PDX Flight Restriction *rant*
gatt
So the FAA issued a TFR for a 3NM radius from the Portland Airport yesterday
because Cheney was in town. TFR means "Terrorist Flight Restriction" which
means that all other aircraft have to tread lightly or get shot down,
clearing the airway for...
Well, let's just put it this way: If I was Abdul the terrorist hijacker
ready to commit suicide, I'd sure be glad that I had an uncrowded,
full-speed direct shot at the target. It's a pain in the ass following a
course with all that ducking and weaving you have to do; all those little
helicopters and Cessnas are a pain in the ass at 350 mph...
Oh...wait...350 mph: that's violating the airspace speed limit. "BETTER
SLOW DOWN, ABDUL! WE DON'T WANT TO GET IN TROUBLE WITH THE FAA! Hell, they
might revoke my hijacking endorsement or pull my certificate all together.
(That's a good idea...a hijacking endorsement. That way the government can
track terrorists. If you don't have the hijacking endorsement you cannot
legally hijack planes. )
If I was Abdul the Terrorist, sure the Air Guard might shoot me down if I
dove into the airspace within 3 nautical miles from the airport. And if
there's something I as a terrorist don't want to risk, it's my hijacked
jetliner full of fuel and cargo slamming into a heavily populated enemy
urban area because people might get KILLED! Oh, NO!
Live in fear, America. It's what the administration, the Republicans, the
Democrats, the media and Al Queda want. And by God, if you're a terrorist
with a hijacked plane, don't go into a Temporary Flight Restriction zone
because it's OFF LIMITS, MISTER!
-c
Joe Johnson
punishing GA the centerpiece of our antiterror campaign? Catch the thread
about Chuck Shumer wanting to turn New York into an ADIZ and closing the
Hudson River VFR corridor.
gatt
"Joe Johnson" <pme...@yahoo.com> wrote in message news
Sent my AOPA enrollment in last week. Here in Portland they scrambled F-15s
four hours or so after an experimental/ultralight pilot joked about flying
into a building (figure he had 3 hours of endurance MAX).
Statistically, you're more likely to be accidentally or deliberately killed
by another American than by a terrorist. We better lock that down right
away!
-c
NW_PILOT
wheel on me but I bet it is like 1.5 minuets. How long dose it take for the
air guard to launch the helicopter or fighter for interception? I know it
takes me about 7 min to get from 59S to KPDX in my Cessna. Every body knows
where Cheney was at he was in the embassy suites right under final of 28L.
All it would take is a terrorist to take over the controls on final for 28R
or 28L and find that big hotel.
I don't think any GA airplane under 5,000lb's could cause enough damage to a
large building. GA is the scapegoat!! They are many more problems & threats
then GA. All you need to do is look to our neighbors in the north. It is so
easy to enter the U.S. from Canada as the border is not that protected and
canadian ports are open to just about anyone that wants to enter. What
needs to happen for GA is AOPA or some other orginization needs to do a few
public test's. 1, find a building ready for demlition and and have a radio
controlled full sized GA airplane fly in to it. 2, They also need to show
that they have very little cargo space and usefull load.
"gatt" <ga...@livefromtheclocktower.com> wrote in message
news:10gd65f...@corp.supernews.com...
Murphy
> needs to happen for GA is AOPA or some other orginization needs to do a
few
> public test's. 1, find a building ready for demlition and and have a radio
> controlled full sized GA airplane fly in to it. 2, They also need to show
> that they have very little cargo space and usefull load.
Who needs radio control when we have suicidal teenagers in Florida ?
http://www.anomalies-unlimited.com/Death/Bishop.html
Peter Duniho
news:A6KdnSpu6MF...@comcast.com...
> Ok at 200 Knots How Long Will It Take To Go 3 Miles I don't have my wiz
> wheel on me but I bet it is like 1.5 minuets.
3 miles in 1.5 minutes is 120 miles per hour. 3 miles at 200 knots would
take less than 60 seconds (180 knots would be exactly 60 seconds). No whiz
wheel should be required to do those calculations.
But regardless, you're preaching to the choir, at least in r.a.piloting. We
know how unbalanced the TFRs are, with respect to what they prevent versus
what the actual risks are. I can't imagine the other newsgroups
cross-posted to have any real relevance; they won't care about TFRs in
general, nor can those audiences do any more to prevent them than we can.
