Fred Hampton & Cocaine at Mena
j...@globaldialog.com
Larry-Jennie wrote:
>
> is a white male named Red Hall out of Columbus, Ohio.
> The CI advises that when loads are expected, that they use
> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> several different planes and flights to avoid the detection of
> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> the true plane in flight.
> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>
Addressed and debunked, right here on this newsgroup,
right in front of the Pink Disinfo Bunny's cute little
disingenuous paws.
And what is the point of your repost? To snag some newbies,
by hiding the abundance of information that developed as
a result of this being posted the first time around?
What is your motivation for leaving the responses, out,
Pink Disinfo Bunny?
Hampton modified planes for Seal. Seal's operation flew out
of Mena to pick up cocaine, dropped it into Lousiana, sent it
on its way to Miami and Los Angeles, and returned to Mena,
where planes were maintained, stored, and (sometimes)
modified. It ended for the most part at the end of 1984.
The consensus reached by Bottoms, Seal's pilot, and Russell
Welch, investigator, is that Seal's organization
dropped *maybe* one load of cocaine into Arkansas, as
opposed to the *hundreds* that have been mythologized.
Now, Pink Disinfo Bunny, tell us all how the decade of
disinformation about Barry Seal, cocaine, guns, cash and
Arkansas doesn't matter. And try to explain what that
disinformation might have been covering up.
Randolph Langley
j...@globaldialog.com writes:
JQP, I take it that your point is that the cocaine was dropped in
Louisiana rather than Arkansas, even though the flights began and
terminated in Arkansas, and the planes were serviced in Arkansas?
I fail to see how this distinction about whether the drop was made
Lousiana, Arkansas, or even MuleTown, Texas, is worth the infinite
number of posts that we have seen on this subject. You concede that
the flights began and ended in Mena, Arkansas, the planes were housed
in Mena, Arkansas, and that Seal worked out of Arkansas. Where the
cocaine actually hit the ground seems to me, at best, academic. Heck,
I think that if even the flights were out of twelve different cities
on the Bat Plane and three gyrojets, that it's irrelevant to the
larger point that Barry Seal was smuggling drugs into the U.S., and
has been alleged to be smuggling guns to the Contras as part of Oliver
North's ring.
>
> Now, Pink Disinfo Bunny, tell us all how the decade of
> disinformation about Barry Seal, cocaine, guns, cash and
> Arkansas doesn't matter. And try to explain what that
> disinformation might have been covering up.
Your disagreement over the exact location that the cocaine was dropped
certainly doesn't merit the title "disinformation". I think it merits
"quibble" at this point.
FWIW,
rdl
j...@globaldialog.com
Randolph Langley wrote:
>
>
> Your disagreement over the exact location that the cocaine was dropped
> certainly doesn't merit the title "disinformation". I think it merits
> "quibble" at this point.
>
"Quibble"?
A decade of misleading Mena puffery, and it's a "quibble"?
Remember "The Crimes of Mena"? Remember Terry Reed's claims?
I bought that book; did you? Remember Iran-Contra and
gun running out of Mena, gun running that doesn't seem to have
happened? Remember "CIA cocaine" that is based on claims
about Mena? Remember how Barry Seal supplied the cash
to ADFA, dropped cash onto Seth Ward's ranch, churned
Dennis Patrick's account?
Just doesn't matter anymore, is that it?
Do you think the Mena stories may have served as subterfuge?
j...@globaldialog.com
Larry-Jennie wrote:
>
> In article <338851...@globaldialog.com> j...@globaldialog.com writes:
>
> >Larry-Jennie wrote:
> >> is a white male named Red Hall out of Columbus, Ohio.
> >> The CI advises that when loads are expected, that they use
> >> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> >> several different planes and flights to avoid the detection of
> >> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> >> the true plane in flight.
> >> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>
>
> John Q. Public wrote:
> >Addressed and debunked, right here on this newsgroup,
> >right in front of the Pink Disinfo Bunny's cute little
> >disingenuous paws.
