The MC Clip
Raymond
the President was found on the sixth floor of the Texas School Book
Depository (TSBD), one cartridge remained, and it was in the chamber.9
Therefore, if operating properly, the rifle had automatically ejected
the clip. The Warren Commission reported, however, that when the rifle
was found, it contained a clip.10 Firearms experts for the HSCA
explained the discrepancy. On September 8, 1978, Monty C. Lutz of the
Committee's firearms panel, was asked about this by Pennsylvania
Representative Robert W. Edgar.
Mr. Edgar. The cartridge clip was removed from CE-139 by Lieutenant
Day of the Dallas Police Department on November 22, 1963 at the crime
laboratory for the police department. Shouldn't a clip automatically
fall out once the last cartridge has fed into the chamber?
Mr. Lutz. This rifle is designed to incorporate that feature so that
the last cartridge is stripped out of the clip, then that allows the
clip itself to fall or to drop from the opening that you see in the
bottom of the box magazine. However, in many cases, and in this
particular case, where we functioned the rifle, fed cartridges through
it, we found this clip to stay in the rifle after the last round had
been stripped and fed into the chamber. Because the lips or the edges
of the clip many times will open up, they will spring against the
walls on the inside of the box magazine and it will hang up in that
area [sic], and even though it is supposed to drop out, many times it
will hang up in the box area.11
-----------------------------------------------------------
Any original Italian clip remains in the weapon until another loaded
clip is inserted into the weapon and it pushed the empty clip out of
the bottom of the magazine.
An article, written by CLIP EXPERT Charles H.Yust,Jr. (Some
Interesting Clips) appeared in the June 1960 issue of American
Rifleman. On P.47, a photo and description of the clip operation
appears. As follows:
ITALY- Clip for Model 1891 6.5 mm. Mannlicher Carcano rifle and
carbine employing Mannlicher type magazine. Holds 6 cartridges. Made
of brass and tinned blued Parkerized and cadmium - plated steel, clip
is held in magazine until last round is used, and then PUSHED OUT
BOTTOM of magazine when new clip is forced in from top. Clip was also
used with Vetterli rifles and carbines altered during World War 1 to
6.5 mm Mannlicher-type magazine. In 1938, when Italy increased caliber
of rifle and carbine to 7.35 mm.,same magazine and clip were
retained.
Few alleged experts ever used original Italian loaded clips when
testing the clip theory that the clip automatically falls out after
the last round is chambered. most used clips that had already been
used, possibly many times and using ammunition other than the original
Italian ammo. Some of these clips were homemade or made by American
manufacturers using metals other than the Italian brass and tinned
blued Parkerized and cadmium - plated steel. These American clips
almost always fell out after the last round was chambered
The Italian soldier carried extra loaded clips and did not reuse clips
that had been released from his MC.
The original FACTORY FILLED clip (SMI) should not fall out when last
round is chambered as
reported. However, numerous clips were made to accommodate surplus
ammo when an original Italian clip, with Italian ammunition, was not
available. Some were even homemade. The Dallas clip was in the weapon
when found. It was empty and a round was found in the chamber. The
clip did not fall out. It was an original Italian clip which had been
emptied at some point and refilled with the Western ammo. Probably
because, by 1963, there were reports of misfires with the Italian
ammo. If you are on a mission to kill the most powerful man in the
world, I think it wise to use more reliable ammo.
Rifle 6.5 mm M1938 (Mannlicher-Carcano 91/38)
Weapon No 109
http://www.rememuseum.org.uk/arms/rifles/armisrc.htm
Notice the small clip release in the photo of the weapon.....in front
of the trigger and protruding through the trigger guard.This release
will remove the clip whether the clip is loaded with rounds or
empty.The Italian soldier can use this release should he want to
remove the clip himself for any reason.
