Power amp for a buttkicker concert?
Phildo
Anyone suggest a reliable amp that would be good for this?
Phildo
Phildo
"Phildo" <Ph...@phildo.net> wrote in message news:...
> http://www.thebuttkicker.com/musicians/products/bk_concert.htm
>
> Anyone suggest a reliable amp that would be good for this?
Oh, and I'm not interested in the one on their website as it's not
rack-mountable, a HUGE oversight on their part.
Phildo
George's Pro Sound Co.
> http://www.thebuttkicker.com/musicians/products/bk_concert.htm
>
> Anyone suggest a reliable amp that would be good for this?
>
> Phildo
>
need and a spare channel for a wedge as well
george
JWald
"George's Pro Sound Co." <bm...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:05KdnQk_xvICE2XW...@earthlink.com...
never get satisfactory results. I was feeding it 1200w from one side of an
EP2500 from an aux send of my kick channel. Every time I got it where I felt
it, it was clipping the crap out of the amp. I gave up, but would REALLY
like to use it. What was I doing wrong? Thanks.
--
J Wald
--
"Can't do it Sally"
Tom Hagen
Godfather I
George's Pro Sound Co.
"JWald" <wl...@grics.net> wrote in message
news:htet4...@enews5.newsguy.com...
position and mounting of buttkicker as well as 'musician expectations" all
play into the subjective"where I felt it" point
my buess is your signal into the amp was too hot and turning down the imput
attenuator on the amp would have better matched your "impression" to the
sweet point of the amp
if the "volume " knob is too high you will clip the amp way to early on the
attack of the signal
turn down the amp volume so it only clipped at the absolute peak of the
signal and you would remove the amp from the equation
George
Rupert
> ----
> "George's Pro Sound Co." <bm...@yahoo.com> wrote in messagenews:05KdnQk_xvICE2XW...@earthlink.com...
>
> >news:ht9mrj$f2p$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
> >>http://www.thebuttkicker.com/musicians/products/bk_concert.htm
>
> >> Anyone suggest a reliable amp that would be good for this?
>
> >> Phildo
>
> > why not a ep4000 they are rock solid at 2 ohms, they have the power you
> > need and a spare channel for a wedge as well
> > george
>
> I'm glad this came up. I bought a butt-kicker a few years ago, but could
> never get satisfactory results. I was feeding it 1200w from one side of an
> EP2500 from an aux send of my kick channel. Every time I got it where I felt
> it, it was clipping the crap out of the amp. I gave up, but would REALLY
> like to use it. What was I doing wrong? Thanks.
>
> --
> J Wald
> --
> "Can't do it Sally"
> Tom Hagen
> Godfather I
One thing about 2 ohm stereo/4 ohm bridge loads for low frequency
reproduction, especially with cheap amps, the amps often don't put out
the juice the specs would indicate. It's often far less. I suspect the
amp is really not able to put out the rated power into a 2 ohm load
when reproducing the low frequencies you want. You might find and old
Crest or Crown amp. They weigh a ton, but they're also kings of
driving low impedance, low frequency reproduction loads. A Crest 8001
isn't rated with much more output than the EP2500 (1400 watts into 2
ohms/ch), but it has handily stomped all over cheaper amps rated with
more power per channel - especially in subwoofer applications. In
fact, it will easily outperform these newer Crown XTi amps rated at
double the power. Or even the newer lighter Crest amps of comparable
power that replaced it. A older Crown MA3600VZ would also do a good
job. These amps hold their value though, so expect to pay 2x the price
of the Behringer amps even though they're 10+ years old now.
George's Pro Sound Co.
"Rupert" <foods...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:7d64a3ec-b5f2-4cc5...@k25g2000prh.googlegroups.com...
That is not my experiance, crown amps have held NOTHING except cost over the
behringer of equal power
Crests just freaking physically self destructed (8002's,FA series)
my Powersofts were ultra sensitive to humidity and as such unsuitable for
outdoor road use
the amps that have held up have been QSC and Behringer
This is my experiance, as the owner of over 70 amps in my career, ymmv
George
Krooburg Science
> "Rupert" <foodste...@gmail.com> wrote in message
Yes George, we've all heard your incessant whining about Crest and
Crown amps. The FACT is that of the 20 or so sound companies I've
managed, tech'd, crew chief'd and owned over the last 35 years, the
old school Crest & Crown amps have been VERY reliable and very
powerful. They've held up to some real abuse in hundreds of venues and
tours over DECADES and many of those are still in operation today. And
they likely will be when your Behringers are in scrap heap. And pretty
much every person I know involved in top level tour and installation
over the 3+ decades agrees. So the only conclusion I can draw is YOU
are doing something wrong. Either that or you are the ONLY one who's
right & EVERYONE else is wrong. Is THAT what you're saying George?
Those amps have been an industry standard for a reason you know
George. Recommended by everyone from Meyer to EAW to L'Acoustics when
they were current products because they perform. Only recently has
L'Acoustics moved away from the old Crown MA series and amps to the
newer Camco amps is because they don't make them anymore. And let me
tell you, they kicked some ass on the VDOSC system. Next you'll be
telling everyone that your tired old Meyer MSL3 speakers with the
piezo tweeters are better than anything else out there.
K
George's Pro Sound Co.
"Krooburg Science" <kroo...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:b50ae5de-fc1d-442a...@y18g2000prn.googlegroups.com...
and that was the exact reason I first went to those amps, the sad fact is
they did not cut it.
And
they likely will be when your Behringers are in scrap heap. And pretty
much every person I know involved in top level tour and installation
over the 3+ decades agrees. So the only conclusion I can draw is YOU
are doing something wrong. Either that or you are the ONLY one who's
right & EVERYONE else is wrong. Is THAT what you're saying George?
just telling you what happened , and how if I am going to buy a amp I want
one that is a solid value and has some return on investment before I shit
can it
crowns and crests did not make the grade
QSC and behringer did
Those amps have been an industry standard for a reason you know
George. Recommended by everyone from Meyer to EAW to L'Acoustics when
they were current products because they perform. Only recently has
L'Acoustics moved away from the old Crown MA series and amps to the
newer Camco amps is because they don't make them anymore. And let me
tell you, they kicked some ass on the VDOSC system.
Sorry, marketing hype does not fly with me
I fell for it and learned a hard expensive lesson that I can only trust the
QSC and behringer amps to live long enough to make them worthwhile
I still have a 4000$ pile of junk Powersofts, I have a 275$ pile of junk
behringers
I sold the crest pro series off , after fail upon fail upon fail
I have two McIntosh 2150s that i can stillbeat the snot out of but they were
not packaged to tour
Next you'll be
telling everyone that your tired old Meyer MSL3 speakers with the
piezo tweeters are better than anything else out there.
I do like the msl3 better than the msl3a's I also run
better that any of the line array crap, easily as far as sound goes but
handeling and flying them is a chore I admit
the main adavantage of the crap that is being sold as line arrays is in ease
of use, clearrly not sonicly
I have fallen for the flavor of the week often enough to know crap from
shinola
and as Isaid in my above post
YMMV.
George
K
George's Pro Sound Co.
> managed, tech'd, crew chief'd and owned over the last 35 years,
Wow that is quite a resume you went through 20 sound companies as their
manager, tech ,crew chief or own in 35 years!!!
a new company about every 18 months!!! Quite a feat IMHO
George
Richard Webb
Krooburg Science writes:
> On May 24, 5:54=A0pm, "George's Pro Sound Co." <bm...@yahoo.com>
> wrote:
>> That is not my experiance, crown amps have held NOTHING except cost over =
>> the
>> behringer of equal power
>> Crests just freaking physically self destructed (8002's,FA series)
>> my Powersofts were ultra sensitive to humidity and as such unsuitable for
>> outdoor road use
>> the amps that have held up have been QSC and Behringer
>> This is my experiance, as the owner of over 70 amps in my career, ymmv
> Yes George, we've all heard your incessant whining about Crest and
> Crown amps. The FACT is that of the 20 or so sound companies I've
> managed, tech'd, crew chief'd and owned over the last 35 years, the
> old school Crest & Crown amps have been VERY reliable and very
> powerful. They've held up to some real abuse in hundreds of venues
> and tours over DECADES and many of those are still in operation
> today. And they likely will be when your Behringers are in scrap
> heap. And pretty much every person I know involved in top level tour
> and installation over the 3+ decades agrees. So the only conclusion
> I can draw is YOU are doing something wrong. Either that or you are
> the ONLY one who's right & EVERYONE else is wrong. Is THAT what
> you're saying George?
Note that's the old school Crown and Crest though, and
that's the part George might have overlooked. I've heard
many complaints about newer models of Crest and Crown. That old stuff is still traveling around in road racks for a
reason though.
I"m still using older Crown and QSC in my remote truck. I
haven't seen the need to replace them yet.
Regards,
Richard
... Remote audio in the southland: See www.gatasound.com
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Krooburg Science
I guess the world of touring is something you don't know about George.
