now, asswipe, if you'd like to contend that Tripp is
Jewish, put up or shut up.
Red Herring
On Tue, 26 May 1998 20:48:40 GMT, Wayne McGuire <wmcg...@cybercom.net>
wrote:
>Intelligence agencies often use dummies without
>their knowledge or cognizance.
Wayne, have you ever crossed your mind that you might be one of those
dummies?
Lewinski and Tripp are on different sides of a heated political batlle. One
has suborned perjury and tampered with evidence to protect Bill Clinton, the
other may have broken Maryland illegal wiretap laws to harm Bill Clinton.
One must be a real dummy to believe that the two may somehow work for the
same political organization, be that Israel's right wing or China's
communist party.
j...@inxpress.net
nob...@nsm.htp.org wrote:
>
> On Tue, 26 May 1998 16:50:00 -0500, j...@inxpress.net wrote:
>
> >Wayne McGuire wrote:
> >>
> >> nob...@nsm.htp.org wrote:
> >>
> >> >On Tue, 26 May 1998 10:59:19 GMT, "Wayne Mann" <tpdN...@callamerica.net> (Wayne Mann) wrote:
> >> >
> >> >>j...@inxpress.net wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >>>her...@my-dejanews.com wrote:
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>
> >> >>>> > according to his information, Monica
> >> >>>> Lewinsky, Linda Tripp, and Lucianne Goldberg
> >> >>>> > [Tripp's literary agent who persuaded Tripp
> >> >>>> to secretly tape Lewinsky] are all Jewish.
> >> >>>> >
> >> >>>
> >> >>>Tripp is not Jewish.
> >> >>
> >> >How does JQP *know* this? If the author of the article, Gerald Carroll,
> >> >couldn't even get Tripp's ethnicity right, then his entire thesis has
> >> >disintegrated. Surely Carroll and the editors at Media Bypass
> >> >would have enough sense to verify this essential piece of
> >> >information before releasing the article.
> >>
> >> Michael Osmalov apparently keeps careful track of
> >> the ethnicity and religion of principals
> >
> >
> >You are truly a goddamned idiot.
> >
> >Five minutes is all it took for me to come up with
> >a Tripp bio, including her very Italian maiden name
> >the least that she might be Jewish. Of course, she
> >could be one of those sneaky *stealth* Jews, but
> >as far as finding any hint of corroboration of his
> >contention that Tripp is Jewish, I didn't see any.
>
It was a reminder to Waynes that they're *everywhere*,
even when he doesn't think so, a comment tailored for
a "pair o' noids". It's tough to convey a tongue-in-cheek
out here on usenet.
> From my own experience, I have known people with last names
> like Smith, Jones or Williams who were in fact Jewish. Are you
> claiming that is very rare? BTW, there are also people with
> Italian-sounding surnames who are Jewish. On what do you base
> your special expertise on this subject? Or do you simply shoot
> from the hip with your judgments?
Go look for yourself. I didn't base it on her name alone.
You want to play it absolutely straight? OK: there is absolutely
no way to know for sure, till she says. Why then would you
believe Carroll, especially since he's wrong about Goldberg?
He bases a whole damned article on an unknown, an accuracy,
and an error about three people's ethnic background.
After your done attacking me, defend Carroll. I'd really
like to see that.
Ray Heizer
In article <199805270014...@nsm.htp.org>, nob...@nsm.htp.org wrote:
< What on earth is a *stealth* Jew? You are becoming very wierd.
< like Smith, Jones or Williams who were in fact Jewish. Are you
< claiming that is very rare? BTW, there are also people with
< Italian-sounding surnames who are Jewish. On what do you base
< your special expertise on this subject? Or do you simply shoot
< from the hip with your judgments?
-- Is a *stealth* Jew similar to someone who posts under a name like
nob...@nsm.htp.org? i.e. not worth listening to since they have no
convictions they have the guts to admit to?
nob...@nsm.htp.org
What on earth is a *stealth* Jew? You are becoming very wierd.
Avi.Ja...@pbdir.com
In article <357a328a...@news.newsguy.com>,
Wayne McGuire <wmcg...@cybercom.net> wrote:
>
> rayh...@value.net (Ray Heizer) wrote:
>
> >In article <3568DB...@inxpress.net>, j...@inxpress.net wrote:
> >
> >< her...@my-dejanews.com wrote:
> >< >
> ><
> >< > Lewinsky, Linda Tripp, and Lucianne Goldberg
> >< > > [Tripp's literary agent who persuaded Tripp
> >< > to secretly tape Lewinsky] are all Jewish.
> >< > >
> ><
> >
> >-- Goldberg is also not Jewish. Her husband is.
>
> How about her son, Jonah, who has dangled the
> Lewinsky tapes over the Clinton administration as
> blackmail material?
>
> How about Jonah Goldberg's boss, Ben Wattenberg,
> who has been deeply preoccupied in controlling the
> presidency and who was a major player in
> Iran-Contra?
>
> How about Victor Lasky and Murray Chotiner, who
> established Lucianne Goldberg on her career as a
> spy?
>
> Please enlighten us about Linda Tripp's real
> ethnicity and religion.
In a rare moment of either carelessness or candor, Wayne McGuire is being
about as straightforward regarding his antisemitism as I have ever seen him.
He has now selected a handful of key figures in Washington scandals who are
alleged -- rightly or not, it is immaterial -- to be Jewish, and is inquiring
rhetorically about their Jewishness in order to draw a parallel between Jews
in general and corruption in general.
Wayne Mann has suggested that McGuire's rabidly antisemitic agenda would die a
natural death in this group, were it not opposed by people like Mike Osmalov
and myself. I respectfully beg to disagree: it is precisely the lack of
opposition (especially in groups not devoted to Israeli or Jewish issues,
like this one, where few readers are informed enough to oppose him) which
makes newsgroups like this one a fertile breeding ground for McGuire's brand
of hate propaganda. For example, after flooding this group with Barry
Chamish's drivel about alleged parallels between the Rabin assassination and
the Oklahoma bombing, McGuire suddenly went silent on the subject and
disappeared for about a week -- after I had pointed out Barry Chamish's
buy-my-book journalism, his previous "parallels" allegations (like John
Lennon's murder as a "dry run" for the attempt on the life of Ronald Reagan),
and his almost exclusive obsession with extraterrestrials.
In short, what McGuire calls for is not silence but informed rebuttal.
That is why I feel it is my duty to inform the members of this group -- and
any group in which McGuire disseminates his poison -- of the agenda,
reputation, and history of this individual.
Gary D. Prideaux, Professor of Linguistics at the University of Alberta in
Canada, recently published a lengthy and detailed linguistic "discourse
analysis" of a large corpus of antisemitic literature taken from the notorious
neo-Nazi "Zündelsite" on the Web. In his analysis, Prof. Prideaux points out
the following characteristics of this Nazi literature, which may seem oddly
familiar to readers of McGuire's articles:
--- quote ---
The writers employ a variety of rhetorical strategies to advance their
positions. One of the commonest is a four-step targeting strategy in which
the authors (a) single out Jews as an Identifiable group, (b) attribute to
Jews as a group a series of negative characteristics (criminals, evil
manipulators, extortionists, assassins, etc.), (c) claim to be exposing the
facts of (b), and finally, (d) on the basis of such "exposure", invite the
reader to target Jews as an identifiable group and attribute to them negative,
criminal, etc. characteristics. In executing the targeting strategy,
the writers typically heap abuse upon both Jews and also those others who, the
writers claim, are controlled by Jews.
Another common strategy is one of _inversion_, in which a particular
expression with its commonly held meaning is inverted, such that its meaning
changes to its opposite. This strategy is frequently found in instances in
which victims of the Holocaust are labelled with scare quotes ("victims",
"survivors", etc.), and then are portrayed as aggressors, while the original
aggressors become the victims.
Another strategy, the _alibi_ strategy, involves the equivocal use of words,
wherein important terms and expressions are given a special, often
restrictive definition in one location and then are used subsequently and
without notice in a different, often broader, meaning. This device is
used with words like "Holocaust", "survivor", and "Zionists" to support
logically untenable and misleading conclusions.
Also frequently used is the _code_ strategy, which employs the use of metaphor
and establishes a series of expressions laden with negative
associations in order to construct a network of interrelated and often
interchangeable terms. Thus, terms such as Jewish (or Zionist or Israeli)
Holocaust Lobby are found in association with expressions like parasite,
unscrupulous, noisy, whining, etc., creating a complex entity with negative
attributes.
The _metonymy_ strategy is one in which the attributes of a particular
instance are projected upon the superordinate category. This is especially
striking in the "Jewish Soap" text. Thus, when some particular attributes are
associated with a particular instance, those attributes are then
inferentially projected to the superordinate set containing that metonym.
Anti-Semitism is found laced throughout the passages. The warrants offered by
the writers for their anti-Semitic position are typically those
which play upon highly negative stereotyping. Included among those are: (a)
Jews are not victims, but victimizers of Germans and others, (b)
Jews as a group are deliberately attempting to undermine (some vague and
unspecified notion of) "Western civilization culture/etc.", (c) Jews
do not know their proper social position; they meddle and interfere in their
betters' business, (d) Jews are unscrupulous and avaricious in their
striving for financial gain and for political and economic power, (e) the
Holocaust is a Jewish propaganda activity and never really took place, (f)
Jews as an identifiable group engage in massive criminal activity, (g)
non-Jewish peoples and cultures must fight against all Jewish activities and
(h) the real victims of WW II were the Nazis, who had reasonable, rational,
and civilized policies toward Jews and other minorities.
These analyses lead to the conclusion that the writers of the passages have in
numerous instances singled out Jews as a special, identifiable
group. Moreover this group is asserted to possess highly negative and criminal
attributes as a group, thereby targeting the group for, e.g.,
hatred, revulsion, contempt, and loathing. In some passages, overt threats of
violence are uttered toward Jews as a group.
--- unquote ---
How strange that all of these rhetorical devices happen to characterize
McGuire's own postings. How strange that THE ONLY SITES ON THE WEB where
McGuire is quoted by name as an authority on anything (apart from McGuire's
own website and mailing list, of course) are the following:
- http://www.ddc.net/ygg/rj/rj-10.htm -- a subpage of the "Jewish Role"
section of the notorious Yggdrasil site, which deals with "the problems facing
European-Americans in this age of racial quotas, reverse discrimination, and
cultural breakdown" and suggests that "In the context of White Nationalism,
one can assume that Yggdrasil binds together different classes of Europeans
and reminds them of their ancient (and modern!) tribal obligations." The
"Jewish Role" section in which McGuire is quoted features such articles as "Of
Soap, Lampshades and Diesel Engines", "Of 'Jewish Soap' and Veiled Hatreds",
and "A Jewish Master Plan", as well as -- surprise! -- a series of articles
devoted to "broader themes of Jewish and Israeli involvement in US affairs."
- http://www.hoffman-info.com/communist.html -- a subpage of Holocaust Denier
Michael A. Hoffman's website. The specific page on which "Researcher Wayne
McGuire of Harvard University" [sic] is quoted, is devoted to proving the
existence of a "holocaust against Christian Russia", perpetrated by -- you
guessed it -- Jews, and Jewish Communists at that. McGuire writes: "Lenin
was a Jew by the standards of Israel's Law of Return: he possessed a Jewish
grandparent. It would seem that not only was Lenin a Jew, but that he was a
Jewish racist and chauvinist, although he kept his ideas on this volatile
subject far in the background, probably because they were in radical conflict
with the supposed universalism of Marxism. ...Lenin was a Jewish racist who
deliberately gave Jews especially, the most 'intellectually demanding tasks.'"
Note the highly irrelevant connection drawn by McGuire between Lenin,
Jewishness, and an Israeli law.
McGuire will counter this, if at all, with the usual strategy: Ignore the
facts, ignore the corroboration, ignore the citings, and resort to an ad
hominem attack on his opponent, consisting entirely of his own inventions with
not a shred of corroboration. He will first point out my worst "crime" -- the
fact that I was given Israeli citizenship, like all Jews who have lived in
Israel for any significant period of time. (This part, by the way, is true,
though McGuire knows full well that I am a native-born U.S. citizen, born and
raised in Philadelphia and now living in the San Francisco Bay Area.) He will
then make all sorts of wild charges: He will say I support villains and
agitate in their favor -- but with no corroboration. He will say I am
mentally ill. He will say I am a dangerous spy, part of the Jewish
Cyberconspiracy, and that his friends in the intelligence community have their
eye on me. He will call me an Israeli extremist, though he knows I left
Israel and returned to the U.S. out of disappointment and disgust with the
path Israel has taken. He will call me a stalker because I systematically
rebut his antisemitic Usenet postings. He will say that I am attempting to
bring an off-topic agenda -- allegedly MY agenda -- into irrelevant forums,
though it is he who has been doing this, here and elsewhere, for years. And
while I am perfectly willing to discuss McGuire at length here (since he is a
phenomenon in this group, and therefore relevant to it), I have made a point
of refusing to discuss Israeli or Jewish political issues here.
