Wegman's sucks!
J E Moryl
I know that I might get flamed for having the nerve to say anything bad
about Wegman's in this group, but here goes:
I like to cook (with quality ingredients) and to eat all kinds of food.
Having lived in Rochester for several years after growing up in
Binghamton, I have seen Wegman's grow from ordinary old-fashioned
supermarkets to the current megastores.
From a purely food related point of view, Wegman's offers nothing
special, unless you live in a particularly deprived (in a cullinary
sense) place. Most of the basic foodstuffs are the usual industrial
grade, agribusiness products: produce that looks good but has no taste,
cheese that is generally some variation on Velveeta, a hundred
variations on a factory chicken, etc. The so called "ethnic" products
sold are often a joke: inauthentic, overpriced and dumbed-down to some
mid-western standard. I'm sorry if you disagree, but go to Italy and buy
a cibatta or go to France and eat a free range chicken or go into your
garden in Sept. and eat a tomato and then tell me that Wegman's has good
ingredients! Hah, but you can always go to some specialty store to get
those things, can't you? Not after the superstores have pushed them out!
Which brings me to my next criticism. These places are bad for our
society. Located on large plots of land, generally reachable only by car
and, unless you live in Rochester, owned and controlled by someone out
of town. The locals, who maybe once could run their own shop, are now
interchangable units in our minimum-wage "service" sector.
A recent trip to my parents in Johnson City confirmed that Wegman's is
not even getting any better. I wanted to take a walk and pick up a few
groceries; the Wegman's is pretty close by. Why can't these places have
better pedestrian access? There is a sidewalk from the access road but
only on one side; comming from where we live it is very inconvenient.
Towns like JC seem so desparate to get these kind of places that the
developers seem to be given carte blanche. Witness the recent vote on
building a outlet mall on a village park (why not expand the park?).
Walking around inside, I had the feeling that, if anything, many of the
things sold there were even more of a joke than they were a few years
back. One of the things I wanted was a nice crusty bread; most of the
"European" style breads were pre-sliced and wrapped in
(crust-destroying)plastic. The selection seemed pretty pedestrian.
Wegman's seems to jump on any trendy bandwagon with its unique
interpretation. The "panini" stand was pretty funny: ordinary sandwiches
served on a kind of bread, the likes of which probably dosn't exist in
Italy. The stand for this was decked out in various products meant to
evoke some kind of Italian deli: among them were jiffy-pop popcorn,
sparkling non-alocholic grape juice, rubber grapes and "italian
flavored" breadcrumbs! Across from this, was the display for "pizzas of
the world", which featured the names of various countries: Germany,
Mexico, etc. As it was morning, the pies weren't out and I had to
fantisize about what a German pizza was like (bratwurst and saurkraut on
top?).
Some of the deli items looked pretty interesting: e.g. the tabouli
looked like 95% bulgar wheat with some green flecks sitting in a puddle
of water. And just why is "fresh, pre-frozen" seafood better than simply
frozen? Well, the apple fritters are tasty and I never realized just how
many kinds of cat food there are.......
It just seems ironic that some upstaters are sitting either on farms or
in (decaying?) ethnic centers and are rushing to buy this stuff. Several
years ago, there were butchers making good kielbasa in JC and lots of
Italian shops in Endicott, etc. Tops (from Buffalo) actually seems to do
a much better job at stocking real ethnic ingredients; e.g. their Indian
section on Winton Rd. in Rochester seems pretty good.
Wegman's seemed to have a policy of running down it's inner-city stores
in Rochester when I lived there in the '70s and '80s in order to build
up big time in the suburbs. I feel this contributed greatly to the decay
of several urban neighborhoods as well, but that is another rant.
Somthing to think about: the Midtown Plaza Wegman's was pretty nice
around 1978, well stocked, with a deli, etc. At some point in the early
'80s it was remodeled and the deli, which was closest to the door was
scaled back and replaced with things like coolers for 40oz. bottles of
malt liquor. I have also heard the story that wilted veggies at the
suburban superstores were sealed in shrink wrap to be sold at the
inner-city stores; from my experiences with the Mt. Hope Ave. store (the
only one I could easily reach without a car) in the early '80s support
this.
I live in NJ now and the supermarkets in my town are pretty bad too.
But I don't miss Wegman's
Cheers,
Joe Moryl
Don and/or Karen Glass
Hi Joe and all,
Nobody ever said that Wegman's was perfect, however they tend to be
innovative, clean, and large enough to carry a decent amount of stuff.
Their ethnic stuff isn't terribly impressive--Tops does better, but I
was disappointed to see that the Mt. Read one is already scaling the
ethnic sections back.
Maybe the Rochester market isn't into ethnic stuff enough to support the
space in the stores. I have to admit that I don't go home expecting to
find great ethnic food, and no one is going to start cooking lots of
things they have never even heard of. (I still think Wegman's Chinese
restaurants aren't bad compared to many, and much more convenient.)
I haven't been to the Wegman's at Midtown in many years. I suspect that
they wouldn't be selling the malt liquor coolers you described if there
wasn't demand. It's painful to see what has happened to downtown. Try
to find a place to eat a decent lunch anymore.
I have seen the Price Choppers in the other parts of New York, and the
Pathmarks and ShopRites in New Jersey, and haven't been impressed.
Kings is very expensive, last I saw.
Wegmans does try to get more local produce into its stores than I see
out here in Illinois, and the lines are much shorter and quicker than at
Jewel here (thank goodness).
I don't think Wegmans can be blamed for the movement to the suburbs, or
for the use of cars. These are not solely Rochester phenomena. As far
as I can tell, the supermarkets in NJ keep getting bigger despite lack
of space and traffic gridlock.
Karen
--------------------------------
Trudi Marrapodi
In article <332852...@xnet.com>, Don and/or Karen Glass
<dmg...@xnet.com> wrote:
> Hi Joe and all,
>
> Nobody ever said that Wegman's was perfect, however they tend to be
> innovative, clean, and large enough to carry a decent amount of stuff.
> Their ethnic stuff isn't terribly impressive--Tops does better, but I
> was disappointed to see that the Mt. Read one is already scaling the
> ethnic sections back.
They actually have better ethnic sections in some stores, from what I have seen.
> Maybe the Rochester market isn't into ethnic stuff enough to support the
> space in the stores. I have to admit that I don't go home expecting to
> find great ethnic food, and no one is going to start cooking lots of
> things they have never even heard of. (I still think Wegman's Chinese
> restaurants aren't bad compared to many, and much more convenient.)
Good point. I mean, I don't usually wake up in the middle of the night
with a craving for authentic Italian panini. And if you went to some
stores and asked for panini, they'd go "What?"
> I haven't been to the Wegman's at Midtown in many years. I suspect that
> they wouldn't be selling the malt liquor coolers you described if there
> wasn't demand. It's painful to see what has happened to downtown. Try
> to find a place to eat a decent lunch anymore.
Well, I guess you'll both be happy and not at all surprised to know the
Midtown Wegmans is no more. They closed it down about a year and a half
ago. Yep, part of their effort to move away from serving the riffraff like
me who live downtown. But that's OK because a Shur Fine store opened there
under the name "Midtown Food Market" and the place looks more open and
clean now that it's been remodeled and really is pretty decent for a city
supermarket. I shop there for little things here and there. I also like
the fact that the clerks don't treat all of us as if we are paying with
food stamps (although a lot of people do). The Wegmans clerks had an
"attitude" as if all the patrons of the Midtown store were on welfare and
were slobs--and it showed in the service they gave us.
