Oil light coming on -- 2004 Santa Fe 3.5L
JayR
it.
The oil light came on today while I was driving and mostly stayed on. I
went to a nearby gas station and had oil added. He put in 2 quarts, but it
looks like it is now over filled by about a 1/2 a quart -- meaning I guess
it was about 1 1/2 quarts low before he added the oil.
Now the oil light comes on but goes on and off. I'm guessing the
possibilities are: A) a bad oil pressure switch if I'm lucky; or B) the oil
pump is failing. I don't think it is leaking oil anywhere or has a worn out
engine etc.
If it's the oil pump that is going bad, how big of a job is that on this
vehicle? I am sure that is not something that I want to do (especially
since I don't even know where the oil pump is located), but is it fairly
easy for a dealer or other mechanic to replace the oil pump?
Would it make sense to first try replacing the oil pressure switch? I could
probably just do that (I assume), depending on where the oil pressure switch
is located.
Thanks.
zayton
Try bringing the oil level down to the proper level first.
hyundaitech
Don't overlook other small issues, either. On this engine, the wire
for the oil pressure switch runs in close proximity to the A/C-
alternator belt pulleys. I've seen cases where the wire
intermittently rubs the pulley, causing the circuit to ground and
illuminate the oil lamp.
JayR
Thanks. I'll check that out.
Here's an update: After I wrote the above message, I got in my car to see
if I could buy a Hyundai repair manual at Pep Boys (so I could figure out
where the oil pump is etc.) and the light didn't come on at all. I thought
maybe it was because the engine was still cool and maybe that kept the oil
pressure high enough for the light not to come on. But I decided to just go
home and skip looking for a repair manual. This morning -- same thing --
the oil light is no longer coming on.
Right after I had the oil added yesterday, I noticed that the light hadn't
gone off so before I left the gas station parking lot I got out and checked
the oil level again. The gas station owner came over wondering if there was
a problem and I told him the light was still coming on. He had a VERY heavy
accent and I could barely understand what he was saying, but he seemed to be
saying don't worry. And, I think he was trying to say the light will go off
but it may takes a few weeks? That didn't make sense to me, but who knows
what he was really saying.
And, also...., I remember the engine seeming a little noisy then and later
in the day before I wrote my original post -- like maybe a slight valve
clattering noise.
Today, the engine seems quiet and the light doesn't come on.
So, I'm wondering if it is possible that it does take a while for the oil
pressure sensor to readjust itself after the new oil was added, and maybe it
takes a while for the oil to get to everywhere it needs to go before it
quieted the engine? Seems unlikely to me, but as of today, no light and no
noise.
hyundaitech
That's not the case. Your oil pressure must be near zero for the oil
lamp to illuminate (if everything is working properly). It's turned
on by a switch screwed into the engine with a diaphragm which, when
oil pressure is applied to it, breaks electrical contact to the block
from the wire which is connected to the switch. Once you add the oil,
the pressure should return and the lamp should go out. If the lamp
remains on, it indicates some sort of problem, either with the oil
pressure or something electrical in the circuit.
You won't want to attempt replacing the oil pump unless you're
familiar with major repair, as you'll need to remove the timing belt
and oil pan to remove the oil pump from the front of the engine.
JayR
Thanks Hyundaitech.
I definitely won't be attempting anything with the oil pump -- that would be
way out of my league. I also just had the timing belt replaced and a lot of
other work (including an oil change) done about 2000 miles ago, so I know
what a big job getting to the timing belt is.
Now I'm wondering what may be going on. The oil light has not come back on
at all for the past few days and everything seems okay. I'm not sure why I
would have been 1 1/2 quarts low on oil since the oil was changed less than
2000 miles ago. And I don't know what caused the oil light to come on in
the first place, although adding 2 quarts of oil did see to fix that.
I guess I'll have to look at where the oil pressure switch is and see if
anything is going on in that area -- like the wire-near-a-belt issue that
you mentioned earlier.
Irwell
Whilst you are there, also check the wiring insulation.
