Standing Seam vs. Lap Seam
ecarecar
What are the advantages and disadvantages of a standing seam
roof versus a lap seam?
Bob Morrison
> I have a small, low-slope metal roof of about 300 square feet.
> What are the advantages and disadvantages of a standing seam
> roof versus a lap seam?
>
Standing seam has no exposed fasteners and should be considered a
permanent roof if properly installed. Laps seams have gasketed fasteners
that can leak over time and this causes rusting of the steel sheets.
Go with standing seam!
--
Bob Morrison, PE, SE
R L Morrison Engineering Co
Structural & Civil Engineering
Poulsbo WA
bob at rlmorrisonengr dot com
ecarecar
What about wicking around the seams of the standing seams?
Bob Morrison
>
The idea of soldering the top hundreds of fasteners doesn't seem very
practical. Also, the soldering process will most likely damage the baked-
on finish.
> What about wicking around the seams of the standing seams?
Never heard of it happening, especially if it is a field rolled seam. But
even snap-lok type standing seam roofs work pretty well.
Dan Deckert
NO SOLDERING ON EXPOSED
FASTENERS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Dan
"ecarecar" <ecar...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:YvOdncILhuxDKaLY...@centurytel.net...
Tim Mulvey
> You can use non-gasketed fasteners and solder them over.
>
> What about wicking around the seams of the standing seams?
I've installed panels from American Buildings, Metallic, and Pac-Clad. The
female has a bead of factory applied butyl sealant that prevents wicking at
the seams. Panels from American can be installed and warrantied on slopes as
low as 1/2" : 12".
Tim Mulvey
Bob Morrison
> Standing seam if you can afford it.
> NO SOLDERING ON EXPOSED
> FASTENERS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
> !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>
Dan:
I agree absolutely! Soldering of fasteners does not seem like one of the
better thought out ideas.
Dan Deckert
"Bob Morrison" <SpamF...@junk.com> wrote in message
news:MPG.1fafb7fb3...@news.west.earthlink.net...
The OP made some mention of soldering. I've NEVER HEARD OF SUCH in 30 yrs.
of putting on metal roofs. I 'suppose' it might apply to 'some type' of
copper roof but it seems wierd to me. The new Kynar paints over galvalume
substrate would never allow adhesion anyway much less with the Kynar painted
zinc chromate srews with neoprene washers.
The newer SSR's with factory installed mastic will prevent wicking if the
SSR is applied correctly. Even better are SSR's with a mechanical seamer run
down them to roll & fold the seam. Damn near bullet proof. I have, however,
installed an SSR roof with a seamer and had leaks. It was because the
factory had failed to apply enough mastic to seal the lap. Interestingly
enough it was a Butler Bldg. of whose product (roofs anyway) I consider one
of the best.
Dan
RicodJour
>
> The OP made some mention of soldering. I've NEVER HEARD OF SUCH in 30 yrs.
> of putting on metal roofs. I 'suppose' it might apply to 'some type' of
> copper roof but it seems wierd to me.
It is possible to directly solder copper nails on a copper roof, but
it's a bit of a hack. The preferred way to achieve that end is to nail
through a copper clip, fold the clip over the top of the nail and
solder the perimeter of the clip.
R
ecarecar
In a previous post Dan Deckert wrote...Standing seam if you can afford it. NO SOLDERING ON EXPOSED FASTENERS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!Dan: I agree absolutely! Soldering of fasteners does not seem like one of the better thought out ideas.
ecarecar
Dan Deckert wrote:
"Bob Morrison" <SpamF...@junk.com> wrote in message news:MPG.1fafb7fb3...@news.west.earthlink.net...In a previous post Dan Deckert wrote...Standing seam if you can afford it. NO SOLDERING ON EXPOSEDFASTENERS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!Dan: I agree absolutely! Soldering of fasteners does not seem like one of the better thought out ideas. -- Bob Morrison, PE, SE R L Morrison Engineering Co Structural & Civil Engineering Poulsbo WA bob at rlmorrisonengr dot comThe OP made some mention of soldering. I've NEVER HEARD OF SUCH in 30 yrs. of putting on metal roofs.
have heard of it.
