Google Groups no longer supports new Usenet posts or subscriptions. Historical content remains viewable.
Dismiss

Where is Gotham?

2 views
Skip to first unread message

Dreamkids1

unread,
Apr 21, 1997, 3:00:00 AM4/21/97
to

What is Gotham equivelent to? Metropolis => New York Gotham => ?

Scouter227

unread,
Apr 21, 1997, 3:00:00 AM4/21/97
to

<<<What is Gotham equivelent to? Metropolis => New York Gotham =>
?>>>

I was under the impression that Gotham was in New Jersey-- but as compared
to a real city. I have heard it put this way.
Metropolis => Park Ave in broad daylight.
Gotham. => Hells Kitchen at 2 in the morning.

Hope the analgy works for you.
As always,
Scouter.

S Ray

unread,
Apr 21, 1997, 3:00:00 AM4/21/97
to

Actually, I think DC published something a few years back that located
all of the major cities in their comics. Gotham was based on New York
and Metropolis was based on Chicago. Can anyone confirm this?

Mike Post

unread,
Apr 21, 1997, 3:00:00 AM4/21/97
to

I've always thought Gotham City was based on New York; you know, murders,
crime running rampant, streets and streets of close-together roofs for
Batman to jump on. Any other thoughts or suggestions on which city
represents what?

Dreamkids1 <dream...@aol.com> wrote in article
<19970421155...@ladder01.news.aol.com>...

robert verrelli

unread,
Apr 21, 1997, 3:00:00 AM4/21/97
to

: Actually, I think DC published something a few years back that located
: all of the major cities in their comics. Gotham was based on New York
: and Metropolis was based on Chicago. Can anyone confirm this?

I can confirm that you're only partly correct.

Gotham is based on New York and Metropolis is based on Toronto (where I
am). This can be found in one of the recent lettercols in a Bat comic.
Sorry, I can't remember which one off-hand; it came out in the past few
months when someone asked about it.

I could look it up for you if you want.

...Loren T. Di Iorio
fal...@servtech.com

Dsikula

unread,
Apr 22, 1997, 3:00:00 AM4/22/97
to

While Batman was located in NYC early on (c.1940), Gotham has been home to
the Dynamic Duo for most of their careers. According to DC (and this was
in the 70s, so it's probably been retconned away), Gotham was in New
Jersey, and Metropolis was across the bridge in Delaware.
===========================================================
"Those who like this sort of thing / --Dsi...@aol.com
will find this is the sort of thing /
they like." --Abraham Lincoln /

Duffy

unread,
Apr 22, 1997, 3:00:00 AM4/22/97
to

I believe Batman's first comic book appearance had him in New York CIty. I
do not know how long it took to be Gotham.

Of course the crime rates have dropped incredibly in NY, so maybe Batman
has been here all along.

John Schroeder

unread,
Apr 22, 1997, 3:00:00 AM4/22/97
to

In note <335BC8...@eden.com>, S Ray writes:
>Actually, I think DC published something a few years back that located
>all of the major cities in their comics. Gotham was based on New York
>and Metropolis was based on Chicago. Can anyone confirm this?

In one of the issues I have, one of the editors said that Gotham was lower New
York City and Metropolis was Upper New York City. Well, at least that is what
they were based on.

Prime Supreme
---
Some adventure for fame, some adventure for glory, me I just like to blow
things up.

Incoming fire has the right of way.


cynthia

unread,
Apr 22, 1997, 3:00:00 AM4/22/97
to

Dreamkids1 wrote:
>
> What is Gotham equivelent to? Metropolis => New York Gotham => ?
Mayfair Games had exclusive rights to DC Comics for their role-playing
game. They published "The Atlas Of The DC Universe" and on their map of
the U.S. they had Metropolis in DELAWARE and Gotham City in NEW JERSEY.
I think you can still get it at comic and game shops.

Rswatski

unread,
Apr 22, 1997, 3:00:00 AM4/22/97
to

Here's my 2 cents for what it's worth: I always thought Gotham was Gotham
(somewhere in the northeast--NJ) and New York was New York in its present
location. I'm not positive, but I vaguely remember reading somewhere that
Metropolis is based on Toronto and located somewhere in its general
vicinity. Gotham, while it is undoubtably based on NY, is a separate
city. For example, in a recent Spectre (no. 51--excellent issue, by the
way: Batman: "Sometimes I think they should just put a revolving door on
Arkham Asylum"), Batman left Gotham for NY to track The Joker down and
bring him back. Also, I think Bludhaven (current home of Nightwing) is in
the general area of Baltimore--it's always referred to as south of Gotham.

