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European Union Has Collapsed!!!
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vivapa...@aol.com
May 16, 2013, 4:58:07 PM5/16/13
to
Jeanne Douglas
May 16, 2013, 5:20:13 PM5/16/13
to
In article <f7a3f92a-1292-49a0...@googlegroups.com>,
Interesting that this collapse hasn't made the news.
--
JD
"Osama Bin Laden is dead and GM is alive."--VP Joseph Biden
Interesting that this collapse hasn't made the news.
--
JD
"Osama Bin Laden is dead and GM is alive."--VP Joseph Biden
vivapa...@aol.com
May 16, 2013, 5:47:06 PM5/16/13
to
Josef Balluch
May 16, 2013, 5:50:49 PM5/16/13
to
On Thu, 16 May 2013 13:58:07 -0700 (PDT), vivapa...@aol.com wrote:
> European Union Has Collapsed
> Economic catastrophe looms for France!!!
LOL !!
Make up your mind, padre. Past tense or future tense?
> European Union Has Collapsed
> Economic catastrophe looms for France!!!
Make up your mind, padre. Past tense or future tense?
Josef Balluch
May 16, 2013, 5:53:43 PM5/16/13
to
On Thu, 16 May 2013 14:47:06 -0700 (PDT), vivapa...@aol.com wrote:
> The media doesn't care too much to forewarn. They prefer 'after the fact.'
Translation: "Fear mongering is one of my specialties."
> The media doesn't care too much to forewarn. They prefer 'after the fact.'
Les
May 16, 2013, 6:26:21 PM5/16/13
to
On Thu, 16 May 2013 14:20:13 -0700, Jeanne Douglas
<hlwd...@NOSPAMgmail.com> wrote:
>In article <f7a3f92a-1292-49a0...@googlegroups.com>,
> "vivapa...@aol.com" <vivapa...@aol.com> wrote:
>
>> Economic catastrophe looms for France!!!
>
>Interesting that this collapse hasn't made the news.
Their economy has just dipped into recession but it
<hlwd...@NOSPAMgmail.com> wrote:
>In article <f7a3f92a-1292-49a0...@googlegroups.com>,
> "vivapa...@aol.com" <vivapa...@aol.com> wrote:
>
>> Economic catastrophe looms for France!!!
>
>Interesting that this collapse hasn't made the news.
just percentage points and only a technical recession.
In reality their economy is neither growing or shrinking.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-22536197
As it happens I have just received a shareholders Email
from Eurotunnel telling us the dvidend will go up 50% this
time since we are carrying record amounts of traffic
between the UK and France.
--
Les Hellawell
Greeting from:
YORKSHIRE - The White Rose County
"When you are in a crowd and you stand out from the
crowd it's ususually because you are being carried on
the shoulders of others."
- Desmond Tutu
Free Lunch
May 16, 2013, 6:58:52 PM5/16/13
to
On Thu, 16 May 2013 23:26:21 +0100, Les <l...@sharnt.tell> wrote in
alt.atheism:
>On Thu, 16 May 2013 14:20:13 -0700, Jeanne Douglas
><hlwd...@NOSPAMgmail.com> wrote:
>
>>In article <f7a3f92a-1292-49a0...@googlegroups.com>,
>> "vivapa...@aol.com" <vivapa...@aol.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Economic catastrophe looms for France!!!
>>
>>Interesting that this collapse hasn't made the news.
>
>Their economy has just dipped into recession but it
>just percentage points and only a technical recession.
>In reality their economy is neither growing or shrinking.
>
>http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-22536197
>
>As it happens I have just received a shareholders Email
>from Eurotunnel telling us the dvidend will go up 50% this
>time since we are carrying record amounts of traffic
>between the UK and France.
Like many great public works projects, the Eurotunnel was a catastrophe
for the initial investors.
alt.atheism:
>On Thu, 16 May 2013 14:20:13 -0700, Jeanne Douglas
><hlwd...@NOSPAMgmail.com> wrote:
>
>>In article <f7a3f92a-1292-49a0...@googlegroups.com>,
>> "vivapa...@aol.com" <vivapa...@aol.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Economic catastrophe looms for France!!!
>>
>>Interesting that this collapse hasn't made the news.
>
>Their economy has just dipped into recession but it
>just percentage points and only a technical recession.
>In reality their economy is neither growing or shrinking.
>
>http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-22536197
>
>As it happens I have just received a shareholders Email
>from Eurotunnel telling us the dvidend will go up 50% this
>time since we are carrying record amounts of traffic
>between the UK and France.
for the initial investors.
