Docsis 3.1 modem

[Robert Baer]

I now have a Technicolor 8305C cable modem, Docsis 3.0 that supports
Ethernet connection to the computer, 2 telephones, and WiFi.

Had it for maybe 8 years, still works great.

Was told to upgrade to take advantage of higher internet speed, so
need a Docsis 3.1 modem.

I have so far wasted 2 hours trying to find such a beast; That search
term in Amazon gets me a bunch of cable modems, half Docsis 3.0 and few
modems with WiFi.
Are there NO Docsis 3.1 modems with WiFi?

Any candidates?

Thanks

[danny burstein]

https://www.amazon.com/docsis-3-1-modem-wireless-router/s?k=docsis+3.1+modem+and+wireless+router

gets me a bunch, including (just as one example):

https://www.amazon.com/ARRIS-Surfboard-Gigabit-Certified-Xfinity/dp/B07M9J3XW2

--
_____________________________________________________
Knowledge may be power, but communications is the key
dan...@panix.com
[to foil spammers, my address has been double rot-13 encoded]

[Robert Baer]

danny burstein wrote:
> In <wMtGH.47798$E44....@fx15.iad> Robert Baer <rober...@localnet.com> writes:
>
>> I now have a Technicolor 8305C cable modem, Docsis 3.0 that supports
>> Ethernet connection to the computer, 2 telephones, and WiFi.
>
>> Had it for maybe 8 years, still works great.
>
>> Was told to upgrade to take advantage of higher internet speed, so
>> need a Docsis 3.1 modem.
>
>> I have so far wasted 2 hours trying to find such a beast; That search
>> term in Amazon gets me a bunch of cable modems, half Docsis 3.0 and few
>> modems with WiFi.
>> Are there NO Docsis 3.1 modems with WiFi?
>
> https://www.amazon.com/docsis-3-1-modem-wireless-router/s?k=docsis+3.1+modem+and+wireless+router
>
> gets me a bunch, including (just as one example):
>
> https://www.amazon.com/ARRIS-Surfboard-Gigabit-Certified-Xfinity/dp/B07M9J3XW2

* NO voice (telephone)

* NO voice even with the outrageously EXPENSVE NETGEAR Nighthawk Cable
Modem WiFi Router Combo (C7800) - Compatible with Cable Providers
Including Xfinity by Comcast, Cox, Spectrum | Cable Plans Up to 2
Gigabits | AC3200 WiFi Speed | DOCSIS 3.1

* NO voice NETGEAR Nighthawk Cable Modem WiFi Router Combo (C7800) -
Compatible with Cable Providers Including Xfinity by Comcast, Cox,
Spectrum | Cable Plans Up to 2 Gigabits | AC3200 WiFi Speed | DOCSIS 3.1

>
Above exhausts that "bunch".
Like i meant to say there NO Docsis 3.1 modems with WiFi and
telephone (voice).

Thanks.

[Paul]

https://www.newegg.com/netgear-cm1150v-100nas-modem-router-combo/p/N82E16825124027

# Two security bulletins at the bottom.

https://www.netgear.com/support/product/CM1150V.aspx

It may have an Intel PUMA inside. You'll have to research the
PUMA saga, to decide whether a PUMA 7 is safe to use or not.

There is also an optional power brick with battery backup which
sits outside the CM1150V, and provides telephone service when the
house power is off. It's based on Lithium, rather than the
alternate chemistries used in the past on voice-equipped kit.

One customer review mentions "crashing", in which case you'd
return it within the return period.

*******

There is an Arris TG9442 here, with Broadcom chipset. It only
has two LAN ports. It's unobtanium, can't find it, released
nominally 2019, perhaps hasn't had the blessing of a NA cable co.

http://en.techinfodepot.shoutwiki.com/wiki/List_of_DOCSIS_Cable_Modems

No idea whether an external brick battery-backup is available.

*******

It's relatively difficult to select a box which is issue
free. Like, did the 2017 example receive a "Cable Haunt" patch ?
Or a patch for the two exploits since then ?

