Turania...Turania...
Dario Moreno
> Oh, Race of Turks! Children of Iron and Fire!
> Founders of a Thousand Homelands!
> Wearers of a Thousand Crowns!
>
Oh,race of Jerks! Bastards of yurt felt and sheep dung!
Destroyers of a thousand homelands not belonging to you!
Thieves of a thousand crowns that will be retrieved from you!
Turania...Turania...Heed the sirens call! Go East Young Turks Go East.
"where the Turkish hoof trods,no grass grows"-Victor Hugo
Dario Moreno
"to protect Armenia, Russia and Iran azerbaijan will be destroyed"
Dario"Prester John" Moreno
"to protect Armenia, Russia and Iran azerbaijan will be destroyed"
-----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==----------
http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own
Turcoman
Polite warning:
"God said, I have a host which I have called Turk and settled in the East.
If any people shall arouse my wrath, I shall give them unto the power of
this host."
(Saying attributed to the prophet Mohammed, repeated in the encyclopedic
dictionary of Mahmud al-Kashgari. Baghdad 1074 AD).
Read your history and be afraid, be very afraid.
Oh, Race of Turks! Children of Iron and Fire!
Founders of a Thousand Homelands!
Wearers of a Thousand Crowns!
Dario Moreno wrote in message <7ai7mf$8k9$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>...
kan...@carroll.com
wrote "where the Turkish hoof trods, no grass grows" Have you seen
what the toork money is worth? it is so bad it's not even funny. Here
we have a little Armenia with a much much better currency then this
toork hoofen bastards. We just let them be they will be in the stone
age soon.
Kind Regards and thanks for the boost ;-)
Vahram
On Thu, 18 Feb 1999 23:28:26 GMT, Dario Moreno <al...@my-dejanews.com>
wrote:
kan...@carroll.com
WITH YOU. AND LEARN HOW TO SPELL HIS NAME RIGHT YOU FOOL. YOU CAN'T
EVEN SPELL HIS NAME SO TAKE YOUR STUPID TALK OUT OF HERE YOU ARE NOT
EMPRESSING ANYONE IDIOT
Oh Fire Breathing Children of Iran what a bunch of lost soles these
toorks are all Day Dreamers
See Kim Toork
See Kim Muhammad
On Thu, 18 Feb 1999 12:17:06 -0000, "Turcoman"
<Turc...@btinternet.com> wrote:
>Me thinks your just a teeeensy weeensy bit jealous.
>
>Polite warning:
>"God said, I have a host which I have called Turk and settled in the East.
>If any people shall arouse my wrath, I shall give them unto the power of
>this host."
>(Saying attributed to the prophet Mohammed, repeated in the encyclopedic
>dictionary of Mahmud al-Kashgari. Baghdad 1074 AD).
>
>Read your history and be afraid, be very afraid.
>
>Oh, Race of Turks! Children of Iron and Fire!
>Founders of a Thousand Homelands!
>Wearers of a Thousand Crowns!
>
>
>Dario Moreno wrote in message <7ai7mf$8k9$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>...
katy pearce
>we have a little Armenia with a much much better currency
Actually, the dram tends to fall apart- it's really flimsy. you can't leave
it crumbled in your pocket, or it will tear.
But new currency has been printed this week.
katy pearce
>There we go! :) Armenia got another "economist" :), judging the financial
>situation by paper quality of monetary unit.
Listen dude... I was just commenting.
Whatever... this is the kind of crap that makes me want to stay away...
A
<36ce1656...@news.carroll.com>:
#Welcome back Katy :-),
#
# I was not saying anything about the drams durability. I was
#trying to point out that Armenian Money is much more stable then
#Turkish money as far as exchange rates and the run of inflation :-)
#
No you were not, you tried to make an invalid point that Armenian economy
is better than Turkish one, based solely on inflation -- while totally
overlooking the triple-digit inflation in Armenia in recent years -- and
then making a hopeless and stupid "argument" that the fact that Turkish
lira has more zeros than Armenia's dram, it shows that it is "bad." I
guess then Kuwait's dinar and British pound are better than US dollar,
although each and every investor and expert would disagree with such
Cunt-Ar style "logic." ;-)
# Kind Regards
# Vahram
#
#PS: another point that my friend failed on was saying that the Russian
#Ruble is now at 6 it's not at six Last Check Ruble stands at 23 or so.
#
Cheez, what an idiot! Yes, it is 23 R now. Because of the August 17, 1998
crisis, which propelled Russian ruble from 6 R to double-digit value.
My example concentrated on the process of redenomination, totally unknown
to such ignoramus' as Cunt-Ar, where before January 1998, $1 USD was worth
roughly R 6,000, while after January 1998, three zero's were chopped off,
new roubles were issued, and $1 USD was now worth R 6 rubles.
As as said, Russia is not the first country to perform this. Poland did it
before in early 90's. Other countries did that too. Turkey too, can easily
do that, as can Italy, and any other country with "too many" zeros. But
they do not, because it tends to create confussion, and costs too much,
both in printing, exchanging money, as well as education, and conversion,
and update of all software, etc., etc., etc. Anyone following EU's slow
conversion towards Euro, knows very much how costly, and painful the
procedure is, despite the fact that EU has well prepared.
In Russia today too, you can still use "old" rubles, and the "new" rubles.
BTW, on Cunt-Ar's yet another idiotic remark about "Italy has Euro" --
yes, it does, but it will continue using the Italian Lira for years to
come. Janitor, learn the facts, and then come back. ;-)
#>
#>>we have a little Armenia with a much much better currency
#>
#>Actually, the dram tends to fall apart- it's really flimsy. you can't leave
#>it crumbled in your pocket, or it will tear.
#>But new currency has been printed this week.
#>
A
#Iran is a friend of Armenia because Iran understands its long term objectives
#and problems with its neighbors Turkey and Azerbaijan.Iranians understand
#Azerbaijans and Turkeys long term objective of eliminating Armenia.A Strong
#Armenia is in Irans interest.The Republic of Azerbaijan is a particular
#threat which is evident in its recent diarrhea of the mouth of wishing
#Turkish or NATO troops on its soil.That is part of the game plan.Northwest
#Persia was Persian and is now inhabited by Azeris.You may want the Republic
#of Azerbaijan to be incorporated into Iran but unfortunately its probably
#going to be the other way around, similar to the problem in Kosovo.The only
#solution to stop Turkey and Azerbaijan from having hegemony in Southwest
#Asia,destroying Armenia and tearing apart Iran is to stop this plan in its
#tracks by Marginalizing and deligitimizing the Republic of Azerbaaijan and
#ultimately partition the Azerbaijan Republic by instigating ethnic
#revolutionary movements within Azerbaijan.By using the Talysh(an Iranian
#people)the Tats(also Iranian), the lezgins(a caucasian people)and the
#Armenians.The Azerbaijan republic will be divided among the
#Iranians,Armenians and Russians.The Armenians will get their historical
#lands,the Russians caucasian lands and the Persians will get the rest.In this
Besides from the aggressive yet empty threat message from some anonymous
Hay, hiding behind other's backs, I should note that Armania stands to
lose a lot from such a scenario. The reason is that Armania belongs to
Aran, as virtually all the lands the current Republic of Armania occupies
were part of Aran, and ruled by its Shah's. So there are absolutely no
mythical "historical lands" that such petty people should or would get;
those lands would be absorbed back into greater Aran.
Meanwhile, Daryusha must be really mad if he thinks that Russia will be
able to, or willing to, take any northern lands of Azerbaijan Republic.
Daghestan is on fire, and Chechnya is independent, de facto, and arguably,
de jure. Russia would not like to excacerbate the situation further for
itself, or Chechens might live up to their promise to drive straight to
Moscow! ;-)
Good luck with your long-ranging, yet totally impossible plans of using
Talysh's, Tat's and whoever else against Azerbaijan Republic. I am
surprized you did not include Kurds. Hmmm. Just as the current play with
Kurds, it will all backlash against Armania. After all, you Daryusha
should know it, you bear that key person's name as your login. :-)
#way,the non Persian Azeris will have their nationalist backs broken and will
#not be a threat for awhile.The Azeris wish to Turkify Iran and make the
#Persians their slaves.It is clear in the actions of Turkey and Azerbaijan.
#
#In article <7akumm$jba$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>,
# Za...@dsuper.net wrote:
#> In article <36cd9fd0...@news.carroll.com>,
#> kan...@carroll.com wrote:
#> Dario Why do you say to protect armania ,Iran will be destroyed"
#> What has Iran ever done to Armania Explain?