[snip]
> I don't think Wegmans can be blamed for the movement to the suburbs, or
> for the use of cars. These are not solely Rochester phenomena. As far
> as I can tell, the supermarkets in NJ keep getting bigger despite lack
> of space and traffic gridlock.
Probably not.
I missed this original post, so...
> J E Moryl wrote:
> >
> > I know that I might get flamed for having the nerve to say anything bad
> > about Wegman's in this group, but here goes:
> >
> > I like to cook (with quality ingredients) and to eat all kinds of food.
> > Having lived in Rochester for several years after growing up in
> > Binghamton, I have seen Wegman's grow from ordinary old-fashioned
> > supermarkets to the current megastores.
> >
> > From a purely food related point of view, Wegman's offers nothing
> > special, unless you live in a particularly deprived (in a cullinary
> > sense) place.
[snip]
My feeling is, unless you are Julia Child, you will not be TOO deprived
shopping there. I mean, I don't just eat Velveeta and I can find good
stuff.
> > Which brings me to my next criticism. These places are bad for our
> > society. Located on large plots of land, generally reachable only by car
> > and, unless you live in Rochester, owned and controlled by someone out
> > of town. The locals, who maybe once could run their own shop, are now
> > interchangable units in our minimum-wage "service" sector.
Well, if they can find a way to compete with more personal service, let
'em. As for the business of "reachable only by car," that's true of many
of them but not all. They have stores on East Avenue and Mt. Hope Avenue
that are reachable by bus, and other places too.
[snip]
> > Wegman's seemed to have a policy of running down it's inner-city stores
> > in Rochester when I lived there in the '70s and '80s in order to build
> > up big time in the suburbs. I feel this contributed greatly to the decay
> > of several urban neighborhoods as well, but that is another rant.
> > Somthing to think about: the Midtown Plaza Wegman's was pretty nice
> > around 1978, well stocked, with a deli, etc. At some point in the early
> > '80s it was remodeled and the deli, which was closest to the door was
> > scaled back and replaced with things like coolers for 40oz. bottles of
> > malt liquor. I have also heard the story that wilted veggies at the
> > suburban superstores were sealed in shrink wrap to be sold at the
> > inner-city stores; from my experiences with the Mt. Hope Ave. store (the
> > only one I could easily reach without a car) in the early '80s support
> > this.
Well, they solved this problem by just closing the store down...
Trudi
www...@spamdagger.frontiernet.net
Address modified to prevent spam. You can figure it out.
Ellen B. Edgerton
J E Moryl (j...@cumsl.ctr.columbia.edu) sez:
: From a purely food related point of view, Wegman's offers nothing
: special, unless you live in a particularly deprived (in a cullinary
: grade, agribusiness products: produce that looks good but has no taste,
: cheese that is generally some variation on Velveeta, a hundred
: variations on a factory chicken, etc. The so called "ethnic" products
: sold are often a joke: inauthentic, overpriced and dumbed-down to some
: mid-western standard. I'm sorry if you disagree, but go to Italy and buy
: a cibatta or go to France and eat a free range chicken or go into your
: garden in Sept. and eat a tomato and then tell me that Wegman's has good
: ingredients!
Hah, but you can always go to some specialty store to get
: those things, can't you? Not after the superstores have pushed them out!
Hey, I couldn't agree more. Allow me to gripe about Wegman's utterly fake
bagels, which are nothing more than bread shaped like a doughnut, and
their so-called "sourdough" bread with is basically whole-wheat "Italian"
(NOT!) bread.
: Which brings me to my next criticism. These places are bad for our
: society. Located on large plots of land, generally reachable only by car
: and, unless you live in Rochester, owned and controlled by someone out
: of town. The locals, who maybe once could run their own shop, are now
: interchangable units in our minimum-wage "service" sector.
However, are they any worse than malls? Or empty Caldor's? Wegmans is
hardly
: A recent trip to my parents in Johnson City confirmed that Wegman's is
: not even getting any better. I wanted to take a walk and pick up a few
: groceries; the Wegman's is pretty close by. Why can't these places have
: better pedestrian access?
Because this is America. You get freedom, justice, prosperity, and places
to drive your car. Get used to it. :-)
Have you been to the Mother of All Wegmans in Dewitt? :-) You know,
the Wegmans where you can look across the gourmet section and still not
see the other side? The one with the 200 different kinds of local
tomatoes in neat bushel baskets with hand-lettered informative signs
telling you exactly what farm they're from? The one with the
earthen-and-emerald bathroom decor with mood lighting? The one with the
Chinese buffet and player piano? The one with the custom-made brick oven?
Despite all this, I can't disagree with your basic points, but...
: It just seems ironic that some upstaters are sitting either on farms or
: in (decaying?) ethnic centers and are rushing to buy this stuff.
Come on, most of the people "rushing to buy this stuff" are tired, harried
suburbanites returning from work and making a quick stop at Wegmans to get
milk and Wonder bread. At least, I am. Just because they've got it on
display doesn't mean they're making money on it. Our local Wegmans was
supposed to be "motherized" last year, and then they abruptly decided that
Fairmount/Camillus wasn't worth it. So they are not exactly expanding
into the surrounding suburbs like a giant evil squid unfurling its
tentacles. There's just so far they can go with the pseudo-ethnic stuff
and all the bells and whistles, I agree. If they were making that much
money on it, you'd see a lot more renovation of the existing stores.
: Wegman's seemed to have a policy of running down it's inner-city stores
: in Rochester when I lived there in the '70s and '80s in order to build
: up big time in the suburbs.
Yes. Take a look at the Wegmans on the North Side of Syracuse which seems
stuck in the 1970s, THAT store isn't going to be motherized any time soon.
However, I think you are being a little bit idealistic/outraged over
Wegmans somehow "contributing" to urban decline and decaying ethnic
outposts...Wegmans isn't creating these trends. People like to live in
the suburbs. That's where they live and that's where the money is. I
admit to being a no-class suburbanite, but that doesn't mean I swallow
whatever Wegmans gives puts out...it's all part of the scenery if you ask
me. Sic transit gloria Olde-Worldia.
Les Wilson
Don and/or Karen Glass wrote:
> Maybe the Rochester market isn't into ethnic stuff enough to support the
> space in the stores. I have to admit that I don't go home expecting to
> find great ethnic food, and no one is going to start cooking lots of
> things they have never even heard of. (I still think Wegman's Chinese
> restaurants aren't bad compared to many, and much more convenient.)
The "Wokery" is a joke. You want real Chinese food? Go to a _real_
Chinese restaurant! Here in Greece in Ridgemont plaza, they have that
restaurant thingie on one side of the store. It's atrociously
expensive, and the food isn't much to write home about. Time for Danny
Wegman to put the coke spoon down and get back to basics -- selling
groceries.
> I don't think Wegmans can be blamed for the movement to the suburbs, or
> for the use of cars. These are not solely Rochester phenomena. As far
> as I can tell, the supermarkets in NJ keep getting bigger despite lack
> of space and traffic gridlock.
Most Wegmans that I can see are at least on a busline. At least in
NJ/NY/LI area you have more choices -- Pathmark, King Kullen, Waldbaums,
Edwards, ShopRite, A&P, etc... In Rochester, it's Tops and Wegmans.
