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Accessible Email Client
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Prisca
Mar 4, 2012, 9:59:57 AM3/4/12
to
With the increase of Windows 7, and the demise of Outlook Express, it is
a problem for both sighted and non sighted to find a decent email client
which is not, a) bloated, as in Outlook or b) web based.
Personally, being sighted, I use Thunderbird and have no problems with
it. However, my non sighted husband has had terrible problems with it
and flatly refuses to try it again, even though Jaws 13 has added
additional support for it. Windows Live Mail is also out for the same
reason.
I also support another blind friend long distance via Teamviewer, who is
having similar problems. Both of them have limited mobility in their
fingers, one from genetic defects and the other from nerve damage, so
they both struggle with certain key combinations. I found an old, non
supported, freeware email client called Postbox, which is based on an
earlier version of Thunderbird, and both manage to use it, but it has
its quirks and peculiarities and there is obviously no Jaws support for
it. The full paid for version has a lot of features which are surplus to
requirements for someone who can't see.
Can anyone suggest a simple, easy to use email client along the lines of
Outlook Express, which is screen reader friendly? Neither of them need
anything fancy, just the ability to read, write emails, forward and save
in folders. They don't need calendars, notes or tasks or anything else
other than the usual address book and the ability to open attachments.
If anyone can help it would be much appreciated, and also save my
patience and sanity when my irascible partner threatens to throw his
laptop out the window again. I can't afford to replace it!
Cheers
Prisca
--
Put the big cat out to reach me.
J. P. Gilliver (John)
Mar 4, 2012, 12:27:13 PM3/4/12
to
In message <YMOdnSUnIIjyHs7S...@giganews.com>, Prisca
I believe Eudora 7 point whatever can be persuaded to work under 7, and
I know that is popular with some blind users; it is however also
unsupported. (I'm not familiar with what you have to do to make it
work.) There's also a version (called Eudora OSE I think) that is really
a version of Thunderbird tricked out to look a bit like Eudora; I really
came across this when migrating a sighted but not very computer-savvy
friend to 7, and AFAIK she gets on fine with it, but I also migrated one
of my blind friends (who was also moving to 7) because he wanted to be
able to support her, and after initial learning problems he hasn't
complained. (But then he's not much of a complainer.) If you like, I can
ask him if he'd mind me giving you his details so you can ask him about
it; he likes helping others with computer problems, so I doubt he'll
mind.
I recently discovered (or was told - I didn't follow it up) that Pegasus
is alive and well under 7; again, I know nothing of how accessible it
is, but it is very venerable, so may well not be too graphics-whizzy.
(Which big cat do I put out - bigcat or leo?)
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G.5AL-IS-P--Ch++(p)Ar@T0H+Sh0!:`)DNAf
No, no, you're not thinking, you're just being logical. -Niels Bohr, physicist
(1885-1962)
<pri...@bigcat.leonin.co.uk> writes:
>
>With the increase of Windows 7, and the demise of Outlook Express, it
>is a problem for both sighted and non sighted to find a decent email
>client which is not, a) bloated, as in Outlook or b) web based.
>
>Personally, being sighted, I use Thunderbird and have no problems with
>it. However, my non sighted husband has had terrible problems with it
>and flatly refuses to try it again, even though Jaws 13 has added
>additional support for it. Windows Live Mail is also out for the same
>reason.
[]
>
>With the increase of Windows 7, and the demise of Outlook Express, it
>is a problem for both sighted and non sighted to find a decent email
>client which is not, a) bloated, as in Outlook or b) web based.
>
>Personally, being sighted, I use Thunderbird and have no problems with
>it. However, my non sighted husband has had terrible problems with it
>and flatly refuses to try it again, even though Jaws 13 has added
>additional support for it. Windows Live Mail is also out for the same
>reason.
>they both struggle with certain key combinations. I found an old, non
>supported, freeware email client called Postbox, which is based on an
>earlier version of Thunderbird, and both manage to use it, but it has
>its quirks and peculiarities and there is obviously no Jaws support for
>it. The full paid for version has a lot of features which are surplus
>to requirements for someone who can't see.
[]
>supported, freeware email client called Postbox, which is based on an
>earlier version of Thunderbird, and both manage to use it, but it has
>its quirks and peculiarities and there is obviously no Jaws support for
>it. The full paid for version has a lot of features which are surplus
>to requirements for someone who can't see.
