Alan Tippit Vs. Bill Hootkins: What's The Point?

[Sky Throne 19efppp]

It is somewhat an intriguing idea to think that Hootkins is Shasteen's Communist Boy, but what would this mean? What would be the most likely explanation? Hootkins, apparently a very intelligent lad taking Russian courses in 1963 Texas, might have come to the attention of American intelligence. They might have hooked him up with Ruth Paine in the 1963 summer course she taught at St. Mark's. He might have been recruited to help set up Oswald with his barbershop performance, but what would be the point of the Communist Boy? He is not needed to set up Oswald. In fact, how does this even help to set up Oswald? Shasteen would have remembered Oswald without the boy, and what difference does the boy make? We already know that Oswald was a dirty red. Introducing a new character unnecessarily does not make any sense.

Okay, maybe you think he's just hanging out with Oswald and that he finds egalitarianism to be an attractive philosophy. But then, how does he end up hanging out with Oswald? Ruth would not have recommended him as a Russian tutor. According to the interview with Hootkins' mother, Ruth would pick up her son at the Hootkins house and drive him to the St. Mark school where the lessons were given. Does Oswald tag along? Maybe, I guess...but it seems unlikely. I don't see how either "paling around with Oswald" or "setting up Oswald" makes any sense with Hootkins.

But, if JD Tippit is involved, then it could make sense that Oswald takes his kid to the barbershop. It's not a good idea. And THEY might have to kill the Dumb Cop if THEY find out. So, there's a sensible explanation for The Communist Boy being Alan Tippit, where there is not one for Hootkins.

[Greg Parker]

On Saturday, May 21, 2022 at 10:32:55 PM UTC+10, Sky Throne 19efppp wrote:
> It is somewhat an intriguing idea to think that Hootkins is Shasteen's Communist Boy, but what would this mean? What would be the most likely explanation? Hootkins, apparently a very intelligent lad taking Russian courses in 1963 Texas, might have come to the attention of American intelligence. They might have hooked him up with Ruth Paine in the 1963 summer course she taught at St. Mark's. He might have been recruited to help set up Oswald with his barbershop performance, but what would be the point of the Communist Boy? He is not needed to set up Oswald. In fact, how does this even help to set up Oswald? Shasteen would have remembered Oswald without the boy, and what difference does the boy make? We already know that Oswald was a dirty red. Introducing a new character unnecessarily does not make any sense.

Mr Oviatt, the assistant headmaster, came from a college that had a campus organization that was basically a junior FBI - right down to infiltrating and keeping files on left wing campus groups. These were operational at about 200 schools across the US at the time, and although I can't prove it, I think Oviatt brought the idea to St Marks. Ab obvious recruit into such an organization would be anyone with acting ability.

If this is what happened, it ran with the cooperation of the FBI. It also may mean that he was actually keeping tabs on the "left" leaning Mrs Paine. Or, as you suggest, he was hooked up with her to get close to Oswald.

In the two times he attended the barber shop with Lee, and never said a word. The only time he spoke was the third time a few days prior to the assassination and he was on his own. It would look like Oswald was leading this kid astray into communism . The reason for it may have had nothing to do with the assassination but actually to do with having something to report to the school group. One thing that could be counted on. Shasteen would report it to the FBI - he had been an informant for the FBI previously when working in defense plants during the Korean war.

> Okay, maybe you think he's just hanging out with Oswald and that he finds egalitarianism to be an attractive philosophy. But then, how does he end up hanging out with Oswald? Ruth would not have recommended him as a Russian tutor. According to the interview with Hootkins' mother, Ruth would pick up her son at the Hootkins house and drive him to the St. Mark school where the lessons were given. Does Oswald tag along? Maybe, I guess...but it seems unlikely. I don't see how either "paling around with Oswald" or "setting up Oswald" makes any sense with Hootkins.

The mother would have no idea where he was driven after being picked up. All she knew was that it was supposed to be to the school.
There was no interview with Bill H because the FBI policy was not to interview kids - just their parents.

>
> But, if JD Tippit is involved, then it could make sense that Oswald takes his kid to the barbershop. It's not a good idea. And THEY might have to kill the Dumb Cop if THEY find out. So, there's a sensible explanation for The Communist Boy being Alan Tippit, where there is not one for Hootkins.

