Where do the Calormenes come from?
Danny Carlton
Feico Nater <eff...@worldaccess.nl> wrote in article
<3407ae9...@news3.worldaccess.nl>...
> 1 In the Magician's Nephew two humans remain in Narnia: Frank and
> Helen.
> 2 In the Lion the Witch and the Wardrobe it is said that there were no
> humans in Narnia. Jadis has no human blood.
Actually The White Witch is half human. Mr Beaver says that "there isn't a
drop of real Human blood in the Witch." But he has just said that she is a
descendant of Adam and someone named Lilith.
> The four Pevensies are the
> only humans.
> 3 In the Horse and his Boy we find that there are humans in Calormen
> and Archenland. They probably were there already during the Great
> Narnian Winter.
>
> Are 2 and 3 a contradiction? Not if you assume that Narnia, Calormen
> and Archenland are different countries. However the word Narnia is
> used in an ambiguous meaning, it can be either a country (part of a
> world), or an entire world. In the Magician's Nephew it is certainly
> the latter.
>
> 4 In Prince Caspian, and the next books, there are humans in Narnia.
> Their origin is explained, they have come via a South Sea island via
> Telmar.
>
> The origin of the kings in Narnia and Archenland is explained in the
> Last Battle. They descend from Frank and Helen. In that case, we must
> assume that the Narnian kings were extinct before the Great Narnian
> Winter.
>
> One question remains: were do the Calormenes come from?
>
>
> ==========================
> Feico (Free Action) Nater
>
Here is the question you need to ask: Does Narnia refer to the entire world
or just the peninsula (which later became an island?
Danny Carlton
Margaret R. Dean
In article <01bcb42d$8cae6a60$49770dcf@pcarlton>,
Danny Carlton <car...@galstar.com> wrote:
>
>Feico Nater <eff...@worldaccess.nl> wrote in article
><3407ae9...@news3.worldaccess.nl>...
>> humans in Narnia. Jadis has no human blood.
>
>Actually The White Witch is half human. Mr Beaver says that "there isn't a
>drop of real Human blood in the Witch." But he has just said that she is a
>descendant of Adam and someone named Lilith.
No, he says she's a descendant of Lilith -- NOT Adam. Lilith (in the
legends about her -- she's not Biblical) is not human.
>Here is the question you need to ask: Does Narnia refer to the entire world
>or just the peninsula (which later became an island?
It's Cair Paravel (the "capital" of Narnia, if you will) that is
originally on a peninsula that later becomes an island -- not the whole
land of Narnia.
--Margaret Dean
<marg...@access.digex.net>
Scott Mayo
In alt.books.cs-lewis, eff...@worldaccess.nl (Feico Nater) wrote:
<One question remains: were do the Calormenes come from?
We are explicitly told, I think by Aslan, that other gates between
Earth and the Narnian world exist. He doesn't list them or
give an account of them, except to say that they are diminishing
in number (this is from memory; I don't have the books to hand.)
It's not a great stretch to assume that Calormenes arrived though
some other such gate. _Magician's Nephew_ explicitly talks about
research done on materials from other worlds; clearly someone else
managed the same sort of trick as the rings provided, and populated
the land south of Narnia.
Danny Pitt Stoller
Andrew Rilstone (and...@aslan.demon.co.uk) wrote:
: In a subsequentprevious volume (the 'Magician's Nephew') Lewis says that
: the Witch is acutally "Jadis" who came neither from Narnia or Earth, but
: a different world called "Charn."
: So either Mrs Beaver made a mistake, or Lewis changed his mind,
: depending on how you look at it.
Not necessarily. The entire royal family of Charn might have been
descended from Lilith. That leaves open the question as to how the sons
and daughters of Lilith ended up in the land of Charn -- but who knows?
Perhaps Lilith herself, after her little fling with Adam, eventually
settled down in Charn. Or, perhaps, Lilith made her appearance late in
Charn's history, and mingled her blood with that of Charn's rulers,
causing the moral deterioration of Charn.
The point, as I see it, is that nobody in Narnia really knew where the
White Witch came from. Some believed she was from the land of men, some
believed she was descended from the Giants at Narnia's northern border,
others thought she came from the jinn.
