Citizenship
Ilya Shambat
between spirit and world, creating a world of injustice and
spirituality of misery. In Romeo and Juliet, spirit comes into the
world to take the form of pure passionate love. The pioneers of
spirituality are sacrificed so that their families end
their pointless feud, lead the world out of feudalism and join
together toward creating a magnificent global civilization containing
wisdom both spiritual and material, with refined and noble conception
of justice, education, reason and spiritual wisdom. This civilization
is, however, also cold - ice cold; Queen Elizabeth cold; reflecting
the frigidity that a woman had to attain in order to take herself out
of the emotional universe in which every semblance of heart was used
as a hook to be used against her. It resulted in a civilization in
which emotion is sacrificed for the good of the glorified empire; a
state of existence similar to King Philip's France, where England is
the greatest nation on Earth and the English its most miserable
people. Which sets the stage for rebellion on the part of the
people.
The rebellion is described in Mark Twain. In it, the lovers from two
feuding clans swim the river to start a new life while the clans,
bound tho their bestial tribalist hatred, kill each other off. THe
American way is the human spirit contained in the lovers breaking free
of the past to start a new life in an alien continent.
But where does this lead? THe lovers settle down; they start a family.
They have to deal with reality shorn of all sources of support. They
have to be entirely self-sufficient; in words of Emerson,
self-reliant, and deal with problems as they come up. They develop
ingenity, guts and acumen, for such is the necessity forced on them by
their choices; they also develop harshness. The very refinement of the
soul - the very cultivation of noble emotion that allowed them to love
so beautifully, so boldly, so immensely, so gliriously - gives way to
the need to provide for one another and navigate the world for
themselves. In the best case scenario, this leads to pragmatic
idealism, the willingness to stand up for liberty within the framework
of righteousness. In the worst case scenario, this leads to the woman
being at the mercy of a brute.
When Scarlet O'Hara wows to never go hungry again - she, the creature
of culture and cultivation, is taken away from her cultivation all the
way down to the first chakric level. At this level she is vulnerable
to consumer coercion - to men who would own her and break down her
spirit lest it influence their children to have ideals; who would
destroy all her creatures and make her life a waste. Her liberty is
undermined not enhanced, and her inner beauty is wasted. Her children
grow up to reject her and to identify with power of the dollar and
power of brute force.
America and Europe work in dialectic with one another, the first
providing the gifts of the body and the second providing the gifts of
the soul. By itself, Europe does not have the driving force or the
stamina to proceed with progress. By itself, America does not have the
civic conscience to make life anything other than a godless
consumerist nightmare in which the hand of man feeds and chokes at the
same time, destroying the spirit through psychological abuse and
spiritual degradation in order that the body could bloat out of
control. Without the gifts of spirit, the AMerican way does not have
foresight to address environmental damage caused by technological
progress, nor does it have a concept of human rights. The American
beats his talented youth out of all talent and inspiration and
thought, degrading it through physical violence and psychological
abuse into depression, suicide and psychological problems. Which state
of being reinforces the stereotype of creative people as being less
than sane and powers the mechanism of eliminating them from the gene pool.
The bottom-up American civilization results, in short, in the
omnipotent businessman who has no social consciousness or concept of duty to
fellow man; the top-down European civilization results in the
omnipotent government. Neither possess complete knowledge of what's in
the best interest of humanity, and they require each other for check
and balance. The dialectic between the Europeans and the Americans
will continue until America learns that the concept of God that it
practices also presumes the soul, and that the soul like the body
possesses inalienable rights. And that among these rights is the right
to noble feeling and thought and the art that cultivates the
preceding.
The Scarlet O'Hara story needs to be revised for the new millenium.
One must say, I will have beauty even if it kills me. One must be
willing to proclaim independence from consumer coercion and thus be in
an independent position to strive for citizenship. And in this concept
of citizenship one must rebuild true liberalism in this country.
Edmond Wollmann
> One must say, I will have beauty even if it kills me.
I wish it would, pal.
Edmond Wollmann
> Ilya Shambat wrote:
>
>
> > One must say, I will have beauty even if it kills me.
>
>
> I wish it would, pal.
This poster is from Altopia.net forging posts as me.
