How and why Faith went bad
The Masked Superstar
Giles says that this sort of thing has happened before
and that it's unavoidable.
Now instead of telling Faith that it's no big deal they all make it sound to
Faith as if it is a big deal driving the poor girl away.
I say it was all planned from the beginning by Betty because she was
jealous.
later,
Fuzzy
The Masked Superstar wrote in message <#s6J#SBGAHA.280@net003s>...
What's this? Betty the Vampire Slayer? Is that Buffy's evil twin?
Sierk
"What, only Xander gets to make dumb jokes?"
-- Willow, "Surprise"
Mattia Valente
>
> She accidentally killed a man.
One of the reasons.
> Giles says that this sort of thing has happened before
> and that it's unavoidable.
Well, unavoidable its not, but avoiding it never happens is impossible.
Subtle but real difference.
> Now instead of telling Faith that it's no big deal they all make it sound to
> Faith as if it is a big deal driving the poor girl away.
It *is* a big deal. Just because things happen more or less often
doesn't mean that it's not a big deal. Killing someone puts a grave
psychological strain on a person, and lets face it, Faith was never a
stable personality, a lot of it due to her less than stellar life
experiences. If you watch S3 again, you'll see they don't try to drive
faith away, although their dealing with it isn't too great. She got
stuck in denial, which is the first part of dealing with trauma, but
never went on to the other steps and healed. Instead she chose the easy
way out and went over to the mayor, who wouldn't try to help her along.
> I say it was all planned from the beginning by Betty because she was
> jealous.
Its Buffy (which you know ;-) and no, she didn't try. She DID try to
help. See Willow's little speech to Faith in Choices. Spot on in all
respects.
Mattia
ReplyMeister[tm]
Jonathan Black
> The Masked Superstar wrote:
>
> > She accidentally killed a man.
>
> One of the reasons.
[snip]
Okay, has anyone noticed that we're crossposting to abe and nksf
here. That's gotta be a first. Not quite "legal", though, I don't
think, with nksf being a Dutch language group and stuff.
:)
--
J o N a T H a N http://come.to/nks+f
The Masked Superstar
What I meant by it's no big deal is the fact that a slayer killing a person
by mistake is not something a slayer will be criticized for.Maybe I should
have
stated it clearer.
So far we agree.
Now after it happened Betty starts nagging.Why?Faith was dealing with it
in her own way.There was no denial at first.Betty caused the denial.
later,
Mattia Valente <mae.v...@std.vu.nl> schreef in berichtnieuws
39B667DE...@std.vu.nl...
Miriam Rocke
:
: What I meant by it's no big deal is the fact that a slayer killing a
: person by mistake is not something a slayer will be criticized
: for.Maybe I should have stated it clearer.
Will be, or should be?
: Now after it happened Betty starts nagging.Why?Faith was dealing with it
: in her own way.There was no denial at first.Betty caused the denial.
Um, Faith was no-way-in-hellmouth dealing. If you look at her
reactions-- coming back to the body, scrubbing her laundry so hard
that she almost wore a hole in it, then saying "I don't care" even
when her body language was screaming that she did...
Rationalizing it to herself ("we save people all the time, if someone
occasionally dies, that's an okay cost") is not dealing. It's just
another layer of denial, another way of pretending there isn't a
problem.
Mir
--
Miriam Rocke "Just so we're clear, you guys
mrr...@ucdavis.edu know you're nuts, right?"
http://handel.cipic.ucdavis.edu/~mrrocke/ --BtVS, "Gingerbread"
george van hal
Jonathan Black wrote:
> [snip]
>
> Okay, has anyone noticed that we're crossposting to abe and nksf
> here. That's gotta be a first. Not quite "legal", though, I don't
> think, with nksf being a Dutch language group and stuff.
>
> :)
Ooh. The ideal way to push oneself up in the top20 lists of both groups
perhaps???
;-)
See Ya,
George
Who tried to not reply to this cross-post, but just had to.....
Mattia Valente
>
> Mattia Valente wrote:
>
> > The Masked Superstar wrote:
> >
> > > She accidentally killed a man.
> >
> > One of the reasons.
>
> [snip]
>
> Okay, has anyone noticed that we're crossposting to abe and nksf
Damn! That's the second time in two days that I've done that! (not to
nksf, crosspost inadvertently.)
> here. That's gotta be a first. Not quite "legal", though, I don't
> think, with nksf being a Dutch language group and stuff.