But here's an interesting question: Who, exactly, is the Emerald Witch
of *The Silver Chair*, and what is her relationship (if any) to Jadis?
--
"One helped becomes the helper..."
- Bruce Todd
Danny Pitt Stoller
(215) 417-6380
http://www.sas.upenn.edu/~dap
S.J.Burr
In article <5u7qvi$t8l$1...@netnews.upenn.edu>,
d...@mail2.sas.upenn.edu (Danny Pitt Stoller) wrote:
>Andrew Rilstone (and...@aslan.demon.co.uk) wrote:
>
>: In a subsequentprevious volume (the 'Magician's Nephew') Lewis says that
>: the Witch is acutally "Jadis" who came neither from Narnia or Earth, but
>: a different world called "Charn."
>
>: So either Mrs Beaver made a mistake, or Lewis changed his mind,
>: depending on how you look at it.
>
>Not necessarily. The entire royal family of Charn might have been
>
>The point, as I see it, is that nobody in Narnia really knew where the
>White Witch came from. Some believed she was from the land of men, some
>believed she was descended from the Giants at Narnia's northern border,
>others thought she came from the jinn.
>
bring her back to our world, C.S. Lewis remarks "Some say there is giantish
blood in the royal house of Charn."
Narnian scholars and philosophers such as the authors of Mr Tumnus's books
might be able to tell what her species was,ie "half a jinn and half a
giantess" without ever having heard of Charn.
Sally
Feico Nater
On 1 Sep 1997 06:38:48 GMT, Douglas Gresham <d...@iol.ie> wrote in
alt.books.cs-lewis:
>Calormenes (pronounced Cal-or-muns)
BTW, I always pronounced
Calormen: Ka LOR min
Calormenes: Ka lor MEANS
Where is your emphasis in Cal-or-muns?
>are the descendants of a
>gang of outlaws who fled from ancient Archenland across the
>great desert and founded their own community.
So they all descend from the London cabby. That does not explain their
skin colour.
Furthermore, LWW describes that there are no humans in Narnia, even
that humans are absolutely unknown. But at least Archenland was
inhabited by humans.
Somehow I think that the word 'world' and 'country' are confused. In
The Magicians Nephew and in the Lion, the Witch & the Wardrobe, Narnia
is described as another world, not another country, not another
planet, not even another galaxy, but another world.. You can only go
thither by magic. In the Horse and his Boy Narnia is described as a
country within another world
Danny Pitt Stoller
Feico Nater (eff...@worldaccess.nl) wrote:
: On 1 Sep 1997 06:38:48 GMT, Douglas Gresham <d...@iol.ie> wrote in
: alt.books.cs-lewis:
: >Calormenes (pronounced Cal-or-muns)
: BTW, I always pronounced
: Calormen: Ka LOR min
: Calormenes: Ka lor MEANS
: Where is your emphasis in Cal-or-muns?
I assume that it is CAL-or-muns. I have always said CAL-or-means, with
my American accent, but if I had ever tried to say it the British way
then I would have said CAL-or-muns too.
: >are the descendants of a
: >gang of outlaws who fled from ancient Archenland across the
: >great desert and founded their own community.
: So they all descend from the London cabby. That does not explain their
: skin colour.
I suppose their skin color is to be explained by the fact that they live
in a different climate, closer to the desert. In fact, I believe that is
the etymology of "calormen": "heat-men".
: Furthermore, LWW describes that there are no humans in Narnia, even
: that humans are absolutely unknown. But at least Archenland was
: inhabited by humans.
Remember, when *LWW* was written, Lewis didn't know yet that there would
ever be an Archenland or a Calormen. It's easy to lose sight of that
fact when you haven't read the books in their original order.
But there may be some solutions to the (apparent) continuity problems.
In *The Voyage of the Dawn Treader*, there are humans inhabiting the
islands surrounding Narnia, and the lost nobles of Caspian's court are
human as well. The lost nobles are, of course, left-over Telmarines who
never left the world of Narnia in *Prince Caspians*. Perhaps the
island-dwellers are Telmarines as well. In that case, maybe we can
assume that Archenland (and Calormen) were founded by some of these
left-over Telmarines -- AFTER the period in which *LWW* takes place.