#
#> > >Dario Moreno wrote in message <7ai7mf$8k9$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>...
#> > >>Turcoman wrote:Refering to the Mythical Turks
#> > >>> Oh, Race of Turks! Children of Iron and Fire!
#> > >>> Founders of a Thousand Homelands!
#> > >>> Wearers of a Thousand Crowns!
#
#> > >>>Darios historical reply:
#> > >>Oh,race of Jerks! Bastards of yurt felt and sheep dung!
#> > >>Destroyers of a thousand homelands not belonging to you!
#> > >>Thieves of a thousand crowns that will be retrieved from you!
#> > >>
#> > >>Turania...Turania...Heed the sirens call! Go East Young Turks Go East.
#> > >>
#> > >>"where the Turkish hoof trods,no grass grows"-Victor Hugo
#>
#
#Dario"Prester John" Moreno
#
#"to protect Armenia, Russia and Iran azerbaijan will be partitioned"
#
Za...@dsuper.net
> >>
>
GET LOST TOORK, You are an Idiot and take your IDOIT PROFITS WORNINGS
> WITH YOU. AND LEARN HOW TO SPELL HIS NAME RIGHT YOU FOOL. YOU CAN'T
> EVEN SPELL HIS NAME SO TAKE YOUR STUPID TALK OUT OF HERE YOU ARE NOT
> EMPRESSING ANYONE IDIOT
>
> Oh Fire Breathing Children of Iran what a bunch of lost soles these
> toorks are all Day Dreamers
>
> See Kim Toork
> See Kim Muhammad
>
> On Thu, 18 Feb 1999 12:17:06 -0000, "Turcoman"
> <Turc...@btinternet.com> wrote:
>
> >Me thinks your just a teeeensy weeensy bit jealous.
> >
> >Polite warning:
> >"God said, I have a host which I have called Turk and settled in the East.
> >If any people shall arouse my wrath, I shall give them unto the power of
> >this host."
> >(Saying attributed to the prophet Mohammed, repeated in the encyclopedic
> >dictionary of Mahmud al-Kashgari. Baghdad 1074 AD).
> >
> >Read your history and be afraid, be very afraid.
> >
> >Oh, Race of Turks! Children of Iron and Fire!
> >Founders of a Thousand Homelands!
> >Wearers of a Thousand Crowns!
> >
>
> >
> >Dario Moreno wrote in message <7ai7mf$8k9$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>...
> >>Turcoman wrote:
> >>> Oh, Race of Turks! Children of Iron and Fire!
> >>> Founders of a Thousand Homelands!
> >>> Wearers of a Thousand Crowns!
> >>>
> >>Oh,race of Jerks! Bastards of yurt felt and sheep dung!
> >>Destroyers of a thousand homelands not belonging to you!
> >>Thieves of a thousand crowns that will be retrieved from you!
> >>
> >>Turania...Turania...Heed the sirens call! Go East Young Turks Go East.
> >>
> >>"where the Turkish hoof trods,no grass grows"-Victor Hugo
> >>
jjh...@osfmail.isc.rit.edu
> Oh Fire Breathing Children of Iran what a bunch of lost soles these
> toorks are all Day Dreamers
>
> See Kim Toork
> See Kim Muhammad
Just one comment, your last insult is not just against Turks but against
Muslims in general.
Javid
jjh...@osfmail.isc.rit.edu
"katy pearce" <kpe...@umich.edu> wrote:
>
>
> >we have a little Armenia with a much much better currency
>
There we go! :) Armenia got another "economist" :), judging the financial
situation by paper quality of monetary unit. Dear Kathy, please reread
Vahram's message :).
Dario Moreno
In article <7akumm$jba$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>,
Za...@dsuper.net wrote:
> In article <36cd9fd0...@news.carroll.com>,
> kan...@carroll.com wrote:
> Dario Why do you say to protect armania ,Iran will be destroyed"
> What has Iran ever done to Armania Explain?
> > >Dario Moreno wrote in message <7ai7mf$8k9$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>...
> > >>Turcoman wrote:Refering to the Mythical Turks
> > >>> Oh, Race of Turks! Children of Iron and Fire!
> > >>> Founders of a Thousand Homelands!
> > >>> Wearers of a Thousand Crowns!
> > >>>Darios historical reply:
> > >>Oh,race of Jerks! Bastards of yurt felt and sheep dung!
> > >>Destroyers of a thousand homelands not belonging to you!
> > >>Thieves of a thousand crowns that will be retrieved from you!
> > >>
> > >>Turania...Turania...Heed the sirens call! Go East Young Turks Go East.
> > >>
> > >>"where the Turkish hoof trods,no grass grows"-Victor Hugo
>
Dario"Prester John" Moreno
"to protect Armenia, Russia and Iran azerbaijan will be partitioned"
kan...@carroll.com
I was not saying anything about the drams durability. I was
trying to point out that Armenian Money is much more stable then
Turkish money as far as exchange rates and the run of inflation :-)
Kind Regards
Vahram
PS: another point that my friend failed on was saying that the Russian
Ruble is now at 6 it's not at six Last Check Ruble stands at 23 or so.
>
Za...@dsuper.net
Dario Moreno <al...@my-dejanews.com> wrote:
I agree with most of your points
What part of azarbaijan do you mean when you say Historicly armanian.
I all for iran and armania signing a defense treaty.
I also think that azarbaijan and armania should solve their problem.
jjh...@osfmail.isc.rit.edu
Za...@dsuper.net wrote:
> In article <36cd9fd0...@news.carroll.com>,
> kan...@carroll.com wrote:
> Dario Why do you say to protect armania ,Iran will be destroyed"
> What has Iran ever done to Armania Explain?
You want an answer? Nothing, except kissing Armenian ass!
Javid
jjh...@osfmail.isc.rit.edu
Dario Moreno <al...@my-dejanews.com> wrote:
> Iran is a friend of Armenia because Iran understands its long term objectives
> and problems with its neighbors Turkey and Azerbaijan.Iranians understand
> Azerbaijans and Turkeys long term objective of eliminating Armenia.A Strong
> Armenia is in Irans interest.The Republic of Azerbaijan is a particular
> threat which is evident in its recent diarrhea of the mouth of wishing
> Turkish or NATO troops on its soil.That is part of the game plan.Northwest
> Persia was Persian and is now inhabited by Azeris.You may want the Republic
> of Azerbaijan to be incorporated into Iran but unfortunately its probably
> going to be the other way around, similar to the problem in Kosovo.The only
> solution to stop Turkey and Azerbaijan from having hegemony in Southwest
> Asia,destroying Armenia and tearing apart Iran is to stop this plan in its
> tracks by Marginalizing and deligitimizing the Republic of Azerbaaijan and
> ultimately partition the Azerbaijan Republic by instigating ethnic
> revolutionary movements within Azerbaijan.By using the Talysh(an Iranian
> people)the Tats(also Iranian), the lezgins(a caucasian people)and the
> Armenians.The Azerbaijan republic will be divided among the
> Iranians,Armenians and Russians.The Armenians will get their historical
> lands,the Russians caucasian lands and the Persians will get the rest.In this
> way,the non Persian Azeris will have their nationalist backs broken and will
> not be a threat for awhile.The Azeris wish to Turkify Iran and make the
> Persians their slaves.It is clear in the actions of Turkey and Azerbaijan.
Tats are Jews, dickhead! Their language is Hebrew, Persian ass-kisser. Iran's
population is half-Azeri, and whether you reap your ass here and lick
Armenians as much as you wish, it will remain so. As per Azerbaijan and
Turkey, you will see your loser grave in both of these countries.
Go fix your deligitimized ass :-)). Even the fact of you hiding your name
under Azeri one, shows that you are immoral shit with no root. Even Armenian
would not afford to do so. You have no origin.
kan...@carroll.com
You did not understand what he said :-) He was Saying to
Protect Armenian, Iran, Russia, and Greece We have to blow up
azerbaijan, :-) I like our defence treaty as well.
Live Long Friend
Vahram
AzerOn Sat, 20 Feb 1999 00:13:18 GMT, Za...@dsuper.net wrote:
>In article <36cd9fd0...@news.carroll.com>,
> kan...@carroll.com wrote:
>Dario Why do you say to protect armania ,Iran will be destroyed"
>What has Iran ever done to Armania Explain?