---- Raymond
------------------------------------------------
Return to original above posting:
That explanation seems reasonable enough. But it is not. It is true
that the clip must be deformed to have any chance of getting as stuck
as this one. But once bent, it stays bent. Commission Exhibits (CEs)
574 and 575 are photographs of the alleged clip in its normal, unbent
condition. And five years after the HSCA reported the clip deformed,
Life magazine photographer Michael O'Neill photographed it in normal
condition for Life's November 1983 issue.12
According to assassination researcher and author J.W. Hughes, who has
tested this deformation over fifty times on each of his seven
Mannlicher-Carcanos, "When deformed, it will not hold the rounds
because the locking ridge is spread too wide to hold the round and the
weapon jams."13 The Warren Commission was apparently silent about
whether expert riflemen from the U.S. Army and FBI had such difficulty
firing the alleged murder weapon in 1964, and whether it was fired
with its alleged clip. Whether or not those marksmen used the original
clip, they were required to use any test clip in the original's
apparent "found" condition, i.e., deformed. Anyone could have tested
the clip by duplicating its required abnormal behavior, and can still.
But CBS News, which claimed to "duplicate the conditions of the actual
assassination" in its filmed rifle test in 1967, did not. According to
reporter Dan Rather, "Eleven volunteer marksmen took turns firing
clips of three bullets each at the moving target." They fired a total
of thirty-seven three-round series, seventeen of which resulted in
unfired bullets due to "trouble with the rifle." Clip problems or not,
all data from those seventeen troubled series was disregarded by CBS
analysts. It was the other series of shots, however, with properly
emptied and ejected clips, deemed worthy of analysis by CBS, that
should have been disqualified. In the CBS film, clips can be seen
flying out of the gun so fast as to be a blur.14 If a test clip is not
bent, or ejects, or moves at all, Oswald's alleged feat is not
duplicated, invalidating the test. The HSCA firearms panel seemed not
to be interested in this phenomenon, since it did not test the clip
under firing conditions. Congressman Edgar learned about the defect
from Mr. Lutz when he asked for details about their firing test:
Mr. Lutz. This was a single cartridge being inserted into the chamber
and firing into a cotton waste recovery box...backing away from the
box, a foot or two, and pointing the muzzle into the box and then
firing into it, in order to recover the projectile.
Mr. Edgar. But you weren't firing with clip -- using the clip, were
you?
Mr. Lutz. No sir; I did not.
Mr. Edgar. Did anyone on the panel fire with the clip in?
Mr. Lutz. I do not believe so; no, sir.
Mr. Edgar. What was the reason for that?
Mr. Lutz. There were no particular markings that we were able to
identify as having come from the clip, nor were we checking for time
firing or sequential firing in any way in that respect.15
Under the heading "Findings and Conclusions of the Firearms Panel
Concerning the Kennedy Assassination," we learn that, "Two bullets
were test-fired into a horizontal water recovery tank. Further tests
were conducted by loading four cartridges into the CE 375 [sic]
cartridge clip and inserting it into the magazine of the rifle. The
cartridges were worked through the rifle's mechanism and ejected
without being fired. When the last cartridge was chambered, the
cartridge clip remained in the magazine instead of falling out as it
is designed to do."16 Given Mr. Lutz's "the clip many times will open
up" statement, this result demands further explanation.
"Many times will" also means "many times won't." Metal expands when
heated and can alter its shape. But during the HSCA tests of the
loading mechanism, the rifle should have been cool. In addition, CE
541 (3), a photograph of the clip stuck in the magazine reproduced on
page 83 of the Warren Report, shows it in a cool rifle. Surely the
rifle had not been fired for some time before that photography
session. Is Lutz suggesting that the clip's sides spring out when cool
and then return to a normal shape in the heat of firing? If such a
violation of the laws of physics occurs with this rifle and clip, how
then could the rifle have "contained a clip" when found?
Walt
Mr Lutz is a LIAR!! ...and only someone who is ignorant about how a
Mannlicher Carcano operates would believe his bullshit!
If the clip is sprung apart as Mr Lutz claims ... The goddamn shells
won't stay in the clip!! You are a FOOL!!
> Weapon No 109http://www.rememuseum.org.uk/arms/rifles/armisrc.htm
Raymond
>
> read more �- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
Mr Lutz claims
"We found this clip to stay in the rifle AFTER the last round had
been stripped and fed into the chamber."
