Pelikan 800 with poor ink flow
Marten van de Kraats
bought my very first 'serious' fountain pen, a Pelikan 800. In the shop
it seemed to work just fine, I tested it dipping the nib into a bottle
of quink ink.
Back home I cleaned the pen with water and than put it in a bottle of
pelikan 4001 brilliant black to pump ink into the barrel, after it was
filled I let three drops fall back into the bottle, closed the piston
again and started writing.
At least that was what I had in mind. No ink came out. Only if I pressed
the nib on the paper it released sufficient ink, but this is not as it
is supposed to be... I also own a pelikan 200 (that is what I think it
is anyway, could also be some other lower end model) and that one writes
without having to press the nib on the paper. This is a big
dissapointment because I paid quite some money for this pen.
I am planning to return it to the shop after Christmas.
But before doing that I wondered: what is wrong here? And also: Should I
wait some days for the ink flow to start running or is this a fable? I
didn't have these problems with my other much cheaper Pelikan pen and my
even cheaper Waterman Apostrophe also runs just fine.
Greetings,
Marten van de Kraats
L Levy
poster on this board, but...we should not accept poor performance from
anything new, be it computers, automobiles or fountain pens. Take it
back, and demand another one (no repairs or adjustments) that works to
your satisfaction.
LL
Nancy Handy
> Merry Christmas. This is my first posting in this newsgroup.
Merry Christmas and welcome to this group!
>Yesterday I
> bought my very first 'serious' fountain pen, a Pelikan 800.
>...after it was filled I let three drops fall back into the bottle,
>closed the piston again and started writing.
> No ink came out.
Try pumping ink in and out repeatedly filling and emptying the pen.
Hopefully there is a slight obstruction that will move and allow the ink
to start flowing.
If it doesn't work, return or exchange it.
Pelikans are normally reliable workhorses.
Nancy
DovR
john cline ii
"DovR" wrote in part:
***Heed LLevy's good advice. Pelikan as opposed to a certain snobbish
snooty Louis Vitton owned pen jewelry co whose initials are M and B and
bear a little white alpen crest on the cap, DO honour their products
and lifetime guarantee. You will not be requested to pay 50bucks, 100
including service and all manners of other BS.****
Dov, Pelikan has only a three year warranty and has for quite some time
now. And you will have to pay a service charge for any item outside
that warranty.
Also, Montblanc is owned by Richemont, who also owns Cartier,
Van Cleef & Arpels, and Dunhill. Vuitton has no connection whatever
with Mont Blanc.
john cline ii who figured that need said...
Bruce Herbitter
John:
Rather than ride the roller coaster of uneven quality in Mont Blacs OR
Pelikans these days, let me chime in in support of vintage pens by BOTH
companies. Pens from the 30s to the 50s by both these companies are far and
away more interesting writers IMO, and aside from cork seal renewal (normal
in the life of any such pen) they are nearly bulletproof.
Sadly, Santa left only 1 pen under our tree. My mother in law sent a wooden
knock off of an MB BP, made of some light colored tree, in a heavy teak pen
box. "I know you don;t use Ball Points," she wrote, "But maybe you'll like
the pen box." I dunno, I think I could splatch some white paint on the cap
and put it on Ebay with a fuzzy jpg, "RARE!!@@ Limited Edition Mont Blanc in
special Wooden Box!!@@" Whaddaya think?
Merry Christmas,
Bruce
fdu...@aol.com
>
> Rather than ride the roller coaster of uneven quality in Mont Blacs OR
> Pelikans these days, let me chime in in support of vintage pens by BOTH
> companies. Pens from the 30s to the 50s by both these companies are far and
> away more interesting writers IMO, and aside from cork seal renewal (normal
> in the life of any such pen) they are nearly bulletproof.
I can't disagree with the above but one peoblem is you will usually pay
more than you would for an equally good or even better US made pen.
This is because very few Pelikans were sold in the US before the 1970s
and the same goes with MB before the 1960s. They could be found, but
not easily here. Even many larger pen stores didn't carry them in most
cases in those days. Therefore very few of these pens ever turn up "in
the wild" here.
