Crossroads and Fred Clark
Spectre
and Crossroads Business Solutions. Well, I can also verify this and if
you goto
http://www.viptx.net/vbm/records/1097v-12.html
you can see it for yourself. Looks like Txrider was Fred all along....
Thanks to Abaciscus for bringing this to our attention
Spectre
tymer
IronDog05
>and Crossroads Business Solutions. Well, I can also verify this and if
>you goto
>
>http://www.viptx.net/vbm/records/1097v-12.html
>
>you can see it for yourself. Looks like Txrider was Fred all along....
>Thanks to Abaciscus for bringing this to our attention
I guess screwing us once wasn't good enough.
Nemo
money we gave this guy. You would think he would have some sort
of loyalty toward the community which made his business thrive for
so long...... Go figure.....
-= Nemo =-
The Peacock BBS
Spectre wrote in message <35CF9A...@hotmail.com>...
>It was posted a week ago that Fred Clark was the person behind Txrider
>and Crossroads Business Solutions. Well, I can also verify this and if
>you goto
>
>http://www.viptx.net/vbm/records/1097v-12.html
>
>you can see it for yourself. Looks like Txrider was Fred all along....
>Thanks to Abaciscus for bringing this to our attention
>Spectre
Pat Clawson
In article <6qp6uv$2...@dfw-ixnews5.ix.netcom.com>, <Nemo> wrote:
> Man when I read this my jaw dropped open! After all the years and
> money we gave this guy. You would think he would have some sort
> of loyalty toward the community which made his business thrive for
> so long...... Go figure.....
>
So what is Fred Clark supposed to do, turn over his crown jewels to
you free of charge? Loyalty toward the community? What the hell is that
supposed to mean?
How about the community being loyal to Clark? He made a solid product, but
BBS sysops - who constantly whine that everything should be free -
deserted him in droves. No money, no Clark Development, no PC Board. It's
as simple as
that. Too many BBS sysops have the weird and mistaken belief that somehow
all software developers should give away their hard work free.
Well, it doesn't work that way. We have families that like to eat and
bankers that demand to get paid. Fred couldn't pay his bankers, and Clark
Development had to close its doors. I'm sure he's been devastated by the
loss of his company.
Clark's $38,000 asking price for his source code is not unreasonable. It is
unreasonable - indeed, it's obscene - for you to demand that he release
it free. It's commercial software, a commercial asset. He has every right
to get what he can for his hard work, and I'm sure his bankers are
insisting that he get the most he can. That's business -- and that's
reality.
Since you feel so charitable today, I recommend that you give your car
away free to a group of the homeless in your town to prove you have some
sort of loyalty toward the community.
Pat Clawson
TeleGrafix Communications
Winchester, VA
fli...@wanker.com
On 1998-08-11 cla...@telegrafix.com(PatClawson) said:
cl>Newsgroups: alt.bbs.pcboard
cl>In article <6qp6uv$2...@dfw-ixnews5.ix.netcom.com>, <Nemo> wrote:
cl>> Man when I read this my jaw dropped open! After all the years and
cl>> money we gave this guy. You would think he would have some sort
cl>> of loyalty toward the community which made his business thrive for
cl>> so long...... Go figure.....
cl>So what is Fred Clark supposed to do, turn over his crown jewels to
cl>you free of charge? Loyalty toward the community? What the hell is
cl>that supposed to mean?
Can't you read, PAt.
cl>How about the community being loyal to Clark? He made a solid
cl>product, but BBS sysops - who constantly whine that everything
cl>should be free - deserted him in droves. No money, no Clark
cl>Development, no PC Board. It's as simple as
cl>that. Too many BBS sysops have the weird and mistaken belief that
cl>somehow all software developers should give away their hard work
cl>free.