I believe Eudora 7 point whatever can be persuaded to work under 7, and
I know that is popular with some blind users; it is however also
unsupported. (I'm not familiar with what you have to do to make it
work.) There's also a version (called Eudora OSE I think) that is really
a version of Thunderbird tricked out to look a bit like Eudora; I really
came across this when migrating a sighted but not very computer-savvy
friend to 7, and AFAIK she gets on fine with it, but I also migrated one
of my blind friends (who was also moving to 7) because he wanted to be
able to support her, and after initial learning problems he hasn't
complained. (But then he's not much of a complainer.) If you like, I can
ask him if he'd mind me giving you his details so you can ask him about
it; he likes helping others with computer problems, so I doubt he'll
mind.
I recently discovered (or was told - I didn't follow it up) that Pegasus
is alive and well under 7; again, I know nothing of how accessible it
is, but it is very venerable, so may well not be too graphics-whizzy.
(Which big cat do I put out - bigcat or leo?)
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G.5AL-IS-P--Ch++(p)Ar@T0H+Sh0!:`)DNAf
No, no, you're not thinking, you're just being logical. -Niels Bohr, physicist
(1885-1962)
Prisca
Mar 4, 2012, 2:33:07 PM3/4/12
to
Yes, please forward my details to your friend - Eudora may be the
answer, although when I tried it a few years ago I didn't like it much.
Perhaps it has improved since then.
I think Pegasus may be too complicated for both users, neither of whom
are very computer literate.
You need to put the bigcat out, leonin is the email addy - an anagram of
online and only used online to keep my personal email from getting spam.
Cheers
Prisca
Brian Gaff
Mar 4, 2012, 11:15:55 PM3/4/12
to
I dont see the problem with Live mail particularly the 2009 version which
I'm told still works on 7. Its based on Outlook express and uses the same
shortcut keys. nvda seems to work well with it too.
OK so it does have the one big pudding of the tree instead of separate
identities, but I don't find that much of a problem.
Most email clients tend to use bloated file formats i find, so its hard to
know where to go here.
I did not get on with Thunderbird either. Not terrible intuitive and laden
with daft useless features and the things you need all the time are awkward
to use.
Unfortunately, you are right, the current trend is for web based email due
I imagine to people using portable devices to read their email.
I hate webmail as the bloody interface changes at the whim of the isp and
also its not fast and does not have a common easy to understand interface.
Brian
--
Brian Gaff....Note, this account does not accept Bcc: email.
graphics are great, but the blind can't hear them
Email: bri...@blueyonder.co.uk
______________________________________________________________________________________________________________
"Prisca" <pri...@bigcat.leonin.co.uk> wrote in message
news:YMOdnSUnIIjyHs7S...@giganews.com...
I'm told still works on 7. Its based on Outlook express and uses the same
shortcut keys. nvda seems to work well with it too.
OK so it does have the one big pudding of the tree instead of separate
identities, but I don't find that much of a problem.
Most email clients tend to use bloated file formats i find, so its hard to
know where to go here.
I did not get on with Thunderbird either. Not terrible intuitive and laden
with daft useless features and the things you need all the time are awkward
to use.
Unfortunately, you are right, the current trend is for web based email due
I imagine to people using portable devices to read their email.
I hate webmail as the bloody interface changes at the whim of the isp and
also its not fast and does not have a common easy to understand interface.
Brian
--
Brian Gaff....Note, this account does not accept Bcc: email.
graphics are great, but the blind can't hear them
Email: bri...@blueyonder.co.uk
______________________________________________________________________________________________________________
"Prisca" <pri...@bigcat.leonin.co.uk> wrote in message
news:YMOdnSUnIIjyHs7S...@giganews.com...
J. P. Gilliver (John)
Mar 5, 2012, 3:14:53 AM3/5/12
to
In message <jj1elr$168$1...@dont-email.me>, Brian Gaff
gives no indication of which text is quoted and which is new text.
Earlier versions may not have this problem, and I don't know if the
problem also exists when it's used for mail (I suspect it does though).
> I did not get on with Thunderbird either. Not terrible intuitive and laden
>with daft useless features and the things you need all the time are awkward
>to use.
Sorry to hear that.
browser, including via someone else's equipment.
> I hate webmail as the bloody interface changes at the whim of the isp and
>also its not fast and does not have a common easy to understand interface.