>
>
> Would you mind posting it?
No; you do it.
>
> In the past, scrutiny has blown your claims through and through.
Hippity hop, brave newbie seeker.
Tell usenet right now, in your own words:
How much cocaine did Seal import into Mena?
How much money did Seal launder through Mena area banks?
What did Al Hadaway, Russell Welch, and Billy Bottoms have to
say about the allegation that the C123 hauled guns out of Mena
in 1984?
What did Billy Bottoms have to say about Red Hall, and about
decoying, and why you never post it?
The Seal myths are dead.
Larry-Jennie
>Larry-Jennie wrote:
>> is a white male named Red Hall out of Columbus, Ohio.
>> The CI advises that when loads are expected, that they use
>> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>> several different planes and flights to avoid the detection of
>> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>> the true plane in flight.
>> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
John Q. Public wrote:
>Addressed and debunked, right here on this newsgroup,
>right in front of the Pink Disinfo Bunny's cute little
>disingenuous paws.
Really ?!??!?
Would you mind posting it?
In the past, scrutiny has blown your claims through and through.
BTW, the "debunked" testimony is from a sworn deposition by a
Mena deputy sheriff.
John Q. Public wrote:
>And what is the point of your repost? To snag some newbies,
>by hiding the abundance of information that developed as
>a result of this being posted the first time around?
>What is your motivation for leaving the responses, out,
>Pink Disinfo Bunny?
To show that your claims have no merit.
To show that the testimony does not fit your "Mena is a myth" BS.
John Q. Public wrote:
>Hampton modified planes for Seal. Seal's operation flew out
>of Mena to pick up cocaine, dropped it into Lousiana, sent it
>on its way to Miami and Los Angeles, and returned to Mena,
>where planes were maintained, stored, and (sometimes)
>modified. It ended for the most part at the end of 1984.
>The consensus reached by Bottoms, Seal's pilot, and Russell
>Welch, investigator, is that Seal's organization
>dropped *maybe* one load of cocaine into Arkansas, as
>opposed to the *hundreds* that have been mythologized.
Big deal?
Mena was still the hub for Seal's cocaine smuggling. He
used identical airplanes to hide scores of dirty flights.
By his own admission, he had flown over 100 flights each
bringing in between 600 and 1200 pounds of cocaine.
John Q. Public wrote:
>Now, Pink Disinfo Bunny, tell us all how the decade of
>disinformation about Barry Seal, cocaine, guns, cash and
>Arkansas doesn't matter. And try to explain what that
>disinformation might have been covering up.
Ask Dan Lasater or Fred Hampton.
Too bad you can't ask Vince Foster and Gary Parks. They would know.
Larry
$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$
$$ $$
$$ The CIA cocaine smuggling on behalf of the Contras $$
$$ through Mena, Arkansas corrupted the Presidencies $$
$$ of Bill Clinton, George Bush and Ronald Reagan. $$
$$ For details, see: $$
$$ ftp://pencil.cs.missouri.edu/pub/mena/ $$
$$ $$
$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$
mir...@mindspring.com
John Q. Public wrote:
>>Hampton modified planes for Seal. Seal's operation flew out
>>of Mena to pick up cocaine, dropped it into Lousiana, sent it
>>on its way to Miami and Los Angeles, and returned to Mena,
>>where planes were maintained, stored, and (sometimes)
>>modified. It ended for the most part at the end of 1984.
lar...@interaccess.com (Larry-Jennie) wrote:
>Mena was still the hub for Seal's cocaine smuggling. He
>used identical airplanes to hide scores of dirty flights.
>By his own admission, he had flown over 100 flights each
>bringing in between 600 and 1200 pounds of cocaine.