No plot would use JD Tippit for anything. Read his police personnel file. He got in only because of the GI bill, otherwise it hard to see how they could have employed him. His father-in-law said he was a nervous individual because of his war experience, and the psych reports indicate he would not make good decisions under any sort of pressure. Moreover, fellow officers complained that he had trouble writing reports and they often had to do it for him. Few cops avoided promotion after 10 years service. Tippit did. He was never going to be getting one.

Scratch him from your list of plotters - and by default after that, scratch Alan Tippit as the barber shop kid. If it wasn't Hootkins (it was - but the sake of argument only) it was some random kid whose identity will never be known,.

[Sky Throne 19efppp]

So, Mr. Oviatt, the headmaster of St. Mark's, I presume, happened to go to one of 200 schools, all of whom had FBI infiltration programs, and you cannot prove that Oviatt had anything to do with these FBI programs, yet you think he started one of these FBI programs at St. Marks in order to keep tabs on Ruth Paine. Is that what you're telling me? Well, sure, I guess...Meanwhile, JD Tippit really was murdered, allegedly by Oswald. And JD Tippit had lunch with wife and son just before the assassination, and son, or somebody who looks much like him and wears the same jacket, was one of the closest witnesses to JFK being shot on Elm Street. I think JD is more likely involved here than is your Mr. Oviatt, and that, plus Shasteen's description of the boy, which matches Allan Tippit far better than Bill Hootkins, makes Allan the far better candidate for Communist Boy. I doubt that any other Rando Boy would not have been identified and not have written a book or two, and not have been interviewed by Stephen Fagan and Geraldo Rivera, so Allan Tippit, obviously, is Clifton Shasteen's tight-trousered commie.

[I C McGurkenfarkle]

There was something I forgot. Oviatt told Hosty that Ruthie was tutoring students IN THEIR OWN HOMES.
https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=10611#relPageId=3

Mrs Hootenanny told the FBI that Ruthie was picking young Bill up and taking him to St Mark's for lessons.
https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=145811#relPageId=34

Naturally the discrepancy was never followed up. But it is a perfect piece of deception, no? Oviatt thinks Bill is having lessons at his own home and Bill's mom thinks he is being driven to St Mark's. But really he is going to Irving. for other shenanigans, and lessons with a real Russian speaker.

As I said, Oviatt had arrived from Williams College in the east which had a chapter of Students for America (SFA) - an org started by a cool and groovy dude named Bob Munger.

According to the Williams College 1954 Year Book
"a vital part of the SFA is the National Security Division - a sort of undergraduate FBI. The Security Division consists of a number of chapter "Intelligence sections" whose job it is to keep up to date information on all Leftist activity of any nature at their school by any means which may be deemed expedient. These sections include a small, very select group whose identities are known only to the leader of the SFA. They join Leftist campus organizations to gain information about them."

The organization was virtually defunct by the end of the 1950s, but you can bet some of the schools involved would have carried on under some other name - after all, the Cold War was far from over and now there was Cuba to worry about - not to mention potential wars in South East Asia. And the SFA itself was just a remaking of a previous group called Students for MacArthur.

Hootkins was THE perfect recruit into a group like this. And Ruth Paine may have come under suspicion for having a Russian woman living with her.

[Greg Parker]

Thank you McGurke. But you could have said that this was mostly taken from my forum - though I had no idea that SFA was defunct before 1963. Are you sure about that?

[Sky Throne 19efppp]

Yes, but you or the other guy said that there were "200 schools" who had these programs. What is that, just about every significant college? It seems to have been so common that it is meaningless that Oviatt went to one of them. That could probably have been said for anybody who happened to be the headmaster at St. Mark's, even if it had been somebody else. Oviatt, according to the evidence, is not special for this. Sure, it's possible, but there is no evidence. Sure, if you could prove that Communist Boy was Hootkins, then you would have a reasonable theory involving Oviatt, but you can't prove the Hootkins, and I don't think the Hootkins is even likely because he does not fit the Shasteen description.

[I C McGurkenfarkle]

Apologies. I did say previously that I am not a researcher, so I was not trying to claim credit for anything. As for when Students of America stopped operating, I read it in a book some time ago about student movements during the cold war. Sorry - can't recall the name of the book.