Worldcom "toll" charges
Dan Rhodes
WorldCom advertises "free" long distance, however on my last bill I was
charged a "toll" for calls made across "lata lines" within California. I
called WorldCom and they said they have nothing to do with it, and that it's
a PacBell charge. How can PacBell charge me for calls I make on my WorldCom
cell phone? Is there any way to avoid this?
Thanks!
Michael Thaler
unethical and outright fraudulent practices about Worldcom's wireless
unit.
As you may know, the parent company is on the verge of collapse. I
am surprised you got thru to a CS person.
PacBell has nothing to do with cellular LD. They are not allowed to
transmit inter-LATA calls from land phones - just intra-LATA. I wonder
if Worldcom, instead of calling it "LD", is saying we make a "connection
charge" on all LD calls and since they originated in a PacBell area they
call it a "PacBell charge".
...You should sign up directly with a legitimate carrier. All
Worldcomm was doing was reselling someone else's service anyway.
...mike
Richard Ness
OK, Mike... I'll put on my NOMEX suit and rebut.... Sorry, these are NOT the
facts.......
Wcom Wireless problems are NOT indicative of the whole company. The problems
many people have had, (including, believe it or not Wcom employees themselves) are
wireless issues, not company wide issues. Employees themselves have had
problems with the wireless folks. This is not being disputed, but as to the rest:
First and foremost, the company's financials are solid. First quarter 2002 revenues
for WorldCom Group were $5.1 billion. This represents a 2 percent year over year
decline in WorldCom revenues - a decline that is similar to others across U.S.
industry. One major cause for this decline is due to the overall slowdown in the
global economy. We anticipate that as the business cycle recovers, our revenues will
improve.
Key factors that differentiates WorldCom from those who might be struggling in this
industry are:
¨ WorldCom currently ranks 42 on the Fortune 500 list and 90 on Fortune's Global 500
list. ¨ WorldCom has a solid base of satisfied bill-paying customers that range from
Fortune 500 to small business and consumers. ¨ WorldCom has built our business on a
foundation of an unsurpassed portfolio of high-demand, global products.
WorldCom's debt levels are manageable and we are cash flow positive. We expect more
than US$ 1 billion in free cash flow in 2002. In summary, WorldCom is NOT GOING TO GO
BANKRUPT and is a safe choice for WorldCom customers today and tomorrow.
"Michael Thaler" <michael...@mindspring.com> wrote in message
news:3D0F87D5...@mindspring.com...
Jay B
>Subject: Re: Worldcom facts
>From: "Richard Ness" richa...@damnspam.nessnet.com
>Date: 6/19/2002 2:27 AM Eastern Standard Time
>Message-id: <uh092fn...@corp.supernews.com>
Don Freeman
news:uh092fn...@corp.supernews.com after much deliberation:
This may well be true and I have no reason to doubt it, but due to the
outright unethical practices of the wireless group the entire company is
being branded with the same iron by those of us (myself included) who have
been screwed over by Worldcom Wireless. And we are very vocal about it. I
would think that if the parent company really wanted to convince us that
they are of a different sort they would step in and fix the woes caused by
the wireless group that shares their name. I don't pretend to understand
corporate law and maybe this is not possible, but if not I would like to
know why not.
Don "still getting billed monthly for a service that was disconnected
months ago (post-contract expiration date)" Freeman
Steven J. Sobol
>
>
>OK, Mike... I'll put on my NOMEX suit and rebut.... Sorry, these are NOT the
>facts.......
>
>Wcom Wireless problems are NOT indicative of the whole company. The problems
>many people have had, (including, believe it or not Wcom employees themselves) are
>wireless issues, not company wide issues.
Absolute BS.
**I had MCI fail to credit a credit-card payment for two months and then
send their idiot bill-collectors after me.
**After cancelling Popvision, the cable company with whom my apt. building
had a contract, the guy came to pick up the box and told me that since
Popvision got bought by Worldcom, even Popvision employees couldn't get good
service from the call center in Texas. The guy told me that Texas hangs up
on them all the time...
