Was LHO A Poor Shot ? His Marine Corp. Rifle Score Book Indicates Otherwise !

cdddraftsman

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May 24, 2007, 1:26:14 PM5/24/07

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Another lie put to rest !

According to CTer's worse than your average conspiracists .
Of course they run in the opposite direction when any loud
sounds occurs . Guilty conscience the lot of them !

eca...@tx.rr.com

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May 24, 2007, 1:33:14 PM5/24/07

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Oswald was a darn good shot by military standards..
Within 1, 2 points of Charles Whitman for God's
sake!!

By civilan standards he was an *EXCELLENT* shot.

MR ;~D
1234may2407

Papa Andy

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May 24, 2007, 1:40:39 PM5/24/07

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you know better

A

Papa Andy

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May 24, 2007, 1:41:43 PM5/24/07

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> > sounds occurs . Guilty conscience the lot of them !- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

by civilian standards -- what does that mean?

what about the 'Maggies Drawers ' testimony?

what about theneed for constant practice in order to keep up skills?

what about the Russians shooting game for him?

A

eca...@tx.rr.com

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May 24, 2007, 1:58:40 PM5/24/07

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> A- Hide quoted text -

>
> - Show quoted text -

Papa it's only around noon.. Are you already hitting the sauce?
These are good scores Oswald put up. He was a *documented* good shot.
By civilian standards he was an "excellent" shot." How can you take
exception with that? Oswald was within 1 or 2 points (*DOCUMENTED*)
of the infamous Charles Whitman's circa 1966 shooting feat !!!

Ed

tomnln

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May 24, 2007, 2:13:31 PM5/24/07

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AGAIN;

lousy takes the "Drawing" of a Urologist who supplies lousy with Penis's

ps;
lousy is a PORN QUEEN>>> http://whokilledjfk.net/tom_lowery.htm

ALL in his own words.

WHERE can lousy find official records?>>> http://whokilledjfk.net/

"cdddraftsman" <cdddra...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1180027574.6...@x18g2000prd.googlegroups.com...

tomnln

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May 24, 2007, 2:19:08 PM5/24/07

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ASSHOLE LIAR; See testimony of Oswald's Sgt Nelson Delgado (volume III
pages 236-239.

Delgado said Oswald was a LOUSY Shot. Even had to ALTER his score to make
the platoon look good.

Oswald never hit Anything he aimed at with a SHOTGUN>>> SEE TESTIMONY in
Volume V page 405.

See the report where THREE (3) NRA "Masters" could NOT do what the WCR
attributed to Oswald.
Volume III ,pages 443-447.

A NRA "MASTER" is Qualified to shoot in Olympic Shooting Competition.

Hence; This is addressed to ASSHOLE LIAR. (ed-in a- cage)

<eca...@tx.rr.com> wrote in message
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Papa Andy

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May 24, 2007, 4:10:15 PM5/24/07

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> Ed- Hide quoted text -

>
> - Show quoted text -

a total non-response -- shocking

A

Ben Holmes

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May 24, 2007, 4:40:40 PM5/24/07

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In article <1180037415.7...@h2g2000hsg.googlegroups.com>, Papa Andy
says...

How silly... Marines are laughing everywhere...

Bud

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May 24, 2007, 5:22:48 PM5/24/07

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Someone tell a knock-knock joke?

eca...@tx.rr.com

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May 24, 2007, 6:10:21 PM5/24/07

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Here's a roar for you Bud: Benny the
Dwarf went to the CA Legislature armed
with the following:
1) His CT in total, complete:
"There were multiple shooters."
(Period.)
2) "Liar"
3) "Lying yellow coward"
4) "LMAO!!"

The Legislature of course, declined to
reopen the JFK case.. Wonder why?

MR ;~D
1710May2407

On May 24, 4:22 pm, Bud <sirsl...@fast.net> wrote:
> Ben Holmes wrote:

> > In article <1180037415.733074.145...@h2g2000hsg.googlegroups.com>, Papa Andy

> Someone tell a knock-knock joke?- Hide quoted text -

Walt

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May 24, 2007, 6:55:59 PM5/24/07

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Easy to take exception..... Oswald wasn't a good shot in the Marine
Corps, but he did qualify. However there is No, None Zilch, Nada,
evidence that he ever practiced with a Mannlicher Carcano. According
to the Warren Commission he took a Mannlicher Carcano out of a blanket
where it had been transported and kicked around for several months
disassembled it then took it to the TSBD and reassassembled it and
fired a perfect score without ever test firing it.

Eddie, you claim to be a Vietnam combat vet.... Do you believe Oswald
or anybody else could have accomplished the feat attributed to him??

Walt

Oswald was within 1 or 2 points (*DOCUMENTED*)
> of the infamous Charles Whitman's circa 1966 shooting feat !!!
>

> Ed- Hide quoted text -

tomnln

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May 24, 2007, 7:29:13 PM5/24/07

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O K I will tell a knock-knock Joke;

Bud's knees KNOCK-KNOCK when asked to address official evidence/testimony.

