For David Von Pein

[Ben Holmes]

Prove that I lied... prove that you ARE willing to debate
knowledgeable critics in open forum. Prove that Chrissy Strimbass
didn't lie.

What time did JFK's body arrive at Bethesda?

Cite for your answer.

Your refusal to answer will merely prove I told the truth, and Chrissy
Strimbass lied.

[David Von Pein]

On Wednesday, April 13, 2022 at 12:50:24 PM UTC-4, Ben Holmes wrote:
> What time did JFK's body arrive at Bethesda? Cite for your answer.

Quoting Dr. Humes (WC Testimony @ 2 H 349): "The President's body was received at 25 minutes before 8."

Quoting Dr. Boswell (ARRB Testimony): "I think the body arrived around 8:00."

And here's a "Common Sense Break" from 2013:

"[David] Lifton doesn't think Humes and Boswell altered the wounds, which means they must have been altered between 6:00 PM and 6:35 PM. And when allowing travel time from an airport in Washington to Bethesda, then how much actual "body altering" time was available to the covert surgeons on 11/22/63? Tell us, David, WHEN was the altering of the President's body done via your super-tight (and impossible) timeline? When? And where? In the hearse on the way to Bethesda perhaps?

You don't want to answer those perfectly logical and reasonable "timeline" questions--mainly because you cannot answer them in a reasonable manner. So you'll just ignore the impossibly tight timeline during which you say all of this stuff was done to President Kennedy's body.

Any casket that arrived at Bethesda Naval Hospital at 6:35 PM EST quite obviously DID NOT and COULD NOT have contained the body of John F. Kennedy. Any such 6:35 casket entry must have been associated with some other case entirely. Especially if it involved a plain "shipping casket".

Anyone with any common sense at all would be able to figure this out. But David Lifton has, instead, decided to believe in the most ridiculous scenario imaginable--one that has JFK's body being deliberately placed by conspirators into a casket that doesn't even begin to resemble the casket that the plotters took JFK out of. This gives new meaning to the term "Brain Dead JFK Conspirators". And yet an obviously intelligent man named David S. Lifton swallows this crap whole. Remarkable." -- DVP; June 20, 2013

Lots more at the link below (which, of course, is material that Benjamin Holmes will refuse to accept as legitimate debate simply because I wrote it several years ago):

http://jfk-archives.blogspot.com/2013/07/david-von-pein-vs-david-lifton.html#Body-Arrival-Times

[Bud]

On Wednesday, April 13, 2022 at 12:50:24 PM UTC-4, Ben Holmes wrote:

> Prove that I lied... prove that you ARE willing to debate
> knowledgeable critics in open forum. Prove that Chrissy Strimbass
> didn't lie.
>
> What time did JFK's body arrive at Bethesda?
>
> Cite for your answer.

So you can ignore the cites?

Why do you ask for information you intend to ignore anyway?

[Ben Holmes]

On Wed, 13 Apr 2022 12:16:18 -0700 (PDT), David Von Pein
<davev...@aol.com> wrote:

>On Wednesday, April 13, 2022 at 12:50:24 PM UTC-4, Ben Holmes wrote:
>> What time did JFK's body arrive at Bethesda? Cite for your answer.
>
>Quoting Dr. Humes (WC Testimony @ 2 H 349): "The President's body was received at 25 minutes before 8."
>
>Quoting Dr. Boswell (ARRB Testimony): "I think the body arrived around 8:00."

Boswell cannot *POSSIBLY* be correct... and you know this.

Humes has already been cited.

Amusingly, you failed quite completely to list *ALL* the relevant
evidence for the time that JFK arrived at Bethesda.

Provably a liar, aren't you Davey....

[Bud]

On Wednesday, April 13, 2022 at 4:32:42 PM UTC-4, Ben Holmes wrote:
> On Wed, 13 Apr 2022 12:16:18 -0700 (PDT), David Von Pein
> <davev...@aol.com> wrote:
>
> >On Wednesday, April 13, 2022 at 12:50:24 PM UTC-4, Ben Holmes wrote:
> >> What time did JFK's body arrive at Bethesda? Cite for your answer.
> >
> >Quoting Dr. Humes (WC Testimony @ 2 H 349): "The President's body was received at 25 minutes before 8."
> >
> >Quoting Dr. Boswell (ARRB Testimony): "I think the body arrived around 8:00."
> Boswell cannot *POSSIBLY* be correct...