(two examples)
--
Steve Sobol, CTO (Server Guru, Network Janitor and Head Geek)
JustThe.net LLC, Mentor On The Lake, OH 888.480.4NET http://JustThe.net
"In a 32-bit world, you're a 2-bit user/You've got your own newsgroup:
alt.total.loser" - "Weird Al" Yankovic, "It's All About the Pentiums"
Michael Thaler
pyramid schemes (euphemistically called "multi-level marketing"). How
he got legitimate financial support for his adventures beyond me. The
company is top heavy with debt - remember it took massive debt for the
mouse to swallow the elephant [tiny company buying established firm].
While there might not be a formal bk., there def. will be some kind
of reorganization so that the lenders "refinance" the debt so as not to
take a big hit at this time. This is a fairly common practice when
countries are on the verge of default and does, often, take place in the
commercial sector as well.
...mike
Jeff Phillips
shack. They have this huge "Worldcom Wireless" banner hung out front their
store. When you go inside, they say that Worldcom is a division of AT&T, not
a reseller and NOT part of MCI. (What a load of crap!!!). Then they hand you
brochours for AT&T wireless. Meanwhile their local newspaper ads say
"Verizion Wireless is now here" above a big Worldcom Wireless logo with no
other mention of Verizon in the ad. In their store they claim to sell
Verizon Wireless phones, but if you try to get one they won't let you
because there is no Verizon Wireless service anywhere in the county, it's an
off-network roaming area and thus Verizon Wireless won't even sign you up
because of your billing address. That radio shack also thinks it is selling
NexTel and Celular One / Dobson phones. Thankfully the only local cellular
company that has any decency apparently is not allowing them to become a
dealer for them.
So back to the topic... MCI Worldcom is an evil company through and
through. It's certainly not just their wireless division. A few years back
they called and asked if they could send me some more information in the
mail about their 5 cent sundays plan. I told them that I didn't want to
change any services over the phone but if they want to send me crap in the
mail, I could care less. In fact, I'd rather read the offer on paper instead
of hearing it over the phone. Next thing I know we get an urgent letter via
airborn express stating that we owe some $300 in MCI in "excesssive" charges
on our "account" (what account?) and that we must call them and state that
we accept these charges or else our phone service will be cut off. Turns out
they slammed our line and started charging us 25 cents a minute for all of
our LOCAL calls... That's right, all of our calls to go on the internet,
which is a local call and normally costs me absolutely nothing, were 25
cents a minute. Before we managed to get them off the line we had racked up
some $700 in "long distance" charges for what they call long distance but
everybody else in the world calls a local / free / unlimited call.
Fortunately GTE (before they became Verizon) was kind enough to help us
dispute the $500 in MCI Worldcom charges that were appearing on the GTE
bill, but we had to file a dispute through the attorney generals office for
the rest of the claim since they were billing us for some calls seperately
without any apparent reason. Both complaints got credited to our account,
$500 thanks to GTE, and the full $700 thanks to the Attorney General. SInce
the $700 included the $500, we ended up with a $500 service credit on our
GTE bill. GTE placed it on our modem line's bill and we didn't get another
bill for that line for 10 months. After a couple months we called and asked
about it (before we knew that it got a double credit) and as soon as the GTE
rep looked up our records she burst out laughing, because it was commented
on GTE's database exactly what MCI did and since they do this to so many
customers, GTE's employees know what a headache they are and put pleanty of
comments on our records to let their fellow co-workers laugh at them.
Many of my friends, including my grandmother, have been lied to by MCI. They
would get MCI long distance and be promised one rate and it would be a
higher rate or completely different terms. My grandmother told me that MCI
promised her 7 cents a minute and she got her bill and every call was 10
cents a minute. When she called MCI Worldcom and complained, they didn't
give her any excuse, any reason, or any appology. They just said "Oh" and
proceeded with her request to discontinue service. Unfortunately not all of
my friends were as lucky as my grandma to be able to get rid of them so
easily.
Whatever you do, I strongly discourage anyone from chaing their "local"
phone service to MCI Worldcom. Two of my friends fell for a telemarketing
scam from MCI Worldcom back last august. They were all offered their local
and long distance service bundled for $35 a month with unlimited local
calling and unlimited calling to adjacent exchanges that are normally local
toll calls or $15/month unlimited through Ameritech's adjacent exchange
plan. Also, the $35 would include some 200 or 400 of free long distance
minutes. One friend said "yes" to the telemarketer because it sounded like a
good deal. The next day he called back and they told him that they do not
even offer local service in his area yet and that there is no such plan for
$35 anywhere and if there were it would not make the adjacent exchanges
unlimited calling areas, which they were for $15 extra through Ameritech. He
told them "well then I don't want your service then", only a day after
falling for and accepting the completely false offer from the telemarketer.
