Klemmer & Associates -- sound familiar?
Eldon
program talks about his experience. Sound familiar? Let's check the
company website:
http://www.klemmer.com/
Oooh, look. They even have network marketing services, naming such
illustrious companies as Mary Kay and Quixtar!
Brian Klemmer says he has a Masters degree, but doesn't say it's in
psychology. He also claims his workshops are not for those with
psychological challenges. Harry, of course, solved the "mental health
problem" by inventing an imaginary license so he could claim to be an
educational psychologist.
A participant says:
http://forum.rickross.com/viewtopic.php?t=7074
The things within me that these seminars stirred up within my
emotions, and psyche level around my core belief systems. Much of what
got stirred up in this area was in much need of being addressed within
me. Not by Klemmer, but by a professional psychologist within the
proper mental health context of one on one counseling. Large Group
Awareness Training is not the proper place for this type of work on a
persons psyche.
Unfortunately this is where there is also much anger towards Klemmer
as I realize from looking back over my almost two year involvement in
applying Klemmers philosophy on my life. Klemmer & Associates seminars
ARE NOT THE PLACE TO CONFRONT THESE CORE BELIEF SYSTEMS WITHIN MYSELF.
The human psyche is not to be messed with by the untrained. Klemmer &
Associates facilitators, staff, volunteer staff are not properly
trained in this realm. They do not have the credentials, proper
training, mental health education, or the license to work within the
human psyche and psychological at the levels which are being done in
their seminars.
Also, note that Klemmer & associates has built their seminars with the
goal of having participants attend all levels. What this means is that
they are all built upon each other. Even though they say each one is a
complete and separate seminar. They are far from separate....
There is much around the seminars exercises that create through the
long hours, exercises, and emotional involvement where the end result
is getting participants to turn off your "critical thinking" and begin
to see all judgments, and resistance to the new philosophies that
Klemmer is revealing as negative and bad.
How it is done is by having you become emotionally involved enough to
where the negative that exists in us all is exposed in a way you see
it. This is powerful and manipulative at the same time.
This is where the bait & switch of core beliefs within participants
begin in seminars. Every seminar does this bait & switch at one level
or another. But, I am referring to the whole scheme behind all of
Klemmers seminars as a whole.....
Freetar Jane
May as well cut-n-paste Klemmer for Star's Edge.
Grace
Do you remember my post on Examine2000 where I advised you to get your
ducks in a row if you were going to take on Harry? Did you do that?
I hate to be the one to point this out to you but.....
We all know your upset is with Harry.
And yet you keep trying to make it about the Avatar course.
It's public record that you were once a Avatar Master and there's even
an article which is posted on the internet that describes what a
rewarding experience it was for you to deliver the course.
When press comes to shove you admit the course is "pretty good" and is
well structured.
So do you really think the only way you can get back at Harry is
through trying to make inaccurate comparisons and calculations about
the Avatar course?
Grace
Eldon
> Eldon,
>
> Do you remember my post on Examine2000 where I advised you to get your
> ducks in a row if you were going to take on Harry? Did you do that?
> I hate to be the one to point this out to you but.....
>
> We all know your upset is with Harry.
How did we ~all~ come to know that? I for one don't. Did it ever occur
to you that some of us might have a more basic concern about the
behavior of psychopathic cult leaders and their minions?
Grace
How do we "all" know that?
Come on don't you remember challenging Harry to sue you?
And isn't this all because Harry failed to recognize what a terrific
Master you were and failed to give you a special invite to the Wizards
course?
Hey, I just had an idea. Since Happ claims to have a handle on logic
maybe he could explain to you what the concept of "getting your ducks
in a row" means.
And maybe he can even tell you where you went wrong.
BTW what was your Masters license number?
Grace
Eldon
> Eldon,
>
> How do we "all" know that?
>
> Come on don't you remember challenging Harry to sue you?
>
> And isn't this all because Harry failed to recognize what a terrific
> Master you were and failed to give you a special invite to the Wizards
> course?
>
> Hey, I just had an idea. Since Happ claims to have a handle on logic
> maybe he could explain to you what the concept of "getting your ducks
> in a row" means.
Maybe that concept will take on new meaning for you in the near
future. Say within a month or thereabouts.
>
> And maybe he can even tell you where you went wrong.
>
> BTW what was your Masters license number?
Don't know. Seems like I did have a cheesy certificate at one time,
but I don't even remember if it had a number on it.
>
> Grace
Grace
> > Hey, I just had an idea. Since Happ claims to have a handle on logic
> > maybe he could explain to you what the concept of "getting your ducks
> > in a row" means.