Probably 98& of all pre-1970s Pelikans and pre-1960s MBs that are sold
here have been brought or shipped over by Eurpeon collectors and dealers
in the last 20 years. Nothing wrong with that, but it does result in a
price mark up that while understandable, does not occure with native
made US pens sold here.
Of course the same mark up can and often does happen with some US made
pens when sold in foreign countries today. Then, of course, ebay and
pen shows have become a sort of equalizer in prices that has reduced the
varied price gaps, but not quite yet eliminated them. So the bottom line
is the average US collector still has to pay a bit extra for pens that
were not originally sold here. Not to say they can't still be good
deals for those who want them. Frank
fdu...@aol.com
Patrick Lamb
Wonder if the "drop of dishwashing detergent in water" would work here.
Pelikan ink seems drier to me than most (except Montblanc), so another
ink might solve the problem. And add me to the list of "Pelikan works
great for me" chorus. It may not help you immediately, but they can
(and usually do) work with no problems.
Pat
--
Apologies to those easily confused. Address is spam-resistant.
Correct email address like pdlamb 'round-about comcast point net.
so what
They are BLANC, Bruciekins, they are BlaNc!
satrap
not Grand, and not Blanc
marlinspike
news:EygO9.42266$3t6....@nwrddc03.gnilink.net...
> Dov, Pelikan has only a three year warranty and has for quite some time
> now. And you will have to pay a service charge for any item outside
> that warranty.
Well, if you just ask, they usually won't care. Just like rotring doesn't
car how old your pen is as long as they still have one to replace it with.
Richard
Johan Thole
>Of course the same mark up can and often does happen with some US made
>pens when sold in foreign countries today. Then, of course, ebay and
>pen shows have become a sort of equalizer in prices that has reduced the
>varied price gaps, but not quite yet eliminated them.
Absolutely true! The prices that are asked in Europe for Sheaffer pens are
sometimes ridiculous. OTOH, Ebay Germany often offers the possibility for
schnapping vintage German pens away for very good prices.
So, if I was rational, I would collect European pens. What I'm doing with
those Sheaffers anyway :-)
Merry Christmas to all a.c.p-p'ers!
Johan
fdu...@aol.com
>
> Absolutely true! The prices that are asked in Europe for Sheaffer pens are
> sometimes ridiculous. OTOH, Ebay Germany often offers the possibility for
> schnapping vintage German pens away for very good prices.
>
> So, if I was rational, I would collect European pens. What I'm doing with
> those Sheaffers anyway :-)
> Merry Christmas to all a.c.p-p'ers!
Who ever said any of us or of this is rational?
The very best of the Season to one and all. Frank
QuarterHorseman
into a bottle of quink ink.
Somebody stab me. :-\
QH
Tony Belding
> Dov, Pelikan has only a three year warranty and has for quite some time
> now. And you will have to pay a service charge for any item outside
> that warranty.
This reminds me of something odd I heard about German law. I don't
think it was in reference to pens when I heard about this, but it
might be applicable to Pelikan anyhow. Apparently, German courts have
ruled that a lifetime warranty is "not economically viable" and
therefore represents a form of unfair competition! In effect,
companies aren't allowed to sell products in Germany with a lifetime
warranty.
If I'm right about this.... Pelikan may be willing to repair your pen
for life, and they probably are allowed to, but they aren't allowed to
*promise* that they will.
Of course, it's also arguable by some that today's Pelikan pens aren't
as durable as many vintage pens, and that offering a lifetime warranty
on them really would be a mistake anyhow. I'll withhold judgment on
that, since I've never yet owned one myself.
Jim Holman
Yesterday I bought my very first 'serious' fountain pen, a Pelikan
800. In the shop it seemed to work just fine, I tested it dipping the
nib into a bottle
of quink ink. Back home I cleaned the pen with water and than put it
in a bottle of pelikan 4001 brilliant black to pump ink into the
barrel, after it was filled I let three drops fall back into the
bottle, closed the piston
again and started writing. At least that was what I had in mind. No
ink came out.