There _was_ Bells and a few smaller stores, but Tops and Wegmans drove
most of them out of business. So much for healthy competition here.
> J E Moryl wrote:
> > From a purely food related point of view, Wegman's offers nothing
> > special, unless you live in a particularly deprived (in a cullinary
> > sense) place. Most of the basic foodstuffs are the usual industrial
> > grade, agribusiness products: produce that looks good but has no taste,
> > cheese that is generally some variation on Velveeta, a hundred
> > variations on a factory chicken, etc. The so called "ethnic" products
> > sold are often a joke: inauthentic, overpriced and dumbed-down to some
> > mid-western standard. I'm sorry if you disagree, but go to Italy and buy
> > a cibatta or go to France and eat a free range chicken or go into your
> > garden in Sept. and eat a tomato and then tell me that Wegman's has good
> > ingredients! Hah, but you can always go to some specialty store to get
> > those things, can't you? Not after the superstores have pushed them out!
Food in general in upstate is pretty bland. You have to look hard to
find something good around here. Not much ethnic food because most
people around here are just plain old white bread Americans with
families going back many generations until they can trace back to when
their ancestors walked off the boat.
Go downstate, and you have a good melting pot. Pretty much you'll find
the best Chinese, Italian, and other ethnic foods down there. My rule
of thumb for buying pizza is the place has to have an Italian name, and
the guy making the pizza has to be a first generation Italian or just
walked off the boat.
> > flavored" breadcrumbs! Across from this, was the display for "pizzas of
> > the world", which featured the names of various countries: Germany,
> > Mexico, etc. As it was morning, the pies weren't out and I had to
> > fantisize about what a German pizza was like (bratwurst and saurkraut on
> > top?).
Wegman's attempt to sell fresh made food in their store is tragic. It's
overpriced, bland, usually not very fresh, and does nothing to "enhance"
my shopping experience there. They should do away with it... it's
nothing but expensive overhead.
--
=========================================
Les Wilson
Rochester, NY - USA
nes...@servtech.com
http://www.servtech.com/public/nessman
=========================================
Dave Hitt
elbr...@worldnet.att.net (Jim Elbrecht) wrote:
> You're not alone, Joe. I've never seen a Wegman's, but I think what
>you wrote applies to *all* "superstores".
>
> My favorite hardware store, Wallace Armer, just closed in
>Schenectady, due in part to a half dozen superstores springing up
>around the Capital District. (they're even putting each other out of
>business)
I think the problem with Wallace Armor was deeper than competition
from the superstores. There aren't any near WA, and they had a better
selection of hardware than any super store ever did.
WA closed because Schenectady is a dying, nearly dead, town. When GE
had 60,000 employees within walking distance of the store WA was
healthy, and so was the city.
I was in WA a week before they closed. It was depressing to see the
shelves and hooks nearly empty. (And of course, their VERY cool
overhead money tram system had been inoperable for years.) For me,
seeing a landmark like WA close really proved that Schenectady is damn
close to dead, and is beyond any hope of getting better.
Jim Elbrecht
You're not alone, Joe. I've never seen a Wegman's, but I think what
you wrote applies to *all* "superstores".
My favorite hardware store, Wallace Armer, just closed in
Schenectady, due in part to a half dozen superstores springing up
around the Capital District. (they're even putting each other out of
business)
I dare say we are in the minority, though, because 'bigger' does
seem to be the way things are going, from groceries, to books, to
hardware......
jim
Chet Seidel
I will paraphrase something I read in the paper this year, a quote
from a Russian visitor to our fair land reacting to the American
Supermarket : "There are so many cheeses. In Russia there is either
cheese or no cheese."
Maybe you should be thankful that (1) there is food to buy, and (2)
you have money to buy it.
Earl Westerlund
J E Moryl wrote:
>
--- < complaints about quality of food deleted > ---
I won't argue with you. They're pretty good in the area, but compared
to what... (I personally have a love-hate relationship with the store..)
>
> Wegman's seemed to have a policy of running down it's inner-city stores
> in Rochester when I lived there in the '70s and '80s in order to build
> up big time in the suburbs. I feel this contributed greatly to the decay
> of several urban neighborhoods as well, but that is another rant.
> Somthing to think about: the Midtown Plaza Wegman's was pretty nice
> around 1978, well stocked, with a deli, etc. At some point in the early
> '80s it was remodeled and the deli, which was closest to the door was
> scaled back and replaced with things like coolers for 40oz. bottles of
> malt liquor. I have also heard the story that wilted veggies at the
> suburban superstores were sealed in shrink wrap to be sold at the
> inner-city stores; from my experiences with the Mt. Hope Ave. store (the
> only one I could easily reach without a car) in the early '80s support
> this.
You may be interested to know that its policy is just about complete.
The Midtown store is gone. They weren't making enough of a profit.
(Note I did not say they were losing money.) The city had to bribe
(excuse me, grant tax breaks to) somebody else to come in. When
confronted with the urban decay issue, they say that gee, they're a
business and have to make money blah blah blah.
Interesting that Robert Wegman has pledged $25 million to the inner city
Catholic schools. I guess to fight the urban decay he helped cause.
Maybe he's trying to buy his way into heaven like Andrew Carnegie tried
to do...
BTW - Tops is planning to build and/or renovate five stores at various
locations in the city. So a Dutch company is going to move into the
city that the locals abandoned...
--
+-----------------+----------------------------------------+
| Earl Westerlund | Kodak's Homepage: http://www.kodak.com |
+-----------------+----------------------------------------+
| The opinions expressed herein are mine and mine alone |
+-----------------+----------------------------------------+
Star
Star thinks:
I don't think Wegmans sucks. Somethings aren't the best, but they do
have good sales and the one I go to is always clean. I would rather shop
at a clean store and not have the best variety then vice versa. I have
been shopping at Wegman's for a long time, I don't see anything wrong
with them.
[BIG SNIP!!] :)
Bill Leonard
In article <33282A...@cumsl.ctr.columbia.edu>, J E Moryl
<j...@cumsl.ctr.columbia.edu> wrote:
>I live in NJ now and the supermarkets in my town are pretty bad too.
>But I don't miss Wegman's
>
>Cheers,
>Joe Moryl
Isn't the entire state of New Jersey like a run-down Wegman;s?
Seriously, I miss Wegman's and Tops more than almost anything from
Buffalo... and I've lived all over the country. Nothing else like them.
Go tell your complaints at www.wegmans.com
Maybe they'll send you some salsa.
--
=================================================================
Bill Leonard bi...@cyberlabgfx.com
Technical Director www.cyberlabgfx.com
cyber.lab g.f.x. 407.849.1903
-----------------------------------------------------------------
Interactive World Wide Web Design and Consulting
-----------------------------------------------------------------
Making Art Out Of Science.
=================================================================
J E Moryl
I had a feeling that this would spark some debate. Thanks for everyones
input; I have a few comments,
My reason for posting "Wegman's sucks!" was that there is a general
feeling that Wegman's (W) is a "good" supermarket. First and foremost I
think a good supermarket should have quality basic foods at fair prices.
I think this is where W falls short. Some posters have established that
W is big and W is sucessful and W is clean: none of which I deny and
none of which is particularly important to me.