I'm also not a fan of units with only Quick Install Guide two
page PDF files either. That's usually a sign there isn't
a full-featured port-forwarding QOS interface to use from
a web browser. My last "properly documented" networking box
here, was years and years ago. The modem I've got now, has
the "dummy interface", and you can barely flip it to bridged mode.

When they offer WAN and LAN ports, those port *could* be off
the same network switch chip or hardware block. In which case the
WAN port just has the interfaces swapped (in the old days, would
need a crossover cable). Now, when one of those boxes offers
a 2.5Gbit WAN RJ45, is that compatible with a RealTek 2.5Gbit/sec
based external four port switch ? So you can run 2.5Gbit networking ?
Having to think about that, is what happens when a standard claims
to offer absurdly high download BW.

I'm sure you'll find something, but it will likely contain
Intel PUMA 7, and you'll have to try to find info. (From a web site
that has not received legal threats etc.) This is Intel we're
talking about here.

Paul

[Robert Baer]

* NO WiFi. Nice tho, 4 Ethernet and 2 telephones.
Believe i need WiFi as in shadowland and "smart" phone BAERly works
with one bar.

* Talk about incompatibility..I remember a few years ago i fiddled
around with Google Maps, satellite view of 3928 14th Ave SE looking at
the round pavers by the management office.
Resolution maybe 1.5 pixels in WinXP and 4 pixels in Win7.

Now, same equipment, same OS; "resolution" if you want to call it
that is at best one quarter of the remembered original.

And one of the "informative" e-mails from Xfinity said i am paying
for more bandwidth and should consider "upgrading" to take advantage;
offering 3 Docsis 3.1 modems as choices.

Methinks they purposely throttled the bandwidth to give excuse for
"upgrading" to Docsis 3.1.

Naturally, they rent them out..at a higher FEE than previous grabrate
of $10/mo.

Cannot win for losing.

[Paul]

Robert Baer wrote:

> Paul wrote:

>> https://www.newegg.com/netgear-cm1150v-100nas-modem-router-combo/p/N82E16825124027
>
> * NO WiFi. Nice tho, 4 Ethernet and 2 telephones.
> Believe i need WiFi as in shadowland and "smart" phone BAERly works
> with one bar.
>
> * Talk about incompatibility..I remember a few years ago i fiddled
> around with Google Maps, satellite view of 3928 14th Ave SE looking at
> the round pavers by the management office.
> Resolution maybe 1.5 pixels in WinXP and 4 pixels in Win7.
>
> Now, same equipment, same OS; "resolution" if you want to call it that
> is at best one quarter of the remembered original.
>
> And one of the "informative" e-mails from Xfinity said i am paying for
> more bandwidth and should consider "upgrading" to take advantage;
> offering 3 Docsis 3.1 modems as choices.
>
> Methinks they purposely throttled the bandwidth to give excuse for
> "upgrading" to Docsis 3.1.
>
> Naturally, they rent them out..at a higher FEE than previous grabrate
> of $10/mo.
>
> Cannot win for losing.

Comcast has a list by the way.

This will be the most valuable link in the posting.

https://approvedmodemlist.com/comcast-xfinity-approved-modems/

*******

This page has some, I'm assuming, competing models.

https://www.netgear.com/home/wifi/modems/cm1150v

2.5Gbps Max download, Voice, DOCSIS 3.1 (CM2050V) ~$300
2.5Gbps Max download, DOCSIS 3.1 (CM2000)
2 Gbps Max download, DOCSIS 3.1 (CM1200)
2 Gbps Max download, Voice, DOCSIS 3.1 (CM1150V) $249.99
1 Gbps Max download, DOCSIS 3.1 (CM1000)

https://www.netgear.com/media/CM1150V_tcm148-72915.pdf Can't see Wifi...