Pete
gatt
"Murphy" <m...@n.com> wrote in message news:GnyNc.39412$
> Who needs radio control when we have suicidal teenagers in Florida ?
>
> http://www.anomalies-unlimited.com/Death/Bishop.html
Thanks for the forward, but...whew...:
"Charles' mom also said that she and Charles' father had attempted suicide
together years earlier but it had "just been the result of drug and alcohol
use when they were young"
Only in Florida.
gatt
"Peter Duniho" <NpOeS...@NnOwSlPiAnMk.com> wrote in message
< I can't imagine the other newsgroups cross-posted to have any real
relevance;
Posted there 'cause The Big Dick (doh...did I say that?) was in PDX
yesterday when the TFR was in effect (and whereI live.)
Jack Black did an EXCELLENT commentary on The Daily Show last night about
how the political campaign season is on, and how there's no better way of
kicking off political conventions for a free nation than by invading major
American cities and declaring martial law. Wish I had a transcript.
-c
Randal L. Schwartz
gatt> So the FAA issued a TFR for a 3NM radius from the Portland Airport yesterday
gatt> because Cheney was in town. TFR means "Terrorist Flight Restriction" which
gatt> means that all other aircraft have to tread lightly or get shot down,
gatt> clearing the airway for...
Uh, "TFR" is "temporary flight restriction", dating to before I got my
ticket some 15 years ago.
Please don't make this crazier than it is. TFRs get issued *all* the
time. In fact, here's a current list:
<http://map.aeroplanner.com/mapping/TFR.cfm?list=all>
--
Randal L. Schwartz - Stonehenge Consulting Services, Inc. - +1 503 777 0095
<mer...@stonehenge.com> <URL:http://www.stonehenge.com/merlyn/>
Perl/Unix/security consulting, Technical writing, Comedy, etc. etc.
See PerlTraining.Stonehenge.com for onsite and open-enrollment Perl training!
Bob Gardner
Bob Gardner
"Randal L. Schwartz" <mer...@stonehenge.com> wrote in message
news:86u0vti...@blue.stonehenge.com...
gatt
"Randal L. Schwartz" <mer...@stonehenge.com> wrote in message
> gatt>TFR means "Terrorist Flight Restriction" which
> gatt> means that all other aircraft have to tread lightly or get shot
down,
> gatt> clearing the airway for...
>
> Uh, "TFR" is "temporary flight restriction", dating to before I got my
> ticket some 15 years ago.
Sarcasm. But, I bet there are more TFRs on any given day now than there were
in entire years previously. For example, there's talk that a TFR appears on
a Seattle sectional. How "temporary" is that?!
-c
Bela P. Havasreti
There are no less than 4 (?) TFRs on the current Seattle sectional &
terminal charts.
Bela P. Havasreti
Bob Moore
> Uh, "TFR" is "temporary flight restriction", dating to before I got my
> ticket some 15 years ago.
And...you didn't get a "ticket", the FAA issues "Airman Certificates".
Bob Moore
Dave S
I dont like it either.
Dave
lein
So what's your opinon of passenger checkpoints at airports? Dump them
altogether and let passengers pick up their tickets and walk unfettered to
their seat on their flight?
Peter Gottlieb
"Bob Moore" <rmoo...@tampabay.rr.com> wrote in message
news:Xns9533B7BAC7A27rm...@65.32.1.6...
Peter Gottlieb
"lein" <boomer_...@my-deja.com> wrote in message
news:885ec7ed.0407...@posting.google.com...
>
> So what's your opinon of passenger checkpoints at airports? Dump them
> altogether and let passengers pick up their tickets and walk unfettered to
> their seat on their flight?
That's a GREAT idea! I love it! If they did that I would even consider
going back to commercial aviation again.
cor
withdrawal from legal drugs, again.
Paul Johnson
Hash: SHA1
"Joe Johnson" <pme...@yahoo.com> writes:
> I'm with you man. Has GA ever been involved in terrorism? Why is severely
> punishing GA the centerpiece of our antiterror campaign?
I thought the Defense Department running itself like a company of
mercenaries forcing us to create a whole new Department of Homeland
Security to do the Defense Department's actual job was the centerpiece
of our antiterror campaign. Pretty much everybody working for Homeland
Security could be reassigned back to Defense and the mass majority laid
off and we would be just as safe...if our military wasn't so confused on
the idea that the United States, which they should be defending, is in
North America, not southwest Asia.
