Replay B10
Antony Phillips
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Date: Fri, 04 Jun 1999 20:29:59 +0200
Date: Thu, 07 Sep 2000 23:29:00 +0200
Date: Sat, 22 Dec 2001 07:14:02 +0100
Date: Fri, 04 Apr 2003 23:20:00 +0100
Date: Fri, 02 Jul 2004 22:36:37 +0100
To: tro...@newciv.org
From: Antony Phillips <i...@post8.tele.dk>
Subject: TROM: Replay B10
Subject: Replay B10
Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 06:59:41 +0100
From: Antony Phillips <i...@post8.tele.dk>
Organization: International Viewpoints
To: tro...@newciv.org
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Msg : 79 of 289 Rcv Pvt K/s Scn
From : ASC Missions Group 236/174.10 Thu 06 Apr 95 20:20
To : Flemming Funch <ffu...@netcom.com> Sat 08 Apr 95 06:37
Subj : Re: Perfect Time
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Apparently-to: a...@jacome.ping.dk
From: ASC Missions Group <spe...@netcom.com>
Subject: Re: Perfect Time
Flemming,
Thanks for posting an alternate view on the question.
Since you are a TROMmer and I am not, I'll yield the point to you as it
may apply to TROM.
Maybe both approaches should be tested? I suspect there's still good to
be had from my recommendations.
-0-
On Fri, 7 Apr 1995, Flemming Funch wrote:
> At 3:48 PM 4/6/95 +0300, Dimitry Ivakhnenko wrote:
> >I am interested in the goals time usage since I am translating TROM in
> >Russian. As I understand "To be known" and "To know" are finished goals.
> >What about "To become known" and "To learn" ? I mean, must the goals in
> >packages be finished? What is preferable?
>
> No, the goals are not finished. That is kind of the whole point. One wants
> it but doesn't have it. Which is why one is creating the opposite at the
> same time.
>
> "To be known" sort of means "I really must become known, but right now I am
> not".
>
> - Flemming
>
>
> o o
> / \------------------ Flemming A. Funch ------------------/ \
> / * \ World Transformation/New Civilization/Whole Systems / * \
> / * * \ ffu...@netcom.com / * * \
> o-------o ------http://www.protree.com/worldtrans/--------o-------o
>
>
>
Speaker for Acceptance <spe...@netcom.com> Acceptance Services Center
Acceptance is appreciation without significance. | (415) 964-3436
Appreciation is willingness to experience as-is. --8-- PO Box 390696
Significance is interpretation, or added-on meaning. | Mtn Vw CA 94039
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Msg : 80 of 289 Rcv Pvt K/s Scn
From : Dustin W. Carr <dc...@newton.ruph.cornell.edu> Sun 08 Jan 95 05:57
To : trom-l <tro...@netcom.com> Sun 08 Jan 95 21:23
Subj : Time Breaking and stuff
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Hello,
I have a few comments relating to the more recent posts. I would
like to say that TROM has generally worked quite well for me,
despite having little formal auditing (< 25 hours) beforehand. I
was able to get gains steadily to the end of level three, but I did
run into huge problems there. I wound up in constant restimulation
of something out of this world (A universe entrance point that was
quite painful). There was about a week that I went to bed at night
uncertain if my body would live until morning. It took a great
deal of energy to just keep a foot in this reality.
I eventually made it through this stumbling block. I have slowed
down alot on my trom auditing, but I still have cognitions steadily
throughout my days.
I have developed a couple of useful 'tools' for dealing with life
using time-breaking. I have found that for pains and other unpleasant
sensations, time-breaking can be very helpful. I am not talking about
a dianetics sort of time breaking, instead I mean time-breaking the
pain itself. I have found that the pain that we 'feel' is usually
much more intense than what the body is actually feeling. This is
due to restimulation. So just compare the pain you feel with the pain
that the body is actually experiencing in present time. I have found
this to be amazingly effective and fast. Many times faster than
dianetics or the 'assists' developed by Ron. I have had some minor
pains disappear entirely, and more intense pains greatly alleviated.
Some of my success in doing this may be due to my ability to time
break things quite easily, so this may not work for someone who has
not made headway on level 3 yet.
This same technique is useful for handling extreme temperatures as
well (having just moved from Oklahoma to upstate New York I found this
necessary :) )
I hope to make progress on level 4 over the next few weeks.
Happy tromming.