ADDRESS THESE;

"Bud" <sirs...@fast.net> wrote in message
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Fat...@aol.com

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May 25, 2007, 9:13:24 AM5/25/07

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This disassemble and reassemble has always concerned me. Most every
rifle that I have taken out of the wood and then reassembled shot a
different point of impact. Perhaps not much difference but probably
enough difference to be important with the shots the assassin is
supposed to have made.

And why use such a crappy rifle?

Bill Clarke

eca...@tx.rr.com

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May 26, 2007, 6:35:30 PM5/26/07

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WALT ON:

"Eddie, you claim to be a Vietnam combat vet.... Do you
believe Oswald or anybody else could have accomplished
the feat attributed to him?? Walt"

Yes Walt, indeed I am a Vietnam war vet..
So what? That has nothing to do with my
ability to assess the shooting skills of
Oswald.. What is pertinent is that I had
extensive training on firing all types of
US Army weaponry from 1966-1969. My MOS
was "Gunner" and I do know how extensive
and stringent military standards were for
learning to fire a rifle and qualifying..

Some did not/could not qualify but the
Army kept training them over and over until
they could meet basic raw standards. Oswald
surpassed those standards. **DOCUMENTED**

The direct answer to your question is "yes"
Oswald could have accomplished that feat..
I have actually done even more difficult
tasks, however I will concede that I wonder
if I could have done it in Dealey Plaza in
the assassination of a President.. But yes,
most military qualifiers achieved shooting
tasks in access of what Oswald did on 11-22-63.
But they/we/I was on a training range..

MR ;~D
Ed Cage
1735May2607 trainingrange

On May 24, 5:55 pm, Walt <papakochenb...@evertek.net> wrote:

> > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -

eca...@tx.rr.com

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May 26, 2007, 7:15:03 PM5/26/07

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Bill it really wasn't a "crappy rifle" as you seem to think.. And it
was capable, and somebody damn sure used a Mannlicher Carcano to kill
Kennedy. Here's an article on the MC I posted in circa March 2003 and
the site it came from if you are interested:

http://groups.google.com/group/alt.conspiracy.jfk/msg/a535f576b345fe5e

-----2003 Article on Mannlicher Carcano by Ed Cage ON-----

The Quality of the Carcano
Could the Carcano make the shots?
Research by Ed Cage

What support is there for the Carcano rifle?
I was recently concerned with what I believed to be an unbalanced
evaluation of the Carcano by someone who claimed to own one. What
follows below is evidence about the Carcano to support both the
Warren Commission's finding and the finding of the 1976 House Select
Committee on Assassination's findings that the Carcano did indeed,
and certainly could have fired the two shots that hit John F.
Kennedy. Both blue ribbon committees agreed that Lee Harvey Oswald's
Carcano was not only capable of the shots; They also agreed that his
Carcano rifle DID make the shots. The claim I am responding to was
that the "Carcano was simply incapable of making two out of three
hits on JFK in Dealey Plaza." The writer (A member of another JFK
group which I put together), went on to emphasize that his claim was
not merely an opinion, but a "fact." This observation offered as
"fact," caused me to do further research in an effort to present
conflicting evidence. I believe, and extensive post assassination
tests have proven, that the Carcano most certainly can make two out
of three hits and in some cases surpass Oswald's performance with
the rifle on 11-22-63.

The Quality of the Carcano - There have been various disparaging
remarks made about the Carcano which -- over the time -- have
tainted its reputation. Most of these remarks are hearsay rumors
which one firearm writer has copied from the other, as so frequently
happens. The most damaging is probably the story about a WW II Allied
soldier getting killed when firing a Carcano, thus giving the Carcano
the reputation of being unsafe. The story goes that the firing pin
ruptured the primer causing the expanding gases to propel the firing
pin backwards, breaking the safety retaining pin and into the face of
the unfortunate soldier. The only problem about this story is that no
one seems to know the name of the soldier, the nearer circumstances
of
the incident, or any other provable fact. Since then, there have been
no other reports of injuries even remotely similar to this incident,
thus either suggesting the incident was a fluke or, more likely,
false
wartime rumor.

The second is the "humanitarian rifle" moniker used a couple of times
in the Warren Commission Report. This rumor apparently has it roots
in
the false belief that the Carcano is so poorly made that it will
either
not fire, or is so inaccurate that when actually fired, you'll
probably
miss the target (the opposing soldier that is), or that the terminal
performance if its 6.5 mm bullet is so insufficient. Thus it would be
considered "humane" to the enemy.
Actually, this quotation seems to go back to an (in) famous Mussolini
speech of early 1943 date in which he tried (with his usual
flamboyant
rhetoric's) to veil the complete failure of Italian military
leadership..
Notably his own -- by blaming equipment.