Josef Balluch
May 16, 2013, 6:59:53 PM5/16/13
to
Your tabloid? Might as well be Nickelodeon.
More news from the tabloids:
http://www.theweek.co.uk/uk-news/52934/barbara-hewson-witch-hunt-sex-at-13-operation-yewtree
http://jezebel.com/this-week-in-tabloids-mileys-fiance-is-hooking-up-wit-479709457
http://weeklyworldnews.com/headlines/49740/u-s-confirms-existence-of-mermaids/
More news from the tabloids:
http://www.theweek.co.uk/uk-news/52934/barbara-hewson-witch-hunt-sex-at-13-operation-yewtree
http://jezebel.com/this-week-in-tabloids-mileys-fiance-is-hooking-up-wit-479709457
http://weeklyworldnews.com/headlines/49740/u-s-confirms-existence-of-mermaids/
Christopher A. Lee
May 16, 2013, 7:24:28 PM5/16/13
to
On Thu, 16 May 2013 17:58:52 -0500, Free Lunch <lu...@nofreelunch.us>
wrote:
>On Thu, 16 May 2013 23:26:21 +0100, Les <l...@sharnt.tell> wrote in
>alt.atheism:
>>
national (or international) infrastructure.
In fact the EU wanted to fund it as part of bringing Europe closer
together but Thatcher said no. They also wanted to fund a high speed
rail connection to London which she also vetoed. saying that any money
from Europe towards it would be subtracted from the subsidy paid to
British rail - after it had already been reduced.
She actually wanted no trains at all through the tunnel, with road
vehicles being driven through it.
Eventually she accepted drive-on/drive-off shuttle trains, with
British Rail connection as long as no government money was used.
Which is why Britain had the embarrassment of trains doing 300kph
(186mph) through France, dawdling through the South London suburbs
using the same track as local commuter trains.
Luckily British Rail had experience of running trains at 100mph on the
third rail DC so all they had to do to make at least part of the run
respectable was to upgrade the existing third rail line through Kent
from revenue.
The EU also wanted to pay for electrification of the line from Crewe
to Holyhead to bring Ireland "closer" to the rest of the EU. But again
she said that the BR subsidy would be reduced by the same amount so
that never happened either.
So even today you have the sight of fast electric multiple units from
London being towed at ordinary speeds from Crewe to Holyhead to meet
the Dublin ferry.
wrote:
>On Thu, 16 May 2013 23:26:21 +0100, Les <l...@sharnt.tell> wrote in
>alt.atheism:
>>
>>As it happens I have just received a shareholders Email
>>from Eurotunnel telling us the dvidend will go up 50% this
>>time since we are carrying record amounts of traffic
>>between the UK and France.
>
>Like many great public works projects, the Eurotunnel was a catastrophe
>for the initial investors.
One reason these are best publicly funded and built as part of the
>>from Eurotunnel telling us the dvidend will go up 50% this
>>time since we are carrying record amounts of traffic
>>between the UK and France.
>
>Like many great public works projects, the Eurotunnel was a catastrophe
>for the initial investors.
national (or international) infrastructure.
In fact the EU wanted to fund it as part of bringing Europe closer
together but Thatcher said no. They also wanted to fund a high speed
rail connection to London which she also vetoed. saying that any money
from Europe towards it would be subtracted from the subsidy paid to
British rail - after it had already been reduced.
She actually wanted no trains at all through the tunnel, with road
vehicles being driven through it.
Eventually she accepted drive-on/drive-off shuttle trains, with
British Rail connection as long as no government money was used.
Which is why Britain had the embarrassment of trains doing 300kph
(186mph) through France, dawdling through the South London suburbs
using the same track as local commuter trains.
Luckily British Rail had experience of running trains at 100mph on the
third rail DC so all they had to do to make at least part of the run
respectable was to upgrade the existing third rail line through Kent
from revenue.
The EU also wanted to pay for electrification of the line from Crewe
to Holyhead to bring Ireland "closer" to the rest of the EU. But again
she said that the BR subsidy would be reduced by the same amount so
that never happened either.
So even today you have the sight of fast electric multiple units from
London being towed at ordinary speeds from Crewe to Holyhead to meet
the Dublin ferry.
Jeanne Douglas
May 16, 2013, 7:38:32 PM5/16/13
to
In article <be9e48ce-a1eb-4813...@googlegroups.com>,
You said :"European Union Has Collapsed". That means we're already
"after the fact".
Care to try for a different excuse?
