Prog 1251 (spoilers)
patrick.brown
Belfast on Tuesdays in recent weeks, no doubt through some fancy
Betelgeusian timewarp contraption. Ah yes, the spoiler space...
Y
O
U
H
A
D
I
T
M
A
D
E
I
N
T
H
E
S
H
A
D
E
B
A
B
Y
,
D
O
N
E
L
E
T
T
H
A
T
T
R
E
E
F
A
L
L
D
O
W
N
O
N
Y
O
U
There you go.
Cover by some new bloke called Doug A Gregory. Kinda nice, I think.
Dredd. Hmm. As usual with Ennis's stuff, it's very readable. Whether it's
any good or not I'm reserving judgement on for a few more episodes at least.
I do wonder what someone who hasn't read 2000AD for, like, ever and doesn't
get all the references to old stories is going to make of it. It's better
than Just A Pilgrim, I'll give it that.
Tor Cyan - wow, this looks amazing! Fantastic art, best Walker's done since
he stopped painting. He does a mean original Rogue as well. Storywise I
kinda like it as well. Nothing much has happened in this two-parter, but it
sets up the motivation for future stories quite well. It's also a good bit
tighter than the last Tor story.
Durham Red. Sorry guys, I know this pleases a lot of you, but I just find it
a load of po-faced nonsense. Harrison's art is a lot more decipherable than
it's been for a while, but the story means slightly less than the square
root of sod all to me. I dunno. I actually gave up reading this halfway
through the episode.
Pussyfoot 5 - this looks like fun. Still a bit of a mismatch between Yeowell
and Blythe - Yeowell, I think, looks better with simpler, flatter, less
intense colours - but that's my only quibble. Look forward to seeing where
it goes from here.
Dante - Andreas is back! Yay! He does look disturbingly like Peter Mandelson
in one panel, but he always lowers the tone admirably. Has the war been
shortened? I seem to remember it was billed as a 5-book epic, 3 by Burnsy
and 2 by Si, but it seems to have been curtailed to 4 books with only 1
Fraser contribution. Eh well. Maybe Robbie's eyes were bigger than his belly
when he was planning it.
Well, At Home With The Snails is starting on the radio, so I'm off. That's
your lot. Goodbye.
Patrick
TONYandCAROLamis
unreadable and the art has been good but when it has no story it becomes art
with no soul !
paulj
"patrick.brown" <patric...@ntlworld.com> wrote in message
news:rD257.44823$WS4.6...@news6-win.server.ntlworld.com...
> "In orbit very Wednesday", it says here, but copies have been arriving in
> Belfast on Tuesdays in recent weeks, no doubt through some fancy
> Betelgeusian timewarp contraption. Ah yes, the spoiler space...
Yes, this curious anomoly of turning up a few days early seems to have
coincided with my subscription copy turning up a few days late ....
ARRRRGHHHH (I'm gonna bang about this /every/ week until either it's fixed,
I get bored or everyone killfiles me)
- pj
Zoë J Robinson
<Cut to the bit about Dante>
> I seem to remember it was billed as a 5-book epic, 3 by Burnsy
> and 2 by Si, but it seems to have been curtailed to 4 books with only 1
> Fraser contribution.
I may be miscounting, but I thought this was book 5...
Zoë
--
"Some people sit on mats and meditate, to attune themselves to
the universe or whatever. Dad sits in his grotty old chair
and... becomes one with ITV" - John Reiber, 'The Books of Magic'
www.nobmouse.net ICQ UIN: 30006397
Pete Wells
>
> Yes, this curious anomoly of turning up a few days early seems to have
> coincided with my subscription copy turning up a few days late ....
> ARRRRGHHHH (I'm gonna bang about this /every/ week until either it's
fixed,
> I get bored or everyone killfiles me)
Got to agree here. My prog 1250 turned up TODAY (Tuesday - a week after it
had been in the shops) and Grud knows when my 1251 will turn up - a nice
surprise for Christmas perhaps?
Bah!!!
Wellsy.
Andy Diggle
>coincided with my subscription copy turning up a few days late ....
>ARRRRGHHHH (I'm gonna bang about this /every/ week until either it's fixed,
>I get bored or everyone killfiles me)
Or, better still, inform the subscriptions department... ? ; )
Andy
Andy
--
2000 AD - The Galaxy's Greatest Comic!
http://www.2000ADonline.com
paulj
- pj
"Andy Diggle" <andyd...@aol.comNOSPAM> wrote in message
news:20010718033943...@ng-fq1.aol.com...
paulj
W
A
T
C
H
O
U
T
T
H
E
R
E
'
S
A
S
P
O
I
L
E
R
A
B
O
U
T
About Tor Cyan: hmmm.... I must admit I'm in two minds over Tor turning out
to have "dreamt" it all up... firstly I disliked the dream sequence, it just
seemed pointless, also I didn't like the apparent direction (Oh look here I
am, there's some big thing killing some people, I dunno who/what they are,
or where I am... but dammit... I'm not a killing machine ... I'M A MAN!) but
I loved the fact that it WAS a dream... thank god. It just seemed like it
was there to tail off Tor Cyan, cut it dead and then ... reintroduce Tor
Cyan as Rogue.
Now I may be up the wrong tree here, but it seemed fairly clear that Tor IS
Rogue. But something happened, possibly a long time ago (I mean, they
wouldn't build GI's with 4 year lifecycles, would they? that'd be
stoopid --- those things would be built to last). What I'd like to see
happen is Tor goes back to Nu Earth to find out who he is he then finds
something which sends him on a quest, maybe the war never really ended but
instead fractured onto a thousand distant worlds? (was he betrayed in the
end by someone close to him but his fractured memory will only give him
small clues -- come on, I've only seen the trailor for memento, but how cool
does that film look?) What would Tor/Rogue /really/ be searching for? peace?
He'll throw himself into the worst possible situations but he'll be unable
to just laydown and die, so instead he'll battle fiercly looking for death.
As his bio buddies are already dead, he'd need to pick up some other
companion, to act as his conscience.
Oh I dunno (I'm waffling now) just bring back Rogue...
BTW: I asked before, but what eventually happened to Major Magnum? Did he
get regened?
- pj
Morph
>BTW: I asked before, but what eventually happened to Major Magnum? Did he
>get regened?
Didn't he get regened, turn up briefly, get brainwashed by Norty
mindcontrol broadcast aimed at Rogue, and end up somehow blowing his
own brains out with his officer's pistol?
It's been a very long time since I saw those progs...
-Morph
[Hmm. That reminds me - things that IMHO deserve to be collected into
TPBs again. All the early Rogue Trooper - up until the end of the
Traitor General story. And "Cinnabar", which was ace... or has someone
already mentioned these?]
--
"Believe me, if wishes were horses then you'd be Shergar..."
robiN
"Morph" <dis...@clara.SPAMSPAMAWAY.net> wrote in message
news:3b55ba1...@news.clara.net...
Someone has already mentioned Cinnabar :-) but the "complete rogue trooper"
(with cinnabar included) would be great.
Chuck in the Alan Moore stories from the annuals too, "Pray for War" was
brilliant.
robiN
Daniel Fawcett
<3B54C6D4...@btinternet.com>...
> "patrick.brown" wrote:
> <Cut to the bit about Dante>
> > I seem to remember it was billed as a 5-book epic, 3 by Burnsy
> > and 2 by Si, but it seems to have been curtailed to 4 books with only 1
> > Fraser contribution.
>
> I may be miscounting, but I thought this was book 5...
>
Nope:
Title: The Rudinshtein Irregulars
Prog Numbers: 1183 - 1190
Note: Book One Of "Tsar Wars"
Title: Love And War
Prog Number(s): 1200 - 1207
Note: Book Two Of "Tsar Wars"
Title: Battleship Potemkin
Prog Number(s): 1213 - 1220
Note: Book Three Of "Tsar Wars"
Then there were a few short stories, and now this, which is
Book Four.
[taken from my roughly 80% complete index of the entire Dante
series, for the site Ross was going to build, but seemed to get
well.. forgotten, I guess]
--
~~Nothing turns out like you want it to~~
- Manic Street Preachers, "Yes"
Now Playing: Nine Inch Nails - The Downward Spiral
William Logan
wrote:
>>Yes, this curious anomoly of turning up a few days early seems to have
>>coincided with my subscription copy turning up a few days late ....
