Real PLayer CODECs
Semi Head
Are you saying :
if i use this JetAudio (17mg) Audio/Video program.... i can (should)
dump my current audio & video player programs?
like :
Real Player Basic
WinAmp
Windows Media Player
QuickTime (Apple's)
Flash 5.0
What you've suggested sounds great but i want to be sure i understand,
all that you suggest.
I mean, "would JA be the only audio/video program i need to do what the
above programs do?"
"or do i need to keep some or all of them?"
>You stated;
>Still I'll be using bsplayer for videos and
>winamp2.8 for audio.
>
Please explain,
what this JA program would (can) replace.
would un_installing the audio/video programs (listed above) cause dll or
missing files errors?
Please explain, in greater detail!
Thanks,
S_H
-----------------------------------------------
From:
spa...@myrealbox.com (Jeroen)
JC wrote:
Get Jetaudio Basic 5. It plays most files - real audio, real video, ogg,
mp3, wav, flac, ape etc.
It is a 17mb download, but its worth it. www.jetaudio.com
Thanks buddie!
..
Just tested this and it works! Jetaudio plays realmedia (audio and
video) *without* realplayer installed!
This is a player that truly plays everything you feed it.
It's even got its own real and quicktime plugins!
No need for them anymore.
Only downside is the whopping 17mb you have to install, but just
consider how big realplayer and quicktime are.
I tested it for spyware too, and it has none.
The setup procedure is very straightforward (unlike realplayer) and the
player is very stable.
Only thing is: why the hell is it called jetaudio? This is quite
misleading as you can play just about anything with it.
Still I'll be using bsplayer for videos and winamp2.8 for audio.
These are much lighter and faster. But Jetaudio is a great alternative
if you want streaming media and are tired of realplayer and quicktime.
PS: bob and co.:
this is what you need if you want streaming media!
Roger Parks
encrypted; what besides checking for codecs?)
Don't know what is communicated; but it might be something to keep an eye on
(as the concern with Real has been privacy). I personally plan on running
some tests to see if it accumulates information during its operation. The
link to MS may be blockable with a firewall, allowing other updates to occur
(it effects a clear connection to Jetaudio).
Otherwise, the quality seems superb in all operations - the advantages of
WMP9 without having to have it.
"bob" <m...@privacy.net> wrote in message
news:Xns93655D...@130.133.1.4...
> Semi Head wrote:
>
>> Are you saying :
>> if i use this JetAudio (17mg) Audio/Video program.... i can (should)
>> dump my current audio & video player programs?
>
> Here's a summary of what Jet Audio can handle:
>
> It has options to be your default Audio CD and DVD Player, and it
> supports these file types:
>
> 669
> AMF
> AMS
> ASF
> ASX
> APE
> AVI
> DBM
> DMF
> DIVX
> FAR
> IMS
> IT
> KAR
> M3U
> MDL
> MED
> MID
> MOD
> MP2
> MP3
> MPG
> MTM
> OGG
> OKT
> PLS
> PTM
> RA
> RAM
> RM
> RMI
> S3M
> ULT
> UMX
> VOB
> WAV
> WAX
> WMA
> WMV
> WVX
> XM
>
> I haven't tried it for anything except Real Media (including streaming
> audio/video), so I can't comment on the rest. But from the list, you can
> see that it's a comprehensive player. But it's never a good idea to dump
> a player you're happy with. Jet Audio may be excellent at playing the
> above file types, but you may still prefer the "look and feel" of WinAmp,
> Quicktime, etc. That's for you to decide. In the meantime, Jet Audio
> can do what the others cannot - namely play Real Media, including
> streaming media, without having RealPlayer or external codecs installed
> on your machine. For me, that's worth the 17 MB download, regardless of
> any other file types it can handle.
>
> I'll probably never test JA with the other file types since I'm already
> happy with WinAmp for audio and QuickTime for video and see no need for
> change. YMMV.