> Brian
>
I'm much the same - and also I don't like using the web for something
that doesn't need it, and usually has lots of things - images, links,
frames, scripts - that get in the way of what I'm trying to read, which
is usually text.
now I only sin 'til ten past three" (Ogden Nash) [via Andy Breen]
<Bri...@blueyonder.co.uk> writes:
>I dont see the problem with Live mail particularly the 2009 version which
>I'm told still works on 7. Its based on Outlook express and uses the same
>shortcut keys. nvda seems to work well with it too.
The main criticism I've seen of WLM 15 is that, as a newsreader, it
>I dont see the problem with Live mail particularly the 2009 version which
>I'm told still works on 7. Its based on Outlook express and uses the same
>shortcut keys. nvda seems to work well with it too.
gives no indication of which text is quoted and which is new text.
Earlier versions may not have this problem, and I don't know if the
problem also exists when it's used for mail (I suspect it does though).
>
>OK so it does have the one big pudding of the tree instead of separate
>identities, but I don't find that much of a problem.
>Most email clients tend to use bloated file formats i find, so its hard to
>know where to go here.
(Sorry, I don't understand what you mean by those two points.)
>OK so it does have the one big pudding of the tree instead of separate
>identities, but I don't find that much of a problem.
>Most email clients tend to use bloated file formats i find, so its hard to
>know where to go here.
> I did not get on with Thunderbird either. Not terrible intuitive and laden
>with daft useless features and the things you need all the time are awkward
>to use.
>
>Unfortunately, you are right, the current trend is for web based email due
>I imagine to people using portable devices to read their email.
It does allow (a sighted person) to access their email via just a
>Unfortunately, you are right, the current trend is for web based email due
>I imagine to people using portable devices to read their email.
browser, including via someone else's equipment.
> I hate webmail as the bloody interface changes at the whim of the isp and
>also its not fast and does not have a common easy to understand interface.
> Brian
>
that doesn't need it, and usually has lots of things - images, links,
frames, scripts - that get in the way of what I'm trying to read, which
is usually text.
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G.5AL-IS-P--Ch++(p)Ar@T0H+Sh0!:`)DNAf
"When I was young I used to scintillate
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G.5AL-IS-P--Ch++(p)Ar@T0H+Sh0!:`)DNAf
now I only sin 'til ten past three" (Ogden Nash) [via Andy Breen]
Howard Schwartz
Mar 12, 2012, 9:45:06 PM3/12/12
to
Prisca <pri...@bigcat.leonin.co.uk> wrote in
news:YMOdnSUnIIjyHs7S...@giganews.com:
> Can anyone suggest a simple, easy to use email client along the lines
> of Outlook Express, which is screen reader friendly? Neither of them
> need anything fancy, just the ability to read, write emails, forward
> and save in folders. They don't need calendars, notes or tasks or
> anything else other than the usual address book and the ability to
> open attachments. Cheers
> Prisca
My client and friend, a retired, blind linguistics professor has been
using the Pine email program happily for many years. Written by the
University of Washington, it was one of the original text based email
clients for the Unix operating system, and was also ported to Dos.
Some years later, a windows version called Alpine was created.
Development of pine and alpine has stopped, but there are some groups
continuing with patches such as the repine group. P
Pine lets you choose other programs of your choice for editing, or
displaying various attachments. And you do not need a mouse and menus to
do the basic things. Your keyboard does it all: S for save D for
delete, F for foreward, R for reply -- as simple as can be.
In windows, the pine screen remains a simple uncluttered text based one.
It has menus, for those who must have them. On the other hand, it
contains hundreds of setup options to tailor it to a user's taste.
I still use it myself because of a fringe benefit: Built in anti-virus,
identity theft, and spyware protection. Almost nobody bothers to write
nasty software for such an old ``outdated'' program.
news:YMOdnSUnIIjyHs7S...@giganews.com:
> Can anyone suggest a simple, easy to use email client along the lines
> of Outlook Express, which is screen reader friendly? Neither of them
> need anything fancy, just the ability to read, write emails, forward
> and save in folders. They don't need calendars, notes or tasks or
> anything else other than the usual address book and the ability to
> Prisca
My client and friend, a retired, blind linguistics professor has been
using the Pine email program happily for many years. Written by the
University of Washington, it was one of the original text based email
clients for the Unix operating system, and was also ported to Dos.