I realize and admit that rebutting the hateful writings of Wayne McGuire is
not and should not be the central issue of a forum devoted to the Clinton
scandals. Should the participants in this newsgroup ask me to desist from
such rebuttal and enable McGuire to continue unhindered, then I shall honor
that request. But in the meantime, we ought to know whom we're dealing with.
--
Avi Jacobson, email: Avi.Ja...@pbdir.com | When an idea is
| wanting, a word
Opinions are those of the poster, =NOT= of | can always be found
Amdocs, Inc. or Pacific Bell Directory. | to take its place.
| -- Goethe
-----== Posted via Deja News, The Leader in Internet Discussion ==-----
http://www.dejanews.com/ Now offering spam-free web-based newsreading
GLC1173
Wayne quoted me:
>> I'm Jewish - and I see the Kneepad Kid as too stupid to be >>any kind of
>>intelligence operative for anybody. Her attorney is also a dim >>bulb, if
you
>>ask this Jewish lawyer.
>> If the Kneepad Kid is any kind of intelligence operative for >>Israel,
then
>>why is her lawyer dumb enough to go on national television >>and tell the
>>world
>>that the Kneepad Kid wants Clinton to stay in power because >>he's
pro-Israel?
and replied:
>Intelligence agencies often use dummies without
>their knowledge or cognizance.
True - but intelligence agencies don't then have the dummies' lawyers run
their mouths about who the whole operation was for.
nob...@nsm.htp.org
On Tue, 26 May 1998 21:21:43 -0700, rayh...@value.net (Ray Heizer) wrote:
>In article <199805270014...@nsm.htp.org>, nob...@nsm.htp.org wrote:
>
>< What on earth is a *stealth* Jew? You are becoming very wierd.
>< From my own experience, I have known people with last names
>< like Smith, Jones or Williams who were in fact Jewish. Are you
>< claiming that is very rare? BTW, there are also people with
>< Italian-sounding surnames who are Jewish. On what do you base
>< your special expertise on this subject? Or do you simply shoot
>< from the hip with your judgments?
>
>-- Is a *stealth* Jew similar to someone who posts under a name like
>nob...@nsm.htp.org? i.e. not worth listening to since they have no
>convictions they have the guts to admit to?
NOW I know what a *stealth* Jew is! It's someone like Ray Heizer who
is ( I saw in another thread) for some unknown reason hiding his Jewishness.
Ray, aren't you the person who has a special interest in the clothing
owned by certain participants in the n.g.? Weren't you going to post a
complete inventory of all the clothing that you've acquired in the past
five years? You aren't a cross-dresser, are you Ray?
nob...@nsm.htp.org
Wayne McGuire
glc...@aol.com (GLC1173) wrote:
>Wayne quoted me:
>>> I'm Jewish - and I see the Kneepad Kid as too stupid to be >>any kind of
>>>intelligence operative for anybody. Her attorney is also a dim >>bulb, if
>you
>>>ask this Jewish lawyer.
>>> If the Kneepad Kid is any kind of intelligence operative for >>Israel,
>then
>>>why is her lawyer dumb enough to go on national television >>and tell the
>>>world
>>>that the Kneepad Kid wants Clinton to stay in power because >>he's
>pro-Israel?
>
>and replied:
>>Intelligence agencies often use dummies without
>>their knowledge or cognizance.
>
> True - but intelligence agencies don't then have the dummies' lawyers run
>their mouths about who the whole operation was for.
But keep in mind that this is the same
intelligence agency that was caught red-handed not
long ago trying to poison a Muslim leader in
Jordan and which has been humiliated by one public
embarrassment after another during recent years.
William Ginsburg did, as you point out, give away
what Monicagate is all about -- whether wittingly
or unwittingly doesn't matter.
Wayne McGuire
j...@inxpress.net wrote:
>Go look for yourself. I didn't base it on her name alone.
>You want to play it absolutely straight? OK: there is absolutely
>no way to know for sure, till she says.
In other words, Michael Osmalov doesn't know
anything about Linda Tripp's ethnicity and
religion. What a bizarre thread.
j...@inxpress.net
nob...@nsm.htp.org wrote:
>
>
> NOW I know what a *stealth* Jew is! It's someone like Ray Heizer who
> is ( I saw in another thread) for some unknown reason hiding his > Jewishness.
Use another layer of foil, Waynes.
j...@inxpress.net
Wayne McGuire wrote:
>
>
> William Ginsburg did, as you point out, give away
> what Monicagate is all about -- whether wittingly
> or unwittingly doesn't matter.
Pure crap, Waynes.
j...@inxpress.net
Wayne McGuire wrote:
>
> j...@inxpress.net wrote:
>
> >Go look for yourself. I didn't base it on her name alone.
> >You want to play it absolutely straight? OK: there is absolutely
> >no way to know for sure, till she says.
>
> In other words, Michael Osmalov doesn't know
> anything about Linda Tripp's ethnicity and
> religion. What a bizarre thread.
I made a semi-educated guess that she isn't, based
on her bio. Carroll apparently simply stated that
she is Jewish because he "heard it", and clealry
didn't bother to check out the ethnicity of his three
conniving harpies. If he had, he would have discovered
that Goldberg is not a Jew. But he didn't, and now,
Waynes, you'll have to cry in your pillow over
being disappointed again.
See Avi's excellent post about Wayne and his tactics.
Carroll is *wrong*, Waynes. But thanks for again showing
all the nice folks what a hate filled, twisted bastard
you are.
j...@inxpress.net
nob...@nsm.htp.org wrote:
>
> On Tue, 26 May 1998 21:21:43 -0700, rayh...@value.net (Ray Heizer) wrote:
>
> >In article <199805270014...@nsm.htp.org>, nob...@nsm.htp.org wrote:
> >
> >< What on earth is a *stealth* Jew? You are becoming very wierd.
> >< From my own experience, I have known people with last names
> >< like Smith, Jones or Williams who were in fact Jewish. Are you
> >< claiming that is very rare? BTW, there are also people with
> >< Italian-sounding surnames who are Jewish. On what do you base
> >< your special expertise on this subject? Or do you simply shoot
> >< from the hip with your judgments?
> >
> >-- Is a *stealth* Jew similar to someone who posts under a name like
> >nob...@nsm.htp.org? i.e. not worth listening to since they have no
> >convictions they have the guts to admit to?
>
> is ( I saw in another thread) for some unknown reason hiding his Jewishness.
>
> owned by certain participants in the n.g.? Weren't you going to post a
> complete inventory of all the clothing that you've acquired in the past
> five years? You aren't a cross-dresser, are you Ray?
Say, you aren't the leader of the Nobody.Sharp.Trio, are you?
Ray Heizer
In article <3578cb65...@news.newsguy.com>, Wayne McGuire
<wmcg...@cybercom.net> wrote:
< There is a high probability that the Lewinsky
< affair is an Israeli right-wing plot. We will
< learn more about this matter as investigators dig
< into the political backgrounds of the Goldbergs.
-- This has been at FreeRepublic for 1-1/2 months:
To: migjagger and anyone else interested
Hey gang - I've waited three months to start talking and if the
response to having done CNN and NBC today is an indication I may
become the next Ginzburg. I hope not but I'm out - I mad as hell
and neither your's truly nor Linda Tripp is going to take it anymore.
(It was the communion bit that finally made me snap-
Goldberg is my husband's name) - My e-mail is attached - let's
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
go kick butt - it's time. My fax is 212-877-6405.
From: Trixie (Luci...@aol.com) * <-----
04/06/98 16:20:54 EDT
http://www.freerepublic.com/forum/a169435.htm
- - -
To: bowdoin72
I thought I'd point out to those of you who have been reading Salon
that it was that intripid investigative reporter Jonathan Broder
who wrote that I was a Moussad agent. For pity sake. This don't
^^^^^^^^^^^^^ *************
even belong to the P.T.A. I am an Episcopalian and a registered
Independent. Sheesh!
From: Trixie (Luci...@aol.com) * <------
05/01/98 16:42:38 EDT
http://www.freerepublic.com/forum/a222667.htm
- - -
-- Have you taken the time to run your Goldberg assumptions up against
reality, Waynes? Did you fax her before reaching yhou conclusions?
-- Is this the kind of research that led you to leave Harvard before
completeing your doctorate?
-- What DO you do for a living? Obvious nothing that involves resesarch or
thinking.
Ray Heizer
In article <357dcf06...@news.newsguy.com>, Wayne McGuire
<wmcg...@cybercom.net> wrote:
< j...@inxpress.net wrote:
<
< >Wayne McGuire wrote:
< >>
< >> j...@inxpress.net wrote:
< >>
< >> >Go look for yourself. I didn't base it on her name alone.
< >> >You want to play it absolutely straight? OK: there is absolutely
< >> >no way to know for sure, till she says.
< >>
< >> In other words, Michael Osmalov doesn't know
< >> anything about Linda Tripp's ethnicity and
< >> religion. What a bizarre thread.
< >
< >I made a semi-educated guess that she isn't, based
< >on her bio.
<
< No, you made a BIGOTED judgement about her
< ethnicity and religion based on your moronic
< assumption that someone with an Italian-sounding
< surname can't be Jewish.
<
< >Carroll apparently simply stated that
< >she is Jewish because he "heard it", and clealry
< >didn't bother to check out the ethnicity of his three
< >conniving harpies.
<
< Three or four separate individuals have claimed on
< Usenet that Linda Tripp is Jewish. I haven't seen
< any proof on the matter one way or the other. You
< certainly possess none.
<
< But there are better than even odds that an
< Israeli angle is going to emerge in Monicagate,
< just as it has in Schwartzgate. The Goldbergs are
< up to their ears in right-wing Israeli political
< connections.
<
< Care to make a bet on the matter?
<
< --
< Wayne McGuire
< http://www.cybercom.net/~wmcguire
-- How much? What will you accept as evidence?
j...@inxpress.net
>
> Both William Ginsburg and Monica Lewinsky made it
> clear that, like you, they value the interests of
> Israel much more than that of the United States.
Sorry, Waynes; you are, once again, incorrect
about me, and it evens takes a stretch to
get there about Lewinsky and Ginsburg. But you
don't give a damn about the truth, when there
are *Jews* in your crosshairs.
> Notice that Ginsburg focused on the fact that
> Clinton was good for ISRAEL, not the United
> States.
And notice your latest "theory" that "Monicagate"
is a *Jew* conspiracy designed to overthrow Clinton
in favor of Gore. You are one crazy whipsaw son of a
bitch, Waynes.
<remaining jewbaiting snipped>
j...@inxpress.net
> >>
> >> >Go look for yourself. I didn't base it on her name alone.
> >> >You want to play it absolutely straight? OK: there is absolutely
> >> >no way to know for sure, till she says.
> >>
> >> In other words, Michael Osmalov doesn't know
> >> anything about Linda Tripp's ethnicity and
> >> religion. What a bizarre thread.
> >
> >I made a semi-educated guess that she isn't, based
> >on her bio.
>
> No, you made a BIGOTED judgement about her
> ethnicity and religion based on your moronic
> assumption that someone with an Italian-sounding
> surname can't be Jewish.
I've got $100 that says she isn't, asshole.
>
> >Carroll apparently simply stated that
> >she is Jewish because he "heard it", and clealry
> >didn't bother to check out the ethnicity of his three
> >conniving harpies.
>
> Three or four separate individuals have claimed on
> Usenet that Linda Tripp is Jewish. I haven't seen
> any proof on the matter one way or the other.
Name 'em, and give their email addresses. I'll
bet you another $100 that at least one is
neoNazi. Which is right up your sick alley.
j...@inxpress.net
Oh, look, waynes, I've found a post by one of your
buddies *already*! I'll be a good sport and save you
that $100. Here it is. Enjoy!
Subject: MONICA LEWINSKY : Sayan ?