Rob

Alleycat

unread,
Apr 22, 1997, 3:00:00 AM4/22/97
to

So where's Keystone City?

Alleycat
Planning a vacation in the DC Universe... (It's a joke, son)

robert verrelli

unread,
Apr 23, 1997, 3:00:00 AM4/23/97
to


: Here's my 2 cents for what it's worth: I always thought Gotham was Gotham


: (somewhere in the northeast--NJ) and New York was New York in its present
: location. I'm not positive, but I vaguely remember reading somewhere that
: Metropolis is based on Toronto and located somewhere in its general
: vicinity. Gotham, while it is undoubtably based on NY, is a separate
: city. For example, in a recent Spectre (no. 51--excellent issue, by the

So it wasn't just me who thought Metropolis was based on Toronto! Thanks
for helping out. Like I said previously, I, too, read that somewhere. I
went through all the Bat-comics and related titles that I have from the
past half year, but came up empty in the lettercols. It's gotta be
somewhere, though. Maybe it was in a recent Wizard...

(a few minutes pass...)

Just found the October '96 Wizard #62. On page 10, in answer to this
question, the editor (or whatever position Jim McLauchlin fills) states
that:

"...the fact of the matter is...that Gotham is loosely based on New York,
while Metropolis is based on Toronto."

Hope that clears things up for everyone.

: bring him back. Also, I think Bludhaven (current home of Nightwing) is in


: the general area of Baltimore--it's always referred to as south of Gotham.

That's a viable possibility. Good call.

Tzen-Ping Liu

unread,
Apr 23, 1997, 3:00:00 AM4/23/97
to

In <5jglev$3ud$1...@post.servtech.com> fal...@cyber1.servtech.com (robert


verrelli) writes:
>
>
>: Actually, I think DC published something a few years back that located
>: all of the major cities in their comics. Gotham was based on New York
>: and Metropolis was based on Chicago. Can anyone confirm this?
>

>I can confirm that you're only partly correct.
>
>Gotham is based on New York and Metropolis is based on Toronto (where I
>am). This can be found in one of the recent lettercols in a Bat comic.
>Sorry, I can't remember which one off-hand; it came out in the past few
>months when someone asked about it.
>
>I could look it up for you if you want.

In an afterword written by Dennis O'Neil for the novelization of
Knightfall, he states Gotham is "New York's mirror-world counterpart."
He also adds "Batman's Gotham City is Manhattan below Fourteenth Street
at eleven minutes past midnight on the coldest night in November." But
don't get me wrong, Wizard Magazine stated New York does exist in the
DCU (just read Green Lantern or Spectre) and is a one (or two) hour
drive from Gotham. Though Metropolis was originally based on Toronto
by Siegal $ Schuster, it has taken more New York characteristics for
nearly 60 years. What I find ridiculous is the fact that the Statue of
Liberty appears in Metropolis in Superman IV and in Gotham in Batman
Forever. (GAH!)

Vince Liu

Nathan Kennedy

unread,
Apr 23, 1997, 3:00:00 AM4/23/97
to

Tzen-Ping Liu wrote:

Forever. (GAH!)

Vince Liu

It was not actually the statue of liberty. It had a sword or shield or
something. It was more like the statue you see in "The Shadow of the
Bat" episodes of the animated series.

--
"I do it for the weak, and the scared, and the oppressed. I do it for
the victims - the innocent - the abused.
I do it to try to end the suffering ... and I do it for the nobodies" -
Batman.
(Batman: Shadow of the Bat #13).


RATMAN

unread,
Apr 24, 1997, 3:00:00 AM4/24/97
to

They're both New York, Actually.

New York was actually called Gotham City back in the twenties, and if
you remember the movie SUPERMAN, he and Lois Lane were flying around the
Statue of Liberty. I guess Tricorner would be Brooklyn(right across the
river from Gotham).

Tzen-Ping Liu

unread,
Apr 24, 1997, 3:00:00 AM4/24/97
to

In <5jll8t$7d8$1...@post.servtech.com> fal...@cyber3.servtech.com (robert
verrelli) writes:
>
>
>: drive from Gotham. Though Metropolis was originally based on Toronto

>: by Siegal $ Schuster, it has taken more New York characteristics for
>: nearly 60 years. What I find ridiculous is the fact that the Statue of
>: Liberty appears in Metropolis in Superman IV and in Gotham in Batman
>: Forever. (GAH!)
>
>Ah, but now you're mixing comics and movies, two totally different
>mediums. The movies always screw up what's put into the comics.

Yeah, I know. That was my whole point.