>> >>
>
>>
>GET LOST TOORK, You are an Idiot and take your IDOIT PROFITS WORNINGS
>> WITH YOU. AND LEARN HOW TO SPELL HIS NAME RIGHT YOU FOOL. YOU CAN'T
>> EVEN SPELL HIS NAME SO TAKE YOUR STUPID TALK OUT OF HERE YOU ARE NOT
>> EMPRESSING ANYONE IDIOT
>>
>> Oh Fire Breathing Children of Iran what a bunch of lost soles these
>> toorks are all Day Dreamers
>>
>> See Kim Toork
>> See Kim Muhammad
>>
>> On Thu, 18 Feb 1999 12:17:06 -0000, "Turcoman"
>> <Turc...@btinternet.com> wrote:
>>
>> >Me thinks your just a teeeensy weeensy bit jealous.
>> >
>> >Polite warning:
>> >"God said, I have a host which I have called Turk and settled in the East.
>> >If any people shall arouse my wrath, I shall give them unto the power of
>> >this host."
>> >(Saying attributed to the prophet Mohammed, repeated in the encyclopedic
>> >dictionary of Mahmud al-Kashgari. Baghdad 1074 AD).
>> >
>> >Read your history and be afraid, be very afraid.
>> >
>> >Oh, Race of Turks! Children of Iron and Fire!
>> >Founders of a Thousand Homelands!
>> >Wearers of a Thousand Crowns!
>> >
>>
>> >
>> >Dario Moreno wrote in message <7ai7mf$8k9$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>...
>> >>Turcoman wrote:
>> >>> Oh, Race of Turks! Children of Iron and Fire!
>> >>> Founders of a Thousand Homelands!
>> >>> Wearers of a Thousand Crowns!
>> >>>
>> >>Oh,race of Jerks! Bastards of yurt felt and sheep dung!
>> >>Destroyers of a thousand homelands not belonging to you!
>> >>Thieves of a thousand crowns that will be retrieved from you!
>> >>
>> >>Turania...Turania...Heed the sirens call! Go East Young Turks Go East.
>> >>
>> >>"where the Turkish hoof trods,no grass grows"-Victor Hugo
>> >>
>> >>Dario Moreno
>> >>
>> >>"to protect Armenia, Russia and Iran azerbaijan will be destroyed"
>> >>
>> >>Dario"Prester John" Moreno
>> >>
>> >>"to protect Armenia, Russia and Iran azerbaijan will be destroyed"
jjh...@osfmail.isc.rit.edu
Za...@dsuper.net wrote:
> In article <7al8c7$ro2$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>,
> Dario Moreno <al...@my-dejanews.com> wrote:
> What part of azarbaijan do you mean when you say Historicly armanian.
> I all for iran and armania signing a defense treaty.
> I also think that azarbaijan and armania should solve their problem.
Btw, first Armenian refugees in early XIX century were from Iran and not
Ottoman Turkey. Did you know that fact? And now you are licking Armenian ass?
Azerbaijan and Armenia (and not ugly interpretations of both in Persian that
you give) should solve their problem between themselves, and not with help
of Persian puppets of Russia, Mullah fanatics, or Russians.
Down with Mullah Government! Long live independence, freedom of expression and
democracy! Down with religious fanatism and Persian fascism!
Btw, did you know people calling themselves Arians have always failed. Last
in a row was Hitler, do you want to join that list now?
Javid
jjh...@osfmail.isc.rit.edu
"katy pearce" <kpe...@umich.edu> wrote:
>
> >There we go! :) Armenia got another "economist" :), judging the financial
> >situation by paper quality of monetary unit.
>
> Whatever... this is the kind of crap that makes me want to stay away...
No, no, no. No one tells you to stay away. Just read before speculating.
That's what we all do here in NGs, speculate ;-). Sometimes, I think that
everyone knows that what they say (whether with proofs or without) will play
no significant role on what will happen in reality. But it just helps people
to communicate, maybe in antagonistic way :-), but still we do reply to each
other. It also helps to learn more about things we don't know. And that's the
most important.
That's why I attend alt.culture.armenian. Because I think, that spilling
anger here in NG is much better, than doing the same thing using weapons. So
don't get pissed or angry at things that might be told. Just relax and enjoy
the discussion.
Regards,
kan...@carroll.com
trying to hard. Now Get off my leg before I smack you down.. be a good
dog behave youself and I shall send you some 1,000,000,000 Turkish
Junk okay toorkey.
>
>No you were not, you tried to make an invalid point that Armenian economy
>is better than Turkish one, based solely on inflation -- while totally
>overlooking the triple-digit inflation in Armenia in recent years -- and
>then making a hopeless and stupid "argument" that the fact that Turkish
>lira has more zeros than Armenia's dram, it shows that it is "bad." I
>guess then Kuwait's dinar and British pound are better than US dollar,
>although each and every investor and expert would disagree with such
>Cunt-Ar style "logic." ;-)
>
You got it all wrong mr Faceles A! Turks stock market fell by 47
percent What do you have to say to this mr A? you filthy faceless dumb
toork. The Armenian stock exchange is doing better then toork fool
exchange. The inflation is much less then you reported ;-) so you lied
Lets see Armenia with your claimed 3% growth and Turkey with 6% growth
your numbers toorkey ;-) Lets see with your Numbers you are trying to
pass 20 so I'll give you that just to show you something :-) and
toorkey Inflation was more then 75%. Now don't you see with your
twisted numbers we are still ahead growth vs infaltion?. bye bye
toorkey ;-) Will post the numbers monday :-) bye bye toorkey ;-)
>#
>
>Cheez, what an idiot! Yes, it is 23 R now. Because of the August 17, 1998
>crisis, which propelled Russian ruble from 6 R to double-digit value.
Backtracking as I corrected you very fast toork ;-). As far as your
logic goes please lets talk monday night when again toork money falls
overboard yet again for a 3rd day in a row. You were wrong in your
Russian Numbers you said the wrong Numbers now you have to correct
those numbers becuase you know you are WRONG ;-)
I have to run now filthy toorkey I'll be back with some more bad
numbers to show you that toorkey is finished YES THE BIRD is going to
be cooked.
As far as you pot shots at me all I have to say is this
Ananna See Kim
Vahram
PS: toorkey ... toorkey.. gobble gobble gobble you filthy bastards ;-)
gobble
jjh...@osfmail.isc.rit.edu
the world, and they all speak their mother tongue Azeri Turkic.
As per Iran, which most of you unfairly treat as Persia, I can say only one
thing. You were always losers, all through your history. Except Darius
(Daryosh) and Cyrus the Great whose relation to modern Iranians is quite
questionable as well, you were losers all the way, if there were no
Azerbaijani shahs. Our land, Azerbaijan, always gave you leaders who could
save your loser asses from foreign invasions.
Should I count your loses without our shahs. You lost to Alexander the Great,
you lost to Arabs without any resistance, and finally laid down under Seljuk
Turks and Moghols. What Iranian heritage are you proud of. Name me one great
Iranian ruler of medieval times who was not related to Azerbaijan. I am not
just mentioning Safavis and Qadjars, but also Agh and Qara Sonqors,
Eldeghuzids: Jahan Pahlavan and Qizil Arslan; Ahmadili Korp Arslan, Toghrul
Atabek, Bahram Ghur and Shirvan Shahs.
If you want more, read Nizami, the great poet, who wrote in Persian in courts
of Azerbaijani Turkic sultans.
Baku is not Persian name, dickhead, it's from Arabic: Baadi Kuuba (city of
winds). You go lick your Persian "history", which is full of losses. The only
reason why your language is so great, because Azeri Turkic sultans liked it
and allowed it to be used as language for their court poetry.
The only Persian leaders were Pahlavis, whose heritage is the most deceitful
and loser part of Iranian history. And then Khomeini, another undercover
Persian fascist. So, read books before your fart about Persian heritage. You
consider yourselves Arians, so your real homeland is Aria which is in India,
and not Iran.
And now, when Azeris are not even allowed to speak their own language, you
call them nationalists. That's why we need to be free from your
Persian/Russian disease.
LONG LIVE FREE AND UNIFIED AZERBAIJAN (NORTH AND SOUTH).
Javid
> You, little numb skull fanatic mersenary child, are trying my patience
> royally!!
>
> Go get some real education about history, and particularly the history of Aran
> (the occupied Iranian territory) which your traitor foreign inspired leaders
> renamed Azarbayejan with the hope of swallowing the real Azarbyejan in the
> south as well.
>
> It is very interesting to see how US/Israeli supported provocation of Iranians
> in this matter
> is proceeding. I was in bAdkoobeh (or Baku, the corruption of the Persian
name)
> a couple of years ago and have learned a lot through my interviews with the
> variety of my countrymen and women
> who for 180 years have been under the domination of the "super powers." We
> Iranians (Azaris, Kurds, Persians, etc. have a lot to say about the so-called
> "Azerbayejan Republic" and the time is getting near that we will see our
> beloved Aran re-joining
> our Sacred Motherland.