Well, Pelikans are great pens, but unfortunately stuff like this does
happen.
As I recall, around a year ago I purchased an M800. Within a month,
the barrell developed a leak. So I sent the pen to Chartpak, the
company that had just started doing Pelikan warranty work. They had
the pen quite a while. As I recall, after a month or so I got it back
from them. The leak was fixed, but then the pen didn't write very
well -- lots of skipping. So I sent the pen back again. At this
point I decided to exercise my nib exchange option, and went from a
medium to an extra-fine. The pen was returned with the new nib after
only a week, which means that Chartpak must have turned it around in a
day.
Today, the pen writes like a dream. It is utterly reliable. I can
not write with it for a couple of weeks, pick it up, and it writes
instantly. It never skips. Even though an extra fine, the nib is
extremely smooth -- no scratchiness whatsoever. It is in every way a
pleasure to write with.
Don't be discouraged. Whether you return it to the store, or send it
to Chartpak for warranty work, eventually you're going to have a great
pen. Sorry to hear that it wasn't great right out of the box. But I
believe it will get there.
jim holman
Paul Vianna
a Christmas gift, and it only writes with more pressure than I am accustomed
to using.
A search of this group will turn up many messages about the "break-in" time
for a new pen. The expert opinion seems to be that there may be a break-in
time of up to a couple of weeks just to completely wet the feed. However, a
nib made of reasonable material will not change much after a couple of weeks
of use, so nibs themselves don't really "break-in."
In the case of the Pelikan 800 there is another issue. On the Pentrace
message board Richard Binder (a top-class nib expert/repair person) has
stated that many _recent_ production high-end Pelikan nibs are basically
defective - The nib is shaped badly and is not matched to the feed
correctly. I don't know if that is the problem with our 800's, but if mine
does not improve a lot in a couple of weeks I will probably have a nib
repair person look at it. From the sound of it, this may not be fixable by
Pelikan because all their new stock has this problem.
If anyone knows that this is all wrong, I would be delighted to hear it.
Pelikan has always had an excellent reputation for pens that "just work",
but this experience (and a less-than-stellar M200) have made me wonder if
they are going downhill. I may be left with just Japanese pens (and vintage)
to wish for...
Paul Vianna
--
"Marten van de Kraats" <mv...@XXXXeuronet.nl> wrote in message
news:mvdk-9C1B3A.0...@news.euronet.nl...
DovR
Van Cleef & Arpels, Dunhill. Nuff said.
Ostensible the 3 year guarantee is correct. However Pelikan have been known
to bend their own rules. They have SUPER ASS (after sales service, not what
you were thinking mate) as opposed to the other brand. Look, to each his
own. I am prejudiced as far as Pelikans are concerned and have been very
happy with each and every one of my beaked bird pens.
Cannot say the same for the MB's I have and am trying to flog. Maybe keep
one vintage Red.
"john cline ii" <jwciit...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:EygO9.42266$3t6....@nwrddc03.gnilink.net...
>
>
Mathew J. Jancsics IV
--
----------------------------------------------------------
Mathew J. Jancsics IV
mjan...@hotmail.com
"semper ubi sub ubi"
Stephen Epstein
"Paul Vianna" <paul....@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:uZtO9.23615$cR2....@nwrddc04.gnilink.net...
>
[snip]
> In the case of the Pelikan 800 there is another issue. On the Pentrace
> message board Richard Binder (a top-class nib expert/repair person) has
> stated that many _recent_ production high-end Pelikan nibs are basically
> defective - The nib is shaped badly and is not matched to the feed
> correctly.
I had a similar skipping problem with an M1000 I purchased from Swisher Pens
about a year ago. I simply called and sent it back -- they swapped the
nib/feed assembly for another that was 99% better. Round trip took about a
week. It *may* go dry if it is filled but unused for days, but start it
once and it will write beautifully until the ink is gone.
YMMV, but I would just send it back to the retailer for adjustment.
SteveE
CyberiusXII
I have nevert held a bad one, & my M800 is the best of the lot!
From all I have read here, the Pelikan folk will take care of your problem.
