Dirty Debating Tricks IV: The One Shade of Gray Meltdown
pnyikos
common features in order to portray disparate things as though they
were the same. Sometimes the features are so abstract that they
aren't even mentioned. For example, the mentioning of a possibility
might get painted as though it were an implication that the
possibility is the only correct one, or even as though it were an
outright assertion to that effect.
But perhaps the most common, and one of the most reprehensible uses,
is to use the lumping to charge the adversary with hypocrisy. Such is
the case with the following post by Ray Fischer. Notice how he is
lumping together questions that can be straightforwardly answered NO
(perhaps with the addition of insults of which Ray is probably the
most prolific spewer in these newsgroups) with questions to which
either a YES or NO answer would be extremely damaging to the would be
answerer.
I have slightly edited his post for the sake of brevity, but you can
see the original on the thread whose Subject : line you see below,
posted to these same newsgroups.
From: rfisc...@sonic.net (Ray Fischer)
Date: 22 May 2009 02:28:29 GMT
Subject: Re: Swine and Abortion
pnyikos <nyik...@bellsouth.net> wrote:
>On May 11, 10:55 pm, rfisc...@sonic.net (Ray Fischer) wrote:
>> pnyikos <nyik...@bellsouth.net> wrote:
>> > rfisc...@sonic.net (Ray Fischer) wrote:
>> >> pnyikos <nyik...@bellsouth.net> wrote:
>> >> > rfisc...@sonic.net (Ray Fischer) wrote:
[to someone else, not me:]
>> >> >> To you women are to be treated like animals, forced to breed as you
>> >> >> dictate.
>> >> >To you, people who think that way are vermin, aren't they?
[...]
>> Have you stopped molesting children, pervert?
[...]
>> >> >And, why are you afraid
>> >>>to say what penalties you would prescribe for
>> >>>doctors that use abortion methods that would kill a fully viable fetus
>> >>>when the woman could induce live birth with equal or lesser risk?
>> >You ducked this question too,
>> Why are you afraid to tell the truth, asshole?
>> >> Why are you afraid to admit that you're not really Peter Nyikos?
>> >Although you are dishonest enough to claim that you are using my
>> Now look who's ducking questions, hypocrite.
>Lots of wishful thinking by you here, Ray, a lot of it in the form of
>loaded questions which cannot be answered in any straightforward way,
Questions like, for example: "To you, people who think that way are
vermin, aren't they?"
You wrote that "loaded question", didn't you?
You're a hypocritical sleazebag, fauxNy.
--
Ray Fischer
rfisc...@sonic.net
Ray Fischer
>But perhaps the most common, and one of the most reprehensible uses,
>is to use the lumping to charge the adversary with hypocrisy.
Such as when you attack people by doing the very thing you accuse
others of doing. As demonstrated in this article you so conveniently
repost.
--
Ray Fischer
rfis...@sonic.net
pnyikos
> pnyikos <nyik...@bellsouth.net> wrote:
> >But perhaps the most common, and one of the most reprehensible uses,
> >is to use the lumping to charge the adversary with hypocrisy.
>
> Such as when you attack people by doing the very thing you accuse
> others of doing.
"the very thing" is exactly what "One Shade of Gray" refers to--not
two shades, but one. But there are huge differences between the
shades of gray in the asking of questions, as I will show below.
> As demonstrated in this article you so conveniently repost.
You need a lesson in making distinctions. Here goes:
>From: rfisc...@sonic.net (Ray Fischer)
>Date: 22 May 2009 02:28:29 GMT
>Subject: Re: Swine and Abortion
> pnyikos <nyik...@bellsouth.net> wrote:
> >On May 11, 10:55 pm, rfisc...@sonic.net (Ray Fischer) wrote:
> >> pnyikos <nyik...@bellsouth.net> wrote:
> >> > rfisc...@sonic.net (Ray Fischer) wrote:
> >> >> pnyikos <nyik...@bellsouth.net> wrote:
> >> >> >On May 6, 10:23 pm, rfisc...@sonic.net (Ray Fischer) wrote:
> >> >> >>bam <blahblahb...@bellsouth.net> wrote:
> >> >> >>>Hitler called Jews "vermin". Therefore, he could claim he was not a
> >> >> >>>murderer. Your little word game is pointed toward the same goal. To you,
> >> >> >>>there is no life until the doctor smacks it.
> >> >> >> To you women are to be treated like animals, forced to breed as you
>>> >> >> dictate.
>> >> >To you, people who think that way are vermin, aren't they?
This can be answered NO, without any ill effects.
> > [...]
> >> Have you stopped molesting children, pervert?
Try answering THAT with a YES or NO, Liar Ray.
Why didn''t you just say NO to may question?
And if NO isn't strong enough for you, why don't you punctuate it with
your favorite insults? Nothing seems to hold you back from doing that
under other circumstances.
>>[...]
> >> >> >And, why are you afraid
> >> >>>to say what penalties you would prescribe for
> >> >>>doctors that use abortion methods that would kill a fully viable fetus
> >> >>>when the woman could induce live birth with equal or lesser risk?
> >> >You ducked this question too,
Fear seems to be the only thing that held you back. Fortunately, Bill
Mosco was able to dig up something you said in 1992 that settles that
problem: voluntary manslaughter, prison time. You said that your
policy had not changed in the meantime. Late-term abortionists like
the late George Tiller would not have been amused.
> >> Why are you afraid to tell the truth, asshole?
> >> >> Why are you afraid to admit that you're not really Peter Nyikos?
Note that, unlike with my question, the thing that would be
"admitted" would be a lie. I did not even charge you with being
unable to admit anything; the only thing that you were charged with
was being afraid of revealing something that I had no reason to doubt
once you revealed it.
> >> >Although you are dishonest enough to claim that you are using my
tactics against me, any reader can see the differences. And since you
love to pretend they aren't there, I've
explicitly pointed them out to you.
> >> Now look who's ducking questions, hypocrite.
> >Lots of wishful thinking by you here, Ray, a lot of it in the form of
> >loaded questions which cannot be answered in any straightforward way,
> Questions like, for example: "To you, people who think that way are
> vermin, aren't they?"
"NO" is a perfectly straightforward answer, Liar Ray. You are
indulging in a dirty debating trick, which I call the One Shade of
Gray Meltdown, which I've explained in the first post to this thread.
Naturally, you deleted the description.
> You wrote that "loaded question", didn't you?
"loaded" has huge shades of meaning.
> You're a hypocritical sleazebag, fauxNy.
Typical insincere "payoff" on your dirty debating trick, Liar Ray.
Peter Nyikos
Ray Fischer
>On Jun 17, 12:21 pm, rfisc...@sonic.net (Ray Fischer) wrote:
>> pnyikos <nyik...@bellsouth.net> wrote:
>> >But perhaps the most common, and one of the most reprehensible uses,
>> >is to use the lumping to charge the adversary with hypocrisy.
>>
>> Such as when you attack people by doing the very thing you accuse
>> others of doing.
>
>"the very thing" is exactly what "One Shade of Gray" refers to--not
>two shades, but one.
Do you believe that you're making sense?
> But there are huge differences between the
>shades of gray in the asking of questions, as I will show below.
This is where you proceed to justify your own sleaze and whine that
people throw it back at you. Like most immoral egotists wyou will
justify any crime done by yourself.
But I'm not interested in self-serving sophistry.
--
Ray Fischer
rfis...@sonic.net
pnyikos
> pnyikos <nyik...@bellsouth.net> wrote:
> >On Jun 17, 12:21 pm, rfisc...@sonic.net (Ray Fischer) wrote:
> >> pnyikos <nyik...@bellsouth.net> wrote:
> >> >But perhaps the most common, and one of the most reprehensible uses,
> >> >is to use the lumping to charge the adversary with hypocrisy.
>
> >> Such as when you attack people by doing the very thing you accuse
> >> others of doing.
>
> >"the very thing" is exactly what "One Shade of Gray" refers to--not
> >two shades, but one.
>
> Do you believe that you're making sense?
I KNOW I am making sense, but your brain is so far atrophied from
minimal use, that you apparently don't even remember what "shades of
gray" are all about in adult conversation. "Things aren't all black
and white, there are shades of gray...." --did that jog your memory?
If so, then it should be obvious that "doing the very thing" implies
that either both are doing something black, or both are doing
something white, or both are doing the exact same shade of gray,
figuratively speaking of course.
> > But there are huge differences between the
> >shades of gray in the asking of questions, as I will show below.
>
> This is where you proceed to justify your own
...statements, and you deleted the whole justification, and posted
arrogant, hateful insults which you didn't even ATTEMPT to justify.
But then, your brain may be so far atrophied, that you are incapable
of attempting something that looks even superficially like a
justification.
Then again, you may realize that all you are capable of is sophistry;
if so, you hit the nail on the head when you wrote:
> But I'm not interested in self-serving sophistry.
That leaves the only thing we've seen from you on this thread so far:
Truth by Blatant Assertion (TbBA).
Peter Nyikos
Ray Fischer
>On Jun 17, 11:18 pm, rfisc...@sonic.net (Ray Fischer) wrote:
>> pnyikos <nyik...@bellsouth.net> wrote:
>> >On Jun 17, 12:21 pm, rfisc...@sonic.net (Ray Fischer) wrote:
>> >> pnyikos <nyik...@bellsouth.net> wrote:
>> >> >But perhaps the most common, and one of the most reprehensible uses,
>> >> >is to use the lumping to charge the adversary with hypocrisy.
>>
>> >> Such as when you attack people by doing the very thing you accuse
>> >> others of doing.
>>
>> >"the very thing" is exactly what "One Shade of Gray" refers to--not
>> >two shades, but one.
>>
>> Do you believe that you're making sense?
>
>I KNOW I am making sense,
You "know" many things which are not true.
> but your brain is so far atrophied from
And the usual insults from the usual pro-liar asshole.
>> > But there are huge differences between the
>> >shades of gray in the asking of questions, as I will show below.
>>
>> This is where you proceed to justify your own
>
>...statements,
Lies. Hypocrisies. Bullshits. Evasions.
--
Ray Fischer
rfis...@sonic.net