>
> A.V. (can not stand foreign mersenary provocators claiming to be "nationalist
> Azaris.")
jjh...@osfmail.isc.rit.edu
> Bullshit! The first Armenians in Iran came to Isphahan because of Turkish
> oppression in the 17th century. No Armenian has left Iran as a refuge because
Hmmm! How many Armenians you could count in Iran, nowadays. I believe
somewhere in the range of 100,000-200,000? Considering so called "exodus from
Ottoman to Iran" I wonder what this number was in 17th century and if there
was exodus where did all Armenians go in early XIXth century? Why was Russian
ambassador and poet Griboedov killed in Tehran for that matter, wasn't it
during Armenian massacres by Iran.
> of Iranian opression. In fact Iranian Azeris and Armenians and the Kurds get
> along very well. One of the most civilized and beautiful cities in Iran is
> Orumieh which has a large population of the above peoeple. Many Iranian Azeris
> even speak Armenian.
> The problem between Azerbajan and Armenia is because of long Turkish held hate
> for the Armenians. In Iran such hate does not exist.
Azerbaijan was not the one who started the war. In fact, Karabakh war has
hardly any relation to Turkish-Armenian conflict on the West. Armenians are
just trying to link Turkic heritage of Azeris to their conflict to Turks to
make their claims more valid.
> Iran supports Armenian and it is for a very good reason, Armenians want to be
> independent and they are not trying to be agents for americans or the SJDG as
> the turks and their communist buddies from North Azarbajan are begging to
> become. But if you read history you will see that the western powers treat
> their dogs far worse than their antagonists. But that's what you deserve if
> you want to be a dog.
Supports my ass. Iranian banana republic of Russia supports Armenians to kill
Azeris. Take a look at Armenian maps of so called "Great Armenia" which
includes the province of Ourmiyeh, which you are farting about so much.
Javid
MrMojoMan
come back before your are done.
---
--- MrMojoMan (is partly Azari himself)
---
jjh...@osfmail.isc.rit.edu wrote in message
<7ank29$nep$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>...
Dario Moreno
Iran:I must have struck a nerve in Javid Huseynov.My original post on the
threat Azerbajan(the country) and Turkey have on Iran is real.Otherwise we
would not have received close to 20 Anti-Iranian posts from him.He is acting
like a rabid dog.Insulting Iran the way he does.He is part of the best and
brightest Azerbaijan(the country)has to offer.Look him up on his own web site
and you can see what he looks like.His ideas are not the mad rantings of an
idiot.These ideas are part of the Intellectual class of Azerbaijan(the
country) and Turkey.They only want to leave the Iranian people the ostan of
Fars, so they can connect with the Republic of Turkmenistan.The Republic of
Azerbaijans wish to destroy Armenia will not stop with their linking hands
with Turkey but will continue with a death blow to Iranian Civilization.The
Turks are a cancer on Iran.
> > jjh...@osfmail.isc.rit.edu wrote
>
> and not with help
> >of Persian puppets of Russia, Mullah fanatics, or Russians.
> >
> >Down with Mullah Government! Long live independence, freedom of expression
> >and
> >democracy! Down with religious fanatism and Persian fascism!
> >
> >Btw, did you know people calling themselves Arians have always failed. Last
> >in a row was Hitler, do you want to join that list now?
> >
> >Javid
>
> You, little numb skull fanatic mersenary child, are trying my patience
> royally!!
>
> Go get some real education about history, and particularly the history of Aran
> (the occupied Iranian territory) which your traitor foreign inspired leaders
> renamed Azarbayejan with the hope of swallowing the real Azarbyejan in the
> south as well.
>
> It is very interesting to see how US/Israeli supported provocation of Iranians
> in this matter
> is proceeding. I was in bAdkoobeh (or Baku, the corruption of the Persian
name)
> a couple of years ago and have learned a lot through my interviews with the
> variety of my countrymen and women
> who for 180 years have been under the domination of the "super powers." We
> Iranians (Azaris, Kurds, Persians, etc. have a lot to say about the so-called
> "Azerbayejan Republic" and the time is getting near that we will see our
> beloved Aran re-joining
> our Sacred Motherland.
>
> A.V. (can not stand foreign mersenary provocators claiming to be "nationalist
> Azaris.")
>
>
Dario"Prester John" Moreno
"to protect Armenia, Russia and Iran; azerbaijan must be partitioned"
jjh...@osfmail.isc.rit.edu
People in Iranian as well as Armenian NG have a right to judge me and my
postings as ever they wish. I have a right to defend my country and my
motherland (Azerbaijan) as everyone else does. Since your motherland is still
not known, I would ask you not to serve like "a rabid dog" between the NGs
trying to intimidate everyone.
You have NO ROOT!
Javid
In article <7anoh9$r4b$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>,
jjh...@osfmail.isc.rit.edu
Dario Moreno <al...@my-dejanews.com> wrote:
> In article <19990220124050...@ng03.aol.com>, To All friends of
> Iran:I must have struck a nerve in Javid Huseynov.My original post on the
> threat Azerbajan(the country) and Turkey have on Iran is real.Otherwise we
> would not have received close to 20 Anti-Iranian posts from him.He is acting
> like a rabid dog.Insulting Iran the way he does.He is part of the best and
> brightest Azerbaijan(the country)has to offer.Look him up on his own web site
> and you can see what he looks like.His ideas are not the mad rantings of an
> idiot.These ideas are part of the Intellectual class of Azerbaijan(the
> country) and Turkey.They only want to leave the Iranian people the ostan of
> Fars, so they can connect with the Republic of Turkmenistan.The Republic of
> Azerbaijans wish to destroy Armenia will not stop with their linking hands
> with Turkey but will continue with a death blow to Iranian Civilization.The
> Turks are a cancer on Iran.
Link to Turkmenistan? And do what? You call 25 million Turks (40% of Iran) a
cancer? I think you are suffering from brain cancer, Dario.
> > > jjh...@osfmail.isc.rit.edu wrote
> >
> > and not with help
> > >of Persian puppets of Russia, Mullah fanatics, or Russians.
> > >
> > >Down with Mullah Government! Long live independence, freedom of expression
> > >and
> > >democracy! Down with religious fanatism and Persian fascism!
> > >
> > >Btw, did you know people calling themselves Arians have always failed. Last
> > >in a row was Hitler, do you want to join that list now?
> > >
> > >Javid
If you were quoting me on what I said above, I stand behind these words. I do
respect freedom of expression and democracy! I do respect independence and
integrity of every country (within its recognized borders) in the region. I
oppose fascism (including Aryanism) in any of its forms. If you have
objections to these, address this in proper manner, so everyone can see your
thoughts.
Javid
t c
attacks/counterattacks). Do you also feel it's stupid for both the
Armenians and the Azeris to fall for the trap Stalin set in scrambling
the territories? Both have pieces of land that should (by historic
population as well as present population) belong to the other. If the
governments could see that arranging access & allowing to be what they
are instead of what Stalin made them they could then address each others
concerns and live in peace.
jjh...@osfmail.isc.rit.edu
tctu...@earthlink.net wrote:
> I agree with most of your message (not the personal
> attacks/counterattacks). Do you also feel it's stupid for both the
> Armenians and the Azeris to fall for the trap Stalin set in scrambling
> the territories? Both have pieces of land that should (by historic
> population as well as present population) belong to the other. If the
> governments could see that arranging access & allowing to be what they
> are instead of what Stalin made them they could then address each others
> concerns and live in peace.
>
I am happy you agree with me in my ideas. Yes, the trap was set by Joseph
Stalin in creating Nagorno-Karabakh Autonomous Region inside Azerbaijan.
There was no need for defining borders inside the country. If you take a look
at maps of Azerbaijan Democratic Republic 1918-1920, Nagorno-Karabakh area as
well as Zangezur, parts of Sharur, and Qoycheh regions are included in
Azerbaijan. Stalin also gave Zangezur to Armenia, leaving no land link
between mainland Azerbaijan and it's part Nakhichevan. So he actually created
enclaves inside the countries, to always keep nations in conflict.
Azerbaijan has never declared its intentions on Zangezur after restoration of
independence in 1991. However, it was Armenia which first started the war and
occupied Karabakh and other regions of Azerbaijan. But the fight is not over,
Azerbaijan's integrity (including Karabakh) is recognized by all
international organizations (including UN), and major powers. So independence
or any kind of subordination of Karabakh to Armenia is out of question.
