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OPERATION LOCKDOWN
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OPERATION LOCKDOWN

The entire world has declared a permanent red alert, and all world leaders
have just put the whole phy$ical universe on lockdown. The troops are fanning out
and will be on every street corner by tomorrow morning, and all prisons and jails have
initiated 24 hour lockdown for all inmates. Robots and drones will be patrolling everywhere,
with shoot to kill orders; no warning shots fired.

The mega survellence and control grid, dubbed "Securitron" will watch
everybody 24/7 and there is no escaping it. All of your movements will be
micromanaged and controlled, and everyone is a suspect for all crimes and
terrorist acts.

All constitutions and bill of rights worldwide have been eliminated, and
anybody caught without their tracking chip will be executed and creamated on the
spot. Everbybody will have to wear a jumpsuit with insignia and their rank in society,
and no freedom of religion, expression, or thought will ever be permitted again

This is all to protect the powers-to-be, and bring in a glorious new future.

Your life as it's been, is over.

---===S=[|_|r|-|-r[]|\|===--- Master of the universe!
anonymous Other October 16, 2018 at 2:57 am 1 0
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Total Recall - Two Weeks [HD]
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Comments • 1,068

Add a public comment...

MasteroChieftan
I love how the animatronic lady head opens up to reveal yet another Arnold animatronic head.
1 week ago
792
27


GenX TV
Yes! But it really looks quite good. Also the animatronics used when Arnold pulls out the tracking device. I think the pacing of the cutting helps. Unlike that repair scene in The Terminator, which lingers on the bad animatronic of Arnold far too long -- I still love that movie though.

READ MORE
1 week ago
55


whats his name?
the first head was supposed to be animatronic but was a real head edited to look like a robotic head, and the second head was actually an animatronic head supposed to to be a real head. pretty cool all the same.

READ MORE
1 week ago
20


Adam Repcik
So like Inception but only in the 80s? ;)
6 days ago
3


Nantawat Kittiwarakul
Maybe half stop-motion, half animatronics. The mechanics might not be able to keep up this complex motion in real time. So it might be done at say, 4 fps instead of 24 fps. (Late 80's robotic technology, you get the idea)

A very, very great practical effect however. Took me years to realize how they got this shot done.

READ MORE
6 days ago (edited)
5


El Roo
Rob Bottin, bit of a legend for that sort of Thing
6 days ago
5


SAMUS-RD1 CHANNEL
Stop Motion head!
6 days ago
1

Drewdog
@El Roo I see what you did there, and I highly appreciate it.
5 days ago
1


Loukhyax
@whats his name? So the lady's head was real (with edition of course)? Because it really looks very well crafted, much better than Arnold's fake head, at the least looking nowadays. But the effects are really nice to see.

READ MORE
5 days ago


whats his name?
@Nantawat Kittiwarakul hit the nail on the head. that exactly. the opening of the head is a combination.
5 days ago
1


whats his name?
@Loukhyax i mean with the edition; going from the real head to stop frame, and returning to the fake physically whole head.
5 days ago (edited)
1


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ZombieStain65
Can’t say “yes or no” but can say “get ready for a surprise.” Lol
1 day ago
35
1


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Peter Frank
Her acting actually seemed like she's animated.
2 days ago
5


Negan The Vegan
Someone needs to dub this over with that "It's ma'am, IT'S MA'AM' video from Game Stop lol
2 days ago
5


teddy mills
not possible to hear "two weeks" without recalling this scene.
4 days ago
51
4


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Torrey Bell-Edwards
This woman--Priscilla Allen--was my drama teacher in high school, she was amazing. She used to pretend to answer the phone and go "Oh Arnold, you MUSN'T call me here, no one can know..."
6 days ago
86
10


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Chris J.P. Black
"Quaid. That woman. Get him. Get her." Lol.
1 day ago
2


emp100k
Had the forethought to program the head to say "get ready for a a surprise", but noting else for dialog besides "2 weeks"...
1 day ago
3


kiyonexus
This movie is so legendary... there's so many good scenes and lines... it's damn good... man they can't make movies like this anymore... Paul Verhoven is a genius too.. Robocop was amazing and Total Recall... I mean come on... he was on a roll

READ MORE
1 week ago
340
30


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Lu
The ear popping out didn't make much sense, there was no space inside the mask to fit that thing.
1 day ago
2


Derrick T
2 weeks: That's how long the lock-down was supposed to be. Maybe we should get our ass to mars.
6 days ago (edited)
232
22


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Recht_voor_zijn_raap
30 years old and the special effects still hold up.
Thats why I highly prefer practical over CGI.
CGI should be used to enhance the effects, not totally replace them.
6 days ago
80
4


ResidentWebbo
Agree. I think it's because your mind knows it's "real" and not computer generated.
5 days ago
11


the missing link
Sure. Like Arnold's head when he unmasked.
3 days ago
6


jpegovitch
The windows not being bulletproof still holds up? Lol
2 days ago
1


Curtis
No they don't they look weird as shit, like I can see the skill that's been put in but it does not hold up
22 hours ago


GIVE EARTH BACK TO DINOSAURS.
Richter opens fire at everything he sees in this movie.
5 days ago
24
1


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Spenser
0:55 it's actually got the name of the actress who plays the Two Weeks-lady, Priscilla Allen.
3 months ago
134
11


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guyverjay
Lol surely emergency shutters should shut automatically when pressure drops rather than waiting for.someone to press the big red button 🤣
6 days ago
4


Greg Elliott
2020: how long you in quarantine for? Me: 2 weeks
6 days ago
131
11


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tokyosmash
Michael Ironsides expression when the head starts to come off is everything.
6 days ago
167
3


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Robin Stiff
Saw it at the theater, blew me away. I HATED the remake.
1 week ago
190
34


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Newbeginnings19 2019
This is how my stupid unmarried aunt acts when she goes on a Open Bar Carnival Cruise.....
1 week ago
178
15


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Edin Hamidović
And to think that the whole air vacuum scene could have been avoided if only they had the amazing adhesive powers of Flex-Tape
1 day ago
1


Hagen Butto
She still makes more sense than what most of my elderly lady customers say.
1 month ago
175
6


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ivannthegreat1
“ Get Ready for a Surprise“ ( And that’s when the Fat Lady Sings ) .
5 days ago
69
2


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aboctok
Now when I'm in a stressful situation, I yell through gritted teeth: THEY'RE ALL CONNECTED.
6 days ago
96
5


Magsec5
aboctok and kiss!
4 days ago
1


aboctok
@Magsec5 Of course.
4 days ago
1


Jesus Margarito
Do you know if the guy saying that is Kramer of Seinfield?
3 days ago


aboctok
@Jesus Margarito Michael Richards, no I'm afraid I don't know who it is, but it's not Richards. Whoever it is nearly gets whiplash from that enthusiastic shove by Michael Ironside. Hope they got that in one take.

READ MORE
3 days ago


Ryan Ds
That’s Mark Alaimo.... best known as Gul Dukat from Star Trek: Deep Space 9
2 days ago
1


Not Sure - 2020
Funny that the reboot of this movie played homage to this scene
1 week ago
2


Jack Benton
Apparently in this movie's universe humanity has the knowledge and the tech to make not just a permanent colony on Mars, but literal CITIES with space ports and everything...yet they don't even have the ability to create something called "automatic shutters" that simply close IMMEDIATELY upon explosive decompression. I guess it makes more sense to require a big red "emergency" button be pushed by one of the people who would almost certainly be sucked out into the vacuum of space in order to save every single living organism inside the building! I also like how Richter's gun just blasts right through the outer window as if it was as thin as the kitchen window in your average American home. Excellent engineering fellas!
1 week ago
171
31


Zoloft77
That's something that Craig from South Park would say.
6 days ago
8


integral
Best not to expect much logic from this movie.
6 days ago
4


harizotoh7
They also use regular glass that shatters really easily rather than even tempred glass that cars use.
6 days ago
10


brakogar
Remember its a corporate world so cost cutting is more important as long as a pretense of safety exists.
6 days ago
18


MEMATRON
Sorry nerd, but that was not explosive decompression. It was rapid decompression. The scenes where their eyes are popping out of their heads was explosive decompression.
6 days ago (edited)
4


TheKaiTetley
MEMATRON NERD ALERT! 🚨
6 days ago
2


MEMATRON
@TheKaiTetley I'm a super nerd. I was a nerd before it was cool in the 80's
6 days ago
3


Murtaza Rizvi
thanks for ruining one of the greatest scenes in sci-fi movies.
6 days ago
1


PeteTheGrouch
@RaiderOfTheLostTwitch Bruh, take your meds... or grab a snickers.
6 days ago
2


Pat McDonald
One advantage to manual controls is you can't hack 'em.
5 days ago
1


MEMATRON
@Pat McDonald Surely, you jest. My parents had a big freezer with frozen treats. I used to pick the lock on it with either a corn holder or top part of a click pen. This was pre-internet in the 1970's and I figured it out because, HACK THE PLANET!
5 days ago


Pat McDonald
@MEMATRON , not really applicable to my post. Also, if your parents had armed guards next to it as per the movie, you wouldn't have even tried.
5 days ago


MEMATRON
@Pat McDonald It's most applicable. You wrote, "One advantage to manual controls is you can't hack 'em." You're wrong. The subject you started is about the ability for manual controls to be hacked. I provided an example of a manual interface being hacked. Hacked by a 6 year old kid by the way, lol. Additionally, one of my parents is black. That's an even more challenging hack to pull off than one watched by armed guards, ya dig? I still did it, knowing the risk so your little guard example is irrelevant.
5 days ago (edited)


Pat McDonald
@MEMATRON manual manipulation of a lock is not the same thing as the remote operation of an automated control via network access, AKA "hacking". Have a nice day.
5 days ago


MEMATRON
@Pat McDonald Hacking isn't just with computers. I've given talks at hacker conventions. You need to attend one and learn something. You've watch too many movies with zero real world experience. Come on, you have access to the total sum of human knowledge. You have no excuse for being this naive.

READ MORE
5 days ago


K LaCoste
yeah the colony was horribly designed lol. they should've just kept the shutters closed permanently
5 days ago
1


John Cusick
there were shutters that closed
4 days ago


Philip Jones
It's a city designed by movie directors and acting luvvies. Most of them thing a 'dangerous vacuum' is a Hoover with teeth.
4 days ago
1


Yseson _
Also why does Mars have vacuum equivalent to outer space?
4 days ago (edited)


MartyvH
Yseson _ The atmospheric pressure is 0.6% of Earth's so it's virtually a vacuum.
4 days ago (edited)
2


plateshutoverlock
Why would a low pressure sensor even need to be on a network? Sensor wired to button circut- done.

Of course, everything today is IoT crap, so I bet if this was real life, it would be remote hackable. :\
1 second ago


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Jonathan Cineus
When you give your 2 week’s notice to quit your job but you’re gonna go crazy if you stay there another minute
1 day ago
1

Golden Jaguar
Get ready for a surprise! 🌝💥
4 months ago
52
3


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Michael Lam
The reboot of this movie sucks crap. It is not even near as entertaining as this movie. Arnold is great in this movie even though he still can’t speak English if his life depended on it.
5 days ago
73
6


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Ch Pe
This was my dad's favorite movie. I had I hard time sneaking by the couch without being asked to watch this with him.
1 week ago (edited)
30
13


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Plissken 21
She's also at the start of Kindergarten Cop. Arnold's character, John Kimble, pushes past her to get down the mall escalator.
6 days ago
103
7


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Lemaure44
Legend has it that she was married to Johnny Cab.
5 days ago
25

Jeremy Robs
"I'm a ginger Hagrid with a haunting smile who needs to blend in. Better wear this yellow trenchcoat."
1 week ago
164
7


SHOW MORE REPLIES
Neal Parr
The special effects are Still mint and I do prefer them than CGI
3 days ago
1

NeonAce
I’m surprised how he didn’t have a Yes or No to his reply
2 days ago

Gallivanter
Anytime anyone says "two weeks" this is all I hear. Every time I say "two weeks" I mimic this lady.
2 days ago
1

Pat O
Richter needs to be careful treating Gul Ducat with such disrespect.
4 days ago
2

stardude2006
The guy with the beret is Marc Alaimo , Gul Dukat from DS 9.
1 day ago
1

SouthwesternEagle
Wow. There are so many things wrong with this scene that I was doubled over laughing. This is ST TOS S3 level of cheesy. X'D
2 days ago
1

L S
Back when movies were not only fun, but were well acted as well.
1 week ago
84
13


SHOW MORE REPLIES
Think for yourself.
"See you at the party Richter." The Terminator
4 days ago (edited)
1

[blinking...@gmail.com]

plateshutoverlock
Look how planes violently decompress at 30,000 feet. Mars atmospheric pressure is MUCH less than that.
1 second ago


Luigi Master
Corporate greed at the cost of human lives/health is a fairly consistent theme throughout this film. While this particular safety oversight was probably done so we could have a cool action scene, it wouldn't be out of character for the mars corporate entities to skimp on automated shutters in sectors they considered less important. And, perhaps the system was automated, but the electronics powering the automation weren't being maintained very well.
3 days ago


Matthew Eurich
They also use the old style CRT monitors.
3 days ago

Shadowcub69
Hell where is the transparent aluminum? Someone isn't practicing safe gun control, yeah let me shoot where all these windows keep the atmosphere in.
3 days ago

Raul
I guess they dont have bullet proof glass in the future.
3 days ago

Kevin Kelly
We will protect this dome with...plate glass windows!
3 days ago

MyCrackpotTheories
For that matter, why do they use guns with bullets?
3 days ago

Taraxanoid
And they can implant memories in people yet they still use CRT monitors.
3 days ago

James Williams
Government contractors cutting corners, and by the time they found out it would have been too expensive and embarrassing to replace. So they figured maybe it would last long enough that they would be retired or they would have a lot of plausible deniability. In other words blame someone else. 😊

READ MORE
3 days ago

SouthwesternEagle
@integral You got that right! :P
2 days ago

SouthwesternEagle
@Murtaza Rizvi LOL! X'D This scene was illogical in so many ways though! :p
2 days ago

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Crocodile Dundee 1986 - A Big Crocodile Gets Up In Her Face
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NotoriousDillinger
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Comments • 174

Add a public comment...

plateshutoverlock
What's cool is that she could not lean forward to get the strap off or else her head would get bitten off. She could not hunch down further to do the same. Imagine if the strap didn't break and Dundee could not get there in time to save her.
1 second ago


Brad Stephens
" that croc was going to eat me "
" oh I wouldn't hold that against him, the same thought crossed my mind a time or two "
6 months ago
22

William Bird
I can't blame the crocodile; I'd like to eat that, too! :)
7 months ago
28

Alex Roth
Those are some nice cheeks
1 year ago
40
1


SHOW MORE REPLIES
lazycalm41
Linda Koslowski in that one piece is the stuff of teenage fantasies!!...still! How could Paul resist her after that scene in the film.
1 year ago
56
4


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Gus Fox
Croc just wanted to give her a kiss, and who could blame him with her wearing an outfit like that, strewth!
1 year ago
30

J.P H
....that croc just wanted to do what all us men were thinking.. lol.
7 months ago
10
1


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Jason Bardell
I know it's only a film but if that was real that croc would have pulled her in .in a sec
1 year ago
56
11


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Некто в Сером
She should have asked him then: "How comes you are here? You were supposed to take a different route"
6 days ago

Francis Ling
Thank god those 80's style high cut swimsuits are coming back into fashion... quite some haunches
7 months ago
6

mel bias
now those are nice buns. saw this at the theater and they looked better on the screen. no wonder he married her.
11 months ago
17
2


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Pierre Pasquette
So thats what a guy gotta do to make a girl fall in love, duly noted
3 weeks ago
1

Clyde Balcom
That's what I call comedic relief.
10 months ago
2

hank scorpio
She is very hot
1 year ago
10

62202ify
Boy that'll wake you up. She was real lucky, that could've been her head.
1 year ago
4

patrick connolly
That croc got a bum deal.
7 months ago
1

FLMKane
'Crikey, what a beauty! It's such a big ass, Gorgeous!'

Lololol. Steve Irwin would just grab the croc by it tail :)
1 year ago
13
3


SHOW MORE REPLIES
Mitch Ross
All I can say is "damn ".
3 months ago

Rick Williams
Linda was excellent then; God Bless Her...
1 year ago
9

Brian Burke
Imagine Paul Hogan tapped that ass for real thousands of times. Jammy git 😀
7 months ago

Alan Deans
THAT is the finest butt EVER in movie-history !
4 months ago

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Stories

A Spaceflight Engineer Recovers the Lost Software For Apollo 10's Lunar Module
from the code-from-1969 dept.
Long-time Slashdot reader destinyland writes:
Vintage computing enthusiasts have recreated NASA's legendary "Apollo Guidance Computer," the 1960s-era assembly-language onboard guidance and navigation computer for the Apollo missions to the moon. Unfortunately, the software had been lost for the Apollo 10 mission (a manned "dress rehearsal" mission which flew to the moon eight weeks before Neil Armstrong's famous moonwalk mission).

