Anyone want to talk about Mr X? SPOILERS
Jason Radak
basis of Hellfire Club and Mr. X he has just replaced Clive Barker as my
favorite horror writer. I have some questions that I'm dying to ask. If
any nice people would like to share their opinions on my questions, I would
greatly appreciate it.
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Upon reading the last sentence my head was spinning and I was extremely
confused, but I think over the course of the next thirty minutes I got all
the major points of the story sorted out. Ned was also Mr. X and Robert,
right? Ned's twin really was the placenta, and Edward Rhineheart really did
die in the prison riot. The major unresolved questions I have (although I'm
sure there are some that I just don't remember) are:
What was the deal with the blue pill the girl in college gave him that made
him smart? Or am I being naive in thinking it's some kind of supernatural
thing and there is actually a drug that perhaps, makes your memory really
strong temporarily?
Who was the guy in the daishiki?
I would love to talk to anyone that wants to discuss the novel by posting or
email. Thanks
Paris
I just finished Mr. X a few weeks ago, so I'm more than happy enough
to start merrily chatting away about this. Since most of these topics
have spoiler elements to it, I'll turn on the SPOILER WARNING now.
On Fri, 28 Jul 2000 20:16:35 -0600, "Jason Radak"
<docto...@mindspring.com> wrote:
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>Upon reading the last sentence my head was spinning and I was extremely
>confused, but I think over the course of the next thirty minutes I got all
>the major points of the story sorted out. Ned was also Mr. X and Robert,
>right? Ned's twin really was the placenta, and Edward Rhineheart really did
>die in the prison riot.
I'm not sure I agree. I suppose that one could argue that Ned's
time-swallowing skills allow him to, after the book has ended,
re-enter the book as Robert and then, after he's much older, as
Rinehart, thus allowing him to play everyone's parts. But both
Rinehart and Robert mention explicitly that they are unable to travel
through time, which would shoot that theory down. My cynical and
potentially very wrong preferred theory is just that the final note
that Straub is striking is a reiteration of the dubiousness of
identity. Because the first two thirds of the book make you wonder
whether Ned is Mr. X, or if Rinehart is Robert, the book plays
something like chess with the reader. The very last line reminds me
of the end of Nabokov's Pale Fire, and I sort of think is de rigeur
for Doppelganger stories; who's to say, really, who's the Doppelganger
and who's the Real Deal?
>What was the deal with the blue pill the girl in college gave him that made
>him smart? Or am I being naive in thinking it's some kind of supernatural
>thing and there is actually a drug that perhaps, makes your memory really
>strong temporarily?
I took this episode as Ned, under stress, tapping into his heritage
and temporarily developing Rinehart-like mental powers.
>Who was the guy in the daishiki?
Jeez, Koko has played hell on memory. You got any sort of rough page
cites or sections that I can double check?
-jeff
Jason Radak
add. To anyone reading this, SPOILERS still apply
Paris <gro...@red.org> wrote in message
news:39860ede...@news.supernews.com...
I greatly resisted the idea of Ned being Robert, thinking that SOMEONE had
seen both of them in the same place together. Then I realized who it was
that had seen them both: Rhinheart. If Ned was both of them, it would make
sense. During that scene, when Robert bashes the guy to death, the thing
that bothered me was, how could Robert have been with Ashton in the hotel,
providing Ned with an alibi when he was actually in the alley, killing the
guy? The only explanation I can think of is that it had to do with time
travel.
> >Who was the guy in the daishiki?
>
> Jeez, Koko has played hell on memory. You got any sort of rough page
> cites or sections that I can double check?
This guy appears somewhere in the middle of the book and passes Ned as they
are both crossing the street. He says something cryptic, along the lines of
"I'm not one of you, just LIKE you," or something like that. He shows up
again on one of the last pages when Ned is lost in the fog and says
something else that's very cryptic. After I posted my message, I read an
online chat with Straub in which he states that the Dunstans are black, as
was the guy in the dashiki. I don't know what that means, but it might be
something.
My last question, is something I can't believe I forgot to mention in my
first post. This is what has bothered me the most: Whose intials were
carved into the table in Ned's hotel room? They were "P.D.", and dated
sometime in the fifties.
Thanks,
Jason
Peter Straub
Jason Radak wrote:
-with a mighty snip here-
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> My last question, is something I can't believe I forgot to mention in my
> first post. This is what has bothered me the most: Whose intials were
> carved into the table in Ned's hotel room? They were "P.D.", and dated
> sometime in the fifties.
>
I'd better answer this, since no one else is likely to. The initials P.D. are
those of Paul Desmond, the alto saxophone player with the Dave Brubeck Quartet
whose solo on "These Foolish Things" during a concert at Albertus College so
inspired Star Dunstan in 1958, and which her son, Ned, travels back through time
to witness in the final pages of the novel. In the novel MYSTERY, Tom Pasmore
sees the same initials scratched into the edge of a table in Mill Walk's St.
Alwyn Hotel.
Peter
Jason Radak
have been, since I've already emailed all my friends about how one of my
favorite writers personally answered one of my questions.
Peter Straub <pst...@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message
news:39868D86...@worldnet.att.net...
Paris
is while combing the book back and forth for anyone who's initials
were P.D. I automatically skipped over Paul Desmond's name. Mr.
Attention to Detail, that's me.