Even worse is television. An example is an early episode of Lois & Clark
(I believe it was the first season) where Clark is shown flying from
Metropolis, where New York should be, to China. But later, Clark flies
home to Smallville, Kansas and explains his tardiness due to an electrical
storm over Cleveland. Now how is Cleveland along the flight path from the
eastern seaboard to Kansas? My best guess is it was just a blurb to pay
homage to Siegal & Schuster.

BTW, it was in a recent issue of Wizard Magazine stating Gotham was a one
(or two) hour drive from New York and Metropolis. And somehow
Bludhaven is in between. Talk about some crowded demographics.

Vince Liu

SDH

unread,
Apr 25, 1997, 3:00:00 AM4/25/97
to

Someone wrote:


> >What I find ridiculous is the fact that the Statue of
> >: Liberty appears in Metropolis in Superman IV and in Gotham in
Batman Forever. (GAH!)


Call me crazy, but I think the statue in the comics AND the movie is
the Lady Gotham of something ridiculous like that... I know I've heard
it mentioned in the books at one point or another...

-SDH

Corey Finnegan

unread,
Apr 26, 1997, 3:00:00 AM4/26/97
to

robert verrelli (fal...@cyber3.servtech.com) wrote:

> (a few minutes pass...)

Actually, Bludhaven is in the general area of Newark or Jersey City.
Bludhaven has repeatedly been referred to as a drain-off type of city, and
as being Gotham's ugly little sister. Baltimore isn't New York's ugly
little sister, Newark and Jersey City are. Plus, Baltimore isn't that
close to New York.

--Corey Finnegan


valdar

unread,
Apr 27, 1997, 3:00:00 AM4/27/97
to

Thanks for the insights . I concur with your conclusions,I must admit that metropolis was always a mystery to me . Rather that I've always seen both place as a picture of the souls of thier respective heros light and dark and therefore not a question of (no disrepect to your insightfull observations)geography but of phsychology, not a map of the countryside but of the spirit(not the guy in fedora and gloves:) )

Jim

unread,
Apr 30, 1997, 3:00:00 AM4/30/97
to

It's in New Jersey

BORISER

unread,
May 2, 1997, 3:00:00 AM5/2/97
to

Actually, if you consider it, Gotham is actually New York. The dark
dismal streets, the port. Metropolis is Chicago. Big buildings,
newspapers.

Scouter227

unread,
May 3, 1997, 3:00:00 AM5/3/97
to

I am really getting tired of this. Gotham and Metropolis are both
*fictional cities*. They are not some actual city in disguise. Maybe ideas
are based on an actual city but that is it. There is no Gotham in New
York or Jersey-- and there is not Metropolis in New York or Chicago-- so
why the debate? Even if some bigwig at DC says "Metropolis is in NY or
Gotham is in Jersey" then so what?
As always,
Scouter

Shangbin Ko

unread,
May 3, 1997, 3:00:00 AM5/3/97
to

i heard a lot of people say that it's in new jersey. dennis o'neille
sticks true to the belief that gotham is an alternate new york city, only
darker (NY exists in the DC universe too, but it's wimp ass compared to
gotham).

new york was the setting for the batman stories in "detective comics"
when it first started, but then they started to use the nickname for new
york, which, at the time, was "gotham city". it then eventually turned
into a city of it's own.

i heard a really interesting angle that gotham is actually based on
chicago, because of it's gothic architecture. new york has some too, but
chicago has a bit more up the ass.

i just think that it's a coastal city in the east with a huge port, some
rivers, and a blown up section that got killed in "contagion". i'd really
like to believe that it's in new york state.

but i think that bludhaven is in new jersey, because it;s supposed to be
so shitty.

--phil ko


Shangbin.Ko HXCL73A@prodigy.com (Shangbin Ko)

unread,
May 3, 1997, 3:00:00 AM5/3/97
to

From: HXC...@prodigy.com (Shangbin Ko)
Subject: Re: Where is Gotham?
Organization: Prodigy Services Company 1-800-PRODIGY

--phil ko

--
| Fidonet: HXC...@prodigy.com (Shangbin Ko) 1:300/43
| Internet: HXCL73A_prodigy_com.(Shangbin.Ko)@pnet.playcom.com

Martyr

unread,
May 4, 1997, 3:00:00 AM5/4/97
to

You are right about Gotham being New York, but Metropolis is actually
moddeled after Toronto, Canada. I'm not shure about Jerry Siegle, but Joe
Shuster is Canadian cousin to Frank Shuster from the renouned Canadian
comic team of Wayne and Shuster.

Just thought I'd set the record straight :)
--
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
----
"Music Ignites the night with passionate fire"
-Jonathan Larson, RENT
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
----

BORISER <bor...@aol.com> wrote in article
<19970502231...@ladder01.news.aol.com>...