Ed Pawlowski
"JayR" <Ja...@rtyesdfgr.mnb> wrote
> I also just had the timing belt replaced and a lot of other work
> (including an oil change) done about 2000 miles ago, so I know what a big
> job getting to the timing belt is.
>
> Now I'm wondering what may be going on. The oil light has not come back
> on at all for the past few days and everything seems okay. I'm not sure
> why I would have been 1 1/2 quarts low on oil since the oil was changed
> less than 2000 miles ago. And I don't know what caused the oil light to
> come on in the first place, although adding 2 quarts of oil did see to fix
> that.
Keep a close eye on the oil level. It is possible the guy refilling the
crankcase miscounted and did not fill it (and did not bother to check), a
leak, but you probably would have noticed by now, or you suddenly started to
get blow by the rings. Used to be valve seals too, but I don't know if
that would be affected on your engine.
Car makers do say a quart a thousand miles is considered normal, but I think
that is a lot, based on my experience with modern engines. I go about 7500
miles between changes and I've never added oil to either of my Hyundai and
only once, that I recall, on my Buick and that has 127,000 miles. I always
kept a few quarts of oil around for top-off, but no more.
JayR
> "JayR" <Ja...@rtyesdfgr.mnb> wrote
>> I also just had the timing belt replaced and a lot of other work
>> (including an oil change) done about 2000 miles ago, so I know what
>> a big job getting to the timing belt is.
>>
>> Now I'm wondering what may be going on. The oil light has not come
>> back on at all for the past few days and everything seems okay. I'm
>> not sure why I would have been 1 1/2 quarts low on oil since the oil
>> was changed less than 2000 miles ago. And I don't know what caused
>> the oil light to come on in the first place, although adding 2
>> quarts of oil did see to fix that.
>
> Keep a close eye on the oil level. It is possible the guy refilling
> the crankcase miscounted and did not fill it (and did not bother to
> check),
Thanks. I did have that thought -- how could I have been 1 1/2 to 2 quarts
low when the dealership did an oil change 2000 miles ago. There is no sign
of any leaking oil -- I looked inside the engine compartment and have been
checking under the car where it is parked. So, you may be correct -- the
dealer may not have filled the oil properly when they did the oil change.
The good news is that the oil light has not been coming on at all after this
last incident, and the oil level is staying the same.
JayR
news:ipf2rg$d5t$1...@speranza.aioe.org...
>
> The good news is that the oil light has not been coming on at all after
> this last incident, and the oil level is staying the same.
Oops, the latest update is that now the oil light has been coming on again.
I can create the problem by first revving the engine up a few times to a
high RPM -- then when it slows down to about 1,000 RPM or less, the oil
light starts flickering on and off or comes on steadily. Then if I increase
the tach speed a little -- up to about 1,500 RPM or so -- the light goes
out. Then back at idle speed the light comes back on or flickers on and
off. The oil level is full -- actually a little over-full by about 3/4
quart after a gas station said I needed two quarts when the oil light first
came on last week.
I hate the thought of having to get a new oil pump put in since I assume
that would cost at least $500 or more and I just had a ton of other
expensive work done (timing belt, power steering pump, etc. etc) costing
nearly $2000.
Would it make sense to just have the oil pressure switch replaced to see if
that is the problem? I have a hunch that the cost of having that done would
be the same or not much more than the cost of asking a dealership to just
diagnose what the problem is (maybe $100 +/-).
I still like the vehicle (Santa Fe), but it's too bad that I didn't just
trade this one in and get a newer one when the warranty on this one ran out
(I'm a second owner), and before I started having all of the other "60,000"
mile service work and other things done just recently.
Ed Pawlowski
"JayR" <Ja...@ertyuiqw.hjk> wrote
> Oops, the latest update is that now the oil light has been coming on
> again. I can create the problem by first revving the engine up a few times
> to a high RPM -- then when it slows down to about 1,000 RPM or less, the
> oil light starts flickering on and off or comes on steadily. Then if I
> increase the tach speed a little -- up to about 1,500 RPM or so -- the
> light goes out. Then back at idle speed the light comes back on or
> flickers on and off.