He was told that his order had not been processed yet so he didn't have MCI
service yet, but that because he had already said yes he had no choice but
to allow them to complete the order and switch his local and long distance
service to MCI even though they do not offer service in his area. He
immediately called Ameritech and desprately cried out for help but they
offered none. For three months following that neither company beileved they
were providing the service. Sometimes one of their lines would work. Other
times the other would. Sometimes they could only make calls to the same
prefix as their number. Sometimes they could make long distance calls.
sometimes they could call adjacent exchanges and sometimes they couldn't.
Ameritech said the line belonged to MCI and MCI said it belonged to
Ameritech. Nobody had the slightest idea if he had the unlimited $15/month
calling plan for adjacent exchange calls, which was necessar for him to
access the internet. Before he knew it he ended up with MCI bills totalling
well over a thousand dollars and two different Ameritech accounts with a few
hundred dollars in charges. In the meantime, the State of Michigan had
already passed a law requiring Ameritech and Verizon to provide free local
calling to all adjacent exchanges, which would take effect in this area at
the end of October. Ameritech sent notice of this in September. MCI Worldcom
intentionally setup a big telemarketing run in August specifically to trick
customers into thinking that by switching to MCI they were expanding their
local calling area beyond what Ameritech offered, but this was completely
false. The expansion of the calling area didn't take effect until the end of
october (not in august when they said it would) and it would take place to
every customer of either Ameritech or MCI. They specifically wanted the
customers to switch local service in August so that they would not receive
notice from Ameritech in September of the expanded calling areas so that
they would continue to pay MCI for local service while thinking that they
were getting a bigger calling area which was a lie. Meanwhile they assumed
that people would not notice that they were charged toll for calls to those
supposed expanded adjacent exchange local calling areas during the months of
August, September, and October until it would take effect. What a complete
scam.... And my friend STILL gets bills from MCI for over $1000 in calls to
what is now a local call and what used to cost him $15 a month under an
unlimited adjacent exchange plans. Meanwhile, MCI now is pretending to offer
an unlimited nationwide long distance plan bundled with local service for
like $50 a month. Man I sure hope nobody falls for that.
There are so many more stories I have of friends / family / businesses with
bad MCI Worldcom experiences. The company is evil through and through.
There's no mistaking it, it is not just the Wireless division.
-Jeff
"Steven J. Sobol" <sjs...@JustThe.net> wrote in message
news:slrnah1e80....@nacs.net...
Steven J. Sobol
>Before I get started, I just want to mention that I laugh at our local radio
>shack. They have this huge "Worldcom Wireless" banner hung out front their
>store. When you go inside, they say that Worldcom is a division of AT&T, not
>a reseller and NOT part of MCI.
You're obviously talking to someone who is completely clueless about
the situation.
> (What a load of crap!!!). Then they hand you
>brochours for AT&T wireless.
I bet Worldcom re-sells AT&T in your area.
>mail, I could care less. In fact, I'd rather read the offer on paper instead
>of hearing it over the phone. Next thing I know we get an urgent letter via
>airborn express stating that we owe some $300 in MCI in "excesssive" charges
>on our "account"
This is illegal. Doesn't surprise me that they did it, though.
>plan. Also, the $35 would include some 200 or 400 of free long distance
>minutes. One friend said "yes" to the telemarketer because it sounded like a
>good deal. The next day he called back and they told him that they do not
>even offer local service in his area yet and that there is no such plan for
>$35 anywhere and if there were it would not make the adjacent exchanges
>unlimited calling areas, which they were for $15 extra through Ameritech.
MCI's Neighborhood service offers $50 unlimited local and long-distance
calling, and is available for my home phone, which is serviced by
Ameritech's Mentor On The Lake, OH switch.
Yeah, right.
I can't even get Worldcom DSL - and I *sell* Worldcom DSL (not through
Worldcom, through one of their resellers). No one services M-O-L but
Ameritech, because it's a small, mostly residential area, as is the
Headlands area just east of us.