John Q. Public wrote:
>>Now, Pink Disinfo Bunny, tell us all how the decade of
>>disinformation about Barry Seal, cocaine, guns, cash and
>>Arkansas doesn't matter. And try to explain what that
>>disinformation might have been covering up.
lar...@interaccess.com (Larry-Jennie) wrote:
>Ask Dan Lasater or Fred Hampton.
I was rereading Meredith Oakley's book, On the Make; she was a
reporter for the Arkansas Democrat in the 1980s. In the section
on Roger Clinton's cocaine arrest, she quotes testimony from
R. Clinton's Colombian drug associate, somebody (Michael? - book
not handy) Rodriguez. They were buying & distributing cocaine,
but they had to make trips to NEW YORK CITY to buy their cocaine.
Then they distributed it in Arkansas. This was in 1983 and 1984.
Roger Clinton bragged about hauling pounds of the stuff back to
Arkansas in his clothes.
He mentioned in press interviews right after Lasater's trial
that he and Lasater were still on exceedingly good terms.
Kind of odd for somebody with an inside line to all that
"Mena/Seal cocaine" to have to fly to NYC for his drugs.
--
Julie
mir...@mindspring.com
Larry-Jennie
>I was rereading Meredith Oakley's book, On the Make; she was a
>reporter for the Arkansas Democrat in the 1980s. In the section
>on Roger Clinton's cocaine arrest, she quotes testimony from
>R. Clinton's Colombian drug associate, somebody (Michael? - book
>not handy) Rodriguez. They were buying & distributing cocaine,
>but they had to make trips to NEW YORK CITY to buy their cocaine.
>Then they distributed it in Arkansas. This was in 1983 and 1984.
>Roger Clinton bragged about hauling pounds of the stuff back to
>Arkansas in his clothes.
>He mentioned in press interviews right after Lasater's trial
>that he and Lasater were still on exceedingly good terms.
>Kind of odd for somebody with an inside line to all that
>"Mena/Seal cocaine" to have to fly to NYC for his drugs.
Excerpts from:
Subject: Unravelled Response
From: true...@worldnet.att.net (Russell Welch)
Date: 1997/03/12
Newsgroups: alt.current-events.clinton.whitewater
The operation was to be
staged out of Carver Ranch, in Belize, which was run
by Chester Cotter. This is the same ranch that Dan
Lasiter flew to in 1984, with the intentions of buying.
<snip>
You (Bear Bottoms) also mentioned that you knew that the Carver
Ranch seemed to display a link between Seal and Dan
Lasiter that was perplexing to you. It was standard
procedure for Seal to use the Carver Ranch but other
smugglers used it, also. If memory serves me correctly,
the usage fee was $5,000 a pop.
***
Excerpts from:
COMMITTEE HEARING; DAY 48 OF HEARINGS INTO INVESTMENTS MADE BY
THE PRESIDENT AND MRS. CLINTON IN THE WHITEWATER LAND DEVELOPMENT
CORPORATION; U.S. SENATOR ALFONSE D'AMATO (R-NY), CHAIRMAN, SENATE
SPECIAL WHITEWATER COMMITTEE; WASHINGTON, D.C.; MAY 01, 1996
(Partial)SPEAKERS LIST: U.S. SENATOR ALFONSE D'AMATO (R-NY), CHAIRMAN
U.S. SENATOR D.M. (LAUCH) FAIRCLOTH (R-NC)
U.S. SENATOR PAUL SARBANES (D-MD), RANKING MEMBER
MICHAEL CHERTOFF, SPECIAL COUNSEL TO MAJORITY
RICHARD BEN-VENISTE, SPECIAL COUNSEL TO MINORITY
DAN LASATER, FORMER CO-OWNER, LASATER & CO.
MICHAEL DRAKE, FORMER EXECUTIVE VICE PRESIDENT,
LASATER & CO.
FAIRCLOTH: Mr. Drake, did you know that in '84, Mr. Lasater and
Patsy Thomasson traveled to Belize?
DRAKE: Yes, sir.
