Desperation question
Antti Matikka
On Sun, 10 Nov 1996 04:01:39 GMT,
bod...@pop.service.ohio-state.edu (Jason M. Bodak) wrote:
>Don't read this if you haven't read _Desperation_ yet.
>Don't say I didn't warn you.
More heavy spoilers to come...
> OK, I don't get the part where David realizes that it was a younger Johnny
>Marinville who was talking to him in the Land of the Dead. What the hell was
>Johnny doing there???? He said only dead people were there (he made a big
>deal out of pointing out that David was the only person there who wasn't
>dead).
Johnny 'died' spiritually and emotionally during his stay in
Vietnam. He only had a physical existense with no 'life' within
him after that, so I'd say he had every right to be in the Land
of the Dead by then.
He loses his _special_ rights much later in the book though (and
acquires the full-fledged membership :)
Andy
Jason M. Bodak
Don't read this if you haven't read _Desperation_ yet.
Don't say I didn't warn you.
OK, I don't get the part where David realizes that it was a younger Johnny
Marinville who was talking to him in the Land of the Dead. What the hell was
Johnny doing there???? He said only dead people were there (he made a big
deal out of pointing out that David was the only person there who wasn't
dead). I think it was mentioned somewhere in the book that Johnny attempted
suicide, and was even successful, but God brought him back from the dead, like
Lazarus--pershaps because Johnny was destined to defeat Tak. But if God
raised him from the dead, why was he still in the Land of the Dead???????
That's the part I don't get. What the heck am I missing here?????
--Jason Bodak
Loyd Phillips
Antti Matikka wrote
>
>
> >Don't say I didn't warn you.
>
>
>
>
>
Johnny
> >Marinville who was talking to him in the Land of the Dead. What the
hell was
> >Johnny doing there???? He said only dead people were there (he made a
big
> >deal out of pointing out that David was the only person there who wasn't
> >dead).
>
> Johnny 'died' spiritually and emotionally during his stay in
> Vietnam. He only had a physical existense with no 'life' within
> him after that, so I'd say he had every right to be in the Land
> of the Dead by then.
> He loses his _special_ rights much later in the book though (and
> acquires the full-fledged membership :)
I read it the same way. The thing that I thought curious was the way
Johnny's life went after he was dead. The alcoholism, loss of the ability
to write anything original, etc. But I can't remember if he wrote his
"good" material before he went to Vietnam or not. I was wondering if this
reveals SK's view of aesthetics: the origin of artistic inspiration. Does
the muse not speak to the dead?
Actually, it goes farther than just aesthetics. This is the same theme we
saw in Insomnia where the antagonist died and was somehow transformed from
a normal human into a monster at that point.
A/C Cassel
Jason M. Bodak wrote:
>
> Don't read this if you haven't read _Desperation_ yet.
>
> Don't say I didn't warn you.
>
> Marinville who was talking to him in the Land of the Dead. What the hell was
> Johnny doing there???? He said only dead people were there (he made a big
> deal out of pointing out that David was the only person there who wasn't
> suicide, and was even successful, but God brought him back from the dead, like
> Lazarus--pershaps because Johnny was destined to defeat Tak. But if God
> raised him from the dead, why was he still in the Land of the Dead???????
> That's the part I don't get. What the heck am I missing here?????
>
> --Jason Bodak
Johnny wasn't phsyically dead, he was spiritually dead. He had given up
living, was just being what he thought people wanted him to be. A stuck
up writer with no sense of slef worth. Because his spirit was dead it
was residing with the people who physically died. -A
Jason M. Bodak
In article <32881B...@polarnet.com> A/C Cassel <st...@polarnet.com> writes:
>Path: magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu!math.ohio-state.edu!howland.erols.net!feed1.news.erols.com!uunet!in2.uu.net!news2.ixa.net!skeeter.mosquitonet.com!news
>From: A/C Cassel <st...@polarnet.com>
>Newsgroups: alt.books.stephen-king
>Subject: Re: Desperation question
>Date: Mon, 11 Nov 1996 21:38:22 -0900
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>Jason M. Bodak wrote:
>>
>> Don't read this if you haven't read _Desperation_ yet.
>>
>> Don't say I didn't warn you.
>>
[MY QUESTION, CONTAINING SPOILERS, DELETED]
>Johnny wasn't phsyically dead, he was spiritually dead. He had given up
>living, was just being what he thought people wanted him to be. A stuck
>up writer with no sense of slef worth. Because his spirit was dead it
>was residing with the people who physically died. -A
You are the third person in a row to tell me this. Thank you, all of you.