But spaceflight engineer Mike Stewart found a clever way to recreate it, according to one science show on YouTube. Stewart found a print-out of an earlier version of the program, and "with the help of a small army of volunteers, Mike hand-transcribed the source listing and all of its programs..." — all 1,735 pages of it. (Though what used to take 25 minutes to compile together on a Honeywell mainframe now takes less than a second on his modern laptop.) There were also NASA memos which described the change, later versions of the program which had implemented the changes — and most importantly, a recently-discovered NASA document giving the checksum for every version of every program run on the Apollo Guidance Computer. So Stewart was able to cut-and-paste carefully-chosen code and variables from later versions of the program — based on the clues in NASA's memos — until he'd recreated a program with the exact same checksum.

There's also a separate video about the Apollo 10 code, highlighting "lighthearted comments in very serious code." (For example, to warn off people who'd change their crucial constants, they'd actually included a Latin phrase — a play on a biblical quote which translates roughly to "Don't touch these.") The ignition routine that actually lights the descent engine for the moon landing is named BURNBABY. The comment accompanying it? "OFF TO SEE THE WIZARD."
Posted by EditorDavid 8 hours ago

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Funny
System security (+1)
moxrespawn 8 hours ago
For example, to warn off people who'd change their crucial constants, they'd actually included a Latin phrase — a play on a biblical quote which translates roughly to "Don't touch these."
And fortunately, for the physical constants, nobody can.
Reply Share
Flag
Re: System security (+1)
rossdee 7 hours ago
"And fortunately, for the physical constants nobody can."
I am thinking that the moon has moved a bit further away from the Earth in the last 50 some years.
Reply Share
Flag
Re: System security (+1)
moxrespawn 7 hours ago
And did so as directed by the same physical constants.
Are you making an anti-physics argument? Hmm... well, in any case, no person changed anything causing this.
Reply Share
Flag
Re: System security (+1)
Ronin Developer 7 hours ago
If it hasnâ(TM)t, Iâ(TM)m sure itâ(TM)s thinking about it.
Reply Share
Flag
Old tech saves the day! (+5, Informative)
destinyland 7 hours ago
The weirdest thing about this is how the primitive 1969 actually helped them recreate the code.

The program they'd wanted to recreate was a total of 72 kilobytes of code, but they spread it across 36 different 512-byte "banks" -- and there was even a separate checksum for each bank!
Reply Share
Flag
Apollo 10 was fun... (+1)
Baby Yoda's Daddy 7 hours ago
I read the NASA didn't provide enough fuel on the lunar lander to prevent the astronauts from landing on the moon to preempt Apollo 11 from that achievement. If they went down, it would have been a one-way trip.
Reply Share
Flag
Re: Apollo 10 was fun... (+1)
systemd-anonymousd 6 hours ago
I heard that too, but I'm assuming the primary motivation was to decrease the mass of the LM assembly to give them a larger safety margin for any burns.
Reply Share
Flag
Re: Apollo 10 was fun... (+1)
blindseer 6 hours ago
I read the NASA didn't provide enough fuel on the lunar lander to prevent the astronauts from landing on the moon to preempt Apollo 11 from that achievement. If they went down, it would have been a one-way trip.
I believe that this is well known by now. NASA may have kept this to themselves for a while since this may not have reflected well on them at the time. After the Apollo missions were complete there would be no need to keep this a secret.
There could have also been a number of made up reasons to do this besides keeping Apollo 10 from reaching the surface of the moon. They could have said this was a weight saving measure. It could be explained as a safety feature, since a lower fuel load would be a lesser danger in case of a fire, or whatever. Some of these reasons may be true, but simply overstated to make the excuse "stick". What this most certainly did was make it clear to the astronauts was that they were not to land on the moon.
Reply Share
Flag
Checksums are overrated
gavron 6 hours ago
There's a reason people have moved from simple CKSUM to MD5SUM and SHA and now AES.
I'm pretty sure since none of us have an Apollo lunar rocket and lander to test the software on, this is academic (or "moot" in the real world.)
Still, checksum and has col's happen. Don't assume you have the "exact same thing" because of it.
E
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Re: Checksums are overrated (+1)
blindseer 6 hours ago
The space in which one could get a matching checksum AND working code has to be very very small. This is made smaller with the memory they had available to work with.
There's only so many ways to arrange those bits in the memory, this is a very very large number. Of those there is a smaller number with the same checksum as that noted in the records they have on file. Of those is a smaller number that will run in a way that is logical for the mission. Of those is a smaller number yet that would be consistent with the memos made noting the changes to the code.
If this number is greater than one then I would be very surprised.
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Re: Checksums are overrated
gavron 6 hours ago
I agree in principle... but the problem is we have no way to verify that the code works other than "it runs".
When you're dealing with 8-bit machine code, there's a lot of leeway to get around issues. NOPs count.
So yeah, I do agree that it's possible this is close or even "right on" but I don't think it's 1:1.
E
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Re: Checksums are overrated (+2)
Samantha Wright 4 hours ago
The actual Apollo 10 code (Luminary 69 Rev 2) was created by backporting changes from later versions (Luminary 70+ code into Luminary 69, which was the actual printout they obtained). The checksums were computed for individual 512-byte blocks, on a 16-bit machine, meaning a check existed for every 256 instructions—of which only a few were different. They were able to match the checksums by copying and pasting code from the next version, following memos that detailed what changes were made. So, the amount of guesswork involved was near zero. Given these facts, I don't think it's unreasonable at all to assume they got it exactly correct, unless the actual L69R2 code contained an unnecessary change that deviated from the primary development history (of L69 to L70), such as swapping the order in which two values were stored or calculated.
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Re: Checksums are overrated (+1)
lgw 4 hours ago
No one uses MD5, SHA, or AES at low level to catch low-level bit errors. It's the wrong sort of tool. We moved to CRCs, and then ECCs. You don't use tools designed to catch deliberate falsification of data, you use tools designed to catch and ideally correct accidental bit flip or transpositions of the kind relevant to the problem at hand.
But most of the code in the Apollo missions was in Core rope memory, which doesn't have to worry about radiation causing bit flips. Bit of a pain to patch a bug, though, as you have to wait for the women to re-weave your computer. Fortunately, they were quite good at it.
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AGC restoration involving Mike Stewart (+4, Interesting)
caseih 6 hours ago
Mike Stewart has been working on the AGC and its software for several years now along with a crew of other enthusiasts who are all extremely talented geniuses, including Marc Verdiell, Ken Sherrif, and several others.
I watched with great interest the entire series of videos on CuriousMarc's youtube channel on restoring the Apollo Guidance Computer to full function, and actually using it to perform a simulated landing. Pretty neat to see that old software running on the real computer hardware, still performing perfectly. A tribute to those engineers in the 1960s who designed and created it including the women who literally sewed the bits into the ROM banks.
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Fanfold printouts were great (+2)
kmahan 5 hours ago
There's something about fanfold printouts that made writing/debugging assembly code a lot more fun than it is today. There are times I miss those days.
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Offensive terms (+2)
skoskav 4 hours ago
Uh oh. Those NASA engineers weren't very inclusive. This shit won't fly in 2020, grandpa.
/s
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Do Not Read (+1)
tchetch 4 hours ago
I am a complotist, Putin-lover, antisemite, racist, sexist, ... whatever ... So now every mission have been recreated in case there is a doubt on their reality. They had to because one the major science project of all humanity is sloppy, undocumented and hazardous. We know Parménide exact words but we know nothing about space exploration older than fifty years ago. Give me a break.
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Decoding Apollo Rope Memory (+1)
aberglas an hour ago
Work was done on some of the earlier missions
https://hackaday.com/2016/09/0...
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Lego Unveils New 'Robot Inventor' Mindstorms Kit
from the coming-for-Christmas dept.
After seven years, Lego has finally unveiled a new Mindstorms kit, reports PC Magazine -- the Lego Mindstorms Robot Inventor, available this fall for $359:
The Robot Inventor kit lets kids (or adults) build five different robot models out of 949 pieces, ranging from a four-legged walker to a bipedal wheeled robot that can give high-fives. All of these robots can be programmed to perform different tricks, like grabbing items, firing plastic projectiles, avoiding obstacles, and playing various sports with a ball.

The kit includes four low-profile, medium-angular motors; a color and light sensor; and a distance sensor, which work together with the Intelligent Hub block to power these robots and execute commands. Of course, like all Mindstorms kits, you can build your own robotic creations with the tools at hand, and add Lego Technic and System pieces for more complex projects.

The Intelligent Hub serves as the brain of Lego Mindstorms, and the block that houses the Mindstorms Robot Inventor Kit is the most advanced one yet. It features six input/output ports for sensors and motors, a six-axis gyro/accelerometer, a speaker, and a five-by-five LED matrix. The Intelligent Hub and all robots built with it can be controlled wirelessly over Bluetooth with the Lego Mindstorms Robot Inventor app for Android, iOS, Windows 10, and macOS. The app supports programming in both the tile-based Scratch language and in Python, for more complex projects that require the precision of written code.
Posted by EditorDavid 9 hours ago

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Viol8 9 hours ago
When I was young Lego used to be a reasonably priced kit of parts - a plastic version of meccano really - you could build anything with. Now its a cynical overpriced cash cow with many special use pieces and figurines that cant really be used in anything other than the particular assembly they came in. We no longer buy it for our kid.
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Re: Meh (+1)
JaredOfEuropa 8 hours ago
They realised that mistake years ago and greatly reduced the number of single purpose blocks in their kits. I’m not a huge fan of the franchise kits, but my nephews seem to like them. And there’s still Technic which has stayed more or less true to form. My one doubt about the modern Technic kits is that they go together a lot more cleverly. It’s impressive, but it might actually put off kids from trying their own builds.

Back when I was young, about half the kids treated Lego as plastic glue kits: build it once and play with it. The other half would build the kit once, then use the bricks for their own creations. I wonder if that ratio has changed.
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Re: Meh (+1)
Ormy 7 hours ago
When I was young the other kids just used to make houses and things with the lego people and roleplay with the characters. I was to introverted for that, I wanted to make machines. I watched my dad build a 3 speed gearbox out of technic lego but that was a bit beyond me at the time. K'nex gave me exactly what I wanted, I could build crude machines that worked and were less finicky/temperamental than those built from technic lego.
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Re: Meh (+2)
ToTheStars 8 hours ago
When I was young Lego used to be a reasonably priced kit of parts - a plastic version of meccano really - you could build anything with. Now its a cynical overpriced cash cow with many special use pieces and figurines that cant really be used in anything other than the particular assembly they came in. We no longer buy it for our kid.
Lego still makes sets like that -- outside of the big licensed themes, they have things like the Creator 3-In-1 line that are heavier on generic bricks and come with official instructions for alternate builds. (They used to have some pictures of alternate builds in the back of the instructions, even in their licensed sets, but I guess Lucasfilm or Disney or whoever said 'not anymore' -- ironic, given that lots of Star Wars ships were originally made by kitbashing official model kits, but whatever.)
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Re: Meh (+1)
chispito 8 hours ago
When I was young Lego used to be a reasonably priced kit of parts - a plastic version of meccano really - you could build anything with. Now its a cynical overpriced cash cow with many special use pieces and figurines that cant really be used in anything other than the particular assembly they came in. We no longer buy it for our kid.
I actually feel like non-licensed LEGO sets are cheaper than ever, inflation adjusted. But this isn't a LEGO kit, it's a modular robotics kit.
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Re: Meh (+4, Insightful)
thegarbz 7 hours ago
When I was young Lego used to be a reasonably priced kit of parts - a plastic version of meccano really - you could build anything with. Now its a cynical overpriced cash cow
What do you base this on? Let's look at this in detail shall we?
1989 - 6285 Black Seas Barracuda - RRP $110 this thing was a beast it had 909 parts, many of which custom and could only be used on the Barracuda and works out to $0.121 per part or $0.2502 per part in inflation adjusted terms.
2011 - 4184 The Black Pearl - RRP $99.99 with slightly less parts at only 804, many of which are custom. Overall this worked out to $0.1245 per part or $0.1490 in inflation adjusted terms.
Ok say boats with custom parts haven't held up. Why not look at castles. 1984 - 6074 Black Falcon’s Fortress $35 RRP, $0.0805 per part and full of custom parts. Now I can't find a castle that cheap. Mind you I also can't find a castle with only 435 parts, but the 2012 9468 Vampyre Castle which has an RRP of $100 worked out to be $0.1054 per part. Not appreciably different and actually *much* cheaper when adjusted for inflation.
Your problem is you don't know the value of money. You look at a sticker price alone. You ignore the average Lego set in the 80s ran at 150 pieces where as in 2020 it runs at 375. You probably think inflation is a foreign concept like everyone including those people who think that $1000 smartphones is something new as opposed to a standard inflation adjusted price of a smartphone from the 90s.
You have a rose colored view of the past and ignore just how many custom blocks were in sets in the past. Sure you could buy just bricks and maybe you did. Personally my pride and joy was the 6958 Android Base. It was a monster and I think it was all custom blocks. There were only two possible things to build with it, but man it was awesome.
But if you are the overly creative type, head over to www.lego.com, and just buy bricks. You can buy basically any kind of brick in any colour and any quantity. Best of all, thanks to inflation you'll find the price is less than half of what it used to be back in the 80s, because that's the reality. The only one here cynical seems to be you using some factually incorrect "cost" as a justification for not buying your kids toys. For shame.
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Re: Meh (+1)
skam240 6 hours ago
Well you were completely spot on until you said "You probably think inflation is a foreign concept like everyone including those people who think that $1000 smartphones is something new as opposed to a standard inflation adjusted price of a smartphone from the 90s.". Maybe did you mean to type "cell phone"? Dumb cell phones were a rarity in the 90's and there were certainly no smart phones, the first iphone came out in 2007 and while there was some precursor stuff out there none of it dates back that far https://www.ooma.com/home-phon... .
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Re: Meh (+1)
TechyImmigrant 5 hours ago
A Newton with a GSM data brick counted. Kinda.
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Re: Meh (+1)
thegarbz 4 hours ago
Maybe did you mean to type "cell phone"?
Well companies have been showing off smartphone devices since the mid 90s, but technically the first true Smartphone as far as I can tell was the one announced in 1999 and which I bought in early 2000. Ericsson R380, ran Symbian OS, had a web browser, PDA which tracked timezones, and while using the internet on it was about as fun as a trip to the dentist it was very much a smartphone and with it's eyewatering $700 RRP it broke the $1000 barrier inflation adjusted before Apple and Samsung made it cool.
Dumb cell phones were a rarity in the 90's
Not sure which 90s you grew up in, but that smartphone I got in 2000 was my 3rd mobile phone. I'm pretty sure a good 50% of my school owned a Nokia 6110 at some point, which was late 90s, but 90s none the less. Sure, they weren't widespread, but they sure as hell weren't "rare"
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Re: Meh (+1)
Richard_at_work 3 hours ago
May I introduce you to the Nokia Communicator range, first released in 1996 - it was most definitely a "smart phone" as we would define them now - and it wasn't even the first.
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Re: Meh (+1)
Malays2 bowman a few seconds ago
Um, there were smartphones in the 90s:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wik...
Only back then they were for business professionals, and did not have stupid apps for putting big creepy anime eyes and cat ears on your self portraits.
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Re: Meh (+1)
Viol8 5 hours ago
You really need to get out more. Plus the pricing and sets were different here in the UK.
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Re: Meh (+1)
thegarbz 4 hours ago
You really need to get out more. Plus the pricing and sets were different here in the UK.
Get out more? It's been raining all day. I have no desire to leave the apartment.
And yes the pricing was different in the UK. But it was always difference and consistently different. For the best part of 30 years you've been paying the same 20% markup on Lego, so unless you moved from the US to the UK the above figures still hold very much true... at least up to 2016. When you guys shat the bed it's widely known that Lego was one of the companies that tacked on an additional 20% Brexit stupidity tax on your exchange rate.
But there's a reason behind it too. The average Lego block is now lighter than it once was, it's how they kept the cost the same despite what you think while wearing Elton John's glasses.
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Re: Meh (+1)
TechyImmigrant 5 hours ago
I have more money than when I was a kid. That overrides the other concerns.
As a kid: $99 (well UK pounds back then) : Not an option.
As a principle engineer with 30 years industry experience: $399 : Well if I like it I could buy it.
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Re: Meh (+1)
thegarbz 4 hours ago
Not sure why that's relevant. I don't think kids bought Lego. It's the parent's they they suck up to that open the wallet, regardless of whether they are engineers of principles or principal* engineers ;-).
Maybe you're actually a principle engineer, but this just triggered me because my own HR department could spell my job title when I got the role of principal engineer. :-)
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Re: Meh (+1)
TechyImmigrant 2 hours ago
I screw up principle and principal all the time. It's normal.
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When did you grow up? (+1)
skam240 6 hours ago
When did you grow up? I ask because when I was a kid in the 80's they were expensive then.
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Re: Meh (+1)
Darinbob 2 hours ago
Well, they computers are getting too advanced in my view. The original mindstorms was a simple 8 bit processor, you could use the dummy graphical programming language or roll your own. Lots of fun I felt, as a programmer. The later ones had a camera and would send images to your PC to do the work of figuring stuff out, so more advanced but also dumbed down in a way and not autonomous.
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RIP Lego?? (+1)
Type44Q 9 hours ago
When their patent expired, I thought they were surely toast - incredibly over-priced Lego 'Lego Batman' (WTF??) and ridiculously over-priced (but nonetheless awesome) Saturn V sets notwithstanding - but what they pulled out of their asses with Mindstorm is literally next-fucking-level shit.
Kudos to those glorious Danish bastards.
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Re: RIP Lego?? (+2)
ToTheStars 8 hours ago
ridiculously over-priced (but nonetheless awesome) Saturn V
Buying a Saturn V today might set you back a lot, since it's out of production, but its MSRP of $120 for 1,969 pieces was substantially lower than the typical 10c/part breakpoint (for their non-licensed sets, anyway...they charge more for the licensed sets because (a) license fees and (b) they know people will pay more for them).
When their patent expired, I thought they were surely toast
Star Wars and Bionicle saved them in 1999. Maybe that was in your Dark Age?
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Re: RIP Lego?? (+1)
thegarbz 8 hours ago
Lego didn't need Mindstorm to survive. It was going to survive based on 3 major traits:
1) Brand recognition, it's like Photoshop in that department. People will call Lego knock offs "Lego". That alone gives you incredible market power.
2) Quality, people like calling Lego overpriced but they are made to incredible tolerances and last and incredible amount of time. There are many knockoffs on the market and you can instantly feel the difference when trying to assemble something. Check out the Youtube video of Lego parts twisting a steel rod to breaking point: https://www.youtube.com/watch?...
3) Marketability, an extension of 1 and precisely the reason why the Lego Batman exists. They will partner with major pop culture media to sub-license, I've yet to see any other brick manufacturer do the same. What do your kid want, some junky white spaceship, or a black spaceship PILOTED BY BATMAN, nanananananananananananana Baaat Maaan!
But I do agree with Mindstorm being awesome. We had to do a university group assignment by building Mindstorm robots.
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Re: RIP Lego?? (+1)
TechyImmigrant 5 hours ago
NQC on the yellow compute brick was an excellent computing environment for kids to explore and learn stuff. Bare metal microcontroller + sensors + motor control + C like language.
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That price tag though. (+1)
Jason1729 8 hours ago
I have kids in just the right age range, my first thought was this will be perfect for them. For the price, I'd rather get them a Nintendo Switch, an Arduino kit, and maybe some Vex robotics kits.