>>ARRRRGHHHH (I'm gonna bang about this /every/ week until either it's fixed,
>>I get bored or everyone killfiles me)
>
>Or, better still, inform the subscriptions department... ? ; )
>
>Andy
>
>Andy
I'm still waiting for my subscription, it should have started with
Prog 1245 and I'm still waiting.
Have been onto the subs department and they gauranteed to get my Progs
to me and I'm still waiting.
24 years of trudging to the newsagents, getting Progs posted to me in
Germany, Cyprus and whilst training people for the Gulf War and when I
finally subscribe the bastards make me wait.
La Placa Rifa,
W. R. Logan.
wakefield.carter
>series, for the site Ross was going to build, but seemed to get
>well.. forgotten, I guess]
>
the official site, which still has holes but is improving all the
time...e.g. I've just added your Tsar Wars book numbers to the notes. Let me
know if you (or anyone else) can spot any mistakes or provide addition info.
However, I'm on holiday soon so I may not do anything about it until
mid-late August.
Cheers,
Wakefield
wa...@2000adonline.com
http://www.2000adonline.com/index.php3?zone=thrill&page=thrills&Comic=2000AD
&Series=nikolai
paulj
subscriptions -@- 2000adonline.com
remove the - - and spaces, and you're in.
- pj
"William Logan" <lo...@classof79.freeserve.co.uk> wrote in message
news:3b55d17a...@news.freeserve.net...
Pete Wells
"paulj" <paulj...@No-ntlworld-Spam.com> wrote in message
news:Deg57.2311$Z81....@news11-gui.server.ntli.net...
> point.
I HAVE contacted them - TWICE. I'll try again tomorrow. Sorry to slag the
usually excellent subs service off online but I'm getting really narked now.
Muttergrumble,
If-it-wasn't-so-bloody-good-at-the-minute-I-wouldn't-be-so-bothered-and-the-
only-thing-that-landed-on-my-doormat-was-a-television-licence-bill-bastards.
..
Wellsy
Simon Fraser
> I may be miscounting, but I thought this was book 5...
It is and it isn't. The original plan was to do 5 books. This has been
cut down to 4 for various reasons. Don't worry though, it's all been
shuffled along and all the really good stuff is still to come!
Simon F.
Mark Jones
probably give up and just order one from the back issues people. The Satanus
conclusion was in that one too. Bugger.
Pete Wells wrote:
--
Mark Jones
Freelance Graphic Artist
Web site: http://morrowind.telefragged.com/dragons_eyrie/
Email: Mjonesg...@erols.com
Daniel Fawcett
<uwk57.66638$B56.12...@news2-win.server.ntlworld.com>...
> >[taken from my roughly 80% complete index of the entire Dante
> >series, for the site Ross was going to build, but seemed to get
> >well.. forgotten, I guess]
> >
> Possibly because any new thrill database would be competing with the one
on
> the official site, which still has holes but is improving all the
> time...e.g. I've just added your Tsar Wars book numbers to the notes. Let
me
> know if you (or anyone else) can spot any mistakes or provide addition
info.
> However, I'm on holiday soon so I may not do anything about it until
> mid-late August.
Do you want a copy of the list I compiled? It only goes up to Tsar Wars
Book 3, but is fairly complete. IIRC its a bit thin at the beginning, but
all the stuff in the middle is complete with prog numbers and artists
listed.
Andy Diggle
what - if you're not getting any joy from the subscriptions bots, drop a line
to our marketing droid Dominic, and he'll kick their asses for you and/or feed
'em to Mek-Quake.
You can email him at:
dominic -@- rebellion.co.uk
(just drop the - - and you're there, as PJ would say!)
Robin Low
patrick.brown <patric...@ntlworld.com> writes
Yeah, it's early days yet, but pretty good so far. Nice dialogue between
Dredd and Hershey.
>I do wonder what someone who hasn't read 2000AD for, like, ever and doesn't
>get all the references to old stories is going to make of it.
A possible problem for newbies, but Dredd does give a little bit of
background about Call-me-Kenneth and Giant as they appear.
>Tor Cyan - wow, this looks amazing! Fantastic art, best Walker's done since
>he stopped painting. He does a mean original Rogue as well.
I wish I had a scanner and then I could provide people with copies of
Walker's work for Games Workshop in the late 80s and you'd all be able
to see what sub-standard pap he currently produces.
>Storywise I
>kinda like it as well. Nothing much has happened in this two-parter, but it
>sets up the motivation for future stories quite well.
He's off to Nu-Earth, which is good, but I've yet to be made to care.
>It's also a good bit
>tighter than the last Tor story.
Yeah, but even this two-parter could have been done in one: one page of
him climbing up the volcano, one page contemplating suicide at the rim
and then two pages with the ghost of Rogue giving him a kick up the arse
and one with Rogue going back down again. Bung in a native carnivorous
plant or animal on one page for a bit of action, perhaps having Tor
fight it as the ghost of Rogue is reminds him what he is and barks
orders.
>
>Durham Red. Sorry guys, I know this pleases a lot of you, but I just find it
>a load of po-faced nonsense. Harrison's art is a lot more decipherable than
>it's been for a while, but the story means slightly less than the square
>root of sod all to me. I dunno. I actually gave up reading this halfway
>through the episode.
Very pretty, certainly the clearest computer art Harrison has done.
Story is OK, but in the same way that Tor isn't Rogue, this isn't Durham
Red anymore.
>
>Pussyfoot 5 - this looks like fun. Still a bit of a mismatch between Yeowell
>and Blythe - Yeowell, I think, looks better with simpler, flatter, less
>intense colours - but that's my only quibble. Look forward to seeing where
>it goes from here.
Mingepod Quinque. Fine by me.
>
>Dante
More of the same, but that's a complement.
Regards
Robin
--
Robin Low
Jim
Tooth.
Good thinking whoever it was that included online subscriptions on the
website, cause I could never be bothered phoning up the subs number, but
filling out a form was no problem.
So, where is my t-shirt then? :p
"Andy Diggle" <andyd...@aol.comNOSPAM> wrote in message
news:20010719044101...@ng-fe1.aol.com...
: Sorry to hear some of you are having trouble with your subscriptions. Tell
Wakefield
>website, cause I could never be bothered phoning up the subs number, but
>filling out a form was no problem.
>
An online shop is just around the corner!
Wake
Jim
"Wakefield" <wa...@2000adnospam.nu> wrote in message
news:9j6pr2$lu217$1...@ID-79479.news.dfncis.de...
: >Good thinking whoever it was that included online subscriptions on the
I'm not sure whether to jump for joy or cry. I can feel my credit cards
trying to run away right now.
Jim
Jim Campbell
Ro...@celephais.demon.co.uk wrote on 19/7/01 2:30 pm:
> I wish I had a scanner and then I could provide people with copies of
> Walker's work for Games Workshop in the late 80s and you'd all be able
> to see what sub-standard pap he currently produces.
I'm sorry, Robin, but I couldn't disagree with you more.
For years, Kev had an overly fussy ink style and used masses of detail to
camouflage a number of pretty basic weaknesses in his draughtsmanship
(which, incidentally, is why Steve MacManus made him ink Steve Dillon for
several years - to get a better understanding of Dillon's solid
draughtsman's skills).
Kev is one of the few artists in the industry who, after all these years,
continually experiments - look at Daemonifuge, Balls Brothers and Tor Cyan,
pretty much consecutive jobs and all as different from each other as can be.
I like the Tor Cyan style as much as I like intricately finished
Daemonifuge, but Tor Cyan shows a boldness and confidence in both line and
colour which I find refreshing and exciting.
Besides, if you really don't like it, try consoling yourself with the
thought that he'll almost certainly have a completely different ink style in
six months ...
Cheers
Jim
patrick.brown
news:GEzM5CAA...@celephais.demon.co.uk...
since
> >he stopped painting. He does a mean original Rogue as well.
>
> I wish I had a scanner and then I could provide people with copies of
> Walker's work for Games Workshop in the late 80s and you'd all be able
> to see what sub-standard pap he currently produces.
