TW's V12 Reply
John Poulos
the August TW. In part the said "We are NOT about to print any
'disclaimer' saying we are guilty of deception, because we are not, and
neither is Paul McKeehan." He suggested what we could do is perhaps have
us compile a list of questions and we will get answers from the author
and print a future article.
If anyone would like to e-mail me with some thoughful questions,
perhaps we can put this one to bed.
--
JP
Studebaker On the Net http://stude.com
My Ebay items: http://stude.com/EBAY
My For Sale page http://stude.com/sale.html
53 Custom Coupe
55 Speedster
64 R1 AT/AC GT Hawk
63 R2 GT Hawk/4 speed (keeper)
63 R1 GT Hawk/4 speed/AC
63 R2 4 speed Daytona HT
63 Avanti R3 clone
56 Golden Hawk
BondoBill1
and find a new hobby.
Without mincing words, forget the article, just have them prove, with real film
negative or real film slide the original photo tken in the shop. I want to know
why there is a Yukon in the background and why no part of the image has any
pixels, or rteal relections of the scene it was taken in.
Turn the magazine over, look at teh truck, the reflections are there, the image
looks photographic, look at the inside front cover, it shows natural
refletions.
By all that is Holy, I know the phot os a fraud. I just made a few t-shirts for
a family of their daughter and husband in front of a Studebaker on their
wedding day. I took out modern cars, added in old cars, I also removed a bunch
of cars from around two Willy's Areos, you can see cloning, rubber stamping,
whatever you want to call it.
Lets be blunt, people fall for bigger scams and loose money, why is it so
difficult to admit that a phot is not a photo.
You know that the Arizona in Pearl Harbor is not the Arizona but a CG, it looks
like a ship, but don't float like a ship, and yet people think they saw real
action.
All I am saying is the picture, not the article, the top picture is a FREAKIN
FAKE.......... you can be gentle, polite, or direct, but unless someone can
produce an unretouched not hand drawn wheel discs, and drawn in tailights, I
say the photo is about as real as me owning a sea going yacht.
Ask away, but ask the right questions, and don't pussy foot. Let the author
provide real proof. Where are the seats in the B&W photo by the leaved tree in
December?
I give up............. Give me a freakin break, we were duped.
Rkstude
As a Packard and Stude owner, just THANK him for me for writing an extremely
good INTERESTING (non-yawn) article. Also for me, tell him not to be afraid to
share his other experiences and that some of us APPRECIATE the work and
sharing.
Keep it coming please. One of the best TW'S I've ever read.
Ron
TomB
But yeah, essentially it's simple. All they have to do to shut me up
is have an independent lab (that routinely does work for prosecutors
or defense attorneys) analyze the negative and certify that chemically
it is 40 years old and that it is an unretouched photograph of a
"place" not a photograph of a drawing.
But, sure, sell me your car. I've got an extra $3,000. <G>
TomB
Rkstude
America and little kids. How dare people say the Babe called his home run. An
investigation is in order.
Ron
Lee Aanderud
> I want to know
> why there is a Yukon in the background
Maybe GM was using a Studebaker design shop to house their top secret
2000 Yukon SUV model.
> You know that the Arizona in Pearl Harbor is not the Arizona but a CG, it looks
> like a ship, but don't float like a ship, and yet people think they saw real
> action.
I did not know that... what's a CG?
Lee
Lee Aanderud
Lee
John Poulos
that you'll be hearing some "new improved " interesting history to pass on.
Rkstude wrote:
--
Chris Coop
just can't...and what is with the door handle placement on the two door on
the cover? How would you open the door like that? The black and white
photo is a 4 door... it has proper handle placement for suicide doors....
also where those fancy red tool boxes available in 1963?
Chris Coop
Billslark
photos had it been presented as what I believe it clearly is--fiction. I find
it hard to believe anyone could objectively think otherwise. If I'm wrong,
I'll stand on the rooftops and scream it, on this one.
First, concerning the cover photo, it is clearly a Cadillac Escalade SUV in the
background. Next to it is a current or previous-generation Seville sedan.
Brooks Stevens did the '62-'64 Larks. Those things in the background look
nothing like other photos he had shared with TW in past years concerning the
design of those cars. What's the story on those?
The photo supposedly taken on Dec. 10, 1963, where the guy picked his son up
from school in the sedan version, but there's no snow in the photo as in photos
taken that week in South Bend.
Thirdly, and although we love Studebaker, look at the rest of their lineup at
that time. A Hawk model that was basically ten years old. A Lark line that
was going on five years old. An Avanti with basically Lark underpinnings. And
a truck line that dated back to the late '40's. And we're to believe that they
spent money on prototypes that appear as advanced (and probably as expensive)
at the time as Chrysler's Turbine Cars, for example?