Mr Lutz was aying that the clip expands AFTER the last round
had been chambered.....had been stripped and fed into the chamber."
Walt
Ridiculous!!... What would cause the clip to "expand"??? There is
NO physical reason the clip would "expand" AFTER the last round is
stripped from it.
Walt
Ridiculous!!.... The clip would not expand once it is in the
maggazine.... It is merely a piece of metal that holds the cartridges
until they are stripped from it by the forward stroke of the bolt.
There is NOTHING in the ation of firing the rifle that would cause the
clip to expand..... AND .the clip CANNOT be sprung apart and still
function as a cartridge holder. If the clip is sprung apart far
enough to cause it to bind against the side walls of the magazine it
won't hold any cartridges.....therefore it can only be sprung apart
when it is EMPTY and then stuck into the magazine.
Gil Jesus
>
> The original FACTORY FILLED clip (SMI) should not fall out when last round is
> chambered as reported.
Mr. EISENBERG. Could you pull out the clip and explain any markings
you find on it?
Mr. FRAZIER. The only markings are the manufacturer's markings, "SMI,"
on the base of the clip.....
( 3 H 398 )
Mr. DAY. The clip is stamped 'SMI'...... ( 4 H 260 )
The SMI clip did not fall out
http://i46.tinypic.com/m96gap.jpg
Walt
That's correct .....as the photos show. But you have to ask
yourself ...WHY??.... WHY didn't it fall out?
I believe the answer to that question is.... The clip didn't fall out
because it was sprung apart so that it would stick in the magazine by
the person who planted that rifle.
It could NOT have been sprung apart and used to feed the cartridges
into the face of the bolt because the clip will not hold the
cartridges if it is sprung apart. Therefore it had to have been
sprung apart and inserted into the magazine ejection port BEFORE the
shooting and before the rifle was buried completely by stacking heavy
boxes of books on top of it.
Having said that the clip could have been sprung apart to make it stay
in the magazine, it could also have been manipulated by the mans
little finger and jammed in the magazine, however this method of
making the unspung clip stay in the magazine is precarious. When the
clip is manipulated and jamed by using the little finger the rifle
must be handled gently because a slight bump will cause the clip to
drop out.
So you're right, Gil..... The clip was in the rifle and Lt Day was
totally unaware that it was in there...... However that clip and the
live round were placed in the rifle before the rifle was hidden
beneath the heavy boxes of books. That rifle was never fired that
day.
robcap...@netscape.com
> On Nov 25, 7:05 am, Gil Jesus <gjjm...@aol.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Nov 23, 8:18 pm, Raymond <Bluerhy...@aol.com> wrote:
>
> > > The original FACTORY FILLED clip (SMI) should not fall out when last round is
> > > chambered as reported.
>
> > Mr. EISENBERG. Could you pull out the clip and explain any markings
> > you find on it?
>
> > Mr. FRAZIER. The only markings are the manufacturer's markings, "SMI,"
> > on the base of the clip.....
>
> > ( 3 H 398 )
>
> > Mr. DAY. The clip is stamped 'SMI'...... ( 4 H 260 )
>
> > The SMI clip did not fall out
>
> That's correct .....as the photos show. But you have to ask
> yourself ...WHY??.... WHY didn't it fall out?
NO photos exist of the rifle in situ with a clip in it. NO evidence
from the crime scene even mentions a clip! Wally continues to lie
like the WC did by insisting a clip was in the rifle upon discovery.
Too bad he has admitted there is NO evidence for this claim, huh?
Quote on
“The FACT is this -- NO clip was found at the scene, NO clip was
mentioned by any of the cops on the scene and NO clip was inventoried
on the sheets of evidence found at the scene.” (Robert)
“Yes, you're absolutely correct....There was NO clip found at the
scene."(Walt – 7/27/09)
Quote off
This lying WC shill wants you all to believe NO one saw the clip when
it was found as there is NO mention of a clip ANYWHERE until the WC
mentioned it, yet it was HANGING OUT so much we can even see it in a
photo of Lt. Day leaving the TSBD!