Sounds like the oil pressure is getting low at low speeds, but an oil pump
may or may not cure the problem. If it is cause by clearances getting
loose, the pump won't make any difference. If, indeed, the pump is work, it
will make a big difference.
I had a '71 Ford like that and it has about 50,000 miles when I bought it. .
Oil light always came on at idle. I drove it for 5 years and another 60,000
miles like that. Maybe you'd be that lucky, but you just don't know.
>
> Would it make sense to just have the oil pressure switch replaced to see
> if that is the problem? I have a hunch that the cost of having that done
> would be the same or not much more than the cost of asking a dealership to
> just diagnose what the problem is (maybe $100 +/-).
What you really want to know is the actual oil pressure. It may be possible
to swap out the sending unit with an aftermarket gauge that will give real
readings in psi. That will give you peace of mind.
Check out JC Whitney or similar stores
http://www.jcwhitney.com/electrical-oil-pressure-gauges/p2014746.jcwx?filterid=c27226j1
Less than $20 for gauge and sending unit.
>
> I still like the vehicle (Santa Fe), but it's too bad that I didn't just
> trade this one in and get a newer one when the warranty on this one ran
> out (I'm a second owner), and before I started having all of the other
> "60,000" mile service work and other things done just recently.
That has always been a problem. When do you stop fixing? If this is it for
the next year or two, not a bad deal compared to payments on a new model,
but if you spend that every couple of months, it would have been better to
trade.
hyundaitech
> Oops, the latest update is that now the oil light has been coming on again.
> I can create the problem by first revving the engine up a few times to a
> high RPM -- then when it slows down to about 1,000 RPM or less, the oil
> light starts flickering on and off or comes on steadily. Then if I increase
> the tach speed a little -- up to about 1,500 RPM or so -- the light goes
> out. Then back at idle speed the light comes back on or flickers on and
> off. The oil level is full -- actually a little over-full by about 3/4
> quart after a gas station said I needed two quarts when the oil light first
> came on last week.
> Would it make sense to just have the oil pressure switch replaced to see if
> that is the problem? I have a hunch that the cost of having that done would
> be the same or not much more than the cost of asking a dealership to just
> diagnose what the problem is (maybe $100 +/-).
You could do what Edwin suggested, or perhaps change the oil and
replace the switch in some order to see if things change. This
doesn't sound like a short (as the light flickers when you're at
idle), but it's still a good idea to check the wire visually just in
case.
In the event this doesn't solve the problem, count on needing a new
oil pump. I've only ever seen one case of this, and it wasn't on this
engine either, but the pumps are similar. The oil pressure relief
valve is spring-loaded in the pump. If it binds just a little bit,
too much oil can bypass, causing the condition you have.
ilbe...@gmail.com
Find out where the oil tap is on the engine block and remove that
fitting , then screw in a pressure guage that goes ujp to at least 60
psi. Get someone to read the value while you slowly bring up the
RPMS of the engine . Tell us what the values are at idle, 1000, and
2000 RPMS.
JayR
> "JayR" <Ja...@ertyuiqw.hjk> wrote
>> Oops, the latest update is that now the oil light has been coming on
>> again. I can create the problem by first revving the engine up a few
>> times to a high RPM -- then when it slows down to about 1,000 RPM or
>> less, the oil light starts flickering on and off or comes on
>> steadily. Then if I increase the tach speed a little -- up to about
>> 1,500 RPM or so -- the light goes out. Then back at idle speed the
>> light comes back on or flickers on and off.
>>
>> see if that is the problem? I have a hunch that the cost of having
>> that done would be the same or not much more than the cost of asking
>> a dealership to just diagnose what the problem is (maybe $100 +/-).
> What you really want to know is the actual oil pressure. It may be
> possible to swap out the sending unit with an aftermarket gauge that
> will give real readings in psi. That will give you peace of mind.
>
> Check out JC Whitney or similar stores
> http://www.jcwhitney.com/ele....
> Less than $20 for gauge and sending unit.
>
> Advanceauto
> http://shop.advanceautoparts.com/we...
Thanks. I have been away from the computer I have that can access
newsgroups (another one at work blocks newsgroup access), so I didn't get to
write back sooner.
Someone else also recently wrote that trying to get a measure of the actual
oil pressure may be a way to diagnose or solve the problem. Makes sense.
JayR
> On Apr 25, 3:15 pm, "JayR" <J...@rtyesdfgr.mnb> wrote:
>> I have a 2004 Hyundai Santa Fe with a 3.5L engine and about 80,000
>> miles on it.
>>
>> The oil light came on today while I was driving and mostly stayed
>> on. I went to a nearby gas station and had oil added. He put in 2
>> quarts, but it looks like it is now over filled by about a 1/2 a
>> quart -- meaning I guess it was about 1 1/2 quarts low before he
>> added the oil.
>>
>> Now the oil light comes on but goes on and off. I'm guessing the
>> possibilities are: A) a bad oil pressure switch if I'm lucky; or B)
>> the oil pump is failing. I don't think it is leaking oil anywhere or
>> has a worn out engine etc.
>>
>> Would it make sense to first try replacing the oil pressure switch?
>> I could probably just do that (I assume), depending on where the oil
>> pressure switch is located.
>>
>> Thanks.
>
> Find out where the oil tap is on the engine block and remove that
> fitting , then screw in a pressure guage that goes ujp to at least 60
> psi. Get someone to read the value while you slowly bring up the
> RPMS of the engine . Tell us what the values are at idle, 1000, and
> 2000 RPMS.
Thanks. Makes sense. I haven't tried that, or asked a mechanic to try that
yet, but see my reply to Hyundaitech about why (problem is gone again).
JayR
> On May 2, 8:50 pm, "JayR" <J...@ertyuiqw.hjk> wrote:
>> Oops, the latest update is that now the oil light has been coming on
>> again. I can create the problem by first revving the engine up a few
>> times to a high RPM -- then when it slows down to about 1,000 RPM or
>> less, the oil light starts flickering on and off or comes on
>> steadily. Then if I increase the tach speed a little -- up to about
>> 1,500 RPM or so -- the light goes out. Then back at idle speed the
>> light comes back on or flickers on and off. The oil level is full --
>> actually a little over-full by about 3/4 quart after a gas station
>> said I needed two quarts when the oil light first came on last week.
> You could do what Edwin suggested, or perhaps change the oil and
> replace the switch in some order to see if things change. This
> doesn't sound like a short (as the light flickers when you're at
> idle), but it's still a good idea to check the wire visually just in
> case.
>
> In the event this doesn't solve the problem, count on needing a new
> oil pump. I've only ever seen one case of this, and it wasn't on this
> engine either, but the pumps are similar. The oil pressure relief
> valve is spring-loaded in the pump. If it binds just a little bit,
> too much oil can bypass, causing the condition you have.
Thanks Hyundaitech. I think you may have hit on something here.
I was able to go to http://hmaservice.com and figure out how to see an
exploded view of the oil pump, and I could see the spring-loaded oil
pressure relief valve. When I saw it, I did think that since it is
spring-loaded I wondered if it could get stuck open, although I didn't know
what it did.
But, what is interesting to me is how this problem started in the first
place, and what I could do to replicate the problem. The oil light first
started coming on when I was doing a 60 mile trip on an Interstate Highway
at admittedly a higher-than-recommended speed of travel. I just assumed
that at the high speed and after travelling for a while, the engine was hot
and the oil thinned out and that's what caused the oil light to come on when
I slowed down to near idle speeds. Then, the gas station said the oil was
two quarts low and added oil. It took a few days for the oil light problem
to go away, and then a few days later it happened again. Then, to reproduce
the problem so I could show it to a friend, what I would do is (as described
above) rev the engine up to high RPM's and then when it slowed down to idle
speed the oil light would flicker on and off.