"Marten van de Kraats" <mv...@XXXXeuronet.nl> wrote in message
news:mvdk-9C1B3A.0...@news.euronet.nl...
BLandolf
> ...I don't know if that is the problem with our 800's,
> but if mine does not improve a lot in a couple of weeks I
> will probably have a nib repair person look at it. From
> the sound of it, this may not be fixable by Pelikan
I would not assume that all or even a significant portion of
their new stock has this problem. I've had an occasional bad nib
from them, but it's been a long time (several years) since that
happened, and I have a pretty nice collection of modern Pelikans.
Paul... You hear of anything like this? I've probably picked up
a dozen new Pelikans in the past year and not one had a bad nib.
Flush your pen with cool water in which you've placed a drop or
two of liquid dish soap (like Ivory, Joy, or Dawn, etc.). If
that doesn't do the trick, send the pen or the nib/feed assembly
to Chartpak for replacement. You'll be happy you did. There's
absolutely no justification for you to pay someone to fix a brand
new nib/feed assembly. Pelikan has some of the best customer
service in the business. They'll make it right, and they'll do
it at no charge. Bernadette
Paul G
before Pelikan left the awful group in Tennessee. During the last few months
many returned nibs were just sent back out to others. Then, a wonderful man
named Salamone entered the repair shop at the new location, and service was just
great.
I just purchased two M800's for friends, from new stock, and not a problem. I
will say this...in my experience, if there is a flow problem with a Pelikan, it
needs to go back for adjustment. As for sitting...I have a 1000 that was filled
five months ago, and gets limited specific use, with it's EF nib. It writes
immediately whenever I uncap it. I've always believed "a properly adjusted
Pelikan is a total delight."
Enjoy!
Pelikanyo Paul
"BLandolf" <blan...@NOSPAMhotmail.com> wrote in message
news:vrnP9.10$am3....@news.abs.net...
Paul Vianna
(currently filled with Waterman Florida Blue), although it still has a
little way to go to match my expectations. Actually, it reminds me a bit of
the medium Parker Duofold Centennial I bought a few years ago - It also took
some breaking in before it performed well.
I'm still a little mystified about the "break-in period" for pens. Some of
the (almost all modern) FP's I've had have just worked perfectly out of the
box (Sheaffer Legacy, Namiki VP.) Others, like the modern Duofold and
(eventually?) the M800 seem to require a period of time to "warm up." Others
just never seem to work well at all.
Incidentally, I recall reading in Pen World a few years ago about a person
(an artist, I believe) who used "nib exercises" to somehow temper the nibs
on his pens, and who claimed that some of his best pens were those that gave
the most trouble out of the box. However, I suspect that Frank thinks this
is all hooey, and the author just got used to his poorly-made pens, rather
than the other way around.
--
Paul Vianna
"Paul G" <pg...@optonline.net> wrote in message
news:CEoP9.180554$a8....@news4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net...
Reuben S. Pitts III
>Thanks, all, for the feedback. My M800 is working quite a lot better now
>(currently filled with Waterman Florida Blue), although it still has a
>little way to go to match my expectations. Actually, it reminds me a bit of
>the medium Parker Duofold Centennial I bought a few years ago - It also took
>some breaking in before it performed well.
>
>I'm still a little mystified about the "break-in period" for pens. Some of
>the (almost all modern) FP's I've had have just worked perfectly out of the
>box (Sheaffer Legacy, Namiki VP.) Others, like the modern Duofold and
>(eventually?) the M800 seem to require a period of time to "warm up." Others
>just never seem to work well at all.
>
>Incidentally, I recall reading in Pen World a few years ago about a person
>(an artist, I believe) who used "nib exercises" to somehow temper the nibs
>on his pens, and who claimed that some of his best pens were those that gave
>the most trouble out of the box. However, I suspect that Frank thinks this
>is all hooey, and the author just got used to his poorly-made pens, rather
>than the other way around.