Bullshit...Clark made bad business decisions, and payed the price,
closed the doors, and took the money from all the pending orders, yup,
THAT's business. Don't blame anything on customers, Pat..if you (or anyone)
has a product that is marketable, it'll sell. I'll not comment on the rest
of the dribble you've posted, you obviously typed it with your brain
disengaged!
cl>Well, it doesn't work that way. We have families that like to eat
cl>and bankers that demand to get paid. Fred couldn't pay his bankers,
cl>and Clark Development had to close its doors. I'm sure he's been
cl>devastated by the loss of his company.
cl>Clark's $38,000 asking price for his source code is not
cl>unreasonable. It is unreasonable - indeed, it's obscene - for you
cl>to demand that he release it free. It's commercial software, a
cl>commercial asset. He has every right to get what he can for his
cl>hard work, and I'm sure his bankers are insisting that he get the
cl>most he can. That's business -- and that's reality.
cl>Since you feel so charitable today, I recommend that you give your
cl>car away free to a group of the homeless in your town to prove you
cl>have some sort of loyalty toward the community.
cl>Pat Clawson
cl>TeleGrafix Communications
cl>Winchester, VA
Spectre
> So what is Fred Clark supposed to do, turn over his crown jewels to
> supposed to mean?
>
> How about the community being loyal to Clark? He made a solid product, but
> BBS sysops - who constantly whine that everything should be free -
> deserted him in droves. No money, no Clark Development, no PC Board. It's
> as simple as
> that. Too many BBS sysops have the weird and mistaken belief that somehow
> all software developers should give away their hard work free.
>
> Well, it doesn't work that way. We have families that like to eat and
> bankers that demand to get paid. Fred couldn't pay his bankers, and Clark
> Development had to close its doors. I'm sure he's been devastated by the
> loss of his company.
>
> Clark's $38,000 asking price for his source code is not unreasonable. It is
> unreasonable - indeed, it's obscene - for you to demand that he release
> it free. It's commercial software, a commercial asset. He has every right
> to get what he can for his hard work, and I'm sure his bankers are
> insisting that he get the most he can. That's business -- and that's
> reality.
>
> Since you feel so charitable today, I recommend that you give your car
> away free to a group of the homeless in your town to prove you have some
> sort of loyalty toward the community.
>
> TeleGrafix Communications
> Winchester, VA
Pat:
Before you shoot off you big mouth about something you are clueless
about, READ THE DAMN MESSAGES FIRST! No one is complaining about the
$38000 for the code. Our complants are with the misrepresentation and
cloak and dagger tactics Mr. Clark is using to sell his code.
And for your information, those of us who run PCBoard BBS software were
always HIGHLY DEVOTED to both the program and Clark Development Company.
They made a great program and supported it well. But when, during a
beta cycle, they shut down overnight, without warning, and after many
sysops sent in money for support and upgrades, they pissed us off. We
were cheated and treated like shit. All we wanted to know was why it
wasnt handled better and why those loyal to the company were treated
like this.
I do agree that Mr. Clark does need to feed his family, blah blah blah.
But did you consider the possibility that some of the money he was using
was from people waiting for a product that never came out? I know of at
least 2 people who were waiting for delivery of MetaWorlds and never got
it.
We dont expect the source for free. In my opinion, he would have been
alot more likely to sell it 2 years ago for the asking price when BBSing
was more popular.
So, next time, before you sprout your crap, get the facts first.
Sincerely,
Spectre
John L. Crane
wrote:
>So what is Fred Clark supposed to do, turn over his crown jewels to
>you free of charge? Loyalty toward the community? What the hell is that
worth a few years ago.
>How about the community being loyal to Clark? He made a solid product, but
>BBS sysops - who constantly whine that everything should be free -
>deserted him in droves. No money, no Clark Development, no PC Board. It's
Whinner??? Oh you meen this whinner was owed support and a upgrade.
A whinner still foolish enough to buy for the latest upgrade if it was
available. You also meen this whinner who's OE disks are crap prays
his backups are good.
To this day I can recall why I picked PcBoard and your right Clark
made a solid product but in retrospect Fred made some bad decisions.
Metaworlds sucked baddly, the Fido intergration was promised before it
was ready, OS2 vs Win95... the list goes on.
Tell you what Pat old chap, before you spout off too much about that
you know too little of I'd suggest a trip to Fido's PcBoard conference
... you pull the fast one Fred did and see how much support you get.
Clark pulled up stakes without a clue to most.
>that. Too many BBS sysops have the weird and mistaken belief that somehow
>all software developers should give away their hard work free.
I'd be rolling on the floor laughing if I wasn't insulted... My time
and money in this hobby dates back to the dollar a meg HD era, how I
could possibly afford that 340 meg drive for the BBS?