"after the fact".
Care to try for a different excuse?
Christopher A. Lee
May 16, 2013, 8:02:10 PM5/16/13
to
On Thu, 16 May 2013 16:38:32 -0700, Jeanne Douglas
<hlwd...@NOSPAMgmail.com> wrote:
>You said :"European Union Has Collapsed". That means we're already
>"after the fact".
>
>Care to try for a different excuse?
Europe _has_ problems, but they're not for the reasons most right wing
<hlwd...@NOSPAMgmail.com> wrote:
>You said :"European Union Has Collapsed". That means we're already
>"after the fact".
>
>Care to try for a different excuse?
commentators imagine.
One is that the European Central Bank has control over the Euro, but
no say in the economies of the countries that use it - unlike the
Federal Reserve Bank and the Bank of England.
Another is that many of the countries the US has invaded or organised
coups wanted to trade their oil in it rather than in dollars.
Malcolm McMahon
May 18, 2013, 5:37:57 PM5/18/13
to
On Thu, 16 May 2013 23:26:21 +0100, Les wrote:
> On Thu, 16 May 2013 14:20:13 -0700, Jeanne Douglas
> <hlwd...@NOSPAMgmail.com> wrote:
>
>>In article <f7a3f92a-1292-49a0...@googlegroups.com>,
>> "vivapa...@aol.com" <vivapa...@aol.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Economic catastrophe looms for France!!!
>>
>>Interesting that this collapse hasn't made the news.
>
> Their economy has just dipped into recession but it just percentage
> points and only a technical recession.
> In reality their economy is neither growing or shrinking.
>
We call it "bumping along the bottom". Although the US banking crisis
> On Thu, 16 May 2013 14:20:13 -0700, Jeanne Douglas
> <hlwd...@NOSPAMgmail.com> wrote:
>
>>In article <f7a3f92a-1292-49a0...@googlegroups.com>,
>> "vivapa...@aol.com" <vivapa...@aol.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Economic catastrophe looms for France!!!
>>
>>Interesting that this collapse hasn't made the news.
>
> Their economy has just dipped into recession but it just percentage
> points and only a technical recession.
> In reality their economy is neither growing or shrinking.
>
kicked it off it seems to be the problem many predicted when the common
currency was first proposed. Having different currency allows difference
economies to adjust according to their economics by allowing the exchange
rate to change. In some ways we could do with a different currency for
London and the rest of England.
Some are inclined to say that the Eurozone economy won't really sort
itself out until it splits into at least two currencies.
vivapa...@aol.com
May 18, 2013, 5:53:37 PM5/18/13
to
Jason
May 18, 2013, 6:20:13 PM5/18/13
to
In article <kn8sbl$auu$2...@dont-email.me>, Malcolm McMahon
When each country in Europe had their own currency, they could print money
to pay their bills.
Greece is NOT able to do it since they no longer have their own currency.
Some experts believe the only solution is to allow each country to have
their own currency.
to pay their bills.
Greece is NOT able to do it since they no longer have their own currency.
Some experts believe the only solution is to allow each country to have
their own currency.
Dreamer In Colore
May 18, 2013, 6:40:39 PM5/18/13
to
economics courses in that college you went to? You can't just blithely
print off 145 billion Euros and present it to foreign economies...
there's nothing to back up the paper.
Printing more money leads to staggering inflation.
Greece couldn't pay its bills because it had a culture where avoiding
paying taxes was a national pastime.
You're as naive about economics as you are about every other subject
you've talked about in this forum.
>Some experts believe the only solution is to allow each country to have
>their own currency.
>
Cheers,
Dreamer
AA 2306
linuxgal
May 18, 2013, 8:26:08 PM5/18/13
to
Jason wrote:
> Some experts believe the only solution is to allow each country to have
> their own currency.
Is that final?
> Some experts believe the only solution is to allow each country to have
> their own currency.
--
Halftime at Circvs Maximvs, and the Lions lead the Christians 326-0
SkyEyes
May 18, 2013, 7:29:16 PM5/18/13
to
On May 18, 3:40 pm, Dreamer In Colore <dreamerincol...@hotmail.com>
wrote:
> Greece couldn't pay its bills because it had a culture where avoiding
> paying taxes was a national pastime.
Not only that, they had no real accounting system for either their
income or their out-go. They simply spent money *as if* they had it,
with no real basis for their belief.