But, on the other hand, I think Lewis says somewhere that the
Archenlanders are descended from the original Narnian kings. Can anyone
tell me what character says that? Perhaps the character is mistaken...?
: Somehow I think that the word 'world' and 'country' are confused. In
: The Magicians Nephew and in the Lion, the Witch & the Wardrobe, Narnia
: is described as another world, not another country, not another
: planet, not even another galaxy, but another world.. You can only go
: thither by magic. In the Horse and his Boy Narnia is described as a
: country within another world
Narnia is the name of a country AND a world. The countries of Narnia,
Archenland, and Calormen are all contained within the world that is also
called Narnia. It's a little confusing, but no confusion on Jack's
part. *The Horse and His Boy* seems like an exception to the other books
because the entire book takes place in the Narnian world, and none of it
takes place in OUR world, so in it only Narnia the country is referred to.
If anyone has any other suggestions for how to save the continuity of the
Chronicles, please post your theories. This is fun!
--
"One helped becomes the helper..."
- Bruce Todd
Danny Pitt Stoller
(215) 417-5581
http://www.sas.upenn.edu/~dap
Danny Pitt Stoller
Feico Nater (eff...@worldaccess.nl) wrote:
: On 2 Sep 1997 23:26:12 GMT, d...@mail2.sas.upenn.edu (Danny Pitt
: Stoller) wrote in alt.books.cs-lewis:
: >there are some more humans that we
: >haven't accounted for, in *Voyage of the Dawn Treader*. The inhabitants
: >of the islands surrounding Narnia are humans, and so are the members of
: >Caspian's court.
: I think all these descent from Telmarines. But I am not sure about the
: Magician and about Ramandu and his daughter.
It is all very confusing. I suppose we must simply let go of the
assumption that, during the time of *LWW*, there were no humans at all in
the world of Narnia. There were some, in Archenland and Calormen, and
perhaps on the neighboring islands, and all of these descend from King
Frank and Queen Helen. But none of these were so bold as to enter the
White Witch's domain and pursue her throne. Actually, this makes sense,
since it explains why the Witch was so paranoid: if there were no humans
anywhere in the world at that time, she would have no reason to enlist so
many spies.
: Ramandu's daughter must have been of the same species as Caspian,
: since modern biology teaches that this is the condition for two
: individuals to beget.
Well....I wouldn't go that far. I think we can assume that a star's
daughter is able to mate with a mortal man. After all, when we are
discussing the offspring of the stars, we are in a mythic realm that
transcends biology.
Andrew Rilstone
In article <3412a63b...@news3.worldaccess.nl>, Feico Nater
<eff...@worldaccess.nl> writes
>This is true, of course, but it does create a flaw in the sequence of
>books.
Oh deary deary deary deary deary.
--
Andrew Rilstone and...@aslan.demon.co.uk http://www.aslan.demon.co.uk/
***************************************************************************
"Why can't I be a non-conformist like everybody else?"
***************************************************************************
Danny Pitt Stoller
Feico Nater (eff...@worldaccess.nl) wrote:
: >d...@mail2.sas.upenn.edu (Danny Pitt Stoller) wrote:
: >>Who, exactly, is the Emerald Witch of *The Silver Chair*?
: Douglas Gresham <d...@iol.ie> wrote:
: > (Emerald belongs to Baum)
: I never heard the name 'Emerald Witch' before, but of course I know
: that emeralds are green, like your wonderful oileán glas. But why does
: Danny say "emerald', and what do you mean by 'Emerald belongs to
: Baum'?
What he means is that the Baum publishers, who formerly published the
American editions of the Chronicles, changed Lewis's original "Green
Witch" to "Emerald Witch." Being an American, and having first come into
contact with the Chronicles via the Baum edition, I always thought it was
"Emerald." Shame on Baum for deceiving me so!
: >is the same spirit as the White Witch or Jadis
: >of Charn, but brought back into different bodily form.