>Well, it doesn't work that way. We have families that like to eat and
Shortend
>Clark's $38,000 asking price for his source code is not unreasonable. It is
Frankly I hope someone buyes it, because the basic software is good..
I'm not waiting to grind a ax with Fred over it,
John Bridges
>How about the community being loyal to Clark? He made a solid product, but
>BBS sysops - who constantly whine that everything should be free -
>deserted him in droves. No money, no Clark Development, no PC Board. It's
>all software developers should give away their hard work free.
Two sets of sysops "abandoned" Clark Development.
1. Those who left BBSing for good, many became ISPs. I didn't see anything
Clark had to sell these people.
2. Those who still ran a BBS. There was nothing for us to buy!! No big
updates, most changes in the past few years were PPL stuff, all the effort was
put into Metaworlds.
Did we ever see any of the tools ported to OS/2? They were all still DOS apps,
no effort was made to start moving them away from the outdated tools they were
developed with.
Did we ever see any effort to port PCBoard to Win32? Nope, Metaworlds was going
to run the old DOS version!
Did we see any effort to support long filenames? Nope, not even through the DOS
INT 21 long filename extensions (which are not available under NT, only Win95).
I wasn't interested in Metaworlds (even if it worked).
Should we all have sent in checks to Clark Development each month to keep them
up and running? Be real, they collapsed because they didn't have anything the
market wanted to buy, and they collapsed in a most ungraceful way, no warning,
no cancelled orders (just kept the money), nothing.
tymer
Pat Clawson wrote in message ...
>
>So what is Fred Clark supposed to do, turn over his crown jewels to
>you free of charge? Loyalty toward the community? What the hell is that
>supposed to mean?
>
>How about the community being loyal to Clark? He made a solid product, but
>BBS sysops - who constantly whine that everything should be free -
>deserted him in droves. No money, no Clark Development, no PC Board. It's
>as simple as
>that. Too many BBS sysops have the weird and mistaken belief that somehow
>all software developers should give away their hard work free.
FREE? I have spent THOUSANDS on Clark Development. 25 node pcboard, PPLC,
PCBIC. Man, the only thing I did not buy was Metaworlds.
I think that when he just suddenly died, and all my future upgrades went up
in smoke, that HE owes me. Not the other way around.
Pat Clawson
Get ready to rumble........
> Pat:
>
> Before you shoot off you big mouth about something you are clueless
> about, READ THE DAMN MESSAGES FIRST! No one is complaining about the
> $38000 for the code. Our complants are with the misrepresentation and
> cloak and dagger tactics Mr. Clark is using to sell his code.
I'm hardly clueless as to the problems that Fred Clark faced. Let's
refresh everyone's memory about the situation by reviewing the news
coverage of last year's corporate collapse:
======================================
Friday, June 20, 1997
Clark Development Is No More
BY LISA CARRICABURU
THE SALT LAKE TRIBUNE
A Murray company that once led the market for computer bulletin
board system (BBS) software has ceased operations without warning
customers or business associates.
``We closed our doors in an effort not to incur any more debt,''
Cory Robin, Clark Development Co. Inc. general manager, said Thursday.
``We are in the process of restructuring.''
Robin said Clark's computer equipment and other physical assets
will be auctioned Saturday by Salt Lake City's TNT Auctions. Proceeds go
to Zions Bank, which held a lien on the property.
He said Chief Executive Officer William ``Fred'' Clark is developing
a new business plan and trying to secure investors.
``We're doing what we can to avoid a bankruptcy filing,'' he said.
Clark was out of the state Thursday and unavailable for comment,
Robin said.
The company's status has been a recent topic of online chat
sessions. Users of Clark's PCBoard and MetaWorlds software have been
posting messages to BBS services such as alt.bbs.pcboard seeking
information.
News that Clark has ceased operations surprised many, including one
customer who said she paid for software she never received.
Sharon Miller of Portland, Ore., said she and her fiance three weeks
ago charged to a credit card nearly $200 in Clark software they have not
been able to download.
Attempts to contact the company this week proved futile, she said.
Telephone calls to Clark went unanswered and online access to the company
was not functioning.