>
>--
>
>Paul Vianna
>
>
>
I find that 1/3 to 1/2 of my pens require a minor "nib tweak" to write
to my expectations. Of course my expectations and the factory
technician may be different. I like saturated writing, so prefer my
pens to write a little bit wet. However, only a few of my purchases
over the past few years would not be acceptable right out of the box. I
only have one Pelikan (sorry Bernadette), but I've never touched the nib
and it is a perfect writer.
Reuben
BLandolf
> I find that 1/3 to 1/2 of my pens require a minor "nib
> tweak" to write to my expectations. Of course my
> expectations and the factory technician may be
> different. I like saturated writing, so prefer my pens
> to write a little bit wet. However, only a few of my
> purchases over the past few years would not be acceptable
> right out of the box. I only have one Pelikan (sorry
> Bernadette), but I've never touched the nib and it is a
> perfect writer.
That's quite all right, Reuben. (You have at least one Omas don't
you? I still prefer those over Pelikans and just about everything
else.) ... I may have a BCHR Waterman 56 that would interest you
depending on whether it comes back from the "nib guru" with flow
modulated enough to suit my tastes... Nice big pen, light weight,
gorgeous moderately flexible nib... A wonderful pen. May need a
new home, though, if it's still too wet ...
Bern
Reuben S. Pitts III
>That's quite all right, Reuben. (You have at least one Omas don't
>you? I still prefer those over Pelikans and just about everything
>else.) ... I may have a BCHR Waterman 56 that would interest you
>depending on whether it comes back from the "nib guru" with flow
>modulated enough to suit my tastes... Nice big pen, light weight,
>gorgeous moderately flexible nib... A wonderful pen. May need a
>new home, though, if it's still too wet ...
>
>Bern
>
>
>
>
Yes, I have a Paragon that John Mottishaw tuned for me, and it is one of
the best writers I own (I think I say that about most of my pens).
Since I mostly collect sets, I have the matching BP and Pencil. If the
Waterman doesn't suit you, let me know. I might be interested. A
fellow can't have too many pens . . .
Reuben
Bruce Herbitter
"Reuben S. Pitts III" & Paul Vianna wrote:
>
it reminds me a bit of.......> >the medium Parker Duofold Centennial I
bought a few years ago - It also took
> >some breaking in before it performed well. I'm still a little mystified
about the "break-in period" for pens
I think that some manufacturers leave traces of the production lubricants on
components like feeds, and sections, or inside converters or barrels, and
these do not react well with inks. Once these are flushed out, either by
cleaning or by ink, the pens seem to work as intended. Visconti has been
particularly prone to this (I don't buy their pens anymore. Very pretty, but
not very good writers)
CB
so what
>I just purchased two M800's for friends,
<satrap, checking mailbox>
hmm, well, mail tends to be slower this time of year...
Paul G
"so what" <chgos...@aol.comorange> wrote in message
news:20021229194803...@mb-fz.aol.com...
Mike Zimmer
an order for one. Is the Pelikan 800 still a good choice? Is this just a
limited instance?
in article 3E0E3ADE...@adelphia.net, Reuben S. Pitts III at
rspitts...@adelphia.net wrote on 12/28/02 3:59 PM:
QuarterHorseman
a little lean for the first couple of days, but fine after that. Nib
tines were perfectly-spaced and perfectly-aligned. I did NOT do my
usual post-purchase 409-and-water flush before filling. This is the
first NIB 800 I've bought, and I can see how it might flow lean or be
balky with certain inks out of the box *if* a soap flush is not done
first. Doctor Black flows heavy in all pens so this may have
compensated. This 800 appears to be more tightly-regulated flow-wise
than my slew of 200s and 400s, but again it is still fairly-new and
unflushed. Yes, I would consider the 800 a good choice based on my
statistically-insignificant sample size of one (just a little
perspective there). Just stay away from inks that are known to flow on
the lean side.
QH
Jerry G
9C1B3A.014...@news.euronet.nl:
> Merry Christmas. This is my first posting in this newsgroup. Yesterday I
> bought my very first 'serious' fountain pen, a Pelikan 800. In the shop
> it seemed to work just fine, I tested it dipping the nib into a bottle
> of quink ink.