You take tech/crew jobs as you can get them be it with companies like
Clair/Showco or smaller outfits like 8th Day. Depending on the year, I
could have worked for as many as 4 companies. It's really not that
many in a 35 year tour of duty. Been all over the world several time
over, loved every minute of it.
K
Krooburg Science
No, he's talking about the older Crest Pro Series. And he's complained
about MacroTech IIRC, probably the best amp Crown ever made.
K
George's Pro Sound Co.
K
Cr3st pro series 8002's and FA series, crown Macrotechs , the original ones
absolute junk IMO, YMMV
George
George's Pro Sound Co.
> Cr3st pro series 8002's and FA series, crown Macrotechs , the original
> ones
> absolute junk IMO, YMMV
> George
Phildo
"Rupert" <foods...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:7d64a3ec-b5f2-4cc5...@k25g2000prh.googlegroups.com...
>One thing about 2 ohm stereo/4 ohm bridge loads for low frequency
>reproduction, especially with cheap amps, the amps often don't put out
>the juice the specs would indicate. It's often far less. I suspect the
>amp is really not able to put out the rated power into a 2 ohm load
>when reproducing the low frequencies you want. You might find and old
>Crest or Crown amp. They weigh a ton, but they're also kings of
>driving low impedance, low frequency reproduction loads. A Crest 8001
>isn't rated with much more output than the EP2500 (1400 watts into 2
>ohms/ch), but it has handily stomped all over cheaper amps rated with
>more power per channel - especially in subwoofer applications. In
>fact, it will easily outperform these newer Crown XTi amps rated at
>double the power. Or even the newer lighter Crest amps of comparable
>power that replaced it. A older Crown MA3600VZ would also do a good
>job. These amps hold their value though, so expect to pay 2x the price
>of the Behringer amps even though they're 10+ years old now.
OK, so what amp available new would best suit my requirements? Drummer is on
IEMs but really wants to feel the kick. Could even go with 2 buttkickers,
one run off each side of the amp. Money is not really an issue although I'm
not expecting to pay �10k on an amp.
Phildo
ps Rupert - is there something wrong with your settings? Your reply never
seems to get recognised as quoted text with the > symbol in front of it. You
are the only poster this happens with so the problem must be at your end. No
biggie, just annoying.
Steve M
> ps Rupert - is there something wrong with your settings? Your reply never
> seems to get recognised as quoted text with the > symbol in front of it.
> You are the only poster this happens with so the problem must be at your
> end. No biggie, just annoying.
I've noticed that many of george's posts exhibit the same.
Besides the fact that too many people on this NG cannot
snip, and quote too much irrelevant text. Which I find even MORE
annoying.
As to amp rec's for a buttkicker...
QSC PLX 2ohm series get you good output at decent cost and only weigh
21 lbs. The 4ohm series weigh in at 14 lbs, I believe.
All else being equal... When it comes to power amps I look at watts per
dollar
and also watts per pound (kg). Nice to keep those racks from being
back-breakers.
--
Steve McQ
Rupert
> OK, so what amp available new would best suit my requirements? Drummer is on
> IEMs but really wants to feel the kick. Could even go with 2 buttkickers,
> one run off each side of the amp. Money is not really an issue although I'm
> not expecting to pay £10k on an amp.
>
If you want something new and lightweight that doesn't cost a fortune,
you might look at the QSC PL3 line. The PL325 is rated at 1250 watts
into 2 ohms per channel at onset of clip. This will give you a bit of
extra headroom to allow some clipping without cooking Kicker. Since
the PL series historically performs well in low frequency
applications, I suspect it's 1200 watts is going to deliver better
punch than cheaper amps. Granted, power is power, but there can be
distinct differences in amp performance though the specs would
indicate the same power. Something about driving real world reactive
loads separates the men from the boys.
>
> ps Rupert - is there something wrong with your settings? Your reply never
> seems to get recognised as quoted text with the > symbol in front of it. You
> are the only poster this happens with so the problem must be at your end. No
> biggie, just annoying.
Unfortunately, I use Google Groups® to do my posting since I'm on
different computers all the time. Therefore I have no control over
what it sends out to usenet readers. FWIW, it auto-quotes fine when I
do my replies. As far as I can tell, there are no settings within the
browser for encoding.
Rupert
linto...@gmail.com
My secret ? No secret really except that none of the amps run into 2 ohm loads. Only 4 ohm loads max.
My monitor rig (while not very large or biamped) is driven passive with Crest 7200s. Once again only into 8 or 4 ohm loads; never anything lower.