Karabakh is Azerbaijani territory, and its inhabitants (including Armenians)
are citizens of Azerbaijan.
t c
too nervous, with autonomy came Stalinist leaders who claimed they had
Azeri interests at heart & whipped up much hatred. Armenia blew it by
taking the bait & I have yet to figure out why the approach of
implementing semi-autonomous regions (to give emotional assurance of
security) with good cooperation never seems to have been actively
persued by either side.
I fear that soviet education left the people too vulnerable to
following bad leaders, theanswer may well only lie in outside influence
to help teach those things the soviets felt it was best to suppress.
A
#The oil blockade which started right after the earthquake made Armenia
#too nervous, with autonomy came Stalinist leaders who claimed they had
There was no "blockade." Armenia continued to receive fuel through
Georgia.
Armenia started to expell Azerbaijanis from Armenia in late 1987, and bulk
of them came in late November and December '88. Armenian SSR by that time
also adopted some resolutions on annexation of Karabakh region of
Azerbaijan to Armenia (see Armenian Parliament/Supreme Soviet resolution
from 15 June 1988), not to mention Armenian fighters infiltrating the
Azerbaijani territory. That was a case of beginning of an undeclared war
of Armenian SSR against Azerbaijan SSR. In that case, when Azerbaijan was
attacked on its territory and its people expelled and killed, had FULL
right to start any boycott and embargo of Armenia. In fact, it had full
right to stop *any* trade with *any* state at *any* time! So stop
complaining!
Especially since bulk of the fuel was traditionally given to Armenia FOR
FREE or for miserable well-below market prices (one entire wagon worth
several tonnes of oil would cost less than 5 kopeeck [1 ruble = 100
kopeeck, official exchange rate was 60 or 80 kopeeck for $1 USD]). In case
of such unfair trading, imposed by Moscow, Azerbaijan had full legal and
moral right to stop it.
Also, you adjust the time frame. A partial-embargo by Azerbaijan was
implemented only in 1989, after several Azerbaijan railroad workers and
passengers were killed en route to Naxcivan, and not in 1988, while full
embargo was kicked in only in 1991. That too is a fact.
Meanwhile, Naxcivan was indeed blockaded since at least 1989, as it had no
other means of receiving any fuel and other supplies but from Armenia,
until independence in 1991. In such case, it was only fair for Azerbaijan
to stop the ridiculous, Moscow-imposed unfair transfer of resources and
fuel to Armenia, pretty much gratis!
#Azeri interests at heart & whipped up much hatred. Armenia blew it by
#taking the bait & I have yet to figure out why the approach of
#implementing semi-autonomous regions (to give emotional assurance of
#security) with good cooperation never seems to have been actively
#persued by either side.
#
# I fear that soviet education left the people too vulnerable to
#following bad leaders, theanswer may well only lie in outside influence
#to help teach those things the soviets felt it was best to suppress.
#
#jjh...@osfmail.isc.rit.edu wrote:
#>
#> In article <36CFB242...@earthlink.net>,
#> tctu...@earthlink.net wrote:
#> > I agree with most of your message (not the personal
#> > attacks/counterattacks). Do you also feel it's stupid for both the
#> > Armenians and the Azeris to fall for the trap Stalin set in scrambling
#> > the territories? Both have pieces of land that should (by historic
#> > population as well as present population) belong to the other. If the
#> > governments could see that arranging access & allowing to be what they
#> > are instead of what Stalin made them they could then address each others
#> > concerns and live in peace.
#> >
#>
#> I am happy you agree with me in my ideas. Yes, the trap was set by Joseph
#> Stalin in creating Nagorno-Karabakh Autonomous Region inside Azerbaijan.
#> There was no need for defining borders inside the country. If you take a look
#> at maps of Azerbaijan Democratic Republic 1918-1920, Nagorno-Karabakh area as
#> well as Zangezur, parts of Sharur, and Qoycheh regions are included in
#> Azerbaijan. Stalin also gave Zangezur to Armenia, leaving no land link
#> between mainland Azerbaijan and it's part Nakhichevan. So he actually created
#> enclaves inside the countries, to always keep nations in conflict.
#>
#> Azerbaijan has never declared its intentions on Zangezur after restoration of
#> independence in 1991. However, it was Armenia which first started the war and
#> occupied Karabakh and other regions of Azerbaijan. But the fight is not over,
#> Azerbaijan's integrity (including Karabakh) is recognized by all
#> international organizations (including UN), and major powers. So independence
#> or any kind of subordination of Karabakh to Armenia is out of question.
#> Karabakh is Azerbaijani territory, and its inhabitants (including Armenians)
#> are citizens of Azerbaijan.
#>
#> Javid
#>
#> -----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==----------
#> http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own
#
#
#
t c
are obviously inferior due to you bigotry and dishonesty. Please evolve.
A
#A VERY small percentage of the need and the historical rate of use. You
#are obviously inferior due to you bigotry and dishonesty. Please evolve.
#
I would not expect any other response from you. You can't oppose the real
facts and truth, but neither can you resist the temptation of just writing
at least smth to attack. Prepare yourself, and only after that come to the
Usenet. Save us from your one-liners and "profound statements." When you
will know 10% of what I know, we can discuss. Until then, you just make
petty talk.
#A wrote:
#>
#> On Sun, 21 Feb 1999, t c wrote:
#>
#> #The oil blockade which started right after the earthquake made Armenia
#> #too nervous, with autonomy came Stalinist leaders who claimed they had
#>
#> There was no "blockade." Armenia continued to receive fuel through
#> Georgia.
#>
#> Armenia started to expell Azerbaijanis from Armenia in late 1987, and bulk
#> of them came in late November and December '88. Armenian SSR by that time
#> also adopted some resolutions on annexation of Karabakh region of
#> Azerbaijan to Armenia (see Armenian Parliament/Supreme Soviet resolution
#> from 15 June 1988), not to mention Armenian fighters infiltrating the
#> Azerbaijani territory. That was a case of beginning of an undeclared war
#> of Armenian SSR against Azerbaijan SSR. In that case, when Azerbaijan was
#> attacked on its territory and its people expelled and killed, had FULL
#> right to start any boycott and embargo of Armenia. In fact, it had full
#> right to stop *any* trade with *any* state at *any* time! So stop
#> complaining!
#>
#> Especially since bulk of the fuel was traditionally given to Armenia FOR
#> FREE or for miserable well-below market prices (one entire wagon worth
#> several tonnes of oil would cost less than 5 kopeeck [1 ruble = 100
#> kopeeck, official exchange rate was 60 or 80 kopeeck for $1 USD]). In case
#> of such unfair trading, imposed by Moscow, Azerbaijan had full legal and
#> moral right to stop it.
#>
#> Also, you adjust the time frame. A partial-embargo by Azerbaijan was
#> implemented only in 1989, after several Azerbaijan railroad workers and
#> passengers were killed en route to Naxcivan, and not in 1988, while full
#> embargo was kicked in only in 1991. That too is a fact.
#>
#> Meanwhile, Naxcivan was indeed blockaded since at least 1989, as it had no
#> other means of receiving any fuel and other supplies but from Armenia,
#> until independence in 1991. In such case, it was only fair for Azerbaijan
#> to stop the ridiculous, Moscow-imposed unfair transfer of resources and
#> fuel to Armenia, pretty much gratis!
#>
#> #Azeri interests at heart & whipped up much hatred. Armenia blew it by
#> #taking the bait & I have yet to figure out why the approach of
#> #implementing semi-autonomous regions (to give emotional assurance of
#> #security) with good cooperation never seems to have been actively
#> #persued by either side.
#> #
#> # I fear that soviet education left the people too vulnerable to
#> #following bad leaders, theanswer may well only lie in outside influence
#> #to help teach those things the soviets felt it was best to suppress.
#> #
#> #jjh...@osfmail.isc.rit.edu wrote:
#> #>
#> #> In article <36CFB242...@earthlink.net>,
#> #> tctu...@earthlink.net wrote:
#> #> > I agree with most of your message (not the personal
#> #> > attacks/counterattacks). Do you also feel it's stupid for both the
#> #> > Armenians and the Azeris to fall for the trap Stalin set in scrambling
#> #> > the territories? Both have pieces of land that should (by historic
#> #> > population as well as present population) belong to the other. If the
#> #> > governments could see that arranging access & allowing to be what they
#> #> > are instead of what Stalin made them they could then address each others
#> #> > concerns and live in peace.
#> #> >
#> #>
#> #> I am happy you agree with me in my ideas. Yes, the trap was set by Joseph
#> #> Stalin in creating Nagorno-Karabakh Autonomous Region inside Azerbaijan.