``It's frustrating,'' Miller said. ``All we want is the software we
paid for.''
Robin said there is no way for customers to reach the company for now.
``We're not operational,'' he said. ``We're insolvent.''
Pat Clawson, president and chief executive officer of Winchester,
Va.-based TeleGrafix Communications Inc., also has tried unsuccessfully to
contact Clark.
He said TeleGrafix sold products to Clark, which he characterized as
a company that once held up to 30 percent of the market for BBS software.
Clawson said Fred Clark is considered an innovator who was ``a principal
creator of online communications.''
Clawson said Clark's demise comes at a time of severe hardship for
all BBS companies as they struggle to adapt to the Internet. In 1994,
there were more than 80,000 BBS's, but today there are fewer than 25,000,
he said.
``[World Wide] Webmania has created another way to go online.''
Clawson said Clark's MetaWorlds product combined BBS and Web server
capabilities in a way that could have carried the company into the
Internet age. The software had flaws, however, and its development took
longer than expected, he said.
Steve Klingler, Clark's vice president and general manager until he
left the company in April, offered an assessment similar to Clawson's.
Klingler said he left after he and Clark were unable to agree on
what was needed ``to get the company out of its rut.''
``Clark had a cool product without enough marketing dollars left to
tell the world about it,'' he said. ``I'm really disappointed.''
© Copyright 1997, The Salt Lake Tribune
================================================================
Now that our history lesson is over, let's continue:
> Our complants are with the misrepresentation and
> cloak and dagger tactics Mr. Clark is using to sell his code.
I don't know what cloak and dagger techniques are at work here. Clark,
through his company, posted a notice to sell his code. He may not have
identified himself by name, but that's irrelevant - his company name and
address was posted. The ownership of his company is a matter of public
record. I assume
Fred probably has creditors hounding him to this day, so I can understand
why he might post a notice in his company name rather than personally.
But there's nothing cloak and dagger about this. If the company has the
legal rights to the software, that's the entity that should be offering
them for sale.
> And for your information, those of us who run PCBoard BBS software were
> always HIGHLY DEVOTED to both the program and Clark Development Company.
> They made a great program and supported it well. But when, during a
> beta cycle, they shut down overnight, without warning, and after many
> sysops sent in money for support and upgrades, they pissed us off. We
> were cheated and treated like shit. All we wanted to know was why it
> wasnt handled better and why those loyal to the company were treated
> like this.
There's never any pretty way to handle the collapse of a company. I'm sure
Fred agonized over it, and continues to do so to this day. Let's all
recall that Fred was one of the pioneers of the online world and is due
some respect. He sure has mine. Fred is a gentlemen and a visionary.
In the end, it was the bankers calling the shots. I know. I tried to buy
the code a year ago when the company hit a brick wall. The bankers at
Zions were a bunch of assholes - they didn't have a clue about what was
valuable and they sure as hell didn't care about the customers. All they
cared about was what physical assets - furniture and computers - they
could get their hands on to auction. I talked to them several times. They
didn't give a shit about the code or the customers.
When they walked in, Fred was history.
Banks don't care about customers or people. They care only about getting paid.
They are the ones your wrath should be directed at. They made no effort to
save the business - Zions just cashed it out for whatever they could, the
customers be damned. I personally wasted a lot of time screwing with them
trying to save the business. Believe me, I know what I'm talking about.
The bankers were arrogant, clueless jerks with an extremely limited
agenda. I spoke with them many times.
Somehow, I'm sure you never did.
> I do agree that Mr. Clark does need to feed his family, blah blah blah.
> But did you consider the possibility that some of the money he was using
> was from people waiting for a product that never came out? I know of at
> least 2 people who were waiting for delivery of MetaWorlds and never got
> it.
I consider the fact that when Zions Bank marched in, he was no longer in
control. While I don't minimize the failure of some customers to receive
some product, I also don't minimize the terrible financial consequences
that this had for Fred personally - or for the lives of his employees.
Who wants to be shamed by having their business taken away from them and
losing their life's work? Who wants to throw people out of work, people
that you've grown close to and respect?
> We dont expect the source for free. In my opinion, he would have been
> alot more likely to sell it 2 years ago for the asking price when BBSing
> was more popular.