Sorry, but I gotta disagree with you there. Volubly. A few well chosen lines
and well placed shadows whip the arse off lots of detail. I always hated
Walker's pen-and-ink stuff partly because it was far too intricate and
fiddly, but mostly because he couldn't draw people. That latter applied to
his painted work as well - didn't matter in the ABC Warriors, but his Judge
Anderson was truly horrible (minority opinion there I know, but that's not a
problem for me, as I'm right and you're all wrong and stupid).
The stuff he's doing now is pretty close to flawless. I can't imagine how
anyone could look at it and see "sub-standard pap".
Patrick
Robin Low
patrick.brown <patric...@ntlworld.com> writes
Both styles have their place, I reckon, but artists should play to their
strengths. There's nothing wrong with trying out new styles from time to
time, but it's been a long, long time since I've seen anything from
Walker that's really made me take interest.
>I always hated
>Walker's pen-and-ink stuff partly because it was far too intricate and
>fiddly, but mostly because he couldn't draw people. That latter applied to
>his painted work as well - didn't matter in the ABC Warriors, but his Judge
>Anderson was truly horrible (minority opinion there I know, but that's not a
>problem for me, as I'm right and you're all wrong and stupid).
No, you're right, his painted art has always been poor and still is
(should see some of his stuff for the new Dungeons and Dragons game -
Wayne Reynolds in wiping the floor with him). I don't doubt that we
could find some exceptions though.
>
>The stuff he's doing now is pretty close to flawless.
Well, there's barely anything going on to find flaws in.
>I can't imagine how
>anyone could look at it and see "sub-standard pap".
Okay, I'm exaggerating as usual because I think he can do so much
better.
I suppose it's just one of those peculiar things about art: something
either grabs you or it doesn't.
Robin Low
<jw.ca...@ntlworld.com> writes
>in article GEzM5CAA...@celephais.demon.co.uk, Robin Low at
>Ro...@celephais.demon.co.uk wrote on 19/7/01 2:30 pm:
>
>> I wish I had a scanner and then I could provide people with copies of
>> Walker's work for Games Workshop in the late 80s and you'd all be able
>> to see what sub-standard pap he currently produces.
>
>I'm sorry, Robin, but I couldn't disagree with you more.
>
>For years, Kev had an overly fussy ink style and used masses of detail to
>camouflage a number of pretty basic weaknesses in his draughtsmanship
>(which, incidentally, is why Steve MacManus made him ink Steve Dillon for
>several years - to get a better understanding of Dillon's solid
>draughtsman's skills).
What can I say? I have a large scrapbook of various artists' work from
White Dwarf, and I still think Walker was doing far better stuff back
then, in a variety of styles.
I thought the detail Walker added to Dillon's art on 'Rogue Trooper:
Cinnabar' and 'Harlem Heroes' improved the art no end (compare Cinnabar
with Dillon's work on 'The Hit' stories). Dillon is good, but he doesn't
draw much other than edges (yes, I know I'm exaggerating).
>
>Kev is one of the few artists in the industry who, after all these years,
>continually experiments - look at Daemonifuge, Balls Brothers and Tor Cyan,
>pretty much consecutive jobs and all as different from each other as can be.
The first was murky and unclear (although this could be a repro problem)
the second was cartoony crap, and the third just plain boring. I'd
prefer him to be consistently as good as he can be.
Best to agree to disagree, I reckon.
Pete Wells
didn't matter in the ABC Warriors, but his Judge
> Anderson was truly horrible (minority opinion there I know, but that's not
a
> problem for me, as I'm right and you're all wrong and stupid).
Wha... buh... his Anderson stuff was Ace! That full page image of that
scientist bloke with the spear through his head was one of the most striking
images I've seen in a comic. The Rogue/cyan stuff he's doing now is also
great.
Wellsy
Michael Flynn
>Durham Red. Sorry guys, I know this pleases a lot of you, but I just find it
>a load of po-faced nonsense. Harrison's art is a lot more decipherable than
>it's been for a while, but the story means slightly less than the square
>root of sod all to me. I dunno. I actually gave up reading this halfway
>through the episode.
I tried to read it. Managed to get as far as the second page before my
eyes glazed over and the words became meaningless. This of course
assumes they had some sort of meaning in the first place. The art
looks nice, it doesn't seem to tell the story too well, but it's a
shame it's covered up by all those bright white word balloons.
--
Michael Flynn
Jim Campbell
Ro...@celephais.demon.co.uk wrote on 19/7/01 6:20 pm:
> What can I say? I have a large scrapbook of various artists' work from
> White Dwarf, and I still think Walker was doing far better stuff back
> then, in a variety of styles.
I think you're still overlooking the fact that, as Patrick pointed out, he
couldn't draw people!
This isn't a problem when you're a Games Workshop staff artist because (and
this is no disrespect to the many fine artists they _do_ have working for
them) decent draughtsmanship and figure drawing is considered less important
than the ability to draw Chaos-Spiky-Things in a ludicrously
over-cross-hatched stylee.
It _is_ a problem when you're a comic artist, hence MacManus pairing Kev
with Dillon.
> I thought the detail Walker added to Dillon's art on 'Rogue Trooper:
> Cinnabar' and 'Harlem Heroes' improved the art no end (compare Cinnabar
> with Dillon's work on 'The Hit' stories). Dillon is good, but he doesn't
> draw much other than edges (yes, I know I'm exaggerating).
No, I agree completely - I thought the combination worked brilliantly, but
that wasn't MacManus' primary intention. He'd spotted Kev as a potential
front-rank artist but realized that he needed to develop his nuts-and-bolts
drawing skills.
> The first was murky and unclear (although this could be a repro problem)
> the second was cartoony crap, and the third just plain boring. I'd
> prefer him to be consistently as good as he can be.
Daemonifuge suffered horribly on that bog-roll on which the early issues of
WHM were printed - JPEGs by e-mail to anyone who wants to see how it
_should_ have looked.
(As an aside, the first thing I said to Marc Gascoine when I saw #1 of WHM
was that, at _that_ cover price, they needed to improve the paper stock and
put up the page count, a suggestion which he got quite stroppy about ...
except of course, they did both these things within a few issues! Not
suggesting for a minute that they did it on my say-so, but it did amuse me
...)
I can't really agree about Balls Brothers, either - all the incidental
detail Kev was cramming into the pages put me in mind of classic 'Old Skool'
2000AD, and quality of the actual drawing (ink style aside) was just fine
...
> Best to agree to disagree, I reckon.
And on Tor Cyan, I fear we will have to! But I still maintain that this is
amongst Kev's best work in terms of figure drawing and draughtsmanship ...
Cheers
Jim
Robin Low
<jw.ca...@ntlworld.com> writes
>
>And on Tor Cyan, I fear we will have to! But I still maintain that this is
>amongst Kev's best work in terms of figure drawing and draughtsmanship ...
Perhaps there's a good compromise that can be worked here. A little bit
of the current Tor Cyan style to get the general shape of things right
and a little bit of the detailing from his White Dwarf days to give it
some depth.
Jim Campbell
dhors...@iprimus.com.au wrote on 20/7/01 11:16 am:
> You really should be careful what you say on a public forum you know.
> ;)
Unfortunately, if Kev drew any hardcore Ephrael-porn it was for his own,
private consumption - 'cos I certainly haven't seen any.
Cheers
Jim
James Graham
Ro...@celephais.demon.co.uk (Robin Low) wrote:
>
> I wish I had a scanner and then I could provide people with copies of
> Walker's work for Games Workshop in the late 80s and you'd all be able
> to see what sub-standard pap he currently produces.
I've followed Kev's career from his GW roots as well, and I have to say I
don't agree with you. For one thing he has only come close to learning to
draw people in the last 2 years.
The stuff he did for GW was almost all either big lumbering monsters or
big lumbering machines. It was very nice to look at, but very little
substance.
Three cheers for an artist that goes off in a new direction every once in
a while.
James
Robin Low
James Graham <james...@cix.co.uk> writes
>I've followed Kev's career from his GW roots as well, and I have to say I
>don't agree with you. For one thing he has only come close to learning to
>draw people in the last 2 years.
Mind you, the inability to draw people has never held back Mike McMahon
(except possibly in the US).