For a smal pile of lego and a few electronic parts $360 is insane.
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Re: That price tag though. (+1)
chispito 8 hours ago
I have kids in just the right age range, my first thought was this will be perfect for them. For the price, I'd rather get them a Nintendo Switch, an Arduino kit, and maybe some Vex robotics kits.
Maybe the previous gen Mindstorms can be had used for a good price?
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Re: That price tag though. (+1)
drinkypoo 8 hours ago
If you already had Lego stuff around, it might be a good investment. I have a lot of Technics that would be interesting in this context, like pneumatics. On the other hand, I'm sure there's people gutting and re-stuffing their RCXs with Arduino already. The Lego motors historically are pretty good, though. And it sounds like they have good language support. Maybe it's worth it to people without electronics experience to just buy it.
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Re: That price tag though. (+1)
thegarbz 7 hours ago
For a smal pile of lego and a few electronic parts $360 is insane.
You missed something: Development platform. Depending on how old your kids are that Arduino Kit may very well catch dust very quickly. Mindstorm and the click together nature of Lego is orders of magnitude easier to get into than Arduino programming and Vex robotics.
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This FP For GNAA
Anonymous Coward 8 hours ago
worthwhile. So I Very sick and its or make loud noises BE treated by your the most vibrant
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The Internet has died. (-1)
Anonymous Coward 7 hours ago
Call me when they make actual metal Lego. (+1)
BAReFO0t 5 hours ago
Plastic for robots is just lame. No power, no rigidity, doesn't look like the Terminator ...
Why the hell aren't they offering metal editions of all their parts. (I know regular bricks are gonna have to be a little different to work. But when did Lego sell them the last time anyway? ;)

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U.S. Supreme Court Endorses Gay, Transgender Worker Protections
from the moving-forward dept.
The U.S. Supreme Court on Monday delivered a watershed victory for LGBT rights, ruling that a landmark federal law forbidding workplace discrimination protects gay and transgender employees. From a report:
The 6-3 ruling represented the biggest moment for LGBT rights in the United States since the Supreme Court legalized same-sex marriage nationwide in 2015. In the new ruling, the justices decided that gay and transgender people are protected under Title VII of the Civil Rights Act of 1964, which bars employers from discriminating against employees on the basis of sex as well as race, color, national origin and religion. Workplace bias against gay and transgender employees has remained legal in much of the country, with 28 U.S. states lacking comprehensive measures against employment discrimination. The rulings -- in two gay rights cases from Georgia and New York and a transgender rights case from Michigan -- recognize new worker protections in federal law.
Posted by msmash 3 hours ago
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Malays2 bowman a few seconds ago

Discriminating against a big group of people because some people who believe in some invisible magic sky daddy that says the first group are an "abomination" is wrong, VERY wrong.
This is another reason why I am now actively against religion. If they want to play this dirty, shitty little game, I will proclaim that my "god" Zanzar thinks all Christians are an abomination, and cannot enter the "Kingdom of Heaven"*. I'll launch lawsuits left and right forcing people to recongnise my "religion" and bow to my religious demands. Go ahead and try me.
*If "heaven" is going to be filled with hate filled scum, then I would rather go to "hell".
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This was an obvious decision (-1, Flamebait)
Anonymous Coward 3 hours ago
Filtered due to preferences.
Re: This was an obvious decision (-1)
Anonymous Coward 3 hours ago
Filtered due to preferences.
Re: This was an obvious decision (+1)
Anonymous Coward 2 hours ago
> Life is about survival, and what you can protect and what you can take.
Many animals live in herds and work to the benefit of the herd there by increasing survivability for any one member of the herd. Primates, including ourselves, work the same way. Having laws which garauntee protections, is simply the herd working to the benefit of itself, ensuring greater survivability for any one member, just scaled up to the complexities of humanity.
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Re: This was an obvious decision (+1)
MightyMartian 2 hours ago
But there are plenty of examples of cooperation in the natural world. Chimpanzees and horses don't function the way you say they should. Social species are, well, social, and work together for protection and propagation. The natural world does not function as you imagine it does. We are not lone wolves.
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Re: This was an obvious decision (+1)
serviscope_minor an hour ago
But there are plenty of examples of cooperation in the natural world. Chimpanzees and horses don't function the way you say they should. Social species are, well, social, and work together for protection and propagation. The natural world does not function as you imagine it does. We are not lone wolves.
It's not even limited to vertebrates or single species. There's amazing footage of an octopus and grouper working together to hunt. And various species of fish will form an orderly queue to be cleaned by a shrimp. The fish and shrimp will let humans join the queue.
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Re: This was an obvious decision (+1)
mark-t 2 hours ago

Humans have a single inalienable right: the right to choose.

This does not necessarily mean that you have the right to *effect* your choice in any way, but you still have the right to make that choice. For example, you can choose to have inner peace about your position in life or you can choose to be dissatisfied. You can choose to forgive someone who has wronged you, or you can choose to hold a grudge. You can choose to love someone, or you can choose to despise them.

The right of choice is unavoidable. Even not making any choice is itself a choice.
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Re: This was an obvious decision (+1)
smooth wombat 2 hours ago
Even not making any choice is itself a choice.

As the philosopher once said:

If choose not to decide, you still have made a choice!
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Re: This was an obvious decision (+1)
blindseer an hour ago
As the philosopher once said:
If choose not to decide, you still have made a choice!
Do you mean Rush?
That would be Rush the band, not Rush the talk radio guy.
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The right to choose may exist, it's not protected (+1, Insightful)
blindseer an hour ago
Humans have a single inalienable right: the right to choose.
Really? Then this ruling is in opposition of that. This ruling says employers cannot choose to fire people over their homosexual or transgender status.
What I'm seeing all too often is people proclaiming loudly on one's right to choose, and then berate people that choose different than them. It's like saying you can have any color of Ford Model T you like, so long as you like black.
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Re: The right to choose may exist, it's not protect (+1)
tsqr an hour ago
Humans have a single inalienable right: the right to choose.
Really? Then this ruling is in opposition of that. This ruling says employers cannot choose to fire people over their homosexual or transgender status.
Sure they can make that choice, providing they're willing to pay the price. Just like all the other people who make the choice to act like assholes.
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Re: The right to choose may exist, it's not protect (+1)
mark-t an hour ago
As I said, the right to choose does not necessarily entail the right to execute that choice, since your ability to take action can be limited by outside factors, nor does it include the right to ensure that the effects of that choice have any ramifications outside of yourself. Regardless, understand that the right to choose does not entail freedom from any possible consequences of executing that choice.

And to that point, you do have the right to choose to fire someone over their homosexual or transgender status, but if you should to actually execute that choice, or possibly even if you were to vocalize the intent around the wrong people even without actually doing anything about it, then there could be some pretty unpleasant consequences afterwards.
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Re: The right to choose may exist, it's not protec (+1)
c6gunner 15 minutes ago
I'm sure someone tried applying that argument back before abortion was legal too.
"Sure, your body your choice, but if you choose wrong there could be some unpleasant consequences ..."
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Re: The right to choose may exist, it's not protec (+1)
mark-t a minute ago
In that case, it's less about choosing "right" or "wrong" than it is about choosing to do or not do something that society has determined it won't tolerate.
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Re: This was an obvious decision (+1)
Rick Schumann an hour ago
"Rights" are an entirely human construct.
Yes, AC, they are, they are.

And today, some high-ranking humans reaffirmed that an entire class of humans has certain 'rights'. Someone else doesn't like that? Tough.
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Re: This was an obvious decision
Anonymous Coward 2 hours ago
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Re: This was an obvious decision (-1)
Anonymous Coward 2 hours ago
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Re: This was an obvious decision
Anonymous Coward an hour ago
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Re: This was an obvious decision (+1)
Sique an hour ago
So you like to call people in general with a pronoun they don't identify with? Then your action is fine with me. If you do it selectively with one specific group only, then I call you a prick.
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Re: This was an obvious decision (+1)
jellomizer an hour ago
I have always found these so called "Evangelicals" an odd bunch. I am a religious person, but I have found that it takes a lot of effort to make sure I am a good person, if I were to put effort in pushing my religion to others, that would only distract me from my ability to stay a good person.
Besides we all have our own unique sets of daemons. My method to help work on mine, won't work on others.
When ever I see people who out in the public try to convert everyone, and tell everyone how bad they are. I feel that they may not be conscious of their own sins they are doing. Ones Sexuality is only a small part of the whole person. This has shown as something that can't be changed in the person. So why press them on it, by quoting translated many times quotes from the bible. That were more focused around how nomads should deal with estate planning, than actual right and wrong.


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Re: This was an obvious decision (+1)
zkiwi34 24 minutes ago
It can and does change. Maybe not that often, but it is not a vanishingly small number who change.
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Re: This was an obvious decision (+4, Funny)
cpurdy 2 hours ago
"Libertarians can get fucked"

Don't they wish.
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Amplifying: (+1)
Rick Schumann an hour ago
Religious rights end where the rights of others begin. <strike>Libertarians</strike>Fake-ass 'conservatives' can get fucked.
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Re: This was an obvious decision (+1)
ranton 44 minutes ago
Religious rights end where the rights of others begin. Libertarians can get fucked
The libertarian viewpoint should be in line with your first statement, although in practice it isn't always the case. Too many people feel you are attacking their rights if you prevent their "right" to discriminate against others. This is where I feel many libertarians fall short when they complain about other groups fighting for their rights since that usually requires others to change their discriminatory behavior. It isn't a universal libertarian problem though; hypocrisy is rampant in all political ideologies.
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Re: This was an obvious decision (+1)
bugmenot151 6 minutes ago
The fuck do you mean "Libertarians can get fucked" Libertarians are not the ones causing problems for LGBT, hell, there are hardly any Libertarian people in congress. I think you are confusing Libertarians with Republicans.
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Just sayin' (-1)
Anonymous Coward 3 hours ago
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Bu ... but ... (-1)
Anonymous Coward 3 hours ago
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Re: Bu ... but ... (-1, Troll)
PhrostyMcByte 2 hours ago
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Also (+1)
SuperKendall 2 hours ago
Brett Kavanaugh Samuel Alito Jr. and Clarence Thomas decided to boost their approval rating with the ultra right and the evangelicals.
Conversely if you believe that statement, then you have to also believe Gorsuch is a champion of the left.
But whoever said the first thing, would never admit the second.
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Re: Also (+1)
dfghjk 2 hours ago
No you don't, because your argument assumes that "approval ratings" are the only determining factor.
We can always count on you, SuperKendall, to offer the most transparently ignorant, partisan, and divisive comments. How does that Trump loss taste to you? Suck it.
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Re: Also (+1)
c6gunner 8 minutes ago
No you don't, because your argument assumes that "approval ratings" are the only determining factor.
But the other guy already made the same assumption, so Ken is right; if you've already made the assumption then the other side is just as guilty. At least be consistent with your baseless assumptions.
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Re: Also (0, Flamebait)
Freischutz 2 hours ago
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Re: Also (+1)
zkiwi34 23 minutes ago
No âoehating onâ is done by people of all sorts of persuasions.
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Re: Bu ... but ... (+2)
fred6666 2 hours ago
Court rulings shouldn't be based on beliefs.
By voting against that, they basically say that the US law allow discrimination based on sexual orientation.
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Re: Bu ... but ... (+2, Insightful)
fred6666 2 hours ago
By looking at Title VII of the Civil Rights Act of 1964, it seems these 3 judges are right.
As much as I support gay rights, I do not support juges changing the law. The solution here is to have the elected lawmakers to change the law to forbid discrimination based on sexual orientation.
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Re: Bu ... but ...
Anonymous Coward 2 hours ago
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Re: Bu ... but ... (+4, Insightful)
dfghjk 2 hours ago
There can be no "sexual orientation" without consideration of sex, by definition. That's exactly what Gorsuch said. Same of course for transgender. The decision is obvious.
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Re: Bu ... but ... (+1)
fish_in_the_c an hour ago
ok... but can I still fire people for having anal or oral sex?
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Re: Bu ... but ...
Anonymous Coward an hour ago
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Re: Bu ... but ... (+1)
DigiShaman an hour ago
"Impeding workflow" and "Not being a team player" That's what would get them fired.
I guess that's one way of beating around the bush.
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Re: Bu ... but ... (+1)
dranga 19 minutes ago
I guess that's one way of beating around the bush.
Based on the ruling, you might not be able to fire them if they are into that sort of BDSM play either.
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Re: Bu ... but ... (+1)
tsqr an hour ago
ok... but can I still fire people for having anal or oral sex?
Sure, if they do it at work.
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Re: Bu ... but ... (+1)
fred6666 an hour ago
No. Sex doesn't includes sexual orientation. When I fill a form, I never answer "heterosexual" when asked what my sex/gender is.
The solution is simple. Just modify the law to make it explicit. Add another point, to this list:
Race.
Color.
Religion.
Sex (including gender and pregnancy).
National origin.
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Re: Bu ... but ... (+4, Insightful)
DRJlaw 2 hours ago
By looking at Title VII of the Civil Rights Act of 1964, it seems these 3 judges are right.
Employee: "I want to marry man."
Employer: "You're fired."
Employee: "Why?"
Employer: "Because you're a man."
Discrimination based upon sex. End of story.
Those three justices are trying to split hairs by saying that the employee is not being fired due to "sex" -- being a man -- but due to something else -- for example, expectations that men will marry women -- that is not sex. Here's Alito's logic in all its glory:
The discharged employees have one thing in common. It is not biological sex, attraction to men, or attraction to women. It is attraction to members of their own sex -- in a word, sexual orientation. And that, we can infer, is the employer's real motive.
That's bunk. The employer presumably wouldn't fire a woman for marrying a man. The employer is firing a man for marrying a man. The variable is sex. Reframing the circumstances is like reframing the physics of a murder. "I didn't shoot the victim, your honor, he recklessly ran into my stationary bullet."
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Re: Bu ... but ... (+2, Funny)
Anonymous Coward 2 hours ago
Employee: "I am a woman."
Employer: "But you have a penis."
Employee: "Even so, I am a woman."
Employer: "You're fired."
Employee: "Why?"
Employer: "Because you're insane."
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Re: Bu ... but ...
Anonymous Coward 2 hours ago
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Re: Bu ... but ...
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Re: Bu ... but ... (+1)
nealric 13 minutes ago
Why is the employer doing strip searches to find out what equipment the employee has?
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Re: Bu ... but ... (+4, Interesting)
gnasher719 2 hours ago
Employee: "I want to marry man."
Employer: "You're fired."
Employee: "Why?"
Employer: "Because you're a man."
There was a similar situation in court in the UK thirty years ago. The bosses wife was very jealous, which is why he couldn't hire a female secretary. So he hired a man instead. Until the wife found out that man was gay, so he got fired.