I don't know how I got the idea it had Wifi. I was
browsing some third-party summary sight and it was
claiming 3x3 + 4x4 MIMO. But it's not there.

cm1150v

"4 Gigabit Ethernet ports for faster access & downloads - with
port aggregation where 2 ports can combine to double maximum wired speeds"

*************************************************************************

One of the "questions and answers" on the previous unit, claims
the 4x1GbE connectors are for link aggregation (teaming mode) connection
to other equipment). This one on the other hand, has a *2.5Gbit/sec* standard
of Ethernet connector on it, thus the goofy choice of a yellow connector.
You would need a 2.5Gbit/sec switch to distribute the flow from
this, without limitations. The link aggregation idea of the previous
unit, limits a download to "only" 1 gigabit per second (because that's
how teaming works, only the aggregate, the total of all connections
is higher than a gigabit worth). With teaming, the Speedtest.net
would only be 1 gigabit, not 2 gigabits.

https://www.netgear.com/home/wifi/modems/cm2050v

It is $299 and has no battery backup, and is for Xfinity/Comcast.

https://www.bestbuy.com/site/netgear-nighthawk-32-x-8-docsis-3-1-voice-cable-modem/6425815.p?skuId=6425815&intl=nosplash

https://www.netgear.com/media/CM2050V_tcm148-96329.pdf

**************************************************************************

https://www.commscope.com/product-type/broadband-video-devices/broadband-devices/docsis-3.1-gateways-modems/

Probably this one is too new.

Seeing as the 9442 did not appear at retail, what are the
odds that the 9452 will appear at retail.

https://www.businesswire.com/news/home/20200923005104/en/CommScope-Introduces-Two-New-DOCSIS-3.1-Home-Gateways-with-Wi-Fi-6

The TG9452 telephony gateway
enables the delivery of data, voice and video services, <===
while the DG9450 gateway supports data and video.

Both have 4×4 802.11ax dual-band wireless radios, offering superior
Wi-Fi performance in dense environments, with high data rates over
Wi-Fi at an increased range. For multigigabit connectivity around
the house, both provide three Ethernet ports, one supporting
2.5Gbps Ethernet, and a MoCA 2.0 port for home networking.

I can find one reference to it here, so maybe it was only offered as a rental.
The 11Mbps implies the very lowest 2.4GHz Wifi standard is working
for this user.

https://h30434.www3.hp.com/t5/Notebook-Wireless-and-Networking/Slow-connection-speed-on-WIFI-and-ethernet/td-p/7524747

**************************************************************************

That leaves connecting the CM2050V modem to a separate router.

https://www.netgear.com/home/wifi/routers/rax200

Now, this seems to be out of stock. And out of their minds.
It's possible in non-COVID times, this might be slightly lower
in price, but probably not by that much. Tri-band to me, suggests
a unit that support mesh extension so that multiple routers
can be set up in a really big McMansion and the backhaul between
them is done on the top band, leaving the other two (2.4GHz, 5GHz)
to connect to clients.

NETGEAR Nighthawk RAX200 - Wireless router
5-port switch - GigE, 2.5 GigE, 802.11ax - 802.11a/b/g/n/ac/ax - Tri-Band $602

https://www.newegg.com/p/0E6-0019-00436

"Ships from United Kingdom. Most customers receive within 7-32 days." <=== Beuler???

So for $300 + $600, you can has a buzzword compliant, power wasting,
steaming pile of technology.

https://c1.neweggimages.com/ProductImageCompressAll1280/33-222-017-V02.jpg

So the yellow port on the RAX200 would plug into the yellow port
on the CM2050V.

There are five output ports. Four GbE ports, two of which support teaming
(which is a "who cares really" technology). The fifth port is a 2.5GbE port,
which allows the whole bandwidth of the modem to be offered in its
entirety, to a 2.5GbE (RealTek) equipped brand-new PC.

The CM1150V is more practical, less Star Trek Enterprise. But
the connections for the average user would be GbE ones, suited
to most existing PCs. Not a lot of PCs have 2.5GbE ports as
a standard feature. You can likely find retail motherboards
to build your own 2.5Gbit/sec interfacing PC. There were some
plugin cards that offered 2.5G/10G wired connections for $100 or so.
The company was bought out, and there was no WinXP driver to be
using the card in a WinXP PC. Likely Win7/8/10 material for
that particular card. That's one of the reasons I didn't buy any.

*******

In conclusion, you have the master list in the very first
link above, and can sally forth on your search.