It bothers me that there is this idea that good food should be for some
kind of elite that exists only in our larger urban centers. Where I grew
up in Binghamton, almost everyone was first or second generation
Italian, Polish or some other nationality and ethnic food was widely
available. We are supposed to live in one of the most prosperous
countries on earth and yet our cuisine, which like it or not, is an
important part of a nation's identity, is pretty debased. There are some
places in the country (e.g. N. Calif. and the Pacific NW) where there
has been an increased appreciation of locally produced foodstuffs but
this seems to be a hard sell in the NE. Even in England (!) one can get
a great free range chicken (from France) in the largest supermarket
chain (Tescos).
Besides, W sells a lot of pseudo-ethnic and "gourmet" items: so the
demand, however manipulated, might be there. They do this to make
additional profits, so are you glad to spend what money you might have
for those little luxuries on fake panini etc.
Maybe things have changed, but if I wanted good prices I wouldn't go to
W; in Roch., Tops was usually cheaper, in Bing., Giant or Price Chopper
was.
I stand by my contention that W is a factor in making places like Roch.
a worse place to live. There were nice city neighborhoods, somthing many
smug suburbanites never bother to find out about. Even in the poorer
areas, people need to eat. W never showed anything but utter contempt
for the city and its residents when I lived there. If the city of Roch.
becomes a total dump, then what is left? A bunch of boring suburbs just
like anywhere else in the country. I can't see this as anything to be
proud of. A few of you people in the suburbs should try schlepping out
from downtown to the Markeplace Mall on RTS to pick up a pile of
groceries. If you should bump into any of those inner city teens that
are on their way out to work at W, ask them how their investment
portfolios are doing.
Sorry for all the people that have to put up with some of the even more
crap stores in small towns. The P&C in that small town between Syr. and
Roc. sounds like one I used to shop at when I lived in Oswego. Still,
this does not make W my ideal .
Even though we have a lot of crap Pathmarks, etc. here in NJ there is a
chain called Fresh Fields (I think it comes from the D.C. area) that has
a few good points. These are ordinary size stores that sell a lot of
"healty/organic" type stuff. Produce is quite good and the variety
better than W. Very good breads, deli items. Meats from humanely raised
cattle, chickens. You get the idea. Prices are pretty high but it might
be what the market can bear (they always locate in pricey places).
Cheers,
Joe Moryl
J E Moryl
Good observations, Earl. It is interesting that Mr. Wegman has offered
to give money to improve the Catholic schools in the city. I seem to
remember a lot of people sending their kids to the Catholic schools
precisely to avoid the kind of people that W. did not want to serve at
their inner city schools.
At least Tops seems to be able to deal with urban areas in both Roch.
and Buffalo. Maybe it is because they are Dutch (not so ingrained with
the drive everywhere mentality). More power to them.
Cheers,
Joe Moryl
Trudi Marrapodi
> J E Moryl (j...@cumsl.ctr.columbia.edu) sez:
> : From a purely food related point of view, Wegman's offers nothing
> : special, unless you live in a particularly deprived (in a cullinary
> : sense) place. Most of the basic foodstuffs are the usual industrial
> : grade, agribusiness products: produce that looks good but has no taste,
> : cheese that is generally some variation on Velveeta, a hundred
> : variations on a factory chicken, etc. The so called "ethnic" products
> : sold are often a joke: inauthentic, overpriced and dumbed-down to some
> : mid-western standard. I'm sorry if you disagree, but go to Italy and buy
> : a cibatta or go to France and eat a free range chicken or go into your
> : garden in Sept. and eat a tomato and then tell me that Wegman's has good
> : ingredients!
> Hah, but you can always go to some specialty store to get
> : those things, can't you? Not after the superstores have pushed them out!
>
> Hey, I couldn't agree more. Allow me to gripe about Wegman's utterly fake
> bagels, which are nothing more than bread shaped like a doughnut, and
> their so-called "sourdough" bread with is basically whole-wheat "Italian"
> (NOT!) bread.
Well, I would never go to Wegmans to buy my bagels! That's what Bruegger's
is for (or in Rochester, if you are really dying for a non-chain bagel,
you go to Brighton and get one from a Jewish store).
> : Which brings me to my next criticism. These places are bad for our
> : society. Located on large plots of land, generally reachable only by car
> : and, unless you live in Rochester, owned and controlled by someone out
> : of town. The locals, who maybe once could run their own shop, are now
> : interchangable units in our minimum-wage "service" sector.
>
> However, are they any worse than malls? Or empty Caldor's? Wegmans is
> hardly
True. All stores make anyone who doesn't have a car take a huge hike to
have half a chance of getting decent prices and selection.
[snip]
> Have you been to the Mother of All Wegmans in Dewitt? :-) You know,
> the Wegmans where you can look across the gourmet section and still not
> see the other side? The one with the 200 different kinds of local
> tomatoes in neat bushel baskets with hand-lettered informative signs
> telling you exactly what farm they're from? The one with the
> earthen-and-emerald bathroom decor with mood lighting? The one with the
> Chinese buffet and player piano? The one with the custom-made brick oven?
> Despite all this, I can't disagree with your basic points, but...
I think this is the one my grad-school landlord once drove us to to
shop--where they bag your groceries and take them away in a box and send
them down a conveyor belt, and you just pull your car up to the loading
area and the guys load up your car for you. Whoa. Valet grocery boys.
> : It just seems ironic that some upstaters are sitting either on farms or
> : in (decaying?) ethnic centers and are rushing to buy this stuff.
>
> Come on, most of the people "rushing to buy this stuff" are tired, harried
> suburbanites returning from work and making a quick stop at Wegmans to get
> milk and Wonder bread. At least, I am.
[snip]
Me too...sort of. I mean, I am not a person who has time or inclination to
want to have the Rochester equivalent of a French market where I can buy
baguettes and free-range chicken every day for a meal that will take me
two hours to cook. Like I said, I'm not a Velveeta eater but neither do I
have the time or money to be a gourmet. I guess my Ohio-born-and-bred
tastebuds are too uncultured to miss that stuff. Some people just got no
class.
[snip]
> However, I think you are being a little bit idealistic/outraged over
> Wegmans somehow "contributing" to urban decline and decaying ethnic
> outposts...Wegmans isn't creating these trends. People like to live in
> the suburbs. That's where they live and that's where the money is. I
> admit to being a no-class suburbanite, but that doesn't mean I swallow
> whatever Wegmans gives puts out...it's all part of the scenery if you ask
> me. Sic transit gloria Olde-Worldia.
Yeah. They get some money, they move out. I am moving out of the downtown
area at the end of the month, for other reasons too, athough I can't
afford the suburbs and the suburbs wouldn't serve the purpose of my
moving...people without cars are more or less stuck with living in the
city somewhere anyway. But I have to admit I am not going to miss the
higher population of panhandlers and such where I live now. And it is a
bit much to blame ALL of that on Danny Wegman.
Trudi Marrapodi
> Don and/or Karen Glass wrote:
>
> > Maybe the Rochester market isn't into ethnic stuff enough to support the
> > space in the stores. I have to admit that I don't go home expecting to
> > find great ethnic food, and no one is going to start cooking lots of
> > things they have never even heard of. (I still think Wegman's Chinese
> > restaurants aren't bad compared to many, and much more convenient.)
>
> The "Wokery" is a joke. You want real Chinese food? Go to a _real_
> Chinese restaurant! Here in Greece in Ridgemont plaza, they have that
> restaurant thingie on one side of the store. It's atrociously
> expensive, and the food isn't much to write home about. Time for Danny
> Wegman to put the coke spoon down and get back to basics -- selling
> groceries.