> Back home I cleaned the pen with water and than put it in a bottle of
> pelikan 4001 brilliant black to pump ink into the barrel, after it was
> filled I let three drops fall back into the bottle, closed the piston
> again and started writing.
> At least that was what I had in mind. No ink came out. Only if I pressed
> the nib on the paper it released sufficient ink, but this is not as it
> is supposed to be... I also own a pelikan 200 (that is what I think it
> is anyway, could also be some other lower end model) and that one writes
> without having to press the nib on the paper. This is a big
> dissapointment because I paid quite some money for this pen.
> I am planning to return it to the shop after Christmas.
> But before doing that I wondered: what is wrong here? And also: Should I
> wait some days for the ink flow to start running or is this a fable? I
> didn't have these problems with my other much cheaper Pelikan pen and my
> even cheaper Waterman Apostrophe also runs just fine.
>
> Greetings,
>
> Marten van de Kraats
I had exactly the same problem with an Aurora Ipsilon a couple months ago.
The store I bought it from traded it for another of the same type, and the
second one writes fine. IMHO, a pen should write easily with no more than
its own weight on the paper.
By the way, the shop manager didn't really agree with me that there was a
problem, since he writes with a lot of pressure. I have a light touch, so
the nib *was* giving me problems. In the interest of customer satisfaction
the store manager and I tried pens (of the same model) until one worked the
way I wanted it to.
--
Jerry G
Michigan
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fdu...@aol.com
> I had exactly the same problem with an Aurora Ipsilon a couple months ago.
> The store I bought it from traded it for another of the same type, and the
> second one writes fine. IMHO, a pen should write easily with no more than
> its own weight on the paper.
Thats the proper test for ANY AND ALL fountain pens. Balance the pen
between your outstretched tumb and forefinger and push, drag and guide
it across paper. Am even line should result no matter the pens
direction. No exceptions. No excuses. Any pen failing that is not
operating as it should. The pens own weight, probably to be fair, with
the cap posted, is all it should need. Another way is to tie a string
to the clip, post the cap, and let the nib dangle on paper in various
directions. Any line less than perfect and unbroken tells there is a
problem.
In reality I doubt 50% of the pens made today could pass the above
test. Vintage pens usually passed it easily, instantly, on the very
first fill. Both Parker and Sheaffer ran numerous full page color ads
showing those tests in fact. A Vintage pens not passing the test now
indicates some lack of proper restoration or adjustment. Of course in
all cases bad paper or ink can effect things. But with rather neutral
paper like standard office copy paper and Skrip or Quink there are no
other excuses. Frank
Patrick Lamb
>Jerry G wrote:
>
>> I had exactly the same problem with an Aurora Ipsilon a couple months ago.
>> The store I bought it from traded it for another of the same type, and the
>> second one writes fine. IMHO, a pen should write easily with no more than
>> its own weight on the paper.
>
>Thats the proper test for ANY AND ALL fountain pens. Balance the pen
>between your outstretched tumb and forefinger and push, drag and guide
>it across paper. Am even line should result no matter the pens
>direction. No exceptions. No excuses. Any pen failing that is not
>operating as it should. The pens own weight, probably to be fair, with
>the cap posted, is all it should need. Another way is to tie a string
>to the clip, post the cap, and let the nib dangle on paper in various
>directions. Any line less than perfect and unbroken tells there is a
>problem.
Do you cut any slack for different pens -- e.g., a featherweight
Pelikan 200 vs. a lead brick large Dupont Orpheo?
... although I like the simplicity of the test as you proposed it.
Pat
fdu...@aol.com
> >fdubiel wrote:
> >Thats the proper test for ANY AND ALL fountain pens. Balance the pen
> >between your outstretched tumb and forefinger and push, drag and guide
> >it across paper. Am even line should result no matter the pens
> >direction. No exceptions. No excuses. Any pen failing that is not
> >operating as it should. The pens own weight, probably to be fair, with
> >the cap posted, is all it should need. Another way is to tie a string
> >to the clip, post the cap, and let the nib dangle on paper in various
> >directions. Any line less than perfect and unbroken tells there is a
> >problem.