Empty claim.

[David Von Pein]

On Wednesday, April 13, 2022 at 4:32:42 PM UTC-4, Ben Holmes wrote:
> On Wed, 13 Apr 2022 12:16:18 -0700 (PDT), David Von Pein
> <davev...@aol.com> wrote:
>
> >On Wednesday, April 13, 2022 at 12:50:24 PM UTC-4, Ben Holmes wrote:
> >> What time did JFK's body arrive at Bethesda? Cite for your answer.
> >
> >Quoting Dr. Humes (WC Testimony @ 2 H 349): "The President's body was received at 25 minutes before 8."
> >
> >Quoting Dr. Boswell (ARRB Testimony): "I think the body arrived around 8:00."
> Boswell cannot *POSSIBLY* be correct... and you know this.

But Boswell's "around 8:00" certainly doesn't help Lifton's theory of the body arriving as early as 6:35. Boswell was obviously just providing a rough estimate. And his estimate is certainly much closer to Humes' 7:35 than it is to 6:35.

> Humes has already been cited.
>
> Amusingly, you failed quite completely to list *ALL* the relevant
> evidence for the time that JFK arrived at Bethesda.
>

Let me guess --- you're the only one who gets to decide what's "relevant" and what isn't?

> Provably a liar, aren't you Davey....

Provably a prick, aren't you Benny?

[Bud]

That is the crooked game he is desperately trying to set up.

[Ben Holmes]

On Wed, 13 Apr 2022 13:55:44 -0700 (PDT), David Von Pein

<davev...@aol.com> wrote:

>On Wednesday, April 13, 2022 at 4:32:42 PM UTC-4, Ben Holmes wrote:
>> On Wed, 13 Apr 2022 12:16:18 -0700 (PDT), David Von Pein
>> <davev...@aol.com> wrote:
>>
>> >On Wednesday, April 13, 2022 at 12:50:24 PM UTC-4, Ben Holmes wrote:
>> >> What time did JFK's body arrive at Bethesda? Cite for your answer.
>> >
>> >Quoting Dr. Humes (WC Testimony @ 2 H 349): "The President's body was received at 25 minutes before 8."
>> >
>> >Quoting Dr. Boswell (ARRB Testimony): "I think the body arrived around 8:00."
>> Boswell cannot *POSSIBLY* be correct... and you know this.
>

>But Boswell's ...

Tut tut tut.

Was he right?

Or was he wrong?

>> Humes has already been cited.
>>
>> Amusingly, you failed quite completely to list *ALL* the relevant
>> evidence for the time that JFK arrived at Bethesda.
>

>Let me guess...

That's what you're apparently doing right now...

>> Provably a liar, aren't you Davey....
>
>Provably a prick, aren't you Benny?

Sorry, assertions without evidence and begged questions don’t
establish anything. Huckster's ashamed of you. However, it's a
provable FACT that you've not listed all evidence bearing on the time
of JFK's arrival.

[Bud]

On Wednesday, April 13, 2022 at 5:07:54 PM UTC-4, Ben Holmes wrote:
> On Wed, 13 Apr 2022 13:55:44 -0700 (PDT), David Von Pein
> <davev...@aol.com> wrote:
>
> >On Wednesday, April 13, 2022 at 4:32:42 PM UTC-4, Ben Holmes wrote:
> >> On Wed, 13 Apr 2022 12:16:18 -0700 (PDT), David Von Pein
> >> <davev...@aol.com> wrote:
> >>
> >> >On Wednesday, April 13, 2022 at 12:50:24 PM UTC-4, Ben Holmes wrote:
> >> >> What time did JFK's body arrive at Bethesda? Cite for your answer.
> >> >
> >> >Quoting Dr. Humes (WC Testimony @ 2 H 349): "The President's body was received at 25 minutes before 8."
> >> >
> >> >Quoting Dr. Boswell (ARRB Testimony): "I think the body arrived around 8:00."
> >> Boswell cannot *POSSIBLY* be correct... and you know this.
> >
> >But Boswell's ...
>
> Tut tut tut.
>
> Was he right?
>
> Or was he wrong?