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Paul Johnson
Hash: SHA1
"gatt" <ga...@livefromtheclocktower.com> writes:
> "Joe Johnson" <pme...@yahoo.com> wrote in message news
>
>> I'm with you man. Has GA ever been involved in terrorism? Why is
> severely
>> punishing GA the centerpiece of our antiterror campaign? Catch the thread
>> about Chuck Shumer wanting to turn New York into an ADIZ and closing the
>> Hudson River VFR corridor.
>
> Sent my AOPA enrollment in last week. Here in Portland they scrambled F-15s
> four hours or so after an experimental/ultralight pilot joked about flying
> into a building (figure he had 3 hours of endurance MAX).
Hmm, if he were to hit, say, Fox Tower or the US Bank tower with an
ultralight, would it even do more than maybe put a pit in the window and
a good crack in the glass? Those windows are super-thick and put in
quite securely to prevent people from falling through them out of the
building. And besides that, even if he was serious, couldn't the pilot
be easily taken out with a well-aimed shot from your standard
police-issue Glock 9mm?
I wonder how much of our tax money was wated, never to be seen again, on
that overreaction...
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Paul Johnson
Hash: SHA1
English is read top down, not random order. Please adjust your quoting
accordingly.
"NW_PILOT" <ste...@fqu2.com> writes:
> Ok at 200 Knots How Long Will It Take To Go 3 Miles I don't have my
> wiz wheel on me but I bet it is like 1.5 minuets. How long dose it
> take for the air guard to launch the helicopter or fighter for
> interception? I know it takes me about 7 min to get from 59S to KPDX
> in my Cessna. Every body knows where Cheney was at he was in the
> embassy suites right under final of 28L. All it would take is a
> terrorist to take over the controls on final for 28R or 28L and find
> that big hotel.
I presume even a disgruntled commercial pilot sent over the edge by an
unusually bad day could have done that, and make it look like a freak
accident.
> I don't think any GA airplane under 5,000lb's could cause enough
> damage to a large building.
Some conservative nutjob tried to take out Clinton at home by flying,
IIRC, a Cessna 172 into the White House. Firmly jammed it in a second
story window, but that was about it.
> GA is the scapegoat!! They are many more problems & threats then
> GA. All you need to do is look to our neighbors in the north. It is so
> easy to enter the U.S. from Canada as the border is not that protected
> and canadian ports are open to just about anyone that wants to enter.
It's not Canada's fault the terrorists don't want to wait in US Customs
8-10 hour line at BC-99/I-5. Though that does bring a good point: Given
that American citizens are gauranteed return to the US, what incentive
is there for legal citizens with nothing to declare to sit in absurdly
long lines to wait on the overpaid twits at the border when Canada
proves that you can run a secure border checkpoint without ever having
more than a 35 minute wait at the same checkpoint? Why are we even
wasting our tax dollars on those twits when you can just as easily drive
a couple dozen miles away and jump the ditch where there's a road on
either side of the border?
And besides all that, how is it Canada's fault that our military is
absentee, off in some other country instead of defending us? Blaming
Canada makes me wonder if you're just not another Paul
Berg/alienlunch/whatever you're going by this week sock puppet...
> What needs to happen for GA is AOPA or some other orginization needs
> to do a few public test's. 1, find a building ready for demlition and
> and have a radio controlled full sized GA airplane fly in to it.
See conservative whacko flying Cessna into white house above.
> 2, They also need to show that they have very little cargo space and
> usefull load.
Can't you just about fit the interior of a Cessna 172 or 182 into a Kia
Sportage with room left over? Obviously, the dimensions are different,
but I'm talking volume. Amazing about such a freakout over planes you
can just about fit two of their fuselages into a full-length parking
lot stall and have room left over...
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Paul Johnson
Hash: SHA1
mer...@stonehenge.com (Randal L. Schwartz) writes:
>>>>>> "gatt" == gatt <ga...@livefromtheclocktower.com> writes:
>
> gatt> So the FAA issued a TFR for a 3NM radius from the Portland Airport yesterday
> gatt> because Cheney was in town. TFR means "Terrorist Flight Restriction" which
> gatt> means that all other aircraft have to tread lightly or get shot down,
> gatt> clearing the airway for...