Some years later, a windows version called Alpine was created.
Development of pine and alpine has stopped, but there are some groups
continuing with patches such as the repine group. P
Pine lets you choose other programs of your choice for editing, or
displaying various attachments. And you do not need a mouse and menus to
do the basic things. Your keyboard does it all: S for save D for
delete, F for foreward, R for reply -- as simple as can be.
In windows, the pine screen remains a simple uncluttered text based one.
It has menus, for those who must have them. On the other hand, it
contains hundreds of setup options to tailor it to a user's taste.
I still use it myself because of a fringe benefit: Built in anti-virus,
identity theft, and spyware protection. Almost nobody bothers to write
nasty software for such an old ``outdated'' program.
David LaRue
Mar 13, 2012, 6:31:30 AM3/13/12
to
Howard Schwartz <howa...@gmail.com> wrote in
news:XnsA014BEC8...@178.63.61.145:
> Prisca <pri...@bigcat.leonin.co.uk> wrote in
> news:YMOdnSUnIIjyHs7S...@giganews.com:
>
>> Can anyone suggest a simple, easy to use email client along the lines
>> of Outlook Express, which is screen reader friendly? Neither of them
>> need anything fancy, just the ability to read, write emails, forward
>> and save in folders. They don't need calendars, notes or tasks or
>> anything else other than the usual address book and the ability to
>> open attachments. Cheers
>> Prisca
Since it hasn't been mentioned I'll suggest looking at PMMail. It
started on OS/2 and is now on Windows. I like it because it is
relatively cheap, use can use it in free mode for evaluation, it is
largely text only. It is simple to use and extensible. Best of all it
doesn't register with Windows as your email client so you are free to
use it as you like. The unregistered version supports one email
account. The registered version supports multiple accounts. There
aren't many upgrades, but it works. I think that it might be good for
low sighted people because it is largely a text application. When you
get email that is HTML based it will read the text-only version of the
email. It has worked for my needs for over 17 years. I'm not a low
vision user though; I just don't like ads with my email.
Good luck,
David
news:XnsA014BEC8...@178.63.61.145:
> Prisca <pri...@bigcat.leonin.co.uk> wrote in
> news:YMOdnSUnIIjyHs7S...@giganews.com:
>
>> Can anyone suggest a simple, easy to use email client along the lines
>> of Outlook Express, which is screen reader friendly? Neither of them
>> need anything fancy, just the ability to read, write emails, forward
>> and save in folders. They don't need calendars, notes or tasks or
>> anything else other than the usual address book and the ability to
>> open attachments. Cheers
>> Prisca
started on OS/2 and is now on Windows. I like it because it is
relatively cheap, use can use it in free mode for evaluation, it is
largely text only. It is simple to use and extensible. Best of all it
doesn't register with Windows as your email client so you are free to
use it as you like. The unregistered version supports one email
account. The registered version supports multiple accounts. There
aren't many upgrades, but it works. I think that it might be good for
low sighted people because it is largely a text application. When you
get email that is HTML based it will read the text-only version of the
email. It has worked for my needs for over 17 years. I'm not a low
vision user though; I just don't like ads with my email.
Good luck,
David
J. P. Gilliver (John)
Mar 13, 2012, 4:25:29 PM3/13/12
to
In message <XnsA015424B07A...@178.63.61.145>, David LaRue
<huey...@gte.net> writes:
[]
>started on OS/2 and is now on Windows. I like it because it is
[]
I'd be a bit wary of that: quite often I get email that is HTML only,
and sometimes - emails from YouGov for example - when the email _is_ two
part, there is often something important (such as links) missing from
the text part.
you'll have to ram them down people's throats." - Howard Aiken
<huey...@gte.net> writes:
[]
>Since it hasn't been mentioned I'll suggest looking at PMMail. It
(No relation to Pegasus mail is it?)
>started on OS/2 and is now on Windows. I like it because it is
>get email that is HTML based it will read the text-only version of the
[]
I'd be a bit wary of that: quite often I get email that is HTML only,
and sometimes - emails from YouGov for example - when the email _is_ two
part, there is often something important (such as links) missing from
the text part.
