Changed Vanguard account number

[Marc Auslander]

My Vanguard account was converted to Brokerage and got a new account
number. Can I convert my existing Quicken account to the new number to
get a continuity of activity?

I tried the obvious ways and I always wind up with the transfer out
entries (from the old account) but no transfer in entries. If I delete
the transfer out entries the account "looks" correct but I'm concerned
this is not the right way to go.

To be explicit, my last try was to inactivate the account, then
reactivate, which offered the old an new account numbers. I linked the
new number to the existing Quicken account and told Quicken to ignore
the old number. The account details now look correct, with the new
number, but the transfers in were not recorded.

If I just create a new account for the new number, the transfer in
entries appear, so the data is correct at Vanguard.

[John Pollard]

I have been reluctant to post because I can't explain your results; and I'm not sure I can help you get better results. But since no one else has commented, I will tell you my experience, with an offer to try to help.

I made the same "conversion" (from a Vanguard mutual fund account to a Vanguard brokerage account) back in May 2020. I did not experience any problems with that "conversion": but I used a different approach than you. I created a New Vanguard investment account, and used the Quicken "Transfer shares between accounts" pseudo-transaction to "move" my shares from the old Quicken Vanguard account to the new Quicken Vanguard account (ignoring/deleting all Vanguard transactions intended to treat the "transfer" of assets).

I handle every such transfer/conversion - regardless of account type - the same way. That is, I always create a new Quicken account and transfer/move the assets from the old Quicken account to the new Quicken account. While I understand why others prefer to keep the same Quicken account; I find that creating a new account relieves me of any need to "remember" (memories not always being reliable) that such a transfer/move took place: I have an unmistakable Quicken record that it did.

Despite my preference, I see no reason why your approach (deactivating the old account, removing traces of the old account's association, then re-activating and linking the download from the new Vanguard account to the old Quicken Vanguard account) would not work.

But, I also do not understand exactly what specific steps you've taken, nor what specific "transfers" are missing (or why).

[Marc Auslander]

Thank you for your input.

The only thing "missing" is the transfer in to the new account number.
I deleted the transfer out transactions and the account is "correct".
I've hesitated to create a transaction to make sure it would download -
I'll probably just wait for the end of the quarter. This account has
very little activity.

[John Pollard]

On Sunday, February 20, 2022 at 7:38:52 PM UTC-6, Marc Auslander wrote:
> On 2/20/2022 12:09 PM, John Pollard wrote:

> > But, I also do not understand exactly what specific steps you've taken,
> > nor what specific "transfers" are missing (or why).

> The only thing "missing" is the transfer in to the new account number.
> I deleted the transfer out transactions and the account is "correct".
> I've hesitated to create a transaction to make sure it would download -

I'm still confused about that "missing" transfer.

If you deactivated the original Quicken account for downloading, then re-activated that Quicken account for downloading, while linking the newly downloaded Vanguard transactions to the old deactivated account; there should not be any transfers involved.

Vanguard certainly would not know which approach you would take (creating a new Quicken account, or pointing the download to the old Quicken account), so Vanguard may well have sent some sort of transfer -thinking you would have created a new Quicken account, attempting to replicate exactly what happened at Vanguard.

But when you elect to treat the old Quicken account as the new Vanguard account (which I understand you to have done); no transfer (in or out) should be necessary, or could be valid. Indeed, any transfer (generated by Vanguard) that assumed you would create a new Quicken account, should be rejected/deleted.

As I understand the approach you took, you were electing to have it appear in Quicken that no new Vanguard account was ever created - that no matter what happened in the real-world - your Quicken account remained linked to the same real-world account.

The only time any transfers would be applicable to handle your situation would be if you created a new account in Quicken to hold the assets in the new Vanguard account. And even then, it is unlikely that Vanguard would have (or could have) downloaded correct transfers: in that situation, it is best to have Quicken generate the transfers ... as I did when I chose to create a new Quicken Vanguard account.

[Marc Auslander]

On the Vanguard side, the old account showed transfer out transactions
for the two mutual funds involved. The new account showed transfer in
transactions for the new accounts mutual funds.

On the Quicken side, the final download of the old account showed the
transfer out transactions.

If I simply start a new Quicken account (your sage advice) the transfer
in transactions appear.

But if I link the new Vanguard account to the old Quicken account, the
transfer in transactions do not appears. I've done so many experiments
I really can't look at the logs - I should have - but my guess it that
Quicken though the transactions had already posted.

Thanks for your time. I am sure that either its fine already or I can
make it OK.

[John Pollard]

On Monday, February 21, 2022 at 9:04:58 AM UTC-6, Marc Auslander wrote:

> On the Vanguard side, the old account showed transfer out transactions
> for the two mutual funds involved. The new account showed transfer in
> transactions for the new accounts mutual funds.

As noted earlier: since Vanguard has no idea how the Quicken user will treat the switch to a new Vanguard account, Vanguard sends transactions intended by Vanguard to cover the situation where the Quicken user elects to create a new Quicken account. "Transfers" out of the old account, and "transfers" into the new account.

When the user elects to link the new financial institution account to the old Quicken account for that financial institution, none of those "transfers" is needed, nor should any be Accepted.

> On the Quicken side, the final download of the old account showed the
> transfer out transactions.
>
> If I simply start a new Quicken account (your sage advice) the transfer
> in transactions appear.

See above: in either case, you should probably delete any "transfer" transactions supplied by the financial institution.

When you link the new financial institution account to the old Quicken account, no "transfer" has occurred (neither "out" nor "in") and none should be recorded in Quicken.

When you create a new Quicken account for the new financial institution account, you should use the Quicken "Shares Transferred Between Accounts", to insure that the shares and their cost basis are correctly "transferred" from the old Quicken account to the new Quicken account.

[NOTE 1. To clarify the term "transfers": while I don't recall exactly what transaction type(s) the financial institution sends; in Quicken, the transactions are one "Shares Removed" for each security in the old Quicken account, and one "Shares Added" in the new Quicken account for each lot of each security owned in the old Quicken account and transferred to the new Quicken account.]

[NOTE 2. The financial institutions virtually never get the "Shares Added" transactions for the new account correct. For one thing, the financial institution may not even know which individual lots you held, if those were lots of a security which were not purchased in the old account. And when securities have been transferred from one financial institution to another in the real-world, the cost-basis of those securities may not have been correctly transferred.]

[NOTE 3. The Quicken pseudo-transaction, "Shares Transferred Between Accounts", generates the necessary "Shares Removed" transaction(s) in the old account and the necessary "Shares Added" in the new account. There is no such thing as an actual "Shares Transferred Between Accounts" transaction recorded in a Quicken account.]