Court said "Being gay is not protected, tough for you". (That was thirty years ago). Next higher court said "wait a second... He got fired because the bosses wife is jealous. If he was a lesbian woman, he wouldn't have been fired because lesbian women don't have affairs with their male bosses. So he was fired because he was a man. Illegal."
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Anonymous Coward 2 hours ago
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Re: Bu ... but ... (+1)
SuricouRaven an hour ago
This sounds like a repeat of some legal arguments regarding segregation and miscegenation laws. "We're not denying anyone their rights! Everyone has the right to marry their own race, so everyone is equal."
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Re: Bu ... but ... (+1)
fred6666 an hour ago
Well at least that makes some sense, thanks. But I still think it's quite far-fetched, and would be much simpler to just change the law to make it explicit.
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Re: Bu ... but ... (+1)
egyas 33 minutes ago
Employee: "I want to marry man."
Employer: "You're fired."
Employee: "Why?"
Employer: "Because you're a man."
This is an argument made from ignorance. And I mean ignorance as defined...
"noun - the state or fact of being ignorant; lack of knowledge, learning, information, etc."
https://www.dictionary.com/bro...
First, let me say that the below is not a critique on whether or not gay/lesbian/trans employees should or should not be protested. It is simply my view on why the court's ruling was technically incorrect.
In Title VII, the term "sex" does not refer to the intimate act between Person A and Person B. That act is, frankly, irrelevant. The term "sex", as a legal term, at least at the time Title VII was written, is defined as the biological gender of Person A. It's also important to remember how gender was defined at the time Title VII was written, not re-defined as we have today.
In that case, whether Person A wants to have intimate acts w/ a male or female is irrelevant. The Title VII is saying you can't fire Person A solely because they are male or female. It's really that simple.
As society changes, and views on subjects such as transgenderism often change. As do the way we define words and terms in the public vernacular. It is important to remember that this does NOT retroactively change their meaning in legal documents written in the past. This would, simply put, be absolutely chaotically destructive as we would be able to "redefine", via public usage alone, any and all legal rights, protections, and laws themselves, without any action from the Legislature.
it's it NOT the courts role to weave society's often fickle viewpoints into the law. Their role is to simply decide whether the law itself, AS WRITTEN, is constitutional. It is the role of the Legislature to change laws. Separation of Powers is a fundamental precept in our governmental system that is being eroded more and more with each year.
I for one, am sad to see it go.
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Re: Bu ... but ... (+1)
XXongo 11 minutes ago
This is an argument made from ignorance. And I mean ignorance as defined...
"noun - the state or fact of being ignorant; lack of knowledge, learning, information, etc."
https://www.dictionary.com/bro......
The definition of argument from ignorance is not "I'm ignorant and making an argument."
In Title VII, the term "sex" does not refer to the intimate act between Person A and Person B. That act is, frankly, irrelevant.
So, you just made an argument that is based on your own ignorance.
Specifically, what you are ignorant about is that it is the job of the supreme court to rule on what the words mean. And... in terms of constitutional law, it is "frankly, irrelevant" what your opinion of the intent or meaning of the word "sex" is.
If the meaning of the word in the law is unclear or ambiguous, it is the job of the supreme court to rule on what it means.
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Re: Bu ... but ... (+1)
Pinky's Brain 6 minutes ago
I agree, it's not how it should be. But that went out of the window a long time ago.
Especially since Roe vs. Wade and the ridiculous specificity they manage to dig up out of supposedly the constitution, the Supreme Court has become defacto a higher standing law maker than congress. Sure constitutional amendment can still overrule them, but that's unrealistic.
The separation of powers in the US has become a joke.
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Re: Bu ... but ... (+1)
Pinky's Brain 25 minutes ago
Title VII doesn't disallow discrimination based on marital status at all ...
You could fire him for marrying either a woman, a man or a pig. All perfectly okay as far as Title VII goes. Sex doesn't come into it.
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Re: Bu ... but ... (+1)
dfghjk 2 hours ago
Perhaps you should read the majority opinion rather than response to yourself on /.
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Re: Bu ... but ... (+1)
r_naked 2 hours ago
I want to make it clear that this post is stating only the facts pertaining to LAW. It has nothing to do with whether I am FOR or AGAINST LGBTQ+ rights -- just addressing the law as written....
I think the part you may have missed is in bold below:
"(k) The terms "because of sex" or "on the basis of sex" include, but are not limited to, because of or on the basis of pregnancy, childbirth, or related medical conditions; and women affected by pregnancy, childbirth, or related medical conditions shall be treated the same for all employment-related purposes, including receipt of benefits under fringe benefit programs, as other persons not so affected but similar in their ability or inability to work, and nothing in section 2000e-2(h) of this title [section 703(h)] shall be interpreted to permit otherwise. This subsection shall not require an employer to pay for health insurance benefits for abortion, except where the life of the mother would be endangered if the fetus were carried to term, or except where medical complications have arisen from an abortion: Provided, That nothing herein shall preclude an employer from providing abortion benefits or otherwise affect bargaining agreements in regard to abortion."
That is why I always make sure that if I have a contract drawn up I try to leave as many of these little "loop holes" as possible. "Include, but not limited to" means that they can interpret it ANY WAY they want.
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Re: Bu ... but ... (+1)
Dixie_Flatline an hour ago
If you read the opinion (which I did, all the way through) the justices strongly belabour how exactly Title VII is applicable to orientation and gender identity. Really, the opinion goes on for way longer than I would think it would take to strongly make the point.
Alito's dissent (Thomas tagging along) tries to claim that sex and orientation/identity aren't linked, but the argument feels weak, especially after reading majority opinion.
Kavanaugh's argument was even weaker, claiming that because orientation and identity aren't specifically enumerated in the law, Title VII doesn't cover them, but that's bunk. The majority opinion again points out that the court needs to interpret statutes as these broadly, because it does not include language that's specifically exclusive (to wit, it does not say ONLY sex, race, etc. are invalid grounds for dismissal).
I recommend reading or at least browsing the opinions. See which one is most convincing to you.
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Re: Bu ... but ... (+1)
K. S. Kyosuke 2 hours ago
Court rulings shouldn't be based on beliefs.
You probably mean on faith. It's virtually impossible to not base court rulings on beliefs...unless you flip a coin or something like that.
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Re: Bu ... but ... (+1)
Freischutz 2 hours ago
Court rulings shouldn't be based on beliefs.
You probably mean on faith. It's virtually impossible to not base court rulings on beliefs...unless you flip a coin or something like that.
Really? It is impossible to reach the conclusion that everybody is equal under the law except gay people because it says in a bronze age scroll written by the prophets of a supernatural being nobody can prove exist, that gay people should not be equal to everybody else?
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Re: Bu ... but ... (+1)
K. S. Kyosuke 2 hours ago
I don't see how this is in any way related to what I said...? If a judge makes a decision based on his conviction that the decision he makes is the right one, that conviction is a belief and that decision is made based on that belief. Whatever bronze age scrolls say or don't say has no bearing on the fact that court decisions are being made based on what the judge presiding the case believes to be the right thing to do (i.e., in his mind his decision is the correct one).
Also, even if whatever you're saying there about bronze age scrolls were applicable, I still couldn't parse it.
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Re: Bu ... but ... (+1)
Freischutz an hour ago
I don't see how this is in any way related to what I said...? If a judge makes a decision based on his conviction that the decision he makes is the right one, that conviction is a belief and that decision is made based on that belief. Whatever bronze age scrolls say or don't say has no bearing on the fact that court decisions are being made based on what the judge presiding the case believes to be the right thing to do (i.e., in his mind his decision is the correct one).
Also, even if whatever you're saying there about bronze age scrolls were applicable, I still couldn't parse it.
Many Christian conservatives are of the opinion that because it says in a bronze age scroll written by the prophets of a supernatural being nobody can prove exist that gay people are an abomination, this means to them that gay people should not be equal to everybody else. In other words that Christian scripture supersedes the law. You then made the claim that it is impossible to avoid basing your rulings on your beliefs, that it is impossible to come to the conclusion that law overrides scripture when ruling in a court case. I have issues with that idea for the simple reason that two conservative SCOTUS judges just proved you wrong.
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Re: Bu ... but ... (+1)
ThosLives an hour ago
Many forget those same "scrolls" also say that the second most important law is to love your neighbor as yourself.
The SCOTUS ruling is fine for those of us who believe that treating people kindly, even if they do things on which moral beliefs differ, is more important than moral compliance.
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Re: Bu ... but ... (+1)
tsqr an hour ago
You then made the claim that it is impossible to avoid basing your rulings on your beliefs, that it is impossible to come to the conclusion that law overrides scripture when ruling in a court case. I have issues with that idea for the simple reason that two conservative SCOTUS judges just proved you wrong.
No, they didn't. The "two conservative SCOTUS judges" didn't rule anything. A minority opinion is not a ruling. Aside from that, there is nothing in the written opinions that would support an assertion that the justices were basing their opinions on religious belief or the contents of bronze age scrolls; that's just what you believe.
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Re: Bu ... but ... (+1)
K. S. Kyosuke 4 minutes ago
Did you even read what I linked above? Probably not, since otherwise you wouldn't make such silly claims as "two conservative SCOTUS judges just proved [me] wrong". Beliefs have nothing to do with religion.
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Re: Bu ... but ... (+1)
fred6666 an hour ago
I meant personal values/opinion. Yes you can include faith into that, but it's more than that.
If I am a judge and I think that homosexuality should be forbidden, and the law doesn't say so, then I *MUST* say it's permitted in my cases. Otherwise, I am not doing my job.
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Re: Bu ... but ... (+1)
PCM2 2 hours ago
Court rulings shouldn't be based on beliefs.
Quite right! The Court's explanation of relevant law and the interpretation that resulted in its ruling is called an opinion.
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Re: Bu ... but ... (+1)
Keick 2 hours ago
Court rulings shouldn't be based on beliefs.
Laws should be weighed against the founding documents of our country, which were at least somewhat based on their beliefs and experiences with the British Empire.
By voting against that, they basically say that the US law allow discrimination based on sexual orientation.
You just said they should NOT make rulings based beliefs, then went on to imply they should 'believe' that there are non-biological genders and make laws protecting those?
We ALREADY have a law against discrimination based on sex. Sexual orientation, if anything, should be viewed as a subdivision of sex. Maybe what they are saying is the law already deals with this?
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dfghjk 2 hours ago
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Re: Bu ... but ... (+1)
Freischutz 2 hours ago
Brett Kavanaugh Samuel Alito Jr. and Clarence Thomas decided to boost their approval rating with the ultra right and the evangelicals.
One of the big points of the supreme court is that approval rating doesn't really matter. People aren't voting you out, so you can make non-political choices. They just legitimately believe LGBTQ+ should be considered less than their fellow citizens.
So SCOTUS justices are above currying favour with certain political factions for personal gain? I don't think so. This ruling has pretty clearly shown which of these conservative justices base their ruling on the law and the constitution (Neil Gorsuch and Chief Justice John Roberts, nice to know there's two of them) and which ones (Brett Kavanaugh, Samuel Alito Jr. and Clarence Thomas) base their rulings on ...ummm ... let's call it 'factors other than just the law'.
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Anonymous Coward 2 hours ago
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Re: Bu ... but ... (+3, Insightful)
guruevi 2 hours ago
Perhaps you should read the decision instead of spouting nonsense.
Kavanaugh, Alito and Thomas (who is black by the way), all supported the rights and said it should be that way but stated that it was not the judiciary's law to fix broken laws, only to interpret them. It's a violation of the constitution for the judiciary to make up new laws wherever it suits them, which they did in this case.
Why didn't the Democrats do it when they had the majority in House, Senate and the Presidency? Perhaps it doesn't matter to them as long as you vote for them. The Democrats still have the House, yet no legislation on this was forthcoming.
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Re: Bu ... but ... (+1)
DRJlaw 7 minutes ago
The Democrats still have the House, yet no legislation on this was forthcoming.
Really? They sure fooled me on that one.
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Re: Bu ... but ... (+1)
cpt kangarooski 2 hours ago
Seriously though, this means that of the five conservatives on the SCOTUS, Neil Gorsuch and Chief Justice John Roberts have a spine
Maybe...
The rule in the Supreme Court is that the seniormost justice in the majority (or the Chief Justice, if they're in the majority) decides who writes the opinion. It's not unheard of for this to be used strategically, where a justice will join in order to narrow the scope of the majority opinion. It's possible that the opinion would've been better but for Roberts' involvement.
But I haven't had time to read it yet, so I can't say that it's been hobbled.
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Re: Bu ... but ... (+1)
dskoll an hour ago
I did read the opinion. I don't think it was hobbled in any way. They very strongly and clearly rejected all of the defendants' arguments.
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Victory! (+1, Troll)
dskoll 3 hours ago
This is a very important victory, almost as important as 2015's Obergefell v. Hodges.
Next up: Smackdown of Pence's anti-trans HHS directive.
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Re: Victory! (+1)
dskoll an hour ago
Above got voted "Troll"? Slashdot never disappoints.
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And a defeat of them Constitution (+1)
raymorris 21 minutes ago
Possibly most people would say that there should be a law protecting LGBT people from workplace discrimination. I won't disagree with that here. (There may be details worth discussing, but that's a different thread).
Since we're talking about the United States, such a law would be created the way laws are created in the United States - either by Congress or the state legistlatures. Then when specific cases come up, the courts would figure out if and how the law applies to a specific case.
Here we have the court entirely inventing brand new law. That's the job of the legistlative branch, not the judicial branch. Our system doesn't give judges dictatorial power to just make up law however they see fit. Judges have the power to apply the pre-existing law to a particular case, and only that power.
So a victory for LGBT and a sad defeat for the Constitution and the American system. Another step toward dictatorial /oligaricharchial control by nine unelected people.
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RIP Voter choice
Anonymous Coward 2 hours ago
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Re: RIP Voter choice (+1)
jacks smirking reven 2 hours ago
Who were "the guys who wrote and passed the laws" and were they infalliable?
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Re: RIP Voter choice
Anonymous Coward 2 hours ago
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Re: RIP Voter choice
Anonymous Coward 2 hours ago
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Re: RIP Voter choice
Anonymous Coward 2 hours ago
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There are three branches of government (+1)
raymorris 29 minutes ago
Okay, so ...
The United States has three branches of government. The legistlative branch makes the law. They decide what the law should be. The are accountable to the voters by needing to be re-elected every two years or every six years. The House every two years so they are responsive to current issues; the Senate every six years to moderate that so that passions from one well-publicized case is less likely to result in a law that is bad overall, bad in the long run. Right now, people are upset about police violence, so Congress will need to adjust the laws related to that. People elect legistlators whom they think will make good laws. According to voters, these people are qualified to decide what the law should be.
The executive, headed by president and by governors, carries out the law. The president is accountable on a medium-term cycle, every four years. The executive branch is responding to current events by changing policies, the details of how laws are carried out. People elect executives (presidents and governors) whom they think will do a good job carrying out the existing law.
The judicial branch looks at each individual case and decides which of the existing laws applies to a given case. For example, the law (passed by the legistlature) is that self-defense is a valid reason to do violence. The court decides whether a particular person in a particular instance was acting in self-defense. Their job is NOT to decide if self-defense is a good reason to hit someone; their job is to decide if the pre-existing self-defense law applies in a specific case.
Juddges are chosen based on their ability to do that job. They should know the law and they should be able to apply the existing law fairly, unswayed by how much press a particular case gets or doesn't get. Because they are supposed to convict a person or not based on what the defendant DID, not based on whether CNN is talking about the case, they are purposely insulated from pressure by voters or anyone else.
Judges are chosen based on who is qualified to apply the law to a particular case. It's not their job to make up new laws and they aren't chosen by the voters on the basis of "who should br making new laws?"
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Re: There are three branches of government
Anonymous Coward 11 minutes ago
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Re: RIP Voter choice (+1)
dfghjk 2 hours ago
In this case "the laws" do what "the guys" intended so what's the complaint, comrade?
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Re: RIP Voter choice
Anonymous Coward 2 hours ago
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Time to abolish the Civil Rights Act (+1, Interesting)
mi 2 hours ago
protected under Title VII of the Civil Rights Act of 1964
Back then, America sacrificed an essential freedom — that of not associating — to gain, not even security, but something even less tangible.
Sixty years later, the hoped for gain did not materialize. Time to restore the sacrificed liberty — and apologize.
There is no argument supporting the ban on discrimination in the workplace, that would not also apply to, for example, dating. If a business-owner turning down four Black applicants, then hiring an Asian has to defend himself from charges of racism, why shouldn't a girl rejecting multiple Black suitors to go out with a White be put on the same spot?
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Re: Time to abolish the Civil Rights Act (+4, Insightful)
UnknowingFool 2 hours ago
There is no argument supporting the ban on discrimination in the workplace, that would not also apply to, for example, dating.
So you are essentially saying that businesses can put up signs saying: "No Negroes" then. Do I have to remind you that personal dating preferences are not the point of this case or the Civil Right Act in regard to businesses and workplace protections.
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Re: Time to abolish the Civil Rights Act (+1)
Kjella an hour ago
So you are essentially saying that businesses can put up signs saying: "No Negroes" then.
It's basically the same logic as "taxation = theft", the moment the government imposes a burden on you it's inherently wrong and the whole of society should be based exclusively on voluntary cooperation with personal veto rights for everyone about everything. Often in black and white opposition to a world where you can be turned into Soylent Green for the greater good. I'm not saying you're wrong - it's an accurate description - but I don't think it matters to those who make the argument. They've usually decided having extreme personal freedom is more important than the ugly ways some will choose to use it.
P.S. In practice it'll be more like might makes right with relatively little freedom for most. But everyone likes to think they'd be on top.
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Re: Time to abolish the Civil Rights Act (+1)
mi an hour ago
So you are essentially saying that businesses can put up signs saying: "No Negroes" then.
Yes, the First Amendment certainly protects such bigotry.
personal dating preferences are not the point of this case
What I said remains: the arguments supporting the ongoing limitations on freedom in business, can be applied to dating verbatim.
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Re: Time to abolish the Civil Rights Act (+1)
dskoll an hour ago
The First Amendment most likely would support a business putting up a sign saying "We don't like Negroes". Expression is protected.