Dustin
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Msg : 81 of 289 Rcv Pvt K/s Scn
From : Antony Phillips 236/174.10 Thu 13 Apr 95 11:50
To : tro...@netcom.com Fri 14 Apr 95 07:22
Subj : forwarded Letter from Judith Methven - mainly on TROM
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Apparently-to: a...@jacome.ping.dk
From: a...@jacome.ping.dk (Antony Phillips)
Subject: forwarded Letter from Judith Methven - mainly on TROM
The Chimes
William Street
Ryde PO33 3EA
Isle of Wight
2 April 1995
Dear Antony
Thank you for your letter and the reports on Internet about TROM that
you sent to me. I found them most interesting. There were also some
good writings by Flemming that were not related to TROM and I found
these very interesting too, and wrote to him to say so. I received
a letter back from him a long while later which surprised me because
I think he only communicates through Internet, as this is easy, quick
and cheap. Anyway, I appreciated the courtesy of his reply.
I finished working with TROM some while ago, though will probably
go back to it for a re-read when I have time. Thought I would mention
the following as these were things that came from working with TROM.
Trom worked well for quite a time until I hit the following obstacle. In
some of the undesirable games that I was playing, it was easy to find
the postulate and to locate its complimentary, but I COULDN'T TRULY
ACCEPT the complimentary postulate - it didn't really find its mark. It
wasn't a case of not getting the wording right, it was more a case
of simply not being willing to accept the complimentary postulate
- it was not acceptable. So I was stuck, and the game continued because
the feelings and emotions were unchanged. (I was actually in quite
a restimulated state, from using TROM).
I found the best way through this was two way communication with Leonard
(he's a wise soul!). He helped me look at various views of the situation,
while remembering the basic laws of life (these are sound rules to
remember when one is in a sticky situation!)
At the end of this run we came to realize that what we had been tackling
was actually the very basic troubles of my case, which had been exposed
by TROM. But I will be honest and say I don't think I could have
got through on my own - the input of an experienced auditor was most
necessary for the most difficult bits. I was able to stir up a lot
with TROM but was not always experienced enough to audit it out. Therein,
to me, lies the danger of TROM.
The frequent use of time breaking, repairing importances, and looking
for and using the complimentary postulate, has become second nature
to me now. I find this most useful in general living and am often
able to help others too in that I can gently prod them into time-breaking
or repairing importances.
I learnt a great deal from TROM and had a good number of major realisations.
There! I think I have now finished telling you of my journey with
TROM.
A small point but I thought I would mention it as it meant a lot to
me. In one of the letters you sent some time ago you mentioned that
often you did not find auditing easy, especially with a new pre-clear. I
thought this very honest and open of you and it made me feel better,
because I experience similar things...and thought it was just me! Thank
you.
I read The Holographic Universe a short while ago, which I found great. It
required a lot of attention in the reading, but was most interesting
and enlightening. I'm so glad you called Leonard's attention to it.
There is always a lot to read, but I find I the best education is
putting what you know into practice...this makes things real and workable...so
I try and live my life quite carefully in that I'm vigilant and look
for what I'm doing wrong and acknowledge what I'm doing right. Leonard
has been very helpful in his guidance here...he is most careful and
conscientious in his guidance and I truly appreciate this.
I've put Leonard's last article CASE COMPLETION AND EDUCATION on the
disk after this letter, and also the review of Flemming's TRANSFORMATIONAL
DIALOGUES (which took a lot of reading!).
Looking forward to seeing you in May.
Best Wishes
Judith
-
*************
(In May there is an independent conference in England)
******************'forwarded to TROM-L by
/ДДД\
| Ant | Antony A Phillips
\ДДД/
Internet address: a...@jacome.ping.dk tlf: (+45) 45 88 88 69
Box 78
DK - 2800 Lyngby
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Msg : 82 of 289 Rcv Pvt K/s Scn
From : Dimitry Ivakhnenko 236/174.10 Fri 14 Apr 95 09:41
To : tro...@netcom.com Sat 15 Apr 95 07:47
Subj : Re: Letter from Judith Methven
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Apparently-to: a...@jacome.ping.dk
From: Dimitry Ivakhnenko <d...@insight.kiev.ua>
Subject: Re: Letter from Judith Methven
Judith Methven wrote:
>Trom worked well for quite a time until I hit the following obstacle. In
>some of the undesirable games that I was playing, it was easy to find
>the postulate and to locate its complimentary, but I COULDN'T TRULY
>ACCEPT the complimentary postulate - it didn't really find its mark. It
>wasn't a case of not getting the wording right, it was more a case
>of simply not being willing to accept the complimentary postulate
>- it was not acceptable. So I was stuck, and the game continued because
>the feelings and emotions were unchanged. (I was actually in quite
>a restimulated state, from using TROM).