I don't know whether you've been there, but the one on Hylan Drive is
quite good, to my admittedly non-Chinese tastebuds. Of course, I don't
just eat Chinese food at Wegmans either.
[snip]
> Most Wegmans that I can see are at least on a busline. At least in
> NJ/NY/LI area you have more choices -- Pathmark, King Kullen, Waldbaums,
> Edwards, ShopRite, A&P, etc... In Rochester, it's Tops and Wegmans.
> There _was_ Bells and a few smaller stores, but Tops and Wegmans drove
> most of them out of business. So much for healthy competition here.
Yeah, but look at what the competition was--Bells and Apple's. They were
really not that big a deal. They never had the pricing and selection of a
Tops or Wegmans that I recall. And don't forget, the Midtown market is a
Shur Fine. I support it because it is there. I think it is important for
*someone* to be there. So even if I wasn't in a habit of running out of
stuff and having to go there because it's conveniently walkable, I would.
Just so that Wegmans doesn't get ALL my business.
[snip]
> Wegman's attempt to sell fresh made food in their store is tragic. It's
> overpriced, bland, usually not very fresh, and does nothing to "enhance"
> my shopping experience there. They should do away with it... it's
> nothing but expensive overhead.
Gosh, I must REALLY have uncultured tastebuds...I never realized the food
was so bad...
Trudi Marrapodi
In article <33297B...@cumsl.ctr.columbia.edu>, J E Moryl
<j...@cumsl.ctr.columbia.edu> wrote:
> I had a feeling that this would spark some debate. Thanks for everyones
> input; I have a few comments,
>
> My reason for posting "Wegman's sucks!" was that there is a general
> feeling that Wegman's (W) is a "good" supermarket. First and foremost I
> think a good supermarket should have quality basic foods at fair prices.
> I think this is where W falls short. Some posters have established that
> W is big and W is sucessful and W is clean: none of which I deny and
> none of which is particularly important to me.
>
> It bothers me that there is this idea that good food should be for some
> kind of elite that exists only in our larger urban centers.
Maybe our definitions of "good food" vary from yours. I mean, I guess it
has never really much bothered me whether my chicken was humantely treated
or not. I admit, PETA would not love a person like me. And I am probably
going to die someday from the cancer all the chemicals in the meat I eat
will give me.
> Where I grew
> up in Binghamton, almost everyone was first or second generation
> Italian, Polish or some other nationality and ethnic food was widely
> available. We are supposed to live in one of the most prosperous
> countries on earth and yet our cuisine, which like it or not, is an
> important part of a nation's identity, is pretty debased. There are some
> places in the country (e.g. N. Calif. and the Pacific NW) where there
> has been an increased appreciation of locally produced foodstuffs but
> this seems to be a hard sell in the NE. Even in England (!) one can get
> a great free range chicken (from France) in the largest supermarket
> chain (Tescos).
This sounds like the old complaint--"Americans don't know what good food
is, they eat Wonder Bread and Velveeta all the time." Well, I don't know;
I'm second-generation Italian/German-American, but I grew up with my
first-generation German-American mother, and when she cooks, with the
exception of the spaghetti sauce her father-in-law taught her to
cook...it's not particularly ethnic cooking. And she probably wouldn't
even know what a free-range chicken was. Maybe this is a commentary on how
debased my tastes are or something, I don't know. All I know is, I enjoy
really well-prepared good food in a restaurant, but I don't have to make
it, nor do I usually have the time or inclination; and usually I just want
to have something to eat.
> Besides, W sells a lot of pseudo-ethnic and "gourmet" items: so the
> demand, however manipulated, might be there. They do this to make
> additional profits, so are you glad to spend what money you might have
> for those little luxuries on fake panini etc.
I guess I'm just curious what the difference between "fake" panini and
"real" panini is to begin with. Because I could probably live a perfectly
good life without ANY panini. If this makes me debased, so be it.
> Maybe things have changed, but if I wanted good prices I wouldn't go to
> W; in Roch., Tops was usually cheaper, in Bing., Giant or Price Chopper
> was.
>
> I stand by my contention that W is a factor in making places like Roch.
> a worse place to live. There were nice city neighborhoods, somthing many
> smug suburbanites never bother to find out about. Even in the poorer
> areas, people need to eat.
And they need REAL panini, right? :-)
> W never showed anything but utter contempt
> for the city and its residents when I lived there. If the city of Roch.
> becomes a total dump, then what is left? A bunch of boring suburbs just
> like anywhere else in the country. I can't see this as anything to be
> proud of.
Unfortunately, this is the way things pretty much are in the good old USA.
I think Wegmans is just one small part of it. I don't think it can be
reversed.
> A few of you people in the suburbs should try schlepping out
> from downtown to the Markeplace Mall on RTS to pick up a pile of
> groceries. If you should bump into any of those inner city teens that
> are on their way out to work at W, ask them how their investment
> portfolios are doing.
Actually, it may not be all that bad a deal to work at Wegmans; they do
have scholarship programs and so on. As for shopping at the "Marketplace"
Wegmans on Mylan Drive, nobody who rides the bus wants to do that, I can
testify myself. It means schlepping back with your groceries on foot
across four lanes of pedestrian-unfriendly mall traffic and walking
through the Marketplace parking lot to the mall and through to the other
side of the mall where the bus stop is. And timing your trip so you don't
miss the infrequently-running bus. No sane person would do it. I only shop
there when I have a ride.
> Sorry for all the people that have to put up with some of the even more
> crap stores in small towns. The P&C in that small town between Syr. and
> Roc. sounds like one I used to shop at when I lived in Oswego. Still,
> this does not make W my ideal .
>
> Even though we have a lot of crap Pathmarks, etc. here in NJ there is a
> chain called Fresh Fields (I think it comes from the D.C. area) that has
> a few good points. These are ordinary size stores that sell a lot of
> "healty/organic" type stuff. Produce is quite good and the variety
> better than W. Very good breads, deli items. Meats from humanely raised
> cattle, chickens. You get the idea. Prices are pretty high but it might
> be what the market can bear (they always locate in pricey places).
I think everyone in Rochester knows that if you are obsessed with the
concept of buying only organically raised food, the Genesee Co-op is your
only option--and you can't get meat there.
capt
I cannot stand Wegman's. They try to sucker you every time. They will
put two identical products (especially meats) next to each other with
different per-pound prices, their bread is stale in one day, and their
produce goes moldy and soft almost immediately. Wegman's stinks.
J E Moryl
Oops, there is a typo in my message above.
In:
I seem to
> remember a lot of people sending their kids to the Catholic schools
> precisely to avoid the kind of people that W. did not want to serve at
> their inner city schools.
the last line should be:
at their inner city stores.
Ruthie Cunliffe
J E Moryl wrote:
>
> At least Tops seems to be able to deal with urban areas in both Roch.
> and Buffalo. Maybe it is because they are Dutch (not so ingrained with
> the drive everywhere mentality). More power to them.
I've been scanning this whole thread and although I have my own opinions
about W and other markets I didn't feel strong enough about it to post
them. Coming from an area that didn't have W nearby (Niagara Falls, NY)
when I lived there (had to drive to Amherst for the closest one), I at
first found W awful and preferred Hegedorns. THen I moved from Webster
and found W more to my liking in Canandaigua but also liked the new PC
there. Back to Rochester 4 yrs. ago and now I shop all over the place
to find what I want. Being married to a European is part of that.