Refusing to serve someone because of ethnicity goes way beyond mere expression, and is not protected by the First Amendment. But you know that. You're just stirring the pot.
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Re: Time to abolish the Civil Rights Act (+1)
mi 36 minutes ago
... a sign saying "We don't like Negroes". Expression is protected.
Any expression is protected — my sign can say anything.
Refusing to serve someone because of ethnicity goes way beyond mere expression
Yes, that's a freedom of not associating. Which is not explicitly spelled out in the Constitution, but is still quite natural — and recognized by the courts.
You're just stirring the pot.
Whatever my motivations, I stand by the words I wrote.
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Re: Time to abolish the Civil Rights Act (+1)
dfghjk 2 hours ago
Perhaps she should...if she's a prostitute. Discrimination laws don't apply to "dating" for obvious reasons, namely that the entire purpose of "dating" is discrimination. Duh.
A "business owner" only faces "charges of racism" if there is reason to believe he discriminated. Your hypothetical, by not suggesting that he did, not only fails to make your point but it suggests that you are racist for believing it does.
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Re: Time to abolish the Civil Rights Act (+1)
mi an hour ago
Discrimination laws don't apply to "dating" for obvious reasons
What reasons? What's a good reason to ban discrimination in the workplace, that wouldn't also apply to dating?
only faces "charges of racism" if there is reason to believe he discriminated
Which reason is provided in my hypothetical: four members of one race turned down, one of another — hired. Such numbers alone may not be enough to prove discrimination — after all, those four may be genuinely unfit for the job — but it would be enough, in the current legal climate, for those turned away to allege it. Which allegation would force the employer to defend him/itself. Just as I said.
it suggests that you are racist for believing it does
No, even if my belief was incorrect, that would only suggest certain legal ignorance on my part — it is an indication of neither my racism, nor of absence thereof.
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Re: Time to abolish the Civil Rights Act (+1)
Impy the Impiuos Imp 19 minutes ago
What's a good reason to ban discrimination in the workplace, that wouldn't also apply to dating?
Legally, it's because the right to engage in business is considered a secondary right, so Congress has much more leeway to poke its fingers in. Many disagree with that, but that's the current state.
Dating and the selection of mates is more like speech, which cannot be abridged. It is the exact opposite of a secondary right.
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Re: Time to abolish the Civil Rights Act (+1)
Lije Baley 2 hours ago
It's different for the same, pragmatic reason. It is healthy, on the whole, for people to have the opportunity to work where they want, and to choose the people they want to mate with. It would be nice if they could do away with the specifics (i.e. protected classes), but they seem to be a necessary evil to help deal with employers that are having trouble adjusting to judging people only by their work.
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Re: Time to abolish the Civil Rights Act (+1)
mi 13 minutes ago
Nice try... But, as I predicted, your argument can be applied to employment easily, here:
It is healthy, on the whole, for people to have the opportunity to date whom they want
(The argument is bogus — because it ignores the other party's willingness to date — but that's the flaw of your original...)
seem to be a necessary evil
At least, you recognize, that it is evil — even if you deem it necessary...
help deal with employers that are having trouble adjusting to judging people only by their work
Leaving aside the usual Libertarian question of why must government "deal" with such employers at all, let's agree on the obvious failure — after 60+ years of trying — of these laws and resulting policies to bring about the positive changes expected of them.
As I wrote, we've sacrificed an essential liberty for the sake of some feel-good "fairness" — and still don't have either. Do we deserve them?
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[blinking...@gmail.com]

tired of the word "discriminate". How about we say what we really mean: "distinguish", or better yet, "differentiate".
How about the law is much simpler. Thou shalt not differentiate humans based on what they do at home, what they did in the past, what they say in private, where they came from, whom they came from, et cetera. Quite frankly, when it comes to anything financial -- that includes both mortgages and employment and everything in-between -- you simply don't get to differentiate humans based on anything but demonstrated skill-set. That's it. The skill to pay, the skill to work, the skill to be on-time, the skill to be polite. What else is both relevant and desirable to society these days?
I'm sick of all of it. I'm a programmer. These are all the same laws. The entire legal system must be broken garbage if you need to explicitly write "women", and then explicitly write "gay" and then explicitly write "trans" and then explicitly write "also the other trans". It's obvious from the start that there will be new categories of humans every few years. Really, we needed to say that you don't get to beat women, and then that you don't get to beat blacks, and then that you don't get to beat gays, and then after all of that, we still needed to say that you don't get to beat foreigners? Really?? REALLY????
How about you don't get to beat anything that bleeds. Not cows either. You get to kill cows, but only in something called a slaughterhouse. Not just anywhere you want. You get to dent cars, but only in something called a garage, not anywhere you want.
You just don't get to destroy anything anywhere you want. Not property, not freedoms, not persons, and not principles.
Maybe that's the issue that needs to be written into law. Forget about the object of the aggression. You don't get use a fist -- not a physical one, not a financial one. You just don't get to use force.
It's been the same fight over and over again for my entire life -- and over and over again in every history book ever written. The only energy that I have left is the energy to run away. Nothing else seems to have any effect.
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Constitution basis/argument for this ruling. (+1)
BenFenner 2 hours ago
My wife and I had a good discussion about this on our short road trip today.
I was a bit surprised by the sudden outbreak of common sense, but was curious about the constitutional basis.

It seems as though the protection against discrimination based on sex was all that was needed. Both arguments seemed very creative, but so simple.

Firing a male who was in a relationship with a male is not allowed, if you wouldn't also fire a female for being in a relationship with a male.

Firing a female who chooses the masculine dress code in the employer's handbook is not allowed, if you wouldn't also fire a male for choosing the masculine portion of the dress code.

Very elegant, I thought. It helped explain the 6-3 decision as well IMO.
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Another accomplishment for Replublicans.

Anonymous Coward 2 hours ago

Republicans:
Freed the slaves.
First black politicians.
Women voting rights.
Civil Rights Act.
Expanded rights for LGTPQ+++
Trump, the first president for gay marriage and has passed laws protecting them world wide -- yeah, not enforceable, but still.

Democrats:
Had slaves, were the Confederates, and then formed the KKK.
Used the KKK to suppress the vote of blacks and keep them down for decades, then blamed Republicans.
... Women didn't want the right to vote, because it came with required duties and the draft ...
Voted mostly against the Civil Rights act, then lied to the brainwashed MORONS that they and the Republicans switched sides.
Use the LGTPQ++ community just like Blacks, for vote harvesting.
No president other than Trump supported gay marriage prior to their election. Most democrats are in bed with Islam...

The left has gone fucking insane! Where are all the screeching crybabies go, that were clawing on the Supreme Court door when Kavanaugh was made justice. They were screaming the SKY IS FALLING! Fucking ignorant fools!! All you do is throw tantrums like pathetic children. Then some of you MORONS have the gull to turn around and act as if it's the conservatives that are doing something wrong. You're a bunch of fucking frauds and hypocrites. Selfish diaper wearing looser.

Conservatives are normal, mostly centered, but you simple minded fools have this fanatical view of things that really do not line up with reality. I'm a liberal -- which is why I rant, but I've had to move towards conservatism, since they're the rational based crowd.
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Re: Another accomplishment for Replublicans. (+1)
Malays2 bowman 2 minutes ago
"Conservatives are normal"
Wow, I love that word "normal". It lets you dehumanise others in a rather soft way.
The moment somebody trots out the word "normal", their cred goes to shit.
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Re: Another accomplishment for Replublicans. (+1)

Malays2 bowman a few seconds ago

Normal - a way to say that the "normal" person is deserving of respect, while the other group is deserving of being spat upon, thrown into the streets, and murdered.

[blinking...@gmail.com]

ut people who live in the margins.
I also don't have a great solution, but "We should continue to allow legal discrimination against people because of their gender because otherwise it upsets my televised sports" is absolutely not it. That should not even be a consideration. Maybe at least try dividing up people by weight and height first? Or how about coming up with per-competition categories based on the physical traits that are actually relevant for that competition?
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Some justice is served
Rick Schumann 5 hours ago
There may be hope for this country yet. Trump and his cadre of fake-ass, twisted 'conservatives' hasn't managed to destroy it completely.
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what about gay transgender n1ggers? (+1)
Dragoonkain 4 hours ago
what about gay transgender n1ggers? why does the supreme court hate gay transgender n1ggers?
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Good
Malays2 bowman 4 hours ago

Discriminating against a big group of people because some people who believe in some invisible magic sky daddy that says the first group are an "abomination" is wrong, VERY wrong.
This is another reason why I am now actively against religion. If they want to play this dirty, shitty little game, I will proclaim that my "god" Zanzar thinks all Christians are an abomination, and cannot enter the "Kingdom of Heaven"*. I'll launch lawsuits left and right forcing people to recongnise my "religion" and bow to my religious demands. Go ahead and try me.
*If "heaven" is going to be filled with hate filled scum, then I would rather go to "hell".
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Re: Good (+1)
Malays2 bowman 4 minutes ago
I see this was modded down.
I'm not going to sugarcoat what I have to say.
I don't care what somebody believes, but when they cross the line and start trampling on the rights of others, to make them out as sub human and a target for hate and MURDER because their holy book says so, I will speak out against it and take action, if nessesary.
Our FOREFATHERS wrote in "Seperation of church and state" for a REASON.
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There goes ..... (+1)
TreeSlayer 4 hours ago
The First Amendment or what was left of it.
This opens up religious organizations and churches, synagogues, mosques etc to all kinds of Law Suits if they refuse to hire those in direct violation of their beliefs.
There is Freedom of Religion, not freedom from it.
You cannot be forced into one by the Government.
You cannot prevent others from practicing theirs in the public square.
If you don't like it, go to Canada or France.
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Re: There goes ..... (+2)
Yosho 3 hours ago
This opens up religious organizations and churches, synagogues, mosques etc to all kinds of Law Suits if they refuse to hire those in direct violation of their beliefs.
So, just checking -- do you believe that a church should be (and is currently allowed to) refuse to hire black people because they're black? Or female? Is there any kind of discrimination that you believe should not be allowed? If so, how do you draw the line between that and transgender people?
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Re: There goes .....

Anonymous Coward 2 hours ago

So, just checking -- do you believe that a church should be (and is currently allowed to) refuse to hire black people because they're black? Or female? Is there any kind of discrimination that you believe should not be allowed? If so, how do you draw the line between that and transgender people?
Do you have context to what you refer to (assuming this isn't a red herring), a religion that says being black or female is sinful? For the Judeo/Christian world, the Bible does not outlaw being born female, black, or black female that I can find, but does outlaw transgender behavior (Leviticus and Deuteronomy).
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Re: There goes ..... (+1)
Yosho 2 hours ago
Do you have context to what you refer to (assuming this isn't a red herring), a religion that says being black or female is sinful? For the Judeo/Christian world, the Bible does not outlaw being born female, black, or black female that I can find, but does outlaw transgender behavior (Leviticus and Deuteronomy).
Timothy 2:12 says you shouldn't let a woman teach, nor hold any positions where she has authority over a man. Genesis IX 18-27 and Ephesians VI 5-7 were also both long used to justify slavery based on skin color.
That's just Christianity, and whew, if you think other religions don't have opinions on what women should be allowed to do, your high school history classes have completely failed you.
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Re: There goes ..... (+1)
moxrespawn 36 minutes ago
Paul says "I", not "God".
Neither of your subsequent verses mention skin color at all.
"People used it to justify" is a weasel argument. Refer to what it actually says.
"So he began to speak boldly in the synagogue. When Aquila and Priscilla heard him, they took him aside and explained to him the way of God more accurately."
Acts 18:26
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Based on Sex... not Gender? (+1)
bpetty 4 hours ago

>> on the basis of sex as well as race, color, national origin and religion.

I thought in this brave new world where Sex and Gender are seen as being different, Sex was the thing you could not change.
Is this just a typo from someone not well versed in Woke?

[blinking...@gmail.com]

try yet. Trump and his cadre of fake-ass, twisted 'conservatives' hasn't managed to destroy it completely.
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Re: Some justice is served (+1)

Malays2 bowman a few seconds ago

Trump is an actor, and lately not a good one.
He also does not know how to calm a volitile and emotionally charged situation ("We will DOMINATE the streets!")
His mouth is dangerous, and has already helped cause a couple mass shootings. His friends try their best to sweep this under the rug, but we remember.
Be it Democrat or Republican, we need somebody else besides Trump to be elected president come November, for the sake of America.

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what about gay transgender n1ggers? (+1)

Dragoonkain 5 hours ago

[blinking...@gmail.com]

izations and churches, synagogues, mosques etc to all kinds of Law Suits if they refuse to hire those in direct violation of their beliefs.
So, just checking -- do you believe that a church should be (and is currently allowed to) refuse to hire black people because they're black? Or female? Is there any kind of discrimination that you believe should not be allowed? If so, how do you draw the line between that and transgender people?
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Re: There goes .....

Anonymous Coward 3 hours ago

So, just checking -- do you believe that a church should be (and is currently allowed to) refuse to hire black people because they're black? Or female? Is there any kind of discrimination that you believe should not be allowed? If so, how do you draw the line between that and transgender people?
Do you have context to what you refer to (assuming this isn't a red herring), a religion that says being black or female is sinful? For the Judeo/Christian world, the Bible does not outlaw being born female, black, or black female that I can find, but does outlaw transgender behavior (Leviticus and Deuteronomy).
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Re: There goes ..... (+1)
Yosho 2 hours ago
Do you have context to what you refer to (assuming this isn't a red herring), a religion that says being black or female is sinful? For the Judeo/Christian world, the Bible does not outlaw being born female, black, or black female that I can find, but does outlaw transgender behavior (Leviticus and Deuteronomy).
Timothy 2:12 says you shouldn't let a woman teach, nor hold any positions where she has authority over a man. Genesis IX 18-27 and Ephesians VI 5-7 were also both long used to justify slavery based on skin color.
That's just Christianity, and whew, if you think other religions don't have opinions on what women should be allowed to do, your high school history classes have completely failed you.
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Re: There goes ..... (+1)

moxrespawn an hour ago

Paul says "I", not "God".
Neither of your subsequent verses mention skin color at all.
"People used it to justify" is a weasel argument. Refer to what it actually says.
"So he began to speak boldly in the synagogue. When Aquila and Priscilla heard him, they took him aside and explained to him the way of God more accurately."
Acts 18:26
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Re: There goes ..... (+1)

Malays2 bowman a few seconds ago

"There is Freedom of Religion, not freedom from it.
You cannot be forced into one by the Government.
You cannot prevent others from practicing theirs in the public square"

This is true, but imagine going to a popular tourist destination with your kids, and having to calm your son or daughter, who is crying his/her eyes out after some idiot with a megaphone told them they are going to hell, complete with a graphical description. If that wasn't bad enough, the preacher said that gays are 'sodomites', give very un-family friendly descriptions of sex acts, and list a few famous celebrities who are supposedly burning, with more graphical depictions of their torment (this is stuff I have witnessed these preachers doing on more than one occasion)
You took your family out for a day of fun, but instead your kid is traumatized and scared from the garbage pouring out of that 'preacher's' mouth. What do you do then?

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Based on Sex... not Gender? (+1)

bpetty 5 hours ago

[blinking...@gmail.com]

othing else seems to have any effect.
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Constitution basis/argument for this ruling. (+1)

BenFenner 3 hours ago

My wife and I had a good discussion about this on our short road trip today.
I was a bit surprised by the sudden outbreak of common sense, but was curious about the constitutional basis.

It seems as though the protection against discrimination based on sex was all that was needed. Both arguments seemed very creative, but so simple.

Firing a male who was in a relationship with a male is not allowed, if you wouldn't also fire a female for being in a relationship with a male.

Firing a female who chooses the masculine dress code in the employer's handbook is not allowed, if you wouldn't also fire a male for choosing the masculine portion of the dress code.