FAIRCLOTH: Did you tell the police in Arkansas that you heard
that this trip was to buy drugs?
DRAKE: No, sir. I don't believe I did.
FAIRCLOTH: Well, now, on page five of the testimony you have
before you, would you -- page two, would you read it? It says, "In
1984, Jim Alexander, Chuck Berry (ph), Patsy Thomasson, and Dan
Lasater flew in Dan's jet to Belize to allegedly buy a cattle ranch.
Michael Drake says he later heard around the office that it was also a
trip to buy cocaine."
DRAKE: Senator, this is someone else's memo. This is not mine.
I don't recall ever saying that to anybody.
FAIRCLOTH: You know you did not say that. This is...
DRAKE: I don't recall saying that, no.
<snip>
CHERTOFF: Now, you were asked, Mr. Drake, about this trip to
Belize. I take it, Mr. Lasater, there was a trip to Belize, right?
LASATER: Yes, sir.
CHERTOFF: And you were on the trip?
LASATER: I was.
CHERTOFF: And Ms. Thomasson was on the trip?
LASATER: She was.
CHERTOFF: Now, you were read a portion of a report of interview
that an Arkansas investigator recorded in 1986, Mr. Drake. Why don't
you get that in front of you?
(UNKNOWN): You want Mr. Lasater to look at it or Mr. Drake?
CHERTOFF: Mr. Drake.
DRAKE: I have it.
CHERTOFF: Mr. Lasater can look at it, too. Mr. Drake, on page
two, you were -- the investigator recorded his interview. I don't
mean recorded on a tape. I mean he made a record...
DRAKE: Right.
CHERTOFF: ...of his interview with you which attributes to you,
"Michael Drake says he later heard around the office that it was also
a trip to buy cocaine."
Now my question to you, Mr. Drake, is you previously testified
that you're not denying the accuracy of the investigator's report as
it was prepared in 1986 -- you know, roughly contemporaneously with
the interview. You said you didn't recall it.
Now, is it your testimony here that you deny saying this to the
investigator?
DRAKE: No, I don't deny it.
CHERTOFF: So, again, you're in the same position. I mean, you
don't remember it, but you're not in a position to say -- to deny that
the investigator was accurately recording the information you were
giving him at the time.
DRAKE: That's correct.
CHERTOFF: And, in fact, we know from you, Mr. Lasater, that you,
in fact, did take this trip to Belize.
LASATER: I did.
CHERTOFF: And what was the reason for this trip?
LASATER: There was a 12,000 acre cattle ranch that was shown to
us by a man by the name of Carver, I think it was -- or Garver or
something -- out of Oklahoma. And we went -- that was a point in time
I'd just sold out of the horse business, had a lot of cash, and I was
looking at different investments.
CHERTOFF: OK. You went down with a guy named Jim Alexander?
LASATER: Yes.
CHERTOFF: And he was walking around with a night scope or
something, one of these things you can use to see in the dark at
night?
LASATER: Right.
CHERTOFF: I mean, that really happened. You're acknowledging
that.
LASATER: Well, that's what I was told happened. I know in -- it
was either in New Orleans or in Little Rock.
CHERTOFF: Did you have a problem with Customs on your way back?
LASATER: Well, in -- that's what I was just talking about.
Either in Little Rock or New Orleans, I think it was, that they asked
Mr. Alexander to step outside, and they visited with him and he had
something like night vision, or I don't know what he had.
CHERTOFF: Do you have any idea why Customs would have been
interested in talking to one of the passengers on your plane?
LASATER: No, sir.
CHERTOFF: And did they search your plane?
LASATER: I'm sorry?
CHERTOFF: Did they search your plane?
LASATER: I can't recall if they did or not. I really don't
think they did.
CHERTOFF: Did you try to get some kind of a special permit or
something from the FAA at one point that allows you to kind of fly in
and out of the country without stopping at a designated, you know,
border entry point?