: So she wasn't dead.
: BTW, if the White Witch is a spirit, can't she move to another world
: without magic? She needed the rings to travel from Charn to Narnia.
: However, she is very alive in our world.
Unless I am mistaken, Doug was not implying that she is a creature of pure
spirit, but merely that she is (like us) a spirit inhabiting a body.
Apparently, when that body died, the spirit was reincarnated (in a green
body rather than a white one?).
Feico Nater
On 1 Sep 1997 06:42:52 GMT, Douglas Gresham <d...@iol.ie> wrote in
alt.books.cs-lewis:
>"Danny Carlton" <car...@galstar.com> wrote:
>
>>Actually The White Witch is half human. Mr Beaver says that "there isn't a
>>drop of real Human blood in the Witch." But he has just said that she is a
>>descendant of Adam and someone named Lilith.
>
>No, she isn't, Mr. Beaver was merely repeating the usual sort
>of grass roots gossip that "Everybody knows", and he was in
>error (such things usually are). Jadis, the White Witch, was
>entirely Charnish.
Of course she came from Charn, and as far as we know she has no root
sin common with our world. So she isn't human. But in that case she
doesn't descend from Adam. She might descend from the Jinn and from
the Giants.
Lilith is perhaps mentioned in the Bible, in Isaiah 34:14. In NBG it
is 'nachtspook', or phantom of the night, in KJV it is 'screech owl'.
Lilith is a Babylonian demon. She is somewhat comparable to the Jinn.
There is one legend that says that she was Adam's first wife. She
forsook Adam and Eve was created afterwards. Another legend says that
demons and evil spirits descend from Adam and Lilith.
Thanks to the Winkler Prins Encyclopaedia, edition 9, volume 14, 1992.
Well, it is obvious that Jack Lewis knew what he was writing about.
Feico Nater
>d...@mail2.sas.upenn.edu (Danny Pitt Stoller) wrote:
>>Who, exactly, is the Emerald Witch of *The Silver Chair*?
On 1 Sep 1997 06:46:42 GMT, Douglas Gresham <d...@iol.ie> wrote in
alt.books.cs-lewis:
> (Emerald belongs to Baum)
I never heard the name 'Emerald Witch' before, but of course I know
that emeralds are green, like your wonderful oileán glas. But why does
Danny say "emerald', and what do you mean by 'Emerald belongs to
Baum'?
>is the same spirit as the White Witch or Jadis
>of Charn, but brought back into different bodily form.
So she wasn't dead.
BTW, if the White Witch is a spirit, can't she move to another world
without magic? She needed the rings to travel from Charn to Narnia.
However, she is very alive in our world.
==========================
Feico (Free Action) Nater
Feico Nater
On 2 Sep 1997 23:26:12 GMT, d...@mail2.sas.upenn.edu (Danny Pitt
Stoller) wrote in alt.books.cs-lewis:
>You have to remember that, when Lewis wrote LWW, he didn't know yet that
>there would be an Archenland OR a Calormen.
This is true, of course, but it does create a flaw in the sequence of
books.
>there are some more humans that we
>haven't accounted for, in *Voyage of the Dawn Treader*. The inhabitants
>of the islands surrounding Narnia are humans, and so are the members of
>Caspian's court.
I think all these descent from Telmarines. But I am not sure about the
Magician and about Ramandu and his daughter.
Ramandu's daughter must have been of the same species as Caspian,
since modern biology teaches that this is the condition for two
individuals to beget.
>But, at least in the case of Caspian's noble subjects,
>we can assume that these are some left-over Telmarines from the days of
>Miraz's reign.
This is certainly correct.
>So maybe Archenland was founded by some of those
>left-over Telmarines -- AFTER the period in which *LWW* takes place.
No, Archenland existed in the time of the Horse and his Boy, and in
the Last Battle we can read that the kings of Archenland descend from
the London cabby.
>But I think Lewis actually says somewhere that Archenland was founded by
>the descendents of the original Narnian rulers. Oh, well....
If you mean Frank, yes, I agree.
