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Uneven tyre wear on F10 5 Series
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Bob
Jun 22, 2013, 6:28:05 PM6/22/13
to
After 2 years I go to get new tyres on the back because the inside of the
tyre is down to the limit, the fronts are also wearing on the outside edge,
so ask them to do a full tracking test. They have all the latest laser
stuff. The test has shown that one wheel is outside BMW specification for
camber and most of the other things on all corners are also way out of
perfect. The engineer said he couldn't adjust it and I'd have to go back to
my dealer to get the camber problem and other things fixed.
What is going on, do BMW not set their cars up before leaving the factory or
are they not strong enough for our potholed roads??
regards
Bob.
tyre is down to the limit, the fronts are also wearing on the outside edge,
so ask them to do a full tracking test. They have all the latest laser
stuff. The test has shown that one wheel is outside BMW specification for
camber and most of the other things on all corners are also way out of
perfect. The engineer said he couldn't adjust it and I'd have to go back to
my dealer to get the camber problem and other things fixed.
What is going on, do BMW not set their cars up before leaving the factory or
are they not strong enough for our potholed roads??
regards
Bob.
R. Mark Clayton
Jun 23, 2013, 7:12:01 AM6/23/13
to
"Bob" <Bo...@privacy.net> wrote in message
news:ZqCdneOBp-FkuVvM...@bt.com...
> After 2 years I go to get new tyres on the back because the inside of the
> tyre is down to the limit,
Under inflation?
> tyre is down to the limit,
> the fronts are also wearing on the outside edge,
roundabouts).
If the tyres are the same front and rear then rotate them (as probably
recommneded in the handbook)
If not and the the tyres are not uni-directional then reverse them on the
rim when about 40% worn.
and er don't drive so hard!
Bob
Jun 23, 2013, 7:57:03 AM6/23/13
to
"R. Mark Clayton" wrote ...
"Bob" wrote in message
(how?) you will put all the suspension geometry out in some cases by more
than BMW tollerance allows.
No, this is not about tyres or driving because I've had BMW's for decades
and never had a problem like this. After I had my last, a 330i, set up by
the same garage it always had perfect flat tyre wear and I've never had to
rotate tyres on any of them.
--
Regards
Bob
R. Mark Clayton
Jun 23, 2013, 9:50:21 AM6/23/13
to
news:i5CdndlPHM0Sf1vM...@bt.com...
>
>> the fronts are also wearing on the outside edge,
>
> This is more normal, especially if you do a lot of cornering (in the UK
> roundabouts).
>
> If the tyres are the same front and rear then rotate them (as probably
> recommneded in the handbook)
>
> If not and the the tyres are not uni-directional then reverse them on the
> rim when about 40% worn.
>
> and er don't drive so hard!
>
>> so ask them to do a full tracking test. They have all the latest laser
>> stuff. The test has shown that one wheel is outside BMW specification for
>> camber and most of the other things on all corners are also way out of
>> perfect. The engineer said he couldn't adjust it and I'd have to go back
>> to my dealer to get the camber problem and other things fixed.
>> What is going on, do BMW not set their cars up before leaving the factory
>> or are they not strong enough for our potholed roads??
>>
>
> Interesting comment, so from that I assume if you drive an F10 520d hard
> (how?) you will put all the suspension geometry out in some cases by more
> than BMW tollerance allows.
Don't know why the rears are wearing on the inside. If you do a lot of high
speed work they tend to wear in the middle.
The front's wearing on the outside is normal, because when you corner more
force is exerted on the outside edge, so it wears faster.
Swapping tyres around the car is usually recommended as a service action.
>
>
> "R. Mark Clayton" wrote ...
>
>
> "Bob" wrote in message
>
>> After 2 years I go to get new tyres on the back because the inside of the
>> tyre is down to the limit,
>
> Under inflation?
Heavy rear loading?
>
> "R. Mark Clayton" wrote ...
>
>
> "Bob" wrote in message
>
>> After 2 years I go to get new tyres on the back because the inside of the
>> tyre is down to the limit,
>
> Under inflation?
>
>> the fronts are also wearing on the outside edge,
>
> This is more normal, especially if you do a lot of cornering (in the UK
> roundabouts).
>
> If the tyres are the same front and rear then rotate them (as probably
> recommneded in the handbook)
>
> If not and the the tyres are not uni-directional then reverse them on the
> rim when about 40% worn.
>
> and er don't drive so hard!
>
>> so ask them to do a full tracking test. They have all the latest laser
>> stuff. The test has shown that one wheel is outside BMW specification for
>> camber and most of the other things on all corners are also way out of
>> perfect. The engineer said he couldn't adjust it and I'd have to go back
>> to my dealer to get the camber problem and other things fixed.
>> What is going on, do BMW not set their cars up before leaving the factory
>> or are they not strong enough for our potholed roads??
>>
>
> Interesting comment, so from that I assume if you drive an F10 520d hard
> (how?) you will put all the suspension geometry out in some cases by more
> than BMW tollerance allows.
speed work they tend to wear in the middle.
The front's wearing on the outside is normal, because when you corner more
force is exerted on the outside edge, so it wears faster.
Swapping tyres around the car is usually recommended as a service action.
Bob
Jun 23, 2013, 1:01:11 PM6/23/13
to
"R. Mark Clayton" wrote
my suspension geometry be out so much to BMW's own standard such that one
wheel is even outside BMW's own tolerance for camber by quite a bit and will
need to go into the BMW garage for work, probably a different suspension arm
(there are two lengths, +30 and -30). This is in two years and 24,000 miles
of mainly driving two up without luggage or anything heavy in the vehicle.
Suspension geometry out of true will cause tyre wear problems and my
suspension is out of true in so many ways. The question is why and maybe how
many others have a similar problem?
Camber and Toe on both rear wheels is out
Camber on the front left is out by some way
Camber on the front right is OK
Toe on both front wheels is out
--
Regards.
Bob
>
>
>
>Don't know why the rears are wearing on the inside. If you do a lot of
>high speed work they tend to wear in the middle.
>
>The front's wearing on the outside is normal, because when you corner more
>force is exerted on the outside edge, so it wears faster.
>
>Swapping tyres around the car is usually recommended as a service action.
>
>
Lets forget about the uneven tyre wear for a moment, why would virtually all
>
>
>Don't know why the rears are wearing on the inside. If you do a lot of
>high speed work they tend to wear in the middle.
>
>The front's wearing on the outside is normal, because when you corner more
>force is exerted on the outside edge, so it wears faster.
>
>Swapping tyres around the car is usually recommended as a service action.
>
>
my suspension geometry be out so much to BMW's own standard such that one
wheel is even outside BMW's own tolerance for camber by quite a bit and will
need to go into the BMW garage for work, probably a different suspension arm
(there are two lengths, +30 and -30). This is in two years and 24,000 miles
of mainly driving two up without luggage or anything heavy in the vehicle.
Suspension geometry out of true will cause tyre wear problems and my
suspension is out of true in so many ways. The question is why and maybe how
many others have a similar problem?
Camber and Toe on both rear wheels is out
Camber on the front left is out by some way
Camber on the front right is OK
Toe on both front wheels is out
--
Regards.
Bob
R. Mark Clayton
Jun 23, 2013, 3:01:49 PM6/23/13
to
news:v-adnRtfQ9ZFtFrM...@bt.com...
I slightly misread the original post.
The main possibilties for being out are : -
Not set up right in the first place (seems likely it was a while ago because
the tyres have worn unevenly).
or
You drive over speed bumps way too fast.
>
> --
> Regards.
> Bob
>
The main possibilties for being out are : -
Not set up right in the first place (seems likely it was a while ago because
the tyres have worn unevenly).
or
You drive over speed bumps way too fast.
>
> --
> Regards.
> Bob
>
Bob
Jun 24, 2013, 3:56:57 AM6/24/13
to
"R. Mark Clayton" wrote
myself to be mechanically sympathetic besides that I have a damaged spine so
it would cause physical pain if I did.
So, you are left with the same conclusion I had reached and my tyre shop
technician had reached, that my car has been "out" since it left the
factory. That beggars the question, has there been a manufacturing problem
and how many others have the same problem, perhaps they fitted the wrong
length camber adjustment arm originally.
The tyre shop say mine is not the only case they have seen like this with
this 5 series.
I'll just have to get BMW to do a suspension test again (half price rate of
£150) and then correct the problem at my expense ! but I will then go to my
highly trusted tyre shop and pay for their technician to check it all again.
(£60) Seeing as I've just saved £122 on two tyres It';s not as bad as it
seems.
--
Regards.
Bob
>
>I slightly misread the original post.
>
>The main possibilties for being out are : -
>
>Not set up right in the first place (seems likely it was a while ago
>because the tyres have worn unevenly).
>or
>You drive over speed bumps way too fast.
>
I certainly do not drive over speed bumps too fast, I've always considered
>I slightly misread the original post.
>
>The main possibilties for being out are : -
>
>Not set up right in the first place (seems likely it was a while ago
>because the tyres have worn unevenly).
>or
>You drive over speed bumps way too fast.
>
myself to be mechanically sympathetic besides that I have a damaged spine so
it would cause physical pain if I did.
So, you are left with the same conclusion I had reached and my tyre shop
technician had reached, that my car has been "out" since it left the
factory. That beggars the question, has there been a manufacturing problem
and how many others have the same problem, perhaps they fitted the wrong
length camber adjustment arm originally.
The tyre shop say mine is not the only case they have seen like this with
this 5 series.
I'll just have to get BMW to do a suspension test again (half price rate of
£150) and then correct the problem at my expense ! but I will then go to my
highly trusted tyre shop and pay for their technician to check it all again.
(£60) Seeing as I've just saved £122 on two tyres It';s not as bad as it
seems.
--
Regards.
Bob
Scott Dorsey
Jun 24, 2013, 10:33:28 AM6/24/13
to
Bob <Bo...@privacy.net> wrote:
>Lets forget about the uneven tyre wear for a moment, why would virtually all
>my suspension geometry be out so much to BMW's own standard such that one
>wheel is even outside BMW's own tolerance for camber by quite a bit and will
>need to go into the BMW garage for work, probably a different suspension arm
>(there are two lengths, +30 and -30). This is in two years and 24,000 miles
>of mainly driving two up without luggage or anything heavy in the vehicle.
>Suspension geometry out of true will cause tyre wear problems and my
>suspension is out of true in so many ways. The question is why and maybe how
>many others have a similar problem?
Because the kid at the tire store doesn't really understand anything about
>Lets forget about the uneven tyre wear for a moment, why would virtually all
>my suspension geometry be out so much to BMW's own standard such that one
>wheel is even outside BMW's own tolerance for camber by quite a bit and will
>need to go into the BMW garage for work, probably a different suspension arm
>(there are two lengths, +30 and -30). This is in two years and 24,000 miles
>of mainly driving two up without luggage or anything heavy in the vehicle.
>Suspension geometry out of true will cause tyre wear problems and my
>suspension is out of true in so many ways. The question is why and maybe how
>many others have a similar problem?
the suspension geometry, he only knows to put it up on the machine with the
arrows in the right place and read what the machine tells him to do.
Maybe one of the arrows wasn't in the right place. Maybe you have some
worn suspension component somewhere that he didn't catch because he doesn't
really know how to check everything before putting it on the machine. One
worn control arm bushing will screw all kinds of stuff up.
Take it to a BMW shop, or take it to a place that specializes in alignments.
I have seen more cars screwed up by kids at tire shops than you would believe.
You need someone who actually understands suspension geometry to look at it.
There may be nothing wrong at all.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."
Bob
Jun 24, 2013, 11:53:09 AM6/24/13
to
"Scott Dorsey" wrote ...
I actually trust the tyre shop technician (who is probably about 35 as are
most that work there) more than the BMW shop, he deals with very fast cars,
i've seen Ferraris and Porsches in there, as well as the mundane like my 5
series. This is probably the premier tyre shop/depot in the UK and I doubt
that BMW have equipment any better.
--
Regards. Bob Hobden.
Posted to this Newsgroup from the W of London, UK
most that work there) more than the BMW shop, he deals with very fast cars,
i've seen Ferraris and Porsches in there, as well as the mundane like my 5
series. This is probably the premier tyre shop/depot in the UK and I doubt
that BMW have equipment any better.
--
Regards. Bob Hobden.
Posted to this Newsgroup from the W of London, UK
Scott Dorsey
Jun 24, 2013, 12:04:45 PM6/24/13
to
Bob <Bo...@privacy.net> wrote:
>>
>I actually trust the tyre shop technician (who is probably about 35 as are
>most that work there) more than the BMW shop, he deals with very fast cars,
>i've seen Ferraris and Porsches in there, as well as the mundane like my 5
>series. This is probably the premier tyre shop/depot in the UK and I doubt
>that BMW have equipment any better.
Well, then ask him to explain what he thinks is wrong.
>>
>I actually trust the tyre shop technician (who is probably about 35 as are
>most that work there) more than the BMW shop, he deals with very fast cars,
>i've seen Ferraris and Porsches in there, as well as the mundane like my 5
>series. This is probably the premier tyre shop/depot in the UK and I doubt
>that BMW have equipment any better.
Bob
Jun 24, 2013, 12:15:57 PM6/24/13
to
"Scott Dorsey" wrote in
problems that there has either been a manufacturing fault** or the
suspension is not up to UK roads, ie a design fault.
** The wrong length camber adjustment arm fitted, there are two.
--
Regards. Bob
>
>Bob <Bo...@privacy.net> wrote:
>>>
>>I actually trust the tyre shop technician (who is probably about 35 as are
>>most that work there) more than the BMW shop, he deals with very fast
>>cars,
>>i've seen Ferraris and Porsches in there, as well as the mundane like my 5
>>series. This is probably the premier tyre shop/depot in the UK and I doubt
>>that BMW have equipment any better.
>
>Well, then ask him to explain what he thinks is wrong.
>
He considers with the number of F10/11 BMW's he has seen with similar
>Bob <Bo...@privacy.net> wrote:
>>>
>>I actually trust the tyre shop technician (who is probably about 35 as are
>>most that work there) more than the BMW shop, he deals with very fast
>>cars,
>>i've seen Ferraris and Porsches in there, as well as the mundane like my 5
>>series. This is probably the premier tyre shop/depot in the UK and I doubt
>>that BMW have equipment any better.
>
>Well, then ask him to explain what he thinks is wrong.
>
problems that there has either been a manufacturing fault** or the
suspension is not up to UK roads, ie a design fault.
** The wrong length camber adjustment arm fitted, there are two.
--
Regards. Bob
Scott Dorsey
Jun 25, 2013, 1:07:08 PM6/25/13
to
Bob <Bo...@privacy.net> wrote:
>
>He considers with the number of F10/11 BMW's he has seen with similar
>problems that there has either been a manufacturing fault** or the
>suspension is not up to UK roads, ie a design fault.
>** The wrong length camber adjustment arm fitted, there are two.
I don't know, I haven't heard of anything like that in the US. If you
>
>He considers with the number of F10/11 BMW's he has seen with similar
>problems that there has either been a manufacturing fault** or the
>suspension is not up to UK roads, ie a design fault.
>** The wrong length camber adjustment arm fitted, there are two.
were in the US, I'd suggest you write the bmwcca magazine a letter asking
how many other people had seen these issues. The BMW Car Club of the UK
is similar, though.
Bob
Jun 26, 2013, 2:58:18 AM6/26/13
to
"Scott Dorsey" wrote ...
Will let you know what happens.
>
>Bob wrote:
>>
>>He considers with the number of F10/11 BMW's he has seen with similar
>>problems that there has either been a manufacturing fault** or the
>>suspension is not up to UK roads, ie a design fault.
>>** The wrong length camber adjustment arm fitted, there are two.
>
>I don't know, I haven't heard of anything like that in the US. If you
>were in the US, I'd suggest you write the bmwcca magazine a letter asking
>how many other people had seen these issues. The BMW Car Club of the UK
>is similar, though.
>
>
I'll see what BMW say and do first, get it checked and take it from there.
>Bob wrote:
>>
>>He considers with the number of F10/11 BMW's he has seen with similar
>>problems that there has either been a manufacturing fault** or the
>>suspension is not up to UK roads, ie a design fault.
>>** The wrong length camber adjustment arm fitted, there are two.
>
>I don't know, I haven't heard of anything like that in the US. If you
>were in the US, I'd suggest you write the bmwcca magazine a letter asking
>how many other people had seen these issues. The BMW Car Club of the UK
>is similar, though.
>
>
Will let you know what happens.
Bob Hobden
Jul 8, 2013, 12:58:53 PM7/8/13
to
"Bob" wrote ...
camber and toe seriously out on the rear, toe out on the front but the
camber on both front wheels within tolerance, the tyre shop said only the
right camber was correct. The BMW garage have adjusted it all and now
everything is within BMW tolerance (@ £290.53). No-one seems to know what
has caused the problem and I am assured it isn't a common problem with
F10/F11 5 Series cars, my own checks have also sown that. I will get it
checked again when I get the next set of tyres just in case it's our
terrible roads causing damage, although if it was it would be a common
problem.
It's only money! :-)
>
>"Scott Dorsey" wrote ...
>>
>>Bob wrote:
>>>
>>>He considers with the number of F10/11 BMW's he has seen with similar
>>>problems that there has either been a manufacturing fault** or the
>>>suspension is not up to UK roads, ie a design fault.
>>>** The wrong length camber adjustment arm fitted, there are two.
>>
>>I don't know, I haven't heard of anything like that in the US. If you
>>were in the US, I'd suggest you write the bmwcca magazine a letter asking
>>how many other people had seen these issues. The BMW Car Club of the UK
>>is similar, though.
>>
>>
>I'll see what BMW say and do first, get it checked and take it from there.
>Will let you know what happens.
>
It went in for a BMW Kinematics Diagnosis System (KDS) and they too found
>"Scott Dorsey" wrote ...
>>
>>Bob wrote:
>>>
>>>He considers with the number of F10/11 BMW's he has seen with similar
>>>problems that there has either been a manufacturing fault** or the
>>>suspension is not up to UK roads, ie a design fault.
>>>** The wrong length camber adjustment arm fitted, there are two.
>>
>>I don't know, I haven't heard of anything like that in the US. If you
>>were in the US, I'd suggest you write the bmwcca magazine a letter asking
>>how many other people had seen these issues. The BMW Car Club of the UK
>>is similar, though.
>>
>>
>I'll see what BMW say and do first, get it checked and take it from there.
>Will let you know what happens.
>
camber and toe seriously out on the rear, toe out on the front but the
camber on both front wheels within tolerance, the tyre shop said only the
right camber was correct. The BMW garage have adjusted it all and now
everything is within BMW tolerance (@ £290.53). No-one seems to know what
has caused the problem and I am assured it isn't a common problem with
F10/F11 5 Series cars, my own checks have also sown that. I will get it
checked again when I get the next set of tyres just in case it's our
terrible roads causing damage, although if it was it would be a common
problem.
It's only money! :-)
Scott Dorsey
Jul 8, 2013, 3:01:31 PM7/8/13
to
Bob Hobden <Bo...@privacy.net> wrote:
>It went in for a BMW Kinematics Diagnosis System (KDS) and they too found
>camber and toe seriously out on the rear, toe out on the front but the
>camber on both front wheels within tolerance, the tyre shop said only the
>right camber was correct. The BMW garage have adjusted it all and now
>everything is within BMW tolerance (@ £290.53). No-one seems to know what
>has caused the problem and I am assured it isn't a common problem with
>F10/F11 5 Series cars, my own checks have also sown that. I will get it
>checked again when I get the next set of tyres just in case it's our
>terrible roads causing damage, although if it was it would be a common
>problem.
So, did they just adjust things, or did they replace things? And if so,
>It went in for a BMW Kinematics Diagnosis System (KDS) and they too found
>camber and toe seriously out on the rear, toe out on the front but the
>camber on both front wheels within tolerance, the tyre shop said only the
>right camber was correct. The BMW garage have adjusted it all and now
>everything is within BMW tolerance (@ £290.53). No-one seems to know what
>has caused the problem and I am assured it isn't a common problem with
>F10/F11 5 Series cars, my own checks have also sown that. I will get it
>checked again when I get the next set of tyres just in case it's our
>terrible roads causing damage, although if it was it would be a common
>problem.
what did they replace?
And how does it drive now, compared with beforehand?
Bob Hobden
Jul 8, 2013, 6:03:25 PM7/8/13
to
"Scott Dorsey" wrote
According to the invoice they just did adjustments, there are no parts
mentioned. However on checking the figures for the two tests, which appear
to be on the same type of machine, the tyre shop are using slightly
different figures for this model to that used in the BMW test. Not that it
makes that much difference to the fact almost everything was outside
tolerance.
