Digital snake for LS9/32
ddf...@gmail.com
I'm not impressed with situation when 40 ch 300' snake trunk is double
size of LS9/32, so I'm thinking of going for digital transport. Good
thing is my amp racks already accept CobraNet (QSC Basis 922az
management). But I've heard that people are more impresed with
Ethersound. Does anybody have some experience with compatibility and
stability issues of either transport platforms? I was thining to
install one EtherSound card to handle 32 inputs and one CobraNet card
for 16 outputs. And then, of course, I'd be happy to control preamps
from console. What would be best/most stable option to arrange this
tranport? What brands / manufacturers are recommended, incl. any
auxilarry equipment i.e. network switches, cables, etc.?
Any help would be highly appreciated, I mean large quantity of
alcoholic beverages if you manage to be somewhere arround :)
Einars
mackerr
> I was thining to
> install one EtherSound card to handle 32 inputs and one CobraNet card
> for 16 outputs. And then, of course, I'd be happy to control preamps
> from console. What would be best/most stable option to arrange this
> tranport? What brands / manufacturers are recommended, incl. any
> auxilarry equipment i.e. network switches, cables, etc.?
>
Each card can only be 16 in and 16 out. With an LS9 you only have 2
slots, so you need 2 EtherSound cards for 32 in and 32 out. You will
have to decide whether you want EtherSound or Cobranet. As far as
preamps, there are not many you can control from the console. The
Yamaha AD8HR is an 8 channel at about $2500 or a little over $300/ch.
The Optocore X6 series is about $5000 for 16 channels, so about the
same. Both have AES out, so need some kind of AES snake. The Roland
proprietary snake system uses a dedicated remote control, and does the
$650/ch Aphex 1788a. All in all a digital snake for an LS9 seems like
the wrong answer.
Mac
Bmoas
Ls9/32
it will allow you to split the desk into a 32 ch house AND a 32
channel monitor
the monitor guy sets the headamps
but you have independent control over all other parameters and efx
george
ddf...@gmail.com
> Once I considered all the options I went with a wireless link to my
> Ls9/32
George, could you give more details about this?
I was thinking of Whirlwind solution, anyone has experience?
Einars
George's ProSound Company
<ddf...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:b22a3fcd-1d22-4564...@56g2000hsm.googlegroups.com...
Einars
The Ls9 has a built in ethernet feature
simply feed itto a wireless router and run yamaha studio manager on your
computer, you need 3 things to run the software, theDME-N driver, the studio
manager software and the ls9 editor, all free at yamaha ls9 downloads web
site
the computer will become a virtual mixer
ok for FoH duty, but Istill want someone with hands on for the desk
my config, that I am still working out
links the channels 1-33, 2-34,3-35 and so on
they only share the head amp
ddf...@gmail.com
wrote:
> The Ls9 has a built in ethernet feature
> simply feed itto a wireless router and run yamaha studio manager on your
> computer, you need 3 things to run the software, theDME-N driver, the studio
> manager software and the ls9 editor, all free at yamaha ls9 downloads web
> site
> the computer will become a virtual mixer
> ok for FoH duty, but Istill want someone with hands on for the desk
> my config, that I am still working out
> links the channels 1-33, 2-34,3-35 and so on
> they only share the head amp
Oooohhhh, I see. No, I think this will be too virtual for me and my
old school engineers. I was looking for an option to have desk in
front of me without rolling 300' of 2 x 24ch pipe. And I think $ 5000
for such a solution is about right amount of money. Multicore (bulk
cable) costs about $25/m (Klotz PL224), 200m is $5000 already, 4 pairs
of 72 pin hartings- another $800, soldering, stageboxes with panel
XLR, desk end pigtails with XLR's - this can go up to about $600 ... $
700, so we're at $6500. Then we need a trunk for this python - another
$300 ... 400.
Einars, will keep on searching
George's ProSound Company
<ddf...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:5786c1fc-31e5-4441...@z72g2000hsb.googlegroups.com...
buy another ls9
maybe a ls9/16 and out fit it to 32 ch
then link them with cat 5
under 4000$ and you would have a second great desk
george
ddf...@gmail.com
wrote:
> buy another ls9
> maybe a ls9/16 and out fit it to 32 ch
> then link them with cat 5
> under 4000$ and you would have a second great desk
> george-
Hmm, that is an interesting approach. So idea is I drop one console on
stage, do a physical connections to it and then have another linked
via Ethernet to control the one on stage? How stable this solution is
and what about latency? Will I have everything accessible like if I
was working with the console on stage?
Einars
George's ProSound Company
<ddf...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:5ccc50b6-da66-4d1f...@56g2000hsm.googlegroups.com...
> On 3 Maijs, 02:10, "George's ProSound Company" <bm...@yahoo.com>
> wrote:
>
>> buy another ls9
>> maybe a ls9/16 and out fit it to 32 ch
>> then link them with cat 5
>> under 4000$ and you would have a second great desk
>> george-
>
> Hmm, that is an interesting approach. So idea is I drop one console on
> stage, do a physical connections to it and then have another linked
> via Ethernet to control the one on stage? How stable this solution is
I would put my full faith and reputation on it.
I have been using digital for close to 10 years now and doubt I will ever
buy another new analouge desk
new technology open up new ways of doing things
the more you understand the less scary it is
> and what about latency?
not a issue with the distances your talking about
I doubt you would be able to discern the small amount of latency
but if you want to assign a number ofmilliseconds to it you need someone
else to quantify that for you
Will I have everything accessible like if I
> was working with the console on stage?