LASATER: Yes. We, when we were flying to Canada a lot, we asked
for special permission to go through Customs at Little Rock rather
than wherever the stopover would have been -- maybe Chicago or Detroit
or something.
CHERTOFF: Did you get that?
LASATER: I don't think so. I don't recall ever getting it.
CHERTOFF: And -- I'm going to ask you for the record -- is it
your testimony that, contrary to what Mr. Drake evidently told the
investigator was the talk in the office in 1986, is it your testimony
that in 1984, this trip down to Belize with the guy with the night
goggles to look at property had nothing to do with drugs?
LASATER: That's absolutely correct.
CHERTOFF: Were you guys using drugs on the plane when you went
down?
LASATER: No, sir, we were not.
<snup>
CHERTOFF: Did Mr. Alexander fly back with you on...?
LASATER: He did.
CHERTOFF: By the way, was this FAA permit -- you said it was for
Canada. Didn't you also try to get a permit to allow you to make your
entry at Little Rock for trips south of the 30th parallel?
LASATER: I don't recall that. But I'm not going to
dispute it.
CHERTOFF: That would be for Latin America?
LASATER: I don't recall that. I think that was the only time
that I took my plane out of the country, south.
CHERTOFF: To Belize?
LASATER: I think so.
CHERTOFF: You didn't make any other trips in the plane to Latin
America?
LASATER: I can't recall any right now.
j...@globaldialog.com
Larry, instead of trying to paper the newsgroup with
lengthy transcripts, how do *you* explain the anomaly
that Julie McClain has reported, from Oakley's book?
--------------------------------------------------------------
Prediction of the decade: "The public will never believe the
innocence of the Clintons & their loyal staff." -- author unknown
Lew Glendenning
Billy Beck wrote:
>
> mir...@mindspring.com wrote:
>
> >John Q. Public wrote:
> >>>Hampton modified planes for Seal. Seal's operation flew out
> >>>of Mena to pick up cocaine, dropped it into Lousiana, sent it
> >>>on its way to Miami and Los Angeles, and returned to Mena,
> >>>where planes were maintained, stored, and (sometimes)
> >>>modified. It ended for the most part at the end of 1984.
> >
> >lar...@interaccess.com (Larry-Jennie) wrote:
> >>Mena was still the hub for Seal's cocaine smuggling. He
> >>used identical airplanes to hide scores of dirty flights.
> >>By his own admission, he had flown over 100 flights each
> >>bringing in between 600 and 1200 pounds of cocaine.
> >
> >John Q. Public wrote:
> >>>Now, Pink Disinfo Bunny, tell us all how the decade of
> >>>disinformation about Barry Seal, cocaine, guns, cash and
> >>>Arkansas doesn't matter. And try to explain what that
> >>>disinformation might have been covering up.
> >
> >lar...@interaccess.com (Larry-Jennie) wrote:
> >>Ask Dan Lasater or Fred Hampton.
>
> >reporter for the Arkansas Democrat in the 1980s. In the section
> >on Roger Clinton's cocaine arrest, she quotes testimony from
> >R. Clinton's Colombian drug associate, somebody (Michael? - book
> >not handy) Rodriguez. They were buying & distributing cocaine,
> >but they had to make trips to NEW YORK CITY to buy their cocaine.
> >Then they distributed it in Arkansas. This was in 1983 and 1984.
> >
> >Roger Clinton bragged about hauling pounds of the stuff back to
> >Arkansas in his clothes.
> >
> >He mentioned in press interviews right after Lasater's trial
> >that he and Lasater were still on exceedingly good terms.
> >
> >Kind of odd for somebody with an inside line to all that
> >"Mena/Seal cocaine" to have to fly to NYC for his drugs.
>
> connected to anything - it just floats in space. Where did the
> cocaine go? (blank out) Where is the money? (no data)
>
> Billy
>
> Anthology
> http://www.mindspring.com/~wjb3/free/essays.html
Of course, this point also argues that a seriously professional
organization was handling the matter.