BUT..the real reason I finally posted was because of the references to
Tops being Dutch. They are now but they didn't start out that way.
Italian, and "shady" at that, all the way when I was growing up. And
although they're not run or owned by them anymore I think their roots
(the store's) still has an influence on where they place their stores.
Niagara Falls and Buffalo are different, vastly, from Rochester (home of
Weggies), and Tops probably hasn't lost it's Niagara Falls/Buffalo
flavor and roots too much.
--
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Ruthie Cunliffe AA2IO http://www.frontiernet.net/~ruthie
rut...@frontiernet.net Iphone: Rut...@pub1.ipn.vocaltec.com
UIN: 219090
I feel like I'm diagonally parked, in a parallel u
Andy Williams
J E Moryl writes:
>I know that I might get flamed for having the nerve to say anything bad
>about Wegman's in this group, but here goes:
>go to Italy and buy
>a cibatta or go to France and eat a free range chicken
>or go into your
>garden in Sept. and eat a tomato
to do this.
>generally reachable only by car
if you want to be able to walk to an Italian deli or a Korean
market or whatever, you should move to New York City. It's
not going to happen in upstate NY. Then I took a closer look
at your email address, and I see you've already done so.
Enjoy it.
--
Andy Williams - real address andywlms at ct2 dot nai dot net
Karl J. Molnar
> Me too...sort of. I mean, I am not a person who has time or inclination to
> want to have the Rochester equivalent of a French market where I can buy
> baguettes and free-range chicken every day for a meal that will take me
> two hours to cook. Like I said, I'm not a Velveeta eater but neither do I
> have the time or money to be a gourmet. I guess my Ohio-born-and-bred
> tastebuds are too uncultured to miss that stuff. Some people just got no
> class.
>
> Trudi
> www...@spamdagger.frontiernet.net
> Address modified to prevent spam. You can figure it out.
Speaking as an Ohio native myself, I thought Velveeta *was* considered
gourmet food in that part of the country...
--
Karl Molnar
mol...@rtp.ericsson.com
Dave Hitt
Earl Westerlund <ea...@kodak.com> wrote:
>You may be interested to know that its policy is just about complete.
>The Midtown store is gone. They weren't making enough of a profit.
>(Note I did not say they were losing money.) The city had to bribe
>(excuse me, grant tax breaks to) somebody else to come in. When
>confronted with the urban decay issue, they say that gee, they're a
>business and have to make money blah blah blah.
Earl, do you have any idea how to run a business *without* making a
profit? If so, I'd like to hear it. I just shut down a business that
had very loyal customers but was losing money, and I couldn't afford
to keep taking it out of my pocket. If I knew that making money was
just "blah blah blah" I would have kept it open, at least until the
bank came and took my house.
>
>Interesting that Robert Wegman has pledged $25 million to the inner city
>Catholic schools. I guess to fight the urban decay he helped cause.
>Maybe he's trying to buy his way into heaven like Andrew Carnegie tried
>to do...
So when he leaves because he's not making money he's a bad guy, but
when he gives twenty five million dollars he's *still* a bad guy?
Some folks just can't win. (When was the last time *you* contributed
$25,000,000 to anything?)
Daniel Danhauser
J E Moryl (j...@cumsl.ctr.columbia.edu) wrote:
: It bothers me that there is this idea that good food should be for some
: kind of elite that exists only in our larger urban centers. Where I grew
: up in Binghamton, almost everyone was first or second generation
: Italian, Polish or some other nationality and ethnic food was widely
: available. We are supposed to live in one of the most prosperous
: countries on earth and yet our cuisine, which like it or not, is an
: important part of a nation's identity, is pretty debased. There are some
: places in the country (e.g. N. Calif. and the Pacific NW) where there
: has been an increased appreciation of locally produced foodstuffs but
: this seems to be a hard sell in the NE. Even in England (!) one can get
: a great free range chicken (from France) in the largest supermarket
: chain (Tescos).
No offense, but I find this a silly argument. "Good" food is by
definition subjective. If you want cheap & easy & generic, then that's
"good" to you. Most of this country avoids foods with strong flavors, so
places like Wegman's reflect that. No Cal & Seattle are areas with well
educated elites that want more purely ethnic food. Most people find Taco
Bell ethnic enough (ahem!). True ethnic food is available everywhere if
you look hard enough & certainly in Upstate NY (compared to most of the
country). Most people just aren't as passionate about this as you.
: I stand by my contention that W is a factor in making places like Roch.
: a worse place to live. There were nice city neighborhoods, somthing many
: smug suburbanites never bother to find out about. Even in the poorer
: areas, people need to eat. W never showed anything but utter contempt
: for the city and its residents when I lived there. If the city of Roch.
: becomes a total dump, then what is left? A bunch of boring suburbs just
: like anywhere else in the country. I can't see this as anything to be
: proud of. A few of you people in the suburbs should try schlepping out
: from downtown to the Markeplace Mall on RTS to pick up a pile of
: groceries. If you should bump into any of those inner city teens that
: are on their way out to work at W, ask them how their investment
: portfolios are doing.
Retailers always go where the money is. That's why they moved to the
cities (shunning small towns) and why they later moved to the cities
(shunning downtowns). What about this process mystifies you? While I
appreciate the sentimentality, it makes no sense for an essentially
suburban focused outfit like Wegman's to slog it out in inner cities where
they have no idea what they're doing. Good riddance to them! Make way
for others who understand that community & who find it "profitable enough"
to be there. BTW, since when does any profit at all make a store
successful to it's owner?
Danny Danhauser
Syracuse, NY
TomSNY
Something everyone should keep in mind. Wegmans keeps on building because
their stores are state of the art and people shop there. If everyone
thought they sucked, they would stop building. The fact is selection or
not, prices high or low, store sucks or doesn't suck, Wegmans is a
incredible success story born in Rochester and speading there success
throughout NY & Penn. I spent 10 Years working for Tops. Their Italian
home town charm wasn't enough to compete, they changed ownership several
times untill Ahold took them over and gave them the money they needed to
compete. The Castalani family although successful for the first twenty
years could not continue on their own. The Wegman could and will continue
to. Wegmans is where they are today with the same owners they started with
and truly one of the largest success stories in Rochester.
Curly Sue
li...@the-vanguard.com (Andy Williams) wrote:
>Come on. Upstate is a big place. I was going to suggest that
>if you want to be able to walk to an Italian deli or a Korean
>market or whatever, you should move to New York City.
Don't let anyone fool you. The Korean markets around here are
probably OK if you want Asian food (I wouldn't know myself) but for
domestic stuff their quality is a myth.
Try, just try, to get a decent tomato anywhere around here in August
or September. Oh, I forgot... one can travel all the way to the
Union Square Greenmarket for fresh produce. Making everything a
federal project is part of the "stimulation" of living in NYC.
Give me Wegman's anyday.
Sue(tm)
Lead me not into temptation... I can find it myself!
sue at interport net
Trudi Marrapodi
> li...@the-vanguard.com (Andy Williams) wrote:
>
> >Come on. Upstate is a big place. I was going to suggest that
> >if you want to be able to walk to an Italian deli or a Korean
> >market or whatever, you should move to New York City.