It was ONE year ago, Spectre, not two. I agree it would have been better
to sell the code last year, but with the collapse of the BBS industry it
would not have been easy to find a buyer. I know that Zions Bank told me
that I was the ONLY
prospective buyer they had talked with. We weren't able to come to terms.
It's even more troublesome now, considering that the BBS industry as we
knew it is basicallly history. Look for Mustang and Galacticomm to go
under anytime now - Mustang is about to be kicked off the NASDAQ stock
market because of its financial woes, and Galacticomm just revealed to the
SEC that it's accountants have concluded that it's chances of survival are
low.
The reason why Clark died was in no small measure due to an industry-wide
collapse, not poor business decisions. Sysops deserted the BBS scene in
favor of the Web in tidal wave proportions. Ironically, at the same time
they were shelling out thousands to get Web servers up and running, they
were bitching about paying pennies for BBS software. That's what killed
Clark Development in the long run. When the company's revenues disappeared
almost overnight, the company could not complete its Metaworlds
development and the company died.
> So, next time, before you sprout your crap, get the facts first.
My facts are right on the money. I remain one of the few guys around
supporting the BBS sysop. I've got the tire tracks across my back to prove
it.
In case you didn't know it, a few days ago TeleGrafix bought the rights to the
Searchlight BBS and Spinnaker Web systems of Searchlight Software -
another icon of the BBS industry that has exited the business. We'll
continue to support
BBS as long as possible, but the entire concept of a BBS has changed in a
Webbed world and we will be changing with it.
Everybody should get off Fred Clark's back. We should wish him well as he
tries to rebuild his life and fortune. He produced great products and was
an industry pioneer. It's unfortunate he got caught in a very difficult
situation that was beyond his control.
Pat Clawson
President/CEO
TeleGrafix Communications
Winchester, VA
Pat Clawson
abac...@prontomail.com wrote:
> This is completely disingenuous, and it shows the lengths to which
> you'll go to prop up Fred Clark. The only reason anyone linked the
> company to Clark was a stroke of luck -- his DBA registration
> happened to be published online by the newspaper in Victoria. Most DBA
> records require an in-person trip to a county courthouse to get --
> Clark probably thought that no one would be able to connect Crossroads
> with him unless they were in Victoria, Texas.
I don't consider it a stroke of luck at all. Any prospective buyer would
check out the company prior to doing a deal. The DBA information is public
record - you can usually get it by phone. And in case you haven't noticed,
this type of information is extremely easy to get online, either directly
from the court house or from data vendors. As a former investigative
reporter, let me assure you that getting this information is not rocket
science. I routinely check court and business records over Internet
connections.
> Clark should have been straightforward with the PCBoard user community
> when his company closed doors, and should have been straightforward
> when trying to sell the source code.
>
> It would not have cost him anything to be forthright with the user
> community. To my knowledge, he has not made a single public statement
> since Clark closed after taking payment for orders it never delivered.
Clark didn't close his company. The bank walked in, started padlocking
everything, and they kicked him out. Clark was removed from control. Vent
your anger at Zions Bank. I spoke several times with the bankers who took
over the company. I asked them several times to make a public statement to
the customers - I even offered to help them get word out - and urged them
to keep the company intact so TeleGrafix (or some other party) could put
together a rescue plan.
Zions refused - not once, but several times. They didn't give a shit
about the company's customers, all they were concerned about was selling
the fucking furniture so they could recoup some of their loan. An
unbelieveable crew of jackasses at Zions completely destroyed any chance
of saving the business. These guys had a very limited agenda - and it did
not include the customers of the company. It also didn't include Fred
Clark.
As for Clark, I think he should have made some public statement. But I
understand why he didn't. He was under brutal legal attack - I'm certain
his lawyers put the gag on him to protect his ass. On top of that, I'm
sure he was struggling to overcome the humiliation of it all. If I had
been his lawyer, I would have told him to shut up too. You may not be
aware of it, but Clark has had continuing lawsuit struggles against Zions
over the way they liquidated the company.
Zions Bank shut down the business. Zions Bank had an absolute duty to make
a public statement. They did not. They did not care about the customers.
They just cared about getting their loan recovered. They handled the
liquidation of Clark Development in a miserable and despicable way. In my
opinion, they were real amateurs who ended up costing their own bank a ton
of money by handling this case in such a Mickey Mouse way.
