can't make the '3 file boot disk'
James Hanley
I set the bios to look at the floppy. I booted, but it doesn't
recognise it as a boot disk, it says "disk error" as if it's any old
disk, not a boot disk.
Attributes are A SHR for ntdetect.com and ntldr
boot.ini is A SH
Those are the same attributes that those files have on my hard drive.
I think I obeyed
http://support.microsoft.com/?kbid=305595
which is an explanation of how to make this 3 file boot disk thing,
but I can't get it to work.
Spajky
wrote:
>I put the 3 files: ntdetect.com, ntldr, boot.ini onto a floppy.
>I set the bios to look at the floppy. I booted, but it doesn't
>recognise it as a boot disk, it says "disk error" as if it's any old
>disk, not a boot disk.
>
>Attributes are A SHR for ntdetect.com and ntldr
>boot.ini is A SH
>
>Those are the same attributes that those files have on my hard drive.
MBR is NOT the same!!! (thats why for NT5 family!)
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James Hanley
> On 6 Oct 2004 07:54:13 -0700, jamesh...@yahoo.co.uk (James Hanley)
> wrote:
>
> >I put the 3 files: ntdetect.com, ntldr, boot.ini onto a floppy.
> >I set the bios to look at the floppy. I booted, but it doesn't
> >recognise it as a boot disk, it says "disk error" as if it's any old
> >disk, not a boot disk.
> >
> >Attributes are A SHR for ntdetect.com and ntldr
> >boot.ini is A SH
> >
> >Those are the same attributes that those files have on my hard drive.
>
> MBR is NOT the same!!! (thats why for NT5 family!)
It's a method described on the MS knowledge base. I think it's meant
to work with a FAT 12 disk. What am I meant to do with the MBR to make
it work?
Article
"How To Create a Boot Disk for an NTFS or FAT Partition in Windows XP"
http://support.microsoft.com/?kbid=305595
Spajky
wrote:
>> MBR is NOT the same!!! (thats why for NT5 family!)
>
>It's a method described on the MS knowledge base. I think it's meant
>to work with a FAT 12 disk. What am I meant to do with the MBR to make
>it work?
I don´t know ...
Robert Baer
Boot floppies have two hidden files at the start of the data area;
they are called (for some strange reason) the boot record (maybe because
they are required to boot, perhaps).
In essence, take a blank floppy and FORMAT /S (the /S means "transfer
the system to it).
Also COMMAND.COM is the third file (name may be different for Win2K).
Now, i understand that XP has no DOS, and that if it did, that /S does
not work, and there is no SYS command to transfer those critical boot
files.
So, it may not be possible to make an XP boot floppy in XP.
Kadaitcha Man
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!!! What a fucking load of shit.
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Jim Berwick
news:48578a8f03b04613...@news-text.bhandari.pvt.np:
> BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!!! What a fucking load of shit.
>
Seriously. The "two hidden files" do not make the disk bootable. The
bootloader that gets written makes it bootable. XP does not have a
"startup disk". You can either boot off the CD to a recovery console, or
download a disk creator set from MS. I don't know how many floppies XP
uses, but 2000 makes a set of 4 floppies to boot the setup program off of
so you can either reinstall or recover from a problem.
Kadaitcha Man
> XP does not have a "startup disk".
> I don't know how many floppies XP uses
See if you can detect the incongruity.
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Thor
"Jim Berwick" <ji...@snip.net> wrote in message
news:Xns957E41F866...@207.103.26.26...
XP uses 6 floppies for it's startup disk set.
James Hanley
you can do a different type of boot disk with 1 floppy. XP will use
the 3 files on the floppy instead, and load windows xp.
That is the one i'm having trouble creating
James Hanley
Well there is a MS knowledge base article on it posted earlier by me
in the thread
I still don't have the answer.
i'll avoid your 'hidden file' mysticism(it's correct but you're acting
like a pawn that is sucking up MS propaganda). And i'll ignore the far
worse bwaha idiot that thinks he knows best and won't help.
You're right about the /s Do format /? in XP and /s is not listed.
It's a different format command than the one in 98. That bwahaha idiot
is making a lot of fuss over nothing. And you're right that there's no
sys command in xp.
Yeah, msdos boot disks have 3 'hidden files'. Files that are very
visible,
do a dir /a or even look at them in windows (view..folder
options..2 stupid options need setting - it was 1 option in 98, now xp
needs 2).
The files just have their attributes set as Read only and Hidden and
even Archive. They are not really hidden, it's just a gimmick option
so that simple users can't mess things up. The logic being that since
they don't know the files exist, they can't do something stupid like
delete them or open them in notepad and change them, and pay 200
dollars for a 'man' to come in to fix it.
Microsoft is right, but there should be an 'expert' option. (of course
naming it 'expert' is patronizing, but the greater of 2 evils when the
alternative is calling it 'non-retard' (the retards will find the
option and get upset, complain, sue and stop buying MS products).
Anyhow!!
The files (whose attributes are set to read only hidden and system and
even archive) on a dos boot disk are io.sys msdos.sys and
command.com
XP does actually have an option to create a start up disk, (right
click 3.5" A drive) but I found - at least on my windows xp version -
that it creates a crippled Win ME disk
( nobobdy in their right mind would want to use it, it lacks important
commands like fdisk, and you can't put new ones on from win98 because
it's a diff version so you get 'incorrect msdos version' and you can't
put setver on from win98 because it's the wrong version. so setver
doesn't actually say it's the wrong version - presumably because ms
thought that'd be too stupid in an ironic way, so it just says nothing
when you run the win98 setver on an me disk. )
Anyhow!! This is all a bit off topic (though hopefully of interest). I
am just trying to follow the article in the MS Knowledge base, whose
link is earlier in the thread, that says I should format the disk and
put those 3 files (NOT THE DOS FILES. But 3 XP files) on there and it
should get me into xp.