>
> bob
>
Semi Head
S_H
Roger Parks
> "Roger Parks" wrote:
>
>> It establishes an encrypted connection with MS during the update
>> check. (Why encrypted; what besides checking for codecs?)
>
> in any program, just on principle, but that doesn't sound too hot. How did
> you identify the connection?
Yep.....under preferences. I deactivated auto update out of principle; but
was curious what would happen during an update with a sniffer running.
>
>> Don't know what is communicated; but it might be something to keep an
>> eye on (as the concern with Real has been privacy). I personally plan
>> on running some tests to see if it accumulates information during its
>> operation. The link to MS may be blockable with a firewall, allowing
>> other updates to occur (it effects a clear connection to Jetaudio).
>
> Sounds good! Let us know your technique (e.g. packet sniffer, etc.) as well
> as your results. :-)
Well, when I get time I'll shut down everything but JA; do a complete
system/registry scan; do some streaming and playin'; do another scan and see
what changed. Find out if it's keeping a log somewhere.
will then sniff it during an update and scan again to see if the log
changes. Worse case is that it keeps an encrypted log which it then sends
during update (I'll compare the contents of the log with the contents of the
encrypted communications).
But I'm -hoping- that I am simply overly suspicious :-)
Roger Parks
> system/registry scan; do some streaming and playin'; do another scan and see
> what changed. Find out if it's keeping a log somewhere.
>
> will then sniff it during an update and scan again to see if the log
> changes. Worse case is that it keeps an encrypted log which it then sends
> during update (I'll compare the contents of the log with the contents of the
> encrypted communications).
>
> But I'm -hoping- that I am simply overly suspicious :-)
>
Well, I did that........ and also ran file and registry access monitoring
tools during update. This is quite a critter!
1. During playing and streaming, it does not appear to consistently create
logs - though it does frequently reference/update: application
data\cowon\jetaudio\jetaudio.sdb and program files/jetaudio/jadplugins.cache
However, one should note that -MS- creates detailed logs both in the
registry and in the file system; files that JA subsequently references.
2. During streaming, it appears to access only the source site.
3. During updates, JA appears to access all of the registry logs created by
MS; plus ntuser.dat
4. During updates, JA creates and deletes a number of encrypted working
files; you may find 2 to 3 relics that it forgets to delete (mine were
created in c:\temp). Named iru3.tmp; iru5.tmp; FB70......tmp.
5. The encrypted communications with MS is intermittent....... don't know if
it is triggered by the content of those encrypted working files; the
calendar; or perhaps some info transferred "in the clear"-advising JA that a
report or download is necessary.
6. Because of the intermittent nature of this connection, I could not tell
what was sent. Because it was a TLS connection, it could have been the
encrypted work files, yet again encrypted for transfer. I wouldn't be able
to crack that.
7. During updates, JA will occasionally (not always) access "armadillo"; a
DRM bot that it installed in the registry under:
HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\The Silicon Realms
Toolworks\Armadillo\\{0D5770197E405C419}.
The information in this key is encrypted. I didn't spend much time at the
site (maybe someone else can check them out), but they appear to either
intercept reads and check DRM, or else they use some sort of encryption
key........... I don't have a lot of time to track this down.
Conclusions: This thing seems to collect a lot of local info at update time.
If I were to continue using it, I would consider either NOT updating it
(i.e. periodically uninstall it; clean out the registry; and load in a new
one), or else first run spybot and mru-blaster (to clear out those logs),
and replace jetaudio.sdb and jadplugins.cache with "virgin" versions (i.e.
copy these files immediately after install; use the installed versions
during updates).
But this strategy might well fail; this fellow is very tricky.
I'm undecided, but inclined to remove it. Sad; the quality of playback of
this thing is superb!
Will be interesting to see what others (with more time) can learn about it.
p.s. I'm no expert on this kind of analysis.............may be many mistakes
here.