For what it's worth, I've been a mergers and acquisitions consultant for
several years. I'm certified as an expert witness by the California
Superior Court, and I've been a court-appointed bankruptcy estate broker
for the U.S. Bankruptcy Courts. I know what I'm talking about - and
several judges agree.
Zions Bank is the problem here. Not Fred Clark. Why don't you call the
bank and unload on them? They killed any chance of keeping the business
going. And believe me, Clark Development could have been saved.
> The first appearance of any kind is made through someone else, and
> without mentioning his name. Whether you care to admit it or not,
> that's shady.
I don't think it was shady at all. When I first saw the company name and
location, I assumed it was Fred Clark. It was no secret that Fred had
relocated to Victoria, Texas. It was Clark Development Corp. that sold you
PC Board - not Fred Clark, individual. There's nothing wrong with him
soliciting offers in his business name. It's not shady at all - its
business, and proper business at that.
> If your company ever goes belly up, I'm highly confident that you
> would post a public message on Usenet and elsewhere explaining the
> circumstances and why it happened. You have made yourself available
> to the users, both to your benefit and to your detriment, for many
> years. Why aren't you holding Fred Clark to the same standard?
Considering the shaky state of the BBS industry, hell, we could go nuclear
any day! BBS sysops have to grow up and realize that they have to
financially support the developers who produce the tools. It's not just
TeleGrafix.
Mustang, Galacticomm and dozens of others have taken it in the fanny
because of the World Wide Web tidal wave and the wholesale refusal of BBS
sysops to pay for products. Almost all of our companies produce both Web
and BBS tools - but we face a stready stream of bitches and moans from
sysops that we should give our products away free. Is it any wonder why
the companies that remain in the BBS marketplace are running - not walking
- to embrace corporate Web users and leaving BBS sysops behind?
Look at the latest financials of Mustang. BBS-related products are
virtually dead, and Mustang is struggling to make inroads in the corporate
Internet telephony market. Mustang makes a fine Web/BBS combo server, but
sysops won't pay for it. They want it free. Look at Galacticomm - they
just filed numbers with the Securities & Exchange Commission that show
they're deep underwater and the tide's rolling in fast. WorldGroup is a
decent product, but sysops won't pony up the cash. That's also why esoft,
Searchlight, FirstClass, MediaHost, and Spider Island left the BBS
business.
That's why Fred Clark and Clark Development hit the brick wall. He was
engulfed by a force beyond his control - just like Mustang and Gcomm have
been.
Anybody even see the phrase "BBS" mentioned in Boardwatch Magazine anymore?
And whatever happened to Sysop News or BBS Magazine?
The sad thing is that BBS technology is still fundamentally sound, and it
is a much better solution that the Web for many services such as
interactive gaming and database access. Local BBS sysops can still play a
viable role in the online world, but the role will be different from that
in 1993.
I encourage all BBS sysops to attend the Syscon98 conference in Las Vegas
on October 2. It's the first national gathering of BBS sysops since
ONEBBSCON in Tampa in 1995. We all need to get together to discuss how we
can go forward.
A little inter-industry cooperation is needed at this time. It's good that
the meeting is being held in Las Vegas. Steve Wynn, the owner of the
Mirage who's widely regarded as being Mr. Las Vegas, brought together the
casino owners over a decade ago to urge them to put aside their petty
rivalries and work together to build Las Vegas. Look at the tremendous
growth that has resulted in Las Vegas! All the casinos are feasting on a
much larger pie. Why can't the same happen in the online world?
If TeleGrafix goes belly up, I'm sure you'll hear about it. I'm also sure
we'll have a long line of mental midgets pissing on our grave and getting
sick satisfaction out of the knowledge that they helped to kill the BBS
industry. But, of course, they won't blame themselves for that.
Since I make myself available to my customers, let me know what you think
about any BBS-related issues or topics. Send me e-mail at
cla...@telegrafix.com or call me at the office at 540-678-4050. And as
usual, you can always call me at home at 540-955-2010. Unlike other
executives in the industry, I'm always willing and delighted to speak with
my customers.