Lastly, how on earth is it possible that none of this stuff ever came even
remotely to light before now? Not to mention....has ANYBODY heard or read of
this gentleman before his articles in TW? We've heard of other styling
employees of the period, like Randy Faurot and Bob Doehler. I for one, wish I
knew who now owns the early '60's South Bend Studebaker employee phone
directory I'd seen for sale on ebay about a year ago. It'd be real
interesting to see what that would show.
While I'm glad for those who enjoyed reading the article, I think it's
unbelievable anyone would not expect someone who concocted this thing (in my
humble opinion only) to come clean. Period.
Bill
Stdbkr1955
>and
>that you'll be hearing some "new improved " interesting history to pass on.
>Rkstude wrote:
>
>> JP:
With the head line of " Once upon a time" in this mans storys are we to figure
that these are FUN storys?
I for one would like to know if Mr. McKeehan's ( if that is his real name )
storys starting after Art's taking over as editor is a coincidence? or has Art
taken on a pen name?
Once more I ask that you look at the box on the bottom of all TW page 3s.
First line states - The information in this magazine is TRUE and complete to
the best of our knowledge.- As editor, Art is under obligation to verify or
deny and at least label fiction.
Mickey
Home of the World Famous
Ms. Estella & Harvey The Traveling Truck
Fredd...@webtv.net
atlantis cruiser!
John Poulos
truthful, others do not. At the very worst, Art is guilty of being trusting, but
nothing more IMHO. He even offered to give me the authors phone number so we could
talk, but honestly I'd expect someone responsible in the club to step forward and
do there homework.
Stdbkr1955 wrote:
--
Itraseecab
edition.
Joe Roberts
BondoBill1
convience store. Look at what past us as we went up Columbus Avenue
http://bondobilly.com/driving.jpg
Billy G
Alex Magdaleno
Ask him if anything special was done with the crank. If we ask him first
about the degree of the V, he may get a clue and come up with a story about
offset journals. If we ask him first and he say nothing about it, then we
can ask him why the chose a 90 degree V which would be inherently out of
balance.
Alex
"John Poulos" <ava...@erols.com> wrote in message
news:3D498507...@erols.com...
cjday...@cox.net
What was it you ran out of? <G>
Chip
--
-------------------- http://NewsReader.Com/ --------------------
Usenet Newsgroup Service
Studegary
received Turning Wheels. I would appreciate it if some of you e-mailed your
analysis of the pictures and article to him <twed...@shaw.ca>. Please stick
with facts, analysis and direct questions, not just your opinion. If it was
listed as fiction and that the pictures were made up, I could go along with it,
but it is presented as factual and the pictures as being photographs. Gary L.
John Poulos
I feel the "he said, we said " discussion is over for now, besides Art will be
away from the computer for a few days at a Studebaker meet. I think this may get
much larger as we revist some of the authors earlier work, we may be needed to help
sort it all out.
Studegary wrote:
--
Skip Lackie
cover. I bought one of those circa 1964 and still have it -- the only
colors available were grey with red drawers (and ribbed aluminum on the
handle faces). In the late 1970s Sears reversed the color scheme to the one
in the cover "photo". They are now available in a number of other color
combos. I have a vague recollection of Mac and Snap On tool boxes of that
era, and think they were plain red. In other words, that tool box was made
a lot later than in 1963.
But the real giveaway is that blue late 90s GM SUV in the background.
Skip Lackie
Chris Coop <s2d...@mac.com> wrote in message
news:B96F16FA.B98A%s2d...@mac.com...
John Poulos
anything ?
Steve Miller
Lee Android wrote:
> I wonder if anyone will ask which version of Photoshop they used?
--
No refunds on menu items ordered "Hot," Very Hot," and "Thai Hot."
Lee Aanderud
Lee
John Poulos
> Hey quit using spell check... look what it did to my last name.
>
> Lee
>
Jerry Forrester
Damn, gotta clean the keyboard and monitor again. You made me spray Coke
through my nose even.
--
Jerry in Georgia
"Lee Aanderud" <aand...@directvinternet.com> wrote in message
news:3D4B0B50...@directvinternet.com...
John Poulos
Jerry Forrester wrote:
> Hey Lee
> Damn, gotta clean the keyboard and monitor again. You made me spray Coke
> through my nose even.
> ..
> > Hey quit using spell check... look what it did to my last name.
> >
> > Lee
> >
> > Steve Miller wrote:
> >
> > > That's hilarious!
> > >
> > > Lee Android wrote:
Freddy Badgett
count 18 evenly spaced dots where the numbers should be."It's 10 after
17 dear".