Worldcom didn't pick up M-O-L even though they bought out Rhythms and Rhythms
was in M-O-L. I like to joke that the area is 95% residential and 5% wetlands,
but that is not far from the actual truth. There are very few businesses
serviced out of the M-O-L central office.
And if Worldcom isn't there already, I can't see them providing service
there. But plug in 440-209-xxxx and they'll tell you they do offer service.
>There are so many more stories I have of friends / family / businesses with
>bad MCI Worldcom experiences. The company is evil through and through.
>There's no mistaking it, it is not just the Wireless division.
Agreed.
Nicholas
news:slrnah45au....@nacs.net:
Hey guys.
I am a telemarketer at one of the MCI call centers. I am not going to sit
here and back up mci, or worldcom for that matter. But honestly, the reps
lied to you guys somewhere along the line. MCI didn't really slam you guys,
some measly rep did, all because the payout that mci gives it's employees
is outrageous. Unfortunately, it's caused some BAD seeds to come out. In
all honesty though, and probably backed by the trouble that they have
gotten in, MCI now has a third-party company that is MANDATED to come on
the line, the reps can no long just send your service through and "slam"
you. In fact, if we attempt so, when the third party comes on the line, and
the person says that they didn't order anything, the sales rep gets a noose
around his neck.
It's definately a competetive market, but when you consider that the Bells,
Ameritech, and Verizon have a pretty solid monopoly over everyone's phone
company, I honestly think MCI ATTEMPTS to run a legitimate company. It's
when the reps sign people up for services that make them more money (and
that the customer isn't informed about) that puts the companies reputation
at stake.
The new neighborhood plan with unlimited LD is a legitimate plan. 49.99 (up
to 59.99 in some areas, like s. florida, i think they are more expensive),
and you call anywhere in the country. hell, compare that to ATT, they are
just now getting to a "friends and family" type plan, where you get to call
any other ATT customer, except they charge you 19.99 for it! MCI lets you
call anyone, no matter what service they have, for free, as a part of your
local service. Just keep in mind that your federal taxes will still apply.
But overall, I don't really want to defend MCI, because unfortunately,
there are SO many corrupt reps, that lie to customers, it makes all of us
look bad. The reality, however, is that MCI is turning pretty big profits,
although I think their wireless division is going away.
-Nicholas *anon*
Steven J. Sobol
>I am a telemarketer at one of the MCI call centers. I am not going to sit
>here and back up mci, or worldcom for that matter. But honestly, the reps
>lied to you guys somewhere along the line. MCI didn't really slam you guys,
I'm not the guy that got slammed, but I'll comment anyhow.
That's every large telco's excuse.
In many cases, it might be correct, but it's still a crappy excuse because
the telco needs to police its resellers. But then, I'm a weirdo that thinks
that telephone companies should be held responsible for their actions. I've
just completed (hopefully) a three-month-long battle with Ameritech over DSL
and voice service to my house. The things the telcos do borders on criminal
sometimes.
>some measly rep did, all because the payout that mci gives it's employees
>is outrageous.
Well. Isn't that nice.
> Unfortunately, it's caused some BAD seeds to come out. In
>all honesty though, and probably backed by the trouble that they have
>gotten in, MCI now has a third-party company that is MANDATED to come on
>the line
Yes, and they *only* did it because they have to, and people still do get
slammed.
>It's definately a competetive market, but when you consider that the Bells,
>Ameritech, and Verizon have a pretty solid monopoly over everyone's phone
>company, I honestly think MCI ATTEMPTS to run a legitimate company.
Bullshit. MCI and Worldcom have traditionally been the most arrogant. "we
can do no wrong. If you don't like it, F you." This attitude (IMHO) trickles
down from top management.
See, everyone thinks AT&T is the bad guy, but the customer service I've
gotten on my AT&T business long-distance account has always been stellar.
(People look at me like I'm crazy when I say that!) MCI has taken over as
the "we don't care, we don't have to, we're the telephone company" company.
>But overall, I don't really want to defend MCI, because unfortunately,
>there are SO many corrupt reps, that lie to customers, it makes all of us
>look bad. The reality, however, is that MCI is turning pretty big profits,
>although I think their wireless division is going away.