I think dynamism is more important, especially in a comic. Simon
Harrison, for example, drew the weirdest looking people imaginable, but
it's the most exciting and action packed comic art I can think of. Simon
Harrison's Strontium Dog is *alive*. Walker's Tor Cyan might look a bit
more realistic, but he's terribly static.
>
>The stuff he did for GW was almost all either big lumbering monsters or
>big lumbering machines.
Can't disagree with that. He certainly has a knack for huge battle
scenes packed with space marines in powered armour and massive war-
machines stalking the landscape, but that doesn't help much when it
comes to drawing faces or musculature.
>It was very nice to look at, but very little
>substance.
>
Not sure what you mean by lack of substance. Do you mean a sense of
personality and depth in the characters?
My main gripe with Walker's Tor Cyan is the lack of detail. I don't
think the fact that his overall ability has improved prevents him adding
a bit of detail or movement.
(Don't know about everyone else, but I've said more than I can usefully
say on this topic.)
Jim Campbell
Graham at james...@cix.co.uk wrote on 20/7/01 12:00 pm:
> I've followed Kev's career from his GW roots as well, and I have to say I
> don't agree with you. For one thing he has only come close to learning to
> draw people in the last 2 years.
>
> The stuff he did for GW was almost all either big lumbering monsters or
> big lumbering machines. It was very nice to look at, but very little
> substance.
>
> Three cheers for an artist that goes off in a new direction every once in
> a while.
With the exception of Mike McMahon, I can't think of another British artist
who's been working in the industry for any length of time that tries as
hard, or as frequently, to develop and re-invent their style. Mind you,
McM's experimentations haven't been universally popular, either ...
Cheers
Jim
Nigel Poll
<Ro...@celephais.demon.co.uk> wrote:
<snip>
>(Don't know about everyone else, but I've said more than I can usefully
>say on this topic.)
Isn't this the point at which the fun usually starts? :)
Nigel
Simon Gurr
Ro...@celephais.demon.co.uk wrote on 20/07/2001 13:11:
> Mind you, the inability to draw people has never held back Mike McMahon
> (except possibly in the US).
Bad example, McMahon's perfectly able to draw people naturalistically. His
figures are stylized, but they come from sound knowledge of anatomy and are
drawn consistently with everything else in a given strip.
Personally, I find his people more convincing than anatomically incorrect
figures drawn in a more naturalistic style.
SiG
--
http://www.simongurr.com Comics Illustration Web Animation
http://www.2000ad.nu/mcmahon/ The Art of Mike McMahon
Andrew Ness
> >big lumbering machines.
>
> Can't disagree with that. He certainly has a knack for huge battle
> scenes packed with space marines in powered armour and massive war-
> machines stalking the landscape, but that doesn't help much when it
> comes to drawing faces or musculature.
>
>
> think the fact that his overall ability has improved prevents him adding
> a bit of detail or movement.
>
I think it would be great if he did backgrounds using his old fully-painted
style and then laid the 'modern' Mignola-esque figurework over them.
Probably take about a year a page, but better than those colour washes which
are getting a bit tedious.
NSY
robiN
"Andrew Ness" <ne...@liverpoolfc.net> wrote in message
news:9j9gec$d4d$2...@news5.svr.pol.co.uk...
Very nice idea...remember the Steve Dillon/John Higgins ABC Warriors story
from one of the old annuals from the 80's, had an amazing sense of depth and
focus, much better then the horrible, bog-standard photo shop blurring we
get now.
robiN
Simon Gurr
roblevy*FOSPAMAD*@dircon.co.uk wrote on 20/07/2001 15:56:
> Very nice idea...remember the Steve Dillon/John Higgins ABC Warriors story
> from one of the old annuals from the 80's, had an amazing sense of depth and
> focus, much better then the horrible, bog-standard photo shop blurring we
> get now.
Red Planet Blues by Alan Moore. Beautiful.
gnilleps
ether...
> in article SDX57.2061$H11.19041@NewsReader, robiN at
> roblevy*FOSPAMAD*@dircon.co.uk wrote on 20/07/2001 15:56:
>
>> Very nice idea...remember the Steve Dillon/John Higgins ABC Warriors story
>> from one of the old annuals from the 80's, had an amazing sense of depth and
>> focus, much better then the horrible, bog-standard photo shop blurring we
>> get now.
>
> Red Planet Blues by Alan Moore. Beautiful.
>
> SiG
Okay, now what annual was it in?
j
Indigo Prime
> Harrison, for example, drew the weirdest looking people imaginable, but
> it's the most exciting and action packed comic art I can think of. Simon
> Harrison's Strontium Dog is *alive*. Walker's Tor Cyan might look a bit
> more realistic, but he's terribly static.
I totally agree -- I loved Harrison's S/D and was amazed so many
slated it (although I imagine many were just pissed that Ezquerra
wasn't doing it anymore). Dynamism is so important, which is why I
also love pretty much anything McMahon has done -- his "camera angles"
are better than any other 2000AD artist.
As for Walker, I appreciate what he's trying to do and although I do
find it a bit too mininal, it's at least very different to the rest of
2000AD's art.
IP
jim bowie
> I think dynamism is more important, especially in a comic. Simon
> Harrison, for example, drew the weirdest looking people imaginable, but
> it's the most exciting and action packed comic art I can think of. Simon
> Harrison's Strontium Dog is *alive*. Walker's Tor Cyan might look a bit
> more realistic, but he's terribly static.
>
>
Simon Harrison's art dynamic, Kev's new style not? I think i'm having
a 'Helter Skelter'moment....!
James Graham
patric...@ntlworld.com (patrick.brown) wrote:
> (minority opinion there I know, but that's not a
> problem for me, as I'm right and you're all wrong and stupid).
That makes me right and clever then! :o)
James Graham
Ro...@celephais.demon.co.uk (Robin Low) wrote:
I'm no artist, but I don't think the creative process can be spliced up as
simply as that!
James
James Graham
Ro...@celephais.demon.co.uk (Robin Low) wrote:
> My main gripe with Walker's Tor Cyan is the lack of detail. I don't
> think the fact that his overall ability has improved prevents him adding
> a bit of detail or movement.
Detail, schmetail. I don't care if its detailed or not, so long as its
dynamic. IMHO, Kev Walker's current style is. Alex Ross isn't.
It's been said before here, and I'll say it again, but read Scott
McCloud's Understanding Comics. I think a lot of what he says there goes
to the heart of this debate.
James
robiN
"gnilleps" <jo...@gnilleps.fsnet.co.uk> wrote in message
news:B77E311C.7174%jo...@gnilleps.fsnet.co.uk...
1985 according to the thrill archives no the website.
r
Simon Gurr
>> Okay, now what annual was it in?
> 1985 according to the thrill archives no the website.
Yep. Probably the nicest looking of all the annuals I've seen. McMahon
cover, Belardinelli's lush colouring of his own Slaine strip at the front,
Red Planet Blues at the back and, in the middle, the cover art to Titan's
Slaine: Book One.
SiG (in nostalgia mode)
Adrian Bamforth
"robiN" <roblevy*FOSPAMAD*@dircon.co.uk> wrote in message
news:hS767.2701$H11.31570@NewsReader...
> > > Red Planet Blues by Alan Moore. Beautiful.
> > >
> > > SiG
> >
> > Okay, now what annual was it in?
> >
> > j
> >
>
> 1985 according to the thrill archives no the website.
Reprinted in Best Of 2000AD Special Edition in 1994
Gotta say I'm no ABC Warriors authority but the coming together of Alan
Moore and The ABC Warriors didn't really do it for me the way most Alan
Moore does.
ADE
Jim Campbell
Graham at james...@cix.co.uk wrote on 21/7/01 12:00 am:
> In article <97GymDAZ$BW7...@celephais.demon.co.uk>,
> Ro...@celephais.demon.co.uk (Robin Low) wrote:
>
>> My main gripe with Walker's Tor Cyan is the lack of detail. I don't
>> think the fact that his overall ability has improved prevents him adding
>> a bit of detail or movement.
>
> Detail, schmetail. I don't care if its detailed or not, so long as its
> dynamic. IMHO, Kev Walker's current style is. Alex Ross isn't.