Just how dumb is this WC shill named Wally?
> I believe the answer to that question is.... The clip didn't fall out
> because it was sprung apart so that it would stick in the magazine by
> the person who planted that rifle.
Prove it. Show us WHY NO ONE saw it or mentioned it or photographed
it in situ or inventoried it then!
But he won't.
> It could NOT have been sprung apart and used to feed the cartridges
> into the face of the bolt because the clip will not hold the
> cartridges if it is sprung apart. Therefore it had to have been
> sprung apart and inserted into the magazine ejection port BEFORE the
> shooting and before the rifle was buried completely by stacking heavy
> boxes of books on top of it.
Prove it. Speculation is a favored tool of the LNers! Even you lover
Ben said so!
Quote on
“Speculation is the favored tool of LNT'ers... since they don't have
the evidence in their favor.” (Ben Holmes – 4/11/09)
Quote off
> Having said that the clip could have been sprung apart to make it stay
> in the magazine, it could also have been manipulated by the mans
> little finger and jammed in the magazine, however this method of
> making the unspung clip stay in the magazine is precarious. When the
> clip is manipulated and jamed by using the little finger the rifle
> must be handled gently because a slight bump will cause the clip to
> drop out.
Speculate all you want Wally, but the FACT is you have NO citations
for your speculation! Even your homo lover Ben said this is NOT a
winning combination!
Quote on
“Speculation in the face of a lack of citation is never a winning
combination.” (Ben Holmes to Shutterbun – 8/29/09)
Quote off
> So you're right, Gil..... The clip was in the rifle and Lt Day was
> totally unaware that it was in there......
LOL!! Yet this liar has said the clip was soooo visable in the PHOTO
of Lt. Day leaving the TSBD it looked like it would fall out!
Quote on
“The FACT that the clip is seen in photos hanging precariously from
the rifle's magazine LESS THAN AN HOUR later as Day walks in front of
the TSBD with the MANNLICHER CARCANO is strong evidence that he was
blissfully ignorant that the clip was there.” (Walt)
Quote off
Just how dumb is this lying WC shill anyway?? He wants his cake and
he wants to eat it too! He wants us to believe EVERYONE WAS SO BLIND
that they did NOT see the clip, but then again it was "HANGING OUT SO
MUCH" IT LOOKED LIKE IT WOULD FALL OUT BY ITSELF!
LOL!!
What a moroon!
> However that clip and the
> live round were placed in the rifle before the rifle was hidden
> beneath the heavy boxes of books.
Too bad the evidence doesn't support you in terms of the clip, huh?
> That rifle was never fired that
> day.
Finally, I can agree with this WC shill for once!
Walt
wrote:
I'm aware that you're too stupid to comprehend that the photos show
the clip hanging out of the rifle, and that means the clip was there
all along. Nobody in law enforcement at the scene,knew anything about
Mannlicher Carcanos so nobody knew enough to know that there had to be
a clip to enable the rifle to be used as a gun. ....and nobody had
enough knowledge to look a to see
if the clip was there anywhere. It was there all along ( the photos
prove it) but because of their ignorance they never knew it.
robcap...@netscape.com
Prove it liar. Show s one piece of evidence from the crime scene that
shows the clip was INSIDE THE RIFLE AT TIME OF DISCOVERY! YOU never
do liar, so we all know you are full of crap WC shill!
> Nobody in law enforcement at the scene,knew anything about
> Mannlicher Carcanos so nobody knew enough to know that there had to be
> a clip to enable the rifle to be used as a gun. ....and nobody had
> enough knowledge to look a to see
> if the clip was there anywhere. It was there all along ( the photos
> prove it) but because of their ignorance they never knew it.
So they were ALL BLIND, HUH? Must have been because the photo you
keep talking about shows the clip quite well.
YOU are a liar and a bad one too WC shill!
Hopefully the government will cut your troll pay in these tough times
as you stink!