The difference is noticeable, rather like changing from Bridgestone tyres to
Michelin Pilot Sport 3 ones on a non runflat car, a more planted, stuck to
the road feel. Especially at the back.
mentioned. However on checking the figures for the two tests, which appear
to be on the same type of machine, the tyre shop are using slightly
different figures for this model to that used in the BMW test. Not that it
makes that much difference to the fact almost everything was outside
tolerance.
The difference is noticeable, rather like changing from Bridgestone tyres to
Michelin Pilot Sport 3 ones on a non runflat car, a more planted, stuck to
the road feel. Especially at the back.
Scott Dorsey
Jul 9, 2013, 9:50:53 AM7/9/13
to
Bob Hobden <Bo...@privacy.net> wrote:
>
>According to the invoice they just did adjustments, there are no parts
>mentioned. However on checking the figures for the two tests, which appear
>to be on the same type of machine, the tyre shop are using slightly
>different figures for this model to that used in the BMW test. Not that it
>makes that much difference to the fact almost everything was outside
>tolerance.
Nobody ever gets quite the same numbers, which is part of why the skill of
>
>According to the invoice they just did adjustments, there are no parts
>mentioned. However on checking the figures for the two tests, which appear
>to be on the same type of machine, the tyre shop are using slightly
>different figures for this model to that used in the BMW test. Not that it
>makes that much difference to the fact almost everything was outside
>tolerance.
the operator is so important.
I'm surprised there was anything to be adjusted if the numbers were that far
out of range.
>The difference is noticeable, rather like changing from Bridgestone tyres to
>Michelin Pilot Sport 3 ones on a non runflat car, a more planted, stuck to
>the road feel. Especially at the back.
this, you didn't really know if you had a measurement issue or a vehicle
issue, and now you know for sure it was really a vehicle issue.
R. Mark Clayton
Jul 11, 2013, 10:29:14 AM7/11/13
to
"Bob Hobden" <Bo...@privacy.net> wrote in message
news:WI2dnbJfurBRckfM...@bt.com...
> "Bob" wrote ...
>>
>>"Scott Dorsey" wrote ...
>>>
>>>Bob wrote:
>>>>
>>>>He considers with the number of F10/11 BMW's he has seen with similar
>>>>problems that there has either been a manufacturing fault** or the
>>>>suspension is not up to UK roads, ie a design fault.
>>>>** The wrong length camber adjustment arm fitted, there are two.
>>>
>>>I don't know, I haven't heard of anything like that in the US. If you
>>>were in the US, I'd suggest you write the bmwcca magazine a letter asking
>>>how many other people had seen these issues. The BMW Car Club of the UK
>>>is similar, though.
>>>
>>>
>>I'll see what BMW say and do first, get it checked and take it from there.
>>Will let you know what happens.
>>
> It went in for a BMW Kinematics Diagnosis System (KDS) and they too found
> camber and toe seriously out on the rear, toe out on the front but the
> camber on both front wheels within tolerance, the tyre shop said only the
> right camber was correct. The BMW garage have adjusted it all and now
> everything is within BMW tolerance (@ £290.53). No-one seems to know what
> has caused the problem and I am assured it isn't a common problem with
> F10/F11 5 Series cars
Dropped from height onto the wharf when unloading
>>
>>"Scott Dorsey" wrote ...
>>>
>>>Bob wrote:
>>>>
>>>>He considers with the number of F10/11 BMW's he has seen with similar
>>>>problems that there has either been a manufacturing fault** or the
>>>>suspension is not up to UK roads, ie a design fault.
>>>>** The wrong length camber adjustment arm fitted, there are two.
>>>
>>>I don't know, I haven't heard of anything like that in the US. If you
>>>were in the US, I'd suggest you write the bmwcca magazine a letter asking
>>>how many other people had seen these issues. The BMW Car Club of the UK
>>>is similar, though.
>>>
>>>
>>I'll see what BMW say and do first, get it checked and take it from there.
>>Will let you know what happens.
>>
> It went in for a BMW Kinematics Diagnosis System (KDS) and they too found
> camber and toe seriously out on the rear, toe out on the front but the
> camber on both front wheels within tolerance, the tyre shop said only the
> right camber was correct. The BMW garage have adjusted it all and now
> everything is within BMW tolerance (@ £290.53). No-one seems to know what
> has caused the problem and I am assured it isn't a common problem with
> F10/F11 5 Series cars
OR
you drove over a hump back bridge too fast...
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