Tree Foliage

davidma...@yahoo.com

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May 12, 2008, 12:26:30 AM5/12/08

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According to the book Inquest the shooters sight was blocked by the
Oak tree's foliage until frame 207.Is this correct? I thought the tree
was smaller in 1963.

WhiskyJoe

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May 12, 2008, 4:11:41 PM5/12/08

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Yes, this is correct.

Back in 1963 the foliage blocked the shots from Oswald's viewpoint
from Zapruder frame 166 to 207, with a slight opening at frame 186.
Essentially, the view was partly blocked from frames 166 to 207.

The tree has grown since then so it would now block more, but back in
1963 in blocked 166 through 207.

yeuhd

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May 12, 2008, 4:12:33 PM5/12/08

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See Commission Exhibit 892, a photograph taken during the reenactment
on May 26, 1964:

http://www.aarclibrary.org/publib/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh18/html/WH_Vol18_0051b.htm

And CE 888:

http://www.aarclibrary.org/publib/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh18/html/WH_Vol18_0050b.htm

Anthony Marsh

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May 12, 2008, 7:42:41 PM5/12/08

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The photos were taken in 1964. The tree did not grow that much in a few
months. Frame 209 might be more accurate for a clear view. But if the
shot was fired at about frame 208 it would have hit between frame 209
and 210.

http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/russ/jfkinfo3/exhibits/ce892.jpg
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/russ/jfkinfo3/exhibits/ce893.jpg

Andrew Mason

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May 12, 2008, 11:34:58 PM5/12/08

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WhiskyJoe wrote:

The WC said that JFK was not visible before frame z210 but the FBI
reconstruction done in May 1964 shows otherwise:

http://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh18/html/WH_Vol18_0051b.htm

As one can see, at frame z207 JFK is quite visible from the SN as is
much of the trunk for several feet behind him. The car was moving a
little less than 1 foot per frame.

One also has to be careful in drawing conclusions from this
reconstruction because the tree in November 1963 was different than it
was in May 1964. Here is what it looked like in November 1963:

http://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh17/html/WH_Vol17_0455a.htm

This photo shows that the occupants of the car were quite visible
through the leaves well before z207 and probably continuously after z186.

Andrew Mason

yeuhd

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May 13, 2008, 10:32:29 AM5/13/08

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On May 12, 11:34 pm, Andrew Mason <a.ma...@dufourlaw.com> wrote:
> One also has to be careful in drawing conclusions from this
> reconstruction because the tree in November 1963 was different than it
> was in May 1964. Here is what it looked like in November 1963:

Actually, December 5, 1963; see index listing of CE 875:

http://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh17/html/WH_Vol17_0012b.htm

Anthony Marsh

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May 13, 2008, 10:41:22 AM5/13/08

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Andrew Mason wrote:
> WhiskyJoe wrote:
>
>> davidma...@yahoo.com wrote:
>>
>>> According to the book Inquest the shooters sight was blocked by the
>>> Oak tree's foliage until frame 207.Is this correct? I thought the tree
>>> was smaller in 1963.
>>
>>
>> Yes, this is correct.
>>
>> Back in 1963 the foliage blocked the shots from Oswald's viewpoint
>> from Zapruder frame 166 to 207, with a slight opening at frame 186.
>> Essentially, the view was partly blocked from frames 166 to 207.
>>
>> The tree has grown since then so it would now block more, but back in
>> 1963 in blocked 166 through 207.
>>
>
> The WC said that JFK was not visible before frame z210 but the FBI
> reconstruction done in May 1964 shows otherwise:
>
> http://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh18/html/WH_Vol18_0051b.htm
>
>
> As one can see, at frame z207 JFK is quite visible from the SN as is
> much of the trunk for several feet behind him. The car was moving a
> little less than 1 foot per frame.
>

JFK would have been visible, but the point is about when the shooter
could get a clear shot beyond the branches and leaves of the tree.

Andrew Mason

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May 13, 2008, 4:16:53 PM5/13/08

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Anthony Marsh wrote:
> Andrew Mason wrote:
>
>> WhiskyJoe wrote:
>>
>>> davidma...@yahoo.com wrote:
>>>
>>>> According to the book Inquest the shooters sight was blocked by the
>>>> Oak tree's foliage until frame 207.Is this correct? I thought the tree
>>>> was smaller in 1963.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Yes, this is correct.
>>>
>>> Back in 1963 the foliage blocked the shots from Oswald's viewpoint
>>> from Zapruder frame 166 to 207, with a slight opening at frame 186.
>>> Essentially, the view was partly blocked from frames 166 to 207.
>>>
>>> The tree has grown since then so it would now block more, but back in
>>> 1963 in blocked 166 through 207.
>>>
>>
>> The WC said that JFK was not visible before frame z210 but the FBI
>> reconstruction done in May 1964 shows otherwise:
>>
>> http://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh18/html/WH_Vol18_0051b.htm
>>
>>
>> As one can see, at frame z207 JFK is quite visible from the SN as is
>> much of the trunk for several feet behind him. The car was moving a
>> little less than 1 foot per frame.
>>
>
> JFK would have been visible, but the point is about when the shooter
> could get a clear shot beyond the branches and leaves of the tree.

We don't know what was going through Oswald's mind. Since JFK was quite
visible through the leaves, Oswald could have been tracking him and then
fired as soon as he was clear of any branches. It appears to me that
there were no branches in the way of a shot from the SN to JFK at least
10 frames before z207.

Andrew Mason

Anthony Marsh

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May 13, 2008, 6:27:55 PM5/13/08

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I agree with the concept, but I doubt that it was Oswald.