Obviously if I put io.sys msdos.sys and command.com (not 'windows
xp' command.com God forbid!) on there then i'd go to dos and it'd be a
dos boot disk. And I don't want that. I want this Win XP 1 floppy boot
disk with 3 winXP files ntdetect.com and ntldr and boot.ini. Those
are the only files that should be on the disk (either that or MS is
unclear)
Robert Baer
I see where you are coming from, but i cannot be of any more
help,because i do not have WinXP (to fiddle with for an answer).
Jim Berwick
news:930a4bf.04101...@posting.google.com:
> I want this Win XP 1 floppy boot
> disk with 3 winXP files ntdetect.com and ntldr and boot.ini. Those
> are the only files that should be on the disk (either that or MS is
> unclear)
>
You are not comprehending that a boot disk is not just a few files needed
to boot the OS. It requires other changes to the diskette so that the
computer knows there is an OS on the disk, and knows how to start that OS.
Also, you don't need a diskette for XP, simply boot off of the XP
installation CD and choose recovery console.
James Hanley
> jamesh...@yahoo.co.uk (James Hanley) wrote in
> news:930a4bf.04101...@posting.google.com:
>
> > I want this Win XP 1 floppy boot
> > disk with 3 winXP files ntdetect.com and ntldr and boot.ini. Those
> > are the only files that should be on the disk (either that or MS is
> > unclear)
> >
>
> You are not comprehending that a boot disk is not just a few files needed
> to boot the OS. It requires other changes to the diskette so that the
> computer knows there is an OS on the disk, and knows how to start that OS.
I was starting to suspect that. I'll try a few things, like installing
win2k(nt5) and formatting it with that. And i'll try making the set of
6 boot disks and doing diskcopy a: a: then deleting the files on the
destination disk and putting the 3 files on. And i'll try that free
prog made by the ppl that made ntfsread, that will let me format a
floppy at ntfs.
And i'll try norton disk editor and see if that tells me anything -
i'm sure it will.
> Also, you don't need a diskette for XP, simply boot off of the XP
> installation CD and choose recovery console.
I should be able to use a disk too. a disk is more convenient,
becasue i may not have the cd at hand and if I don't then a disk can
be made with files available on the internet.
I'll implement some of those ideas i mentioned and report back for the
sake of the archives.
Trent©
>Kadaitcha Man <nos...@rainx.cjb.net> wrote in
>news:48578a8f03b04613...@news-text.bhandari.pvt.np:
>
>> BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!!! What a fucking load of shit.
>>
>
>Seriously. The "two hidden files" do not make the disk bootable. The
>bootloader that gets written makes it bootable. XP does not have a
>"startup disk".
Sure it does...a boot disk. I use one all the time.
> You can either boot off the CD to a recovery console, or
>download a disk creator set from MS.
Or you can boot from a floppy.
Have a nice one...
Trent
Budweiser: Helping ugly people have sex since 1876!
Trent©
Hanley) wrote:
>"Thor" <m...@arms.com> wrote in message news:<10mi8lt...@corp.supernews.com>...
>> "Jim Berwick" <ji...@snip.net> wrote in message
>> news:Xns957E41F866...@207.103.26.26...
>> > Kadaitcha Man <nos...@rainx.cjb.net> wrote in
>> > news:48578a8f03b04613...@news-text.bhandari.pvt.np:
>> >
>> >> BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!!! What a fucking load of shit.
>> >>
>> >
>> > Seriously. The "two hidden files" do not make the disk bootable. The
>> > bootloader that gets written makes it bootable. XP does not have a
>> > "startup disk". You can either boot off the CD to a recovery console, or
>> > download a disk creator set from MS. I don't know how many floppies XP
>> > uses, but 2000 makes a set of 4 floppies to boot the setup program off of
>> > so you can either reinstall or recover from a problem.
>>
>> XP uses 6 floppies for it's startup disk set.
>
>you can do a different type of boot disk with 1 floppy. XP will use
>the 3 files on the floppy instead, and load windows xp.
>That is the one i'm having trouble creating
I use one here, Jim.
Read the .ini file on the floppy. Did you get it from the
computer?...or did you build it? Are you pointing it to the proper
partition?...or some other minor error?
Also, consider a bad floppy...or floppy drive. And make sure you
don't have any system files on the floppy. If necessary, reformat
with XP. AFAIK, it needs to be an XP floppy.
Good luck...let us know.
Trent©
XP boots easily from just 1 boot disk...as per the white paper
referenced.
James Hanley
Thanks you're right.
Turned out I had to format it in XP (either with format.com within xp,
or with 'my computer' within xp - deselecting dos boot disk).
When using a sector editor like Roadkil's sector editor and probably
the great 'Partition Table Doctor', it shows you the first sector of
the disk.
With a disk formatted in XP, (with format.com or with 'My Computer'
with dos boot disk deselected), you can see the words NTDETECT written
in the first sector. As oppose to when a DOS boot disk is created,
then you see the words IO.SYS and MSDOS.SYS written in. You also see
the exact text of the error you get when it tries to boot off the
disk, and those files it's looking for aren't on the disk.
Having a sector editor handy to look at the disk really clarifies
things.
Currently, neither an XP boot disk nor the XP boot record required is
available on www.bootdisk.com
note:
The boot record on the 6 setup disk set is different from the one
required to for a single boot floppy, do it's no use downloading that
from the net and running diskcopy a: a: