1997 Caravan (Rad Failure) transmission full of coolant
AMD Rules
transmission fluid and coolant all over the place.
Wife was driving to store, and complained it wasn't shifting properly. She
turned around and came home. Once at home it puked this mixture out the
overflow reservoir onto the ground.
I've since removed the radiator and tested the transmission exchanger, which
leaks as expected. That appears to be root cause for the failure.
Have also drained the transmission, which was full to the brim with what
looked like chocolate milk (a mixture of transmission fluid and engine
coolant).
To remedy the problem, I want to replace the rad, have the transmission
flushed at a local shop with new filter etc, and flush the engine cooling
system of course. From that point I was going to cross my fingers and hope
the transmission survived.
What other areas should I be looking at for potential damage ? Items to
check prior to re-assembly (engine components in cooling system damaged) ?
Lastly, this is an OEM radiator that has only been flushed once or twice
since new (bad me...bad me). Is this failure scenario one that is "common",
or happens relatively frequently (I do have poor preventative maintenance
techniques) ?
Can I expect that flushing out the system will be enough ? ...OR.. Should I
bite the bullet and get a transmission rebuild (remember the year of vehicle
and my desire to spend the fewest $$) ?
Any advice, comments, thoughts from the experts (I am not one of them) that
can guide me during my re-assembly would be appreciated.
Many thanks !
AMD Rules
obviously suggested that it be flushed out, and one of them recommended that
its better to flush the transmission by disconnecting the cooling lines, and
filling the tranny from the top while running the engine. This was said to
be better than using an external pump because the transmission will pump
itself out and get into the crevices which would not happen with an external
flush system.
Which is best ? External forced flush system, or using the transmission
itself to pump out the sludge until the lines squirt clean fluid out ?
Assuming the latter, should I place the transmission into all gears while
flushing to allow the fluid to get all the areas clean ?
Either way, I want to put on a new transmission filter, a new rad, and flush
out the engine coolant system.
Comments/advice/suggestions appreciated.
Thanks !
"AMD Rules" <AMDRules@H_o_t_m_a_i_l.com> wrote in message
news:Ex86b.10564$Pa1.4...@read1.cgocable.net...
Tbone
--
If at first you don't succeed, you're not cut out for skydiving
"AMD Rules" <AMDRules@H_o_t_m_a_i_l.com> wrote in message
news:uRn6b.10683$Pa1.5...@read1.cgocable.net...
AMD Rules
While I must admit I solicited the group for "comments", I was hoping for
comments that provided some helpful information.
If you can add any further thoughts to your statement below, I'd be
grateful.
"Tbone" <Fatc...@noway.now> wrote in message
news:YKCcnbR8PYP...@comcast.com...
Clem
You might have lucked out if you happen to have the 3 speed auto tranny.
('97.... I doubt it)
If you have the 4 speed you are REALLY hoping for a miracle if you expect a
flush to save it. I've heard that putting Dexron in there shortens the life
significantly... I can't imagine what anti-freeze and water did to the
insides... *shudder*
I have done the line-removal flush technique with good results. Of course it
wasn't flushing out contaminants (besides old dirty tranny fluid). I don't
think it'd be easy to shift through the gears while flushing unless you have
a helper to keep up with the containers filling with tranny fluid. Keep your
foot on the brake (of course). It's worth a try.....
Good luck.
"AMD Rules" <AMDRules@H_o_t_m_a_i_l.com> wrote in message
news:pKu6b.11099$Pa1.5...@read1.cgocable.net...
rob...@speakeasy.net
torque converter pumped out. You have nothing to lose but the cost of the
ATF, filter, gasket etc. I still have problems thinking in metric, but I
think 215k kms is about 130k miles. You're lucky if the trans is original.
It doesn't owe you anything - must have the will to live. If it were mine
and it seemed to work, I'd do the filter and flush routine again in about a
month. I doubt it would cause any cooling system problems that a good flush
won't take care of. The failure doesn't sound like a maintenance problem.
Just age related.
"AMD Rules" <AMDRules@H_o_t_m_a_i_l.com> wrote in message
news:Ex86b.10564$Pa1.4...@read1.cgocable.net...
cla...@_snyder.on_.ca
<mygodistherea...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>Heh... Next time be more specific!
>
>You might have lucked out if you happen to have the 3 speed auto tranny.
>('97.... I doubt it)
>
>If you have the 4 speed you are REALLY hoping for a miracle if you expect a
>flush to save it. I've heard that putting Dexron in there shortens the life
>significantly... I can't imagine what anti-freeze and water did to the
>insides... *shudder*
>
>I have done the line-removal flush technique with good results. Of course it
>wasn't flushing out contaminants (besides old dirty tranny fluid). I don't
>think it'd be easy to shift through the gears while flushing unless you have
>a helper to keep up with the containers filling with tranny fluid. Keep your
>foot on the brake (of course). It's worth a try.....
>
The vehicle needs to have the wheels off the ground, and run it up
through the gears (put in OD) as well as in neutral and reverse to
flush all accumulators and servos, as well as valves.
The transmission has a lockup converter - and the glue holding the
linings on the clutches of SOME of these converters is water soluable.
IF yours is one of these, the converter clutch will fail.
If it is a four speed, it is not a question of IF the transmission
will fail, but when. If you plan on keeping the van, get it overhauled
NOW, while you are expecting trouble, and when you will not need to be
towed a couple hundrend miles to a tranny shop. It will cost less to
fix before anything fails catastrophicly too.
They always give trouble at the most inoportune time - and if the
fluid is not changed on a regular basis they are guaranteed to fail.
The 3 speed is a bit better, but on a 3 liter 97 van the chances of
finding a 3 speed are extremely remote.
AMD Rules
> The vehicle needs to have the wheels off the ground, and run it up
> through the gears (put in OD) as well as in neutral and reverse to
> flush all accumulators and servos, as well as valves.
Just posting a follow-up, as reference material for other's who may
experience an ATF cooler failure.
I raised the vehicle on jack stands, and I cycled through all gears
including reverse while having my assistant continuously replenish the
fluid.
I had both transmission lines emptying into a container, and filled through
the dipstick tube.
Ran it until only clean pure red fluid appeared to come out of the lines.
(The mixture that was in it before looked exactly like chocolate milk.)
I used about 16 quarts (litres) of tranmission fluid to flush it out.
> The transmission has a lockup converter - and the glue holding the
> linings on the clutches of SOME of these converters is water soluable.
> IF yours is one of these, the converter clutch will fail.
I was not aware of this. Thanks for the heads-up.
Seems peculiar to design for a water soluable adhesive, when the potential
exists for a (water based) cooler failure.
> If it is a four speed, it is not a question of IF the transmission
> will fail, but when.
I have the 3spd transmission. While not quite as smooth as the big brother
4spd, it has been very reliable. I do tow a small pop-up trailer with this
vehicle, and had added and external transmission cooler to assist with heat
removal. I only wish I had taken the rad out of the loop. Instead I opted
to run both the OEM cooler and the aftermarket cooler in series. Hindsight
is 20/20.
> If you plan on keeping the van, get it overhauled
> NOW, while you are expecting trouble, and when you will not need to be
> towed a couple hundrend miles to a tranny shop. It will cost less to
> fix before anything fails catastrophicly too.
> They always give trouble at the most inoportune time - and if the
> fluid is not changed on a regular basis they are guaranteed to fail.
Generally I would agree, however this van has accumulated quite a few miles
and I hope to use minimum $ to get in through one more year. There is a
risk to everything in life, and this is one decision I hope works out for
me. We are fortunate to have a second vehicle, and a membership to CAA
(AAA) to cover towing within reasonable distance. I have had a transmission
failure on another vehicle in the past, during a family trip, and can
appreciate your warning regarding the hassles it can cause.
> The 3 speed is a bit better, but on a 3 liter 97 van the chances of
> finding a 3 speed are extremely remote.
> >Good luck.
This is the 3.0L V6 , and from what I am hearing that is a good thing !
I've installed a new radiator, thermostat & gasket, upper radiator hose,
flushed the cooling system, drained and installed new filter in the
transmission, flushed the transmission to the best of my abilities, and
crossed all 10 toes, fingers, and a couple of eyes.
I have had some oily residue appearing in the rad cap region, however my
wife was kind enough to loan me the turkey baster (suction device) which has
allowed me to skim it out of there, and replenish the coolant. I've also
cleaned out the overflow reservoir a few times to make certain it is not
accumulating the oily residue. It seems to have stopped appearing, and
most likely came from some crevices that the flushing process had missed.
(Yes, I did purchase the wife a new baster from the dollar store !)
The transmission fluid appears ok, with no visible discoloration or odd
smell.
Its been over a week, and so far all seems OK.
Thanks again for your thoughts & ideas.
Anonymous
AMDRules@H_o_t_m_a_i_l.com says...
I realize this is an old thread but I was curious as to whether you
replaced the tranny or what.
I have a 90 3.0 with the 4 speed. I have never experienced a
transmission / anti-freeze mix with any vehicle before. I have checked
my radiator recently and it looks amazingly clean inside.
Just wondering.
--
Chas Stokes
c...@zuul24.com
I have no idea why this stupid service is making me anonymous now. Most
annoying.
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