Michael T Novy

unread,
May 7, 1997, 3:00:00 AM5/7/97
to

I believe that Metropolis is also New York, as is Gotham. Each portrays
an image of the only truly cosmopolitan city in the U.S. Gotham is the
gritty side, the Bronx or Brooklyn, while Metropolis represents the more
pristine portions of Manhattan.

Also, each archtypical city is just that, so that each set of writers and
artists can change and rearrange the cityscape to suit their purposes.

This is not to say other cities do make up some of the fabric of Gotham
and Metropolis, just that I beleive the original inspiration was New York
for each fictional city.


Joe Donahue

unread,
May 9, 1997, 3:00:00 AM5/9/97
to


Michael T Novy <mn...@shrike.depaul.edu> wrote in article
<Pine.GSO.3.95.970507...@shrike.depaul.edu>...

I believe the original concept for Gotham was that it was like Pittsburgh
after years of property from the steel mills of the industrial revolution
had taken it's toll creating a dark crime ridden city. Metropolis was
defiantly
New York, a still bright and thriving city.
>


tw...@pcis.net

unread,
May 12, 1997, 3:00:00 AM5/12/97
to

On 9 May 1997 15:05:33 GMT, "Joe Donahue" <je...@maine.rr.com> wrote:

>
>
>Michael T Novy <mn...@shrike.depaul.edu> wrote in article
><Pine.GSO.3.95.970507...@shrike.depaul.edu>...

>> I believe that Metropolis is also New York, as is Gotham...


>>
>I believe the original concept for Gotham was that it was like Pittsburgh
>after years of property from the steel mills of the industrial revolution
>had taken it's toll creating a dark crime ridden city. Metropolis was
>defiantly
>New York, a still bright and thriving city.
>>
>

both of the cities would have been modelled after a number of
different cities.

the writers of Batman grew up, lived and worked in southern Illinois.
while the ideas for the physical looks of both cities would have come
from the numerous books and movies of the 1930's to 1950's the moral
and cultural values of the people were those of the midwest USA.

both cities could have been the how those writers saw St Lous and East
St Louis. both of these cities were thriving during this period of
time, in fact, St Louis is doing fairly well right now and has a both
a clean modern city look and a dark and forbidding side with many
shadows. and if any city could use a crime fighting super-hero it
would be East St Louis.


The Geeks

unread,
May 12, 1997, 3:00:00 AM5/12/97
to

Michael T Novy wrote:
>
> I believe that Metropolis is also New York, as is Gotham. Each portrays
> an image of the only truly cosmopolitan city in the U.S. Gotham is the
> gritty side, the Bronx or Brooklyn, while Metropolis represents the more
> pristine portions of Manhattan.
>
> Also, each archtypical city is just that, so that each set of writers and
> artists can change and rearrange the cityscape to suit their purposes.
>
> This is not to say other cities do make up some of the fabric of Gotham
> and Metropolis, just that I beleive the original inspiration was New York
> for each fictional city.
Metropolis is Toronto, not NY
Havok

Lex Luthor

unread,
May 15, 1997, 3:00:00 AM5/15/97
to

Lets try to clear this up. This is, of course, totally hypothetical, but
it keeps things clear for me, maybe it will work for you.

New York in the DCU is New York, located where New York would be.

Metropolis is not New York, but it too is in on the Eastern US seaboard.
I've always had the feeling it's a little South of New York, but still in
NY state.

Gotham is not New York, but is is also on the Eastern seaboard. It's south
of both NY and Met., and probably in New Jersey.

Salem, where John, Marlena and Kristen live, is on a river somewhere in a
midwestern state. (Anyone catch the reference? If not, you spend your
afternoons more productively than me.)

Central City? I dunno.

Coast City? Go to LA. Go north. See that big crater? Good, you're there.

Gateway City (Wonder Woman)? I haven't a clue.

DC should reprint Who's Who and include a map. That would be quite helpful.

Note that in DOOMSDAY!, when they showed a map of the monster's
destruction that the arrow for Metropolis was pointing a bit south of
where NY is in the so-called "real" world.

Kirk
Wondering where the planet Vulcan is...

Mac OS: It does. It will. You can.
==================================
"I'm not [a psycopath]. Psycopaths kill for no reason at all. I kill for money."
John Cusack-Grosse Pointe Blank

JulieC

unread,
May 17, 1997, 3:00:00 AM5/17/97
to

I once saw a map that DC put out as a poster....pointing out where all
the cities like Metropolis, Gotham and Coast City were....Gotham was
in New Jersey....now doesn't that explain everything.


On Thu, 15 May 1997 00:39:23 -0500, rkir...@nkn.net (Lex Luthor)
wrote:

0 new messages