Be aware, that Wifi is quite quite sensitive to greenfield
and legacy equipment and the need to back off to keep
all devices happy. The chances of getting anywhere near
the top Wifi rates are zero. If you lived on a farm,
were miles from any neighbor, had expunged every stinking
computer you owned, got a machine with an Intel AX200,
*maybe* it would work at some glorious speed. Otherwise,
you're just delusional.

Part of me picking the RAX200, was so there'd be at least
one port with 2.5GbE on it as an output. And most realistically,
you would connect a *third* box, a 2.5GbE in to (4) 2.5GbE out,
to get 2.5GbE service to all the PCs with 2.5GbE capability.
I would select a cheaper Wifi box with regular GbE ports
if not trying to achieve Speedtest.net test conditions.

You can add 2.5GbE wired, to existing PCs having PCIe slots. $30

https://www.amazon.com/Gigabit-Ethernet-Express-Controller-Converter/dp/B07RF4SZ8R

Paul

[Robert Baer]

*
So, only 2 out of these magical 5 support my starving telephone.
Betcha the DOCSIS 3.1 Cable Modem (CM2050V) Nighthawk® Multi-Gig
2.5Gbps Cable Modem for XFinity Voice has NO WiFi.

Now, i do not care about the speed on the WiFi, that is to support my
"smart" phone which needs 3+bars to work reasonably well and i am lucky
to get 1 bar almost anywhere.
It is an Android meaning crap for calls; iPhone works ni same
environment and reads as if 5+ bars.

Phone switches over to WiFi for calls.

** Interesting; from that approved list there IS one that supports phone
and WiFi*: NETGEAR C7100V...*but does that "WiFi Router" mean i gots tew
$$pay$$ for yet another box for Tx/Rx air time?


Then there are apparent contenders from the full list:
ARRIS SVG2482AC ♦ 24×8 1.0 Gbps
ARRIS TG862R 8×4 343 Mbps
Motorola MT7711 24×8 1 Gbps
NETGEAR C7100V 24×8 960 Mbps

Well, am i glad that i am a liar here, there seems to be at least one
cable modem that supports a telephone and WiFi.
So (later) some research on those.

**** THANKS ****

>
> https://www.netgear.com/media/CM1150V_tcm148-72915.pdf    Can't see Wifi...
>
> I don't know how I got the idea it had Wifi. I was
> browsing some third-party summary sight and it was
> claiming 3x3 + 4x4 MIMO. But it's not there.

* Yeah; had the same impression until i did some digging.

>
> cm1150v
>
>   "4 Gigabit Ethernet ports for faster access & downloads - with
>    port aggregation where 2 ports can combine to double maximum wired
> speeds"
>
> *************************************************************************
>
> One of the "questions and answers" on the previous unit, claims
> the 4x1GbE connectors are for link aggregation (teaming mode) connection
> to other equipment). This one on the other hand, has a *2.5Gbit/sec*
> standard
> of Ethernet connector on it, thus the goofy choice of a yellow connector.
> You would need a 2.5Gbit/sec switch to distribute the flow from
> this, without limitations. The link aggregation idea of the previous
> unit, limits a download to "only" 1 gigabit per second (because that's
> how teaming works, only the aggregate, the total of all connections
> is higher than a gigabit worth). With teaming, the Speedtest.net
> would only be 1 gigabit, not 2 gigabits.

* What is this bit on color? All of the specs I have seen say "black"
and by golly, the case is painted black.
[making fun of the case color..now know 'color" in that situation
means cable color]

>
> https://www.netgear.com/home/wifi/modems/cm2050v
>
> It is $299 and has no battery backup, and is for Xfinity/Comcast.

* Battery backup...my Technicolor ha a place for an expensive battery
for backup, and Comcast claims the battery does not last; neither giving
hours, nor lifetime.
So, what is the big deal, just plug it into your overburdened UPS.

PS: that bit about the pavers seen at 4 pixels years ago using Win7 and
now gone; the present resolution is worse than i thought; we have been
dumbed down by a factor of 8 as far as i can tell.
If this crap continues, we may need multi-TerrorHertz computers to
get TTY speed results at the keyboard/console.