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G.5AL-IS-P--Ch++(p)Ar@T0H+Sh0!:`)DNAf
"Don't worry about people stealing your ideas. If your ideas are any good,
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G.5AL-IS-P--Ch++(p)Ar@T0H+Sh0!:`)DNAf
you'll have to ram them down people's throats." - Howard Aiken
Andrew Hodgson
Mar 18, 2012, 3:12:42 PM3/18/12
to
On Tue, 13 Mar 2012 20:25:29 +0000, "J. P. Gilliver (John)"
<G6...@soft255.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>In message <XnsA015424B07A...@178.63.61.145>, David LaRue
><huey...@gte.net> writes:
>[]
>>Since it hasn't been mentioned I'll suggest looking at PMMail. It
>
>(No relation to Pegasus mail is it?)
No, PMMail is different from Pmail (Pegasus).
<G6...@soft255.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>In message <XnsA015424B07A...@178.63.61.145>, David LaRue
><huey...@gte.net> writes:
>[]
>>Since it hasn't been mentioned I'll suggest looking at PMMail. It
>
>(No relation to Pegasus mail is it?)
Pegasus Mail from version 4 isn't that wonderful with accessing
attachments, but that was a couple of years ago now.
Thunderbird I would argue is more usable with speech than WLM 15 and
the like. The WLM stuff is very bloated and slow in my opinion.
Unfortunately with JFW now though the trend is to support Outlook very
well, and that is what I switched to using a couple of years back as I
use it at work all the time as well.
Andrew.
Prisca
Mar 21, 2012, 5:36:27 PM3/21/12
to
email clients. I've taken all the suggestions on board and will try them
all out. I've found a few others to try as well.
Cheers
Deddajay
burt1...@gmail.com
Mar 24, 2012, 4:29:22 AM3/24/12
to
personally, being blind, I find thunderbird an excellent e-mail client
for most any home or small business purpose, and with a bit of
configuration can be made viable for the enterprise as well.
I would recommend NVDA for best out of the box performance, and you are
still probably better off using the latest 3.1 version instead of TB 10
or 11. I've honestly not tried 11 yet in Windows, mostly being a Linux
user, but I've used thunderbird for years in windows as well. At least
since 3 came out it is the best and most accessible alternative for the
blind in my opinion, and I'm not alone in thinking this.
If you're a jaws only person then you will want to get jaml maseri's
scripts. (maybe not for jfw13, but for anything older for sure). I think
there are still separate versions for the 3.1 and the ever changing
newer version branches.
for most any home or small business purpose, and with a bit of
configuration can be made viable for the enterprise as well.
I would recommend NVDA for best out of the box performance, and you are
still probably better off using the latest 3.1 version instead of TB 10
or 11. I've honestly not tried 11 yet in Windows, mostly being a Linux
user, but I've used thunderbird for years in windows as well. At least
since 3 came out it is the best and most accessible alternative for the
blind in my opinion, and I'm not alone in thinking this.
If you're a jaws only person then you will want to get jaml maseri's
scripts. (maybe not for jfw13, but for anything older for sure). I think
there are still separate versions for the 3.1 and the ever changing
newer version branches.
burt1...@gmail.com
Mar 24, 2012, 4:38:20 AM3/24/12
to
Yes, I guess there was/is alpine for windows, but it is also the name
for the last few versions of the program under Linux as well. It is
quite intuitive, but has some issues with strange erratic
screen-refreshes that make it less than ideal for blind folks as speakup
can't be shut up quickly when this starts. I don't know if this is an
issue under windows or not. Mutt is a bit harder to get used to, but
after a few sessions of learning keystrokes is perhaps the most
efficient e-mail client I know of for sorting through mail fast out of
the box, but I prefer thunderbird for setting up filters to presort things.
Mutt is available for windows, but again, my only experience is with the
Linux flavour. Oh, BTW: the latest alpine releases are called re-alpine
in some formats.
HTH
--
Burt
for the last few versions of the program under Linux as well. It is
quite intuitive, but has some issues with strange erratic
screen-refreshes that make it less than ideal for blind folks as speakup
can't be shut up quickly when this starts. I don't know if this is an
issue under windows or not. Mutt is a bit harder to get used to, but
after a few sessions of learning keystrokes is perhaps the most
efficient e-mail client I know of for sorting through mail fast out of
the box, but I prefer thunderbird for setting up filters to presort things.
Mutt is available for windows, but again, my only experience is with the
Linux flavour. Oh, BTW: the latest alpine releases are called re-alpine
in some formats.
HTH
Burt
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