At least you have your gay lover Ben to comfort you!
Walt
No they weren't blind, stupid...... The clip was INSIDE the magazine
and out of sight until Lt Day started to leave the building....He the
apparently bummped the rifle and dislodged the clip which started to
fall uot, as can be seen in the PHOTOS ( there is more than one)
Must have been because the photo you keep talking about shows the
clip quite well.
Well I'll be dipped!...... Ya got yer head outta yer ass long enough
to see the clip hanging precariously from the rifle as Lt day carries
it in front of the TSBD.
>
> YOU are a liar and a bad one too WC shill!
>
> Hopefully the government will cut your troll pay in these tough times
> as you stink!
>
> At least you have your gay lover Ben to comfort you!- Hide quoted text -
Walt
What is the going rate the government pays trolls to discredit
information and spread bullshit?
>
> At least you have your gay lover Ben to comfort you!- Hide quoted text -
Ben Holmes
robcap...@netscape.com says...
>
>On Nov 25, 9:37=A0am, Walt <papakochenb...@evertek.net> wrote:
>> On Nov 25, 7:05=A0am, Gil Jesus <gjjm...@aol.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> > On Nov 23, 8:18 pm, Raymond <Bluerhy...@aol.com> wrote:
>>
>round is
>> > > chambered as reported.
>>
>> > Mr. EISENBERG. Could you pull out the clip and explain any markings
>> > you find on it?
>>
>> > Mr. FRAZIER. The only markings are the manufacturer's markings, "SMI,"
>> > on the base of the clip.....
>>
>> > ( 3 H 398 )
>>
>> > Mr. DAY. The clip is stamped 'SMI'...... ( 4 H 260 )
>>
>> > The SMI clip did not fall out
>>
>> yourself ...WHY??.... =A0WHY didn't it fall out?
>
>NO photos exist of the rifle in situ with a clip in it. NO evidence
>from the crime scene even mentions a clip! Wally continues to lie
>like the WC did by insisting a clip was in the rifle upon discovery.
>Too bad he has admitted there is NO evidence for this claim, huh?
>
>Quote on
>
>mentioned by any of the cops on the scene and NO clip was inventoried
>
>=93Yes, you're absolutely correct....There was NO clip found at the
>scene."(Walt =96 7/27/09)
>
>Quote off
>
>This lying WC shill wants you all to believe NO one saw the clip when
>it was found as there is NO mention of a clip ANYWHERE until the WC
>mentioned it, yet it was HANGING OUT so much we can even see it in a
>photo of Lt. Day leaving the TSBD!
>
>Just how dumb is this WC shill named Wally?
>
>
>> I believe the answer to that question is.... The clip didn't fall out
>> because it was sprung apart so that it would stick in the magazine by
>> the person who planted that rifle.
>
>Prove it. Show us WHY NO ONE saw it or mentioned it or photographed
>it in situ or inventoried it then!
>
>But he won't.
>
>
>> It could NOT have been sprung apart and used to feed the cartridges
>> into the face of the bolt because the clip will not hold the
>> sprung apart and inserted into the magazine ejection port BEFORE the
>> shooting and before the rifle was buried completely by stacking heavy
>> boxes of books on top of it.
>
>Prove it. Speculation is a favored tool of the LNers! Even you lover
>Ben said so!
>
>Quote on
>
>the evidence in their favor.=94 (Ben Holmes =96 4/11/09)
>
>Quote off
>
>
>> Having said that the clip could have been sprung apart to make it stay
>> in the magazine, it could also have been manipulated by the mans
>> little finger and jammed in the magazine, however this method of
>> clip is manipulated and jamed by using the little finger the rifle
>> must be handled gently because a slight bump will cause the clip to
>> drop out.
>
>Speculate all you want Wally, but the FACT is you have NO citations
>for your speculation! Even your homo lover Ben said this is NOT a
>winning combination!
>
>Quote on
>
>combination.=94 (Ben Holmes to Shutterbun =96 8/29/09)
>
>Quote off
>
>
>> So you're right, Gil..... The clip was in the rifle and Lt Day was
>> totally unaware that it was in there......