From: troy...@aol.com (TroyLaws)
Date: 1998/01/24
Message-ID: <19980124172...@ladder01.news.aol.com>
Newsgroups: alt.activism
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If I were to guess why the Jew-controlled media has
suddenly turned on Clinton like a pack of rabid dogs,
I would probably say something like this:
Monica Lewinsky and Linda Tripp are both Jewish
Sayanim ("assistants" to Israel) who were recruited
to use Clinton's voracious appetite for sex to set him
up in order to blackmail him into attacking Iraq and
destroying its biological weapons. But he didn't attack
Iraq, despite enormous pressure from the Jew-controlled
media. That was his fatal mistake.
In addition, right wing elements in Israel do not want
=any= land traded for peace, which Clinton seems
inclined to ask them to do. In fact, he's meeting right
now with Arafat and Bebe. Quite a coincidence.
Now, Clinton knows that he's probably been set-up by
Lewinsky and Tripp, and he knows why. But if my theory
is correct, he will never be able to tell the American people
the whole truth, because there's someone at Stanford
University who might get hurt.
[[[[[[ National Alliance, PO Box 90, Hillsboro, WV 24946 ]]]]]]
[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[ http://www.natall.com
]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]
Wayne McGuire
j...@inxpress.net wrote:
>Wayne McGuire wrote:
>>
>
>>
>> William Ginsburg did, as you point out, give away
>> what Monicagate is all about -- whether wittingly
>> or unwittingly doesn't matter.
>
>
>Pure crap, Waynes.
Care to elaborate?
Both William Ginsburg and Monica Lewinsky made it
clear that, like you, they value the interests of
Israel much more than that of the United States.
Notice that Ginsburg focused on the fact that
Clinton was good for ISRAEL, not the United
States.
Lewinsky was an excellent tool for Walter Kaye,
Marcia Lewis, Linda Tripp and Lucianne and Jonah
Goldberg to manipulate.
Benjamin Netanyahu has made it clear that he is
determined to destroy the Clinton administration,
using all the assets he can muster, in order to
wreck of Oslo Accords and the Mideast peace
process.
There is a high probability that the Lewinsky
affair is an Israeli right-wing plot. We will
learn more about this matter as investigators dig
into the political backgrounds of the Goldbergs.
--
Wayne McGuire
http://www.cybercom.net/~wmcguire
Wayne McGuire
j...@inxpress.net wrote:
>Wayne McGuire wrote:
>>
>> j...@inxpress.net wrote:
>>
>> >Go look for yourself. I didn't base it on her name alone.
>> >You want to play it absolutely straight? OK: there is absolutely
>> >no way to know for sure, till she says.
>>
>> In other words, Michael Osmalov doesn't know
>> anything about Linda Tripp's ethnicity and
>> religion. What a bizarre thread.
>
>I made a semi-educated guess that she isn't, based
>on her bio.
No, you made a BIGOTED judgement about her
ethnicity and religion based on your moronic
assumption that someone with an Italian-sounding
surname can't be Jewish.
>Carroll apparently simply stated that
>she is Jewish because he "heard it", and clealry
>didn't bother to check out the ethnicity of his three
>conniving harpies.
Three or four separate individuals have claimed on
Usenet that Linda Tripp is Jewish. I haven't seen
any proof on the matter one way or the other. You
certainly possess none.
But there are better than even odds that an
Israeli angle is going to emerge in Monicagate,
just as it has in Schwartzgate. The Goldbergs are
up to their ears in right-wing Israeli political
connections.
Care to make a bet on the matter?
--
Wayne McGuire
http://www.cybercom.net/~wmcguire
Wayne McGuire
j...@inxpress.net wrote:
>Wayne McGuire wrote:
>>
>> j...@inxpress.net wrote:
>>
>> >Wayne McGuire wrote:
>> >>
>> >
>> >>
>> >> William Ginsburg did, as you point out, give away
>> >> what Monicagate is all about -- whether wittingly
>> >> or unwittingly doesn't matter.
>> >
>> >
>> >Pure crap, Waynes.
>>
>> Care to elaborate?
>>
>> Both William Ginsburg and Monica Lewinsky made it
>> clear that, like you, they value the interests of
>> Israel much more than that of the United States.
>
>Sorry, Waynes; you are, once again, incorrect
>about me, and it evens takes a stretch to
>get there about Lewinsky and Ginsburg. But you
>don't give a damn about the truth, when there
>are *Jews* in your crosshairs.
But Mr. Osmalov: Israel for you is obviously a
SACRED COW. You've demonstrated your blind
subservience to Israel literally thousands of
times in this newsgroup over the years. Israel is
the center of your emotional and ideological life.
You have shown no such sensitivity in attacking
the American government with the ferocity of a
Bolshevik. I really doubt that you feel an ounce
of loyalty towards the United States -- all your
loyalty is reserved for Israel.
>> Notice that Ginsburg focused on the fact that
>> Clinton was good for ISRAEL, not the United
>> States.
>
>And notice your latest "theory" that "Monicagate"
>is a *Jew* conspiracy designed to overthrow Clinton
>in favor of Gore. You are one crazy whipsaw son of a
>bitch, Waynes.
Many intelligent commentators have speculated that
Monicagate is an Israeli operation designed to
replace Bill Clinton with the more subservient Al
Gore. There is a good deal of evidence on the
table already to support the theory, and more will
be forthcoming.
Wayne McGuire
rayh...@value.net (Ray Heizer) wrote:
>In article <3578cb65...@news.newsguy.com>, Wayne McGuire
><wmcg...@cybercom.net> wrote:
>
>< There is a high probability that the Lewinsky
>< affair is an Israeli right-wing plot. We will
>< learn more about this matter as investigators dig
>< into the political backgrounds of the Goldbergs.
>
>
Do you really think the Mossad is incapable of
using or recruiting as an agent an Episcopalian
who worked as a spy for Murray Chotiner and whose
husband was up to his ears in spook connections?
Read Victor Ostrovsky's two books on the Mossad
before commenting further on the subject.
Lucianne Goldberg, of course, like Bear Bottoms,
has a background as a professional liar and
deceiver. Nothing she says can be believed, given
her background.
We especially should learn more about Jonah
Goldberg's political background and connections to
characters like Ben Wattenberg, since he has
behaved as a co-conspirator with his mother in
this sordid and disgusting affair.
Benjamin Netanyahu has threatened to burn down
Washington and destroy the Clinton administration.
The Goldbergs may have been one of many tools
which he and his political operatives have used to
achieve that objective.
M Soja
On Thu, 28 May 1998 02:31:18 GMT, -<[ Wayne McGuire ]>- posted:
>Benjamin Netanyahu has made it clear that he is
>determined to destroy the Clinton administration,
>using all the assets he can muster, in order to
>wreck of Oslo Accords and the Mideast peace
>process.
>There is a high probability that the Lewinsky
>affair is an Israeli right-wing plot. We will
>learn more about this matter as investigators dig
>into the political backgrounds of the Goldbergs.
When did Lewinsky take power?
When did Netanyahu?
If Lewinsky and Ginzburg are pro Israel and want Clinton out then why
are they fighting Starr?
j...@inxpress.net
Wayne McGuire wrote:
>
> rayh...@value.net (Ray Heizer) wrote:
>
> >In article <3578cb65...@news.newsguy.com>, Wayne McGuire
> ><wmcg...@cybercom.net> wrote:
> >
> >< affair is an Israeli right-wing plot. We will
> >< learn more about this matter as investigators dig
> >< into the political backgrounds of the Goldbergs.
> >
> >
Well, Waynes, why are you ducking the subject of the thread,
which was Gerald Carroll's theory that was based on Tripp
and Goldberg and Lewinsky being Jews?
Never mind. I'll just reread Avi's post to find out why.
Ray Heizer
In article <357dcf06...@news.newsguy.com>, Wayne McGuire
<wmcg...@cybercom.net> wrote:
<
< Three or four separate individuals have claimed on
< Usenet that Linda Tripp is Jewish. I haven't seen
< any proof on the matter one way or the other. You
< certainly possess none.
-- Wanna bet? How much? I assume you would have no problem accepting a
statement from Linda herself or her lawyer as evidence that she is not
Jewish.
Roger Alexander
This was my gut reaction the morning I heard about it. Of course, I
have
no evidence whatever to support it. but then the hoi polloi don't often
get such.
RLA
Wayne McGuire wrote:
> j...@inxpress.net wrote:
>
> >Wayne McGuire wrote:
> >>
> >
> >>
> >> William Ginsburg did, as you point out, give away
> >> what Monicagate is all about -- whether wittingly
> >> or unwittingly doesn't matter.
> >
> >
> >Pure crap, Waynes.
>
> Care to elaborate?
>
> Both William Ginsburg and Monica Lewinsky made it
> clear that, like you, they value the interests of
> Israel much more than that of the United States.
> Notice that Ginsburg focused on the fact that
> Clinton was good for ISRAEL, not the United
> States.
>
> Lewinsky was an excellent tool for Walter Kaye,
> Marcia Lewis, Linda Tripp and Lucianne and Jonah
> Goldberg to manipulate.
>
> Benjamin Netanyahu has made it clear that he is
> determined to destroy the Clinton administration,
> using all the assets he can muster, in order to
> wreck of Oslo Accords and the Mideast peace
> process.
>
> There is a high probability that the Lewinsky
> affair is an Israeli right-wing plot. We will
> learn more about this matter as investigators dig
> into the political backgrounds of the Goldbergs.
>
> --
> Wayne McGuire
> http://www.cybercom.net/~wmcguire
Roger Alexander
Not to steal Mr. McGuire's thunder, nor to answer for him, but as a
person
who has an opinion on this subject, the short answer is that it aappears
the
original thrust was to pressure Clinton to bomb Iraq. The Israelis could
not
have realized that the right wing Republicans, who hate Clinton for
taking the
presidency away from them, would be able to make so much of the scandal.
Thus it appears that Lewinsky and her affair has escaped from the Israeli
grasp.
Her attorney's remarks make a lot os sense viewed in that light.
RLA
M Soja wrote:
> On Thu, 28 May 1998 02:31:18 GMT, -<[ Wayne McGuire ]>- posted:
>
> >Benjamin Netanyahu has made it clear that he is
> >determined to destroy the Clinton administration,
> >using all the assets he can muster, in order to
> >wreck of Oslo Accords and the Mideast peace
> >process.
>
> >There is a high probability that the Lewinsky
> >affair is an Israeli right-wing plot. We will
> >learn more about this matter as investigators dig
> >into the political backgrounds of the Goldbergs.
>
Wayne McGuire
rayh...@value.net (Ray Heizer) wrote:
So present the evidence. I'm an agnostic on the subject.
I am, however, not agnostic on the subject of Lucianne Goldberg's ties to
Murray Chotiner, Victor Lasky, William Safire, Jonah Goldberg and her
husband.
From a researcher:
--- BEGIN ---
On Ben Wattenberg, employer of Jonah:
Wattenberg was intimately involved with contra support activities
during the 1980s. He's a pro-Israeli think tank activist. He's
in Who's Who in America. He was on the Board for International
Broadcasting (RFE and RE), linked to NED/CIA projects such as Prodemca.
Wattenberg and Penn Kemble founded the Coalition for a Democratic Majority
in 1972. Ben is/was involved with SD-USA and Freedom House -- both
intelligence linked. One of Elliott Abrams' assistants was a
Dan Wattenberg, and Ben has a son named Daniel (I presume they
are one and the same). His daughter Ruth is also in SD-USA.
---- END ---
j...@inxpress.net
Roger Alexander wrote:
>
> Not to steal Mr. McGuire's thunder, nor to answer for him, but as a
> person
> who has an opinion on this subject, the short answer is that it aappears
> the
> original thrust was to pressure Clinton to bomb Iraq. The Israelis could
> not
> have realized that the right wing Republicans, who hate Clinton for
> taking the
> presidency away from them, would be able to make so much of the scandal.
> Thus it appears that Lewinsky and her affair has escaped from the Israeli
> grasp.
> Her attorney's remarks make a lot os sense viewed in that light.
> RLA
Yes, here we have yet another poster who sees poor Bill Clinton
as a victim.