#> #> There was no need for defining borders inside the country. If you take a look
#> #> at maps of Azerbaijan Democratic Republic 1918-1920, Nagorno-Karabakh area as
#> #> well as Zangezur, parts of Sharur, and Qoycheh regions are included in
#> #> Azerbaijan. Stalin also gave Zangezur to Armenia, leaving no land link
#> #> between mainland Azerbaijan and it's part Nakhichevan. So he actually created
#> #> enclaves inside the countries, to always keep nations in conflict.
#> #>
#> #> Azerbaijan has never declared its intentions on Zangezur after restoration of
#> #> independence in 1991. However, it was Armenia which first started the war and
#> #> occupied Karabakh and other regions of Azerbaijan. But the fight is not over,
#> #> Azerbaijan's integrity (including Karabakh) is recognized by all
#> #> international organizations (including UN), and major powers. So independence
#> #> or any kind of subordination of Karabakh to Armenia is out of question.
#> #> Karabakh is Azerbaijani territory, and its inhabitants (including Armenians)
#> #> are citizens of Azerbaijan.
#> #>
#> #> Javid
#> #>
#> #> -----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==----------
#> #> http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own
#> #
#> #
#> #
#
#
#
kan...@carroll.com
>
>I would not expect any other response from you. You can't oppose the real
>facts and truth, but neither can you resist the temptation of just writing
>at least smth to attack. Prepare yourself, and only after that come to the
>Usenet. Save us from your one-liners and "profound statements." When you
>will know 10% of what I know, we can discuss. Until then, you just make
>petty talk.
>
Do me a favor toork YOU GET LOST, you are in no position to
say anything to anyone considering you are an intruder. You Filthy
begger here is a buck now get lost, if you convert the money into
Turkish Lira you will be rich <trying to hold back from laughin> with
350,680.00 you could by yourself a lot in toorkey ;-). So get out of
this group and stop posting here becuase you lie, lie, lie, and lie.
Only thing a toork is really really really good at. However with you
currencey worthless now and going down ever since you opened your
mouth how on earth do you have the face to show up here like an ass
day after day?
You make me sick
Vahram
jjh...@osfmail.isc.rit.edu
tctu...@earthlink.net wrote:
> The oil blockade which started right after the earthquake made Armenia
But the conflict was started due to Armenian claims on territory of Azerbaijan
and not vice versa. In addition, earthquake in Armenia was tragedy for whole
USSR back then, and Azerbaijan also sent an aircraft with humanitarian help
in December 1988. This aircraft was shot down, and there was only one survivor
who is still in wheel-chair.
As per blocade, it started only after independence in 1991. There could be no
blockade before, if both sides were parts of one country. And now, if Mexico
would occupy Texas and declare that Texas (and not Mexico) is fighting against
United States, what would U.S. do in this case. I believe U.S. policy against
it's opponents are implemeted using economic sanctions. You can't help your
enemy to destroy you.
> I fear that soviet education left the people too vulnerable to
> following bad leaders, theanswer may well only lie in outside influence
> to help teach those things the soviets felt it was best to suppress.
I agree. Extended autonomy you talk about above, is what Azerbaijan has
offered numerous times under OSCE negotiations. But Armenians consider only
"independence" for Karabakh puppet, and until they understand that they WILL
NOT achieve it, this will drag on.
Javid
-----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==----------
Simon Kesenci
> > Oh Fire Breathing Children of Iran what a bunch of lost soles these
> > toorks are all Day Dreamers
> >
> > See Kim Toork
> > See Kim Muhammad
>
> Just one comment, your last insult is not just against Turks but against
> Muslims in general.
Actually, the insult seemed directed to Mohammad, which is really no use,
since he is dead.
--
-Simon `the Heretic' Kesenci
Executor of the Get-A-Life Fleet.
t c
currency to make it a matter of paper quality. Any observation on
comparative printing and engraving qualities? After all, we don't want
this investigation incomplete!
t c
prevent there being a blockade, it is called a failure to restart
delivery but is the same thing. Yes the earthquake was a tragedy for the
entire region and I'm personally certain many Azeris wished to help, the
leadership is a differnt matter. Given the paranoia of all governments
in the region it's easy to manipulate another government into shooting
down a humanitarian airlift. I'm not saying this happened, just that
since both governments lie about so many things I really have no way of
figuring out which it was.
Actually neither side will get what they want, they both use
acceptable terms but the problem is when you see how they define them.
The security of the population in the autonomous regions must be assured
by groups they can trust far more than the nominal governing bodies.
This is probably achievable if both sides are willing to be honest in
negotiations regarding their economic and security concerns that drive
their positions.
If it was a matter of people like you & I sitting down and working it
out we could solve it in a short time (if we had the data),
unfortunately both governments are unstable enough to feel the need to
provide their people with a common enemy. When this happens there is
little room to both reach an agreement and save face.
t c
t c
only outcome that guarantees the problem becoming worse and longer is
military victory by either side. Decision by force of arms only creates
resistance by force of arms or terrorism, resolutions that require
cooperation eventually lead to mutual trust and understanding.
There is a native american culture (the Hopi) who pray for the crops
of the entire world. We need that understanding. There can be no
security for any nation that doesn't involve assuring the security of
its neighbors and minority groups.
jjh...@osfmail.isc.rit.edu wrote:
>
> In article <36D1EF13...@earthlink.net>,
> tctu...@earthlink.net wrote:
> > The technicality of being part of the same nation at the time didn't
> > prevent there being a blockade, it is called a failure to restart
> > delivery but is the same thing. Yes the earthquake was a tragedy for the
> > entire region and I'm personally certain many Azeris wished to help, the
> > leadership is a differnt matter. Given the paranoia of all governments
> > in the region it's easy to manipulate another government into shooting
> > down a humanitarian airlift. I'm not saying this happened, just that
> > since both governments lie about so many things I really have no way of
> > figuring out which it was.
>
> The humanitarian mission was organized by then Azerbaijan leadership. Though
> forces shooting down the aircraft are still not known. It might even be
> something organized by then-center Moscow to keep the conflict in-tact. I
> can't speculate, since the only fact I have is that aircraft was shot down.
>
> > Actually neither side will get what they want, they both use
> > acceptable terms but the problem is when you see how they define them.
> > The security of the population in the autonomous regions must be assured
> > by groups they can trust far more than the nominal governing bodies.
> > This is probably achievable if both sides are willing to be honest in
> > negotiations regarding their economic and security concerns that drive
> > their positions.
>
> I agree. There is no winner in this conflict. Even if this conflict is
> resolved by military means of one of the sides, this will not ever cure, and
> once balance jumps on opposite side, the conflict will flame again even if
> there are many decades to come. Therefore, resolution through direct
> negotiations between conflicting sides: Azerbaijan and Armenia (or
> Azerbaijanis and Armenians, however you wish to call it), is important.
>
> > If it was a matter of people like you & I sitting down and working it
> > out we could solve it in a short time (if we had the data),
> > unfortunately both governments are unstable enough to feel the need to
> > provide their people with a common enemy. When this happens there is
> > little room to both reach an agreement and save face.
>
> I believe the government of LTP in Armenia was closest to resolution of the
> conflict by peaceful means. But the confidence level in Armenia was not
> sufficient to settle the problem, and that's why LTP's peace policy failed.
> When there are extreme sides in power in conflicting countries, the ways of
> peaceful resolution are not very bright. One more deficiency in both Armenia
> and Azerbaijan is that most of internal and external politics in these
> countries is based on approach to Karabakh problem. Azerbaijan seems to
> reverse from this approach a little, but early last year's events in Armenia
> showed that Karabakh problem is still the major driver of Armenian foreign
> and internal policy.
jjh...@osfmail.isc.rit.edu
tom...@earthlink.net wrote:
> jjh...@osfmail.isc.rit.edu wrote:
>
> > > Oh Fire Breathing Children of Iran what a bunch of lost soles these
> > > toorks are all Day Dreamers
> > >
> > > See Kim Toork
> > > See Kim Muhammad
> >
> > Just one comment, your last insult is not just against Turks but against
> > Muslims in general.
>
> Actually, the insult seemed directed to Mohammad, which is really no use,
> since he is dead.
I guess you are just proving your nickname: "Heretic". Mohammad is a
messenger-prophet, as Jesus is. Muslims could never say the same about Jesus,
because they consider him as one of the prophets.