Neither is the Carcano unsafe, nor is it inherently inaccurate:
According to expert Bloomgarden, on the sporting (competitive)
use of the Model 91 Carcano:
"[The Royal Arms Works in Terni] might still take pride [sc.
in the mid-1960s]:in an experiment a Model 91 of her own,
with sight modified to make it correspondent with a modern
Garand rifle manufactured by Beretta, displayed a greater
accuracy than the Garand."
The president of Interarms, the largest private
wholesaler of ammunition and armaments [stated]:

"It's interesting to note that the Italian army NATO
rifle team still uses the 6.5-mm M91 rifle in the NATO matches
and still comes out in the top positions, it advises us, every
year, against all other NATO teams with all the other rifle
types. It uses their own original 6.5-mm cartridges, which are,
now, at least ten years old minimum."
-----------------
According to expert Hobbs: "Several years ago the Editor of Banzai
called me about the Type I Carcano, it seems at the annual Alabama
Shoot Out they had shot the Type I Carcano for the first time and
were surprised to find it was more accurate than the Arisakas."
-----------------
According to a kind notice I recently received from expert
John Stovall:
From:John.A.Stov...@cdc.com (John A. Stovall) Subject: Re: Kennedy
Assassination Rifle:

"If you haven't read much about the M91 Carcano then. I
suggest you read, "Testing the Weapons of War" by Timothy J. Mullin.
Mullin fired over a hundred different military weapons of this
century
and a few of the last. And guess what, it ended up in the five best
rifles he tested."
"The M91 Italian Carcano carbine with fixed sights was
the most surprising of the weapons fired. I had always thought of
them
these rifles as cheap wartime emergency weapons, but instead they are
light, handy, and easy to shoot with great combat sights. It is he
best
rifle fielded by the Italians during the war and much better than any
other bolt action rifle used in the two world wars by the combatants
--
Except with the Pattern 14/m1917 Enfield."
~~~~~
I was inspired to respond to the writer's comments (He is a member
of
another JFK Q&A group I formed), because he described his opinion
that
the Carcano could not make the JFK shots as "a fact."

Ed Cage / 972-596-4363
PS: There have been various tests of the Carcano since the 11-22-63
assassination of JFK. If I get at least two independent requests
for research/input on this particular subject, I will also address
them as well. - Ed Cage

----Ed Cage 3/2003 article on Mannlicher Carcano OFF----

Bill I hope this helps you have a little more faith in the MC.. Anyway
there can be little dispute that * SOMEBODY * killed Kennedy with a
Mannlicher-Carcano.

Regards,
Edwin M. Cage
US Army 1966-1969 (Volunteered)
Vietnam March 1967 to March 1968
Lifetime Member Veterans of Foreign Wars
1807May2607 mannlichercarcano

On May 25, 8:13 am, "Fatm...@aol.com" <Fatm...@aol.com> wrote:

> > Easy to take exception..... ?Oswald wasn't a good shot in the Marine
> > Corps, but he did qualify. ?However there is No, None Zilch, Nada,
> > evidence that he ever practiced with a Mannlicher Carcano. ?According

> > to the Warren Commission he took a Mannlicher Carcano out of a blanket
> > where it had been transported and kicked around for several months
> > disassembled it then took it to the TSBD and reassassembled it and
> > fired a perfect score without ever test firing it.
>
> > Eddie, you claim to be a Vietnam combat vet.... Do you believe Oswald
> > or anybody else could have accomplished the feat attributed to him??
>
> > Walt
>
> This disassemble and reassemble has always concerned me. Most every
> rifle that I have taken out of the wood and then reassembled shot a
> different point of impact. Perhaps not much difference but probably
> enough difference to be important with the shots the assassin is
> supposed to have made.
>
> And why use such a crappy rifle?
>

> Bill Clarke- Hide quoted text -

tomnln

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May 26, 2007, 9:33:12 PM5/26/07

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Another one for ed-in-a-cage

Oswald was a Lousy shot. see Sgt. Nelson Delgado's testimony Volume VIII
pgs 236-239.

Oswald's unit "ALTERED" scores to make the unit look good Volume VIII
pgs-236-239

Oswald was SO Bad while in Russia he NEVER hit anything he aimed at with "A
SHOTGUN"
Volume V page 405.

You're either an Asshole OR, a LIAR.

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tomnln

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May 26, 2007, 9:43:01 PM5/26/07

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Criminal Trials are NOT determined by Opinions ed.

That's WHY you never address evidence/testimony.

NOBODY accomplished what Oswald was charged with "WITH CE-139"
(Different rifles have different Pecularities)

NOT FBI Experts WCR
NOT THREE (3) NRA Masters (Staley, Hendrix & Miller)
An NRA "Master" is one who is Qualified to shoot in "Olympic" Competition.

THIS is the price you pay for NOT reading the evidence/testimony.

START HERE>>> http://whokilledjfk.net/officer_m.htm

You've been DODGING it for a Year Chickenshit.

ps;
Oswald was a Lousy shot see Volume VIII 236-239 Volume V page 405.

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Fat...@aol.com

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May 27, 2007, 1:00:50 PM5/27/07

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Thanks a lot Ed. Guess I'll have to change my opinion of the
Carcano. Seems like other people have had to upgrade their opinion
also.

Bill Clarke

> > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -