Eating The Planet Like A Bag Of Doritos For Jesus

7 views
Skip to first unread message

H2-PV, PV-H2

unread,
Dec 23, 2006, 6:15:32 AM12/23/06
to
Eating The Planet Like A Bag Of Doritos For Jesus
Friday, 22 December 2006, 10:17 am
Opinion: Phil Rockstroh
Expanding markets and dying oceans: Eating the planet like a bag of
Doritos for Jesus.

By Phil Rockstroh
Online Journal Contributing Writer
Dec 21, 2006, 00:38

"Standing next to me in this lonely crowd,
Is a man who swears he's not to blame."
--Bob Dylan

It has been reported that George W. Bush is counting on the judgment of
history to redeem the perception that he has been at the helm of a
failed presidency. This notion is as muttering-at-the-wallpaper crazy
as had Jeffery Dahmer, before his murder, been expecting gourmet chefs
to someday champion his culinary choices. In the present day United
States, our insulated leaders (who merely reflect the insularity of the
daily lives of the nation's people) have shunned reality to such a
degree, one would think that they spend their time writing wishful
letters to Santa Claus instead of creating policy and law.

There's a well-known witticism from the 1980s about Ronald Reagan that
played-off a ubiquitous television commercial of the time that went,
"Ronald Reagan is not the president: He just plays one on TV." A
similar trope can be said of the present-day United States. We're no
longer an empire: We just resemble one on TV.

How did it come to be that our ability to apprehend reality is in such
short supply, at a time when the consequences of such dangerous folly
will prove so tragic and lasting?

At times, in equal degree to the enormity of a given situation, there
will come to exist an equal degree of denial. If you ever have the
desire for a bit of solitude when attending a social function, try
this. Drop the small talk and utter something along the lines of: "Our
actions are causing ongoing and exponentially increasing upheaval in
the earth's ecosystem, due to the effects of global warming." Or: "Did
you know that the earth's oceans and seas will be all but devoid of
life in fifty years?" Then there's the always reliable: "Because of our
national dependency on the crack-house economics of a system based on a
need for an ever-increasing squandering of our planet's finite
resources (maintained by a cross-addiction to a global marketplace
sustained by petroleum)-all of which has been inflicted on the planet
by a class of hyper-rich, psychotic death monkeys-you have no more
control over your fate than some scrawny, brown-skinned feller strapped
to a torture table at Guantánamo."
ADVERTISEMENT

As stated, if you give it a go, you'll be afforded an abundance of
personal space. Such utterances have the terrible disadvantage of being
the truth; as such, they're guaranteed room-clearers. The largest
social faux pas of all, in the contemporary US, might be to remind
people of their powerlessness.

Understandably, we avoid the knowledge of those things that inflict
upon us the feelings of powerlessness we experience when secured in a
dentist's chair. In such circmstances, the only question we're
concerned with is: Will there be enough anesthetizing agents available
to numb out the anxiety and pain? Perhaps this is what underpins the
reason we have become a people who've grown incurious of the larger
world around us to point of becoming all but insensate: We need the
equivalent of a root canal on a global-wide basis. Worse, the drilling
must start at the epicenter of the decay, right here in the United
States.

Accordingly, there are a few facts it is imperative we face,
immediately and unmedicated. Among them: The changes to the earth
ecosystem wrought by global warming are neither a political opinion nor
the acts of a wrathful god in heaven, but are a dynamic of nature set
in motion by our actions-and are wholly indifferent to the fate of
mankind.

The capitalist's drive for endless abundance has allowed us to ascend
the fast-food chain, yet we blink uncomprehendingly at the catastrophic
algorithms of global climate change. We-the progeny of global
corporatism-in regard to our acknowledgment of the dire events and
pressing issues of our time, our sense of collective narrative is, for
all practical purposes, about as keen as that of the creatures of the
Cretaceous Period in regard to their understanding of the
earth-altering implications of planetary collisions with comets. The
size of our denial is as enormous as the body of a brachiosaurus and
our response to the dire situation has been about as adequate as if we
were using its walnut-sized brain.

Furthermore, we are the comet. We are both the threatened, dominate
species-as well as the comet of destruction that will end this Empire
of Endless Burgers and Ceaseless Bullshit. Our delusions of the
sustainability of ever-expanding market-based economies, wholly
dependent upon a never-wavering abundance of resources, has rendered us
as inflexible as the dinosaurs were before a global-wide, sky-occluding
dust cloud. We're devouring the life-sustaining resources of the earth
as if it were a bag of Doritos. Our empty appetites, engendered by
global corporatism and its reliance on fossil fuels, is leveling an
effect upon our world tantamount to a slow-motion collision with a
comet.

To survive, we must curb our appetite for this everyday menu of
death-for these Valueless Meals comprised of the empty calories of
comforting lies proffered by the corporate state.

The present paradigm must (and will) collapse: Rising gross national
products, imaginative ad campaigns and faith in some mythological being
returning from the sky will not cause the earth's rising oceans to
recede nor its melting Polar ice caps to reconstitute. Our advertising
and public relations evangelists here in the Empire of Endless Burgers
cannot convert the forces of extinction to marketplace pieties with new
advertising slogans. Our redeemer gods of product placement cannot
provide our dying culture with longer shelf life. Belief in these gods
of the mall and empyrean may have banished doubt and diffidence-yet
these myths cannot shelter us from the anonymous fury of the
exponential mathematics of global systems shifted into entropic
runaway.

All in all, our belief in economic providence has proven our
undoing-our insistence on its very existence left us mistaking a full
stomach for a leveling portion of divine grace. Our gods of commerce
offered drive-thru-window epiphanies. We believed our prayers would
always be answered: Instantly-came the high priests of the consumer
state's homilies of perpetual gratification-their voices crackling
like a burning bush from the drive-thru order-box.

But now: Overcooked in arrogance and oil: The Empire of Endless Burgers
is char: Stick a fork in it-it's overdone. As our delusions bake to
ash, what shall we cry into the gathering darkness? Can our pleas be
heard over the thunderous machinery of the encompassing void? What if
the realization came that our most sacrosanct beliefs-both economic
and epistemological-were but a musky collection of antiquated myths?
To survive, our blind-faith-based suppositions must not be flattered by
political opportunists (I'm looking at you, Hillary and Obama)-but
allowed to rot into compost, then be buried. Because deep down, we
already realize our allegiances to the imaginary gods and saviors of
long-dead, desert tribalists not only blind us to the dangers at hand
but in large measure helped to contribute to our troubles in the first
place.

Ergo, It's a fact: Jesus will not descend and heal the earth's dying
seas. We might as well hold out for Little Folk, adorned with gossamer
wings, to appear from the gnome-haunted air and sprinkle Fairy Dust
upon it. Furthermore, there are no Chosen People-nor does there exist
an Omnipotent Sky Daddy above who could give a rodent's rectum about
the oil-soaked real estate of the Middle East nor any other plot of
disputed ground on this cosmological backwater of a planet.

It's time to wake up and smell the mythology. God has no will. God has
no more of a plan than a tree has a financial portfolio. God does not
say God bless you: Your life is not an eternal sneeze in need of a
perpetual gesundheit. And there never was a character who rose from
this sin-sullied earth and took up residence in the starry filament
named Jesus Christ-who will love you no matter how big of an asshole
you are: That's the job of your dog.

Perhaps such shocks to the system might rouse us from that narcissistic
swoon called "my faith," might shatter our perennial delusions that God
desires for us to conquer and kill in his name, and might deliver us to
the true Promised Land-the one that exists just beyond the limited
sight-line of our systems of belief. And might banish the empty mythos
of instant gratification-the guiding god of global capitalism-which
is the force (in a toxic, paradoxical mixture with sexual repression)
that begot the fantasies of contemporary Christian Fundamentalism.

In essence, what is the Christian fundamentalist belief in the
so-called End Time, but a worldview that reduces mythic reality to
channel surfing? One moment you're watching the Armageddon Channel,
then you click the remote and you're in eternal RaptureLand. Then you
click over to the Fundie Porn Channel to view fantasies involving the
instantaneous shedding of your clothes, next you're being ejaculated
from your body to engage in a celestial orgy with Jesus-whereas all
of life on earth climaxes with a cosmic money shot involving you and
your fellow Christian's immortal souls being splattered upon the face
of God.

If it were possible for their myths to be made manifest, and Christ did
return, not only would he make a War on Christmas-but also on the
death-lusting delusions of Christianity itself.

What can lead people to such belief systems? To understand, one must
look at the poetic metaphors that are literalized into religious faith.
Place, landscape, situation, and the mythos of a people are
inextricably bound. When I was a child growing up in the Deep South, on
the occasion of fishing expeditions and such, I would have contact with
rural African American farmers who still lived by the agrarian rhythms
of the nineteenth century. We would sit on wooden porches, snapping
string beans, and I would listen as they quoted scripture. Like their
life-sustaining crops, the figure of Christ was born of humble
beginnings (a mere seed) and grew beneath the hot sun, but, at the
height of maturity, was cut down, sacrificed to sustain their lives;
and then, like the figure of Christ, resurrected as next year's seed
crop. These tales held resonance for them because they were suffused
with a metaphoric analog of the criteria that they lived every day; the
metaphors resounded with the verities of place and circumstance. Hence,
Jesus was as real to them as the snap beans beneath their fingertips.

And this is why megachurch Christians and present day conservatives
long for the release of death. When passion, intimacy and hope are
thwarted by pervasive feelings of powerlessness, people will long for
release into paradise. Life lived under corporate hegemony is a cage:
one that distorts the human animal's instinctual longing for love,
communal acceptance and freedom by providing commercial facsimiles of
those things-and, as a result, delivers the human animal to economic
imprisonment. The bars of the cage might be invisible-yet the sense
of confinement is palpable across our utterly commodified culture,
where, like convicts in the cell, longing for release, Christian
fundies long for the aforementioned carnal video game of
RaptureLand-while consumers, confined in their work stations and
shackled by debt, long for vacations, enormous motor vehicles, porn,
and, paradoxically, yet more imprisoning consumer goods....as George W.
Bush longs for his own idealized reflection to be mirrored by the
judgment of history. And we, to paraphrase a Bob Dylan song, shall be
released-just not in the manner in which we pine.

As recent history has shown, insularity is a chaos generator; closed
systems decay at exponentially increasing rates; hubris brings the
fall. Sometimes, as a means of escaping the confinement of one's own
life-diminishing, self-proclaimed "morality," an individual (or even a
culture) will court destruction. (You may insert the name of the
disgraced, hypocritical Christian moralist of the moment here.) Carl
Jung asked the question: Why would the story line of the Christian myth
of Christ place the birth of the savior of the vast cosmos in the
remote hinterlands of the ruling Roman empire, plus have that divine
birth take place in the hinterlands of those hinterlands, plus have the
birth take place on the floor of a barn, no less, amid the animal shit?
Jung answered that the human ego, as is the case with an overgrown,
corrupt empire, will cast out what it cannot exploit and subdue.

This is why every age presents us with an imperial occupation of the
mind. Yet, in our era, the stakes could not be higher. From the
deathscape we've made of the city of Baghdad, to the dying oceans of
the earth-beneath our arrogance and carelessness lies a culture in
suicidal despair. Contemporary Christians may call it faith, neocons
may call it freedom, and corporatists might call it market values --
but it smells like death.

There are occasions when all other means have failed and circumstances
have grown so desperate that one, against all habit and will, is driven
to face the truth. Where I was raised, such a situation is called a
"come-to-Jesus moment." Paradoxically, the come-to-Jesus moment we must
embrace is: There is no Jesus to come to-only a host of unnerving
facts we have banished to the hinterlands of our minds. There will be
no star blazing in the eastern sky to guide us; no divine child
vouchsafed in a boondocks manger to genuflect before. All we can hope
to gain is the opportunity for renewal that flickers to life from
ending the long, forced exile of truth.

*************

Phil Rockstroh, a self-described auto-didactic, gasbag monologist, is a
poet, lyricist and philosopher bard living in New York City. He may be
contacted at: philangie2000 @ yahoo.com.

JFH

unread,
Dec 27, 2006, 6:39:35 AM12/27/06
to
What is wrong with Global Warming? If we could get several hundred feet of
rising water millions of people would drown, economies would crash,
factories would stop producing and Mother Earth would go back to "normal"
and the surviving humans would go back to the "Root, Hog or Die" method of
survival.

Being a hater, you should have no problem with this.

JFH


"H2-PV, PV-H2" <f...@h2-pv.us> wrote in message
news:1166872532.6...@f1g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...

Joseph Hertzlinger

unread,
Jan 15, 2007, 2:01:53 AM1/15/07
to
On 23 Dec 2006 03:15:32 -0800, H2-PV, PV-H2 <f...@h2-pv.us> wrote:

> At times, in equal degree to the enormity of a given situation, there
> will come to exist an equal degree of denial. If you ever have the
> desire for a bit of solitude when attending a social function, try
> this. Drop the small talk and utter something along the lines of: "Our
> actions are causing ongoing and exponentially increasing upheaval in
> the earth's ecosystem, due to the effects of global warming."

When are we hanging the anti-nuclear activists?

> Or: "Did
> you know that the earth's oceans and seas will be all but devoid of
> life in fifty years?" Then there's the always reliable: "Because of our
> national dependency on the crack-house economics of a system based on a
> need for an ever-increasing squandering of our planet's finite
> resources (maintained by a cross-addiction to a global marketplace
> sustained by petroleum)-all of which has been inflicted on the planet
> by a class of hyper-rich, psychotic death monkeys-you have no more
> control over your fate than some scrawny, brown-skinned feller strapped
> to a torture table at Guantánamo."

The "resources" of the Dirt aren't used up. The atoms are still there.

> Phil Rockstroh, a self-described auto-didactic, gasbag monologist, is a
> poet, lyricist and philosopher bard living in New York City. He may be
> contacted at: philangie2000 @ yahoo.com.

Why are the most hysterical environmentalists always non-scientists?

--
http://hertzlinger.blogspot.com

H2-PV, PV-H2

unread,
Jan 15, 2007, 2:10:36 AM1/15/07
to
Exxon Surrenders but Joseph Hertzlinger keeps sucking their dead dick:
Exxon said "Greenhouse gas emissions are one of the factors that
contribute to climate change...

Joseph Hertzlinger wrote:
> On 23 Dec 2006 03:15:32 -0800, H2-PV, PV-H2 <f...@h2-pv.us> wrote:
>
> > At times, in equal degree to the enormity of a given situation, there
> > will come to exist an equal degree of denial. If you ever have the
> > desire for a bit of solitude when attending a social function, try
> > this. Drop the small talk and utter something along the lines of: "Our
> > actions are causing ongoing and exponentially increasing upheaval in
> > the earth's ecosystem, due to the effects of global warming."
>
> When are we hanging the anti-nuclear activists?

You and what army, lardass?


>
> > Or: "Did
> > you know that the earth's oceans and seas will be all but devoid of
> > life in fifty years?" Then there's the always reliable: "Because of our
> > national dependency on the crack-house economics of a system based on a
> > need for an ever-increasing squandering of our planet's finite
> > resources (maintained by a cross-addiction to a global marketplace
> > sustained by petroleum)-all of which has been inflicted on the planet
> > by a class of hyper-rich, psychotic death monkeys-you have no more
> > control over your fate than some scrawny, brown-skinned feller strapped
> > to a torture table at Guantánamo."
>
> The "resources" of the Dirt aren't used up. The atoms are still there.
>
> > Phil Rockstroh, a self-described auto-didactic, gasbag monologist, is a
> > poet, lyricist and philosopher bard living in New York City. He may be
> > contacted at: philangie2000 @ yahoo.com.
>
> Why are the most hysterical environmentalists always non-scientists?

Why do you suck Exxon's Dick? Oh, because you mistook it for
Halliburton's Dick. OK, nevermind. That makes perfect sense seeing you
like nuke constructor's no-bid contracts.

Joseph Hertzlinger

unread,
Jan 16, 2007, 1:15:56 AM1/16/07
to
On 14 Jan 2007 23:10:36 -0800, H2-PV, PV-H2 <f...@h2-pv.us> wrote:

> Exxon Surrenders but Joseph Hertzlinger keeps sucking their dead dick:

Ooooh! Ooooh! Ooooh! Ooooh! He used a four-letter Anglo-Saxon w*rd
while arguing with one of us conservatives!

I'm melting, melting....

Set seriousness bit to ON. Is the above attitude the reason parts
of the Left use pointless foul language? Do they think of vulgar
terms for body parts as part of an exorcism ritual?

That might explain nude protests as well...

> Exxon said "Greenhouse gas emissions are one of the factors that
> contribute to climate change...

Yes? And?

Doesn't that imply we need more nukes than ever?

> Joseph Hertzlinger wrote:

>> When are we hanging the anti-nuclear activists?
>
> You and what army, lardass?

Do you really think you're going to have a pro-environmentalist
military coup?

>> Why are the most hysterical environmentalists always non-scientists?
>
> Why do you suck Exxon's Dick? Oh, because you mistook it for
> Halliburton's Dick. OK, nevermind. That makes perfect sense seeing you
> like nuke constructor's no-bid contracts.

I'm waiting for a real argument.

"I came here for an argument and all I get is abuse!" --- Monty Python

--
http://hertzlinger.blogspot.com

RepigglyKKKlan Sewer Rat Plinker

unread,
Jan 16, 2007, 3:40:50 AM1/16/07
to

Joseph Hertzlinger wrote:
> > Why do you suck Exxon's Dick? Oh, because you mistook it for
> > Halliburton's Dick. OK, nevermind. That makes perfect sense seeing you
> > like nuke constructor's no-bid contracts.
>
> I'm waiting for a real argument.
>
> "I came here for an argument and all I get is abuse!" --- Monty Python
>
> --
> http://hertzlinger.blogspot.com

You regurgitate your food and eat it, you anatomically incorrect sick
minded penile colonist who smells like the imperialist chicken molester
and the lewd snob.

When god was handing out personalities, you must have been holding the
door. You're so boring, even a boomerang wouldn't come back to you. You
are nastier than a five-dollar whore getting a shit enema. You're a
waste of time, space, air, flesh, and the rectum you were born from,
retard. Maybe you wouldn't read like such a pathetic loser if you had
enough brains to find water after falling down a well; if your weren't
so fat that when you run, you make the CD player skip at the radio
station, or if you didn't have a face that makes Medusa look like a
supermodel. No, come to think of it, you would.

If you called the Suicide Hotline, they'd say: "Go ahead. Do it!" Maybe
you wouldn't be such a Jerk-In-The-Box if your father didn't screw a
plant and raised a blooming idiot; if your weren't so fat that you make
sumo wrestlers look anorexic, or if you didn't have a face like a
bulldog chewing a stinging nettle while taking a constipated dump in a
heat wave. Nah, of course you would.

Just when I think I've read the stupidest post ever, you go and post
another. Try learning elementary grammar before attempting to inflict
your next literary abomination on this message board.

I don't know what makes you such a worthless poster, but it really
works! Clearly, the full area of your ignorance is not yet mapped. We
are presently only exploring the fringes of that vast expanse. Reading
your post makes blindness a wonderful thing to look forward to. To
quote Thomas Brackett Reed: "They never open their mouths without
subtracting from the sum of human knowledge."

You are about as entertaining as a child's inflatable punching toy. You
bop it, it springs back, you bop it again and you forget it ever
existed. It slowly deflates in an unused corner, then one day you throw
it away. You are validating my inherent mistrust of strangers. Maybe
you wouldn't come across as such a jellyfish-sucking mental midget if
that pimple on your ass hadn't turned out to be a brain tumor; if your
weren't so fat that all the restaurants in town have signs that say:
"Maximum Occupancy: 80 Patrons OR You.", or if you didn't have a face
so ugly that even your mother didn't know which end to put the diaper
on. Who am I kidding? You would.


I notice that you never let an idea interrupt the flow of your posts. I
understand what you are trying to say, even though you obviously don't.
Have you ever noticed that whenever you sit behind a keyboard, some
idiot starts typing? To quote Martin Luther King, Jr.: "Nothing in the
world is more dangerous than a sincere ignorance and conscientious
stupidity."

If that post was intended as a joke, you forgot to include the punch
line. Why don't you close your mouth before someone sticks an apple in
it? Maybe you wouldn't come across as such a jellyfish-sucking mental
midget if you weren't intellectually slower than a herd of turtles
stampeding through a vat of chunky peanut butter; if your weren't so
fat that your cereal bowl has its own lifeguard, or if you didn't have
a face like a boiled Octopus. No, come to think of it, you would.

Joseph Hertzlinger

unread,
Jan 17, 2007, 1:58:12 AM1/17/07
to
On 16 Jan 2007 00:40:50 -0800, RepigglyKKKlan Sewer Rat Plinker
<Weasle_...@h2-pv.us> wrote:

[snipped]

Ah. You're a bot.

--
http://hertzlinger.blogspot.com

Saddam's Rope, Exxon's Neck

unread,
Jan 17, 2007, 2:12:03 AM1/17/07
to
You are a lamentably obtuse peon and a ludicrous, soul-destroying
quibbling querulous quidnunc.

VistaJustWorks

unread,
Mar 1, 2007, 11:08:57 PM3/1/07
to

"Joseph Hertzlinger" <jcyclespersec...@nine.reticulatedcom.com>
wrote

> When are we hanging the anti-nuclear activists?

After the Chornobyl cleanup is complete and radiation levels are normal.

How many thousands of years hence do you project that to be?

"Joseph Hertzlinger" <jcyclespersec...@nine.reticulatedcom.com>
wrote


> Why are the most hysterical environmentalists always non-scientists?

Why is it that science is always on the side of Environmentalists?


Joseph Hertzlinger

unread,
Mar 11, 2007, 5:09:41 AM3/11/07
to
On Thu, 1 Mar 2007 20:08:57 -0800, VistaJustWorks
<BushIsA...@hotmail.com> wrote:

> "Joseph Hertzlinger" <jcyclespersec...@nine.reticulatedcom.com>
> wrote
>> When are we hanging the anti-nuclear activists?
>
> After the Chornobyl cleanup is complete and radiation levels are normal.
>
> How many thousands of years hence do you project that to be?

Radiation levels are already at acceptable levels in most of the area.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/4216102.stm

In related news, people are returning to Love Canal and the US might
soon have a military base in Vietnam. (If we do Arnold Schwarzenegger
can give the welcoming speech.)

> "Joseph Hertzlinger" <jcyclespersec...@nine.reticulatedcom.com>
> wrote
>> Why are the most hysterical environmentalists always non-scientists?
>
> Why is it that science is always on the side of Environmentalists?

Why is the sky green?

--
http://hertzlinger.blogspot.com

Vendicar Decarian

unread,
Mar 10, 2007, 7:18:35 AM3/10/07
to

VistaJustWorks <BushIsA...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>> How many thousands of years hence do you project that to be?


"Joseph Hertzlinger" wrote:
> Radiation levels are already at acceptable levels in most of the area.
> http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/4216102.stm

Acceptable to whom?

How about in the sarcophagus?


"Joseph Hertzlinger" wrote:
> In related news, people are returning to Love Canal and the US might
> soon have a military base in Vietnam.

Excellent. More AmeriKKKan military targets.

Joseph Hertzlinger

unread,
Mar 11, 2007, 5:28:56 AM3/11/07
to
On Sat, 10 Mar 2007 04:18:35 -0800, Vendicar Decarian
<BushIsA...@hotmail.com> wrote:

> VistaJustWorks <BushIsA...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>> How many thousands of years hence do you project that to be?
>
>
> "Joseph Hertzlinger" wrote:
>> Radiation levels are already at acceptable levels in most of the area.
>> http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/4216102.stm
>
> Acceptable to whom?
>
> How about in the sarcophagus?

In view of the fact that people in the Rocky Mountain area ("where the
scenery's attractive and the air is radioactive") have lower cancer
mortality rates, Chernobyl's radioactivity may be saving lives.

> "Joseph Hertzlinger" wrote:
>> In related news, people are returning to Love Canal and the US might
>> soon have a military base in Vietnam.
>
> Excellent. More AmeriKKKan military targets.

The Klan was, of course, an indigenous terrorist resistance movement.

The Yankee occupation of Dixie was a case of classic imperialism.
Capitalist civilization went forth and crushed a world view opposed to
tolerance and free speech (e.g., the "gag" rule). The d@mn Yankees
used state terrorism (Sherman's march to the sea), which set off a
"cycle of violence" in the form of the KKK and Jesse James (who
started out as a pro-slavery terrorist). There were even Yankee
settlements on Dixie soil. Dubya himself is a second-generation
settler.

--
http://hertzlinger.blogspot.com

Vendicar Decarian

unread,
Mar 10, 2007, 11:45:38 AM3/10/07
to

>> Acceptable to whom?
>>
>> How about in the sarcophagus?

"Joseph Hertzlinger" <jcyclespersec...@nine.reticulatedcom.com>
wrote


> In view of the fact that people in the Rocky Mountain area ("where the
> scenery's attractive and the air is radioactive") have lower cancer
> mortality rates, Chernobyl's radioactivity may be saving lives.

Bullshit.

Answer the questions put to you. Turd.


"Joseph Hertzlinger" <jcyclespersec...@nine.reticulatedcom.com>
wrote


> The Klan was, of course, an indigenous terrorist resistance movement.

Quite the contrary, the Klan was an indigenous terrorist organization.

Pigs, every last one of them.

Joseph Hertzlinger

unread,
Mar 11, 2007, 12:55:08 PM3/11/07
to
On Sat, 10 Mar 2007 08:45:38 -0800, Vendicar Decarian
<BushIsA...@hotmail.com> wrote:

>>> Acceptable to whom?
>>>
>>> How about in the sarcophagus?
>
> "Joseph Hertzlinger" <jcyclespersec...@nine.reticulatedcom.com>
> wrote
>> In view of the fact that people in the Rocky Mountain area ("where the
>> scenery's attractive and the air is radioactive") have lower cancer
>> mortality rates, Chernobyl's radioactivity may be saving lives.
>
> Bullshit.
>
> Answer the questions put to you. Turd.

You're comparing me to organic fertilizer? I suppose that's a
compliment on your planet.

To answer the question: The radiation levels are acceptable to people
whose lives might be saved by hormesis.

> "Joseph Hertzlinger" <jcyclespersec...@nine.reticulatedcom.com>
> wrote
>> The Klan was, of course, an indigenous terrorist resistance movement.
>
> Quite the contrary, the Klan was an indigenous terrorist organization.
>
> Pigs, every last one of them.

Aren't many resistance movements composed of chauvinists?

--
http://hertzlinger.blogspot.com

Vendicar Decarian

unread,
Mar 10, 2007, 5:39:28 PM3/10/07
to

"Joseph Hertzlinger" <jcyclespersec...@nine.reticulatedcom.com>
wrote

> To answer the question: The radiation levels are acceptable to people
> whose lives might be saved by hormesis.

There is no such thing. Only a Piece of Garbage.would excuse the
irradiation of the public by nuclear waste based on a handfull of
contradictory studies and an well developed need to distort the facts in
order to justify their own petty personal ideologies.

The tobacco industry, for a time, claimed that smoking was healthy as
well.

What is needed is a little experimentation of course.

I propose that some large city in Texas be be destroyed by a nuclear
weapon, and that the survivors in the city and down wind be monitored for
the next 50 years to see if they live longer than expected.

If they do, then we will have another round of more precise lab
experiments in which several hundred AmeriKKKan identical twins are
separated at birth and one chronically irradiated for life while the other
kept out of the previous nuclear blast zone, and after 90 years their life
expectancies compared.

Should the second study find that there is a homeosis effect, then I will
give the AmeriKKKan Public the chance to vote on weather they wish to spend
their lives being irradiated by nuclear waste, or if they would prefer not
to.

I will abide by their decision, approximately 110 years from now.

I take it that since you already hold that eating nuclear waste is good
for you, that you have no objections to the plan?

"Joseph Hertzlinger" wrote


> Aren't many resistance movements composed of chauvinists?

I recognize that there is a difference between resistance to military
occupation, slavery, torture, execution and destruction, and the "crime" of
racial desegregation. And I laugh at the thought that the intellectually
inferior would foam at the mouth for the purpose of keeping their
intellectual and genetic inferiority pure.

The Klan was an indigenous terrorist organization.

Joseph Hertzlinger

unread,
Mar 11, 2007, 6:15:25 PM3/11/07
to
On Sat, 10 Mar 2007 14:39:28 -0800, Vendicar Decarian
<BushIsA...@hotmail.com> wrote:

> "Joseph Hertzlinger" <jcyclespersec...@nine.reticulatedcom.com>
> wrote
>> To answer the question: The radiation levels are acceptable to people
>> whose lives might be saved by hormesis.
>
> There is no such thing. Only a Piece of Garbage.would excuse the
> irradiation of the public by nuclear waste based on a handfull of
> contradictory studies and an well developed need to distort the facts in
> order to justify their own petty personal ideologies.
>
> The tobacco industry, for a time, claimed that smoking was healthy as
> well.

Source? Date?

> What is needed is a little experimentation of course.

It's been done.
http://www.jpands.org/vol9no1/chen.pdf

> I propose that some large city in Texas be be destroyed by a nuclear
> weapon, and that the survivors in the city and down wind be monitored for
> the next 50 years to see if they live longer than expected.
>
> If they do, then we will have another round of more precise lab
> experiments in which several hundred AmeriKKKan identical twins are
> separated at birth and one chronically irradiated for life while the other
> kept out of the previous nuclear blast zone, and after 90 years their life
> expectancies compared.

Should we ask for a similar amount of evidence about the possible
crisis of being cursed by witches?

Demands for evidence can be taken too far.
http://www.bmj.com/cgi/content/full/327/7429/1459

> Should the second study find that there is a homeosis effect, then I will
> give the AmeriKKKan Public the chance to vote on weather they wish to spend
> their lives being irradiated by nuclear waste, or if they would prefer not
> to.
>
> I will abide by their decision, approximately 110 years from now.

I'm reminded of the rhetoric of anti-immigration activists.

> I take it that since you already hold that eating nuclear waste is good
> for you, that you have no objections to the plan?
>
>
>
> "Joseph Hertzlinger" wrote
>> Aren't many resistance movements composed of chauvinists?
>
> I recognize that there is a difference between resistance to military
> occupation, slavery, torture, execution and destruction, and the "crime" of
> racial desegregation. And I laugh at the thought that the intellectually
> inferior would foam at the mouth for the purpose of keeping their
> intellectual and genetic inferiority pure.
>
> The Klan was an indigenous terrorist organization.
> Pigs, every last one of them.

Today's terrorist movements are usually concerned with keeping the
"wrong" people from moving into their neighborhood. What do you think
Hamas's goals are?

--
http://hertzlinger.blogspot.com

Vendicar Decarian

unread,
Mar 10, 2007, 9:50:47 PM3/10/07
to

>> The tobacco industry, for a time, claimed that smoking was healthy as
>> well.


"Joseph Hertzlinger" <jcyclespersec...@nine.reticulatedcom.com>
wrote
> Source? Date?

1940's to 1950's tobacco advertising campaigns.

Vendicar Decarian

unread,
Mar 10, 2007, 10:12:31 PM3/10/07
to

> On Sat, 10 Mar 2007 14:39:28 -0800, Vendicar Decarian
>> What is needed is a little experimentation of course.


"Joseph Hertzlinger" <jcyclespersec...@nine.reticulatedcom.com>
wrote in

"Based on the observed 7 cancer deaths, the cancer
mortality rate for this population was assessed to be 3.5 per
100,000 person-years. Three children were born with congenital
heart malformations, indicating a prevalence rate of 1.5 cases per
1,000 children under age 19."

Sorry, 7 is not a statistically significant sample size.


RADIATION RISKS AND LINEARITY: SOUND SCIENCE?
- Kenneth L. Mossman - Arizona State University -

It has been suggested that low doses of ionizing radiation may be
beneficial (hormesis). A large number of cell, animal and human
studies suggest that DNA repair, enhancement of immune function, and
other stimulatory effects may reduce the radiogenic and natural
incidence of disease (Luckey, 1991 ). Proponents of hormesis have
argued that conventional risk estimates, based on the LNT theory, may
be overstated because no allowance have been made for potential
beneficial effects of radiation at low dose which may reduce risk.

Radiation hormesis remains controversial. Luckey cites over 1000
literature references documenting radiation hormesis in the context of
growth and development, reproductive capacity, immunity, cancer, and
lifespan (Luckey 1991). UNSCEAR (1994) acknowledged radiation induced
repair as an important cellular phenomenon, but found little evidence
that cellular adaptive responsiveness and other forms of repair could
convey beneficial effects to the organism that would outweigh
potential harmful effects.

Demonstration of hormetic effects is a formidable task and hinges on
the establishment of a causal relation between dose and beneficial
effect. Evidence for causality should include demonstration of a
strong statistical association, reproducibility of results,
dose-response, and biological plausibility. Spontaneous incidence of
disease can vary widely in human populations and studies involving an
unusually high spontaneous incidence of disease may be misinterpreted
as a hormetic effect. Hormetic effects at low dose may be difficult to
demonstrate with statistical significance because of the large
background incidence of disease (especially cancer). Accordingly,
because of the paucity of statistically significant data in the low
dose region, it may not be possible to distinguish an hormetic
response from other biologically plausible dose-response curves.

...

The New England Journal of Medicine
Feb. 14, 1991 - HEALTH EFFECTS OF EXPOSURE TO LOW LEVELS OF
IONIZING RADIATION:

...

Some of Gotman's major conclusions about the induction of
cancer from low-level ionizing radiation are that (1) there are
adequate human epidemiologic data on the effects of radiation at
low doses to quantify risks directly at those dose levels, without
extrapolating from studies of high doses; (2) there is no safe
dose or dose-rate -- i.e., there is no threshold below which there
is no risk; (3) there is no protection offered from fractionation
or the slow delivery of low total doses -- i.e.,
dose-rate-effectiveness factors, which predict decreased risk under
these slow-dose circumstances, should not be used for humans; (4)
in the low- dose range, the risk of cancer is possibly more severe
per dose-unit than in the moderate- and high-dose ranges -- i.e.,
the dose-response curve may be supralinear; (5) the approximate
lifetime yield of fatal cancer in the low-dose range is 27 excess
deaths from cancer per 10,000 person-rem (wholebody dose) in
populations of mixed ages, but for young persons the risk is even
higher; (6) over the course of several decades, about 400,000
people in Europe and the Soviet Union combined could die of cancer
resulting from long-term exposure to fallout from Chernobyl, and

(7) there is no scientific validation for the concept of hormesis
(a net beneficial effect from radiation).

...


>> I propose that some large city in Texas be be destroyed by a nuclear
>> weapon, and that the survivors in the city and down wind be monitored for
>> the next 50 years to see if they live longer than expected.
>>
>> If they do, then we will have another round of more precise lab
>> experiments in which several hundred AmeriKKKan identical twins are
>> separated at birth and one chronically irradiated for life while the
>> other
>> kept out of the previous nuclear blast zone, and after 90 years their
>> life
>> expectancies compared.


"Joseph Hertzlinger" <jcyclespersec...@nine.reticulatedcom.com>
wrote in


> Should we ask for a similar amount of evidence about the possible
> crisis of being cursed by witches?

Good example, being negatively effecte by a witches curse is about as
likely as being positively effected by exposure to nuclear waste.