-
Brenda Nelson, A.A.#34 and A+ atheist
BAAWA Knight of the Golden Litterbox
EAC Professor of Feline Thermometrics and Cat-Herding
skyeyes nine at cox dot net OR
skyeyes nine at yahoo dot com
-
wrote:
> Greece couldn't pay its bills because it had a culture where avoiding
> paying taxes was a national pastime.
income or their out-go. They simply spent money *as if* they had it,
with no real basis for their belief.
-
Brenda Nelson, A.A.#34 and A+ atheist
BAAWA Knight of the Golden Litterbox
EAC Professor of Feline Thermometrics and Cat-Herding
skyeyes nine at cox dot net OR
skyeyes nine at yahoo dot com
-
Free Lunch
May 18, 2013, 7:34:28 PM5/18/13
to
On Sat, 18 May 2013 16:26:08 -0800, linuxgal <linu...@cleanposts.com>
wrote in alt.atheism:
>Jason wrote:
>> Some experts believe the only solution is to allow each country to have
>> their own currency.
>
>Is that final?
I'm completely confused. Does Jason know that the "some experts"
includes Paul Krugman? Does he know why Krugman expects the Euro to
fail?
wrote in alt.atheism:
>Jason wrote:
>> Some experts believe the only solution is to allow each country to have
>> their own currency.
>
>Is that final?
includes Paul Krugman? Does he know why Krugman expects the Euro to
fail?
linuxgal
May 18, 2013, 9:20:50 PM5/18/13
to
PIIGS are chained to the northern Eurozone they are in for nothing but
Austrian economics, good and hard.
Josef Balluch
May 18, 2013, 11:04:17 PM5/18/13
to
> European Union Has Collapsed
Uh huh. Let's see what Nickelod ................................. umm, your
tabloid had to say a few years ago:
http://www.thetrumpet.com/article/1446.559.0.0/europe/united-states-of-europe-revealed-at-last
http://www.thetrumpet.com/article/7170.5710.0.0/economy/dont-bet-against-europe
http://www.thetrumpet.com/article/2359.1070.0.0/europe/european-union/does-the-world-need-a-european-superpower
http://www.thetrumpet.com/article/1125.26549.45.0/world/government/growing-as-superpower
And sure enough, you bought it hook, line and sinker:
https://groups.google.com/forum/?hl=en&fromgroups#!msg/alt.religion.mormon/5jVMJWm2PrI/Ix9GamjQ6hoJ
With this post another one of your prophecies has fallen flat, thus
maintaining your perfect track record in Usenet. Thanks once again for
demonstrating that you are a false prophet.
Uh huh. Let's see what Nickelod ................................. umm, your
tabloid had to say a few years ago:
http://www.thetrumpet.com/article/1446.559.0.0/europe/united-states-of-europe-revealed-at-last
http://www.thetrumpet.com/article/7170.5710.0.0/economy/dont-bet-against-europe
http://www.thetrumpet.com/article/2359.1070.0.0/europe/european-union/does-the-world-need-a-european-superpower
http://www.thetrumpet.com/article/1125.26549.45.0/world/government/growing-as-superpower
And sure enough, you bought it hook, line and sinker:
https://groups.google.com/forum/?hl=en&fromgroups#!msg/alt.religion.mormon/5jVMJWm2PrI/Ix9GamjQ6hoJ
With this post another one of your prophecies has fallen flat, thus
maintaining your perfect track record in Usenet. Thanks once again for
demonstrating that you are a false prophet.
Josef Balluch
May 18, 2013, 11:05:28 PM5/18/13
to
On Sat, 18 May 2013 14:53:37 -0700 (PDT), vivapa...@aol.com wrote:
> It's just that we're talking about Europe in general, and France in particular.
Who's "we", white man? It's YOUR fantasy world.
> It's just that we're talking about Europe in general, and France in particular.
> So it's really not all that important.
Free Lunch
May 19, 2013, 12:00:05 AM5/19/13
to
On Sat, 18 May 2013 17:20:50 -0800, linuxgal <linu...@cleanposts.com>
understood economics far better than the Austrians or the Austerians.
wrote in alt.atheism:
>Free Lunch wrote:
>> On Sat, 18 May 2013 16:26:08 -0800, linuxgal <linu...@cleanposts.com>
>> wrote in alt.atheism:
>>
>>> Jason wrote:
>>>> Some experts believe the only solution is to allow each country to have
>>>> their own currency.
>>>
>>> Is that final?
>>
>> I'm completely confused. Does Jason know that the "some experts"
>> includes Paul Krugman? Does he know why Krugman expects the Euro to
>> fail?
>
>Krugman is an unreconstructed Keynesian, and he knows as long as the
>PIIGS are chained to the northern Eurozone they are in for nothing but
>Austrian economics, good and hard.
He's hardly a slave to Keynes, but he does understand that Keynes
>Free Lunch wrote:
>> On Sat, 18 May 2013 16:26:08 -0800, linuxgal <linu...@cleanposts.com>
>> wrote in alt.atheism:
>>
>>> Jason wrote:
>>>> Some experts believe the only solution is to allow each country to have
>>>> their own currency.
>>>
>>> Is that final?
>>
>> I'm completely confused. Does Jason know that the "some experts"
>> includes Paul Krugman? Does he know why Krugman expects the Euro to
>> fail?
>
>Krugman is an unreconstructed Keynesian, and he knows as long as the
>PIIGS are chained to the northern Eurozone they are in for nothing but
>Austrian economics, good and hard.
understood economics far better than the Austrians or the Austerians.
Dreamer In Colore
May 19, 2013, 12:05:52 AM5/19/13
to
On Sat, 18 May 2013 16:29:16 -0700 (PDT), SkyEyes <skye...@cox.net>
wrote:
>On May 18, 3:40 pm, Dreamer In Colore <dreamerincol...@hotmail.com>
>wrote:
>
>> Greece couldn't pay its bills because it had a culture where avoiding
>> paying taxes was a national pastime.
>
>Not only that, they had no real accounting system for either their
>income or their out-go. They simply spent money *as if* they had it,
>with no real basis for their belief.
>
As an ethnic Greek, I'm just hacked off that it could happen. My uncle
used to be a politician, and you should see his house... how he could
have afforded that place on a public servant's salary was always
bizarre to me until my mother took me aside and told me to stop asking
so many naive questions.
Somewhere along the line, a lot of Greek people realized there was a
lot of easy living to be had at the government's expense, and nobody
did any serious book-checking because... well, it would interfere with
coffee and cigarette time, not to mention afternoon siesta.
Michael Lewis had an amazing article in Vanity Fair about Greek
Orthodox monks and their hand in the banking crisis. It got put into
his latest book, "Boomerang".
There's real irony now if you read Aesop's Fable about the ant and the
grasshopper.
Cheers,
Dreamer
AA 2306
wrote:
>On May 18, 3:40 pm, Dreamer In Colore <dreamerincol...@hotmail.com>
>wrote:
>
>> Greece couldn't pay its bills because it had a culture where avoiding
>> paying taxes was a national pastime.
>
>Not only that, they had no real accounting system for either their
>income or their out-go. They simply spent money *as if* they had it,
>with no real basis for their belief.
>
used to be a politician, and you should see his house... how he could
have afforded that place on a public servant's salary was always
bizarre to me until my mother took me aside and told me to stop asking
so many naive questions.
Somewhere along the line, a lot of Greek people realized there was a
lot of easy living to be had at the government's expense, and nobody
did any serious book-checking because... well, it would interfere with
coffee and cigarette time, not to mention afternoon siesta.
Michael Lewis had an amazing article in Vanity Fair about Greek
Orthodox monks and their hand in the banking crisis. It got put into
his latest book, "Boomerang".
There's real irony now if you read Aesop's Fable about the ant and the
grasshopper.
Cheers,
Dreamer
AA 2306
Malcolm McMahon
May 19, 2013, 5:48:08 AM5/19/13
to
we inflate our way out of. Each recession the government comes up with
some cunning plan which they're sure will get us out of recession without
devaluing the pound. The length of each recession is determined by how
dogged and convinced they are that the plan will work. Eventually they
give up, the pound is devalued and the recession ends.
One of the worst was caused by our membership of the ERM (pegging the
pound to European currencies). It went on and on until "Black Wednesday"
when Soros, almost single-handed, broke the ERM. Within weeks the economy
was picking up.
The lessons of that day were probably the reason why we never seriously
considered joining the Euro.
The problem with the current recession is it's worldwide, so you get a
kind of competitive devaluation which cancels out.
Recessions seem to be fundamentally caused by too much money going out of
circulation into "safe havens". Devaluation puts the value of that money
back into circulation.
Dreamer In Colore
May 19, 2013, 9:00:22 AM5/19/13
to
On Sun, 19 May 2013 09:48:08 +0000 (UTC), Malcolm McMahon
I used to live in England in the 1970s. Great place for a kid to grow
up, actually. Not so good for people to make a living, as it turned
out. I digress...