Probably is a first..I feel a little more than stupid now. I'm just so
used to the fact that barely any of the posts here are crossposted (not
the ones we reply to, anyway) that I don't even bother looking. Posts in
nksf are marked as read, so I didn't really notice them. Sorry! BTW,
only posting this to abe to stick to them rules ;-)
Mattia
ReplyMesiter[tm]
busybee
see ya
busybee
Hans Versteegt
wrote:
Only one answer possible
Maar een antwoord mogelijk
Bah !
Good in both language's
Goed in beide talen
Harmony,
Hans.
Hans Versteegt
Indeed, nksf is a 'dutch language group'. Not a big thing, but it would
be nice to keep it 'gewoon nederlands'
BTW, Faith was a growing out of control, slowly, more and more, until
she was on the wrong side
Overigens, Faith raakte meer en meer buiten controle, langzaam, steeds
meer, totdat ze aan de verkeerde kant stond.
Harmony,
hans.
( doesn't like crossposting )
Mattia Valente
>
> betty anne = elizabeth anne = buffy anne (here)
Nope. Buffy's name is just Buffy, not Elizabeth. Just Buffy. I know
that's the victorian england abbreviation of the name, though..
Mattia
ReplyMeister[tm]
The Masked Superstar
thousand apologies.
The Masked Superstar
Mattia Valente <mae.v...@std.vu.nl> schreef in berichtnieuws
39B6AA86...@std.vu.nl...
Jonathan Black
> Mattia Valente schreef:
>
> > busybee wrote:
> > >
> > > betty anne = elizabeth anne = buffy anne (here)
> >
> > Nope. Buffy's name is just Buffy, not Elizabeth. Just Buffy.
> > I know that's the victorian england abbreviation of the name,
> > though..
>
> In one episode Joyce calls her Elisabeth Anne Summers when she
> was angry.
Oh really? Which episode is that? I just searched all the
transcripts for that phrase and it doesn't seem to appear
anywhere.
Miriam Rocke
: 39B6AA86...@std.vu.nl...
: > busybee wrote:
: > >
: > > betty anne = elizabeth anne = buffy anne (here)
: >
: > Nope. Buffy's name is just Buffy, not Elizabeth. Just Buffy. I know
: > that's the victorian england abbreviation of the name, though..
: In one episode Joyce calls her Elisabeth Anne Summers when she was
: angry.
You sure? I couldn't find it in my transcripts, searching either on
"Elisabeth" or "Anne Summers". Searching on "Anne" brought up The
Witch (character Lishanne -- the mouthless one), IRYJ ("scanne[r|d]"),
Puppet Show ("mannequin"), Nightmares ("mannequin"), Invisible Girl
("banner"), SAR ("manner"), School Hard ("Anne Rice routine"), Reptile
Boy ("channel")--
--at which point I got impatient with all the false positives, and
gave up. I'm sure Anne would have been a hit though. :)
Searching on "Elizabeth" (more common in the US, so probably what
Buffy would be if Buffy were an Eliz.) got only Helpless ("Elizabeth
Barrett Browning")
Mattia Valente
> On Wed, 6 Sep 2000, The Masked Superstar wrote:
> > Mattia Valente schreef:
> > was angry.
>
> Oh really? Which episode is that? I just searched all the
> transcripts for that phrase and it doesn't seem to appear
> anywhere.
She says 'Buffy Anne Summers' once though, IIRC. In becoming or
thereabouts, I thought...I'd like to know the answer as well, BTW ;-)
Mattia
ReplyMeister[tm]
Jonathan Black
> Jonathan Black wrote:
> > The Masked Superstar wrote:
> > > Mattia Valente schreef:
> > > In one episode Joyce calls her Elisabeth Anne Summers when she
> > > was angry.
> >
> > Oh really? Which episode is that? I just searched all the
> > transcripts for that phrase and it doesn't seem to appear
> > anywhere.
>
> She says 'Buffy Anne Summers' once though, IIRC. In becoming or
> thereabouts, I thought...
Nope, can't find that either... Must be just one of those things
like the fact that the words "Beam me up, Scotty" were never
actually spoken in Star Trek...
;-)
Miriam Rocke
Okay, me bored again.
Searching on 'Anne', case sensitive, brings up three episodes: School
Hard ("Anne Rice routine"), What's My Line 2 ("Little Anne",
referenced by Dru; possibly a younger sister), and Anne (duh! -- but
never referenced by Joyce, just Buffy and Lily/Chantarelle and the
other folks down there.