Alisdair
> Conclusions: This thing seems to collect a lot of local info at
> update time. If I were to continue using it, I would consider
> either NOT updating it (i.e. periodically uninstall it; clean out
> the registry; and load in a new one), or else first run spybot and
> mru-blaster (to clear out those logs), and replace jetaudio.sdb
> and jadplugins.cache with "virgin" versions (i.e. copy these files
> immediately after install; use the installed versions during
> updates).
>
> But this strategy might well fail; this fellow is very tricky.
>
> I'm undecided, but inclined to remove it. Sad; the quality of
> playback of this thing is superb!
>
>
Thanks Roger! Very good report on the wee beastie. You may be right
WRT DRM reportage to MS. If one decided not to update and not use the
streaming, it might be worth keeping. I think that I'll keep it
installed on my test box if for no other reason than to be able to
play those pesky REAL files.
--
Cheers,
Alisdair
"There are three things which are real: God, human folly and
laughter." Ramayana
Reply to: arj...@vafvtugoo.pbz ROT13
Roger Parks
>> created by MS; plus ntuser.dat
>
> outbound communication that is outside the user's control, these are the
> only updates I know about:
>
> 1. The Auto Update that can be turned off in preferences, and that is used
> to check for later versions of the software.
>
> 2. Updates to the the registry, .sdb file, and other files on disk. This
> is a just a local update to the disk.
>
> Are you talking about a third type of update?
No, only the first type. The second type, as you note, occurs continuously.
>
> If you're just talking about Auto Update, and turning that off prevents
> outbound communications, I think I'd be satisfied. But if you're talking
> about something else, I'd be very concerned.
Only Auto Update........ which should be deactivated.
>
> Also, you mention the registsry logs and ntuser.dat are accessed during
> these communications. What about the the .sdb file? I haven't yet checked
> to see what's in the registry logs, but I do know the .sdb file contains at
> least portions of our viewing/listening history. So I'm wondering if that
> is being sent out.
Yes - I didn't check sdb and cache specifically; as I started the monitors
AFTER JA was loaded.
However, since JA accesses these files immediately upon loading, it would
have that info in memory during update. It was probably the source of some
of the info that was assembled in c:\temp.
>
>> 4. During updates, JA creates and deletes a number of encrypted
>> working files; you may find 2 to 3 relics that it forgets to delete
>> (mine were created in c:\temp). Named iru3.tmp; iru5.tmp;
>> FB70......tmp.
>
> My c:\temp file was empty. Apparently did a good job cleaning up after
> itself.
>
>> 5. The encrypted communications with MS is intermittent....... don't
>> know if it is triggered by the content of those encrypted working
>> files; the calendar; or perhaps some info transferred "in the
>> clear"-advising JA that a report or download is necessary.
>
> Okay, so you *are* talking about a third type of update?!
No. When you do an update; either the automatic type we discussed, or a
manual execution which I did, JA contacts two, and sometimes three different
sites.
>> 7. During updates, JA will occasionally (not always) access
>> "armadillo"; a DRM bot that it installed in the registry under:
>> HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\The Silicon Realms
>> Toolworks\Armadillo\\{0D5770197E405C419}.
>
> Not familiar with DRM.
Digital Rights Management.
But here's a description of Armadillo from the
> Silicon Realms Toolworks site:
>
> "Armadillo is a powerful license manager and software protection system.
> It wraps around your program like an armored shell, defending your work
> from pirates and program crackers while enforcing your license agreement.
> It allows you to add a complete ready-made registration-key and software
> protection system to your existing programs in five minutes or less --
> source code is NOT required! It works with almost any 32-bit Windows EXE,
> DLL, OCX, or screen saver file, regardless of the language it was written
> in."
>
> http://www.siliconrealms.com/
>
> So I'm guessing Armadillo is intended to prevent reverse-engineering of the
> program - specifically the WMP part since that's the only part Microsoft
> would care about.