Javid
--
> -Simon `the Heretic' Kesenci
> Executor of the Get-A-Life Fleet.
jjh...@osfmail.isc.rit.edu
Javid
-----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==----------
jjh...@osfmail.isc.rit.edu
tctu...@earthlink.net wrote:
> I would even agree if you strengthened one of your statements to the
> only outcome that guarantees the problem becoming worse and longer is
> military victory by either side. Decision by force of arms only creates
> resistance by force of arms or terrorism, resolutions that require
> cooperation eventually lead to mutual trust and understanding.
I agree. But unfortunately, people of Caucasus are far from this
understanding. The most important thing we should understand, is that
problems between us should be solved by ourselves, and not by any of the
surrounding states: Russia, Iran, or Turkey. I believe you would agree that
current arms race by Armenia dangerously heated the situtation in the region,
as a result Georgia and Azerbaijan are leaving CIS common defense treaty,
which is turning into a Russian harassment weapon rather than security
guarantee. I still don't understand what Russians are trying to secure. I
would rather spend the money they waste for producing weapons on reviving
their destroyed economy.
We should understand that our common future is not with Russia or any other
regional country, but with Europe.
> There is a native american culture (the Hopi) who pray for the crops
> of the entire world. We need that understanding. There can be no
> security for any nation that doesn't involve assuring the security of
> its neighbors and minority groups.
The rights of minority groups should certainly be assured within each and
every society, and they were, in fact, assured in Azerbaijan of Soviet times
and they are assured today. There are thousands of Russians, Jews, Georgians,
Kurds and other minorities in Azerbaijan. All of them can study in their
language, practice their ethnic/religious rights in media, television, radio
and so on. But the term "within the country" should also have importance. If
we will divide everyone and everything by ethnic lines, the result will be
what we have in Karabakh and Abkhazia - chaos and anarchy.
Simon Kesenci
> I guess you are just proving your nickname: "Heretic". Mohammad is a
> messenger-prophet, as Jesus is. Muslims could never say the same about Jesus,
> because they consider him as one of the prophets.
I guess you're just proving that you can't distinguish between people because I
am not the one who insulted Mohammad. And why can't a muslim speak insults about
Jesus? Or Mohammad for that matter? Just because they were messengers doesn't
mean that everyone who follows their teachings agrees with everything they say
and do. So a Christian can say "Fuck Jesus" and still be a Christian.
I am a Deist, and I can say, Fuck God!!!
jjh...@osfmail.isc.rit.edu
tom...@earthlink.net wrote:
> I guess you're just proving that you can't distinguish between people because
> I am not the one who insulted Mohammad. And why can't a muslim speak insults
> about Jesus? Or Mohammad for that matter? Just because they were messengers
> doesn't mean that everyone who follows their teachings agrees with everything
> they say and do. So a Christian can say "Fuck Jesus" and still be a
> Christian.
I know you were not the one who insulted Mohammad, I replied only to your
reply.
> I am a Deist, and I can say, Fuck God!!!
It's your own business. I am not a worshipper, but I trust in God.
> -Simon `the Heretic' Kesenci
> Executor of the Get-A-Life Fleet.
Javid
t c
Russia is THE cause of escalation of tension I would disagree, if you're
asking if it's A cause I would agree.
The ever increasing taking of sides by Turkey created a very real
threat for Armenia, on the other hand the fact that Armenia was so
clearly winning (militarily) was a very real threat to the Azeris. I
don't expect anyone to accept an outcome that would destroy them, I just
wish that all sides would see that not finding a peaceful solution does
destroy them.
Armenia has much less room to comprimise being surrounded by states
that have declared themselves hostile than would be the case with a
secure trade corridor. I can also see why Russian basing in Armenia is
seen as a threat to neighboring states, although I think that now the
threat is only one of counterattack.
Turkey is determined to be the regional superpower no matter how many
lives it costs. This makes me glad that the Iranian government has the
same goal, at least the smaller neighbors aren't just there for the
taking. If I had my way neither would be trying to control the region,
but just maybe the standoff can work out as well as the cold war (no big
war with both sides finally deciding they can't afford it).
A
#> If you are asking if I think the Armenians arming and getting help from
#> Russia is THE cause of escalation of tension I would disagree, if you're
#> asking if it's A cause I would agree.
#
#Russia is THE cause of escalation, all these years conflict has been
#escalated by Russia and its predecessor Soviet government as a tool to
#control both republics. And shot of the humanitarian plane mentioned before
#is an example of such escalation, because I doubt it's been done by
#Armenians.
I posted long ago some contemporary articles from Soviet press describing
the shoting down of Azerbaijani airplane near Erevan. It should be noted
that Azerbaijan, despite expelled refugees from Armenia by then numbering
in upper 70,000's according to official Soviet statistics, as well as
Gugark, Sumgait and other provocations and pogroms, was among the first,
if not the first, to send humanitarian aid to Armenia. I remember that all
the workers of Azerbaijan declared that their wages worth one or two days
would be sent to the casualties of the earthquake, and as always, free
fuel and other supplies were provided. Several hundred Armenians were
urgently taken to Azerbaijani hospitals, most notably to Kelbajar region.
Too bad Armenians don't know or don't remember that.
Also, on November 20 (?), 1991, the helicopter with half of Azerbaijan's
government was shut down in Karabakh. First and most natural version was
that Armenians did it, but a closer look revealed that there were three
helicopters, with the one with all the officials flying in the middle, the
missile used was too sophisticated, and generally, only Russians knew and
set it up so that all the officials would cram into one helicopter. Among
those killed were Russians, as well as other non-Azerbaijanis. Apparently,
someone feared Azerbaijani gov. commission would solve all the problems
and restore peace. So just killed all the experienced gov. officials, and
showed then President Mutalibov that he just will not be able to solve
anything w/o "brotherly help." Khojaly massacre followed shortly, just
before both Armenia and Azerbaijan were admitted to the UN.
#No wonder, both Armenians and Azerbaijanis understand that the solution to
#Karabakh problem is in Russian hands. Though there is minor difference,
#Azerbaijanis don't want that key to be in Russian hands. I am sure, if
#Azerbaijan agreed to Russian military presence on its land, Karabakh problem
#would be resolved immediately. But why should we, people of Caucasus, agree to
#anyone's military presence. Can't we live together by ourselves.
#
#Those keys to resolution should be in hands of Armenians and Azerbaijanis, not
#Turks, Russians, and especially Iranians.
#
#> The ever increasing taking of sides by Turkey created a very real
#> threat for Armenia, on the other hand the fact that Armenia was so
#> clearly winning (militarily) was a very real threat to the Azeris. I
#> don't expect anyone to accept an outcome that would destroy them, I just
#> wish that all sides would see that not finding a peaceful solution does
#> destroy them.
#
#Turkey took the side of Azerbaijan, as Russia did take that of Armenia. Except
#unlike Turkey, Russia always did it undercover. And billion dollar illegal
#weapons supply to Armenia is a proof of that.
And that number is not final. Actually, General Rokhlin revealed that it
was $2 billion USD, taking into account all the transportation and other
expenses, but media consistently quotes only 1 billion.
#> Armenia has much less room to comprimise being surrounded by states
#> that have declared themselves hostile than would be the case with a
#> secure trade corridor. I can also see why Russian basing in Armenia is
#> seen as a threat to neighboring states, although I think that now the
#> threat is only one of counterattack.
#
#It does not give Armenia the right to occupy the land of neighboring country.
#Ability to counterattack should be developed within your own country. There is
#a clear difference between preemptive attack and occupation of neighboring
#country. If Armenia was not warring with Azerbaijan, we would not object to
#Russia-Armenia bilateral military partnership, actually, there would be none
#if we weren't warring with each other.
#
#> Turkey is determined to be the regional superpower no matter how many
#> lives it costs. This makes me glad that the Iranian government has the
#> same goal, at least the smaller neighbors aren't just there for the
#> taking. If I had my way neither would be trying to control the region,
#> but just maybe the standoff can work out as well as the cold war (no big
#> war with both sides finally deciding they can't afford it).
#
#Same can be said about Russia. Except Russia tries to reestablish itself as a
#regional superpower in real way by sacrificing Armenian, Azeri, Georgian,
#Abkhazian, and other human lives. So far there was no direct involvement by
#Turkey in Caucasus conflicts. If there was any, the cards would definitely be
#not on Armenian side, and I don't support it either. But this interference is
#more meaningful now, after Russian-Armenian alliance became too obvious.
#
#I think for any peace to be reached, complete demilitarization of Caucasus is
#the best. Total withdrawal of Russian bases from the region, some kind of
#agreement of no-Russian, no-Turkish interference guaranteed perhaps by NATO
#or other European structures. If such a miracle would happen, then there is
#no need for armies in any of the regional countries, and more attention can
#be given to improving economies.