Worldcom is run by criminals, as is evidenced by the many stories here. I
just found out that they totally trashed my friend's credit due to non-payment
of bogus bills too.
Jeff Phillips
not verify the terms and conditions of the service. The telemarketer calls
the customer and makes some tremendously wonderful offer. The offers don't
exist and have never been real MCI Worldcom service plans. Sometimes the
customer falling for it doesn't even live in a service area that MCI offers
anything even close to what the telemarketer offers.
The moment the telemarketer convinces the customer to say "Yes", they
immediately send the call over to the 3rd party company to verify that
indeed the customer is authorizing their service to be changed to MCI.
Here's the problem. The 3rd party company is only verifying that they want
MCI, not which service plan they want or how much it will cost. So, the
customer falls for some tremendous lie the telemarket offered, and then they
verify through a 3rd party company that they want MCI, and then they get
screwed and put on some completely different plan that is not what they
agreed to. They really NEED the 3rd party company to repeat back the full
terms and conditions of the service plan they are verifying that the
customer is signing up for. Without that, the 3rd party verification process
is total B.S. .
-Jeff
"Nicholas" <spa...@spam.net> wrote in message
news:Xns9234E890E5...@68.12.19.6...
> sjs...@JustThe.net (Steven J. Sobol) wrote in
> news:slrnah45au....@nacs.net:
>
Nicholas
news:aevack$m36$1...@feed.centurytel.net:
> The major problem with the 3rd party authorization system is that it
> does not verify the terms and conditions of the service. The
> telemarketer calls the customer and makes some tremendously wonderful
> offer. The offers don't exist and have never been real MCI Worldcom
> service plans. Sometimes the customer falling for it doesn't even live
> in a service area that MCI offers anything even close to what the
> telemarketer offers.
>
> The moment the telemarketer convinces the customer to say "Yes", they
> immediately send the call over to the 3rd party company to verify that
> indeed the customer is authorizing their service to be changed to MCI.
> Here's the problem. The 3rd party company is only verifying that they
> want MCI, not which service plan they want or how much it will cost.
> So, the customer falls for some tremendous lie the telemarket offered,
> and then they verify through a 3rd party company that they want MCI,
> and then they get screwed and put on some completely different plan
> that is not what they agreed to. They really NEED the 3rd party
> company to repeat back the full terms and conditions of the service
> plan they are verifying that the customer is signing up for. Without
> that, the 3rd party verification process is total B.S. .
>
> -Jeff
>
The sad thing is, all I can say is... I agree. :)
-Nicholas
Barrie Brozenske
says...
> It's definately a competetive market, but when you consider that the Bells,
> Ameritech, and Verizon have a pretty solid monopoly over everyone's phone
> company, I honestly think MCI ATTEMPTS to run a legitimate company.
>
they give good stable service at a fair price, in contrast to the
"competitive" companies that misrepresent their services and try to talk
(or cheat) potential customers into spending more money for the same (or
less) service. This may meet the legal definition of "legitimate"...but
it will never generate a good reputation with consumers. The chickens
are now coming home to roost.....
I love my Verizon landline and cellphone service.....
Just my opinion,
Barrie B
altnon
news:MPG.177cf399e...@News.CIS.DFN.DE:
>
> I love my Verizon landline and cellphone service.....
>
> Just my opinion,
> Barrie B
>
I guess you like paying nearly double the average state-to-state rates on
just calling instate longdistance... That's incredibly sad, and that's why
the FCC sees it as a problem. You are like so many who don't understand how
much more you really pay than is necessary
Steven J. Sobol
>In article <Xns9234E890E5...@68.12.19.6>, spa...@spam.net
>says...
>> It's definately a competetive market, but when you consider that the Bells,
>> Ameritech, and Verizon have a pretty solid monopoly over everyone's phone
>> company, I honestly think MCI ATTEMPTS to run a legitimate company.
>>
>One of the reasons the ex Bell Companies have that "monopoly" is that
>they give good stable service at a fair price,
As I replied to someone else in this thread: bullshit.
SBC, the largest Baby Bell, has been fined and sued so many times over
shoddy business practices that I have lost count.