>
> Don't let anyone fool you. The Korean markets around here are
> probably OK if you want Asian food (I wouldn't know myself) but for
> domestic stuff their quality is a myth.
And there are things like ethnic markets in Rochester, too, if you REALLY
want to shop there. Chinese markets, Korean Markets, Italian markets.
> Try, just try, to get a decent tomato anywhere around here in August
> or September. Oh, I forgot... one can travel all the way to the
> Union Square Greenmarket for fresh produce. Making everything a
> federal project is part of the "stimulation" of living in NYC.
Yeah, well, you can't get a decent tomato in ANY supermarket, let's face
it. Any tomato you get out of a garden if you have one, or from a produce
market, will be the only one with any flavor...that's true anywhere.
Dori Green
If anybody's seriously interested in an alternative to plastic overpriced
food imported 1200 miles or more, contact me.
I operate the only Community-Supported Agriculture project within my
5-county area where the megastores are taking over (just as everywhere
else, it seems). We don't have a farmer's market around here because
almost all of the rest of the truck farmers are out of business. I didn't
start out as a farmer, just as an informed consumer lucky enough to survive
a bout with cancer and really motivated to get off the pesticide wagon. I
actually make my living in other ways, donate my land and expertise and
time to the CSA project because I think it's an important option for the
community to have available to them. I hire local teenagers and college
students to do much of the summer garden labor.
We're discussing the possibility of a local market again next Wednesday;
I'll let you'all know how it goes. The Elmira Merchants Association now
thinks a downtown market would be a great idea, but if the mall gives us an
"in" we'll probably have to go there. Corning still occasionally rumbles
some interested noises but isn't interested enough to actually do anything
about it. Some of the local churches would love to have a farmer's market
in their parking lot, but the town law is that if anybody makes any money
on church property the church loses their tax exempt status.
Nobody can afford to do a market any more unless they're pretty darned sure
of making $400 or more. Gone are the days when it's worth the immense
amount of work if all we're going to clear is $50.
I'm now accepting membership applications for 1997. Can ship weekly care
packets of fresh organic produce, herbs, and flowers to Rochester, Buffalo,
Syracuse. The farm is only a 2-3 hour drive away, members are welcome to
wander the fields with our goats to pick wild flowers and berries, listen
to the wind and the creek. We offer camping and B&B, workshops in cooking
and gardening and abundant living, celebrate the eight quarter-days. We're
five miles from New York State's #3 tourist destination.
I don't sell to Wegmans or other stores. Direct sales to members is the
only way I can make enough to (maybe) clear my farming expenses. Wegmans
wanted my certified organic tomatoes all right but wouldn't pay me any more
than they gave to the chemical guys bringing the plastic stuff in by the
truckload. Wouldn't pay correctly for my mesclun, either -- gave me $1.50
per pound, turned around and slapped a $5.99/lb. price on it. Sold it all
within three hours after telling me their low price was because of their
high loss risk. I don't blame them, they're in business to make money.
They just don't see the whole picture of what will happen to them when
they've let all the little farmers go out of business and anything happens
to the trucking system. I'm hoping that some consumers do see that picture
and are bothered enough by it to do something about it before all of the
farms are paved over.
People can be as involved or not-involved in the community farm as they
like. Memberships start at $100 for weekly packets worth $6.25 July
through October.
Is something like this culture? I certainly hope so! I've got my life
savings and a 30-year mortgage behind the idea that there _are_ some people
out there who would like to see agribusiness move back toward agriculture.
Dori Green
Ash Grove Community Farm & Center for Sustainable Living
Corning, NY
rpea...@aol.com
>scaled back and replaced with things like coolers for 40oz. bottles of
>malt liquor. I have also heard the story that wilted veggies at the
>suburban superstores were sealed in shrink wrap to be sold at the
>inner-city stores; from my experiences with the Mt. Hope Ave. store (the
>only one I could easily reach without a car) in the early '80s support
>this.
>
>I live in NJ now and the supermarkets in my town are pretty bad too.
>But I don't miss Wegman's
>
>Cheers,
>Joe Moryl
Hey--
The city stores not withstanding, Wegmans kicks anything in NJ (Well, Bergen Cty. at least except Kings (never been rich enough to be in one)) in its ass!
Going to my local Shop-Rite makes me miss Wegman's even more. I don't know. I'd love it but I think the people would have a big problem; I know that the cashiers and service clerks are not union in a Wegman's, and I don't know about the meat cutters, but in some areas around here, Wegman's wouldn't play out.
Boy1e
I read all these complaints about Wegman's and I have to recall my
childhood. I was practically raised in a grocery store. My
great-grandparents opened a small store when they came from Canada: My
grandfather managed one of the first supermarkets, and his older brother
owned a small chainn of stores. My father is still a supermarket manager,
and he taught me much of what he knows about his specialty -- produce.
I no longer work in the industry, but I know enough about it to read these
complaints about Wegman's and shake my head.
Supermarkets were designed 50 years ago. (In fact, I think the first
opened in 1947 or so.) They were meant to be a big convenience for
car-owning, baby-booming families. Now you could get a week's groceries
without having to go one place for produce, another for bread and a third
for meat.
The same theory holds true today, even for the super stores. They're a
convenience. I read a complaint about their bagels. OK, maybe they suck.
When I was a boy (and that was only 15 or 20 years ago) bagels in my
hometown were frozen. There was no such thing as a fresh one. A place like
Wegman's would be a treat.
Don't like Wegman's ethnic foods? Again, it's better than what the
industry offered 20 years ago.
Don't like them moving out of the inner cities? Other chains are doing it,
too. It's an industry trend because the money is in the suburbs, and land
is cheaper and is taxed at a lower rate.
But consider what Wegman's *does* offer -- a fairly good organic food
section for a supermarket, some local produce (although it could do
better. Native produce is a common in-season selling point for any
supermarket -- I know my dad would buy as much local stuff as he could. It
was better quality because it could ripen on the vine longer, and was
frequently worth the extra cost. His customers thought so, too.)
Wegman's also offers a full-service meat counter -- which supermarkets
stopped offering about 15 years ago because of the cost of training and
paying a quality butcher.
And as other people point out, its stores are clean, with nice wide aisles
(except those damn choke points they design in JC and Fayetteville around
produce and meat). They do offer a variety of goods that other
supermarkets don't offer, though perhaps they don't have the quality of a
specialty store.
But while I regularly shop the Wegman's in Johnson City, I avoided the
Fayetteville store the second Price Chopper opened in Syracuse. I know my
preferences. I like quality produce and will gladly pay extra for it, and
I like nice cut meat. I like polite cashiers and helpful department
clerks. Canned and frozen goods are generally all the same price between
similar sized stores, and because I own a car, location isn't very
important.
And those qualities are of individual stores, not chains. A good produce
manager makes all the difference in quality, as does a good meat manager.
And the front-end supervisor who properly trains the cashiers knows that
making customers leave with a smile is the best guarantee of a repeat
customer.
Todd
Michael Moroney
In article <5ga3bd$e...@mtinsc05.worldnet.att.net>,
elbr...@worldnet.att.net (Jim Elbrecht) wrote:
> My favorite hardware store, Wallace Armer, just closed in
> Schenectady,
Damn.
Last one out of Schenectady, please shut off the lights.
(How many people still work at the main GE plant now?)
-Mike
Dave Hitt
mor...@world.std.com (Michael Moroney) wrote:
>Damn.