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1. 98/05/28 024 Re: Broken Arab Promises#1/2 talk.politics.mideast
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2. 98/05/24 024 Re: Torture by Israel talk.politics.mideast
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Roger Alexander
15. 98/05/23 023 Re: Zionist Hate in the Holy talk.politics.mideast
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16. 98/05/22 023 Re: Torture by Israel talk.politics.mideast
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18. 98/05/22 023 From the Prostitution FA#2/2 talk.politics.mideast
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Roger Alexander
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31. 98/05/25 022 Murdering History Chomsk#3/5 talk.politics.mideast
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33. 98/05/25 022 Re: Broken Arab Promises talk.politics.mideast
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61. 98/05/19 022 Re: Broken Arab Promises#1/2 talk.politics.mideast
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64. 98/05/15 022 Re: . . . For a Number O#2/2 talk.politics.mideast
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89. 98/05/05 021 Re: Hezbollah chief ratt#3/4 talk.politics.mideast
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90. 98/05/04 021 Re: Hezbollah chief ratt#1/2 talk.politics.mideast
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Ray Heizer
In article <35a0d6ca...@news.newsguy.com>, Wayne McGuire
<wmcg...@cybercom.net> wrote:
< rayh...@value.net (Ray Heizer) wrote:
<
< >In article <357dcf06...@news.newsguy.com>, Wayne McGuire
< ><wmcg...@cybercom.net> wrote:
< ><
< >< Three or four separate individuals have claimed on
< >< Usenet that Linda Tripp is Jewish. I haven't seen
< >< any proof on the matter one way or the other. You
< >< certainly possess none.
< >
< >-- Wanna bet? How much? I assume you would have no problem accepting a
< >statement from Linda herself or her lawyer as evidence that she is not
< >Jewish.
<
< So present the evidence. I'm an agnostic on the subject.
-- Put your money where your mouth is, Henry.
Wayne Mann
Wayne McGuire <wmcg...@cybercom.net> wrote:
Damn it Wayne take your despicable anti-Semitism somewhere
else but get it OFF ac-ecw where is does_NOT_ belong. You can
hate Israel and Jews all you want, but you may _NOT_ highjack
every damned thread here and through your sick hatred twist it to
your hate for Jews. You are a sick, evil, despicable bastard and
I am tired of your posting your hate here where it is completely
_OFF-SUBJECT! Now you either take it someplace else and stay off
this newsgroup or I am going to complain to your real ISP which
is erols.com and get everyone else I can to complain as well. It
is against all Netiquette rules to do what you are doing and I am
fed up with you. Now get off here and stay off!
Folks if he posts here any more if you agree you can
complain to: postmaster@ erols.com and ab...@erols.com We do not
have to put up with people that are posting off-subject and
spamming it here.
>j...@inxpress.net wrote:
>
>>Wayne McGuire wrote:
>>>
>>> j...@inxpress.net wrote:
>>>
>>> >Wayne McGuire wrote:
>>> >>
>>> >
>>> >>
>>> >> William Ginsburg did, as you point out, give away
>>> >> what Monicagate is all about -- whether wittingly
>>> >> or unwittingly doesn't matter.
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >Pure crap, Waynes.
>>>
>>> Care to elaborate?
>>>
>>> Both William Ginsburg and Monica Lewinsky made it
>>> clear that, like you, they value the interests of
>>> Israel much more than that of the United States.
>>
>>Sorry, Waynes; you are, once again, incorrect
>>about me, and it evens takes a stretch to
>>get there about Lewinsky and Ginsburg. But you
>>don't give a damn about the truth, when there
>>are *Jews* in your crosshairs.
>
>But Mr. Osmalov: Israel for you is obviously a
>SACRED COW. You've demonstrated your blind
>subservience to Israel literally thousands of
>times in this newsgroup over the years. Israel is
>the center of your emotional and ideological life.
>
>You have shown no such sensitivity in attacking
>the American government with the ferocity of a
>Bolshevik. I really doubt that you feel an ounce
>of loyalty towards the United States -- all your
>loyalty is reserved for Israel.
>
>>> Notice that Ginsburg focused on the fact that
>>> Clinton was good for ISRAEL, not the United
>>> States.
>>
Roger Alexander
I have rather cooled on Clinton. He is too influenced by his Zionist friends.
He is finding
out now that they are fair weather friends. But in this case, I think they
tried to pull some crude stuff.
RLa
M Soja
On Thu, 28 May 1998 21:35:25 GMT, -<[ Roger Alexander ]>- posted:
>Not to steal Mr. McGuire's thunder, nor to answer for him, but as a
>person
>who has an opinion on this subject, the short answer is that it aappears
>the
>original thrust was to pressure Clinton to bomb Iraq. The Israelis could
>not
>have realized that the right wing Republicans, who hate Clinton for
>taking the
>presidency away from them, would be able to make so much of the scandal.
>Thus it appears that Lewinsky and her affair has escaped from the Israeli
>grasp.
>Her attorney's remarks make a lot os sense viewed in that light.
>RLA
I agree that Clinton was being blackmailed, but not by Jews wanting
Hussein out of power (at least not by the Lewinskys.)
Lewinsky withheld her affidavit only until her job offer came through,
not until Irag got bombed.
jz
How reassuring to Clinton it must be to read this ng and see that the
anti-semites, the populist conspiracy nuts, the Noam Chomsky fans,
Neo-Nazis, LaRouchites and Wayne McGuire are all rallying to his support.
Rack Jite - meet "Winston Smith" and Wayne McGuire, your new comrades-in-arms.
JS
Howard J. Aubrey
jz wrote:
> How reassuring to Clinton it must be to read this ng and see that the
> anti-semites, the populist conspiracy nuts, the Noam Chomsky fans,
> Neo-Nazis, LaRouchites and Wayne McGuire are all rallying to his support.
>
Since you are posting here, which one are you????
jz
> jz wrote:
>
> > How reassuring to Clinton it must be to read this ng and see that the
> > anti-semites, the populist conspiracy nuts, the Noam Chomsky fans,
> > Neo-Nazis, LaRouchites and Wayne McGuire are all rallying to his support.
> >
>
> Since you are posting here, which one are you????
I'm not "rallying to Clinton's support"
like McGuire and the rest. Do you always
deliberately misread posts to make a cheap point?
JS
A. G. Phillbin
In article <357158da...@news.newsguy.com>, ms...@javanet.com (M Soja) wrote:
^On Thu, 28 May 1998 21:35:25 GMT, -<[ Roger Alexander ]>- posted:
^
^>Not to steal Mr. McGuire's thunder, nor to answer for him, but as a
^>person
^>who has an opinion on this subject, the short answer is that it aappears
^>the
^>original thrust was to pressure Clinton to bomb Iraq. The Israelis could
^>not
^>have realized that the right wing Republicans, who hate Clinton for
^>taking the
^>presidency away from them, would be able to make so much of the scandal.
^>Thus it appears that Lewinsky and her affair has escaped from the Israeli
^>grasp.
^>Her attorney's remarks make a lot os sense viewed in that light.
^>RLA
^
^I agree that Clinton was being blackmailed, but not by Jews wanting
^Hussein out of power (at least not by the Lewinskys.)
^
^Lewinsky withheld her affidavit only until her job offer came through,
^not until Irag got bombed.
Roger needs a long rest if he still believes that Lewinsky/Zionist conspiracy
crap. Clinton was being pressured by the Republicans, who wanted to bring him
down, plain and simple. The Clinton White House controlled Monica's "defense"
from day one. Her ex-attorney, Ginsburg, was hired on the recommendation of
Vernon Jordan, the same White House courtier who allegedly coached Lewinsky on
what to say if she was asked about her "affair" with Clinton, and who tried to
set her up with a job at Revlon. The only "grasp" Monica got out of was
Clinton's, by hiring two real criminal attorneys, not Ginsburg the malpractice
sheister.
As far as Iraq is concerned, it is connected to the Lewinsky affair only in
the sense that the Clinton White House hoped to use it to deflect attention
from his own difficulties -- but that was entirely the doing of the Clinton
White House, not Monica or some shadowy "Zionists" supposedly behind her. Were
these same "Zionists" behind her when they met months before? Is Linda Tripp a
"zionist," or just a despicable sleazebag who spies on her "friends" and went
straight to Ken Starr with her story? Is Ken Starr a "zionist," or a partisan
Republican prosecutor with connections to the Mellon-Scaife Foundation?
If you're having trouble following this, it's because the theory is
ridiculously insane. We have "zionist" Monica having an affair with Clinton,
who is finked on by "zionist" Linda Tripp, who runs to "zionist" Ken Starr.
"Zionist" Monica then hires "zionist" lawyer Ginsburg, at the recommendation
of Clinton confidante "zionist" Vernon Jordan. Both prosecution and defense
are stacked with "zionists!" And all of them no doubt were itching to bomb
Iraq! If this isn't paranoia, then I'm going to start believing in astrology,
since obviously the motion of the stars and planets reveals the "real" power
behind everything.
So why did Clinton try to bomb Iraq? It wasn't because of Monica, although he
certainly hoped that a "Wag the Dog" scenario would help him. The State Dept.
was still smarting from the defeat they had been delivered during the first
installment of the "Iraqi weapons inspection crisis." Hussein had successfully
broken the coalition. The US had to settle for a face-saving
Security Council resolution that threatened force against Iraq, but didn't
actually authorize it. The second installment started as l'affaire Monica
became public. The US, having failed to get the coalition behind them,
threatened to bomb Iraq on their own, if Hussein didn't comply with the
weapons inspectors. The coalition "allies" had to be shown who was boss. The
main purpose behind US belligerency towards Iraq has been the same as it was
in the Gulf War -- control of the oil flowing out of the Gulf. They couldn't
allow Iraq to control Kuwaiti oil, and the US wasn't going to allow it's
"allies," notably France and Russia, to be allowed to make separate deals with
Iraq to buy it's oil. But things didn't go America's way the second time
around, either. Not only didn't the Gulf War coalition (with the exception of
Britain) not go along, but Boris Yeltsin went so far as to say that "Clinton
could stumble into World War Three" if he continued on his course. It wasn't
long before the US backed off. Shortly before UN Sec. Gen'l Kofi Annan
negotiated that deal with Hussein, the Security Council unanimously (incl. US)
raised Iraq's oil revenue ceiling by greater than 100%. And I'd bet the
contracts went to French and Russian companies. Personally, I love it -- for
all their ridiculous gloating over "the death of communism," the US ruling
class is STILL frightened of the Russians, with or without communism.
The US didn't need the Zionists cheering from the sidelines to get them to
bomb Iraq -- they had ample reasons of their own. And, without retracting any
criticism of Zionism that I have posted, I say without reservation that the
Zionists motives are more honorable than the Americans as far as the Persian
Gulf is concerned. At least Israel is potentially in danger from Iraqi
missiles (they're in range). All the Americans want is money, and the power to
control a resource that their "allies" need more than they do (America has
large oil reserves).
In short, to paraphrase Roger, Uncle Sam is sucks.
Wayne McGuire
It makes little sense for the Republicans to bring
down Clinton now -- the sole effect would be
greatly to increase the advantage of Al Gore, a
Democrat, in the next presidential election, who
would be running as an incumbent.
On the other hand, reputable sources, like the
Forward, have reported that powerful hardline
forces in the Israeli lobby have much preferred Al
Gore to Bill Clinton for some time now.
Sophisticated analysts have noticed that Clinton
continued the peace policies established by George
Bush and James Baker, and that Al Gore would be
likely to reverse these policies in favor of
Benjamin Netanyahu's aggressive and messianic
nationalism.
Blowjobgate came to a head just as stress between
the United States and Israel was reaching the
breaking point over the peace process. The timing
was so convenient, in fact, that a number of savvy
Jewish writers in Israel and the United States
compared the development to the "miracle" of
Purim.
A. G. Phillbin
In article <35991c82...@news.newsguy.com>, wmcg...@cybercom.net (Wayne McGuire) wrote:
^agfi...@hooked.net (A. G. Phillbin) wrote:
^
^>In article <357158da...@news.newsguy.com>, ms...@javanet.com (M Soja)
^ wrote:
^>^On Thu, 28 May 1998 21:35:25 GMT, -<[ Roger Alexander ]>- posted:
^>^
^>^>Not to steal Mr. McGuire's thunder, nor to answer for him, but as a
^>^>who has an opinion on this subject, the short answer is that it aappears
^>^>the
^>^>original thrust was to pressure Clinton to bomb Iraq. The Israelis could
^>^>not
^>^>have realized that the right wing Republicans, who hate Clinton for
^>^>taking the
^>^>presidency away from them, would be able to make so much of the scandal.
^>^>Thus it appears that Lewinsky and her affair has escaped from the Israeli
^>^>grasp.
^>^>Her attorney's remarks make a lot os sense viewed in that light.