I can't say everything, cause there is a whole bunch of stuff in that desk
I will say 'everything" you would ever need to create a mix
there might be some routings and such you might not have access to
you would need to direct that question to yamaha directly for the
authoritive answer
george
>
> Einars
>
mackerr
I don't think that is what George was saying. I don't think you can
remote control one console from another. With 2 LS9s you would use the
mic pres in the stage desk for both of them, and route all the direct
outs via EtherSound or CobraNet over CAT5 to the FOH desk. All the FOH
mixing would be at FOH. You would have to use some inputs on the stage
desk to get the FOH returns out of it, and if you want to control the
mic pres from FOH it would have to be via computer over another CAT5.
The other alternative is to just have the stage console, and control
it from a computer, either via a wired Ethernet connection or as some
have done, via WiFi. Personally I would not recommend WiFi for a show
critical use.
Mac
George's ProSound Company
"mackerr" <mac...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:3bc81435-6d14-4e43...@f63g2000hsf.googlegroups.com...
On May 2, 7:26 pm, ddf...@gmail.com wrote:
> On 3 Maijs, 02:10, "George's ProSound Company" <bm...@yahoo.com>
> wrote:
>
> Hmm, that is an interesting approach. So idea is I drop one console on
> stage, do a physical connections to it and then have another linked
> via Ethernet to control the one on stage? How stable this solution is
> and what about latency? Will I have everything accessible like if I
> was working with the console on stage?
>
> Einars
I don't think that is what George was saying. I don't think you can
remote control one console from another. With 2 LS9s you would use the
mic pres in the stage desk for both of them, and route all the direct
outs via EtherSound or CobraNet over CAT5 to the FOH desk. All the FOH
mixing would be at FOH.
yes that is what I meant
it would be pointless to set up a second desk , simply to control the sone
at stage
but with two you can send return via cat 5, there by avioding the big copper
tube
personally I have no issues with doing FoH mixing via studiomanager,and for
me , wireless wifi is where I am going, but Istill need a tablet pc before
I can fully commit to that, mixing via a mouselikepainting a house with a 2
inch brush
sure it can be done, but it is no way optimal
as long as my monitor guy is setting head amps
mackerr
wrote:
> "mackerr" <mack...@aol.com> wrote in message
>
> news:3bc81435-6d14-4e43...@f63g2000hsf.googlegroups.com...
> On May 2, 7:26 pm, ddf...@gmail.com wrote:
>
> > On 3 Maijs, 02:10, "George's ProSound Company" <bm...@yahoo.com>
> > wrote:
>
> > Hmm, that is an interesting approach. So idea is I drop one console on
> > stage, do a physical connections to it and then have another linked
> > via Ethernet to control the one on stage? How stable this solution is
> > and what about latency? Will I have everything accessible like if I
> > was working with the console on stage?
>
> > Einars
>
> I don't think that is what George was saying. I don't think you can
> remote control one console from another.
>
and George responded:
> yes that is what I meant
> it would be pointless to set up a second desk , simply to control the sone
> at stage
> but with two you can send return via cat 5, there by avioding the big copper
> tube
> personally I have no issues with doing FoH mixing via studiomanager,and for
> me , wireless wifi is where I am going, but Istill need a tablet pc before
> I can fully commit to that, mixing via a mouselikepainting a house with a 2
> inch brush
> sure it can be done, but it is no way optimal
> as long as my monitor guy is setting head amps
>
George, I don't know how you could have missed the point that I was
explaining to Einars that while you can route all your audio via CAT5,
the FOH mixing would either have to take place in the FOH mixer, OR
you would have to use a computer to remote control the stage console.
You cannot remote control an LS9 from another LS9 AFAIK. I have not
used an LS9, so if I am wrong about the remote control thing, feel
free to correct me. In my experience, the only Yamaha digital console
that can be operated from a different control surface is the PM1D,
which can be controlled by a DM2000 or DM1000.
Mac
ddf...@gmail.com
> .... you can route all your audio via CAT5,
> the FOH mixing would either have to take place in the FOH mixer, OR
> you would have to use a computer to remote control the stage console.
> You cannot remote control an LS9 from another LS9 AFAIK.
Well, this is what I was saying - the default ETH port is to run PC
application not to send audio over - I think. For sending audio I need
expansion card (EtherSound or CobraNet) and interface in other end.
I'll contact someone from Yamaha techs and get everything clear.
Einars
mackerr
>
>
> Well, this is what I was saying - the default ETH port is to run PC
> application not to send audio over - I think. For sending audio I need
> expansion card (EtherSound or CobraNet) and interface in other end.
> I'll contact someone from Yamaha techs and get everything clear.
>
> Einars
Yes, the built in Ethernet port does not transport audio. To send 32
channels of audio back and forth you would need 2 cards in each
console. They could be EtherSound, CobraNet, Optocore, Aviom64,
RocknNet, or probably some I've forgotten, but each card can only send
and receive 16 channels.
Mac
bob urz
DeYoung. Two VI-6's came off the truck (very neat little package)
We ran two cat five's from stage rack to FOH. At a casual look, here
were guys doing this sharing digitally and running cat Five FOH.
Well, all was not as it seemed. It was cat 5 to FOH all right, but they
did a passive split at monitor position with a separate stage rack for
both the FOH and MOnitor VI6. They seemed to think this way they could
both trim the gains and not have to fight over who has control of the
pre's. Fact or fantasy, that's what these guys thought.
Bob