Douglas Gresham
eff...@worldaccess.nl (Feico Nater) wrote:
>Ramandu's daughter must have been of the same species as Caspian,
>since modern biology teaches that this is the condition for two
>individuals to beget.
This is not true even here on this world. Horses breed
with donkey (producing mules) Lions with Tigers and so
on. Ramandu was a star remember, and by that I mean that
when he was on duty he orbited somewhere out in Narnian
Space. We know nothing of his wife. Thus his daughter was
at least of half stellar blood.
>>But I think Lewis actually says somewhere that Archenland was founded by
>>the descendents of the original Narnian rulers. Oh, well....
>If you mean Frank, yes, I agree.
Archenland was founded by a younger Narnia Prince. (Col I
think but I can't find my reference book at present).
Doug.
Douglas Gresham
eff...@worldaccess.nl (Feico Nater) wrote:
>Where is your emphasis in Cal-or-muns?
Hmm a bit tricky with the lack of symbols enforced by
this computer system (or my ignorance of it), but let's
try.
"Kuh" as in kaleidescope, "or" as in Bangalore, and
"Muns" as in opens. The stress being marginally greater
on the 2or" and less on the first and last syllables.
Does that help?
>>are the descendants of a
>>gang of outlaws who fled from ancient Archenland across the
>>great desert and founded their own community.
>
>So they all descend from the London cabby. That does not explain their
>skin colour.
Well that's what Jack wrote about them. Perhaps Frank was
a descendant of a sailor who cmew ashore from the wreck
of the Spainsh Armada, and had some Moorish blood. Anyway
centuries of living in the desert sunb does tend to
darken one a tad, in fact a mere couple of decades will
do it quite adequately as far as skin colour is
concerned.
>Furthermore, LWW describes that there are no humans in Narnia, even
>that humans are absolutely unknown. But at least Archenland was
>inhabited by humans.
At the time of the WW, Archenland may well ahve been
settled by humans, but this is where NArnia World and
Narnia Country comes in. Narnia country and Archenland
country were both "in" Narnia World. The WW ruled Narnia
Country but not Narnia world.
>Somehow I think that the word 'world' and 'country' are confused. In
>The Magicians Nephew and in the Lion, the Witch & the Wardrobe, Narnia
>is described as another world, not another country, not another
>planet, not even another galaxy, but another world.. You can only go
>thither by magic. In the Horse and his Boy Narnia is described as a
>country within another world
Ahh, close, they are not so much confused as
differentiating. The word "Narnia" Is the name for both
the world, and also one of the countries in it. You have
to use contextual clues to determine which is meant at
any one time.
Blessings,
Doug.
Douglas Gresham
d...@mail1.sas.upenn.edu (Danny Pitt Stoller) wrote:
>: >>Who, exactly, is the Emerald Witch of *The Silver Chair*?
>: Douglas Gresham <d...@iol.ie> wrote:
>: > (Emerald belongs to Baum)
>
>: I never heard the name 'Emerald Witch' before, but of course I know
>: that emeralds are green, like your wonderful oileán glas. But why does
>: Danny say "emerald', and what do you mean by 'Emerald belongs to
>: Baum'?
>
>What he means is that the Baum publishers, who formerly published the
>American editions of the Chronicles, changed Lewis's original "Green
>Witch" to "Emerald Witch." Being an American, and having first come into
>contact with the Chronicles via the Baum edition, I always thought it was
>"Emerald." Shame on Baum for deceiving me so!
Uhhm... That is not what I meant at all and I have never
heard of anybody called Baum Publishers. The original
pubnlishers of the CoN in America were MacMillan. What I
meant was that the "Emerald City", and all of those
references to "Emerald" in this genre of literature are
better associated with Frank Baum's Oz stories in which The
Emerald City features. I have never encountered any Narnia
edition which refers to an Emerald Witch.
>: >is the same spirit as the White Witch or Jadis
>: >of Charn, but brought back into different bodily form.
>: So she wasn't dead.
>
>: BTW, if the White Witch is a spirit, can't she move to another world
>: without magic? She needed the rings to travel from Charn to Narnia.
>: However, she is very alive in our world.