>
> Maybe that concept will take on new meaning for you in the near
> future. Say within a month or thereabouts.
Gee Eldon, I might take that as a threat and I might be worried but
since your performance in the last seven years has been so dismal I
can't imagine I'll be losing any sleep tonight or anytime soon.
As a matter of fact your rants of late have gotten so repetivie and
boring, new material will be a welcome relief.
Can you give us a hint to what it's all about? Will this new attack
land you in the slammer and/or are you counting on it to boost your
google ratings?
Grace
Eldon
Are those the only outcomes you can envision? Maybe the Wizard course
could help you with that. See www.avatarcult.info for additional
possibilities.
> Grace
HAPPYsamuri
> Eldon,
>
> How do we "all" know that?
>
> Come on don't you remember challenging Harry to sue you?
>
> And isn't this all because Harry failed to recognize what a terrific
> Master you were and failed to give you a special invite to the Wizards
> course?
>
> Hey, I just had an idea. Since Happ claims to have a handle on logic
> maybe he could explain to you what the concept of "getting your ducks
> in a row" means.
i think you need to emapthise with what betrayal means
logic accepts that people who have been betrayed take time to come to
terms with it
most victims of fraud take a little time to get all "their ducks in a
row" when it comes to how they are gonna react to the conman
perhaps you could teach the guys responsible for trying the OJ case -
how to get all their ducks in a row - court cases are won and lost
everyday
more to the point -- what DUCKS was harry trying to put in a row when
- HE - the master of LIVING DELIBERATELY - deliberately chose to
present himself as an educational psychologist
i suppose he assumed those particular ducks would fall into line cos
he wanted them to
HAPPYsamuri
> > > Hey, I just had an idea. Since Happ claims to have a handle on logic
> > > maybe he could explain to you what the concept of "getting your ducks
> > > in a row" means.
>
> > Maybe that concept will take on new meaning for you in the near
> > future. Say within a month or thereabouts.
>
> Gee Eldon, I might take that as a threat and I might be worried but
> since your performance in the last seven years has been so dismal I
> can't imagine I'll be losing any sleep tonight or anytime soon.
>
you are not in anyway a catalyst for peace - this sounds like a script
for a sectarian high school movie
"your a loser - we kiked you out of the team- just get over it"
> As a matter of fact your rants of late have gotten so repetivie and
> boring, new material will be a welcome relief.
>
after enlightenment - chop wood fetch water - repetive repetitive
> Can you give us a hint to what it's all about? Will this new attack
> land you in the slammer and/or are you counting on it to boost your
> google ratings?
>
"yep Eldon - you"re just sooooo unpopular - I can't believe harry ever
let you on the team - lets show his ugly high school photo on the
iternet and call him a loser"
just another enlightened approach to conflict resolution by todays
leaders in "thoughtstorming"
Grace
You're a relative newbie on the scene.
Are you aware of the offers that were made to Eldon?
The kindness that was extended to him?
Probably not, but you seem to have a handle on logic, and such.
So please do tell us, Wise Chinese Master that you are, what an
enlightened being would do with a nutcase such as Eldon?
What do you do when someone chooses a destructive path?
Grace
Eldon
So did L. Ron Hubbard when he bought a mail order Ph.D. from "Sequoia
University" for $50 or whatever it cost him. When caught, he renounced
it by saying that "doctor" had become a word of ill repute anyway.
Then there was the title "nuclear physicist" he bestowed on himself as
author of the quack medical book, All about Radiation.
Keep Harry's motto in mind: "If Ron could do it, I can do it too!"
Harry is sort of like... well, The Little Caboose that Could --
bringing up the rear of the cult train while chanting, "I think I
can...." Or to put it another way, he's chasing Ron the locomotive
while being drowned in smoke and showered by cinders.
The Scientology train wreck already happened a long way ahead (or
years ago on the time track). But Harry is still moving way back
there, chanting the primary, "I think I can, I think I can..."
Meanwhile, there's a lot of derailed, jackknifed cars and carnage
along the tracks ahead of the Little Caboose.
HAPPYsamuri
>
I assume in your case its whatever the boss tells you to do
If you are trying to tell me - that the level of your spirituality has
reached such a degree that you are out looking for people on a
destructive path - so you may work with them.... to help them...
perhaps someone who is beyond causing you a conflict of interests
might be a better place to start
if you are trying to tell me you have Eldon's best interests at heart
- my Question would be - how has the strategy you have been using
worked so far
from your point of view - is Eldon LESS destructive since you have
been trying to help him - or have your efforts had a reverse effect
waynemcmahon
good is evil and evil is good, nobody in their right mind pays him any
attention.