Very elegant, I thought. It helped explain the 6-3 decision as well IMO.
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Re: Constitution basis/argument for this ruling. (+1)

Malays2 bowman a few seconds ago

To put it simply, there is no justice or freedom when a group is made out to be subhuman.

[blinking...@gmail.com]

How an Online Mob Doxxed an Innocent Man
from the wrong-arm-of-the-law dept.
"An innocent man faced a torrent of online threats and abuse after being mistakenly identified in a viral video in which an angry cyclist hurt a child," reports the BBC:
Mr. Weinberg was falsely identified when the wrong date was attached to the initial appeal made by the police in Bethesda, U.S. Mr. Weinberg used the popular fitness tracking app Strava, which showed him as having been on the Maryland bike trail on that day.

However on the correct date he was working at home...

Once his address had been shared by others — a practice known as doxxing — the police had to patrol the area for his safety, reported New York magazine... Mr. Weinberg has since received dozens of apologies from people who abused him online.

Weinberg mistakenly thought his app only shared his bike-ride routes with his network of friends, New York Magazine reports.

They add that Weinberg also discovered tweets wrongly accusing another man — a former police officer in Maryland — which had been retweeted and liked more than half a million times. And that the woman who'd posted Weinberg's home address later "deleted it and posted an apology, writing that in all of her eagerness to see justice served, she was swept up in the mob that so gleefully shared misinformation, depriving someone of their own right to justice.

"Her correction was shared by fewer than a dozen people."
Posted by EditorDavid 2 days ago

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Mob justice is bad (+5, Insightful)
Kohath 2 days ago
The whole criminal justice system and civil court system was developed over a dozen centuries to avoid it. Outrage mobs and lynch mobs are evil, even when they're correct.
Too bad we don't have schools to teach people these sorts of things. I bet they know the state capitals though.
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Re: Mob justice is bad (+1, Troll)
wyattstorch516 2 days ago
Schools do teach people that outrage and lynch mobs are evil. Except of course when the target is a white male.
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Re: Mob justice is bad (-1, Troll)
majorme 2 days ago
Schools do teach people that outrage and lynch mobs are evil. Except of course when the target is a white male.
Get the fuck out with this bullshit
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Re: Mob justice is bad (+2)
Type44Q 2 days ago
So who are they vilifying on your planet?
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Re: Mob justice is bad (+1)
dryeo 2 days ago
The Chinese seems to be popular to vilify, with too many stories of old men being pushed down and young ladies punched in the face.
Seems some politicians have been using them as a scapegoat.
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Re: Mob justice is bad (+1)
Type44Q 2 days ago
The Chinese seems to be popular to vilify
They perhaps they should stop doing all that altruistic shit that the rest of the world so loves them for.
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Re: Mob justice is bad (+1)
Type44Q 2 days ago
*then* Gotta love my Chinese-made iPhone's keyboard...
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Re: Mob justice is bad (+1)
Type44Q 2 days ago
...definitely not suited for my barbarian, western hands. ;)
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Re: Mob justice is bad (+1)
dryeo 2 days ago
Some of these people came over to build the railway in the 19th century. If you figure that punishing people based on their ancestry is right, I guess vilifying Americans of European descent for keeping slaves is OK.
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Re: Mob justice is bad (+1)
DrMrLordX 2 days ago
Yes, let us thank Xi for what Chinese immigrant workers did over a hundred years ago. That'll be brilliant.
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Re: Mob justice is bad (+1)
dryeo a day ago
Looking back at my original comment, it seems I left out the local part, locally people of Chinese descent are being vilified.
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Re: Mob justice is bad (+2, Insightful)
DRJlaw 2 days ago
Schools do teach people that outrage and lynch mobs are evil. Except of course when the target is a white male.
Sure they do. It's that liberal indoctrination that's causing Republican outrage mobs.
And when did Colin Kaepernick become white?
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I'm I the only one old enough to remember (+3, Insightful)
rsilvergun 2 days ago
when the religious right demanded we boycott pretty much everything? Heavy Metal. D&D. He-Man.

These guys have never been the friends of nerds. They gave us wedgies for fucks sake.
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Re: I'm I the only one old enough to remember (+4, Insightful)
alvinrod 2 days ago
The old church ladies from the 1980's are dead or have been relegated to nursing homes. They no longer wield any political power. Cancel culture has now become a phenomenon associated more with the political left than the political right and the younger generation that's primarily responsible for the worst of it really only grew up in the tail end of that era. It's probably why there's some expectation that the upcoming generation will shift back to the right, because young people tend to dislike moral authoritarians of any persuasion.

Cancel culture sucks regardless of who's doing it, but if the religious right still held any real sway we wouldn't have legalized marijuana in many states or gay marriage for that matter. There's a new set of pretty tyrants in town for now, but eventually they'll become old cat ladies and either die or be relegated to nursing homes and we'll get some other set of assholes throwing their weight around and annoying everyone else.
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That's not what happened (+1)
rsilvergun 2 days ago
what happened is the toy & video game industry became a multi-billion dollar juggernaut and Metallica went platinum. The money from selling He-Man, D&D & Heavy Metal was > money from calling for boycotts and those church ladies were taken off TV and radio and replaced with guys like Creflo Dollar.

The grift changed because the money flow changed. Those nut jobs are still out there, they're just not allowed to talk much in polite society because they get in the way of profits.
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Re: I'm I the only one old enough to remember (0, Troll)
serviscope_minor 2 days ago
Cancel culture
Cancel culture a.k.a. free speech combined with capitalism.
That's all it is. People are using their free speech to convince others to vote with their dollars in a particular way. It should be celebrated as the embodyment of the first amendment and the America way.
I predict dowmods because there's nothing like having a contrary opinion for people to try and silence it rather than trying to debate.
and either die or be relegated to nursing homes and we'll get some other set of assholes throwing their weight around and annoying everyone else.
That is true.
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Re: I'm I the only one old enough to remember
Anonymous Coward a day ago
The religious right is exactly how Trump got elected and how the republicans continue to hold a majority in the senate. Yes their power may be weakening a little, but they are far from gone.
Republicans have a long history of claiming they're in favor of some right or another but then in practice it means "we only like that right used in furtherance of things we want."
So like small government, republicans love big government as long as it is only doing the things they want like farm subsidies and beating down true innovation and competition and making sure they control what people see/read/consume.
Free speech, absolutely, as long as it is speech that promotes christian, capitalist, creationism and pro-life stances.
Local control, oh yeah, as long as the control is also exerted by republicans.
Let me offer an alternative.
When threatening a boycott seemed to come every other day out of the right wing, there were studies that found that no matter how much they blustered, very few republicans actually took part in the boycott. It turned out that their convenience was more import than their "morals".
But now you've got people that when they decide to do it, they actually do it. They stop patronizing businesses with offensive policies/actions. They shun celebrities who make jerks of themselves.
So of course now republicans are incensed because how dare non-republicans make the system work like republicans say it is supposed to work!?!?
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Re: I'm I the only one old enough to remember (+1)

Malays2 bowman a few seconds ago

"The old church ladies from the 1980's are dead or have been relegated to nursing homes"
They were the stuff of horror movies. They had that nice warm smile, and a fresh baked apple pie, but then they would put on an even bigger grin and say that so and so (or a particular group) is going to burn in hell. Sometimes this would be peppered with epithets, racial or otherwise, and curse words that they would not normaly say in polite company.
Stephen King would be given a run for his money. =|
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Re: I'm I the only one old enough to remember (+1)
dknj 2 days ago
i lol'd at this comment. where tf is he-man. also wtf happened to care bears

[blinking...@gmail.com]

Malays2 bowman 18 minutes ago

"The old church ladies from the 1980's are dead or have been relegated to nursing homes"
They were the stuff of horror movies. They had that nice warm smile, and a fresh baked apple pie, but then they would put on an even bigger grin and say that so and so (or a particular group) is going to burn in hell. Sometimes this would be peppered with epithets, racial or otherwise, and curse words that they would not normaly say in polite company.
Stephen King would be given a run for his money. =|
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Re: I'm I the only one old enough to remember (+1)
dknj 2 days ago
i lol'd at this comment. where tf is he-man. also wtf happened to care bears

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Re: I'm I the only one old enough to remember (+1)
Impy the Impiuos Imp 2 days ago

when the religious right demanded we boycott pretty much everything? Heavy Metal. D&D. He-Man.

This has been going on for thousands of years, during which gay people and so on merely wished to be tolerated and left alone, and not actively camp8gned against with laws and mobs.
Now the shoe is on the other foot and people are getting upset.
And my observation is the lament that toleration of others was not learned. I cannot blame the attempt at controlled destruction of the other side, but it should not be.
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Re: Mob justice is bad (+5, Insightful)
LynnwoodRooster 2 days ago

Sure they do. It's that liberal indoctrination that's causing Republican outrage mobs.

Huh. So boycotts = death threats, riots, murder, and secession. Got it.

And when did Colin Kaepernick become white?

Since birth, because his mom's white. Why are you so racist as to ignore half his heritage? Are you one of those that counts a person with a drop of African heritage as a black? Are you that racist?
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Re: Mob justice is bad (+1, Interesting)
DRJlaw 2 days ago
Huh. So boycotts = death threats, riots, murder, and secession. Got it.
Funny, I said outrage mob. Why are you creating a strawman?

And when did Colin Kaepernick become white?

Since birth, because his mom's white.
You're forgetting your own rule, LynwoodRooster.
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Re: Mob justice is bad (+2, Interesting)
LynnwoodRooster 2 days ago
Funny, I said outrage mob. Why are you creating a strawman?
So in your mind, boycotting a business (which is what you linked) is an outrage mob. What do you call hundreds of thousands injuring people, destroying property, and attempting to secede from the US?
You're forgetting your own rule, LynwoodRooster.
WTF does that mean? Is it my rule? Prove it, please. Prove I support that rule - or you can say you're wrong.
My guess, is you'll toss off a smarmy comment and slink away, because you know you're showing your own hatred and "outrage mob" mentality by literally lying about another person. In other words - you're the same as the slime in TFA who doxxed an innocent man, because in your mind that's OK. Because politics.

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Re: Mob justice is bad

DRJlaw 2 days ago
What do you call hundreds of thousands injuring people, destroying property, and attempting to secede from the US?
Trumpists So, so many Trumpists.
WTF does that mean? Is it my rule? Prove it, please. Prove I support that rule - or you can say you're wrong.
Oh, so you owe him an apology too, now don't you?
My guess, is you'll toss off a smarmy comment and slink away, because you know you're showing your own hatred and "outrage mob" mentality by literally lying about another person.
You're wrong. It's not lying if I truly believe it, and I certainly don't have to prove it. Trump isn't special in that regard, and I claim the same privilege.
In other words - you're the same as the slime in TFA who doxxed an innocent man, because in your mind that's OK. Because politics.
I learned it from you, Lynwood. All from you.
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Re: Mob justice is bad
LynnwoodRooster 2 days ago
Such a special snowflake you are! Live in your fantasy world, and run along - let the adults solve your little tantrums, Donny... How do you like sharing a first name with the President? Does that make you feel racist even more (we already know you're racist by insisting Kaepernick is just a black man).

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Re: Mob justice is bad

DRJlaw 2 days ago
Such a special snowflake you are!
You're the one being triggered by a post about Republican outrage mobs.
Live in your fantasy world, and run along - let the adults solve your little tantrums, Donny...
Nah, you've earned special attention now.
Does that make you feel racist even more (we already know you're racist by insisting Kaepernick is just a black man).
Says the racist.

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Re: Mob justice is bad

Anonymous Coward 2 days ago
You should get that frothing around the mouth checked out.
Could be rabies.

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Re: Mob justice is bad (+1)

Barsteward 2 days ago
"Does that make you feel racist even more (we already know you're racist by insisting Kaepernick is just a black man)."... mm he has some shared features due to the ethnicity of one of his parents that makes him non-white in the racists' eyes and they need zero excuse to abuse anyone who is not deemed 100% white. Until the world is rid of the sick racist/racism/white supremacist, he and others like him will be, for ease of of the racist mind, be classed as black. Once we can judge someone on who they are instead of their colour or where they came from, we are going to face this shit down.

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Re: Mob justice is bad

Anonymous Coward 2 days ago

And when did Colin Kaepernick become white?

Since birth, because his mom's white. Why are you so racist as to ignore half his heritage?
Charging someone with being racist is just for show. They don't actually care about it. It's theatre, used to tear down opponents only. So they can be racist as much as they want and it doesn't matter to them.
Do you think Biden's past remarks will get any scrutiny? Not from the MSM.
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Re: Mob justice is bad (+1)
Impy the Impiuos Imp 2 days ago
My theory all is about getting rid of Trumo is still at a 100% explanatory rate. Let's test the prediction and see how fast this all dies down if he loses.

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Re: Mob justice is bad (+1)

ebvwfbw a day ago
They want to get rid of him because people are going to start going to jail. Swamp critters. I anticipate not just democrats though I think they make up the vast majority of it. Corruption is equal opportunity. Cuts across race, gender, party.
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Re: Mob justice is bad (+1)

Malays2 bowman a few seconds ago

No, it's about Trump not being a good president, and not even knowing when NOT to use inflammitory language ("we will DOMINATE the streets!", as if he was trying to make things worse).
His mouth has already lead to a couple mass shootings, a fact his friends are trying hard to make everybody forget. His mouth is dangerous, and this is somebody no country needs as president.

[blinking...@gmail.com]

eneration that's primarily responsible for the worst of it really only grew up in the tail end of that era. It's probably why there's some expectation that the upcoming generation will shift back to the right, because young people tend to dislike moral authoritarians of any persuasion.

Cancel culture sucks regardless of who's doing it, but if the religious right still held any real sway we wouldn't have legalized marijuana in many states or gay marriage for that matter. There's a new set of pretty tyrants in town for now, but eventually they'll become old cat ladies and either die or be relegated to nursing homes and we'll get some other set of assholes throwing their weight around and annoying everyone else.
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That's not what happened (+1)
rsilvergun 2 days ago
what happened is the toy & video game industry became a multi-billion dollar juggernaut and Metallica went platinum. The money from selling He-Man, D&D & Heavy Metal was > money from calling for boycotts and those church ladies were taken off TV and radio and replaced with guys like Creflo Dollar.

The grift changed because the money flow changed. Those nut jobs are still out there, they're just not allowed to talk much in polite society because they get in the way of profits.
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Re: That's not what happened (+1)

Malays2 bowman a few seconds ago

If anything, the religious right INCREASED sales of those items.
Kids love forbidden fruit.

[blinking...@gmail.com]

Stories

Google Resumes Its Senseless Attack On the URL Bar, Hides Full Addresses On Chrome 85
from the overly-simplified dept.
Google is pressing on with new plans to hide all parts of web addresses except the domain name. Android Police reports:
A few new feature flags have appeared in Chrome's Dev and Canary channels (V85), which modify the appearance and behavior of web addresses in the address bar. The main flag is called "Omnibox UI Hide Steady-State URL Path, Query, and Ref" which hides everything in the current web address except the domain name. For example, "https://www.androidpolice.com/2020/06/07/lenovo-ideapad-flex-5-chromebook-review/" is simply displayed as "androidpolice.com." There are two additional flags that modify this behavior. One reveals the full address once you hover over the address bar (instead of having to click it), while the other only hides the address bar once you interact with the page. An issue page on the Chromium Bug tracker has also been created for keeping track of the changes, though there aren't any additional details there.

There's no public explanation yet for why Google is pressing ahead with these changes, but the company has said in the past that it believes showing the full address can make it harder to tell if the current site is legitimate. "Showing the full URL may detract from the parts of the URL that are more important to making a security decision on a webpage," Chromium software engineer Livvie Lin said in a design document earlier this year.
Google has since clarified how the experiment will work and what opt-out options will be available.

"We think this is an important problem area to explore because phishing and other forms of social engineering are still rampant on the web," a Chromium developer on the bug tracker for the change said, "and much research shows that browsers' current URL display patterns aren't effective defenses. We're implementing this simplified domain display experiment so that we can conduct qualitative and quantitative research to understand if it helps users identify malicious websites more accurately."

It was also confirmed that Google will keep the opt-out mechanism that is already present -- an 'Always show full URLs' setting that appears when you right-click the address bar. "We plan to support this opt-out option indefinitely," the same developer said.
Posted by BeauHD 21 hours ago

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50 Comments
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All
Outstanding
Funny
Safari already does that. (+3, Interesting)
Jane Q. Public 21 hours ago
Safari has been doing that for quite some time.

And I hate it.