Freddy
BondoBill1
>17 dear".
Think that is weird? Remember after 9-11 all the photos of the guy who was
supposedly on top of the WTC as the plane was approaching?
Look carefully at this
Weird huh?
Jeff DeWitt
at
Kennedy's assassination, at Lakehurst NJ as the Hindenburg went up in
flames, at
Lincoln's assassination and on the Titanic.
Jeff DeWitt
Ron / Champ 6
interesting how hush-hush this whole deal was, and NO one else knew
about it. The article did not mention any other prototyping, and yet
there the Packard is with all of these other so-called prototypes that
no one knows about....why were they not given cursory mention in the
article?
Ron/Champ 6
1963 8E5 Champ (Champ 6)
1960 Lark Hardtop (Buttercup)
1988 VW Jetta (Franz.... Hanz is long gone)
1992 VW Passat (Taxi)
1995 VW Passat (Vanilla..yuk)
Lee
Lee DeLaBarre
Daytona62
1962 Lark Daytona Convertible
1962 Lark Regal Convertible (Dad's Last New Studebaker)
1962 Lark Regal Convertible (When Done, Dad's Next New Studebaker)
1964 Avanti R2 4-Speed R5410
1964 Cruiser (Dubbed the Survivor II)
1964 Lark 4-Door Sedan R1 Powered Y3 Police Car
1964 Lark Convertible
1965 Cruiser (Parts Car)
(2) Studebaker Factory Parts Train Cars
Steve Miller
John Poulos
anyone else go back and read the authors other articles ? They are not quite as
over the top as this one, but they sure do have the same odor.
Steve Miller wrote:
--
Stdbkr1955
>anyone else go back and read the authors other articles ? They are not quite
>as
>over the top as this one, but they sure do have the same odor.
Yes I did JP, What hits me are the pictures of obvious small models shown as
the real item. It should be shown as such.
My worry is that these items will find thier way into some main stream
publication as the truth.
In your opinion, does the "Once upon a time" header serve as a notice that
these articles are fiction?
Now, the writter has a gift for story telling and he takes great care to fill
in little parts of a story most would not bother with. Too bad all of this
needs to happen.
John Poulos
but our editor has been convinced otherwise. It's now up to to SDC board to sort
this out and let us know how it turns out. That's why they get paid the big bucks
<G> The Packard Club is doing exactly the same thing and I suspect will share any
findings with us too.
Stdbkr1955 wrote:
--
Fredd...@webtv.net
wheres R2D2???????
Loy
(BondoBill1) writes:
>I give up............. Give me a freakin break, we were duped.
>
Yeah...we were duped into believing it was a fraud! I want my money back!
Now...let's go to the next tent and see the 3-eyed giant!
Loy Daniel
http://clubs.hemmings.com/hpsdc/
Carl Shontz
I finally give up. what does POFLMSAO mean????
Carl ( calor me puzzled ) Shonrz
1951 Commander
!963 GTHawk
Ron / Champ 6
Ron/Champ 6
Steve Miller
I sent a pretty-well measured analysis of the car image the day I
received the issue (see earlier posting to this newsgroup). Art's
response was that the photo was scanned from a 40-year-old slide, and
that the author would be pleased to know I considered him expert enough
in Photoshop to do what I believed I saw. Ann's response to further
e-mail was a little shorter.
I'm sure Art and Ann have received _many_ anaylses of the photos.
Steve Miller
Steve Miller
Ron / Champ 6
<G>
On 02 Aug 2002 15:08:49 GMT, bondo...@aol.com (BondoBill1) wrote:
>I ran out of Pepsi last night, so Ellen and I took a ride to the local
>convience store. Look at what past us as we went up Columbus Avenue
>
>http://bondobilly.com/driving.jpg
>
>
>Billy G
Oldcarfart
>Ann's response to further
>e-mail was a little shorter.
two words or a scanned finger??? <G>
Steve Miller
BondoBill1
>response was that the photo was scanned from a 40-year-old slide, and
I want one of them scanners, my $1995.99 scanner could not bring out the that
much detail, real or fake, from a 40 year old slide. I have been playing around
with a 60 plus year old Kodachrome slide of the Queen Elizibeth coming up the
lower Hudson in camoflage paint during the beginning of WWII. I have been able
to bring out some detail of the vehicle parked along the west side, but nothing
like Arts scanner.
Bill
BondoBill1
Yes, it past us at 60mph, as I understand it, it only runs once a year on
Columbus avenue, when Fontaine Fox eats a great Twinkie in the sky
Studegary
NO - I didn't send my e-mail to Art on the day of the NG post. I sent it the
day I received my TW via first class mail. Gary L.