I guess I was just being too literal. I just thought that you had to be
COMPLETELY, PHYSICALLY dead to inhabit the Land of the Dead. I guess it makes
sense then that the Johnny Marinville that David encountered was very young,
the same age as he was during the Vietnam War. It all makes sense now.
Thanks again. You've helped me enjoy the book even more now.
On a related note, that would also explain why Tak was able to inhabit the
Land of the Dead--he was probably never spiritually alive in the first place.
--Jason Bodak
Angelo Wentzler
bod...@pop.service.ohio-state.edu (Jason M. Bodak) writes:
>Don't read this if you haven't read _Desperation_ yet.
>Don't say I didn't warn you.
> OK, I don't get the part where David realizes that it was a younger Johnny
>Marinville who was talking to him in the Land of the Dead. What the hell was
>Johnny doing there???? He said only dead people were there (he made a big
>deal out of pointing out that David was the only person there who wasn't
>dead). I think it was mentioned somewhere in the book that Johnny attempted
>suicide, and was even successful, but God brought him back from the dead, like
>Lazarus--pershaps because Johnny was destined to defeat Tak. But if God
>raised him from the dead, why was he still in the Land of the Dead???????
>That's the part I don't get. What the heck am I missing here?????
I read it as if it meant that Marinville's life was already over, in the
figurative sense. Which was sort of true, since his books sucked, he was
divorced and his life going down the toilet in general was the reason he
got into Desperation in the first place.
Chuckie chuckie chuckieeeeee!
Angelo
--
rcb...@urc.tue.nl (internet) Hemelrijken 167, 5612 LC Eindhoven, Netherlands
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"The good are innocent and create justice. The bad are guilty, which is why
they invent mercy." -- Terry Pratchett, Witches Abroad.
Dan Monroe
In article <bodak.2.9...@pop.service.ohio-state.edu>,
bod...@pop.service.ohio-state.edu (Jason M. Bodak) wrote:
> Don't read this if you haven't read _Desperation_ yet.
>
> Don't say I didn't warn you.
>
>
>
>
> OK, I don't get the part where David realizes that it was a younger Johnny
> Marinville who was talking to him in the Land of the Dead. What the hell was
> Johnny doing there???? He said only dead people were there (he made a big
> deal out of pointing out that David was the only person there who wasn't
> dead). I think it was mentioned somewhere in the book that Johnny attempted
> suicide, and was even successful, but God brought him back from the
dead, like
> Lazarus--pershaps because Johnny was destined to defeat Tak. But if God
> raised him from the dead, why was he still in the Land of the Dead???????
> That's the part I don't get. What the heck am I missing here?????
>
> --Jason Bodak
I interpreted it as Johnny did die in Vietnam and was brought back by God
to fulfil His will even though Johnny's younger soul is still in the land
of the dead and maybe if he completes his mission, his soul can move onto
a better place.
You understand what I mean?
Dan
--
Flip-Flop, ***
Hippety-Hop, 0 0
Offa Your Rocker ____mUm___
And Over the Top.
Life's a Fiction,
And the World's a Lie
So Put on Some Creedence
And Let's Get High.
Dennis McLaughlin
A long time ago in a galaxy far, far away, Jason M. Bodak led us all
to believe:
> OK, I don't get the part where David realizes that it was a younger Johnny
> Marinville who was talking to him in the Land of the Dead. What the hell was
> Johnny doing there???? He said only dead people were there (he made a big
> deal out of pointing out that David was the only person there who wasn't
> dead). I think it was mentioned somewhere in the book that Johnny attempted
> suicide, and was even successful, but God brought him back from the
> dead, like
> Lazarus--pershaps because Johnny was destined to defeat Tak. But if God
> raised him from the dead, why was he still in the Land of the Dead???????
> That's the part I don't get. What the heck am I missing here?????
My interpretation of this is that Johnny's spirit had died. I thought
that King was commenting that Johnny's life had been squandered. His
body wasn't dead, but it might as well have been dead because he
hadn't been doing anything productive with it.
[Exit chased by a bear]
Dennis McLaughlin
den...@anet-chi.com
carr...@aol.com
I have to agree with Dan. I think Johnny died in Vietnam. That's why
they made such a fuss about the picture of the three guys in front of the
bar. This also makes sense because Johnny was the one who was sacraficed
(spelling?). Since he was already dead, he didn't have much to loose
while the kid was still alive. Make sense?
Carri