Tut, tut, tut.

Is it in evidence? Why do you hate the evidence in this case? Is it because it doesn`t support your faith?

> >> Humes has already been cited.
> >>
> >> Amusingly, you failed quite completely to list *ALL* the relevant
> >> evidence for the time that JFK arrived at Bethesda.
> >
> >Let me guess...
>
> That's what you're apparently doing right now...
> >> Provably a liar, aren't you Davey....
> >
> >Provably a prick, aren't you Benny?
> Sorry, assertions without evidence

Why lie, he provided evidence. You haven`t provided anything.

> and begged questions don’t
> establish anything. Huckster's ashamed of you. However, it's a
> provable FACT that you've not listed all evidence bearing on the time
> of JFK's arrival.

He has produced evidence. You haven`t.

[Christopher Strimbu]

You're a joke Ben. And a bad one at that.

For the record, Prick Yellowpants, I did answer you stupid question, here:
https://groups.google.com/g/alt.conspiracy.jfk/c/pK9JOFHVwjw/m/1j1LRo_KAQAJ

But King Yellowpants gets to decide what's faked or not.

[Ben Holmes]

On Wed, 13 Apr 2022 17:40:38 -0700 (PDT), Christopher Strimbu
<christoph...@yahoo.com> wrote:

>On Wednesday, April 13, 2022 at 5:07:54 PM UTC-4, Ben Holmes wrote:
>> On Wed, 13 Apr 2022 13:55:44 -0700 (PDT), David Von Pein
>> <davev...@aol.com> wrote:
>>
>>>On Wednesday, April 13, 2022 at 4:32:42 PM UTC-4, Ben Holmes wrote:
>>>> On Wed, 13 Apr 2022 12:16:18 -0700 (PDT), David Von Pein
>>>> <davev...@aol.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>On Wednesday, April 13, 2022 at 12:50:24 PM UTC-4, Ben Holmes wrote:
>>>>>> What time did JFK's body arrive at Bethesda? Cite for your answer.
>>>>>
>>>>>Quoting Dr. Humes (WC Testimony @ 2 H 349): "The President's body was received at 25 minutes before 8."
>>>>>
>>>>>Quoting Dr. Boswell (ARRB Testimony): "I think the body arrived around 8:00."
>>>> Boswell cannot *POSSIBLY* be correct... and you know this.
>>>
>>>But Boswell's ...
>>
>> Tut tut tut.
>>
>> Was he right?

Notice folks, that Davy Von Peiny has already run away.

>> Or was he wrong?
>>>> Humes has already been cited.
>>>>
>>>> Amusingly, you failed quite completely to list *ALL* the relevant
>>>> evidence for the time that JFK arrived at Bethesda.
>>>
>>>Let me guess...
>>
>> That's what you're apparently doing right now...
>>>> Provably a liar, aren't you Davey....
>>>
>>>Provably a prick, aren't you Benny?
>> Sorry, assertions without evidence and begged questions don’t
>> establish anything. Huckster's ashamed of you. However, it's a
>> provable FACT that you've not listed all evidence bearing on the time
>> of JFK's arrival.
>
>You're a joke Ben. And a bad one at that.

Chrissy thinks it's a joke when I point out facts he has no refutation
for.

>https://groups.google.com/g/alt.conspiracy.jfk/c/pK9JOFHVwjw/m/1j1LRo_KAQAJ

Notice folks, that Chrissy's proud of her lie.

[Ben Holmes]

We'll see no more of Davey... he's crying in his safe place.

He simply REFUSES to debate knowledgeable critics in uncensored
arenas...

[Bud]

You couldn`t discuss ideas honestly to save your life.

[David Healy]

Timmy, Timmy, Timmy what happen to your accent, Mate? Move to the otherside of Ithaca? LMFAO!

[David Healy]

who needs ideas when you have Mark Lane's RTJ and case evidence... you dolt's cave at the slightest mention of Lane and his "ideas." And frankly, I doubt you've had an original idea since your freshman year at Marquette... Carry on Padre!