Yeah - I'll take well-drawn at the pencil stage over fiddly inking detail
any day of the week.
Actually, while we're on the subject of not liking artwork, am I the only
person who thinks that this episode of Helter Skelter is a bloody lazy art
job from Ezquerra?
I mean, basically no more than two (clear) figures per frame ... and
wrapping preset Bryce textures onto primitive objects doesn't count as
drawing backgrounds, either, IMO.
Bah ...
Cheers
Jim
Gary Gray
Wakefield <wa...@2000adnospam.nu> wrote in message
news:9j6pr2$lu217$1...@ID-79479.news.dfncis.de...
> >Good thinking whoever it was that included online subscriptions on the
> >website, cause I could never be bothered phoning up the subs number, but
> >filling out a form was no problem.
> >
> Barny did the coding for that. Far too technical for me :-)
>
> An online shop is just around the corner!
>
> Wake
>
>
Oh goody, whenever I get a permanent address in Edinburgh I'll be
subscribing as well!
Gary
robiN
"Indigo Prime" <cngra...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:446334d.01072...@posting.google.com...
I'd like to see what Simon Harrison is doing now, I missed the Warhammmer
Monthly story that he did, or am I completely talking out me arse?
I liked his Strontium Dog but thought that maybe the old bog roll paper
quality didn't do it any favours. He did some lovely colour work too, I had
that pic he did of Joe Pineapples on my wall for years and Revere (I can#t
be bothered to check the spelling) looked gorgeous- if a little
indecipherable at times. (a bit like my grammar)
Be nice to see a tooth cover or poster by him.
robiN
robiN
"Jim Campbell" <jw.ca...@ntlworld.com> wrote in message
news:B77F606F.C1839%jw.ca...@ntlworld.com...
> in article memo.20010721...@jamesgraham.compulink.co.uk, James
> Graham at james...@cix.co.uk wrote on 21/7/01 12:00 am:
>
> > In article <97GymDAZ$BW7...@celephais.demon.co.uk>,
> > Ro...@celephais.demon.co.uk (Robin Low) wrote:
> >
>
> Actually, while we're on the subject of not liking artwork, am I the only
> person who thinks that this episode of Helter Skelter is a bloody lazy art
> job from Ezquerra?
>
> I mean, basically no more than two (clear) figures per frame ... and
> wrapping preset Bryce textures onto primitive objects doesn't count as
> drawing backgrounds, either, IMO.
>
> Bah ...
>
> Cheers
>
> Jim
>
I have to agree, he seems to have put in a lot more effort into Just A
Pilgrim.
Just read the final part of that BTW-quite a nasty but strangely
entertaining little story...a Missionary Man rip-off it isn't.
robiN
Si Spurious
> amongst Kev's best work in terms of figure drawing and draughtsmanship ...
>
I'm with Jim all the way on this one.. One minor quibble (from someone who
can't draw anatomy for toffee), there's something not quite right about
Tor's wrists in some of the recent panels. Too stumpy, or sommink. Dunno.
Deniz
>>> Harrison, for example, drew the weirdest looking people imaginable, but
>>> it's the most exciting and action packed comic art I can think of. Simon
>>> Harrison's Strontium Dog is *alive*. Walker's Tor Cyan might look a bit
>>> more realistic, but he's terribly static.
>>
>> I totally agree -- I loved Harrison's S/D and was amazed so many
>> slated it (although I imagine many were just pissed that Ezquerra
>> wasn't doing it anymore). Dynamism is so important, which is why I
>> also love pretty much anything McMahon has done -- his "camera angles"
>> are better than any other 2000AD artist.
>
> Monthly story that he did, or am I completely talking out me arse?
He's teaching Kung Fu to Paul Weller. No shit. Umm... hanging out with nice
bloke John Hincklenton from time to time... And he's completed an amazing,
superintense huge conceptual GN called the Billion Year War, or something...
the artwork is utterly stunning!
> I liked his Strontium Dog but thought that maybe the old bog roll paper
> quality didn't do it any favours. He did some lovely colour work too, I had
> that pic he did of Joe Pineapples on my wall for years and Revere (I can#t
> be bothered to check the spelling) looked gorgeous- if a little
> indecipherable at times. (a bit like my grammar)
>
> Be nice to see a tooth cover or poster by him.
I'm sure if Andy asked him nicely, he'll pop something out... maybe he
should team him up with Pat Mills for something short and obtuse...
Oh, and... REPRINT REVERE!!
(It makes a lot more sense in one sitting...)
Tim.
paulj
himself) Simon Harrison represents everything that was wrong with 2000AD
(artwise) in the early/mid 90's. It was ugly, it was hard to read and, imho,
it had no redeeming features whatsoever.
Him, and Jim McCarthy, and Shaky and ...who else? any others?
oh well...
-pj
(I love to go a rambling along the mountain top)
Jim Campbell
paulj...@No-ntlworld-Spam.com wrote on 22/7/01 8:54 am:
> I'm sorry, but for me (and not wanting to diss the kung-fu, ass kicking, guy
> himself) Simon Harrison represents everything that was wrong with 2000AD
> (artwise) in the early/mid 90's. It was ugly, it was hard to read and, imho,
> it had no redeeming features whatsoever.
Couldn't agree more. Lots of airbrush and don't worry whether you can tell
which character's which, what's going on, or even whether these beings are
human, so poor was the figure drawing. And then, up he pops in Warhammer
Monthly and, oh, look, absolutely no development in the intervening years.
Which is a shame, 'cos he struck me as a very nice chap when I met on the
Black Library table at Games Day a couple of years ago.
> Him, and Jim McCarthy, and Shaky and ...who else? any others?
Simon Coleby. The worst sort of sub-Bisley clone - couldn't draw people,
couldn't draw faces, couldn't draw a bloody curve. And another one who
resurfaced at Black Library ... although I don't care for his newer, rather
odd, Ian-Gibson-meets-Jack-Kirby style, at least there seemed to have been
some kind of evolution in style.
Cheers
Jim
david horsburgh
"paulj" <paulj...@No-ntlworld-Spam.com> wrote in message
news:ODv67.25798$v2.1...@news11-gui.server.ntli.net...
> I'm sorry, but for me (and not wanting to diss the kung-fu, ass kicking,
guy
> himself) Simon Harrison represents everything that was wrong with 2000AD
> (artwise) in the early/mid 90's. It was ugly, it was hard to read and,
imho,
> it had no redeeming features whatsoever.
>
Revere!!
Okay, some of it looked a bit funny, some of his faces were a bit long(?),
but...Revere!
And Bradley had some redeeming features.
David
patrick.brown
news:ODv67.25798$v2.1...@news11-gui.server.ntli.net...
Oh come on. You can't put Simon Harrison in the same category as Jim
McCarthy. Harrison was weird and idiosyncratic and not to everybody's taste
(was to mine). McCarthy minor just blatantly couldn't draw the curtains.
As for Shaky, well, what's the point of a doing a parody of Jack Kirby in
the nineties?
Patrick
patrick.brown
> > Him, and Jim McCarthy, and Shaky and ...who else? any others?
>
> Simon Coleby. The worst sort of sub-Bisley clone - couldn't draw people,
> couldn't draw faces, couldn't draw a bloody curve.
Oh Christ yes. Made Jim McCarthy look good. Wouldn't have connected him to
Bisley in any way though. There were plenty of bad Bisley wannabes (Chris
Halls for example), but Coleby was bad in a totally unique way I thought.
Just had a thought. Wasn't A Magic Place, as collected in the Emerald Isle
book, part drawn by him?
I'd have to introduce 90s incarnation Brett Ewins into the mix. I was never
much of a fan, but did you see that Kelly's Eye thing he did?
I remember writing an article about tooth for a fanzine about that time in
which I observed that it seemed to be editorial policy to have Brett Ewins
draw two strips in every issue, but unfortunately he seemed to have
forgotten how to draw. When the article saw print I discovered the editor
had removed this comment. What hold does Ewins have over comics people in
this country?
Patrick
paulj
"patrick.brown" <patric...@ntlworld.com> wrote in message
news:OCx67.4015$Iz3.1...@news2-win.server.ntlworld.com...
> paulj <paulj...@No-ntlworld-Spam.com> wrote in message
> news:ODv67.25798$v2.1...@news11-gui.server.ntli.net...