Having said that, clicking in the address bar brings the whole address back. But I don't want it hidden in the first place.
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Re: Safari already does that. (+1)
93 Escort Wagon 20 hours ago
Safari -> Preferences -> Advanced -> "Show Full Website Address"
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Re: Safari already does that. (+2)
Rockets84 15 hours ago
That setting only exists for the macOS version of Safari. There's no way to turn that feature off on iOS. Can't say I'm a fan of that feature and prefer to see the full URL.
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Re: Safari already does that. (+1)
Malays2 bowman 15 minutes ago
Imagine a car that refuses to give any reading below 40MPH. Or will not show how much gas you have left, or the odometer, unless you tweak some setting deep within a huge menu structure that most drivers would not even know where to look for.
I didn't RTFA, but I am assuming the address bar butchery is on by default.
This also leaves open the possibility of more malicious behavior (user sees htt ps://domain.co m instead of htt ps://domain.co m/users/1337haxx0r/embeddedbadstuff.htm)
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DUUUUUUUPE! (+2)
quonset 21 hours ago
Seriously. Dupe.
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Re: DUUUUUUUPE! (+5, Funny)
SeaFox 21 hours ago
I thought I'd clicked the previous posting. I couldn't tell the difference since the address bar only said "slashdot.org" on both of them.
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Re: DUUUUUUUPE! (+1)
msauve 20 hours ago
... and dope (BeauHD). They're only a page apart. I'd guess the mods don't actually read /.
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Re: DUUUUUUUPE! (+2)
antdude 17 hours ago
Maybe the editors' Chrome hid the original post. :P
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A decent compromise missed (+1)
Tablizer 21 hours ago
A good compromise would be to highlight the domain but keep the rest displayed. Stop bleeping with de-facto standards, Google, or suffer MS-IE's fate.
I remember when they placed the alert box (JavaScript "alert();") high up in the window instead of the middle. This confused roughly 2% of users for a certain app, creating a flood of help-desk tickets. If all the other browsers put it in the middle, why deviate? Before you deviate, ask for feedback. Is that asking too much?
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Re: A decent compromise missed (+1)
Impy the Impiuos Imp 21 hours ago
You need popups to overlay the menu bar, to distinguish them from fraud boxes that are just drawings on the web page.
That's one solution, anyway.
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Re: A decent compromise missed (+1)
Tablizer 21 hours ago
It barely covers it up (in my test). A fake alert could just be at the top and few would notice the difference. And if they moved it even higher, people may miss it altogether.
I understand the concern, but they didn't solve it. Perhaps make the browser border/menu flash or change color for a real alert box. If you don't see it flash, you know you're dealing with a fake alert.
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Re: A decent compromise missed (+1)
phantomfive 14 hours ago
Javascript alert() is 100% controlled by the page anyway, so that wouldn't make any difference.
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Re: A decent compromise missed (+1)
squiggleslash 6 hours ago
...which is why you don't want the pop-up overlaying the menu bar. The Javascript alert() function is user generated, there's no set of circumstances in which you want it to look like an official message from your web browser.

alert() should produce a box in the middle of the tab, that doesn't overlay anything other than the tab's content, and doesn't prevent access to the menus or other tabs.
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Re: A decent compromise missed (+1)
Sigma 7 19 hours ago
I remember when they placed the alert box (JavaScript "alert();") high up in the window instead of the middle.
That's meant to ensure that it's a browser thing rather than a webpage thing.
But since they changed it, they might as well make it whole-hog and make that alert box non-modal on subsequent attempts to close the window - or add a way to force close webpages in the same way the operating system allows force-killing browsers.
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Re: A decent compromise missed (+1)

Malays2 bowman a few seconds ago

This just reeks of programmers having nothing else to add to the browser, and are just adding 'features' like this to justify their continued employment.
A web browser is a very mature product at this point, so there is little left to add.
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BeauHD resumes senseless attack on Slashdot (+1)
thegarbz 21 hours ago
Posts dupes of popular heavily commented stories.
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Re: BeauHD resumes senseless attack on Slashdot
Anonymous Coward 21 hours ago
Is it really necessary for you to be such a little flaming faggot about this shit? You hate it here so much then LEAVE. Otherwise STFU.
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Re: BeauHD resumes senseless attack on Slashdot (+1)
NagrothAgain 20 hours ago
If you don't like the comments then leave! Or hide the user, or comment on the orginal story and ignore the fucking dupe. The editors need to be called out for obvious mistakes like this.
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Re: BeauHD resumes senseless attack on Slashdot (+1)
thegarbz 9 hours ago
Is it really necessary for you to be such a little flaming faggot about this shit?
Yes. Although I feel insulated. Personally I consider myself a big flaming faggot about this shit.
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Its not sensless... (+5, Insightful)
wakeboarder 21 hours ago
They'll keep reducing things until you forget how to use the web and only use google
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Re: Its not sensless... (+1)
SeaFox 21 hours ago
> Implying most people online nowadays know how to use the URL bar to begin with.
That's a pretty bold claim.
There's a reason companies sweat so much about where they show up on search engine rankings for their trademarks.
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Re: Its not sensless... (+1)
LynnwoodRooster 20 hours ago
The goal is to go back to the AOL model - that's all you needed, just AOL.
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Re: Its not sensless... (+1)
ackerrj 19 hours ago
Yup. Evil.
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Agreed, pointless and stupid (+3, Insightful)
Rick Schumann 21 hours ago
Never liked Chrome in the first place and they keep giving me more reasons to hate it. I'll stick to Firefox.
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Re: Agreed, pointless and stupid (+1)
Maletherin 17 hours ago
Hating a browser is really silly.
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Re: Agreed, pointless and stupid (+1)
Rick Schumann 17 hours ago
Not understanding why it deserves peoples' hate is even worse. Do you work for Google or something?
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Re: Agreed, pointless and stupid (+1)
toddestan 16 hours ago
I agree. Even Internet Explorer needs some love!
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Re: Agreed, pointless and stupid (+1)
lactose99 14 hours ago
Mosaic or bust.
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Re: Agreed, pointless and stupid (+1)
transporter_ii 4 hours ago
Pfft. I telnet to the site and compile the tags in my head.
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Technically it's not senseless. (+4, Insightful)
hey! 21 hours ago
It definitely is *controversial*. There's a good chance it's wrong. It might even be stupid. But they have a justification for doing it that's worth thinking about: *for some people* a full URL obscures information they need by jumbling it with other information that's meaningless to them.
That doesn't mean *nobody* has a use for that information. But presumably people who benefit from all that detail would know enough to opt-in. People who don't have use for that information, when presented with it, will just see an address bar as full of gibberish and ignore it. People are really good at ignoring stuff that's right there in front of them.
Of course that argument cuts both ways; you can pare the address bar down so it only displays the most important thing for the non-technical user: the identity of the domain serving the data they're looking at. But it doesn't mean they'll pay any attention to it.
So here's one possible result: they mildly inconvenience a bunch of power users and benefit absolutely nobody. But we know that will happen for sure.
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Re: Technically it's not senseless. (+1)
Killall -9 Bash 4 hours ago
People are really good at understanding things without knowing they understand them.

By changing the behavior of the address bar, they are fucking with an already only partially useful paradigm, the URL.

People barely understand the web they browse, and someone wants to give the plebs less data for their minds to crunch on in the background?

How long before Google hides the domain too? No, really, you can trust us, you're actually on Twitter, not a google look-alike. Would we lie?
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Re: Technically it's not senseless.

Anonymous Coward 2 hours ago

There's no might about it. It is stupid.
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Re: Technically it's not senseless. (+1)
hey! an hour ago
A priori sure. But one thing I learned from decades of designing software for users is that a priori judgment is unreliable. Empirical data trumps handwaving arguments.
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Good for hacking you (+1)
backslashdot 21 hours ago
It's starting to look like they need that so that you keep getting hacked and are dependent on them. Without phishing attacks a whole bunch of application security folk would have less justification for their job and have to find another gig.
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Just colour the URL blue to the left of the domain (+1)
Ocker3 21 hours ago
And then red to the right, or whatever colour scheme you want, to show people that there are different parts and they do different things. Tech support is hard enough without having to also tell people to click into the URL bar so they can actually see the specific page they're on! Removing things usually isn't the solution, sure, simplicity and elegance should be striven for, but here Context is what we need.
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Re: Just colour the URL blue to the left of the dom (+1)
clovis 16 hours ago
And then red to the right, or whatever colour scheme you want, to show people that there are different parts and they do different things. Tech support is hard enough without having to also tell people to click into the URL bar so they can actually see the specific page they're on!
Removing things usually isn't the solution, sure, simplicity and elegance should be striven for, but here Context is what we need.
This.
And do it for both the URL bar and especially for the hover over url links.
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The end goal (+2)
backslashdot 21 hours ago
For you to be Chrome-Locked. Guaranteed at some point they will make it a pain in the ass to copy and paste URLs outside of Chrome/Google and then eventually they will make you think everything --all content is "on Google".
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Re: The end goal
thegarbz 9 hours ago
Oh is that why Safari did it?
You fail to understand that at no point has google ever reduced the ability to copy or link. So congratulations on being in unsubstantiated conspiracy theory territory. I'd put your tinfoil hat on, but then how will you get google if you block the starlink satellites?
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This option needs to be hidden (+1)
Joe2020 20 hours ago
Having an option is only good to intelligent people. This option needs to be hidden deep in the interface in about:config. We cannot let this option fall into the hands of dumb people, because giving dumb people the freedom of choice leads to bad outcomes (i.e. the election of the US president).
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Re: This option needs to be hidden (+1)
Killall -9 Bash 4 hours ago
because giving dumb people the freedom of choice leads to bad outcomes


Why is it always people dumber than me having this elitist opinion? YUO NO SMRT, I AM TEH SMAART, YOU NO VOET, ONLI I AM VOOT.
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There is a flag for that (+3, Interesting)
Midnight Thunder 19 hours ago
A timely e-mail came into my mailbox today, since I had been watching an issue. Apparently there is a flag to go back to showing the full URL:
Comment #289 on issue 41467 by xx...@google.com: URL bar no longer shows http:///
https://bugs.chromium.org/p/ch...
This was fixed in Chrome 83:
- Enable chrome://flags/#omnibox-context-menu-show-full-urls
- Restart the browser
- Right-click the address bar, and check "Always show full URLs"
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Thank God for Microsoft Edge (+1)
mfearby 19 hours ago
Did I just say that?! :-)
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Dumbing down. (+4, Insightful)
Camel Pilot 19 hours ago
Is not this the same motivation behind hiding the file extension by default? Or hiding the actual hierarchical location of the "virtual folder" Documents, Downloads, etc?
Always pisses me off when you have to explain to a newbie where the photo they just download actually resides on their file system. By trying to make GUI interfaces easier (or dumber) the woke designers end up making it harder and more confusing.
Remember when Gates himself download Mozilla to show how easy it is to install another web browser and he couldn't find where the download directory was?
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Re: Dumbing down. (+2)
TJHook3r 10 hours ago
Google is aiming for a UI that eventually looks like a smart TV! That said, I would rather it be Google mangling things than Microsoft - if they had their way, the Internet would be run on SharePoint and URLs would be meaningless garbage!
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They've tried less extreme approaches (+1)
The MAZZTer 17 hours ago
I guess phishing is still a big problem?
The domain is bolded in the address bar, https:/// is hidden (so now the domain is the first thing you see next to the lock), the lock is more picky about when it appears, and extended SSL certs can contain company info that can be displayed next to the lock, making it easy for users to verify their website.
I can only assume there's still problems with users giving their passwords away to obvious phishing sites if Google feels they have to take this further, and honestly I can't think of any alternative steps they could take. I have to pity them as well since I am sure some users will blame Google when they carelessly share their password with a malicious third party. It really comes down to a lack of education I think. By the time someone is already clicking on an e-mail to open a phishing site in Google Chrome, there's only so much Google can do for them at that point.
I think this additional step is meant to address sites that might have a domain like "facebook.com.login.phishing.example.org" which may trick a user who doesn't understand domains. And in fairness, domains are backwards from the rest of the url in that they get more selective going to the left instead of the right. It's easy to see this could be confusing for someone who is used to looking to the left of a url for the domain.
I think I would also argue that if you need to go and edit the full url, read it, copy a piece of it, or otherwise do anything other than copy the full thing, it's a failure of the website rather than Chrome. While it is nice that it has been easy to do all these things, I would say the website should provide easy navigation that is faster than editing the url, and any text bits you want to read or copy should be made available in the page itself for ease of access.
That said I agree it's frustrating that this is changing. Thankfully most of the time I don't need to touch the address bar, Most of the time it's to clean up a URL I intend to share, and I would blame the site itself for putting garbage in the url and not offering a website button that cleans it up for me. But then most people don't care about cleaning up urls anyway...
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Re: They've tried less extreme approaches (+1)
tlhIngan an hour ago
Similar.
It's because phishing sites have tried everything, including http://example.com/blah/blah/b...
The padding is there to basically scroll the URL - on many space constrained browsers, it's less useful to know the site you're on than the actual document path so they will generally scroll to the end (so the user sees "https/www.facebook.com/" in the URL bar. It's why mobile browsers started showing just the domain name now and hiding the URL itself (but the full URL is exposed if you tap on it to say, copy it).
Definitely controversial since it pits casual users against power users, and many "power" users are too casual and fall for the trick I showed above thinking they're immune and "I'm smart don't pretend I'm dumb" mode.
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Good news for yours truly (+1)
invalid_user 10 hours ago
I use Firefox.
(Also, this is old news.)
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Does this apply to Chromium as well? (+1)
OneHundredAndTen 6 hours ago
Hopefully not.
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phishing my backside (+3, Insightful)
Shaitan 5 hours ago
This is about hiding tracking data they've encoded in the url
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Re: phishing my backside (+1)
Shaitan 5 hours ago
Also this would let them automatically modify and censor certain data was contained in the url when you copy/paste.
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Chrome foot gun (+1)
LordWabbit2 an hour ago
Another reason not to use Chrome, like I needed another. Used to love Chrome back in the day, back in the day when I thought I could trust google.
To be honest most browsers are cookie cutter versions of each other anyways.

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Stories

Google Resumes Its Senseless Attack On the URL Bar, Hides Full Addresses On Chrome 85
from the overly-simplified dept.
Google is pressing on with new plans to hide all parts of web addresses except the domain name. Android Police reports:
A few new feature flags have appeared in Chrome's Dev and Canary channels (V85), which modify the appearance and behavior of web addresses in the address bar. The main flag is called "Omnibox UI Hide Steady-State URL Path, Query, and Ref" which hides everything in the current web address except the domain name. For example, "https://www.androidpolice.com/2020/06/07/lenovo-ideapad-flex-5-chromebook-review/" is simply displayed as "androidpolice.com." There are two additional flags that modify this behavior. One reveals the full address once you hover over the address bar (instead of having to click it), while the other only hides the address bar once you interact with the page. An issue page on the Chromium Bug tracker has also been created for keeping track of the changes, though there aren't any additional details there.

There's no public explanation yet for why Google is pressing ahead with these changes, but the company has said in the past that it believes showing the full address can make it harder to tell if the current site is legitimate. "Showing the full URL may detract from the parts of the URL that are more important to making a security decision on a webpage," Chromium software engineer Livvie Lin said in a design document earlier this year.
Google has since clarified how the experiment will work and what opt-out options will be available.

"We think this is an important problem area to explore because phishing and other forms of social engineering are still rampant on the web," a Chromium developer on the bug tracker for the change said, "and much research shows that browsers' current URL display patterns aren't effective defenses. We're implementing this simplified domain display experiment so that we can conduct qualitative and quantitative research to understand if it helps users identify malicious websites more accurately."

It was also confirmed that Google will keep the opt-out mechanism that is already present -- an 'Always show full URLs' setting that appears when you right-click the address bar. "We plan to support this opt-out option indefinitely," the same developer said.

Posted by BeauHD a day ago

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51 Comments

Help
All
Outstanding
Funny
Safari already does that. (+3, Interesting)

Jane Q. Public a day ago

Safari has been doing that for quite some time.

And I hate it.

Having said that, clicking in the address bar brings the whole address back. But I don't want it hidden in the first place.
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Re: Safari already does that. (+1)

93 Escort Wagon 21 hours ago

Safari -> Preferences -> Advanced -> "Show Full Website Address"
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Re: Safari already does that. (+2)

Rockets84 16 hours ago

That setting only exists for the macOS version of Safari. There's no way to turn that feature off on iOS. Can't say I'm a fan of that feature and prefer to see the full URL.
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Re: Safari already does that. (+1)

Malays2 bowman 29 minutes ago

Imagine a car that refuses to give any reading below 40MPH. Or will not show how much gas you have left, or the odometer, unless you tweak some setting deep within a huge menu structure that most drivers would not even know where to look for.
I didn't RTFA, but I am assuming the address bar butchery is on by default.
This also leaves open the possibility of more malicious behavior (user sees htt ps://domain.co m instead of htt ps://domain.co m/users/1337haxx0r/embeddedbadstuff.htm)
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DUUUUUUUPE! (+2)

quonset a day ago

Seriously. Dupe.
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Re: DUUUUUUUPE! (+5, Funny)
SeaFox 21 hours ago
I thought I'd clicked the previous posting. I couldn't tell the difference since the address bar only said "slashdot.org" on both of them.
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Re: DUUUUUUUPE! (+1)

msauve 21 hours ago

Malays2 bowman 13 minutes ago

LynnwoodRooster 21 hours ago

The goal is to go back to the AOL model - that's all you needed, just AOL.
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Re: Its not sensless... (+1)
ackerrj 19 hours ago
Yup. Evil.
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Agreed, pointless and stupid (+3, Insightful)
Rick Schumann 21 hours ago
Never liked Chrome in the first place and they keep giving me more reasons to hate it. I'll stick to Firefox.
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Re: Agreed, pointless and stupid (+1)

Maletherin 18 hours ago

Killall -9 Bash 5 hours ago

Re: The end goal (+1)

Malays2 bowman a few seconds ago

I've lost track of how many times I had to remove all of the /amp/ garbage from links so I could post them* . And there seems to be a few different formats when it comes to /amp/.
*One reason is that Google is not seen as very trust worthy these days, so I post urls that are directed to the original page.