[Bud]

On Thursday, April 14, 2022 at 2:08:40 PM UTC-4, David Healy wrote:
> On Wednesday, April 13, 2022 at 6:17:38 PM UTC-7, Bud wrote:
> > On Wednesday, April 13, 2022 at 9:12:16 PM UTC-4, Ben Holmes wrote:
> > > On Wed, 13 Apr 2022 13:32:42 -0700, Ben Holmes
> > > <Ad...@ConspiracyJFKForum.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > >On Wed, 13 Apr 2022 12:16:18 -0700 (PDT), David Von Pein
> > > ><davev...@aol.com> wrote:
> > > >
> > > >>On Wednesday, April 13, 2022 at 12:50:24 PM UTC-4, Ben Holmes wrote:
> > > >>> What time did JFK's body arrive at Bethesda? Cite for your answer.
> > > >>
> > > >>Quoting Dr. Humes (WC Testimony @ 2 H 349): "The President's body was received at 25 minutes before 8."
> > > >>
> > > >>Quoting Dr. Boswell (ARRB Testimony): "I think the body arrived around 8:00."
> > > >
> > > >Boswell cannot *POSSIBLY* be correct... and you know this.
> > > >
> > > >Humes has already been cited.
> > > >
> > > >Amusingly, you failed quite completely to list *ALL* the relevant
> > > >evidence for the time that JFK arrived at Bethesda.
> > > >
> > > >Provably a liar, aren't you Davey....
> > > We'll see no more of Davey... he's crying in his safe place.
> > >
> > > He simply REFUSES to debate knowledgeable critics in uncensored
> > > arenas...
> > You couldn`t discuss ideas honestly to save your life.
> who needs ideas when you have Mark Lane's RTJ and case evidence...

Which has taken you all the way to dead in the water.

[Ben Holmes]

On Wed, 13 Apr 2022 14:12:15 -0700 (PDT), Bud <sirs...@fast.net>

wrote:

>On Wednesday, April 13, 2022 at 5:07:54 PM UTC-4, Ben Holmes wrote:
>> On Wed, 13 Apr 2022 13:55:44 -0700 (PDT), David Von Pein
>> <davev...@aol.com> wrote:
>>
>>>On Wednesday, April 13, 2022 at 4:32:42 PM UTC-4, Ben Holmes wrote:
>>>> On Wed, 13 Apr 2022 12:16:18 -0700 (PDT), David Von Pein
>>>> <davev...@aol.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>On Wednesday, April 13, 2022 at 12:50:24 PM UTC-4, Ben Holmes wrote:
>>>>>> What time did JFK's body arrive at Bethesda? Cite for your answer.
>>>>>
>>>>>Quoting Dr. Humes (WC Testimony @ 2 H 349): "The President's body was received at 25 minutes before 8."
>>>>>
>>>>>Quoting Dr. Boswell (ARRB Testimony): "I think the body arrived around 8:00."
>>>> Boswell cannot *POSSIBLY* be correct... and you know this.
>>>
>>>But Boswell's ...
>>
>> Tut tut tut.
>>
>> Was he right?
>>
>> Or was he wrong?

LFD.

>>>> Humes has already been cited.
>>>>
>>>> Amusingly, you failed quite completely to list *ALL* the relevant
>>>> evidence for the time that JFK arrived at Bethesda.
>>>
>>>Let me guess...
>>
>> That's what you're apparently doing right now...
>>>> Provably a liar, aren't you Davey....
>>>
>>>Provably a prick, aren't you Benny?
>> Sorry, assertions without evidence

LFD.

>> and begged questions don’t
>> establish anything. Huckster's ashamed of you. However, it's a
>> provable FACT that you've not listed all evidence bearing on the time
>> of JFK's arrival.

LFD.

[Ben Holmes]

On Wed, 13 Apr 2022 13:51:27 -0700 (PDT), Bud <sirs...@fast.net>

wrote:

>On Wednesday, April 13, 2022 at 4:32:42 PM UTC-4, Ben Holmes wrote:
>> On Wed, 13 Apr 2022 12:16:18 -0700 (PDT), David Von Pein
>> <davev...@aol.com> wrote:
>>
>>>On Wednesday, April 13, 2022 at 12:50:24 PM UTC-4, Ben Holmes wrote:
>>>> What time did JFK's body arrive at Bethesda? Cite for your answer.
>>>
>>>Quoting Dr. Humes (WC Testimony @ 2 H 349): "The President's body was received at 25 minutes before 8."
>>>
>>>Quoting Dr. Boswell (ARRB Testimony): "I think the body arrived around 8:00."
>>
>> Boswell cannot *POSSIBLY* be correct...
>
> Empty claim.