^>^>RLA
^>^
^>^I agree that Clinton was being blackmailed, but not by Jews wanting
^>^
^>^Lewinsky withheld her affidavit only until her job offer came through,
^>
^>Roger needs a long rest if he still believes that Lewinsky/Zionist conspiracy
^>crap. Clinton was being pressured by the Republicans, who wanted to bring him
^>down, plain and simple.
^
^It makes little sense for the Republicans to bring
^down Clinton now -- the sole effect would be
^greatly to increase the advantage of Al Gore, a
^Democrat, in the next presidential election, who
^would be running as an incumbent.
BULLSHIT. Gore would have been tainted by association with Clinton, and by his
prominent role in the presidential campaign finance scandal. This is like
claiming that if the Democrats had brought down Nixon before Agnew resigned,
it would have strengthened Agnew.
^
^On the other hand, reputable sources, like the
^Forward,
Who the fuck is "the Forward?" Reputable to whom?
^have reported that powerful hardline
^forces in the Israeli lobby have much preferred Al
^Gore to Bill Clinton for some time now.
^Sophisticated analysts have noticed that Clinton
^continued the peace policies established by George
^Bush and James Baker, and that Al Gore would be
^likely to reverse these policies in favor of
^Benjamin Netanyahu's aggressive and messianic
^nationalism.
What "peace policies?" Care to name some "peace policies" worthy of the name
coming from Bush or Baker?
^
^Blowjobgate came to a head just as stress between
^the United States and Israel was reaching the
^breaking point over the peace process. The timing
^was so convenient, in fact, that a number of savvy
^Jewish writers in Israel and the United States
^compared the development to the "miracle" of
^Purim.
I didn't read any of those particular writers, but I fail to see any logical
connection -- or were those writers in on this great conspiracy as well? Isn't
it more logical to assume that the writers in question were simply expressing
their relief that Clinton's own troubles had saved Israel from an embarassing
rift with the United States? Since the crisis has already passed, why would
Ken Starr still be pressuring Monica to testify? Why, if Monica was a "Zionist
agent," as you and resident talk.politics.middle-east muddlehead RLA contend,
would she ever have attempted to resist testifying against Clinton? Surely a
"Zionist agent," intent on bringing down the president, would have jumped at
the chance to testify, with or without immunity. Instead, she sent her lawyer
ahead to talk for her and stall as long as possible. This is the stupidest
conspiracy theory I have ever heard, including the UFO coverup theories.
One more question: why did you cut the rest of my statement from this post?
That statement explained very clearly the dynamics of the Persian Gulf
conflict. I'll tell you why -- because you couldn't answer it. But it proves
one thing I told Roger before -- anti-Semites and Zionists agree on one thing:
the whole world revolves around the navel of Israel -- they only argue over
whether or not that's a good thing.
Michael Rivero
No matter what goes wrong, in Wayne's view, it's the Jews who did it.
Vince Foster? The Mossad killed him.
The economic slowdown in asia? The Jews did it.
El Nino? The Jews did it.
I'm not convinced that Wayne is anti--semitic, but I think he hopes
everyone else is as he lays all kinds of false trails to take the heat
off of the White House.
Tonight's 600 Minutes featured a Commerce Departnent worker who was
ordered by his superiors not to question the transfer of sophisticated
machine tools to China, tools that wound up in a factory that produces
cruise missiles.
Wayne will be sure it's the Jews who did it!!
--
Mike & Claire - The Rancho Runnamukka http://www.accessone.com/~rivero/
http://www.accessone.com/~rivero/POLITICS/FOSTER_COVERUP/foster.html
Awarded a Lycos "Top 5%" of the web!
Roger Alexander
A. G. Phillbin wrote:
> In article <35991c82...@news.newsguy.com>, wmcg...@cybercom.net (Wayne McGuire) wrote:
> ^agfi...@hooked.net (A. G. Phillbin) wrote:
> ^
> ^>In article <357158da...@news.newsguy.com>, ms...@javanet.com (M Soja)
> ^ wrote:
> ^>^On Thu, 28 May 1998 21:35:25 GMT, -<[ Roger Alexander ]>- posted:
> ^>^
> ^>^>Not to steal Mr. McGuire's thunder, nor to answer for him, but as a
> ^>^>person
> ^>^>who has an opinion on this subject, the short answer is that it aappears
> ^>^>the
> ^>^>original thrust was to pressure Clinton to bomb Iraq. The Israelis could
> ^>^>not
> ^>^>have realized that the right wing Republicans, who hate Clinton for
> ^>^>taking the
> ^>^>presidency away from them, would be able to make so much of the scandal.
> ^>^>Thus it appears that Lewinsky and her affair has escaped from the Israeli
> ^>^>grasp.
> ^>^>Her attorney's remarks make a lot os sense viewed in that light.
> ^>^>RLA
> ^>^
> ^>^I agree that Clinton was being blackmailed, but not by Jews wanting
> ^>^Hussein out of power (at least not by the Lewinskys.)
> ^>^
> ^>^Lewinsky withheld her affidavit only until her job offer came through,
> ^>^not until Irag got bombed.
> ^>
> ^>Roger needs a long rest if he still believes that Lewinsky/Zionist conspiracy
> ^>crap. Clinton was being pressured by the Republicans, who wanted to bring him
> ^>down, plain and simple.
> ^
> ^It makes little sense for the Republicans to bring
> ^down Clinton now -- the sole effect would be
> ^greatly to increase the advantage of Al Gore, a
> ^Democrat, in the next presidential election, who
> ^would be running as an incumbent.
>
> BULLSHIT. Gore would have been tainted by association with Clinton, and by his
> prominent role in the presidential campaign finance scandal. This is like
> claiming that if the Democrats had brought down Nixon before Agnew resigned,
> it would have strengthened Agnew.
>
There is a culture war going on in this country. Few nonZionists even are aware of it.People on
this board take ti for granted and don't even discuss it. So long as it remains
unspoken on TV and in newspapers, most Americans will not realize the context in
which your remarks are spoken. So Gore can still be Mr Clean even if Clinton is
knocked out, none of which I am hoping for BTW. I still have a lingering
like for Clinton, even as he has done the Israeli bidding. I think there is an elite
which is resisting capitulating to the Israelis but that Clinton is badly hurt by the
various efforts (all one really) by Ken Starr, all designed to strengthen the rightwing
branch of our elite. Again I have zero data for all this. Ifeel like the ordinary
Russian during the Communist era, trying to figure out waht is going on from what
is not said.
RLA
> ^
> ^On the other hand, reputable sources, like the
> ^Forward,
>
> Who the fuck is "the Forward?" Reputable to whom?
>
Used to be called the Jewish Forward if that helps. Sort of independent Jewishnewpaper out of
New York. RLA
> ^have reported that powerful hardline
> ^forces in the Israeli lobby have much preferred Al
> ^Gore to Bill Clinton for some time now.
> ^Sophisticated analysts have noticed that Clinton
> ^continued the peace policies established by George
> ^Bush and James Baker, and that Al Gore would be
> ^likely to reverse these policies in favor of
> ^Benjamin Netanyahu's aggressive and messianic
> ^nationalism.
>
It should be clear that Gore has sold his soul to the Israelis.I try not to go too overboard in
my comments, and I am a lifelong
Democrat, but when Gore becosme the party's candidate, I cannot
support him. I don't use the word whore lightly, but in his case it fits.
And I am sorry as hell to have to say that about a man whom I had
always regarded highly.
RLA
> What "peace policies?" Care to name some "peace policies" worthy of the name
> coming from Bush or Baker?
>
One has to give the devil his due. Without Bush and Baker, there would have beenno "peace
process". The Israelis didn't try to assassinate him at Madrid because
he was their buddy. he lost his election because of it. What more do you want of
the man?
> ^
> ^Blowjobgate came to a head just as stress between
> ^the United States and Israel was reaching the
> ^breaking point over the peace process. The timing
> ^was so convenient, in fact, that a number of savvy
> ^Jewish writers in Israel and the United States
> ^compared the development to the "miracle" of
> ^Purim.
>
> I didn't read any of those particular writers, but I fail to see any logical
> connection -- or were those writers in on this great conspiracy as well? Isn't
> it more logical to assume that the writers in question were simply expressing
> their relief that Clinton's own troubles had saved Israel from an embarassing
> rift with the United States? Since the crisis has already passed, why would
> Ken Starr still be pressuring Monica to testify? Why, if Monica was a "Zionist
> agent," as you and resident talk.politics.middle-east muddlehead RLA contend,
> would she ever have attempted to resist testifying against Clinton? Surely a
> "Zionist agent," intent on bringing down the president, would have jumped at
> the chance to testify, with or without immunity. Instead, she sent her lawyer
> ahead to talk for her and stall as long as possible. This is the stupidest
> conspiracy theory I have ever heard, including the UFO coverup theories.
>
I realize there's no smoking gun. Nor do I think Monica Lewinsky wanted itto happen. She is not
the world's brightest person. And I think you are right
that the Republicans highjacked the issue, and made more of it than the Israelis
thought possible. They have no sexual morality and so they didn't perhaps
realize the import of what they were doing.
> One more question: why did you cut the rest of my statement from this post?
> That statement explained very clearly the dynamics of the Persian Gulf
> conflict. I'll tell you why -- because you couldn't answer it. But it proves
> one thing I told Roger before -- anti-Semites and Zionists agree on one thing:
> the whole world revolves around the navel of Israel -- they only argue over
> whether or not that's a good thing.
Again, you may be right. I freely admit to no data. None nada zip.
RLA
j...@inxpress.net
Roger Alexander wrote:
>
> Again I have zero data for all this.
> It should be clear that Gore has sold his soul to the Israelis.
Does he have more than one soul? Because he's certainly sold
something of value to his Asian "supporters", as well.
Subject: NOVEMBER 22, 1988: PLC BUYS AL GORE
From: j...@inxpress.net
Date: 1998/02/08
Message-ID: <34DE06...@inxpress.net>
Newsgroups:
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not to be used for commercial purposes
Indonesian Financier Sought Senators' Favors
Politics: Before backing Clinton, James Riady raised money for
Democratic lawmakers, records show.
By WILLIAM REMPEL, ALAN C. MILLER, Times Staff Writers
Indonesian financier James Riady, a central figure
in the controversy over campaign donations supporting President
Clinton's reelection, sought direct business benefits from earlier
fund-raising alliances with U.S. senators, according to documents
obtained by The Times.
A memo by Riady in April 1988 outlined a plan to
press senators to urge Taiwan to ease its banking
rules and allow Asian American banks, "or at least [the
Riady-owned] Bank of Trade," to open a branch office
there. The memo was prepared four days after Riady
hosted a dinner for Asian American donors at his
Brentwood home that raised $110,000 for the
Democratic Senatorial Campaign Committee.
Riady, whose family controls the $12-billion
Lippo Group conglomerate in the Far East, also expressed
his desire that various federal agencies and an arm of
the Democratic Party deposit funds into his and other
Asian American banks. "Perhaps the DSCC could start
by making a deposit at Bank of Trade," Riady wrote.
The three-page memo, with a handwritten cover
note on the Los Angeles-based Bank of Trade
letterhead, was sent to Asian American fund-raiser
Maria Hsia, an organizer of the controversial 1996
Democratic fund-raiser at a Buddhist temple in
Hacienda Heights with Vice President Al Gore.
Riady asked Hsia to follow up with the senators
"and let me know of progress" on those and other
issues ranging from sponsoring the lawmakers' travel
to Asian capitals to enlisting their assistance on
special immigration problems.
Attorneys for Riady and Hsia declined to comment
on the document.
Massachusetts Sen. John F. Kerry, who was DSCC
chairman in 1988, called it "a raw, graphic memo"
reflecting the kind of special-interest agenda he said
is "usually communicated discreetly and verbally, not in
writing." But he said he recalls no effort to lobby
him on behalf of Riady's financial interests.
The documents--from files of the now-defunct
Pacific Leadership Council that Riady and Hsia
formed to tap ethnic Asian donors--open a new
chapter in the fund-raising saga, further indicating
that foreign interests may have tried to buy influence not
only in the White House but in Congress as well.
Moreover, the documents, containing many of the
seeds of the 1996 campaign finance furor, could
undercut White House claims that longtime friendship
alone was behind the hundreds of thousands of dollars
that the Riadys, their companies and employees have
spent and raised to back Clinton.
"I can tell you categorically that there was no
influence" on administration policy by the Riadys,
Clinton said after his reelection in November.
Records show that the Riadys' companies, their
executives and close associates have contributed a
total of $854,300 to the Democratic National
Committee alone since 1991 and nearly $1 million
more to various Democratic committees and candidates.
