Installing in wall runs for air compressor in detached garage?
Comcast
will be an air compressor. Rather than have a hose running across the floor
all the time, I thought I would run two separate in wall runs to the areas I
would use the air most. The I could just attach a yellow bungee style air
hose.
Here is my questions..
I was planning on using a couple of 50' rubber hoses and run them in the
wall to each place. Coming off the compressor with a 3 to 1 manifold. Is
this the best way?
I have hear you can use copper tubing or PVC as well? which is the best
method?
what ca I use to terminate the hose and make it come out of the drywall so
it looks like good and is stable?
Any help would be appreciated.
AI
Chas Hurst
"Comcast" <ne...@iskowitz.net> wrote in message
news:gTLV8.592353$%y.379...@bin4.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com...
copper pipe (since your shop is small, using copper 3/4 or 1" won't cost a
lot more) overhead or around the top of the wall. Drop down with copper to a
T, put the female connector pointing out, drop down 10" to a petcock or ball
valve- this is to trap water before it gets in your tools or paint. Schedule
80 pvc is cheaper but harder to find than copper. Copper is easier to attach
firmly to the wall.
Chas Hurst
harriswest
A home-shop compressed air system is great - you'll wonder how you ever
got along without it!
PVC is probably not a good idea. Many local codes prohibit its use and
most mfrs specifically recommend against it. PVC weakens when exposed
to UV light (sun, arc welders) and on contact with some solvents. It
can burst spectacularly and send plastic shrapnel great distances. That
said, where not regulated by code I've seen a lot of guys use sch40
without incident - in its favor in your situation, the system would not
remain pressurized except when you are using it, and the lines are
enclosed so the wallboard/insulation would provide some protection.
Copper would be a good solution, as would ABS if compressed-gas rated
piping is available in your area. ABS is easier, cutting and gluing
just like PVC. Copper is very easy to solder with a little practice but
not nearly as quick.
Regardless of what piping you use, the compression/heating/cooling will
create lots of condensation in your lines. Prepare for it with adequate
slope in your lines for drainage, and valved tees below your compressor
and each outlet fitting, where the water can be drained periodically.
Use dryers at the outlets where moisture in the compressed air might be
problematic, e.g. at a paint booth. A dryer at the compressor will
likely not be adequate as the heated compressed air will not give up its
moisture until it cools in the lines.
--
Mike Harris
Austin, TX
Don Linsenbach
Wouldn't schedule 80 (the gray stuff) be a better choice ?
That's what I'm planning to use, unless someone can show otherwise.
"harriswest" <harri...@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
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Don Linsenbach
"Chas Hurst" <hur...@comcast.net> wrote in message
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Sched 80 (gray) is readily available at Lowes, just bought some last week.
Lyle B. Harwood
Comcast <ne...@iskowitz.net> wrote:
€I have hear you can use copper tubing or PVC as well?
I would use the copper, and I wouldn't put it in the wall. There's no
reason to, and you're going to need access to it.
Best of luck, and let us know how it comes out!
--
Lyle B. Harwood, President
Phoenix Homes, Inc.
(206) 523-9500 www.phoenixhomesinc.com
Chas Hurst
"Don Linsenbach" <dlins...@swfla.rr.com> wrote in message
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not sure if it's the same as sched 80 pipe. I will check again because I'm
putting air my shop too. Must be that time of the year.
Chas
harriswest
The problem as I understand it is the possibility of the PVC weakening
slightly then explosively bursting at the weak point. With water this
is not such a problem; water is incompressible and relatively dense and
a failed pipe is merely messy. Compressed air OTOH can hurl small sharp
fragments of PVC at very high speed. I believe that this is regardless
of grade - IIRC sch40 in good condition is perfectly capable of handling
400PSI when cold.
When I lived there, the People's Republic of California was debating
whether to ban PVC in commercial/industrial compressed-air applications,
which is why I know a little bit about it and know of some of the
alternatives (e.g. ABS which merely cracks and doesn't shatter.)
However, I have never seen a PVC-built shop compressed air system fail,
nohow.
...although when I was a kid and experimenting with M-80's, cherry bombs
and the like I did find out that PVC pipe can generate a lot of
shrapnel....<G>
I just did a quick browse through PVC and CPVC mfrs websites; this was
a spot-check only but those that have published anything at all on the
subject make it a point to spell out that NONE of their fittings valves
pipes etc are rated for compressed air.
When I'm ready to plumb the missus' current shop for air, I'll use
copper - but only because she welds, which generates a lot of heat and
UV radiation.