>> Should the second study find that there is a homeosis effect, then I
>> will
>> give the AmeriKKKan Public the chance to vote on weather they wish to
>> spend
>> their lives being irradiated by nuclear waste, or if they would prefer
>> not
>> to.
>>
>> I will abide by their decision, approximately 110 years from now.


"Joseph Hertzlinger" <jcyclespersec...@nine.reticulatedcom.com>
wrote in


> I'm reminded of the rhetoric of anti-immigration activists.

I am reminded of the manufacturers of thalidimide.


>> I recognize that there is a difference between resistance to military
>> occupation, slavery, torture, execution and destruction, and the "crime"
>> of
>> racial desegregation. And I laugh at the thought that the intellectually
>> inferior would foam at the mouth for the purpose of keeping their
>> intellectual and genetic inferiority pure.
>>
>> The Klan was an indigenous terrorist organization.
>> Pigs, every last one of them.


"Joseph Hertzlinger" <jcyclespersec...@nine.reticulatedcom.com>
wrote in


> Today's terrorist movements are usually concerned with keeping the
> "wrong" people from moving into their neighborhood.

Which brinks us back to the KKK. Good Segway.


"Joseph Hertzlinger" <jcyclespersec...@nine.reticulatedcom.com>
wrote in


> What do you think Hamas's goals are?

Resistance to the onging campaign of the theft of Palestinian Property by
Zionist thieves, supplied and funded by the Fascist AmeriKKKan state, and
the return of all property stolen so far.

All moral people support their demand for Justice.


Joseph Hertzlinger

unread,
Mar 12, 2007, 11:17:37 PM3/12/07
to
On Sat, 10 Mar 2007 19:12:31 -0800, Vendicar Decarian
<BushIsA...@hotmail.com> wrote:

>> On Sat, 10 Mar 2007 14:39:28 -0800, Vendicar Decarian
>>> What is needed is a little experimentation of course.
>
>
> "Joseph Hertzlinger" <jcyclespersec...@nine.reticulatedcom.com>
> wrote in
>> It's been done.
>> http://www.jpands.org/vol9no1/chen.pdf
>
> "Based on the observed 7 cancer deaths, the cancer
> mortality rate for this population was assessed to be 3.5 per
> 100,000 person-years. Three children were born with congenital
> heart malformations, indicating a prevalence rate of 1.5 cases per
> 1,000 children under age 19."
>
> Sorry, 7 is not a statistically significant sample size.

This might not be a statistically-significant sample sample for a
claim of a marginal health benefit.

It is adequate to make it clear that low levels of ionizing radiation
are not a death sentence.

> "Joseph Hertzlinger" <jcyclespersec...@nine.reticulatedcom.com>
> wrote in
>> Should we ask for a similar amount of evidence about the possible
>> crisis of being cursed by witches?
>

> Good example, being negatively effecte [sic] by a witches curse is about as

> likely as being positively effected by exposure to nuclear waste.

What reason do you have for your prior assumptions?

> "Joseph Hertzlinger" <jcyclespersec...@nine.reticulatedcom.com>
> wrote in
>> I'm reminded of the rhetoric of anti-immigration activists.
>

> I am reminded of the manufacturers of thalidimide [sic].

What rhetoric did they use?

> "Joseph Hertzlinger" <jcyclespersec...@nine.reticulatedcom.com>
> wrote in
>> What do you think Hamas's goals are?
>
> Resistance to the onging campaign of the theft of Palestinian Property by
> Zionist thieves, supplied and funded by the Fascist AmeriKKKan state, and
> the return of all property stolen so far.

Step one: Try to stop people from moving into the wrong neighborhood.

Step two: Abandon your houses when they insist on moving in anyway.

Step three: Threaten revenge if you are allowed to return.

Step four: Act outraged when the logical consequences ensue.

> All moral people support their demand for Justice.

Will you next support reparations for the "property" stolen when
the slaves were freed after the Civil War?

In any case, I think we International Bankers can afford to pay for
the housing sufficient for the population of Palestine at the
beginning of the latest Jewish settlement.

There are, of course, other examples of "resistance" movements being
led by chauvinists (cf. "World on Fire" by Amy Chua).

--
http://hertzlinger.blogspot.com

Joseph Hertzlinger

unread,
Mar 12, 2007, 11:18:47 PM3/12/07
to
On Sat, 10 Mar 2007 18:50:47 -0800, Vendicar Decarian
<BushIsA...@hotmail.com> wrote:

>>> The tobacco industry, for a time, claimed that smoking was healthy as
>>> well.
>
>
> "Joseph Hertzlinger" <jcyclespersec...@nine.reticulatedcom.com>
> wrote
>> Source? Date?
>
> 1940's to 1950's tobacco advertising campaigns.

In other words, you have no checkable evidence.

--
http://hertzlinger.blogspot.com

Free Lunch

unread,
Mar 12, 2007, 11:27:05 PM3/12/07
to
On Tue, 13 Mar 2007 03:18:47 GMT, in alt.atheism
Joseph Hertzlinger <jcyclespersec...@nine.reticulatedcom.com>
wrote in <rKoJh.9343$PL....@newsread4.news.pas.earthlink.net>:

I, too, recall seeing such ads from the '30s to early '50s, either from
old magazines I read or from reliable reproductions.

Reply all
Reply to author
Forward
0 new messages