I think we don't know a lot more about the Gotti family's drug
smuggling, for example, and for the same reason: they kill anyone who
talks.
According to Jerry Park's wife, Parks was moving trunkfuls of $100 bills
for Vince Foster.
This just hangs in space also, for want of a serious investigation.
It is too early to absolve the CIA of drugs/Mena/Money. There has been
no serious investigation.
Just like the Foster murder!
Lew
Bear Bottoms
mir...@mindspring.com wrote in article
<3389696f...@news.mindspring.com>...
> --
> Julie
> mir...@mindspring.com
>
Wow, somebody with a brain. Larry, take notes.
Billy Beck
M. Soja
On Mon, 26 May 1997 10:52:20 GMT, mir...@mindspring.com posted:
>I was rereading Meredith Oakley's book, On the Make; she was a
>reporter for the Arkansas Democrat in the 1980s. In the section
>on Roger Clinton's cocaine arrest, she quotes testimony from
>R. Clinton's Colombian drug associate, somebody (Michael? - book
Ha, on page 298 there is "...Maurice Rodrigues, the other alleged
co-conspirator in the case against Roger Clinton." and on page 302
there is "...Manuel Rodrigues, the source for Roger's drug
trafficking, received three years." Between the two I think you can
call him Michael if you want.
>not handy) Rodriguez. They were buying & distributing cocaine,
>but they had to make trips to NEW YORK CITY to buy their cocaine.
>Then they distributed it in Arkansas. This was in 1983 and 1984.
Then on page 297 there is:
"Twelve days later, during a ten-minute hearing before US District
Judge Oren Harris, a former Democrat congresssman, Roger pleaded not
guilty to all charges and was released on a $5,000 bond. He was
represented in the case by William R. Wilson, who nine years later
would be named to the federal bench by President Clinton, and by Steve
Engstrom, who in December 1993 would assist Betsey Wright in drafting
a statement in which a state trooper sought to retract statements he
had made about a bribe the president allegedly offered him to quell
controversy involving charges of Cliinton's womanizing while
governor."
<<<--- end
An informant said that Roger made "at least one trip to New York City,
where he obtained an unspecified quantity of cocaine" but Oakley
continues, "Roger, who according to United States Attorney Asa
Hutchinson was "one tentacle of cocaine distribution in Arkansas," had
decided to cooperate with authorities, who said they had "plenty of
video" of his drug transactions with undercover narcotic agents. He
pleaded guilty.."
Bill Clinton played innocent through it all, keeping a low profile
until after the election, when Roger changed his plea.
A trip or two to the big city does not negate "plenty of video" on the
south forty.
mir...@mindspring.com
mir...@mindspring.com wrote:
>>she quotes testimony from
>>R. Clinton's Colombian drug associate, somebody (Michael? - book
ms...@globalnet.co.uk (M. Soja) wrote:
>Ha, on page 298 there is "...Maurice Rodrigues, the other alleged
>co-conspirator in the case against Roger Clinton." and on page 302
>there is "...Manuel Rodrigues, the source for Roger's drug
>trafficking, received three years." Between the two I think you can
>call him Michael if you want.
>>not handy) Rodriguez.
Well, yes, as I said, "book not handy." What's your point?
>An informant said that Roger made "at least one trip to New York City,
>where he obtained an unspecified quantity of cocaine" but Oakley
>continues, "Roger, who according to United States Attorney Asa
>Hutchinson was "one tentacle of cocaine distribution in Arkansas,"
[...]
>A trip or two to the big city does not negate "plenty of video" on the
>south forty.
Page 310:
"The indictment revealed that Roger had spent the winter of 1983-84
shuttling between Little Rock and New York, buying large quantities of
cocaine for thousands of dollars and distributing them in Arkansas."
Sounds like more than one trip or two. Roger Clinton did turn to
Lasater -- for money, not drugs.
--
Julie
mir...@mindspring.com