#
#Javid
jjh...@osfmail.isc.rit.edu
> If you are asking if I think the Armenians arming and getting help from
Russia is THE cause of escalation, all these years conflict has been
escalated by Russia and its predecessor Soviet government as a tool to
control both republics. And shot of the humanitarian plane mentioned before
is an example of such escalation, because I doubt it's been done by
Armenians.
No wonder, both Armenians and Azerbaijanis understand that the solution to
Karabakh problem is in Russian hands. Though there is minor difference,
Azerbaijanis don't want that key to be in Russian hands. I am sure, if
Azerbaijan agreed to Russian military presence on its land, Karabakh problem
would be resolved immediately. But why should we, people of Caucasus, agree to
anyone's military presence. Can't we live together by ourselves.
Those keys to resolution should be in hands of Armenians and Azerbaijanis, not
Turks, Russians, and especially Iranians.
> The ever increasing taking of sides by Turkey created a very real
> threat for Armenia, on the other hand the fact that Armenia was so
> clearly winning (militarily) was a very real threat to the Azeris. I
> don't expect anyone to accept an outcome that would destroy them, I just
> wish that all sides would see that not finding a peaceful solution does
> destroy them.
Turkey took the side of Azerbaijan, as Russia did take that of Armenia. Except
unlike Turkey, Russia always did it undercover. And billion dollar illegal
weapons supply to Armenia is a proof of that.
> Armenia has much less room to comprimise being surrounded by states
> that have declared themselves hostile than would be the case with a
> secure trade corridor. I can also see why Russian basing in Armenia is
> seen as a threat to neighboring states, although I think that now the
> threat is only one of counterattack.
It does not give Armenia the right to occupy the land of neighboring country.
Ability to counterattack should be developed within your own country. There is
a clear difference between preemptive attack and occupation of neighboring
country. If Armenia was not warring with Azerbaijan, we would not object to
Russia-Armenia bilateral military partnership, actually, there would be none
if we weren't warring with each other.
> Turkey is determined to be the regional superpower no matter how many
> lives it costs. This makes me glad that the Iranian government has the
> same goal, at least the smaller neighbors aren't just there for the
> taking. If I had my way neither would be trying to control the region,
> but just maybe the standoff can work out as well as the cold war (no big
> war with both sides finally deciding they can't afford it).
Same can be said about Russia. Except Russia tries to reestablish itself as a
regional superpower in real way by sacrificing Armenian, Azeri, Georgian,
Abkhazian, and other human lives. So far there was no direct involvement by
Turkey in Caucasus conflicts. If there was any, the cards would definitely be
not on Armenian side, and I don't support it either. But this interference is
more meaningful now, after Russian-Armenian alliance became too obvious.
I think for any peace to be reached, complete demilitarization of Caucasus is
the best. Total withdrawal of Russian bases from the region, some kind of
agreement of no-Russian, no-Turkish interference guaranteed perhaps by NATO
or other European structures. If such a miracle would happen, then there is
no need for armies in any of the regional countries, and more attention can
be given to improving economies.
t c
the region, there are 2 major problems that I see. First, the issue of
convincing the leaders it's good to be involved (to work well it would
have to be very long term so the peoples could relearn to trust each
other). Second,there would have to be some explanation/ excuse for the
Russians to give their people to save face.
I tend to think of it as Soviets causing the problem, not Russia. They
still have much power in Russia but it is diminishing. This is another
very complex problem.
Russia is still a global superpower whether we like it or not, at
least militarily.
t c
right to occupy Azeri territory but there is a right (given current
circumstances) to seek to assure the security of the people in NK and
the corridor to make this possible. I personally don't think it had to
end up that way, I do think it is valid at this point. This is obviously
an aspect where I agree NATO would be far better for the role.
jjh...@osfmail.isc.rit.edu
tctu...@earthlink.net wrote:
> I've thought for some time NATO would be a very good peacekeeper for
> the region, there are 2 major problems that I see. First, the issue of
> convincing the leaders it's good to be involved (to work well it would
> have to be very long term so the peoples could relearn to trust each
> other). Second,there would have to be some explanation/ excuse for the
> Russians to give their people to save face.
I agree. There is a need to convince both sides in advantages on NATO
peacekeeping mission. Further division of Caucasus by geopolitical lines is
dangerous for all of us. Up to date only Armenia, for some logical reasons,
is boosting relationships with Russia. But seeing NATO as Armenian enemy is
wrong just because Turkey is it's member, and Azerbaijan and Georgia are in
the center of Western economic interests.
> I tend to think of it as Soviets causing the problem, not Russia. They
> still have much power in Russia but it is diminishing. This is another
> very complex problem.
Soviet Union ceased to exist in 1991. Right now, the Russia stirs and
controls all conflicts in Caucasus, including Abkhazia and Karabakh. Except
comparing to Soviet times, Russian policy is more extreme now and tends
towards more Russian imperialistic approach, which wasn't so in Soviet Union.
That's why it caused problems not only in Transcaucasia but also in Chechnya
and other regions of Russia. Pan-Russianism is as dangerous as Pan-Turkism
and Pan-Iranism.
Armenians should understand that Russia poses the same threat to Azerbaijan
and Georgia as Turkey does virtually to Armenia. Except Russian interference
is more direct and open than Turkish. That's why to prevent Turkish
interference, Russian interference should be stopped as well.
> Russia is still a global superpower whether we like it or not, at
> least militarily.
Yes, in fact it is! But we, people of Caucasus, have to take the advantage of
developing geopolitical vacuum, and create a Caucasus region neutral from
policies of neighboring states. And this can only be enforced by NATO and
European structures.
jjh...@osfmail.isc.rit.edu
tctu...@earthlink.net wrote:
> Sorry, I forgot to reply to one comment. I agree that Armenia has no
> right to occupy Azeri territory but there is a right (given current
> circumstances) to seek to assure the security of the people in NK and
> the corridor to make this possible. I personally don't think it had to
> end up that way, I do think it is valid at this point. This is obviously
> an aspect where I agree NATO would be far better for the role.
>
I agree with this as well. But such a corridor to NK should be protected by
independent forces, such as NATO (not Russia or Armenia). I think any
peacekeeping mission in the region should exclude forces of three neighboring
countries. One of them, Iran, is definitely out. As per Russia and Turkey,
which create counter balance (Armenia - Azerbaijan), their involvement should
be excluded as well. Further balance games in the region will result only in
casualties among people of Caucasus. Let them practice their balances within
their borders. Actually, there is not much blame Turkey in this case since
it's not involved militarily YET, the attention should be given more to
Russian military games in the region, which can be stopped only by NATO and
West.
Dario Moreno
In article <7aiai5$h6j$1...@plutonium.btinternet.com>,
"Turcoman" <Turc...@btinternet.com> wrote:
> Me thinks your just a teeeensy weeensy bit jealous.
Polite warning:
"Satan said, I have a host which I have called Jerks and settled in the East.
If any people shall arouse my wrath, I shall give them unto the power of
this host."
(Saying attributed to Cukurovali, repeated in the encyclopedic
dictionary of Erenkoy. Cyprus 1974 AD).
Read your comic books and be amused, be very amused.
Oh,race of Jerks! Bastards of yurt felt and sheep dung!
Destroyers of a thousand homelands not belonging to you!
Thieves of a thousand crowns that will be retrieved from you!
Turania...Turania...Heed the sirens call! Go East Young Turks Go East.
"where the Turkish hoof trods,no grass grows"-Victor Hugo
Dario Moreno"Ah if I could only be alive and sing my sweet songs of
Izmir.Instead of being thrown out of the third floor of a Turkish police
station in Izmir"
"to protect Armenia, Russia and Iran; turkiye will be destroyed"
> >-----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==----------
> >http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own
>
>
Dario"Prester John" Moreno
"to protect Armenia, Russia and Iran azerbaijan will be destroyed"
Turcoman
It took, what... at least three weeks
for you to think up your response
to my post.
What you seem to overlook is
the essence of the quotation
you so eagerly corrupted.
The message is;
Again and again
you and your ilk
will feel the wrath
of the Turk
throughout your
pitiful existences.
The Turk will return to you
the fear of God.
He will teach you
to humble yourselves,
before God.
And will remind you
that your degeneration
to heathenism,
sodomy and deceit,
will not go unpunished.
And the punisher
will be the Turk,
the sword of God,
as he has been
for ten millennia.
Read you history
and be afraid
be very afraid.
Dario Moreno wrote in message
<7b7n9n$fcf$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>...