>
>Unless I am mistaken, Doug was not implying that she is a creature of pure
>spirit, but merely that she is (like us) a spirit inhabiting a body.
Absolutely right so far, but:-
>Apparently, when that body died, the spirit was
reincarnated (in a green
>body rather than a white one?).
It was not her body that was green, but her dress. She was a
beautiful lady all dressed in green. The White Witch
embodiment was actually white or at least mostly so.
Blessings,
Doug.
Yael Furman
Feico Nater wrote:
> On 2 Sep 1997 23:26:12 GMT, d...@mail2.sas.upenn.edu (Danny Pitt
> Stoller) wrote in alt.books.cs-lewis:
> >there are some more humans that we
> >haven't accounted for, in *Voyage of the Dawn Treader*. The inhabitants
> >of the islands surrounding Narnia are humans, and so are the members of
> >Caspian's court.
> I think all these descent from Telmarines.
I don't have the books with me, but I remember somthing from the "Voyage
of the Dawn Treader". When they reached the islands, I think it was
Edmund who said somthing about Peter ruling those islands when four of
them were the kings and queens. Surely there were humans there already,
so they couldn't be Telmarines - not to mention that the Telmarines were
afraid from the sea!
I don't know who where those people, but I don't think they were
Telmarines.
Yael Furman
Florence Deems
Lilith: a character in Jewish mythology. The Talmudists say that Adam
had a wife before Eve, whose name was Lilis. Refusing to submit to Adam,
she left Paradise for a region of the air. She still haunts the night as
a spectre and is especially hostile to new-born infants. Some
superstitious Jews still put in the chamber occupied by their wives four
coins with labels on which the names of Adam and Eve are inscribed with
the words, 'Avaunt thee, Lilith!' Our word 'lullaby' is said to be a
corruption of 'Lilla, abi' (Lilith, avaunt). [Encyclopedia Amaricana]
The White Witch, then, according to CSL, sure fits what we'd imagine any
offspring of Adam and Lilith would be like!
Florence Deems
About the discussion on where to place the accents in Calormenes -
By using the Alt key + e you can create an accent mark over vowels,
therefore accenting that syllable. So, alt+e, then release alt and
retype e again. Jose becomes Jos=E9. Hope this helps.
Joshua W. Burton
RED13...@webtv.net (Florence Deems) wrote:
> Lilith: a character in Jewish mythology. The Talmudists say that Adam
> had a wife before Eve, whose name was Lilis. Refusing to submit to Adam,
> she left Paradise for a region of the air. She still haunts the night as
> a spectre and is especially hostile to new-born infants. Some
> superstitious Jews still put in the chamber occupied by their wives four
> coins with labels on which the names of Adam and Eve are inscribed with
> the words, 'Avaunt thee, Lilith!' Our word 'lullaby' is said to be a
> corruption of 'Lilla, abi' (Lilith, avaunt). [Encyclopedia Amaricana]
The Talmudic part is right, but Lilith -> lullaby whiffs of folk etymology,
especially since the onomatopoetic `lulla' appears frequently from the 15c
on, long before Cromwell let any of us Lilith-fearers back into Merrie Olde
Judenrein England. (When you read Merchant_of_Venice, it helps to bear in
mind that old Bill probably never met a Jew in the flesh.) OED again:
- ? C. 1450 in Cov. Myst. (Shaks. Soc.) Notes 414 Lully, lulla, thow
littell tine child; By, by, lully, lullay, thow littell tyne child.
- C. 1450 in Cov. Myst. 137 `Fayr chylde, lullay', sone must she syng.
- C. 1460 Towneley Myst. xiii. 442, 445 Sing lullay thou shall, for I
must grone, And cry outt by the wall on mary and Iohn,..Sing lullay
on fast When thou heris at the last.
- C. 1485 Digby Myst. (1882) iv. 719, I sange lullay to bringe you on
slepe.
- A. 1500 Songs & Carols (Percy Soc.) 12 And ever among A mayden song
Lullay, by by, lullay. [Other verses simply by by, lullay.]
- A. 1500 Songs & Carols 19 Lullay, my chyld, and slepe.