--
Mike Harris
Austin, TX
Don Linsenbach
> Don,
>
> The problem as I understand it is the possibility of the PVC weakening
> slightly then explosively bursting at the weak point. With water this
> is not such a problem; water is incompressible and relatively dense and
> a failed pipe is merely messy. Compressed air OTOH can hurl small sharp
> fragments of PVC at very high speed. I believe that this is regardless
> of grade - IIRC sch40 in good condition is perfectly capable of handling
> 400PSI when cold.
>
> When I lived there, the People's Republic of California was debating
> whether to ban PVC in commercial/industrial compressed-air applications,
> which is why I know a little bit about it and know of some of the
> alternatives (e.g. ABS which merely cracks and doesn't shatter.)
> However, I have never seen a PVC-built shop compressed air system fail,
> nohow.
>
> ...although when I was a kid and experimenting with M-80's, cherry bombs
> and the like I did find out that PVC pipe can generate a lot of
> shrapnel....<G>
>
> I just did a quick browse through PVC and CPVC mfrs websites; this was
> a spot-check only but those that have published anything at all on the
> subject make it a point to spell out that NONE of their fittings valves
> pipes etc are rated for compressed air.
>
> When I'm ready to plumb the missus' current shop for air, I'll use
> copper - but only because she welds, which generates a lot of heat and
> UV radiation.
Thanks, Mike.
What size is the compressor and what size copper are you going to use ?
I have a 10HP 80gal vert. compressor and don't need any *unplanned*
explosions. heh-heh
Do you know of any sources for in-wall *jacks*, I mean. places where one
might connect hoses to ?
It'll be a month or more til I get to installing, so I am researching.....
harriswest
I was figuring type L 1" copper, in my area it's about the same price as
M (Type K 1" or anything larger in any grade is very pricey.) I wanted
to get as large as possible to effectively increase the tank size but
with inch line a 100-foot run would only amount to an extra 2-1/2 cu ft
or so. 1" is large enough so friction loss will be negligible.
Her fittings are standard ball-lock QR which I think she buys at her
local welding shop, I think 1/2 or 5/8, don't know for sure. They're
her toys and she won't let me touch them; Fair's fair - I won't let her
touch my tools either except on very special dispensation! <VBG>
--
Mike Harris
Austin, TX
> What size is the compressor and what size copper are you going to use ?
JD
way to drain the lines of condensation.
Comcast <ne...@iskowitz.net> wrote in message
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Don Linsenbach
> Her compressor is a 8HP, either 60 or 80 gal two-stage 220V.
>
> I was figuring type L 1" copper, in my area it's about the same price as
> M (Type K 1" or anything larger in any grade is very pricey.) I wanted
> to get as large as possible to effectively increase the tank size but
> with inch line a 100-foot run would only amount to an extra 2-1/2 cu ft
> or so. 1" is large enough so friction loss will be negligible.
>
> Her fittings are standard ball-lock QR which I think she buys at her
> local welding shop, I think 1/2 or 5/8, don't know for sure. They're
> her toys and she won't let me touch them; Fair's fair - I won't let her
> touch my tools either except on very special dispensation! <VBG>
Checked with a friend that just set up his shop recently.
He used galvanized threaded pipes for all of his airlines, 1/2" ID, teflon
tape at all joints.
He said it was less expensive than copper, and easier to install / repair,
and nothing will ever penetrate the pipes by accident.
He also had some *junction* boxes, found locally, that have 2 outlets for
the hose connections, though they were pricey, in the $75 each range.
What kind of stuff does your wife do, with welding and air compressors ?
SGaines
@bin5.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com:
>
>
I would recommend sticking to copper just in case (see article below
regarding failure):
> http://www.wwforum.com/faqs_articles/airpiping.html
Leigh Knudson
> Plastic pipe is a mistake for compressed air. Use copper and give yourself a
> way to drain the lines of condensation.
>
> Comcast <ne...@iskowitz.net> wrote in message
> news:gTLV8.592353$%y.379...@bin4.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com...
> > I am in process of building a 20x20 detached garage, located in one corner
> > will be an air compressor. Rather than have a hose running across the
>
> >
> > method?
I have seen what happens when PVC breaks and anyone that installs it
for air lines is an idiot. It can kill you. When fractured by impact
it breaks into slivers which fly long distances very fast. Don't do
it. The standby to industry is black (Steel) iron pipe. CA code
requires that be schd 80 steel between the compressor and the first
shut off valve. This area is prone to fatigue fractures and I can
assure you copper will fatigue much faster then steel. Steel is slower
to install then copper and takes more skill to make good joints but it
also is tribute to your inteligence and abilities when completed.
Remember to slope it toward the drains and to put water traps in to
dry the air as much as possoble. Ever try to run a bead blaster with
air that drips water. Doesn't work at all. Leigh Knudson