And when you call....place an order. <G>
Jim Henry
>>How about the community being loyal to Clark? He made a solid product, but
>>BBS sysops - who constantly whine that everything should be free -
>>deserted him in droves. No money, no Clark Development, no PC Board. It's
>>as simple as
>>that. Too many BBS sysops have the weird and mistaken belief that somehow
>>all software developers should give away their hard work free.
ÿ
Some background here: I was one of CDC's staunch defenders in the
Fido PcBoard echo, before and after their demise. I didn't take
what happened personally as many did, but saw it as an unfortunate,
unforseen event, not some plot for F.C. to run off with SysOps' money.
My PcBoard software, my doors, my mailer, my email gateway, my 2
different site licensed client programs, all are registered I even own
a license for Spinnaker, though I have never run it. I respect the
hell out of programmers and their product, because I can't do it, and I
want them to KEEP doing it. I have even chastised some SysOps for NOT
registering product.
That said, whereas Fred Clark took a powder and left his users
hanging, Spectre went to great lengths to provide a superb support site
for PcBoard, at no profit for himself. He did much to help keep
Pcboard alive. If he DID have a proprietary copy of PcBoard
there to be downloaded, so what? Who was hurt? WHERE could someone
have purchased it during this time? We heard NOTHING from CDC during
this time. Clark could have said something; he could have told people
what was going on. Instead he could have left the planet for all we
knew.
--
James Henry MCSE,MCPI | AirPower Information Services (sm)
(610)259-2198 - FAX | www.airpower.com j...@AirGunHQ.com
(610)259-2193 - BBS | Telnet://airpower.dyn.ml.org
* 1st 2.00 #9525 * "It takes a village.........of armed citizens."
--
(Jim Henry)
* AirPower BBS * 24 hrs/day * 28800 bps * 610-259-2193
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Oaklands
IronDog05 wrote:
> >It was posted a week ago that Fred Clark was the person behind Txrider
> >and Crossroads Business Solutions. Well, I can also verify this and if
> >you goto
> >
> >http://www.viptx.net/vbm/records/1097v-12.html
> >
> >you can see it for yourself. Looks like Txrider was Fred all along....
> >Thanks to Abaciscus for bringing this to our attention
>
> I guess screwing us once wasn't good enough.
--
Please remove the -a after my name before replying.
Are you an ICQ user. My ICQ number is 2633678.
Jim Henry
>any day! BBS sysops have to grow up and realize that they have to
>financially support the developers who produce the tools. It's not just
>TeleGrafix.
>Mustang, Galacticomm and dozens of others have taken it in the fanny
>because of the World Wide Web tidal wave and the wholesale refusal of BBS
>sysops to pay for products. Almost all of our companies produce both Web
>and BBS tools - but we face a stready stream of bitches and moans from
>sysops that we should give our products away free. Is it any wonder why
>the companies that remain in the BBS marketplace are running - not walking
>- to embrace corporate Web users and leaving BBS sysops behind?
You are right on target here.....
Jim
* 1st 2.00 #9525 * * If you can read this, I can hit my brakes and sue you
Serial # 0
who are controlling the destiny of the software, and who are the
beneficiaries of the sale, not Fred Clark.
Al Lawrence
You would think that that would be the case. However, if the creditors
were going to benefit, I would imagine that THEY would be selling the
asset and not Fred (as all indications seem to point to.. although
unconfirmed by me)...
Al
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John L. Crane
wrote:
>software market I can think of. The free-lunchers, ingrates and
>pirates make BBS software programming a field that few people in their
>right mind should enter, especially if they want to make money.
I'm struck with a few thoughts on this matter...
First, I've always considerd this a hobby, not a business. I've never
expected to make a fortune off BBSing. At best I expected not to go
broke from it.
From that viewpoint who can spend a fortune on the latest wizz bang
feature they might not even want. I've seen some laughable prices on
some addons.
Secondly BBSing is supported by a grass roots bunch of hacks
(dscription offered in the good sence). When a friend and I wanted a
TRIBBS like menu system we wrote one and uploaded it to SaltAir.
People who care about the medum giving back, perhaps the way it should
be..
I think your right that there isn't a lot of money to be made in
BBSing, there never was. Even then, I'd love to be able to fiind and
redgesture a couple of programs.