Recessions happen when people all of a sudden realize that some of the
fundamental assumptions made about where money is invested, and the
mechanics of the investment, are based on no real financial
principles. Then people get scared, and pull money into theoretically
safer things. Tax and spend isn't a real solution either.
I really need to start studying economics.
Cheers,
Dreamer
AA 2306
up, actually. Not so good for people to make a living, as it turned
out. I digress...
Recessions happen when people all of a sudden realize that some of the
fundamental assumptions made about where money is invested, and the
mechanics of the investment, are based on no real financial
principles. Then people get scared, and pull money into theoretically
safer things. Tax and spend isn't a real solution either.
I really need to start studying economics.
Cheers,
Dreamer
AA 2306
Alex W
May 19, 2013, 9:30:35 AM5/19/13
to
On Sat, 18 May 2013 18:40:39 -0400, Dreamer In Colore wrote:
> On Sat, 18 May 2013 15:20:13 -0700, Ja...@nospam.com (Jason) wrote:
>>
>>When each country in Europe had their own currency, they could print money
>>to pay their bills.
>>
>>Greece is NOT able to do it since they no longer have their own currency.
>>
>
> You think the solution is to print more money? Did you take any
> economics courses in that college you went to? You can't just blithely
> print off 145 billion Euros and present it to foreign economies...
> there's nothing to back up the paper.
OK, but that's true of currencies in general. We have fiat
>>
>>When each country in Europe had their own currency, they could print money
>>to pay their bills.
>>
>>Greece is NOT able to do it since they no longer have their own currency.
>>
>
> You think the solution is to print more money? Did you take any
> economics courses in that college you went to? You can't just blithely
> print off 145 billion Euros and present it to foreign economies...
> there's nothing to back up the paper.
currencies that are not explicitly backed up by anything at
all, and implicitly backed by the economic capacity and
potential of that nation. For Greece, that amounts to sweet
f.a. in either case.
>
> Printing more money leads to staggering inflation.
If we're talking actual paper bills, it wouldn't make much
difference. Currency in circulation makes up only a small
fraction of the total money supply: CinC is 867bn, M1 is
5,203bn, M2 is 9,090bn and M3 is 9,810bn. Only the
economically illiterate -- the technical term is "a Jason",
for some reason -- think that cash money still matters much.
Besides, even if the GReeks were physically capable of
printing their own Euro notes (which they are not), the
logistics of printing those huge numbers of bills would be
prohibitive.
>
> Greece couldn't pay its bills because it had a culture where avoiding
> paying taxes was a national pastime.
social and welfare systems were wide open to abuse, where
governments were able to cook their own books, and where
none of its European partners stood up and said "enough is
enough" until it was far, far too late.
linuxgal
May 19, 2013, 9:39:22 AM5/19/13
to
Alex W wrote:
> OK, but that's true of currencies in general. We have fiat
> currencies that are not explicitly backed up by anything at
> all, and implicitly backed by the economic capacity and
> potential of that nation. For Greece, that amounts to sweet
> f.a. in either case.
But someday when 3D printers are perfected we will print actual goods
> OK, but that's true of currencies in general. We have fiat
> currencies that are not explicitly backed up by anything at
> all, and implicitly backed by the economic capacity and
> potential of that nation. For Greece, that amounts to sweet
> f.a. in either case.
rather than just money.
Alex W
May 19, 2013, 11:07:37 AM5/19/13
to
economic power of a nation. If everybdy uses a 3D printer
to make their own widget and as a result Acme Widget and
Thingummy Inc in Cincinatti goes out of business with the
loss of 267 jobs, this might actually reduce the nation's
ability to back their own currency.
linuxgal
May 19, 2013, 11:25:35 AM5/19/13
to
maintain the status quo. The radicals of the 60s have become the new
Establishment.
Dreamer In Colore
May 19, 2013, 1:43:56 PM5/19/13
to
On Sun, 19 May 2013 08:25:35 -0700, linuxgal <linu...@cleanposts.com>
wrote:
I'm not sure that's a fair assessment. Alex was just pointing out a
possibility, not making a stance for the preservation of status quo.
The rate of change of technology is far outstripping the ability of
people to assimilate all the consequences, and there are going to be a
bunch of people who do get hurt... but there will also be a new
economic shift towards a much higher degree of personalization and
customization, so as usual, the people who embrace change will do
well, and the rest will have spinning heads for a while.
Cheers,
Dreamer
AA 2306
wrote:
possibility, not making a stance for the preservation of status quo.