It appears that Riady and his colleagues were
successful in obtaining at least some of the favors
they expressly sought from Congress, beginning in the late
1980s.
For example, U.S. senators accompanied PLC
members on at least two trips to Asia, including one
in 1989 that featured then-Tennessee Sen. Al Gore.
According to the minutes of a PLC planning meeting,
the Asian visit was "a good chance to recruit new
members overseas; and potentially to raise some
money for PLC"--a problematic tactic because
political contributions by non-U.S. legal residents
are prohibited.
Immigration Matters
Other successes included help on special
immigration matters by then-Sen. Paul Simon of
Illinois. He interceded with State Department
officials in response to Asian American donor requests to help
reverse visa rejections.
Asked if fund-raising support prompted his
involvement, Simon said: "The honest answer is that
you are less than human if you don't try to help
people who try to help you."
Three of the Democratic senators who were active
raising money for the DSCC also recommended John
Huang--the Riadys' top banking executive in the United
States and a founding member of the PLC--for an
appointment in the new Clinton administration in 1993.
One of those early Huang backers was Sen. Tom
Daschle of South Dakota, who as minority leader has
fought to expand the Senate probe of Clinton election
fund-raising to include various Republican campaigns.
Huang was awarded a mid-level Commerce
Department job in 1994 and later moved to the DNC
as a fund-raiser, where he brought in $3.4 million in
10 months. His solicitation of illegal and suspect
campaign funds triggered the ongoing controversy.
Federal investigators are examining whether
campaign assistance from the Riadys and Huang had
any impact on administration actions. In addition,
they are probing whether the Riady family or Huang acted
as conduits for illegal foreign money from
China--where the family has invested heavily--or if
Huang provided classified information to the Riadys
or the Chinese government.
In recent interviews, senators and former
staffers for the DSCC--on whose behalf Riady, Hsia and
Huang were raising money in 1988--said they were
stunned that Riady had formalized such a self-interested
wish list. "It's what we all say doesn't happen," said one
former DSCC aide.
But former Sen. Timothy E. Wirth of Colorado, one
of those named as a lobbying target, said the
existence of such a list did not surprise him.
Wirth, now undersecretary of State for global
affairs, recalled that Hsia and her associates were
"very, very aggressive" in pushing for senators to do
things "relating to [the donors'] economic interests."
He said he quickly decided to "duck out" of
involvement with them because "certain things just
didn't feel right."
Added Wirth: "You don't give significant amounts
of funding in American politics just because people
are interested in truth, light and the American way."
One original PLC member, speaking on condition
of anonymity, acknowledged that the group's political
support "wasn't altruistic at all." The Riadys and
others, he said, "wanted to know what kinds of
appointments and what kinds of contracts we could get
out of all this."
Riady wrote a second memo in April 1988, directly
to DSCC Executive Director Robert A. Chlopak.
Without being specific, it noted that the "issues and
concerns that were discussed [at the Riady
fund-raiser] need to be followed up and actions need
to be delivered."
Insistent on Access
Ultimately, according to former DSCC staff
members, Hsia and the group became so insistent on
access to senators and other benefits that it led to a
rift. The PLC then turned its allegiance from the DSCC
to the Democratic National Committee, where its
members were active into the early 1990s, when
Huang began raising money for Clinton's first
presidential race.
"They became more and more unbearable,"
recalled a onetime DSCC aide. Instead of seeking
access as "interested donors," he said, "they started
doing it as dominant principals and making it clear
they wanted to be giving orders rather than making
requests."
The Riadys failed to persuade the DSCC to change
its banking practices, according to aides. However,
documents show that Riady's Bank of Trade (now
Lippo Bank) did provide an account for the PLC,
handling funds set aside for contributions, trade
missions and fund-raising expenses. The account was
administered by Riady's personal secretary, PLC
records show.
It is not clear from other available records or
interviews whether the Riady interest in easing
Taiwan banking rules resulted in any lobbying by U.S.
senators or other government officials. To date,
however, Riady's conglomerate has failed to break
into the Taiwan banking market.
John Muncy, executive vice president of the Lippo
Group in Hong Kong, acknowledged Lippo's aspirations for Taiwan.
"We always would have liked to open there, but the regulations
require a $400-million investment and limit the ownership
to 20%. . . . That's a lot of money to tie up."
Riady, Huang and Hsia debuted on the national
political stage on April 22, 1988. Not only did they
put together an elegant and successful fund-raiser at
the home of James and Aileen Riady, but they
effectively launched an Asian fund-raising strategy
that would eventually land the three major roles in the
Democratic money chase during the 1996 presidential
campaign.
McCarthy Campaign
Guests of honor were Sens. Daniel K. Inouye of
Hawaii, Kent Conrad of North Dakota, Dennis
DeConcini of Arizona, John Melcher of Montana, J.
James Exon of Nebraska and Wirth. The admission
price was a $5,000 contribution to the DSCC to aid
the Senate campaign of then-Lt. Gov. Leo T. McCarthy
of California.
Many donors that evening became the core of the
PLC, which was established soon thereafter and
strongly backed McCarthy.
The PLC and its members ultimately contributed
about $500,000 through 1990, half of it to the DSCC,
records show.
Just before the Riady fund-raiser, Hsia
circulated a list of "Topics of Concern" to share with the
senators and faxed a copy to DSCC headquarters. The topics
included immigration reform, banking regulations,
international trade issues and appointments of Asian
Americans to federal posts.
After the party, Riady sent his detailed memo to
Hsia. Most urgent, it seems, was his desire for
prominent allies to break down Taiwan banking restrictions.
He wanted help from Wirth, a member of the Banking
Committee, and other senators "to impress upon
Taiwan to allow Asian American banks (or at least
Bank of Trade) to be allowed to open a branch office
in Taiwan in the very near future."
Riady singled out senators for separate lobbying
goals. He wanted to persuade Inouye to attend
upcoming international meetings of Chinese bankers in
Los Angeles and to visit Indonesia for a dinner hosted
by his family.
A spokeswoman said the senator does not recall
any contact with the PLC after the Riady fund-raiser.
Riady also wanted to arrange Asian trips for
Conrad, Exon, Melcher and Daschle. It was his plan,
according to the memo, to set up visits for U.S.
senators "on an ongoing and regular basis to
Indonesia, Hong Kong and Taiwan at our invitation or with
us as host."
Before year's end, Conrad headed a
Riady-sponsored trip billed as a North Dakota trade
mission to Indonesia, Taiwan, Hong Kong and Tokyo.
Conrad spokesman Jim Berard said he did not believe
that the senator lobbied Taiwan officials on behalf of
Riady's banking interests. "They were speaking
strictly about North Dakota" trade issues, Berard said.
Exon, who retired from the Senate this year, was
scheduled to join another PLC-backed Asian tour in
January 1989, but dropped out because his wife had a
foot ailment.
"Hopefully, sometime in the future, we will be
able to join you," Exon wrote in a Dec. 8, 1988, letter to
Hsia. In an interview, he said he did not recall
accepting such an offer and never traveled to Asia on
a Riady-sponsored trip.
Failure to Recruit
As the trip approached, PLC members became
increasingly upset with the DSCC's failure to recruit
additional senators, former party aides recall.
In a Nov. 22, 1988, letter to Gore, Hsia wrote:
"If you decide to join this trip, I will persuade all my
colleagues in the future to play a leader role in your
presidential race."
Gore, who had run in the Democratic presidential
primary that year and was expected to do so again,
became the only senator to make the trip.
The vice president's aides insist that no
fund-raising was done on the trip, but records show
that seven trip participants gave his campaign a total
of $6,250 that year. And last year one of the trip's
sponsors, the Hsi Lai Buddhist temple, hosted the
fund-raiser attended by Gore that later became a
political embarrassment.
The event, which was organized by Huang and Hsia
and raised $140,000, later was deemed improper by
the DNC because it was held at a tax-exempt religious
institution. Questions also arose about the legality
of some of the contributions.
Another senator favored by the PLC was Simon,
who sat on the Judiciary Committee--which handled
immigration bills--and supported immigration reforms
widely endorsed by Asian Americans. Simon also was
available to Hsia and other PLC donors to assist
friends or relatives who encountered difficulties in
getting visas in Asia, records show.
When a Washington restaurateur--and major backer
of the PLC--had trouble getting a group of Chinese
chefs to his grand opening because of visa difficulty,
Simon intervened and the problem was resolved.
Simon also wrote letters to the U.S. ambassador
in Beijing and the consul general in Guangzhou when the
niece of a supporter in Los Angeles was denied a
tourist visa by American authorities. The case was
reconsidered, but the visa was not granted, according
to PLC files.
Appointment Urged
Later, Simon joined Daschle and Conrad in
recommending Huang's appointment to a Clinton
administration post.
"I have known John Huang for four years, having
worked with him on a number of economic development projects
and participated with him in several issues conferences,"
Daschle wrote to the Clinton transition team. "I can personally
attest to John's strong background in trade and Pacific Rim
issues."
Although Huang arranged a small fund-raiser for
Daschle in Los Angeles in 1991 and participated in an
Asian American forum sponsored by Daschle and
Simon in 1988, Daschle's spokeswoman said last
week that the senator "actually does not know John
Huang well at all." She said the letter was written by
an aide and that neither the aide nor the senator
could explain the reference to joint efforts on economic
development projects.
By 1989, following McCarthy's defeat in the
Senate race, the PLC had become disillusioned with the
DSCC because, sources said, the committee had not
been responsive enough to the donors. But PLC
members forged a new alliance with Ronald H.
Brown, then chairman of the Democratic National
Committee, who was seeking to expand fund-raising
among Asian Americans.
"They felt [that Brown] was going to pay them the
appropriate homage," said a former DSCC aide.
Brown soon appointed Hsia to the Democratic
Convention Site Selection Committee.
Riady, Huang and Hsia continued to mobilize
significant Asian American donations to the
Democratic Party behind the Clinton-Gore ticket
through the 1996 campaign.
Soon after Clinton's inauguration in 1993,
Mochtar Riady--the family patriarch and father of James
Riady--urged the new president in a letter to pursue
expanded trade ties with China, despite its human
rights abuses, and to normalize relations with
Vietnam.
In addition, the White House acknowledged that
James Riady talked to Clinton about U.S. trade policy
with China and Indonesia during separate visits in the
Oval Office. Among other things, he encouraged
Clinton to meet with Indonesian President Suharto at a
summit of world leaders in Tokyo in 1993. Clinton
later did so.
Rempel reported from Los Angeles, Miller from
Washington. Times staff writer Maggie Farley in Hong
Kong, special correspondent James Liu in Taiwan and
researcher Janet Lundblad in Washington contributed
to this story.
Copyright Los Angeles Times
>
> Again, you may be right. I freely admit to no data. None nada zip.
> RLA
And then there's Al Gore's buddy, Sanford Robertson. Here's a little
something that mentions it. Now you can say you have sources.
Subject: NO SEX - JUST MONEY - Fund-raiser Gore
From: sof...@us.net (sof...@us.net)
Date: 1998/01/29
Message-ID: <6aqdma$ibq$1...@news.us.net>
Newsgroups:
talk.politics.crypto,alt.politics.clinton,alt.politics.org.nsa,alt.politics.org.fbi,alt.politics.org.cia,alt.current-events.clinton.whitewater
[More Headers]
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I have taken the time to write up a few working points on Al
Gore's fundraising calls. The fact remains that Mr. Gore sought
money from the same folks that also benefited from his oversight
of export policy for China. Simply put, the Vice President
turned his head (for a few bucks) while DNC donors were allowed
to deal in advanced technology to communist China. To further
emphasize Mr. Gore's role I have also included his latest
official statement (10/1/96) which outlines his support for KEY
RECOVERY encryption. Mr. Gore's recent statement clearly shows
the legal and technical depth of the Vice President in his
oversight role restricting encryption exports.
Fund-raiser Gore Order of Events:
-------------------------------
1. Gore charged with encryption policy according to PDD-5 and
PRD-27 on April 16, 1993.
2. Government officials represent themselves on Al Gore's behalf
for RSA patent purchase negotiations in Feb. 1994.
3. RSA chairman Bidzos meets with Chinese officials at the same
time as Ron Brown in Oct. 1995.
4. RSA Chairman Bidzos enters into merger negotiations with
Security Dynamics, a company backed by Sanford Robertson, in
Nov. 1995.
5. VP Gore calls Sanford Robertson from the White House for a
donation in Nov. 1995.