> > I'm sorry, but for me (and not wanting to diss the kung-fu, ass kicking,
> guy
> > himself) Simon Harrison represents everything that was wrong with 2000AD
> > (artwise) in the early/mid 90's. It was ugly, it was hard to read and,
> imho,
> > it had no redeeming features whatsoever.
> >
> > Him, and Jim McCarthy, and Shaky and ...who else? any others?
> >
> > oh well...
> >
> > -pj
> > (I love to go a rambling along the mountain top)
>
> Oh come on. You can't put Simon Harrison in the same category as Jim
> McCarthy.
Oh yes I can ;) They ALL contributed to a general ugliness that categorised
2000AD at that point. /None/ of them belonged in 2000AD.
>Harrison was weird and idiosyncratic and not to everybody's taste
> (was to mine). McCarthy minor just blatantly couldn't draw the curtains.
>
I agree with you, Harrison definately wasn't to my taste at all. Don't
remember Simon Cobley (but maybe I'd stopped reading it then). And Brett
Ewins of that period (and even the prog 2001 Bad Company period ) was fairly
stinky, especially compared to what he'd done on Rogue Trooper way back
when.
> As for Shaky, well, what's the point of a doing a parody of Jack Kirby in
> the nineties?
>
Actually gotta add Ryan Hughes -- while I thought it was fantastic quality
(much better than those listed above) it just seemed at odds with what I
expected 2000AD to look like.
- pj
> Patrick
>
>
Matt Moore
>...)
>
>I can't really agree about Balls Brothers, either - all the incidental
>detail Kev was cramming into the pages put me in mind of classic 'Old Skool'
>2000AD, and quality of the actual drawing (ink style aside) was just fine
>...
the classic old skool plenty of detail is what i like best :)
>
>> Best to agree to disagree, I reckon.
>
>And on Tor Cyan, I fear we will have to! But I still maintain that this is
>amongst Kev's best work in terms of figure drawing and draughtsmanship ...
>
>Cheers
>
>Jim
>
Yeah, esp the Rogue Trooper bit. and the Sparta Kurse, really neat
art. much better than the story IMHO.
Cheers
Matt M
Matt Moore
Under construction since '82
sog <at> NOSPAM sless dot freeserve dot co dot uk
remove spam trap and rearrange to send me email
Yahoo ID - Obegron
ICQ# 115791204
Martin Johnstone
>
> I can't really agree about Balls Brothers, either - all the incidental
> detail Kev was cramming into the pages put me in mind of classic 'Old
Skool'
> 2000AD, and quality of the actual drawing (ink style aside) was just fine
> ...
>
>
Shame the story was utter crap.
MJ
Morph
>I'd have to introduce 90s incarnation Brett Ewins into the mix. I was never
>much of a fan, but did you see that Kelly's Eye thing he did?
Yes, it was dire. In fact, I think the only colour Ewins work I
actually liked was the Milligan/Ewins DC miniseries, "Skreemer".
[And isn't it about time that someone collected that as a TPB, by the
way?]
His black and white work, on Bad Company etc, was *far* superior -
probably because of the way he used shadows and lots of solid black,
techniques that didn't export well to colour.
Steve Yeowell initially seemed to hit similar problems with changing
his existing style for colour work, but adapted quite quickly.
[Although I still thinkt the colouring on Zenith IV - prologue
excluded - is a bit pants]
Although I have the artistic skills of your average woodlouse, so I
may be talking crap at this point. :)
-Morph
--
"Believe me, if wishes were horses then you'd be Shergar..."
robiN
"Morph" <dis...@clara.SPAMSPAMAWAY.net> wrote in message
news:3b5b008e...@news.clara.net...
> patrick.brown wrote:
> >I'd have to introduce 90s incarnation Brett Ewins into the mix. I was
never
> >much of a fan, but did you see that Kelly's Eye thing he did?
>
> Yes, it was dire. In fact, I think the only colour Ewins work I
> actually liked was the Milligan/Ewins DC miniseries, "Skreemer".
>
> [And isn't it about time that someone collected that as a TPB, by the
> way?]
>
> His black and white work, on Bad Company etc, was *far* superior -
> probably because of the way he used shadows and lots of solid black,
> techniques that didn't export well to colour.
>
> Steve Yeowell initially seemed to hit similar problems with changing
> his existing style for colour work, but adapted quite quickly.
> [Although I still thinkt the colouring on Zenith IV - prologue
> excluded - is a bit pants]
>
> Although I have the artistic skills of your average woodlouse, so I
> may be talking crap at this point. :)
>
uh oh....that sounds like a altcomics.alanmoore type thing ;)
Nothing wrong with having an opinion...I'd have much prefered Zenith IV in
black and white.
robiN
Frazer Irving
couldn't help it. The FEAR took me. FEAR of not making yet another banal
reply. FEAR of being lost amidst the whirling Khaos of reality. FEAR that
this newsgroup might just sieze up and DIE. So, with heavy head I placed my
hands upon my keyboard, and began to TYPE....
> As for Shaky, well, what's the point of a doing a parody of Jack Kirby in
> the nineties?
Ask steve rude and eric larson that...
F
--
frazer alex irving
http://www.frazerirving.com
Indigo Prime
> I liked [Harrison's] Strontium Dog but thought that maybe the old bog roll paper quality didn't do it any favours. He did some lovely colour work too,
I agree. In fact, his Strontium Dog cover (Alpha + elecronux) from
around 640 remains my all-time favourite 2000AD cover...
IP
Indigo Prime
>
> Oh, and... REPRINT REVERE!!
I agree -- one of the best 2000AD stories I've seen, except maybe the
third book -- alhough I think there's more chance of 'Wireheads' or
'Dry Run' being reprinted...
IP
James Graham
jw.ca...@ntlworld.com (Jim Campbell) wrote:
> Simon Coleby. The worst sort of sub-Bisley clone
Let's spare a thought for Charlie Gillespie here guys!
James
James Graham
paulj...@No-ntlworld-Spam.com (paulj) wrote:
> > Oh come on. You can't put Simon Harrison in the same category as Jim
> > McCarthy.
>
> Oh yes I can ;) They ALL contributed to a general ugliness that
> categorised
> 2000AD at that point. /None/ of them belonged in 2000AD.
I didn't particularly mind Simon Harrison per se. What I hated was his run
on Strontium Dog.
That in itself was no bad thing, new artist, new direction and all that.
Except that he wasn't being hired to take the strip off in a new
direction, he was being hired to kill the lead character.
Whether you agree or disagree with Alpha being killed off, it /should/
have been Ezquerra who did the deed.
James
Deniz
>
> Let's spare a thought for Charlie Gillespie here guys!
>
> James
Alive and well and working in American Comics. Or was that Charlie
Adlard...?
Who was it said there is no God?
Tim.
Si Spurious
James Graham <james...@cix.co.uk> wrote in message
news:memo.20010723...@jamesgraham.compulink.co.uk...
> In article <B78053BC.C30C3%jw.ca...@ntlworld.com>,
> jw.ca...@ntlworld.com (Jim Campbell) wrote:
>
> > Simon Coleby. The worst sort of sub-Bisley clone
And Wayne England. Euuugh.
Simon Fraser
> >> Simon Coleby. The worst sort of sub-Bisley clone
> >
> > Let's spare a thought for Charlie Gillespie here guys!
> >
> > James
>
> Alive and well and working in American Comics. Or was that Charlie
> Adlard...?
>
Adlard, I've no idea what happened to Gillespie, last I heard his life
had crashed spectacularly, his wife left him, he lost all his work and
went to pieces. Which is a shame as he was a nice bloke when I met
him, though an inexcusably bad artist. I blame the editor!
Simon F.
Robin Low
James Graham <james...@cix.co.uk> writes
>I didn't particularly mind Simon Harrison per se. What I hated was his run
>on Strontium Dog.
>
>That in itself was no bad thing, new artist, new direction and all that.
>Except that he wasn't being hired to take the strip off in a new
>direction, he was being hired to kill the lead character.
>
The irony being that he wasn't the one to draw the deed, but Colin
MacNeil, who had previously done the Ezquerraesque 'A Sorry Case'.