The rate of change of technology is far outstripping the ability of
people to assimilate all the consequences, and there are going to be a
bunch of people who do get hurt... but there will also be a new
economic shift towards a much higher degree of personalization and
customization, so as usual, the people who embrace change will do
well, and the rest will have spinning heads for a while.
Cheers,
Dreamer
AA 2306
Malcolm McMahon
May 19, 2013, 1:43:02 PM5/19/13
to
starting to worry about the state of the economy.
Then all the money for trade and investment evaporates, and it becomes a
self-fulfilling prophecy.
>
> I really need to start studying economics.
>
vivapa...@aol.com
May 19, 2013, 5:04:46 PM5/19/13
to
vivapa...@aol.com
May 19, 2013, 5:08:04 PM5/19/13
to
Alex W
May 19, 2013, 6:28:43 PM5/19/13
to
On Sun, 19 May 2013 17:43:02 +0000 (UTC), Malcolm McMahon
Forget the state of the economy as a whole. Loss of faith
in the banking system is enough to cause a threat to the
system as a whole.
>
>
>>
>> I really need to start studying economics.
>>
>
> I shouldn't. Not for nothing is is named the "dismal science".
I'm not sure it deserves the label "science". There's an
awful lot of wishful thinking and unfounded speculation
going on there...
in the banking system is enough to cause a threat to the
system as a whole.
>
>
>>
>> I really need to start studying economics.
>>
>
> I shouldn't. Not for nothing is is named the "dismal science".
awful lot of wishful thinking and unfounded speculation
going on there...
Alex W
May 19, 2013, 6:57:02 PM5/19/13
to
fury will have resulted in a net gain or not.
I'm not sure how far this can be taken anyway. People may
like choice -- they certainly say they do -- but they will
also tell you that there is such a thing as too much choice.
Jeanne Douglas
May 19, 2013, 9:45:01 PM5/19/13
to
SkyEyes
May 20, 2013, 3:30:18 AM5/20/13
to
On May 18, 9:05 pm, Dreamer In Colore <dreamerincol...@hotmail.com>
wrote:
> On Sat, 18 May 2013 16:29:16 -0700 (PDT), SkyEyes <skyey...@cox.net>
them we didn't cheat when we filled out the Greek income tax forms.
(As expatriates working for an international company - Lockheed - we
had to pay dual taxes, to both Greece and the U.S.) They literally
could not understand the concept that the government needs money -
income - in order to run. And they all worked for the Greek
government's aircraft maintenance and overhaul facility they'd just
built in Tanagra.
American companies over there. The Lockheed facility my husband
worked at had major difficulties getting the Greek employees to work
through the afternoons instead of taking naps - they actually expected
the company (Hellenic Aerospace Industries and Lockheed) to put in
cots for them to rest on. And I got in trouble in my apartment
building (I lived on the 4th floor) because I *didn't* take a nap in
the afternoon, but walked around my apartment. When a Greek takes a
nap, he damn well expects the rest of the world to shut up and stay
quiet.
Of course, it worked the other way at night. We went to bed at 10:30
PM so my husband could get up and catch the bus at 7 AM the next
morning, and the Greeks partied in their apartments until well after 1
AM.
altogether.
wrote:
> On Sat, 18 May 2013 16:29:16 -0700 (PDT), SkyEyes <skyey...@cox.net>
> wrote:
>
> >On May 18, 3:40 pm, Dreamer In Colore <dreamerincol...@hotmail.com>
> >wrote:
>
> >> Greece couldn't pay its bills because it had a culture where avoiding
> >> paying taxes was a national pastime.
>
> >Not only that, they had no real accounting system for either their
> >income or their out-go. They simply spent money *as if* they had it,
> >with no real basis for their belief.
>
> As an ethnic Greek, I'm just hacked off that it could happen. My uncle
> used to be a politician, and you should see his house... how he could
> have afforded that place on a public servant's salary was always
> bizarre to me until my mother took me aside and told me to stop asking
> so many naive questions.
When I lived in Greece, our Greek friends died laughing when we told
>
> >On May 18, 3:40 pm, Dreamer In Colore <dreamerincol...@hotmail.com>
> >wrote:
>
> >> Greece couldn't pay its bills because it had a culture where avoiding
> >> paying taxes was a national pastime.
>
> >Not only that, they had no real accounting system for either their
> >income or their out-go. They simply spent money *as if* they had it,
> >with no real basis for their belief.
>
> As an ethnic Greek, I'm just hacked off that it could happen. My uncle
> used to be a politician, and you should see his house... how he could
> have afforded that place on a public servant's salary was always
> bizarre to me until my mother took me aside and told me to stop asking
> so many naive questions.
them we didn't cheat when we filled out the Greek income tax forms.