SBC Ameritech, my phone company, put a bridge tap on my phone line, which
is damaging to DSL lines (basically causes them not to work, see
http://www.dslreports.com/information/kb/BRIDGE+TAP
for the definition) and went ahead and gave me DSL anyhow. I couldn't use
my DSL *or* my *voice line* reliably for two months (thank god I didn't have
to dial 911, there would have been so much static no one would have heard
me) -- and I have *just* finished up an ongoing dialog with the Public
Utilities Commission of Ohio wherein PUCO managed to badger SBC into giving
me full credits for two months for DSL and voice.
Did I tell you about the time they threatened disconnection on a balance
for which they'd *just printed the bill two days earlier?*
Nah, probably not....
>"competitive" companies that misrepresent their services and try to talk
>(or cheat)
All telephone companies suck. Some just suck less.
>potential customers into spending more money for the same (or
>less) service. This may meet the legal definition of "legitimate"...but
>it will never generate a good reputation with consumers. The chickens
>are now coming home to roost.....
>I love my Verizon landline and cellphone service.....
I love my Verizon Wireless cellphone service, for what it's worth, and
Verizon Wireless has taken care of me. However, I don't have any doubts that
if I had a Verizon landline they'd be pulling the same borderline illegal
crap that SBC does.
I'd bet that Cingular, the cellular carrier in which SBC has a big percentage
of ownership, has much better customer service (on average) than SBC's landline
divisions do. But then, cellular carriers actually have to worry about
competition.
Jeff Phillips
> {...snip...}
>
> I'd bet that Cingular, the cellular carrier in which SBC has a big
percentage
> of ownership, has much better customer service (on average) than SBC's
landline
> divisions do. But then, cellular carriers actually have to worry about
> competition.
I live out in the boonies in the Thumb area of Michigan, which is covered by
Thumb Cellular and Dobson / Cellular One, both of which are TDMA. I have a
Thumb Cellular phone and have found that they have great service with
excellent coverage and a strong reception throughout their coverage area.
When I leave the Thumb, they have roaming agreements with CenturyTel and
Cingular/SBC-Ameritech (both of which are also TDMA) for coverage throughout
the rest of Michigan.
I've noticed that consistently regardless of where I go, it seems that my
phone usually gets a much better reception in the Thumb Cellular and
CenturyTel coverage areas than in the Cingular coverage area of south-east
Michigan / Detroit. My phone often only gets one or two bars on the signal
strength meter when I travel down there. Sometimes it even says No-Service
and I have to keep it up high or in a window to ensure that I don't miss
calls. I've noticed this problem in Mount Clemens, Clinton Township, Imlay
City, Good Rich, Davison, and I'm sure many other areas. Around my home area
through Thumb Cellular, I often 3 or 4 bars or a full signal. Likewise when
I travel in CenturyTel's coverage area in Saginaw or even way up North in
places like Macinaw. It's just Cingular's south-east michigan coverage that
sucks.
I have several friends down in the various Detroit subbarbs, and they pretty
much all use Verizon Wireless. I've noticed when I'm down visiting them,
their Verizon Wireless phones usually get a better reception than my Thumb
Cellular phone on the Cingular towers. When they come up to my area, their
Verizon Wireless phone roams in analog mode on the Thumb Cellular towers.
(Unfortunately the CDMA phones Verizon Wireless uses just don't seem to work
good in analog areas.)
Does Cingular / SBC / Ameritech know how to compete? I doubt it. I think
they're so used to not having to bother with compeition that they just have
no idea what to do. Most people I know that had the choice between Cingular
or Verizon either went with Verizon or had Ameritech in the past and
switched to Verzion Wireless at the end of their contract. I don't know how
other SBC/Cingular areas are, but their service in south-east Michigan just
sucks by comparison of other carriers in the state.
-Jeff
Barrie Brozenske
don'ts...@spammail.com says...
> I guess you like paying nearly double the average state-to-state rates on
> just calling instate longdistance... That's incredibly sad, and that's why
> the FCC sees it as a problem. You are like so many who don't understand how
> much more you really pay than is necessary
>
>
distance considering both MCI and Quest wanted, as I recall... 10 or
15....and did not want to tell me how much, just touting cheap long
distance.
But then everything is relative......I would rather pay a known amount
that is fairly quoted and billed, than be scammed by who knows HOW much
each month, and have to look for it and fight for it...life is WAY too
short for that. The companies are finding that out too....
Regards,
Barrie B