Anyway, I can't figure out `abi' = avaunt, unless it's really `afi', the
feminine form of the command, `take wing!' Long before accepting this one,
I'll believe the (still dubious!) conjecture that brouhaha comes from the
Hebrew `barukh ha-ba', blessed be he who comes, a traditional greeting.
> By using the Alt key + e you can create an accent mark over vowels,
> therefore accenting that syllable. So, alt+e, then release alt and
> retype e again. Jose becomes Jos=E9. Hope this helps.
It helps illustrate that hi-bit glyphs don't transmit well over Usenet,
even with the help of MIME encoding. Stick to ASCII, to be safe.
I wish the liberals were for |=============================================
liberty, and the conservatives | Joshua W Burton 847/677-3902 jbu...@nwu.edu
were for conservation.... |=============================================
Feico Nater
On Sat, 6 Sep 1997 12:50:14 -0400, RED13...@webtv.net (Florence
Deems) wrote in alt.books.cs-lewis:
>She still haunts the night as
>a spectre and is especially hostile to new-born infants.
Might she be related to Pontianak? To does who don't know, Pontianak
is a female spirit who haunts children and pregnant women. She is
feared in Indonesia.
ma...@dragontree.com
Joshua W. Burton wrote:
> I wish the liberals were for |=============================================
> liberty, and the conservatives | Joshua W Burton 847/677-3902 jbu...@nwu.edu
> were for conservation.... |=============================================
Given the latter, the former would be. :-)
Mary
Nicholas Young
In article <5us2u4$4ur$1...@newsd-199.bryant.webtv.net>,
RED13...@webtv.net (Florence Deems) wrote:
>By using the Alt key + e you can create an accent mark over vowels,
>therefore accenting that syllable. So, alt+e, then release alt and
>retype e again. Jose becomes Jos=E9. Hope this helps.
Public service announcement: this does NOT necessarily work - it depends on
your news software and maybe other things. See how it appeared to me in
your quoted text above.
Sorry!
Nicholas.
--
Views expressed are mine. Please mail anything important; remove all
the "xyz"s in the header to get my address (junk mail avoidance).
"'Macbeth' is a play written by a man who, on this occasion at least,
if he had the talent, ought to have written a fairy tale." - JRRT.
Douglas Gresham
For those intersted, I have managed to dig out my reference book
on all this,"The Land Of Narnia" by Brian Sibley, which
contains a Nanria Time-line prepared by Jack.
in 180 N. Prince Col younger son of Frank V of Narnia led a group
of followers to Archneland and setled that country founding the
new kingdom of the same name.
in 204 N the bandits fled from Archenland and settled in what
became Calormen.
In 300 N Calormen had spread out into an empire and colonised
Telmar (not necessarily called that). They behaved so wickedly
that in 302 Aslan turned them into dumb beasts.
In 460N Pirates from our world entered and took over Telmar.
In 898 Jadis return fromthe far North to take over Narnia and
begin the Long Winter in 900.
In 1000 N The Pevensies arrived.They reigned in Narnia for 15
years, taking possession of the Lone Islands etc.
Blessings,
Doug.
GA.R...@worldnet.att.net
S.J.Burr <BIP...@news.salford.ac.uk> wrote in article
<5ueajo$70g...@salford.ac.uk>...
> In article <5u7qvi$t8l$1...@netnews.upenn.edu>,
> d...@mail2.sas.upenn.edu (Danny Pitt Stoller) wrote:
> >Andrew Rilstone (and...@aslan.demon.co.uk) wrote:
> >
> >: In a subsequentprevious volume (the 'Magician's Nephew') Lewis says
that
> >: the Witch is acutally "Jadis" who came neither from Narnia or Earth,
but
> >: a different world called "Charn."
to draw from a different source, i think "Charn" seems to refer to "Char"
which in many works (Stephen King's The Dark Tower most notably) is a word
for "Death."
It seems logical that Lewis, like Tolkien, simply borrowed a word from
somewhere else, perhaps not specifically for that purpose, but who knows?
Yes, of course King came much after Lewis, but it seems sure that he also
borrowed the word.
Just a random thought...
joseph