>
> Uh, "TFR" is "temporary flight restriction", dating to before I got my
> ticket some 15 years ago.
Let it be noted that gatt only used "terrorist" instead of "temporary"
the first time. Some readers not acquainted with the northwest's kind
of humor might not catch it.
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John Clonts
> wheel on me but I bet it is like 1.5 minuets.
Yes, but only at like 1.667 minuets per minute...
Paul Johnson
> They always can blow it out to 30 miles if you think 3 is inadequate.
Oh, come on. We're talking about someone who has pretty much everybody
in Portland pissed after him and his boss incited riots on a visit to
Portland three years ago. Like he would have been missed that much to
begin with. Certainly not enough to justify shutting down the world
during evening rush hour once again.
Paul Johnson
Yeah, I'd turn in my Amtrak tickets for airline tickets if the security
checkpoints haven't proven themselves to, ultimately, be a tremendous
waste of time.
Baxter
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Free software - Baxter Codeworks www.baxcode.com
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Paul Johnson" <ba...@ursine.ca> wrote in message
news:873c3dc...@ursine.ca...
>
> Hmm, if he were to hit, say, Fox Tower or the US Bank tower with an
> ultralight, would it even do more than maybe put a pit in the window and
> a good crack in the glass?
Unless, of course, he was carrying a bomb. Five gallons of home-made nitro
perhaps?
Randal L. Schwartz
Bob> And...you didn't get a "ticket", the FAA issues "Airman Certificates".
From the time I got it, it's always been casually called a "ticket".
I'm smarter than those who call it a "pilot license". You at least
have to give me that. There are no licenses, except for the radio.
gatt
>And besides that, even if he was serious, couldn't the pilot
> be easily taken out with a well-aimed shot from your standard
> police-issue Glock 9mm?
Yeah...the airplane would bounce off the building harmlessly but the
resulting Portland Police gunfire would kill several bystanders. And by
astronomical coincidence, they'd all be black.
-c
gatt
"lein" <boomer_...@my-deja.com> wrote in message
> So what's your opinon of passenger checkpoints at airports?
Well, coming home from Robot Wars in London we got searched in Vancouver,
BC. They confiscated our red electric tape but let us keep the black roll.
No lie. Meanwhile, a shard of lexan, glass or any hard nylon or plastic
makes a great knife and gets right past all those metal detectors.
That's what I think of passenger checkpoints at airports.
Dump them? No. But our airport security shouldn't be reminiscent of
Officer Barbrady from South Park.
-c
Paul Johnson
Hash: SHA1
"gatt" <ga...@livefromtheclocktower.com> writes:
Not possible. We finally sent that racist, Californian moron Mark
Kroeker down the river without a paddle.
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David Barts
> Jack Black did an EXCELLENT commentary on The Daily Show last night about
> how the political campaign season is on, and how there's no better way of
> kicking off political conventions for a free nation than by invading major
> American cities and declaring martial law. Wish I had a transcript.
Har! Good one!
--
David Barts
Portland, OR
David Barts
> Well, coming home from Robot Wars in London we got searched in Vancouver,
> BC. They confiscated our red electric tape but let us keep the black roll.
> No lie. Meanwhile, a shard of lexan, glass or any hard nylon or plastic
> makes a great knife and gets right past all those metal detectors.
>
> That's what I think of passenger checkpoints at airports.
>
> Dump them? No. But our airport security shouldn't be reminiscent of
> Officer Barbrady from South Park.
You should experience the wasteful petty fascism that passes for
"security" measures at the Portland Greyhound terminal some time.
Everyone lines up and the guard opens up their luggage and gropes
through it. Yes, gropes. No X-rays or anything. (Wonder how long
that will last after a guard gropes something sharp, or worse, sharp
and toxic?) The screened passengers then... move to a different line
five feet away! NO barriers between the screened and unscreened ones.
After being "screened", I felt the need to use the restroom. So I
turn to the person behind me: "Excuse me, would you mind watching my
bag for a minute?" "No problem." I come back and nobody bats an eye.
Could have easily stashed a gun in the restroom and come back with it
hidden under my shirt.
I resisted the temptation to crack a snide remark when the human sheep
who was thankful for having her bags rifled through spoke. Figured
I'd get some sort of royal treatment for my indiscretion.
Portland's the only place I've been subject to this stupidity. See no
evidence of it ever being done at Newport, Corvallis, or Salem.