Searching on 'Summers' (doing 'Buffy Summers' only asks to match both
somewhere in the document, and all transcripts have "Buffy" in them)
brings up WTTH (Flutie, and a "Miss Summers?" by Giles), Nightmares
("Hank Summers" and a "Buffy Summers" gravestone), Reptile Boy
("Summers house" and Buffy introducing herself to Tom), Go Fish
(Cameron and Angelus), Becoming 1 (Snyder and Watcher
[Merrick-equiv]), Becoming 2 (Snyder again, police), DMP (Giles
yelling at Snyder), BatB (psychiatrist), Homecoming (Buffy trying to
get a teacher to remember her), The Wish (Cordy, alt-Giles,
alt-Angel), Enemies (Faith to Mayor), Choices (Mayor), The Prom (Angel
to Joyce, Jonathan at the prom), Living Conditions, HLOD, Initiative,
A New Man, This Year's Girl, Who Are You, and The Yoko Factor. I left
the speaking characters off the last few eps 'cause I couldn't
remember where the spoilerspace divide was, but it isn't Joyce.
So I guess she never did. :> Either that, or the search is messed up...
Mattia Valente
> Mattia Valente wrote:
> > thereabouts, I thought...
>
> Nope, can't find that either... Must be just one of those things
> like the fact that the words "Beam me up, Scotty" were never
> actually spoken in Star Trek...
Ah well, guess not then. So I didn't bother checking the transcripts for
once...
Mattia
ReplyMeister[tm]
P@rick
Yeah, that bitch Betty! And you know Willow never had an affair with Xander?
That was just Betty in disguise! And later she threatened Willow to play
along and admit it was her.
And you know that robot Ted, in 'Ted'? That was Betty's work as well. She
was jealous of Buffy for having such a great mom. So Betty made this robot
Ted, and she wanted to kidnap Joyce and keep her in the basement. Betty's
basement?
And you know that Oz turned into a werewolf because he was bitten once? One
guess who bit him...
And you know that Gipsy woman who cursed Angel? Well, she was a friend of a
cousin of a neighbour of the mailman, who Betty's great greater greatest
grandmother once saw in the street!!!
And you know why Snyder always hates his students? You guessed it. Betty
used to be one of his students, and Snyder used to be a really nice
child-loving man!
And you know that Hellmouth thingy? You think it has always been there?
Noooo, somebody had to dig that hole, didn't she?
And you think vampires are afraid of sunlight? No they're not! It's just an
excuse to avoid Betty during the day!!
And you know that First Evil in 'Amends'? You think it was childless? Well,
it has one daughter. And it kicked her out of his house because he couldn't
stand her! She was too evil!!
Bye, Patrick
hope Betty doesn't read this!
Fuzzy
The Masked Superstar wrote in message <#5uQXPEGAHA.334@net003s>...
>In one episode Joyce calls her Elisabeth Anne Summers when she was
angry.
Oh? Which one? One in Season 5 I presume?
Sierk
Miriam Rocke
:
: The Masked Superstar wrote in message <#5uQXPEGAHA.334@net003s>...
: >In one episode Joyce calls her Elisabeth Anne Summers when she was
: angry.
:
: Oh? Which one? One in Season 5 I presume?
Season 5 hasn't even aired in the *US* yet, let alone anywhere else,
so we don't have any clue what Buffy'll be called in any of the
episodes. <g> But (if it ever happened at all, which I'm not
convinced of) it would at least have to have been post-"Anne", 'cause
that was the first time we knew Buffy's middle name.
Ian Shuttleworth
Valente) wrote:
> I know that's the victorian england abbreviation of the name
Not just Victorian. The current Queen Mother (God bless her) (that phrase
is now required by law) was known in her youth as Buffy Bowes-Lyon.
Somebody tell Kim Newman :-)
Actually, there's a thing - does anyone know Kim's opinion of BTVS?
Something tells me he wouldn't be likely to be its greatest fan...
--
Ian S.
Mattia Valente
>
> In article <39B6AA86...@std.vu.nl>, mae.v...@std.vu.nl (Mattia
> Valente) wrote:
>
> > I know that's the victorian england abbreviation of the name
>
> Not just Victorian. The current Queen Mother (God bless her) (that phrase
> is now required by law) was known in her youth as Buffy Bowes-Lyon.
Not that British Law applies to us interntional poster people :-P
What I meant was that the nickname has its origins in Vicotiran England,
IIRC.
Mattia
ReplyMeister[tm]
Ian Shuttleworth
Valente) wrote:
> > The current Queen Mother (God bless her) (that phrase is now required
> > by law)
> Not that British Law applies to us interntional poster people :-P
Nor, perhaps, some British humour :-)
--
Ian S.
Mattia Valente
:-p
Mattia
ReplyMeister[tm]
A little miffed, to be honest..