>
>LOL!! Yet this liar has said the clip was soooo visable in the PHOTO
>of Lt. Day leaving the TSBD it looked like it would fall out!
>
>Quote on
>
>the rifle's magazine LESS THAN AN HOUR later as Day walks in front of
>the TSBD with the MANNLICHER CARCANO is strong evidence that he was
>
>Quote off
>
>Just how dumb is this lying WC shill anyway?? He wants his cake and
>he wants to eat it too! He wants us to believe EVERYONE WAS SO BLIND
>that they did NOT see the clip, but then again it was "HANGING OUT SO
>MUCH" IT LOOKED LIKE IT WOULD FALL OUT BY ITSELF!
>
>LOL!!
>
>What a moroon!
>
>> However that clip and the
>> live round were placed in the rifle before the rifle was hidden
>> beneath the heavy boxes of books.
>
>Too bad the evidence doesn't support you in terms of the clip, huh?
>
>> That rifle was never fired that
>> day.
>
>Finally, I can agree with this WC shill for once!
Robsie keeps quoting me as if I'm one of the authors of the Bible, yet labels me
a liar in virtually every post. Rather confused, isn't he?
--
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ben Holmes
Learn to Make Money with a Website - http://www.burningknife.com
Gil Jesus
Walt
>
> - Show quoted text -
Gil I believe that's the same photo you posted a link to
previously..... There are several photos taken by news photographers
William Allen, and Jack Beers which clearly show the clip about to
fall out of the rifle as Lt Day carried it in front of the TSBD. Can
you find any of the other photos showing the clip in the rifle??
robcap...@netscape.com
I thought he was supposed to PROCESS THE RIFLE AT THE CRIME SCENE!!! I
thought part of the processing was to TAKE THE RIFLE APART??? Why did
he NOT do this?
> Must have been because the photo you keep talking about shows the
> clip quite well.
Editing won't save you liar! I see you use your lover's tactics, huh?
> Well I'll be dipped!...... Ya got yer head outta yer ass long enough
> to see the clip hanging precariously from the rifle as Lt day carries
> it in front of the TSBD.
Commenting on what I did NOT say won't save you liar! He is sooooo
dumb he doesn't even put the right number of >> in front of what I
supposedly said!
LOL!!!
Ben Holmes
robcap...@netscape.com says...
>
>On Nov 25, 1:42=A0pm, Walt <papakochenb...@evertek.net> wrote:
>> On Nov 25, 11:55=A0am, "robcap...@netscape.com" <robcap...@netscape.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> > On Nov 25, 12:01=A0pm, Walt <papakochenb...@evertek.net> wrote:
>>
>> > > On Nov 25, 10:46=A0am, "robcap...@netscape.com" <robcap...@netscape.c=
>om>
>> > > wrote:
>>
>> > > > On Nov 25, 9:37=A0am, Walt <papakochenb...@evertek.net> wrote:
>>
>> > > > > On Nov 25, 7:05=A0am, Gil Jesus <gjjm...@aol.com> wrote:
>>
>> > > > > > On Nov 23, 8:18 pm, Raymond <Bluerhy...@aol.com> wrote:
>>
>en last round is
>> > > > > > > chambered as reported.
>>
>ings
>> > > > > > you find on it?
>>
> "SMI,"
>> > > > > > on the base of the clip.....
>>
>> > > > > > ( 3 H 398 )
>>
>> > > > > > Mr. DAY. The clip is stamped 'SMI'...... ( 4 H 260 )
>>
>> > > > > > The SMI clip did not fall out
>>
>> > > > > yourself ...WHY??.... =A0WHY didn't it fall out?
>>
>> > > > NO photos exist of the rifle in situ with a clip in it. =A0NO evide=
>nce
>> > > > from the crime scene even mentions a clip! =A0Wally continues to li=
>e
>> > > > like the WC did by insisting a clip was in the rifle upon discovery=
>.
>> > > > Too bad he has admitted there is NO evidence for this claim, huh?