>Whether you agree or disagree with Alpha being killed off, it /should/
>have been Ezquerra who did the deed.
I think Ezquerra said in an interview that he turned down the job,
because the liked the character too much.
Regards
Robin
--
Robin Low
Robin Low
<jw.ca...@ntlworld.com> writes
>in article ODv67.25798$v2.1...@news11-gui.server.ntli.net, paulj at
>paulj...@No-ntlworld-Spam.com wrote on 22/7/01 8:54 am:
>
>> I'm sorry, but for me (and not wanting to diss the kung-fu, ass kicking, guy
>> himself) Simon Harrison represents everything that was wrong with 2000AD
>> (artwise) in the early/mid 90's. It was ugly, it was hard to read and, imho,
>> it had no redeeming features whatsoever.
>
>Couldn't agree more. Lots of airbrush and don't worry whether you can tell
>which character's which, what's going on, or even whether these beings are
>human, so poor was the figure drawing.
You won't be surprised to hear that I don't agree with the above. Are
you talking specifically about his colour work on Revere? There was
certainly some problems there.
>And then, up he pops in Warhammer
>Monthly and, oh, look, absolutely no development in the intervening years.
Which was fine by me, of course. Nothing more annoying than an artist
with a good and truly original style suddenly changing it.
>Simon Coleby. The worst sort of sub-Bisley clone - couldn't draw people,
>couldn't draw faces, couldn't draw a bloody curve. And another one who
>resurfaced at Black Library ... although I don't care for his newer, rather
>odd, Ian-Gibson-meets-Jack-Kirby style, at least there seemed to have been
>some kind of evolution in style.
I agree with this bit. Too damn chunky and no interesting detail.
Robin Low
Spurious <s...@wellington-college.berks.sch.removeme.uk> writes
You're kidding right?
Robin Low
<paulj...@No-ntlworld-Spam.com> writes
>I'm sorry, but for me (and not wanting to diss the kung-fu, ass kicking, guy
>himself) Simon Harrison represents everything that was wrong with 2000AD
>(artwise) in the early/mid 90's. It was ugly, it was hard to read and, imho,
>it had no redeeming features whatsoever.
>
>Him, and Jim McCarthy, and Shaky and ...who else? any others?
Simon Harrison's black and white work on Strontium Dog was actually
88-89, although his painted stuff on Revere was around 91-92, and that
was about the limit of his contribution to 2000AD as far as I can
remember. His art may not be to everyone's liking, but I think it's
unfair to include him as part of the problems 2000AD had in the 90s.
Robin Low
<jw.ca...@ntlworld.com> writes
>Actually, while we're on the subject of not liking artwork, am I the only
>person who thinks that this episode of Helter Skelter is a bloody lazy art
>job from Ezquerra?
>
>I mean, basically no more than two (clear) figures per frame ... and
>wrapping preset Bryce textures onto primitive objects doesn't count as
>drawing backgrounds, either, IMO.
Whilst I'd never say it was bad, it's not exactly what I've come to
expect from him. I suppose he and Ennis could argue that at present
Dredd is avoiding crowds and the neon-lights of the upper city, and
heading into the darker, quieter city bottom.
Robin Low
James Graham <james...@cix.co.uk> writes
>In article <97GymDAZ$BW7...@celephais.demon.co.uk>,
>Ro...@celephais.demon.co.uk (Robin Low) wrote:
>
>> My main gripe with Walker's Tor Cyan is the lack of detail. I don't
>> think the fact that his overall ability has improved prevents him adding
>> a bit of detail or movement.
>
>Detail, schmetail. I don't care if its detailed or not, so long as its
>dynamic. IMHO, Kev Walker's current style is. Alex Ross isn't.
And yet, Ross stands out as a good comic artist because his static art
is *so* good (although I wouldn't want to see his style copied
everywhere - cover art is probably his strength). This probably goes to
show that there are no absolutes in what's good and what's bad. I think
there are some important generalities about what is good comic art
(dynamism, good figure-drawing, etc.) that can be made, but if an artist
has an outstanding style, they can overcome their other failings.
On balance though, as far as 2000AD is concerned, I think I'd prefer to
see odder, quirkier and highly distinctive styles that give me something
to really look at, than ones that may be technically better, but aren't
quite so interesting to look at.
(In wonder what an Alex Ross Dredd would look like. Better or worse than
the Miller effort?)
Robin Low
<denizmu...@earthlink.net> writes
>> I'd like to see what Simon Harrison is doing now, I missed the Warhammmer
>> Monthly story that he did, or am I completely talking out me arse?
>
>He's teaching Kung Fu to Paul Weller. No shit. Umm... hanging out with nice
>bloke John Hincklenton from time to time... And he's completed an amazing,
>superintense huge conceptual GN called the Billion Year War, or something...
>the artwork is utterly stunning!
Do you have any more information on this GN?
James Graham
denizmu...@earthlink.net (Deniz) wrote:
I've got no beef with the Adlard lad. Personally, he's my favourite
"not-Fraser" Dante artist. He didn't draw everything like it was a soft
porn mag.
James
Simon Gurr
Ro...@celephais.demon.co.uk wrote on 23/07/2001 14:48:
> (In wonder what an Alex Ross Dredd would look like.
(splutter) I was having a drink then!
Maybe a Ross Dredd cover could work, but I doubt it. Never a strip though.
I've just found a Dave McKean Dredd pin-up and that's not very good either.
Did nothing come of the Judge Death stuff he worked on?
SiG
--
http://www.simongurr.com Comics Illustration Web Animation
http://www.2000ad.nu/mcmahon/ The Art of Mike McMahon
paulj
"Simon Fraser" <mzun...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message
news:a6d9ceb4.01072...@posting.google.com...
I met him once. Spide.
- pj
(only pb may get that reference)
> Simon F.
robiN
"Robin Low" <Ro...@celephais.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
news:TYjJ+KAL...@celephais.demon.co.uk...
> In article <ODv67.25798$v2.1...@news11-gui.server.ntli.net>, paulj
> <paulj...@No-ntlworld-Spam.com> writes
> >I'm sorry, but for me (and not wanting to diss the kung-fu, ass kicking,
guy
> >himself) Simon Harrison represents everything that was wrong with 2000AD
> >(artwise) in the early/mid 90's. It was ugly, it was hard to read and,
imho,
> >it had no redeeming features whatsoever.
> >
> >Him, and Jim McCarthy, and Shaky and ...who else? any others?
>
> Simon Harrison's black and white work on Strontium Dog was actually
> 88-89, although his painted stuff on Revere was around 91-92, and that
> was about the limit of his contribution to 2000AD as far as I can
> remember.
Of course there was Bradley too.
> His art may not be to everyone's liking, but I think it's
> unfair to include him as part of the problems 2000AD had in the 90s.
I agree, I thought his art was "funky". ...erm, in a good way.
robiN
Jim
"paulj" <paulj...@No-ntlworld-Spam.com> wrote in message
: > > >> Simon Coleby. The worst sort of sub-Bisley clone
: > > >
: > > > Let's spare a thought for Charlie Gillespie here guys!
: > > >
: > > > James
: > >
: > > Alive and well and working in American Comics. Or was that Charlie
: > > Adlard...?
: > >
: >
: > Adlard, I've no idea what happened to Gillespie, last I heard his life
: > had crashed spectacularly, his wife left him, he lost all his work and
: > went to pieces. Which is a shame as he was a nice bloke when I met
: > him, though an inexcusably bad artist. I blame the editor!
: >
:
: I met him once. Spide.
:
: - pj
: (only pb may get that reference)
Translation for Scottish people - Spide = Ned.
Jim
Robin Low
<simon...@virgin.net> writes
>in article o4RHWeAB...@celephais.demon.co.uk, Robin Low at
>Ro...@celephais.demon.co.uk wrote on 23/07/2001 14:48:
>
>> (In wonder what an Alex Ross Dredd would look like.
>
>(splutter) I was having a drink then!
>
>Maybe a Ross Dredd cover could work, but I doubt it.
Yeah, I was thinking of a cover rather than a strip.
>Never a strip though.