>
> Do you cut any slack for different pens -- e.g., a featherweight
> Pelikan 200 vs. a lead brick large Dupont Orpheo?
> ... although I like the simplicity of the test as you proposed it.
Zero slack. Well, any pen no matter how light should easily pass. A
extra heavy pen is not worthy of the name "pen" if it can't pass. The
test, once again, has not been proposed by me. Its a standard well
known test that was used by Sheaffer, Parker and many others on all
their pen before shipment in QC tests. The fact they even advertised the
test to the public in expensive ads encouraged the public to try the
tests after purchase and of course, perhaps return a pen that didn't
pass.
Today at least some pen repairmen (me for one) perform the test on
every pen worked on. Of course many pens and nibs are so poorly made
today they really can't pass the test without considerable work or even
a nib change. Such pens go out of here at my place at least, with the
info that I consider the pen in question to be factory deffective as it
is, but in many cases its a marginal call on that. A slight occasional
skip in the tests is probably "good enough" in most cases. One often
has to make a judgement call when any repair of anything is "good
enough."
One other obvious exception is someone who writes with heavy pressure
and yet and/or wants a lighter ink flow. So the pen may be adjusted to
not pass the test, as a special request for certain users. But thats
kind of rare since most heavy handed writers use a firm nib and a good
firm nib doesn't vary its writing that much from light to heavy
pressure. Frank
Marten van de Kraats
Patrick Lamb <pdla...@comcast.net> wrote:
> On Wed, 01 Jan 2003 12:38:03 -0500, fdu...@aol.com wrote:
>
> >Jerry G wrote:
> >
> >> I had exactly the same problem with an Aurora Ipsilon a couple months ago.
> >> The store I bought it from traded it for another of the same type, and the
> >> second one writes fine. IMHO, a pen should write easily with no more than
> >> its own weight on the paper.
> >
>
> Do you cut any slack for different pens -- e.g., a featherweight
> Pelikan 200 vs. a lead brick large Dupont Orpheo?
>
> ... although I like the simplicity of the test as you proposed it.
>
It certainly is a good test. The featherweight pelikan 150/200 passes
this test by the way. And so does the famous cheap 4 euro/dollar
Sheaffer (thick black or red without the white point), which is also
quite light. The rather expensive Waterman Expert II (heavy) doesn't
pass the test. But a 3 euro/dollar Waterman passes it, so does the 21
euro/dollar Waterman Apostrophe.
BTW speaking as the one that started this thread, I'd like to thank you
all for your advise. I made a deal with the shop. They will receive a
shipment of new Pelikan fountain pens in a week or so, and I can
exchange my faulty Pelikan 800 for another one then.
Fountain pens are amazingly attractive gadgets. Being a frequent user (I
write 5 to 10 pages of prose per night) they are pretty important tools
for me. I really value a good pen. I used to have four lying around (one
with blank ink at the office, one with red ink at the office and the
same setup at home), but the last couple of week I bought some more
because I wanted better quality pens. Hence I bought the Pelikan 200 and
just before christmas the 800. My latest addition is the really cheap
Shaeffer that is mentioned somewhere on the Internet being the best drop
dead cheap Fountain pen, and good it is.
Marten
Patrick Lamb
can't resist:
Marten van de Kraats wrote:
>
> Fountain pens are amazingly attractive gadgets. Being a frequent user (I
> write 5 to 10 pages of prose per night) they are pretty important tools
> for me. I really value a good pen. I used to have four lying around (one
> with blank ink at the office, one with red ink at the office and the
> same setup at home), but the last couple of week I bought some more
> because I wanted better quality pens.
What's your favorite blank ink? What's the most permanent and
water-resistant? Which has the best (blank) color?
Pat (g,d&r)
--
Apologies to those easily confused. Address is spam-resistant.
Correct email address like pdlamb 'round-about comcast point net.