>>
>> > > > Quote on
>>
>> > > > mentioned by any of the cops on the scene and NO clip was inventori=
>ed
>> > > > on the sheets of evidence found at the scene.=94 (Robert)
>>
>> > > > =93Yes, you're absolutely correct....There was NO clip found at the
>> > > > scene."(Walt =96 7/27/09)
>>
>> > > > Quote off
>>
>> > > > This lying WC shill wants you all to believe NO one saw the clip wh=
>en
>> > > > it was found as there is NO mention of a clip ANYWHERE until the WC
>a
>> > > > photo of Lt. Day leaving the TSBD!
>>
>> > > > Just how dumb is this WC shill named Wally?
>>
> out
>> > > > > because it was sprung apart so that it would stick in the magazin=
>e by
>> > > > > the person who planted that rifle.
>>
>hed
>> > > > it in situ or inventoried it then!
>>
>> > > > But he won't.
>>
>es
>> > > > > into the face of the bolt because the clip will not hold the
>n
>> > > > > sprung apart and inserted into the magazine ejection port BEFORE =
>the
>> > > > > shooting and before the rifle was buried completely by stacking h=
>eavy
>> > > > > boxes of books on top of it.
>>
>u lover
>> > > > Ben said so!
>>
>> > > > Quote on
>>
>ave
>> > > > the evidence in their favor.=94 (Ben Holmes =96 4/11/09)
>>
>> > > > Quote off
>>
>> > > > > Having said that the clip could have been sprung apart to make it=
> stay
>> > > > > in the magazine, it could also have been manipulated by the mans
>> > > > > little finger and jammed in the magazine, however this method of
>en the
>> > > > > clip is manipulated and jamed by using the little finger the rifl=
>e
>> > > > > must be handled gently because a slight bump will cause the clip =
>to
>> > > > > drop out.
>>
>> > > > Speculate all you want Wally, but the FACT is you have NO citations
>a
>> > > > winning combination!
>>
>> > > > Quote on
>>
>>
>> > > > Quote off
>>
>> > > > > So you're right, Gil..... The clip was in the rifle and Lt Day wa=
>s
>> > > > > totally unaware that it was in there......
>>
>O
>> > > > of Lt. Day leaving the TSBD it looked like it would fall out!
>>
>> > > > Quote on
>>
>om
>> > > > the rifle's magazine LESS THAN AN HOUR later as Day walks in front =
>of
>> > > > the TSBD with the MANNLICHER CARCANO is strong evidence that he was
>>
>> > > > Quote off
>>
>> > > > Just how dumb is this lying WC shill anyway?? =A0He wants his cake =
>and
>> > > > he wants to eat it too! =A0He wants us to believe EVERYONE WAS SO B=
>LIND
>> > > > that they did NOT see the clip, but then again it was "HANGING OUT =
>SO
>> > > > MUCH" IT LOOKED LIKE IT WOULD FALL OUT BY ITSELF!
>>
>> > > > LOL!!
>>
>> > > > What a moroon!
>>
>> > > > > However that clip and the
>> > > > > live round were placed in the rifle before the rifle was hidden
>> > > > > beneath the heavy boxes of books.
>>
>> > > > Too bad the evidence doesn't support you in terms of the clip, huh?
>>
>> > > > > That rifle was never fired that
>> > > > > day.
>>
>> > > > Finally, I can agree with this WC shill for once!-
>>
>> > > I'm aware that you're too stupid to comprehend that the photos show
>> > > the clip hanging out of the rifle, and that means the clip was there
>> > > all along.
>>
>> > Prove it liar. Show s one piece of evidence from the crime scene that
>> > do liar, so we all know you are full of crap WC shill!
>>
>> > > Nobody in law enforcement at the scene,knew anything about
>e
>> > > a clip to enable the rifle to be used as a gun. ....and nobody had
>> > > enough knowledge to look a to see
>os
>> > > prove it) but because of their ignorance they never knew it.
>>
>> > So they were ALL BLIND, HUH?