From: Edmond Wollmann <e...@astroconsulting.net>
Newsgroups: alt.angst,alt.romance,alt.support.depression,soc.singles,alt.astrology
Subject: Re: Citizenship
Date: Sat, 25 Oct 2003 13:18:43 -0700
Organization: Altair Counseling SAN 299-5603
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David O'Lantern
> The pure Christian order, manifest in Middle Ages, is separation
> between spirit and world, creating a world of injustice and
> spirituality of misery.
Which is why Christianity is a BAD thing, right? So you've kicked
Jesus out of your, uh, heart, so now you're a Jew again? Right?
> In Romeo and Juliet, spirit comes into the world to take the form
> of pure passionate love. The pioneers of spirituality are sacrificed
> so that their families end their pointless feud, lead the world out
> of feudalism and join together toward creating a magnificent global
> civilization [...]
I think technically speaking Julia/ette is supposed to kill herself
by herself, but because she's a Christian what you're thinking of
so loudly here might be permissable: she'd have to see that whatever
happens is part of God's plan. Of course you would have to sacrifice
yourself immediately afterwards, so that you could rise to that Pure
Land of Spirit -- instead of becoming the bitch of unevolved lifer.
(Surely you can't expect to get away with just murdering the ho now!)
I think it'd be far easier to just admit to yourself that deep down
inside you're a mixed-up little fag. Nobody'd have to die that way.
I'll be happy to teach to how *that* is done, Mathilda. You might
even have the brains to be a good Alanis Morisette impersonator.
D.
--
"You better understand that you're alone -- a long way from home."
---------------------------------------------------------------------
(C) `TheDavid^TM' 2003 | David, P.O. Box 21403, Louisville, KY 40221
Jeffrey Jupiter
wrote:
>Edmond Wollmann <e...@astroconsulting.net> wrote in message news:<bnelrg$elo$0...@pita.alt.net>...
>> Ilya Shambat wrote:
>>
>>
>> > One must say, I will have beauty even if it kills me.
>>
>>
>> I wish it would, pal.
>
>This poster is from Altopia.net forging posts as me.
Way to be unaffected, spankard.
Cujo
news:de874437.03102...@posting.google.com:
> Edmond Wollmann <e...@astroconsulting.net> wrote in message
> news:<bnelrg$elo$0...@pita.alt.net>...
>> Ilya Shambat wrote:
>>
>>
>> > One must say, I will have beauty even if it kills me.
>>
>>
>> I wish it would, pal.
>
> This poster is from Altopia.net forging posts as me.
Wrong again, dumbfuck.
NANAU and "alt.support.*" group snecked, AAM & AUK added. Kook ridiculed.
Nail. Hammer. Bang.
--
Cujo - The Official Overseer of Kooks and Trolls in
alt.paranormal, alt.astrology and alt.astrology.metapsych.
Winner of the 8/2000 & 2/2003 HL&S award. Hail Petitmorte!
Official TruKook(tm) as certified by Ed Wollmann. Meow.
"I never said such an idiotic thing." - Ed demonstrates his
short-term memory loss.
catb...@fwiw.com
>
>On Sat, 25 Oct 2003, Ilya Shambat wrote:
>
>> The pure Christian order, manifest in Middle Ages, is separation
>> between spirit and world, creating a world of injustice and
>> spirituality of misery.
>
>Which is why Christianity is a BAD thing, right? So you've kicked
>Jesus out of your, uh, heart, so now you're a Jew again? Right?
>
>--
Calling one's self a "Christian" or a "Muslim", or anything else for that
matter, doesn't mean that those so styling themselves, in fact, actually
practice the higher virtues of those faiths.
It is being asumed here that because a culture, like the Medieval European,
calls itself "Christian" they are axiomatically behaving as "Christians" are
supposed to behave and that the real issue is not, as it most surely is, a
matrix built around superstition/ignorance, material hardship, and social
oppression.
>> In Romeo and Juliet, spirit comes into the world to take the form
>> of pure passionate love. The pioneers of spirituality are sacrificed
>> so that their families end their pointless feud, lead the world out
>> of feudalism and join together toward creating a magnificent global
>> civilization [...]
Romeo and Juliet are not a new idea. See Publius Ovidus Naso's (Ovid)
'Metamorphosis.' Ideas about tragic love go back to the Hellenic Age and
probably beyond.