[Robert Baer]

* After wasting many hours of research, it seems i am NOT a liar; the
ONLY approved cable modem that supports voice and WiFi is the Netgear
C7100V, and the damn thing is Docsis 3.0!
So why should i #pend money for a modem that does what my Technicolor
does?

Gurr!

[Paul]

Robert Baer wrote:

>
> * After wasting many hours of research, it seems i am NOT a liar; the
> ONLY approved cable modem that supports voice and WiFi is the Netgear
> C7100V, and the damn thing is Docsis 3.0!
> So why should i #pend money for a modem that does what my Technicolor
> does?
>
> Gurr!

Damn. I wanted to hear how much better your new $900.00 stack
of networking boxes was working :-) And what speedtest.net
benchmark you got.

Paul

[Robert Baer]

Well, remember what i said about Google Map resolution going down
about a factor of 8?
Well i moved and Comcast changed my service ("upgrade") due to change
of account.

So now they are giving me a higher data rate which requires Docsis3.1
and that killed the use of my modem for telephone service.
Internet still works; operationally drags a bit tho.

I think Comcast did this on purpose, so i will have to get that ONE
Docsis 3.1 cable modem that supports Ethernet and voice but NOT WiFi.
That way, i can have my telephone back!

Pisses me off no end.

Why do I insist on WiFi? To support my "smart" phone in this "1-3
bar" environment.

[Paul]

But isn't it one of these plus a Wifi, and you're done ?

https://www.netgear.com/home/wifi/modems/cm1150v

That has four Ethernet off the back. One of the Ethernet can
be run to a separate Wifi box.

TP-Link Archer A8 AC1900 Wireless MU-MIMO WiFi Router $80

https://www.newegg.com/tp-link-archer-a8/p/0E6-002W-006B7

Paul

[Robert Baer]

* Pete and re-Pete: there are no Docsis 3.1 cable modems that support
Ethernet, voice, and WiFi.

>
> https://www.netgear.com/home/wifi/modems/cm1150v
* Does not support WiFi. Seems crazy to have a clutter of equipment just
to have WiFi.

>
> That has four Ethernet off the back. One of the Ethernet can
> be run to a separate Wifi box.

* Seems crazy to have a clutter of equipment just to have WiFi.

>
> TP-Link Archer A8 AC1900 Wireless MU-MIMO WiFi Router  $80

* My now useless Technicolor TC8405C has it all, it is Docsis 3.0 - so
would that do for that WiFi scheme? Cost $0.00
Do not care about speed, to support my "smart' phone only.


>
> https: //www.newegg.com/tp-link-archer-a8/p/0E6-002W-006B7
>
>    Paul

[Paul]

Robert Baer wrote:

> * My now useless Technicolor TC8405C has it all, it is Docsis 3.0 - so
> would that do for that WiFi scheme? Cost $0.00
> Do not care about speed, to support my "smart' phone only.

New-modem --------- Old-modem
Eth Eth
LAN port Lan port

As long as the two modems have GbE Ethernet, they have MDI/MDIX
for ethernet wiring, and whether the cable used is straight thru
or rolled, it should work. GbE ports remove the uncertainty about
cable type. It's the 100BT that usually require pissing around
with cables until you get the right one in there.

You're supposed to be able to connect from switch to switch.

Logically speaking, this config

WAN LAN LAN LAN LAN

is actually a five port switch, where the port labeled
"WAN" is just rolled with respect to the wiring plan of
the LAN ports. That's so the WAN port can be connected
with a straight thru cable, to the upstream modem.

If you have this only (as the technicolor 8305C does)...

LAN LAN LAN LAN

you are supposed to be able to use a LAN port in the same way.

I would expect the 8305C would work better if the configuration
interface was told not to expect a cable signal on the cable
connector. The 8305C can then provide telephone, more wired ports,
and the Wifi should work. That's because the 8305C would still be
a router, and be routing between the Wifi module and the switch
ports labeled "LAN".

I've never tried anything like that here, so have no hands
on with that method.

Paul