Actually, it protects media. If it did this via encryption; and did
not accumulate a report, then that would be o.k. If it prepares a report, or
does this by intercepting OS functions (e.g. "exe"), then it is a problem.
>
>> The information in this key is encrypted. I didn't spend much time at
>> the site (maybe someone else can check them out), but they appear to
>> either intercept reads and check DRM, or else they use some sort of
>> encryption key........... I don't have a lot of time to track this
>> down.
>
> So if I'm following you, Microsoft is accessing the Armadillo key via the
> encrypted connection to make sure the WMP technology is not being cracked.
> And that may explain the registry logs and files. They may be part of the
> Armadillo protection system.
Don't know if they and MS are cooperators, competitors, or both. Suspect
that there is a lot of cooperation.
>
>> Conclusions: This thing seems to collect a lot of local info at update
>> time. If I were to continue using it, I would consider either NOT
>> updating it (i.e. periodically uninstall it; clean out the registry;
>> and load in a new one), or else first run spybot and mru-blaster (to
>> clear out those logs), and replace jetaudio.sdb and jadplugins.cache
>> with "virgin" versions (i.e. copy these files immediately after
>> install; use the installed versions during updates).
>
> If simply turning off Auto Update prevents outbound connections, then the
> above cleanup would not be necessary except for good housekeeping. But if
> you are saying the connection to Microsoft happens, regardless of whether
> you have disabled Auto Update, then it would seem advisable not to use
> JetAudio at all. Whatever information is being sent out to Microsoft, you
> can be sure it includes details of your personal computer (OS, serial
> number, etc.). They'd need that info in case you (I'm using "you"
> rhetorically :-) are caught attempting to reverse-engineer their WMP
> technology. And if information in the .sdb file is sent, then JetAudio may
> be sending details of your viewing/listening history as well.
My guess is that it is sending sdb info AND registry info. The registry info
is even more troubling, as it is accumulated for -any- media player, not
just JA.
But as mentioned earlier, this occurs during the single form of Internet
update, which you can deactivate...
> And I'm with you, the outbound connections are troubling. But I'd need
> clarification concerning whether these outbounds happen when AutoUpdate is
> turned off. Sounds like they do, in which case, I would not continue using
> the program. Even if it's not sending out our viewing habits, and is
> mainly concerned with the prevention of reverse-engineering, I'd still view
> the program as an unwelcome intrusion that is taking place without our
> consent.
>
> bob
That's where I'm ending up............................ this thing is
intrusive AND hiding
the fact that it is. And I don't know what else is in there that I didn't
catch...........
Roger Parks
> installed on my test box if for no other reason than to be able to
> play those pesky REAL files.
>
> --
> Cheers,
> Alisdair
Hey, Alisdair,
If I were keeping it, I'd go to the Real site now and click on those various .ram
files; which will result in codec updates for JA (I didn't sniff this
transaction, but it appeared to be an honest update). Then you don't have to
do it after you've accumulated data.
Alisdair
I'll have a go at that tomorrow. I may move JA to a W2K box instead
of the 98lite box just to have a bit more control over watching
things. I did get an error message from the Norton WinDoctor on that
box about a missing dll that is apparently related to the dot.Net
stuff. I didn't keep the error message, but am thinking that I could
uninstall the re-install and monitor. I'll post back what turns up.
BoB
wrote:
>>> 7. During updates, JA will occasionally (not always) access
>>> "armadillo"; a DRM bot that it installed in the registry under:
>>> HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\The Silicon Realms
>>> Toolworks\Armadillo\\{0D5770197E405C419}.
>>
>> Not familiar with DRM.
>
>Digital Rights Management.
They are discussing DRM in alt.privacy.spyware and the fiasco's
involving TurboTax and Symantec's new DRM policies.
Since DRM can write to your BIOS, sometimes without your advising
you, it is not something I would want to allow on my computer.