Later, the problem went away for a few more days and then after travelling
on an Interstate Highway again, the oil light started flickering again at
idle speed.
Now, the oil light has been staying off completely for a few days.
After reading what you wrote, I have a hunch that at high speeds, or when I
rev the engine up to a high speed, "maybe" that kicks the spring-loaded oil
pressure relief valve into a position where it sometimes binds or sticks a
little and stays open -- causing, as you suggested, too much oil to bypass
and cause a low pressure condition.
I think this because it would otherwise seem counterintuitive for high speed
to cause the pressure to be lower. I would ordinarily think that revving
the engine to a higher speed would pump up the oil pressure. But, maybe,
the high speed is in fact throwing the spring-loaded oil pressure relief
valve all the way into a position where it binds or sticks a little.
For now, since the oil pressure light has been staying off again for a few
days now, I think I may just monitor the situation and see what happens
next. Or, maybe another oil change wouldn't hurt if in fact something (a
small piece of dirt or crud in the oil) is causing the spring-loaded relief
valve to bind or stick at times.
We'll see what happens, but I have a hunch that you may have hit on what is
causing the problem.
JayR
P.S. If I do try doing an oil change, would it make sense to use a thinner
grade of oil for this one oil change (such as 5w-30 instead of 10w-40 or
whatever) to help clean out anything that may be causing the spring-loaded
oil pressure relief valve to stick? I am in New Jersey and we are entering
summer weather here.
Or, is there any other way, or additive etc., to help "clean" the engine?
hyundaitech
> JayR wrote:
> >> hyundaitech wrote:
> >> In the event this doesn't solve the problem, count on needing a new
> >> oil pump. I've only ever seen one case of this, and it wasn't on
> >> this engine either, but the pumps are similar. The oil pressure
> >> relief valve is spring-loaded in the pump. If it binds just a
> >> little bit, too much oil can bypass, causing the condition you have.
>
> > Thanks Hyundaitech. I think you may have hit on something here.
>
I'd probably go with a more viscous oil such as 10W-30 just to see if
it'll hold enough higher pressure to keep the lamp off. If the relief
valve is sticking, changing the oil viscosity won't free it.
byJoeS
>
http://shop.advanceautoparts.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/PartSearchCmd?storeId
151&catalogId 051&langId=-1&pageId=partTypeList&suggestion=&actionSrc=Suggest&searchTerm=oil+pressure+gauge
I just started experiencing the problem you are discussing with my 2004 Santa
Fe.
It recently started coming on at idling speed (about 750/800 RPM) when stopped
in traffic or at a traffic light. The solution for that I have found is to put
the car in Neutral and increase the RPM to 1000.
The other thing that I notice is that it only occurs when the engine is warm.
Which indicates to me that the viscosity of the oil is reduced as the
temperature of the engine goes up.
I happen to be away from home on a trip to Orlando from my home in NJ.
This happened to me about 18 months ago when stopped at a traffic light in NJ.
I changed the oil putting 10/30 weight oil in and the problem went away. Not
doing my own oil changes recently my mechanic puts in 5/?. which is a lower
viscosity.
Right now I ready to have the oil drained and put 10/30 oil in my engine and
see if it makes a difference. When I get back home to NJ I probably have the
oil pressure/sensor switch replaced.
Thanks for the insight of the above Threads.
--
for full context, visit http://www.motorsforum.com/hyundai/oil-light-coming-on-2004-santa-fe-3-5l-23295-.htm
Ed Pawlowski
it and I put an additional 50k miles on it. Replacing the sensor may or
may shut off the light but it will not fix the problem. In older
engines the bearings do wear, tolerances get loose and pressure at low
rpm can drop. Yes, it does it more the hotter it gets. Given the age
of the vehicle my guess is you have high miles and it is wearing.
When the light comes on at high rpm, change the oil with 50 weight and
sell it.