6. Robertson delivers $100,000 donation ($80,000 soft - $20,000
directly into the Clinton/Gore campaign) in Jan. 1996.
7. RSA signs deal with China in Feb. 1996. The administration
previously prosecuted similar deals but this time does
nothing.
8. Justice Dept. approves RSA merger with Security Dynamics in
April 1996 for $280 million dollars, netting Sanford
Robertson's company a cool $2 million just to write the deal.
Fiction Vs. Truth on Fund-raiser Gore:
-------------------------------------
Fiction #1 - Gore is not responsible because he is
dumb/out-of-the-loop/mouthing policy written for him by unseen
bureaucratic underlings.
Truth #1 - Gore is the loop. Al Gore was tasked in 1993 by
President Clinton to oversee, and write policy for encryption
regulations, including exports. Clinton tasked Gore personally
using two Presidential decrees, PDD-5 and PRD-27. In fact, VP
Gore had to sign documents committing himself to oversight of
encryption policy.
Fiction #2 - Gore has no association with RSA.
Truth #2 - Al Gore has participated in policy decisions that
directly regulate RSA since 1993. Gore's documented oversight
role includes several reports that specifically name RSA and
their products. In fact, RSA Chairman James Bidzos noted that
Commerce legal counsel Ginger Lew stated she was representing
Vice President Al Gore during 1994 government negotiations held
directly with RSA.
Fiction #3 - Gore has had no association with Sanford Robertson.
Truth #3 - Al Gore knows Sanford Robertson well. Gore has
personally met Robertson. Gore and Clinton have attended
several parties held by Robertson since 1992. Many of Mr.
Robertson's private "parties" actively solicited millions of
dollars in contributions for the DNC. Donors include the
Chairman of Pixar, Apple Computer and Robertson himself.
Fiction #4 - Sanford Robertson has no connection with the
Clinton administration other than fundraising parties.
Truth #4 - Robertson flew on the tax-payer tab with Ron Brown to
China. Robertson paid $100,000 to the DNC in 1994 just prior to
taking that trade trip to China with Commerce Secretary (and
former DNC Chairman) Ron Brown. Mr. Robertson wrote a report
from this trip directly to President Clinton, praising Secretary
Brown for avoiding human rights issues with the Chinese
government. Robertson donated another $100,000 to the DNC
immediately after taking the trip paid for by your tax dollars.
Fiction #5 - The Clinton administration is not responsible for
RSA's "deal" with China.
Truth #5 - Export regulations in place in early 1996 restricted
the sale of encryption technology under weapon control laws.
Attorney General Reno attempted to prosecute famed cryptographer
Phil Zimmerman at the same time the RSA "deal" with China was
being negotiated. Reno's prosecution was based on the grounds
that Zimmerman illegally exported a weapon. The Clinton
administration still controls all exports under threat of
prosecution.
Fiction #6 - The Clinton administration was unaware of the RSA
deal with China.
Truth #6 - Former DNC fund-raiser (and associate of John Huang)
Ira Sockowitz illegally removed secret documents from the
Commerce Dept. right after Ron Brown's death. These documents
detail RSA's actions on a moment by moment basis. The secret
files include a full dossier on RSA, the China deal and Chairman
Bidzos. NSA and Commerce documentation show that the
administration actively monitors all possible exports, including
the actions of industry leader RSA.
Fiction #7 - VP Gore did not break the law while calling for
donations from the White House.
Truth #7 - CONFLICT OF INTEREST. No government official,
appointed or elected, may solicit money from those over which
they also have regulatory powers. Gore openly admits that he
helped write encryption policy. The simple conflict of interest
violation alone falls under Federal jurisdiction as a felony.
The fact that Gore phoned from the White House without paying
for the call is a minor complication in comparison to bribery
and graft.
Fiction #8 - There is no cover up.
Truth #8 - The Commerce Dept. has admitted in Court that they
destroyed documents right after Ron Brown died. Ira Sockowitz
removed secret documents on RSA and encryption policy from the
Commerce Dept. also after the death of Ron Brown. The White
House has issued false statements that deceased White House
Counsel Vince Foster had NOTHING to do with encryption or the
NSA. This statement was proven to be false when the NSA was
forced to release documents showing Foster attended a meeting at
Ft. Meade on encryption in May of 1993.
GORE 10/1/96 STATEMENT:
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
THE WHITE HOUSE
OFFICE OF THE VICE PRESIDENT
FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE CONTACT: 456-7035
TUESDAY, October 1, 1996
STATEMENT OF THE VICE PRESIDENT
President Clinton and I are committed to promoting the growth of
electronic commerce and robust, secure communications worldwide
while protecting the public safety and national security. To
that end, this Administration is consulting with Congress, the
information technology industry, state and local law enforcement
officials, and foreign governments on a major initiative to
liberalize export controls for commercial encryption products.
The Administration's initiative will make it easier for
Americans to use stronger encryption products - whether at home
or abroad - to protect their privacy, intellectual property and
other valuable information. It will support the growth of
electronic commerce, increase the security of the global
information, and sustain the economic competitiveness of US
encryption product manufacturers during the transition to a key
management infrastructure.
Under this initiative, the export of 56-bit key length
encryption products will be permitted under a general license
after one-time review, and contingent upon industry commitments
to build and market future products that support key recovery.
This policy will apply to hardware and software products. The
relaxation of controls will last up to two years.
The Administration's initiative recognizes that an industry-led
technology strategy will expedite market acceptance of key
recovery, and that the ultimate solution must be market driven.
Exporters of 56-bit DES or equivalent encryption products would
make commitments to develop and sell products that support key
recovery system I announced in July. That vision presumes that
a trusted party (in some cases internal to the user's
organization) would recover the user's confidentiality key for
the user or for law enforcement officials acting under proper
authority. Access to keys would be provided in accordance with
destination country policies and bilateral understandings. No
key length limit or algorithm restrictions apply to exported key
recovery products.
Domestic use of key recovery will be voluntary, and any American
will remain free to use any encryption system domestically.
The temporary relaxation of controls is one part of a broader
encryption policy initiative designed to promote electronic
information security and public safety. For export control
purposes, commercial encryption products will no longer be
treated as munitions. After consultation with Congress,
jurisdiction for commercial encryption controls will be
transferred from the State Department to the Commerce
Department. The Administration also will seek legislation to
facilitate commercial key recovery, including providing
penalties for improper release of keys, and protecting key
recovery agents against liability when they properly release a
key.
As I announced in July, the Administration will continue to
expand the purchase of key recovery products for US government
use, promote key recovery arrangements in bilateral and
multilateral discussions, develop federal cryptographic and key
recovery standards, and stimulate the development of innovative
key recovery products and services.
Under the relaxation, six month general export licenses will be
issued after one-time review, contingent on commitments from
exporters to explicit benchmarks and milestones for developing
and incorporating key recovery features into their products and
services, and for building the supporting infrastructure
internationally. Initial approval will be contingent on firms
providing a plan for implementing key recovery. The plan will
explain in detail the steps the applicant will take to develop,
produce, distribute, and/or market encryption products with key
recovery features. The specific commitments will depend on the
applicants line of business.
The government will renew the licenses for additional six-month
periods if milestones are met. Two years from now, the export
of 56-bit products that do not support key recovery will no
longer be permitted. Currently exportable 40-bit mass market
software products will continue to be exportable. We will
continue to support financial institutions in their efforts to
assure the recovery of encrypted financial information. Longer
key lengths will continue to be approved for products dedicated
to the support of financial applications.
The administration will use a formal mechanism to provide
industry, users, state and local law enforcement, and other
private sector representatives with the opportunity to advise on
the future of key recovery. Topics will include:
- evaluating the developing global key recovery architecture
- assessing lessons-learned from key recovery implementation
- advising on technical confidence issues vis-à-vis access and
release of keys
- addressing interoperability and standards issues
- identifying other technical, policy, and program issues for
government action.
The Administration's initiative is broadly consistent with the
recent recommendations of the National Research Council. It
also addresses many of the objectives of pending Congressional
legislation.
Vice President Gore
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
1 if by land, 2 if by sea. Paul Revere - encryption 1775
Charles R. Smith
SOFTWAR
http://www.us.net/softwar
Pcyphered SIGNATURE:
8461B8B098C2C728092BD39D704A61B99476223690192D81C9346D314A020CC1
04F650526B423BEE3C0D3AEE2C7A2978FD1FA4D80808F2F375DF360113CB8C37
8586F121E54229D5
A. G. Phillbin
In article <357BEF3D...@bellsouth.net>, Roger Alexander <rla...@bellsouth.net> wrote:
^
^
^A. G. Phillbin wrote:
^
^ McGuire) wrote:
^> ^agfi...@hooked.net (A. G. Phillbin) wrote:
^> ^
^> ^>In article <357158da...@news.newsguy.com>, ms...@javanet.com (M Soja)
^> ^>^On Thu, 28 May 1998 21:35:25 GMT, -<[ Roger Alexander ]>- posted:
^> ^>^
^> ^>^>Not to steal Mr. McGuire's thunder, nor to answer for him, but as a
^> ^>^>person
^> ^>^>who has an opinion on this subject, the short answer is that it aappears
^> ^>^>the
^> ^>^>original thrust was to pressure Clinton to bomb Iraq. The Israelis could
^> ^>^>not
^> ^>^>have realized that the right wing Republicans, who hate Clinton for
^> ^>^>taking the
^> ^>^>presidency away from them, would be able to make so much of the scandal.
^> ^>^>Thus it appears that Lewinsky and her affair has escaped from the Israeli
^> ^>^>grasp.
^> ^>^>Her attorney's remarks make a lot os sense viewed in that light.
^> ^>^>RLA
^> ^>^
^> ^>^I agree that Clinton was being blackmailed, but not by Jews wanting
^> ^>^
^> ^>^Lewinsky withheld her affidavit only until her job offer came through,
^> ^>
^> ^>Roger needs a long rest if he still believes that Lewinsky/Zionist
^> ^>crap. Clinton was being pressured by the Republicans, who wanted to bring
^ him
^> ^>down, plain and simple.
^> ^
^> ^It makes little sense for the Republicans to bring
^> ^greatly to increase the advantage of Al Gore, a
^> ^Democrat, in the next presidential election, who
^> ^would be running as an incumbent.
^>
^> BULLSHIT. Gore would have been tainted by association with Clinton, and by
^ his
^> prominent role in the presidential campaign finance scandal. This is like
^> claiming that if the Democrats had brought down Nixon before Agnew resigned,
^> it would have strengthened Agnew.
^>
^
^There is a culture war going on in this country. Few nonZionists even are
^ aware of it.
Everyone in America who reads the papers is aware of it, and the connections
to Zionism are peripheral, at best. The right wing "culture war" arsenal
includes anti-affirmative action, "pro-family" rhetoric, anti-abortion,
attacking multi-culturalism, etc. Some conservative Jews have gotten behind
this agenda, others vehemently oppose it. Once again you prove my point:
anti-Semitism and Zionism both live in a Jew-centered universe -- the
anti-Semite sees the stars as being manipulated by the Jews, the Zionist
thinks the stars are plotting to kill the Jews. Both are branches of political
astrology, as far as I'm concerned.
^People on
^this board take ti for granted and don't even discuss it. So long as it
^ remains
^unspoken on TV and in newspapers, most Americans will not realize the context
^ in
^which your remarks are spoken. So Gore can still be Mr Clean even if Clinton
^ is
^knocked out, none of which I am hoping for BTW.
NO WAY. Gore was already up to his ass in the campaign finance scandal, and if
Clinton fell, all of Gore's accomplices would have come out of the woodwork
and fought each other to the death to be the first to reach Ken Starr's
office.
^I still have a lingering
^like for Clinton, even as he has done the Israeli bidding. I think there is an
^ elite
^which is resisting capitulating to the Israelis but that Clinton is badly hurt
^ by the
^various efforts (all one really) by Ken Starr, all designed to strengthen the
^ rightwing
^branch of our elite. Again I have zero data for all this.
Actually, that's a fairly rational analysis (the part about "strengthening
the right wing branch of our elite"), and the data does point that way --
recovery is just around the corner. As far as the part about the Israelis
goes, I'll grant you that this weakened Clinton in dealing with them, but not
because they planned it. If you look at the sequence of events, it also
weakened Clinton in dealing with Iraq -- even the Iraqi press couldn't resist
alluding to that "Wag the Dog" movie!