(As expatriates working for an international company - Lockheed - we
had to pay dual taxes, to both Greece and the U.S.) They literally
could not understand the concept that the government needs money -
income - in order to run. And they all worked for the Greek
government's aircraft maintenance and overhaul facility they'd just
built in Tanagra.
>
> Somewhere along the line, a lot of Greek people realized there was a
> lot of easy living to be had at the government's expense, and nobody
> did any serious book-checking because... well, it would interfere with
> coffee and cigarette time, not to mention afternoon siesta.
Seriously. Siesta was a pain in the patoot for Americans, and for
> Somewhere along the line, a lot of Greek people realized there was a
> lot of easy living to be had at the government's expense, and nobody
> did any serious book-checking because... well, it would interfere with
> coffee and cigarette time, not to mention afternoon siesta.
American companies over there. The Lockheed facility my husband
worked at had major difficulties getting the Greek employees to work
through the afternoons instead of taking naps - they actually expected
the company (Hellenic Aerospace Industries and Lockheed) to put in
cots for them to rest on. And I got in trouble in my apartment
building (I lived on the 4th floor) because I *didn't* take a nap in
the afternoon, but walked around my apartment. When a Greek takes a
nap, he damn well expects the rest of the world to shut up and stay
quiet.
Of course, it worked the other way at night. We went to bed at 10:30
PM so my husband could get up and catch the bus at 7 AM the next
morning, and the Greeks partied in their apartments until well after 1
AM.
>
> Michael Lewis had an amazing article in Vanity Fair about Greek
> Orthodox monks and their hand in the banking crisis. It got put into
> his latest book, "Boomerang".
I read the Vanity Fair piece. It was a real eye-opener.
> Michael Lewis had an amazing article in Vanity Fair about Greek
> Orthodox monks and their hand in the banking crisis. It got put into
> his latest book, "Boomerang".
>
> There's real irony now if you read Aesop's Fable about the ant and the
> grasshopper.
The Greeks of Aesop's time were the Hellenes. Different people
> There's real irony now if you read Aesop's Fable about the ant and the
> grasshopper.
altogether.
SkyEyes
May 20, 2013, 3:32:57 AM5/20/13
to
On May 19, 3:57 pm, Alex W <ing...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
> On Sun, 19 May 2013 13:43:56 -0400, Dreamer In Colore wrote:
> > On Sun, 19 May 2013 08:25:35 -0700, linuxgal <linux...@cleanposts.com>
> On Sun, 19 May 2013 13:43:56 -0400, Dreamer In Colore wrote:
a grocery store and buying a frozen pizza that *doesn't* have
pepperoni on it? You'll get plenty of choice - 10 different brands -
but they'll all either be plain cheese, or have pepperoni on it. No
such thing as a frozen pizza with just sausage. I'd be happier with
fewer brands that offered more varieties instead of 10 brands of the
same thing.
Alex W.
May 21, 2013, 7:25:23 AM5/21/13
to
among customers, and respond to it. There's the
customisation of basic designs (say, with shoes), and there
is the conscious limiting of products on offer. The mantra
of "more choice is always better" does not really hold true
for actual shopping behaviour, it seems.
As for peperoni, the reason for that, I think, is that they
hope to create the illusion of a flavoursome pizza by
slapping on the single strongest ingredient (and one, which
not coincientally, is also far from the priciest).
Anyway, I always customise my pizza so the peperoni does not
really bother me. Enough sundried tomato paste, grated
cheese, artichoke, anchovy and other toppings, and even the
worst frozen pizza becomes edible.
Josef Balluch
May 21, 2013, 9:13:48 PM5/21/13
to
And you still don't. So keep guessing, padre. That's what theists do.
Josef Balluch
May 21, 2013, 9:44:07 PM5/21/13
to
On Thu, 16 May 2013 17:50:49 -0400, Josef Balluch wrote:
> On Thu, 16 May 2013 13:58:07 -0700 (PDT), vivapa...@aol.com wrote:
>
>
>> European Union Has Collapsed
>
> On Thu, 16 May 2013 13:58:07 -0700 (PDT), vivapa...@aol.com wrote:
>
>
>> European Union Has Collapsed
>
>> Economic catastrophe looms for France!!!
>
>
> LOL !!
>
>
>
> Make up your mind, padre. Past tense or future tense?
No response, coward? Is the question too difficult, Shakespeare?
LOL !!!
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