So no "new thing" comes into the world with Romeo and Juliet. Shakespeare is
merely tapping into a common and recognizable, theme. One he knew, showman that
he was, would strike a familiar and resonant chord with his audience. Stories of
tragic love destroyed by social convention are not uncommon in Medieval
literature.
As for Renaissance culture somehow superceding Medieval, I'll will respectively
remind you that more witches were burned in 16th and 17th centuries than in the
proceeding five. And that the Saint Bartholomew's Eve Massacre and the Spanish
Inquisition are both products of the so-called Age of Renaissance.
Cat
David O'Lantern
[...]
> I do not deny that I am Edmond Wollmann.
I do! I deny that I am Edmond Wollman!
What do I win?
Indigo Moon Man
> On Sun, 26 Oct 2003, bob wrote:
> [...]
>
>> I do not deny that I am Edmond Wollmann.
>
> I do! I deny that I am Edmond Wollman!
>
> What do I win?
>
>
Francisco treat! And of course as always, the home version of our game
show!
--
A good summary of my beliefs:
http://www.upci.org/doctrine
Michaela
news:e37mpvg2u2ac4d83p...@4ax.com...
> On 25 Oct 2003 17:56:36 -0700, in alt.astrology, Azim...@yahoo.com
(Edmond
> Wollmann) wrote:
>
> >Edmond Wollmann <e...@astroconsulting.net> wrote in message
news:<bnelrg$elo$0...@pita.alt.net>...
> >> Ilya Shambat wrote:
> >>
> >> > One must say, I will have beauty even if it kills me.
> >>
> >> I wish it would, pal.
> >
> >This poster is from Altopia.net forging posts as me.
>
>
> No he isn't, Is he? You are telling another lie on usenet...Right?
>
> >From: Edmond Wollmann <e...@astroconsulting.net>
>
> Do you have ownership of the address e...@astroconsulting.net?
>
> Do live on Topanga Canyon Blvd in Chatsworth, California
>
> Then you are not the person that has control over astroconsulting.net Are
> you? Then unless The person that owns astroconsdulting.net complains, it
is
> none of your business, is it?
>
> If not you don't have the address e...@astroconsulting.net, then it isn't a
> "forgery", is it?
>
> Eddy for someone that claims to have a double degree, you don't have much
> of a grasp of the english or any other language. What were doing when you
> should have been in English class? out playing daredevil games?
>
>
> Bob Officer
> "Trust me, the astrological ramblings are not realistic, pragmatic, or
> applicable in real counseling or consulting scenarios either."
> Eddy Wollmann,
> Net Kook, liar and plagiarist,
> Message-ID: <3F9727...@earthlink.net>
And you bob, sound like a real sweetie. Just like all the other bobs.
- Michaela
Mr. 4X
news:r0nnpvkbgiunbfe4r...@4ax.com:
> Today, Sun, 26 Oct 2003 08:28:52 -0000, Two Buddha read a post from
> Cujo <cu...@petitmorte.newt> , Wicked Pete starting telling fibs
> about hacking
> SPNAK SPNAK
> Oh and:
>
>
>>Azim...@yahoo.com (Edmond Wollmann) wrote in
>>news:de874437.03102...@posting.google.com:
>>
>>> Edmond Wollmann <e...@astroconsulting.net> wrote in message
>>> news:<bnelrg$elo$0...@pita.alt.net>...
>>>> Ilya Shambat wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> > One must say, I will have beauty even if it kills me.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I wish it would, pal.
>>>
>>> This poster is from Altopia.net forging posts as me.
>>
>>Wrong again, dumbfuck.
>>NANAU and "alt.support.*" group snecked, AAM & AUK added. Kook ridiculed.
>>Nail. Hammer. Bang.
>
>
> Edmos stupidity revealed YET AGAIN? What the fuck? How many usenet
> psychics are spanking Wedmo now?
IMNSHO not enough - Wollkook is still online...
catb...@fwiw.com
>Remember love is when a lot of strangers kiss your
>ass because you are just too wonderful.
Well, I have a really nice ass - and I AM wonderful!
;}
Cat
Ilya Shambat
> And you bob, sound like a real sweetie. Just like all the other bobs.
I parsed the second sentence as "Just like all the other boobs."
David O'Lantern
Why, Ilya? Have many boobs do you have?
Some bitches have 8.
bob
Coming from you ...
bob
please send me a picture of it for independent verification purposes