Dan Deckert
experience, not to mention ADVERSLY CONTRASTED.................LOL Ya
suppose a 78 yr old guy is ticked off here? 60 yrs. of roofing and 18 yrs.
to be old enuf 2 do the work????
Dan
"RicodJour" <rico...@worldemail.com> wrote in message
news:1162268353.4...@e3g2000cwe.googlegroups.com...
RicodJour
> Seems as though ecarecar is in severe contrast to our opinions and
> experience, not to mention ADVERSLY CONTRASTED.................LOL Ya
> suppose a 78 yr old guy is ticked off here? 60 yrs. of roofing and 18 yrs.
> to be old enuf 2 do the work????
Which makes this more curious:
http://tinyurl.com/yzjgce
I'd like to hear his reasoning and procedure for directly soldering the
fastener.
R
Bob Morrison
>
Okay, I thought about it for about 5 seconds and have come to the
conclusion that soldering roofing fasteners on a steel roof is one of the
dumbest ideas I have ever heard of.
ecarecar
In a previous post ecarecar wrote...Well, you should think about it.Okay, I thought about it for about 5 seconds and have come to the conclusion that soldering roofing fasteners on a steel roof is one of the dumbest ideas I have ever heard of.
The process comprises soldering sheet stainless steel together then driving
nails in to hold it in place and soldering the nails. It produces an excellent
roof.
Bob Morrison
>
> The process comprises soldering sheet stainless steel together then driving
> nails in to hold it in place and soldering the nails. It produces an
> excellent
> roof.
>
That may be, but one doesn't need to go to that much work to get an
excellent roof. Not to mention, most steel roofs these days have a baked
on finish that would make soldering them together virtually impossible
without ruining the finish.
A standing seam roof is only marginally more expensive (25% or so) than a
conventional lap seam roof. This seems like a small price to pay for what
is essentially a permanent roof.
As others have pointed out, a field rolled seam is usually best, but snap
lock seams work pretty well too for residential applications over a solid
sheathing substrate.
RicodJour
>
> The process comprises soldering sheet stainless steel together then driving
> nails in to hold it in place and soldering the nails. It produces an
> excellent roof.
Okay, now you've lost me. I've done a fair bit of copper and
lead-coated copper roofing. When sections are seamed and soldered, all
of the nails and copper clips/cleats are concealed. There are few if
any exposed fasteners. Why would you have exposed fasteners,
essentially creating a new metal roofing technique, when the existing
copper roofing techniques have centuries of performance standing behind
them? You obviously could do the same thing with stainless steel.
The concealed clips/cleats are what allows the metal roofing to move
with thermal expansion/contraction. By nailing it down directly you're
just building in weak points in the roofing. If your soldering job is
impeccable and the solder doesn't fail, the thermal expansion cycle
will elongate the nail hole and the nail will lose a significant amount
of its holding power. This is a critical flaw in high wind areas. The
roof will fail at those points, it's just a question of when.
The fact that in your experience you haven't had any failures doesn't
mean much in this instance. A stainless or lead-coated copper roof
should outlast you, your children and their children if done correctly.
It's like being in the fiberglass roofing business and saying that
you've been installing them for 4 years, so there's no problem with
your installation. Doesn't fly.
R
RicodJour
> Seems as though ecarecar is in severe contrast to our opinions and
> experience, not to mention ADVERSLY CONTRASTED.................LOL Ya
> suppose a 78 yr old guy is ticked off here? 60 yrs. of roofing and 18 yrs.
> to be old enuf 2 do the work????
It's our own fault. I didn't keep track of the posting history. I
thought he was weighint in with some expertise on the OP's question, so
I replied. I hadn't noticed that he is the OP.
Gee, maybe we were "set up" - maybe he's checking to see if we know
what we're talking about. So either he's a troll, has trollish
tendencies, or, from the comments, has no basis to determine if we do
know what we are talking about or not.
R