-jeff
A. C. Chapin
> Hi, Jeff, thanks for responding. I have a few comments that I'd like to
> add. To anyone reading this, SPOILERS still apply
Also (speculative) Ghost Story spoilers
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> something else that's very cryptic. After I posted my message, I read an
> online chat with Straub in which he states that the Dunstans are black, as
> was the guy in the dashiki. I don't know what that means, but it might be
> something.
I never heard about this chat but I find this very interesting. The first
time I read Mr. X, I came away quite convinced that the Dunstans were
black. The second time I read it though, I realized I had no idea what it
was that pointed me to that conclusion. I've looked since and I still
can't figure out how I got that impression.
How'd you do it, Peter?
Similarly, in Ghost Story, I was convinced that Sears was in love with
Ricky. Now I can point to a half-dozen sentences in the novel that
could be read to support this, but I still don't know how I got that
impression in the first place. I wonder if this was intentional too.
--
AC Chapin acch...@virginia.edu www.cs.virginia.edu/~acc2a
Mathematicians, like ax murderers, achieve many of their
objectives by dissecting complicated structures and
manipulating their pieces. - Larry Gerstein
A. C. Chapin
[on the initials PD]
> In the novel MYSTERY, Tom Pasmore
> sees the same initials scratched into the edge of a table in Mill Walk's St.
> Alwyn Hotel.
I *knew* those seemed familiar when I read Mr. X, but I could never figure
out why. Thanks Peter!
Paris
There's a couple of great touches, very subtle throughout the book.
Among the few hints that I remember; there's a scene where Ned is
clearing off his bookshelf, maybe at college, and the books are
heavily weighted towards the works of great black authors. An early
description of Earl Sawyer definitely mentions the color of his skin.
For me,though, the really beautiful piece of observation is the brief
exchange between Ned and the workman in the hospital. Ned's with
Laurie Hatch and Cobbie and as the workman gives Ned a meaningful
smirk:
"I said, 'Don't jump to any conclusions.'
"'I ain't concluded, and so far I ain't jumped,' he said. We both
laughed."
(p. 107 in my paperback). There's something about the familiarity
with which the two men interact that suggests a common bond, a
familiarity. And, a few pages later, as Cobbie's imitation of the man
begins more and more to resemble "Kingfish," gives a hint to what that
connection must be.
The Dunstans' ethnic identity is one of the most intriguing parts of
Mr. X; on one level, it's a very nice twist and critique of
Lovecraft's heavy-duty xenophobia and racism. On another, there's
some really nice parallels to Ellison's "Invisible Man" that I think
would be very rewarding to pursue. But for me, this issue made me
challenge my own perceptions and where they begin to color into
racism. For example, it was hard for me to wrap my head around the
idea that Ned was black and could be greeted so freely into fine
restaurants and fancy homes. It was also hard to conceive of a town
recording its own history that would not sweep the fact that it was
founded by men of color under the heaviest rug it could find. Is that
my own experience of the world or my own racism?
And then there was the mitigating factor that enjoying the Dunstan
aunts and uncles' antics went from being a guilty pleasure when I
thought they were white to just guilt when I realized they weren't.
My unconscious mind kept rebleaching them so that I could go back to
enjoying their hijinks.
All this combined for me to help make Ned simultaneously blurry and
distinct in his mind, which only adds, I think, to the ambience of the
book.
>Similarly, in Ghost Story, I was convinced that Sears was in love with
>Ricky. Now I can point to a half-dozen sentences in the novel that
>could be read to support this, but I still don't know how I got that
>impression in the first place. I wonder if this was intentional too.
Oooh, I hope someone takes up the gauntlet on this one. BTW, I was
very lukewarm about the movie Ghost Story (which I finally saw this
year after being a fan of the book for a long time), but was I the
only one who thought that it was one of the best cast movie
adaptations ever? Right down to poor ol' Craig Wasson as Don
Wanderly. Too bad what they did with the rest of the movie, though...
-jeff
JGM
> Jason Radak wrote:
>
> > Whose intials were
> > carved into the table in Ned's hotel room? They were "P.D.", and dated
> > sometime in the fifties.
>
> I'd better answer this, since no one else is likely to. The initials P.D. are
> those of Paul Desmond, the alto saxophone player with the Dave Brubeck Quartet
> (. . .)
> In the novel MYSTERY, Tom Pasmore
> sees the same initials scratched into the edge of a table in Mill Walk's St.
> Alwyn Hotel.
Hm. Peter: was Desmond a known graffitist, or is this purely a fancy of yours?
Either way, I love little touches like this; funny how such details can add
texture and tangibility to a story even while the explanation remains a mystery.
Now I gotta go home and pull out "Jazz Goes to College". . .
JGM
Peter Straub
>
> Hm. Peter: was Desmond a known graffitist, or is this purely a fancy of yours?
>
>
No, I just liked the idea of having my characters run across these little traces
Desmond had left behind in his passage through the world. He was such an endearing,
remarkable person.
Peter
toa...@bigfoot.com
completely understand ANY of Peter Straub's books, but that's one of the
things that's so interesting about them! Plus, we are lucky enough to
have Peter himself lurking to answer any questions (he explained to me
what he meant by "bee-orchid" in Ghost Story).
Beth
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
Peggo
<toa...@bigfoot.com> wrote in message news:8mn3bp$hok$1...@nnrp1.deja.com...
> No spoilers here, just a general comment: I don't think I ever
> completely understand ANY of Peter Straub's books, but that's one of the
> things that's so interesting about them!
They just get in my head and rattle around until I read them again. It
seems that his stories have meant different things to me each time I've read
them. It depends where I am in my life at that time.
peggo