^ Ifeel like the
^ ordinary
^Russian during the Communist era, trying to figure out waht is going on from
^ what
^is not said.
^RLA
I think we're in a little better shape than that -- we have the option of
figuring out the truth based on the lies they wish us to believe, and the real
information they do provide in order for us to swallow the lies.
^
^> ^
^> ^On the other hand, reputable sources, like the
^> ^Forward,
^>
^> Who the fuck is "the Forward?" Reputable to whom?
^>
^
^Used to be called the Jewish Forward if that helps. Sort of independent
^ Jewishnewpaper out of
^New York. RLA
Jewish Daily Forward, I remember them. But if all they said is that the
Israeli lobby prefers Gore to Clinton, I see no logical reason to launch into
conspiracy theories, without evidence.
^
^> ^have reported that powerful hardline
^> ^forces in the Israeli lobby have much preferred Al
^> ^Gore to Bill Clinton for some time now.
^> ^Sophisticated analysts have noticed that Clinton
^> ^continued the peace policies established by George
^> ^Bush and James Baker, and that Al Gore would be
^> ^likely to reverse these policies in favor of
^> ^Benjamin Netanyahu's aggressive and messianic
^> ^nationalism.
^>
^
^It should be clear that Gore has sold his soul to the Israelis.I try not to go
^ too overboard in
^my comments, and I am a lifelong
^Democrat,
I consider that a possible sign of mental illness (no, I'm not a Republican),
but that's for another newsgroup.
^ but when Gore becosme the party's candidate, I cannot
^support him. I don't use the word whore lightly, but in his case it fits.
^And I am sorry as hell to have to say that about a man whom I had
^always regarded highly.
^RLA
^
^> What "peace policies?" Care to name some "peace policies" worthy of the name
^> coming from Bush or Baker?
^>
^
^One has to give the devil his due. Without Bush and Baker, there would have
^ beenno "peace
^process". The Israelis didn't try to assassinate him at Madrid because
^he was their buddy.
You just slipped that one in there, hoping I wouldn't notice. I read the same
newspapers as you, and I'm aware of no assassination attempt on George Bush by
anyone. Care to elaborate, quote sources, or duck as you often do when called
on something?
^ he lost his election because of it. What more do you
^ want of
^the man?
BULLSHIT. Once again, your drift into anti-Semitism reveals itself in it's
resplendent idiotic glory. Israel wasn't even a major issue in that election.
He lost the election because of Ross Perot, who drew enough votes away from
him to give the election to Clinton. The same thing happened in 1996 to Bob
Dole, who also lost Republican support due to a real "culture war" issue
(abortion), which showed his unwillingness to be a pawn in the hands of his
party's activist right wing..
Now, why don't you try answering the question I put to Wayne McGuire -- what
"peace policies," and be specific.
^
^> ^
^> ^Blowjobgate came to a head just as stress between
^> ^the United States and Israel was reaching the
^> ^breaking point over the peace process. The timing
^> ^was so convenient, in fact, that a number of savvy
^> ^Jewish writers in Israel and the United States
^> ^compared the development to the "miracle" of
^> ^Purim.
^>
^> I didn't read any of those particular writers, but I fail to see any logical
^> connection -- or were those writers in on this great conspiracy as well?
^ Isn't
^> it more logical to assume that the writers in question were simply expressing
^> their relief that Clinton's own troubles had saved Israel from an embarassing
^> rift with the United States? Since the crisis has already passed, why would
^> Ken Starr still be pressuring Monica to testify? Why, if Monica was a
^ "Zionist
^> agent," as you and resident talk.politics.middle-east muddlehead RLA contend,
^> would she ever have attempted to resist testifying against Clinton? Surely a
^> "Zionist agent," intent on bringing down the president, would have jumped at
^> the chance to testify, with or without immunity. Instead, she sent her lawyer
^> ahead to talk for her and stall as long as possible. This is the stupidest
^> conspiracy theory I have ever heard, including the UFO coverup theories.
^>
^
^I realize there's no smoking gun.
Smoking gun? You don't even have a trail of bread crumbs!
^ Nor do I think Monica Lewinsky wanted itto
^ happen. She is not
^the world's brightest person.
Wouldn't know -- never heard her talk -- but she's bright enough to get a job
with Revlon from Vernon Jordan.
^ And I think you are right
^that the Republicans highjacked the issue, and made more of it than the
^ Israelis
^thought possible.
I never said the Republicans "hijacked" anything -- l'affaire Monica was their
game from day one.
^They have no sexual morality and so they didn't perhaps
^realize the import of what they were doing.
Again for another newsgroup, but the real intersting thing was the reaction of
the public -- it actually helped Clinton. That wouldn't have happened ten
years ago. Some things actually do get better, and I don't say this out of
regard for Clinton.
^
^
^> One more question: why did you cut the rest of my statement from this post?
^> That statement explained very clearly the dynamics of the Persian Gulf
^> conflict. I'll tell you why -- because you couldn't answer it. But it proves
^> one thing I told Roger before -- anti-Semites and Zionists agree on one
^ thing:
^> the whole world revolves around the navel of Israel -- they only argue over
^> whether or not that's a good thing.
^
^ Again, you may be right. I freely admit to no data. None nada zip.
^RLA
Glad you admit it. Now why don't you quit spreading tales for which you have
no evidence -- it's called gossip at best, rumor-mongering at middle level,
and lying at worst.
Wayne McGuire
riv...@accessone.com (Michael Rivero) wrote:
> In article <35991c82...@news.newsguy.com>, wmcg...@cybercom.net (Wayne McGuire) wrote:
>
>
> No matter what goes wrong, in Wayne's view, it's the Jews who did it.
>
> Vince Foster? The Mossad killed him.
I specifically rebutted this many times. But a
former senior editor at Forbes magazine continues
to insist that multiple government insiders told
him that Vince Foster was being investigated for
spying for Israel before his mysterious death.
Do you believe that James Norman was lying?
Can you tell us a bit about your ethnic and
religious agenda, Mr. Rivero? Like Michael Osmalov
and many others on the disinfo team here, you have
repeatedly tried to block any inquiries into the
Israeli angle in the Clinton administration
scandals, even though that angle is growing
increasingly difficult to ignore -- especially
with the appearance of Bernard Schwartz.
From whence comes your passion on this subject?
Rob Robertson
Wayne McGuire wrote:
>
> riv...@accessone.com (Michael Rivero) wrote:
>
> > In article <35991c82...@news.newsguy.com>, wmcg...@cybercom.net (Wayne McGuire) wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> > Vince Foster? The [xxxxxx] killed him.
>
> I specifically rebutted this many times. But a
> former senior editor at Forbes magazine continues
> to insist that multiple government insiders told
> him that Vince Foster was being investigated for
>
> Do you believe that James Norman was lying?
>
> Can you tell us a bit about your ethnic and
> religious agenda, Mr. Rivero? Like Michael Osmalov
> and many others on the disinfo team here, you have
> repeatedly tried to block any inquiries into the
> scandals, even though that angle is growing
> increasingly difficult to ignore -- especially
> with the appearance of Bernard Schwartz.
>
> From whence comes your passion on this subject?
>
> --
> Wayne McGuire
> http://www.cybercom.net/~wmcguire
Ah, much better.
_
Rob Robertstein
Roger Alexander
Reagrding most everything you psoted, you are so rational I can't disagree with you.
On the assassination attempt, the authority is Victor Ostrovsky, and the book is
I believe The Other Side of Deception.
RLA
A. G. Phillbin wrote:
I respectfully disagree.
> Now, why don't you try answering the question I put to Wayne McGuire -- what
> "peace policies," and be specific.
>
Oslo. courtesy of Georgie boy and Baker. RLA
> ^
> ^> ^
I haven't claimed I have. RLA
j...@inxpress.net
Wayne McGuire wrote:
> Israel on the planet are Christian fundamentalists
> who are not remotely Jewish. They believe that
> Israel will somehow serve as the trigger for the
> Second Coming, even though the First Coming has
> yet failed to materialize. They positively
> salivate at the prospect of Armageddon, and seem
> quite eager to speed its coming.
>
> Michael Rivero is obviously extremely defensive on
> the subject of Israel. I'd love to know why.
Maybe he's got a Yid in the woodpile. They're *everywhere*.
Wayne McGuire
Rob Robertson <rr...@gte.com> wrote:
the subject of Israel. I'd love to know why. I
expect very little intellectual honesty from him
on this or any other topic, however, based on his
past performance.
AviJa...@my-dejanews.com
In article <35ac4507...@news.newsguy.com>,
wmcg...@cybercom.net (Wayne McGuire) wrote:
> Can you tell us a bit about your ethnic and
> religious agenda, Mr. Rivero? Like Michael Osmalov
> and many others on the disinfo team here, you have
> repeatedly tried to block any inquiries into the
> Israeli angle in the Clinton administration
> scandals, even though that angle is growing
> increasingly difficult to ignore -- especially
> with the appearance of Bernard Schwartz.
>
> From whence comes your passion on this subject?
Note that once again, McGuire is not asking or arguing a substantive point of
the debate; he wants to know about Michael Rivero's ethnicity and religion.
If he can't get any info on that (and even if he can), he'll make something
up. Soon Michael Rivero will be right in the drawer with the other Jews
(don't feel bad, Michael -- a lot of your neighbors in the drawer aren't
Jewish either), Kahanists (most of whom aren't), administration plants (all
of whom aren't), Israeli spies (all of whom aren't), Messianic Tribalists,
and Luddites.
McGuire even has the chutzpa (sorry to pollute your eyes with a Yiddish word,
McGuire; try Visine) to say that RIVERO is "passionate" on the subject of
Jews. This from McGuire, the overwhelming majority of whose postings (I'm
talking high-nineties) are on Israel, Zionists, or Jews -- and most of them
in off-topic forums devoted to software, espionage, or Whitewater.
Here's a piece of Jewish culture for your files, McGuire. You can file it
along your imaginary definition of "goyim" and that "famous Jewish prayer"
you invented. You can ask one of your Jewish subversive friends to translate
it from Yiddish for you, because it describes you perfectly: "Kleyne kinder
kakn kleyne kupkelech."
Now tell them all what a spy and agitator and Pollard supporter and Kahanist
and drug smuggler I am.
--
Avi Jacobson | When an idea is
av...@pacbell.net | wanting, a word
| can always be found
| to take its place.
| -- Goethe
-----== Posted via Deja News, The Leader in Internet Discussion ==-----
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AviJa...@my-dejanews.com
In article <357d5dd0....@news.newsguy.com>,
wmcg...@cybercom.net (Wayne McGuire) wrote:
> >> Can you tell us a bit about your ethnic and
> >> religious agenda, Mr. Rivero?
[snip]
> >> From whence comes your passion on this subject?
and then he wrote:
> Some of the most mindless idol-worshippers of
> Israel on the planet are Christian fundamentalists
> who are not remotely Jewish. They believe that
> Israel will somehow serve as the trigger for the
> Second Coming, even though the First Coming has
> yet failed to materialize. They positively
> salivate at the prospect of Armageddon, and seem
> quite eager to speed its coming.
>
> Michael Rivero is obviously extremely defensive on
> the subject of Israel. I'd love to know why. I
> expect very little intellectual honesty from him
> on this or any other topic, however, based on his
> past performance.
McGuire, is there ANYONE who has ever disagreed with you on any Jew-related
subject for more than two weeks whom you have not tried to smear personally
by attributing him to some terrorist group, or labelling as some sort of
fundamentalist? A single worthy opponent with whom you grappled on the basis
of the issues?
Frothing at the mouth, McGuire asked about Michael Rivero's ethnicity and
religion, hoping to add him to the other figures in his Jooz drawer. When he
woke up and realized he was going to have a tough time making Rivero look
Jewish if he said he wasn't (the name doesn't help), he decided that even
Christians can be Jooz. "Kleyne kinder kakn kleyne kupkelech."
jz
> Michael Rivero is obviously extremely defensive on
> the subject of Israel. I'd love to know why. I
> expect very little intellectual honesty from him
> on this or any other topic, however, based on his
> past performance.
I have severe philosophical and ideological differences with Mr. Rivero;
however mistaken and populist he is, he's sincere - you, on the other
hand, McGuire, are a creepy, malicious, resentful little crypto-Nazi swine
and your "intellectual honesty" - which, practised by you, consists in a
thin veneer of rationality and pompous self-importance covering up a
squirming, writhing, festering mass of barely repressed hatred, ignorance
and irrational obsessive bigotry - your "intellectual honesty" is a
pitiable joke.
JS