A strip might work, providing it was written appropriately. Perhaps if
it was done, say, in the form of a series of 'photographs' taken and
annotated with text boxes by the MC1 equivalent of a photojournalist. As
a longish (Megazine length) one-off, written by someone who knew what
they were doing, I don't see why it couldn't work.
jim bowie
a succession of Simons in the hope of a repeat triumph. Hence the
arrival of the Harrison, Coleby and Jacob droids. Tharg only realised
he had gone too far when he received Simon Bates Dredd multi-part epic
back....
paulj
"jim bowie" <jime...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:955e47ab.01072...@posting.google.com...
/Cue the sound of Our Tune/
DeMarco Loved Joe, but Joe, sadly, could never return his feelings....
- pj :P
Robin Low
ircon.co.uk> writes
>
>"Robin Low" <Ro...@celephais.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
>news:TYjJ+KAL...@celephais.demon.co.uk...
>> In article <ODv67.25798$v2.1...@news11-gui.server.ntli.net>, paulj
>> <paulj...@No-ntlworld-Spam.com> writes
>> >I'm sorry, but for me (and not wanting to diss the kung-fu, ass kicking,
>guy
>> >himself) Simon Harrison represents everything that was wrong with 2000AD
>> >(artwise) in the early/mid 90's. It was ugly, it was hard to read and,
>imho,
>> >it had no redeeming features whatsoever.
>> >
>> >Him, and Jim McCarthy, and Shaky and ...who else? any others?
>>
>> Simon Harrison's black and white work on Strontium Dog was actually
>> 88-89, although his painted stuff on Revere was around 91-92, and that
>> was about the limit of his contribution to 2000AD as far as I can
>> remember.
>
>Of course there was Bradley too.
Bugger. Forgot all about them. Quite liked them too, but I know I'm in a
minority there.
James Graham
mzun...@yahoo.co.uk (Simon Fraser) wrote:
You're making me feel bad for slating him now. Din't I hear somewhere he
was doing something online? Cool Beans possibly?
James Graham
Ro...@celephais.demon.co.uk (Robin Low) wrote:
> In article <memo.20010723...@jamesgraham.compulink.co.uk>,
> James Graham <james...@cix.co.uk> writes
>
> >I didn't particularly mind Simon Harrison per se. What I hated was his
> run >on Strontium Dog.
> >
> >That in itself was no bad thing, new artist, new direction and all
> that. >Except that he wasn't being hired to take the strip off in a new
> >direction, he was being hired to kill the lead character.
> >
>
> The irony being that he wasn't the one to draw the deed, but Colin
> MacNeil, who had previously done the Ezquerraesque 'A Sorry Case'.
Which is even worse - he didn't even finish the strip! Not only is
MacNeil's style completely different, but it was full painted colour -
talk about a shift in art styles! Sheer madness!
> >Whether you agree or disagree with Alpha being killed off, it /should/
> >have been Ezquerra who did the deed.
>
> I think Ezquerra said in an interview that he turned down the job,
> because the liked the character too much.
Best argument for creator ownership I reckon.
James
James Graham
Ro...@celephais.demon.co.uk (Robin Low) wrote:
> >Never a strip though.
>
> A strip might work, providing it was written appropriately. Perhaps if
> it was done, say, in the form of a series of 'photographs' taken and
> annotated with text boxes by the MC1 equivalent of a photojournalist. As
> a longish (Megazine length) one-off, written by someone who knew what
> they were doing, I don't see why it couldn't work.
As a non-Marvel reader, I loved Marvels. As a DC reader, I hated Kingdom
Come. You're right about having a script which plays to his strengths
(for those who don't know, Marvels tells the story of 40 years in the
Marvel universe from the perspective of a press photographer).
All this is a bit hypothetical though, as Alex Ross is almost certainly
too expensive for Tharg to keep in oil and batteries, and in either case
probably views Judge Dredd in a manner similar to how one would consider a
dog turd they had just stepped in. From what I can tell the man
disappeared up the anus of American "superheroica" a long time ago.
James
James Graham
ck...@spamhotmail.com (Jim) wrote:
> Translation for Scottish people - Spide = Ned.
Well that's crystal. And in English?
James
Jim
: In article <PJX67.9824$Iz3.3...@news2-win.server.ntlworld.com>,
I believe "the kids" these days call them trendies or townies.
Jim
Deniz
Tim.
Simon Gurr
Graham at james...@cix.co.uk wrote on 24/07/2001 0:00:
> You're making me feel bad for slating him now. Din't I hear somewhere he
> was doing something online? Cool Beans possibly?
Are you thinking of Nick Percival? He had a similar painty style to
Gillespie and is now big in CoolBeansWorld.
Jim Campbell
ck...@spamhotmail.com wrote on 24/7/01 1:01 am:
> I believe "the kids" these days call them trendies or townies.
Eh? We've been calling trendies and townies, umm ..., trendies and townies
for as long as I can remember ...
Cheers
Jim
paulj
"Jim" <ck...@spamhotmail.com> wrote in message
news:ZZ277.13355$Iz3.3...@news2-win.server.ntlworld.com...
>
> "James Graham" <james...@cix.co.uk> wrote in message
> news:memo.20010724...@jamesgraham.compulink.co.uk...
> : In article <PJX67.9824$Iz3.3...@news2-win.server.ntlworld.com>,
> : ck...@spamhotmail.com (Jim) wrote:
> :
> : > Translation for Scottish people - Spide = Ned.
The term "spide" originated from these type of people wearing red jumpers,
blue drainpipe trousers and shiny red shoes -- looking lie "spider-man".
Over the years the style has evolved, female spides, known as Millies, tend
to birth at age 15 and wear big dangling oval shaped gold earrings. Nowadays
all spides wear baseball caps (although not all baseball cap wearers are
spides).
Actually thinking about it, Charlie Gillespie wasn't a spide, I just didn't
like him (he's from Londonderry/Derry I think, so I just assumed I'd get on
well with him but didn't)
-pj
Robin Low
James Graham <james...@cix.co.uk> writes
>In article <geXl$DAbiE...@celephais.demon.co.uk>,
>Ro...@celephais.demon.co.uk (Robin Low) wrote:
>
>> >Never a strip though.
>>
>> A strip might work, providing it was written appropriately. Perhaps if
>> it was done, say, in the form of a series of 'photographs' taken and
>> annotated with text boxes by the MC1 equivalent of a photojournalist. As
>> a longish (Megazine length) one-off, written by someone who knew what
>> they were doing, I don't see why it couldn't work.
>
>As a non-Marvel reader, I loved Marvels. As a DC reader, I hated Kingdom
>Come. You're right about having a script which plays to his strengths
>(for those who don't know, Marvels tells the story of 40 years in the
>Marvel universe from the perspective of a press photographer).
(Rather embarrassingly, I'd completely forgotten about the 'plot' of
Marvels when I came up with the photographer idea. Doh!)
I liked both, but thought that Kingdom Come was better both in terms of
art and story. It's worth reading just to see Superman get the better of
Batman in a war of words for a change. Also, it's the only comic I've
ever seen which makes Wonder Woman a worthwhile character, an impressive
achievement in itself. And then there are the maggot things crawling out
of Captain Marvel's ears.
>
>All this is a bit hypothetical though, as Alex Ross is almost certainly
>too expensive for Tharg to keep in oil and batteries, and in either case
>probably views Judge Dredd in a manner similar to how one would consider a
>dog turd they had just stepped in. From what I can tell the man
>disappeared up the anus of American "superheroica" a long time ago.
I don't know anything about him apart from his art.
robiN
"Simon Gurr" <simon...@virgin.net> wrote in message
news:B782C66C.25FF5%simon...@virgin.net...
> in article memo.20010724...@jamesgraham.compulink.co.uk, James
> Graham at james...@cix.co.uk wrote on 24/07/2001 0:00:
>
> > You're making me feel bad for slating him now. Din't I hear somewhere he
> > was doing something online? Cool Beans possibly?
>
> Are you thinking of Nick Percival? He had a similar painty style to
> Gillespie and is now big in CoolBeansWorld.
>
HUGE in Cool Beans World...I was under the impression that the Percival
Brothers set up/owned the company.
I may not have thought highly of Nick Percival's artwork in tooth but it's
cool that he's providing another British outlet for the genre.
robiN
- hoping I'm not totally talkin' out me arse.