That doesn't help Eldon in his goal to "bring Harry down", but it does
minimize his bad karma so he won't have to spend a bunch more lifetimes
as an insect.
Eldon
> On Jul 7, 2:25 pm, Grace <am_gr...@adelphia.net> wrote:
>
> > What do you do when someone chooses a destructive path?
What the hell is the problem with destruction? Let's not forget that
Lord Shiva of the Hindu triumvirate has a respectable job. He's called
the god of destruction, but it's more a matter of transformation and
transition into a new era.
I mean, what did I destroy so far that shouldn't have been discreated?
Harry's fake, imaginary psychology license? The non-disclosure secrecy
scam? The Wizard course quackery hype? Hey, some things need to be
destroyed.
Besides, I sure didn't do it singlehandedly, so stop giving me all the
credit.
Grace
Yes, I agree Eldon is less destructive. At one time I thought he
might be suicidal, that passed and then I thought he might be headed
for a mental breakdown, I don't anymore.
Other then being a nutcase and fixated on "getting back at Harry" he
probably will live to a ripe old age of 70 or so. It's sad though to
carry around that much anger and hatred when life can be so amazing.
Oh well, I guess I'll leave you all with in your muck.
Grace
HAPPYsamuri
> Less destructive, of course. Except for a few screwballs who believe
> good is evil and evil is good, nobody in their right mind pays him any
> attention.
>
> That doesn't help Eldon in his goal to "bring Harry down", but it does
> minimize his bad karma so he won't have to spend a bunch more lifetimes
> as an insect.
>
so your strategy for helping him is to tell him he will be
reincarnated as an insect and that has brought about this positive
change in Eldon's level of destructiveness
does this mean avatar teaches reincarnation?
HAPPYsamuri
> What gave you the impression that I answer to a boss?
>
sorry its a colloqualism - onviously not used around your parts
> Yes, I agree Eldon is less destructive. At one time I thought he
> might be suicidal, that passed and then I thought he might be headed
> for a mental breakdown, I don't anymore.
>
so what particular technique did you use to help in this subtle
transformation to the "less" destructive level?
> Other then being a nutcase and fixated on "getting back at Harry" he
> probably will live to a ripe old age of 70 or so. It's sad though to
> carry around that much anger and hatred when life can be so amazing.
>
do you agree with Wayne that it will have bearing on his next
incarnation?
> Oh well, I guess I'll leave you all with in your muck.
>
i think you are right - it is only a guess - i guess there's a time
for you to live DELIBERATELY and a time for you to Guess what your
next move will be
does Harry teach them both or just the Deliberate part
Freetar Jane
http://forum.rickross.com/viewtopic.php?t=7074
I love the part about integrity used against you to keep the materials
secret. never heard of such a thing LOL
Grace
> > Yes, I agree Eldon is less destructive. At one time I thought he
> > might be suicidal, that passed and then I thought he might be headed
> > for a mental breakdown, I don't anymore.
>
> so what particular technique did you use to help in this subtle
> transformation to the "less" destructive level?
Reach and withdrawal
> > Other then being a nutcase and fixated on "getting back at Harry" he
> > probably will live to a ripe old age of 70 or so. It's sad though to
> > carry around that much anger and hatred when life can be so amazing.
>
> do you agree with Wayne that it will have bearing on his next
> incarnation?
Have you ever read the channeled material called Ramatha? He states
it's not important what you believe (in regards to after life), what's
important is that you believe in something. It's those who believe in
nothing that are stuck in limbo. I choose to believe in what makes
sense to me and what feels right. Do I agree with Wayne in the notion
of karma? Somewhat. I feel it is a person's choice whether their
existence on this earth is heaven or hell. I also believe what
happens in your afterlife is what you believe will happen.
>
> > Oh well, I guess I'll leave you all with in your muck.
>
> i think you are right - it is only a guess - i guess there's a time
> for you to live DELIBERATELY and a time for you to Guess what your
> next move will be
>
> does Harry teach them both or just the Deliberate part
One of the things I learned from the Avatar course is the possiblity
of endless possibilities.
HAPPYsamuri
>
> One of the things I learned from the Avatar course is the possiblity
> of endless possibilities.
i learned it from the guy down the road....
but you mentioned something YOU were going to do or not do
> > Oh well, * I* guess * I'll* leave you all with in your muck.
is that merely a "possibility" of something that you MAY or MAY not
choose to do
or are you going to be more DELIBERATE about it
-- isn't it all about your relationship with endless "possibilty" thru
"deliberate" action
and how to choose effective actions - rather than waste energy on
ineffective ones
[trade mark to me and the guy down the road]