Marten van de Kraats
It was a typo, I meant black ink. My black ink is the Pelikan Brilliant
Black. I followed the advise from the marcuslink fountain pen website. I
dont know if it is permanent or water-resistant. Don't really care. I
don't tend to write under the shower. And it is not like I need to
archive it for 50 years or so. After having finished a piece I just type
it in my computer and throw away the handwriting (first draft).
Marten
Norman M. Schwartz
"Patrick Lamb" <pdla...@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:3E150A30...@comcast.net...
> I know it's a typo, and I hate people who obsess on typos, but I just
> can't resist:
>
> Marten van de Kraats wrote:
> >
> > Fountain pens are amazingly attractive gadgets. Being a frequent user (I
> > write 5 to 10 pages of prose per night) they are pretty important tools
> > for me. I really value a good pen. I used to have four lying around (one
> > with blank ink at the office, one with red ink at the office and the
> > same setup at home), but the last couple of week I bought some more
> > because I wanted better quality pens.
>
> What's your favorite blank ink? What's the most permanent and
> water-resistant? Which has the best (blank) color?
>
These posts take me way back to my childhood. We had fun using something we
called "invisible ink". The pen would be dipped in milk, (I believe there
was only whole milk at the time), and after use, the paper written upon
would be treated somehow (I have gone blank there), perhaps heated, causing
the casein to denature and take on a brownish
coloration. Milk therefore =ed blank ink! I'm hopeful someone can fill in
my blanks.
Robin Myers
>
> These posts take me way back to my childhood. We had fun using something we
> called "invisible ink". The pen would be dipped in milk, (I believe there
> was only whole milk at the time), and after use, the paper written upon
> would be treated somehow (I have gone blank there), perhaps heated, causing
> the casein to denature and take on a brownish
> coloration. Milk therefore =ed blank ink! I'm hopeful someone can fill in
> my blanks.
One of the easiest ways to make the ink visible is to heat the paper on
or near the surface of an incandescent light bulb, usually mounted in a
vertical position with the bulb up. Be careful because the temperature
where some of these inks appear is close to the point where the paper
will char. Another "invisible" ink that can be processed the same way is
lemon juice, although it's odor can give it away. Did you see the scene
in "The Name of the Rose" where the lemon juice secret message is
detected by Sean Connery from the ink odor and developed with the heat
of a candle?
The 2001 edition of Greg Clark's Ink Sampler had several examples of
commercial versions of invisible inks. You might check with Greg to see
if the current version also has these samples.
Robin Myers
Ken Freeman
center of gravity? That wouldn't seem to make sense, since there might be
no pressure between the nib and paper. What does make sense to me is to
hold the pen at the end of the posted cap, so that the moment due to the
pen's mass is creating pressure. I don't think I'm skewing the results
significantly, since I do have pens, low mass and high mass, that fail this
test.
Ken
<fdu...@aol.com> wrote in message news:3E1327...@aol.com...
fdu...@aol.com
>
> Frank, when you say to "balance the pen" do you mean to hold the pen at its
> center of gravity? That wouldn't seem to make sense, since there might be
> no pressure between the nib and paper. What does make sense to me is to
> hold the pen at the end of the posted cap, so that the moment due to the
> pen's mass is creating pressure. I don't think I'm skewing the results
> significantly, since I do have pens, low mass and high mass, that fail this
> test.
Balance the pen means the pen is resting and writing on the paper by its
own weight. Nothing more or less. The mass of the pen makes no
difference other than a heavier pen should pass the test easier. One
once more time, any pen, no matter the weight or size than cannot make a
clean more or less unbroken line on paper by nothing more than its own
weight isn't working as a pen should.
Holding the pen by its posted cap isn't quite the same as some weight is
probably going to be added by holding it. The proper way would be to
dangle the pen with a string or rubber band under the clip of a posted
cap and see how the pen writes a line. That was the Sheaffer way of
testing, wheras Parker also used the pen in open palm method. Just rest
the pen against an open palm and drag the pen or push it with the pens
own wright doing the written line. Frank
Ken Freeman
described, I'm getting the intent of the test, which is to use the pen's own
weight.
Thanks!
Ken
<fdu...@aol.com> wrote in message news:3E1895...@aol.com...