Excerpts from TROM:
Affinity is the willingness to create complementary postulates.
Reality is the degree to which complementary postulates are created.
Communication is the action of creating complementary postulates.
I'd like to share my humble experience. Life and TROM became much easier
thanks to the small everyday exercises in creating communication,
affinity, admiration, granting of beingness. I came to creating
(imagining) communication with the objects, people (real and imagined),
thoughts, feelings, restimulations, situations, pains, etc. etc.
Knowledge about the complementary postulates helps a lot. It's so easy
and pleasant to live in a friendly world. I think that the exercises in
creating complementary postulates fit in TROM very well.
Cheers,
--
Dimitry Ivakhnenko
Phone:+7 (044) 224 7323
E-mail: d...@insight.kiev.ua
PO Box 298-9 Kiev 252034 Ukraine
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Msg : 84 of 289 Snt Loc Hld Scn
From : Antony Phillips 2:235/159.10 Sat 15 Apr 95 12:10
To : For Judiths info Sat 15 Apr 95 12:10
Subj : forwarded Letter from Judith Methven - mainly on TROM
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*** repeating a msg posted in (my editors) area NETMAIL (Fido-style Netmail
Area). That is, it was a private message to me, and was not sent to all the
others on the list.
Thursday April 13 1995 19:48, Flemming Funch wrote to Antony Phillips:
FF> Apparently-to: a...@jacome.ping.dk
FF> From: ffu...@netcom.com (Flemming Funch)
FF> Subject: Re: forwarded Letter from Judith Methven - mainly on TROM
FF> At 10:50 AM 4/13/95 +0100, Antony Phillips wrote:
(Actually he is quoting my sending of Judiths letter: beggining with FF>> are
Flemming himself)
>> A small point but I thought I would mention it as it meant a lot to
>> me. In one of the letters you sent some time ago you mentioned that
>> often you did not find auditing easy, especially with a new
>> pre-clear. I thought this very honest and open of you and it made me
>> feel better, because I experience similar things...and thought it was
>> just me! Thank you.
FF> Just wanted to comment there, as I didn't answer when you talked about
FF> it in ACT.
(Flemming is talking about another list - actually meant for upper level
confidential material, but I wrote in it concerning handling of a new
preclear -
expalantory note by ANT)
FF> I actually find it easiest to deal with brand new people. Mostly
FF> because I don't have any particular procedures in mind that HAVE to
FF> work, and a new person has no particular expectation on what will
FF> happen or how it will be done. So, anything that gets them a bit
FF> uptone is good news to them.
FF> I have more trouble with people who've done a lot of other practices,
FF> including Scientology, and who expect that they can only change if
FF> particular actions are done.
FF> With a new person I would just do it in a coffee shop style. Sitting
FF> down talking with them, getting an idea what is going on with them,
FF> and when I find an angle that I have a fitting tool for, I use that.
FF> If it doesn't work very well, I try something else, until I find
FF> something that works well and leads to a result.
FF> I always get a good result in the first session. I would attribute
FF> that more to my attitude and my willingness to be flexible than to my
FF> overall skill as an auditor.
FF> If I insist that I have to be able to do a repetitive process or R3R
FF> with a new person, that is a bit scary, in that I can't be sure that
FF> it will work. But I can know for sure that SOMETHING will work. If
FF> nothing else, just sitting listening to what the person has to say.
FF> - Flemming
FF> o o
FF> / \-+--+--+--+--+--+- Flemming A. Funch -+--+--+--+--+--+-/ \
FF> / * \ World Transformation/New Civilization/Whole Systems / * \
FF> / * * \ ffu...@netcom.com / * * \
FF> o-+--+--o -+--+-http://www.protree.com/worldtrans/-+--+---o-+--+--o
FF> -+- GIGO+ sn 299 at jacome vsn 0.99.950303
Greetings,
/ДДД\
| Ant | Antony A Phillips
\ДДД/
Internet address: a...@jacome.ping.dk tlf: (+45) 45 88 88 69
Box 78
DK - 2800 Lyngby
--
--
Ant Antony A Phillips
i...@post8.tele.dk
tlf: (+45) 45 88 88 69
Box 78
DK - 2800 Lyngby
Editor, International Viewpoints (= IVy). See Home Page:
http://home8.inet.tele.dk/ivy/
Administrator: trom-l, selfclearing-l, superscio-l,
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