ROTFMAO!!!

This kook actually believes JFK arrived at 8:00!!!

Of course, it's not an "empty claim," it's merely common sense that if
you have two contradictory statements, at *least* one of them is
wrong.

But you go ahead... cite the corroborating evidence that Boswell is
right.

You won't, of course... you're simply lying.

[Ben Holmes]

On Wed, 13 Apr 2022 18:17:37 -0700 (PDT), Bud <sirs...@fast.net>

wrote:

>On Wednesday, April 13, 2022 at 9:12:16 PM UTC-4, Ben Holmes wrote:
>> On Wed, 13 Apr 2022 13:32:42 -0700, Ben Holmes
>> <Ad...@ConspiracyJFKForum.com> wrote:
>>
>>>On Wed, 13 Apr 2022 12:16:18 -0700 (PDT), David Von Pein
>>><davev...@aol.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>>On Wednesday, April 13, 2022 at 12:50:24 PM UTC-4, Ben Holmes wrote:
>>>>> What time did JFK's body arrive at Bethesda? Cite for your answer.
>>>>
>>>>Quoting Dr. Humes (WC Testimony @ 2 H 349): "The President's body was received at 25 minutes before 8."
>>>>
>>>>Quoting Dr. Boswell (ARRB Testimony): "I think the body arrived around 8:00."
>>>
>>>Boswell cannot *POSSIBLY* be correct... and you know this.
>>>
>>>Humes has already been cited.
>>>
>>>Amusingly, you failed quite completely to list *ALL* the relevant
>>>evidence for the time that JFK arrived at Bethesda.
>>>
>>>Provably a liar, aren't you Davey....
>> We'll see no more of Davey... he's crying in his safe place.
>>
>> He simply REFUSES to debate knowledgeable critics in uncensored
>> arenas...
>
> You couldn`t discuss ideas honestly to save your life.

Notice folks, who's using logical fallacies, and who's stating
evidence & facts...

[Ben Holmes]

On Wed, 13 Apr 2022 12:21:14 -0700 (PDT), Bud <sirs...@fast.net>
wrote:

>On Wednesday, April 13, 2022 at 12:50:24 PM UTC-4, Ben Holmes wrote:
>> Prove that I lied... prove that you ARE willing to debate
>> knowledgeable critics in open forum. Prove that Chrissy Strimbass
>> didn't lie.
>>
>> What time did JFK's body arrive at Bethesda?
>>
>> Cite for your answer.

LFD.

[Ben Holmes]

On Wed, 13 Apr 2022 13:57:21 -0700 (PDT), Bud <sirs...@fast.net>

wrote:

>On Wednesday, April 13, 2022 at 4:55:46 PM UTC-4, David Von Pein wrote:
>> On Wednesday, April 13, 2022 at 4:32:42 PM UTC-4, Ben Holmes wrote:
>>> On Wed, 13 Apr 2022 12:16:18 -0700 (PDT), David Von Pein
>>> <davev...@aol.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>>On Wednesday, April 13, 2022 at 12:50:24 PM UTC-4, Ben Holmes wrote:
>>>>> What time did JFK's body arrive at Bethesda? Cite for your answer.
>>>>
>>>>Quoting Dr. Humes (WC Testimony @ 2 H 349): "The President's body was received at 25 minutes before 8."
>>>>
>>>>Quoting Dr. Boswell (ARRB Testimony): "I think the body arrived around 8:00."
>>> Boswell cannot *POSSIBLY* be correct... and you know this.
>> But Boswell's "around 8:00" certainly doesn't help Lifton's theory of the body arriving as early as 6:35. Boswell was obviously just providing a rough estimate. And his estimate is certainly much closer to Humes' 7:35 than it is to 6:35.
>>> Humes has already been cited.
>>>
>>> Amusingly, you failed quite completely to list *ALL* the relevant
>>> evidence for the time that JFK arrived at Bethesda.
>>>

>> Let me guess ...

LFD.