BoB
Alisdair
The DRM and related privacy/security concerns are being discussed in
several newgroups. It has the looks of something that should concern
all of us. I have followed the discussion over in news.grc.privacy
for the last couple of months. It's a scary thing, and I certainly
don't want it on my computers either. However, it may not be easy to
keep out.
Mike Hornsby
>BoB wrote in news:78ciav0bh9i951avf...@4ax.com:
>
>> On Thu, 24 Apr 2003 22:19:44 -0400, "Roger Parks"
><Ro...@NoSpam.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>>>> 7. During updates, JA will occasionally (not always) access
>>>>> "armadillo"; a DRM bot that it installed in the registry under:
>>>>> HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\The Silicon Realms
>>>>> Toolworks\Armadillo\\{0D5770197E405C419}.
>>>>
>>>> Not familiar with DRM.
>>>
>>>Digital Rights Management.
>>
>> They are discussing DRM in alt.privacy.spyware and the fiasco's
>> involving TurboTax and Symantec's new DRM policies.
>>
>> Since DRM can write to your BIOS, sometimes without your advising
>> you, it is not something I would want to allow on my computer.
>>
>
>The DRM and related privacy/security concerns are being discussed in
>several newgroups. It has the looks of something that should concern
>all of us. I have followed the discussion over in news.grc.privacy
>for the last couple of months. It's a scary thing, and I certainly
>don't want it on my computers either. However, it may not be easy to
>keep out.
>
Actually it is something which is not too difficult to keep out if people are:
(a) aware of it and most importantly
(b) Don't buy software which includes it
How many think that Intuit will be using the same type of DRM if any at all in next years release - they already lost a huge # of customers, myself included. Think TaxCut will be following Intuits lead and implement DRM or taking advantage of Intuit's mistake and advertising themselves as being DRM free?
How many remember the early days of copy-protected software ? It was a complete pita. Lotus 123 was the leading spreadsheet back then and an early adopter of copy protection. Think they regret that decision now? People switched to other software. Now look at their market share.
Vote with your wallets folks - its the most effective way to say you don't want that crap on your computer.
--
Posted by usenet4all.com
Thiri
> On Fri, 25 Apr 2003 13:31:48 GMT Alisdair <Alis...@disorg.invalid> wrote..
>
> >BoB wrote in news:78ciav0bh9i951avf...@4ax.com:
> >
> >> On Thu, 24 Apr 2003 22:19:44 -0400, "Roger Parks"
> <Ro...@NoSpam.com>
> >> wrote:
> >>
> >>>>> 7. During updates, JA will occasionally (not always) access
> >>>>> "armadillo"; a DRM bot that it installed in the registry under:
> >>>>> HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\The Silicon Realms
> >>>>> Toolworks\Armadillo\\{0D5770197E405C419}.
> >>>>
> >>>> Not familiar with DRM.
> >>>
> >>>Digital Rights Management.
> >>
> >> They are discussing DRM in alt.privacy.spyware and the fiasco's
> >> involving TurboTax and Symantec's new DRM policies.
> >>
> >> Since DRM can write to your BIOS, sometimes without your advising
> >> you, it is not something I would want to allow on my computer.
> >>
> >
> >The DRM and related privacy/security concerns are being discussed in
> >several newgroups. It has the looks of something that should concern
> >all of us. I have followed the discussion over in news.grc.privacy
> >for the last couple of months. It's a scary thing, and I certainly
> >don't want it on my computers either. However, it may not be easy to
> >keep out.
This is rather scary.
But going back to Real, which is suspect, Real sends me a newsletter,
from which I can access some nice music. My problem is that there does
not even seem to be a way of saving the music clip which is being
played in the Real player (free copy).
So how would I access and save these files (with the object of
deleting the Real player and playing them with JetAudio?
Sorry if this seems to be a "baby" question!
Regards,
Thiri
th...@vsnl.com