>>
>> No they weren't blind, stupid...... The clip was INSIDE the magazine
>> and out of sight until Lt Day started to leave the building....He the
>> apparently bummped the rifle and dislodged the clip which started to
>> fall uot, as can be seen in the PHOTOS ( there is more than one)
>
>I thought he was supposed to PROCESS THE RIFLE AT THE CRIME SCENE!!! I
>thought part of the processing was to TAKE THE RIFLE APART??? Why did
>he NOT do this?
Why can't you provide any cite for this?
>> Must have been because the photo you keep talking about shows the
>> clip quite well.
>
>Editing won't save you liar! I see you use your lover's tactics, huh?
Does the photo show a clip, Robsie?
If it doesn't - explain why it doesn't.
If it does - EXPLAIN IT!
>> Well I'll be dipped!...... Ya got yer head outta yer ass long enough
>> to see the clip hanging precariously from the rifle as Lt day carries
>> it in front of the TSBD.
>
>Commenting on what I did NOT say won't save you liar! He is sooooo
>dumb he doesn't even put the right number of >> in front of what I
>supposedly said!
>
>LOL!!!
>
Walt
There in a nutshell lies your problem..... You ASSUME that you know
stuff that you don't actually know. Once you've ASSUMED something it
becomes a FACT in your warped brain.
Processing a weapon at the scene is quite perfunctory..... Many times
it isn't really "processed " until it is in the police departments
lab. Usually the examination at the scene is little more than taking
photos of the weapon as it was found at the scene and recording the
make and model of the gun ( if known) and the serial number. Many
times it isn't even dusted for prints until it is at the police lab...
( usually just a matter of minutes from the crime scene) NEVER is
the weapon disassembled at the scene. That part of the processing
takes place in the police lab.
>
> > Must have been because the photo you keep talking about shows the
> > clip quite well.
>
> Editing won't save you liar! I see you use your lover's tactics, huh?
>
> > Well I'll be dipped!...... Ya got yer head outta yer ass long enough
> > to see the clip hanging precariously from the rifle as Lt day carries
> > it in front of the TSBD.
>
> Commenting on what I did NOT say won't save you liar! He is sooooo
> dumb he doesn't even put the right number of >> in front of what I
> supposedly said!
>
> LOL!!!- Hide quoted text -
Walt
Since you have trouble comprehending what you read, let me clarify
what I wrote. I said :...."“Yes, you're absolutely correct....There
was NO clip found at the scene."
If Lt Day had been aware there was a clip in the rifle..... and if the
clip had been noticed ...and if the clip had been removed from the
rifle, examined and recorded, THEN it would have been said to have
been "found"..... But since none of these things occurred then of
course the statement that it wasn't found at the scene is true. It
was there it just wasn't found. We can know with certainty that it
was there in the magazine of the rifle because we have at least eight
photos which show the clip hanging from the ejection port of the
magazine as Lt carried it from the TSBD about 30 minutes after it was
lifted from the place it had been hidden by placing heavy boxes of
books around and over it. Obviously the clip wasn't hanging out as
it is seen in the photos, or Day would have "found" it. Apparently it
was inside the magazine and during the handling it the rifle as Day
carried it the jostling caused the clip to start to slide out of the
rifle..... and that's where it was when reporters took the photos
which show it about to fall out of the rifle.
> Finally, I can agree with this WC shill for once!- Hide quoted text -
Walt
"SMI" ----Societa Metallurgica Italiana.. I believe that is akin to
something like.... "American Cartridge Company" ...in english.
I've never seen a ammo clip for a Mannlicher carcano that was NOT
stamped "SMI". Usually the year that the clip was made is also
stamped on the clip....so "SMI 952" woul mean the clip was made by the
Italian Cartridge Company in Sept of 1952.
IF IF there are clips that were made by other companies...they MAY?
not function as the original design which were made by the Societa
Metallurgica Italiana....But that idea is null and void because the
clip in the rifle was an original clip made for the Mannlicher
carcano. All of the BS that it might have hung up in the rifle because
it wasn't made for that rifle is just that..BULLSHIT!