>
>Last one out of Schenectady, please shut off the lights.
>
>(How many people still work at the main GE plant now?)
>
I've asked around, and no one seems to know for sure. Most guesses
are in the range of 5,000-8,000.
orp...@buffnet.net
I agree 100 percent plus with nearly everything posted in the original
post ...
Several years ago I lived in Rochester and used to shop in the Wegmans
store (foods section) that actually was part of the Rochester Sibley
Dept. store .... Wegmans was something SPECIAL at that point and the
SPECIAL FOODs were indeed just that .. about the only really good
thing about WEGMANS is the BEEF ... they really do have excellent beef
roasts if YOU r a meat eater !!!!!!
The stores R not going UP they really do seem to be going down and do
not at all operate on the same QUALITY level as the TOPS markets here
in the Buffalo area ...
I can never find the newest brand names for sale at Wegmans and
certainly NOT the newest quality brand products that might be offered
elsewhere ... I do recall that Wegmans was very impressive when they
first opened here ... and a real selling point was the way the shelves
were RESTOCKES by an internal computer notation that had the item on
its way to the store as soon as the computer inventory indicated
replenishing was necessary !!!!!! WELL look around BABE !!!! often is
is a few weeks before something is restocked ... and heaven forbid if
U use a SIZE that WEGMANS does not stock !!!!!! U will NEVER get it at
WEGMANS !!!!! U change your shopping habits to THEIR way of thinking
or U go to TOPS ... Guess what :) !!!!!!!
And damnit please do something about all that fucking fish !!!!! I
like fish ... but all that dead fish sitting around ontop of ice ALL
the time like some kind of RELIGIOUS display of HOLY RELICS is getting
to me ... especially when I have to make a REAL effort to SKIRT around
these FISHY displays early on Sunday morning when I JUST NOT in the
MOOD to be FACE to FACE with GLASSY eyed WALLEYE !!!!
efc
Curly Sue
www...@spamdagger.frontiernet.net (Trudi Marrapodi) wrote:
Except two things-at least upstate people have gardens and you can
always get good tomatoes from someone and the grocery store problem is
not as critical, second, the tomatoes here really are worse than that,
and (OK, make it three...) few people upstate brag about Korean
produce markets.
GC
Food is food. If it tastes good and doesn't cost a lot, I eat it.
GC
Ellen B. Edgerton
orp...@buffnet.net (orp...@buffnet.net) sez:
: And damnit please do something about all that fucking fish !!!!! I
: like fish ... but all that dead fish sitting around ontop of ice ALL
: the time like some kind of RELIGIOUS display of HOLY RELICS is getting
: to me ... especially when I have to make a REAL effort to SKIRT around
: these FISHY displays early on Sunday morning when I JUST NOT in the
: MOOD to be FACE to FACE with GLASSY eyed WALLEYE !!!!
You know, this really is one of the more entertaining rants I've read on
any subject for quite a while. Thanks for the laugh.
Dori Green
Seven growers showed up at last week's interest meeting for an Elmira
Farmer's Market at downtown Wisner Park. The group sponsoring the market,
Downtown Merchants Association, insists on holding the market 11 AM - 4 PM
on Fridays, their reasoning being that there are already 6,000 people
downtown working. They ignored reminders from farmers that the Ithaca and
Tioga farmers markets bring 10,000+ people into the area on Saturdays.
Farmers who pointed out that most farmers and gardeners hold down full-time
jobs in order to keep their mortgage paid (it ain't going to happen by
means of market sales) and most would-be produce buyers are at work until 5
PM (an hour after the market closes) -- and don't want to go grocery
shopping on Friday anyway --were quickly hushed by the Cooperative
Extension person running the meeting.
The Merchants Association claimed to be sponsoring the market but will not
put any money toward the effort. They'll provide access to the (public)
park and arrange for planning meetings in the (public) city hall. Any
advertising, etc. will have to come from the farmers, who will be expected
to pay a $15 weekly booth fee for booths they bring themselves.
The Association did not promise any results but did indicate that they
would see about getting the help of a 4H group to assist farmers with
offloading the produce from their trucks -- vehicles are not allowed in the
selling area so farmers are required to carry everything to the site after
working at harvests all morning, then be cheerful and friendly serving the
customers (if any) for five hours. No help is promised to schlep leftovers
back to the vehicle.
It was left unclear how much of the $15 fee will go toward advertising and
how much will be used to pay the "Market Manager" (a position being
reserved, it seemed, for the Cooperative Extension representative).
This farmer might decide to participate in this market just to give it the
benefit of the doubt but will not have high expectations for its success
and will certainly be looking for other outlets in the meantime. It will
be worth driving an extra 30 miles to get:
fee money going toward advertising, not bureaucracy
off-vehicle sales with a minimum of schlepping
pavilion or similar rain/sun protection
market day accessible by farmers and customers
Dori Green
A Farm Market Fan
GC
Smells good to me. MMMMMMM, hummy seafood!
GC
Ellen B. Edgerton <ebed...@newstand.syr.edu> wrote
> orp...@buffnet.net (orp...@buffnet.net) sez:
>
> : And damnit please do something about all that fucking fish !!!!! I
> You know, this really is one of the more entertaining rants I've read on
JNL
whatever
The Wheats
GC wrote:
>
> Smells good to me. MMMMMMM, hummy seafood!
>
The smell is so gross!! Don't know about other Wegmans, but where I go
the fish is right next to the bakery. I suppose there is some marketing
reasoning for this but I find it hard to buy bakery products there, due
to the fish smell! Why DO they do that???
IntoWishinRock
* Can't go in there for a few things without spending $100. By a few, I mean items and quantities that never look like it's worth the money spent.
* Always under-stocked... even before COVID. They fail to carry some basic everyday items. I went there for freaking cucumbers and they didn't
have any. It wasn't a poor growing season either. "Oh a new shipment will be here tomorrow." Well, I'm here today. Thanks for that.
* You want a brand name? Sorry, you'll have to settle for Wegmans brands. Some are very good but c'mon!
* To cashier: Do I need my Shopper's Club card? Answer 1 = no. Alternate answer: Yes.....Oh look...you saved 15 cents on a $300 grocery bill.
* Constantly rearrange the store. Just when I become comfortable, they do this and now I'm on a scavenger hunt for 2 hours to find simple things.
* Can I just have a regular apple? We ran out Sir, but we have many organic types at just 4.99/lb.
* I go to buy Wegmans coffee pods, 100 pack. Not ONE box in the coffee aisle. Continue shopping to find them all in a varied display near
candy/chips. How foolish of me!
* In the store I go to, there are quite a few items that have no advertised price. And there are no scanners for customers. Well, I'm either paying 99
cents for this head of lettuce or $8.00. I'll probably never know.
* They always hire very clean cut people, especially the younger kids. The image is great, but personality is important too. Many of the employees
have the personality of a tree. To hire these clean clones has to be in violation of anti-discrimination laws. There's pretty much no diversity
overall.
* My store only...they changed the doors. From inside the store, the exit door is on the left and the entrance door is on the right. For five years now,
I'm still watching some people go to the wrong doors to exit and enter, only to be startled and embarrassed when they realize it won't open. Then
they look around to see if anyone saw the incident. Yep. ME! The door change must have been an upper management decision.
* There are probably more things that have happened. These are just off the top of my head and I'm tired now.