End of the Matter?
chompie
Just wondering if the 'end of the matter' being the 4th house from the
house in question holds true for natal charts as well as horary
charts.
Thanks!
chompie
Jyeshta
wrote:
Hi Chompie,
>Just wondering if the 'end of the matter' being the 4th house from the
>house in question holds true for natal charts as well as horary
>charts.
I don't think so, but I'm not sure what you're specifically
thinking of. Natally, the 4th represents the end of life
(circumstances surrounding the end of life). As far as how you
might be remembered after passing on, some think it's an MC/IC
thing, others think it's a 5th house thing. I'm still not sure
what I believe about that. I guess I'd have to look at the
natals of people who have passed on and see whether their 5th
house rulers and planets describe how they're best remembered.
G.
>Thanks!
>
>chompie
astropophageous
news:uhjud31q21odq9mvb...@4ax.com...
> On Wed, 5 Sep 2007 15:47:29 -0500, chompie <cv...@optonline.net>
> wrote:
>
> Hi Chompie,
>
> >Just wondering if the 'end of the matter' being the 4th house from the
> >house in question holds true for natal charts as well as horary
> >charts.
>
> I don't think so, but I'm not sure what you're specifically
> thinking of. Natally, the 4th represents the end of life
> (circumstances surrounding the end of life).
If THAT isn't "the end of the matter", I don't know what is ... :)
Astropophageous
Ms.Maleficent
"Jyeshta" <what...@twixtntween.com> wrote in message
news:uhjud31q21odq9mvb...@4ax.com...
I've always read that the 8th house describes the manner of death, and the
4th the place of burial.
Jyeshta
The 4th is also the grave but among other things it describes the
circumstances preceding death, and of old age - whether the
environment will be peaceful or not, whether the person will be
moved from place to place, whether the person will still be
active, etc.
Ms.Maleficent
It's interesting that the 4th rules both what you come into the world with
and how you go out. The midnight position seems a mysterious place, like a
connection with the soul or karma, both past and future, kind of like the
Moon.
Jyeshta
<ms.mal...@hotmail.com> wrote:
I think that's the Ascendant? But the 4th is also one's roots
(and father), so I'm not really disagreeing. Roots are both a
personal and a collective thing.
>and how you go out. The midnight position seems a mysterious place, like a
>connection with the soul or karma, both past and future, kind of like the
>Moon.
I like that idea. Also, "ashes to ashes, dust to dust" kind of
feeling.
Ms.Maleficent
Well, the Ascendant is the early life, for sure, but as yoou say below, the
4th is roots, ancestry, the father, etc. I wonder if it should be linked to
genetics? I have Saturn there, opp the Sun, and I was born with a slight
defect in my spine. In addition, my family history is very fractured and
much of it is lost to us (Saturn)
But the 4th is also one's roots
> (and father), so I'm not really disagreeing. Roots are both a
> personal and a collective thing.
Very true.
>
>>and how you go out. The midnight position seems a mysterious place, like a
>>connection with the soul or karma, both past and future, kind of like the
>>Moon.
>
> I like that idea. Also, "ashes to ashes, dust to dust" kind of
> feeling.
>
Yes, like that.
Dottie
> "Jyeshta" <whate...@twixtntween.com> wrote in message
>
> news:oop3e3hs4v0endtcd...@4ax.com...
>
>
>
> > On Fri, 7 Sep 2007 18:45:38 -0500, "Ms.Maleficent"
>
> >>"Jyeshta" <whate...@twixtntween.com> wrote in message
> >>news:4m03e355r2gtart9f...@4ax.com...
> >>> On Fri, 7 Sep 2007 10:10:24 -0500, "Ms.Maleficent"
>
> >>>>"Jyeshta" <whate...@twixtntween.com> wrote in message
I have Virgo on the fourth house and the only planet in the fourth is
Neptune. I had read that Neptune in the fourth is an indication of
problems concerning the father. My father deserted us when I was six
and we never saw him again. My son has Neptune in the fourth and he
is adopted. My sun is in Taurus and my husband has Taurus on the
fourth house...no planets. His parents stayed married and together
for a long time.
Wendy of NJ
I have Scorpio on the 4th house, holding my North node, and Mars. My
parents were married for 45 years (till mom died). I, on the other
hand, have been married for 25 years, but to 3 different people
(sequentially, not concurrently) :)
Ms.Maleficent
"Dottie" <Dorot...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:1189465399....@g4g2000hsf.googlegroups.com...
I have Saturn in the 4th next to Jupiter. My alcoholic father left when I
was 7 and wasn't part of my life, but my mother worked hard (my brother and
I had no idea we were poor!) and I was blessed with a kind, funny, wonderful
woman for a babysitter until I was in the 3rd grade.
chompie
>
> - Show quoted text -
That started a nice discusson on the 4th house! But I guess I was
unclear about what I was asking. I meant the fourth from whatever
house you are starting from. For instance, in the natal chart, is the
end of the matter for the 2nd house found in the 5th house, as it
would be in horary? That's what I meant to ask. Sorry!
Ms.Maleficent
"chompie" <cv...@optonline.net> wrote in message
news:1189621337.2...@y42g2000hsy.googlegroups.com...
I would say no to that. A lot of things can translate over from horary to
natal, but I've never known that to be one of them.
astropophageous
news:1189621337.2...@y42g2000hsy.googlegroups.com...
It would be, I think, in the derivative (or derived) houses system of
interpretation.
It's a system which develops the use of the houses in interpretation into a
fine art.
In the same way, you can find i.e. your father's great-grandmother's
physical appearance.
I have no idea if it holds up to real world experience.
Astropophageous
astropophageous
news:ZpCdna2M5ZtlqHXb...@comcast.com...
AFAIK, this is not taken from horary astrology. It's a system of
interpretation known as "derivative houses system". Some French astrologers
were experts in it.
Astropophageous
Todd Carnes
news:46e8522e$0$14248$ba62...@news.skynet.be...
In traditional horary we call this 'turning the chart' & the French are not
the only ones that use the technique by any means.
As for the original poster's question, I, personally, have never heard of
turning a natal chart, but just because I have never heard of it doesn't
mean there isn't someone out there who doesn't do it.
Todd
Ms.Maleficent
"Todd Carnes" <toddc...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:fc9spf$cn9$1...@aioe.org...
I've definitely known people to turn the natal chart, just not for "The end
of the matter"
chompie
>
> - Show quoted text -
Thanks to all who responded! Everyone seems to be pretty much in
unison on this matter. Good to know!
chompie