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This option needs to be hidden (+1)

Joe2020 21 hours ago

Having an option is only good to intelligent people. This option needs to be hidden deep in the interface in about:config. We cannot let this option fall into the hands of dumb people, because giving dumb people the freedom of choice leads to bad outcomes (i.e. the election of the US president).
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Re: This option needs to be hidden (+1)

Killall -9 Bash 5 hours ago

invalid_user 11 hours ago

I use Firefox.
(Also, this is old news.)
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Does this apply to Chromium as well? (+1)

OneHundredAndTen 7 hours ago

Hopefully not.
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phishing my backside (+3, Insightful)

Shaitan 6 hours ago

This is about hiding tracking data they've encoded in the url
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Re: phishing my backside (+1)

Shaitan 6 hours ago

[blinking...@gmail.com]

U.S. Supreme Court Endorses Gay, Transgender Worker Protections
from the moving-forward dept.
The U.S. Supreme Court on Monday delivered a watershed victory for LGBT rights, ruling that a landmark federal law forbidding workplace discrimination protects gay and transgender employees. From a report:
The 6-3 ruling represented the biggest moment for LGBT rights in the United States since the Supreme Court legalized same-sex marriage nationwide in 2015. In the new ruling, the justices decided that gay and transgender people are protected under Title VII of the Civil Rights Act of 1964, which bars employers from discriminating against employees on the basis of sex as well as race, color, national origin and religion. Workplace bias against gay and transgender employees has remained legal in much of the country, with 28 U.S. states lacking comprehensive measures against employment discrimination. The rulings -- in two gay rights cases from Georgia and New York and a transgender rights case from Michigan -- recognize new worker protections in federal law.

Posted by msmash a day ago

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376 Comments
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Outstanding
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One thing I've noticed about the right wing (+1)

Malays2 bowman a few seconds ago

They have to bully groups they see as weak and can't fight back. They always need people to feel superior over.
I wonder what happens when they run out of victims to bully?

[blinking...@gmail.com]

r/SeattleWA
chocolatefondant2d
Residents of apartments that ended up in CHAZ / CHOP need to sleep too. Please stop blasting music and chanting at night. We are really tired and want peace and quiet at least at night. Sleep is a basic human need.
Other
And telling us that this is better than tear gas and flash bangs is not making this noise any more bearable.

EDIT: Answering most common questions or suggestions:

I use white noise and earplugs. The fact is that we BEG you to be quiet at least at nighttime and you don’t care. How am I supposed to be supportive of police-free environment if in this environment no one cares about people who actually live here? You blast music 24/7 and don’t give us ANY BREAK. I put earplugs in to hide from insane party outside, and I take my earplugs out and end up in an insane party outside. Fulfilling this simple request will make us feel heard and respected.
If you want me to move, pay me 10k. 5200 to break my lease, about 1500 in moving expenses, and inconvenience fee for time spent looking for a new apartment that’s as good as the one I live in right now. If you are interested, I will send you the invoice😊
This is not the normal noise at Cal Anderson. Not for a week straight, 24/7.
Being able to afford to live in an expensive apartment doesn’t make feelings of people living here any less valid.
Not liking CHAZ because it affects my quality of life does not make me racist.
We did not ask to live in CHAZ. You can hang out at CHAZ and come home elsewhere to where you can sleep in peace. We cannot.
What’s the point of comparing ruining our sleep and bringing us daily headaches with 24/7 noise, and the racism against POC? Also I am literally an immigrant to the US from a country where we never had black slavery. Stop justifying making me suffer for something neither I nor my ancestors did.
My white privilege does not give me a superpower to block out this noise, nor does it make the perpetual noise acceptable.
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Sleazy_James2d
I was just down there and an older Native woman was lecturing everyone in cal Anderson about precisely this.

828
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6 more replies
my_lucid_nightmarewell-known Capitol Hill community member2d
Community good will is important. Nothing pisses people off more than visitors keeping them up all night.

Yes, it's "better than police flash-bangs."

But you watch. If CHAZ/CHOP keeps just becoming "Capitol Hill-a-Palooza" every night, neighbors are going to start complaining to the city about it.

The point was protesting police violence.

Giving speeches against police violence in front of the East Precinct building? On point and valid. Murals on the street? On point and valid.

All night loud music in Cal Anderson? Off topic, and likely to generate more bad feelings among anyone who isn't a part of the party, diverting attention from the message.

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Tasmanian_T-rexCapitol Hill2d
Seconded, I’m all for the cause and support the movement but heavy bass at 3am is a little tiring. Just asking for a small community courtesy.

780
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6 more replies
peanut_shell2d
Thanks for saying something! It's so exhausting. No break from noise ever. It sucks.

981
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Zoomalude
2d
My friend keeps saying "It's basically Burning Man in the middle of the city" and I couldn't imagine living in a building in the middle of Burning Man and trying to sleep.

299
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5 more replies

lupus21
2d
I think they don't get that if they want this to go on for longer they'll need support of the people living in the area. If more people are going to start complaining this whole thing might end pretty soon.

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kardigank1d
I’m a healthcare professional and live a block from cal Anderson. I’ve been working more days and longer hours since covid started and now I can’t even go home at night and get any quality sleep for my shift the next day. I was woken up the other night at 11pm by 2 jerkoffs pulling a dumpster down the middle of the street. I really wish these tourists would go home at a decent hour.

59
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SillyChampionship2d
This may be an unpopular opinion, but I don’t think that the chaz/chop thing would have happened if we hadn’t been in lockdown for months ahead of it. I believe that 1/2 the people are out there using the tragic events as an excuse to have the capital hill block party.

1.0k
Reply

darwinsbutterchicken
2d
Not unpopular at all. Having been through the zone several times, my observation is that most people visit to hang, listen to the music, and check out the art. Definitely has a block party vibe.

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2 more replies

Wingman4l7
2d
I think there's more people that privately would agree with you than are willing to risk voicing that opinion aloud.

298
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lovebudds
1d
As someone who has walked her dog at night in the area, it is absolutely just a big party people just wanna drink and let loose

15
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triskaidekaphobia
2d
Not unpopular. I live on a bordering street and it’s like a tourist attraction.

42
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14 more replies
max_caulfield_1d
THANK YOU for making this post. I've been ranting about this the past few days and no one seems to understand the actual disruption going on. One person said "you haven't been in Cap Hill in the summer yet, this is what the noise is like." Really??? They think some partying on the weekend is the same as people screaming all night and blasting music? It's absolutely insane that people are trying to defend it.

28
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chocolatefondant
Capitol Hill1d
Yep. Most people are understanding but I am still getting those comments tbh. Along with telling me to break my lease and move, as if I am a walking bag of money or something. I am so tired of them. I pray this gets resolved so I can delete this post...

12
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1 more reply
Anilxe2d
I bought a whitenoise machine just for this. I hadn't gotten sleep for almost 3 full nights. Id suggest just getting a whitenoise machine, because i don't think it'll stop for a while

189
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Muzzledpet
2d
Shout out to mynoise.net with some of the most stupendous noise generators out there- white pink etc as well as nature scapes, tavern, singing bowls, cat purrs...

34
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1 more reply

J3CubAv8er
2d
Ive been using one for years. Careful they are addicting

57
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11 more replies
Samsonspimphand1d
The CHAZ kids booed a black woman off stage for saying they co-opted the movement and the protests. These are rich wanna be Bolsheviks LARPing revolution.

101
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__JonnyG
1d
As a leftist I completely agree. It's embarrassing and will eventually be counter productive.

15
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1 more reply
akmcm_262d
This was the same for COVID when people started to go outside again. I lived next to Harborview and there was literally no sense of courtesy from people. 2 girls at 4am were laughing so damn loud in the Harborview parking lot, that I could hear them from the 5th floor of my apartment. They immediately jumped to the “my sister is at the hospital fighting for her life” nonsense. Like I totally get that you’re in support of healthcare workers, but jesus christ, nurses and other healthcare workers live here too. Same shit goes for CHAZ/CHOP, nobody is against BLM, but have some sense of decency for people that actually live in the area ☹️

Edit: It seems like people are missing the LIVED, implying that I no longer live there. Stop throwing the “why don’t you just move” type of shit around. Also, you get used to noises that have been lingering in the area, new and much louder noises cause lots of sleep issues for some people.

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wowannoraxus1d
I can't even imagine being so privileged that I'd be able to set up a 24/7 zone where I don't need to acknowledge regular law and order, can spend my daytime tending to a crummy garden, and have drum circles until 4 am every night.

I mean that also sounds like hell to me personally, but those people seem to actually like it. Those of you losing sleep: I hope things change ASAP for your sanity's sake.

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Komoritane2d
Maybe try talking to some of the main volunteers/organizers. They are pretty vocal about people picking up trash when talking on the bullhorn, so they might champion your cause as well. I had no idea some people were staying up all night making noise, that’s really difficult

155
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Moses_On_A_Motorbike
2d
I can see it now, 3am and two people with bullhorns yelling at each other to keep the damn noise down

147
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1 more reply
HzyBrained1d
Agreed! Some peeps still have to get up in the morning and work.

13
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bear20082d
South Park predicted all of this. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ywVHF6Lltac

25
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Stories

Google Resumes Its Senseless Attack On the URL Bar, Hides Full Addresses On Chrome 85
from the overly-simplified dept.
Google is pressing on with new plans to hide all parts of web addresses except the domain name. Android Police reports:
A few new feature flags have appeared in Chrome's Dev and Canary channels (V85), which modify the appearance and behavior of web addresses in the address bar. The main flag is called "Omnibox UI Hide Steady-State URL Path, Query, and Ref" which hides everything in the current web address except the domain name. For example, "https://www.androidpolice.com/2020/06/07/lenovo-ideapad-flex-5-chromebook-review/" is simply displayed as "androidpolice.com." There are two additional flags that modify this behavior. One reveals the full address once you hover over the address bar (instead of having to click it), while the other only hides the address bar once you interact with the page. An issue page on the Chromium Bug tracker has also been created for keeping track of the changes, though there aren't any additional details there.

There's no public explanation yet for why Google is pressing ahead with these changes, but the company has said in the past that it believes showing the full address can make it harder to tell if the current site is legitimate. "Showing the full URL may detract from the parts of the URL that are more important to making a security decision on a webpage," Chromium software engineer Livvie Lin said in a design document earlier this year.
Google has since clarified how the experiment will work and what opt-out options will be available.

"We think this is an important problem area to explore because phishing and other forms of social engineering are still rampant on the web," a Chromium developer on the bug tracker for the change said, "and much research shows that browsers' current URL display patterns aren't effective defenses. We're implementing this simplified domain display experiment so that we can conduct qualitative and quantitative research to understand if it helps users identify malicious websites more accurately."

It was also confirmed that Google will keep the opt-out mechanism that is already present -- an 'Always show full URLs' setting that appears when you right-click the address bar. "We plan to support this opt-out option indefinitely," the same developer said.

Posted by BeauHD 2 days ago

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56 Comments
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Outstanding
Funny

Safari already does that. (+3, Interesting)

Jane Q. Public 2 days ago

Safari has been doing that for quite some time.

And I hate it.

Having said that, clicking in the address bar brings the whole address back. But I don't want it hidden in the first place.
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Re: Safari already does that. (+1)

93 Escort Wagon 2 days ago

Safari -> Preferences -> Advanced -> "Show Full Website Address"
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Re: Safari already does that. (+2)

Rockets84 2 days ago

That setting only exists for the macOS version of Safari. There's no way to turn that feature off on iOS. Can't say I'm a fan of that feature and prefer to see the full URL.
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Re: Safari already does that. (+1)

Malays2 bowman 21 hours ago

Imagine a car that refuses to give any reading below 40MPH. Or will not show how much gas you have left, or the odometer, unless you tweak some setting deep within a huge menu structure that most drivers would not even know where to look for.
I didn't RTFA, but I am assuming the address bar butchery is on by default.
This also leaves open the possibility of more malicious behavior (user sees htt ps://domain.co m instead of htt ps://domain.co m/users/1337haxx0r/embeddedbadstuff.htm)
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DUUUUUUUPE! (+2)

quonset 2 days ago

Seriously. Dupe.
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Re: DUUUUUUUPE! (+5, Funny)

SeaFox 2 days ago

I thought I'd clicked the previous posting. I couldn't tell the difference since the address bar only said "slashdot.org" on both of them.
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Re: DUUUUUUUPE! (+1)

msauve 2 days ago

... and dope (BeauHD). They're only a page apart. I'd guess the mods don't actually read /.
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Re: DUUUUUUUPE! (+2)

antdude 2 days ago

Maybe the editors' Chrome hid the original post. :P
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A decent compromise missed (+1)

Tablizer 2 days ago

A good compromise would be to highlight the domain but keep the rest displayed. Stop bleeping with de-facto standards, Google, or suffer MS-IE's fate.
I remember when they placed the alert box (JavaScript "alert();") high up in the window instead of the middle. This confused roughly 2% of users for a certain app, creating a flood of help-desk tickets. If all the other browsers put it in the middle, why deviate? Before you deviate, ask for feedback. Is that asking too much?
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Re: A decent compromise missed (+1)

Impy the Impiuos Imp 2 days ago

You need popups to overlay the menu bar, to distinguish them from fraud boxes that are just drawings on the web page.
That's one solution, anyway.
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Re: A decent compromise missed (+1)

Tablizer 2 days ago

It barely covers it up (in my test). A fake alert could just be at the top and few would notice the difference. And if they moved it even higher, people may miss it altogether.
I understand the concern, but they didn't solve it. Perhaps make the browser border/menu flash or change color for a real alert box. If you don't see it flash, you know you're dealing with a fake alert.
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Re: A decent compromise missed (+1)

phantomfive a day ago

Javascript alert() is 100% controlled by the page anyway, so that wouldn't make any difference.
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Re: A decent compromise missed (+1)

squiggleslash a day ago

...which is why you don't want the pop-up overlaying the menu bar. The Javascript alert() function is user generated, there's no set of circumstances in which you want it to look like an official message from your web browser.

alert() should produce a box in the middle of the tab, that doesn't overlay anything other than the tab's content, and doesn't prevent access to the menus or other tabs.
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Re: A decent compromise missed (+1)

Sigma 7 2 days ago

I remember when they placed the alert box (JavaScript "alert();") high up in the window instead of the middle.
That's meant to ensure that it's a browser thing rather than a webpage thing.
But since they changed it, they might as well make it whole-hog and make that alert box non-modal on subsequent attempts to close the window - or add a way to force close webpages in the same way the operating system allows force-killing browsers.
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Re: A decent compromise missed (+1)

Malays2 bowman 20 hours ago

This just reeks of programmers having nothing else to add to the browser, and are just adding 'features' like this to justify their continued employment.
A web browser is a very mature product at this point, so there is little left to add.
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BeauHD resumes senseless attack on Slashdot (+1)

thegarbz 2 days ago

Posts dupes of popular heavily commented stories.
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Re: BeauHD resumes senseless attack on Slashdot

Anonymous Coward 2 days ago
Filtered due to preferences.

Re: BeauHD resumes senseless attack on Slashdot (+1)

NagrothAgain 2 days ago

If you don't like the comments then leave! Or hide the user, or comment on the orginal story and ignore the fucking dupe. The editors need to be called out for obvious mistakes like this.
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Re: BeauHD resumes senseless attack on Slashdot (+1)

thegarbz a day ago

Is it really necessary for you to be such a little flaming faggot about this shit?
Yes. Although I feel insulated. Personally I consider myself a big flaming faggot about this shit.
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Its not sensless... (+5, Insightful)

wakeboarder 2 days ago

They'll keep reducing things until you forget how to use the web and only use google
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Re: Its not sensless... (+1)

SeaFox 2 days ago

> Implying most people online nowadays know how to use the URL bar to begin with.
That's a pretty bold claim.
There's a reason companies sweat so much about where they show up on search engine rankings for their trademarks.
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Re: Its not sensless... (+1)

LynnwoodRooster 2 days ago

The goal is to go back to the AOL model - that's all you needed, just AOL.
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Re: Its not sensless... (+1)

ackerrj 2 days ago

Yup. Evil.
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Agreed, pointless and stupid (+3, Insightful)

Rick Schumann 2 days ago

Never liked Chrome in the first place and they keep giving me more reasons to hate it. I'll stick to Firefox.
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Re: Agreed, pointless and stupid (+1)

Maletherin 2 days ago

Hating a browser is really silly.
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Re: Agreed, pointless and stupid (+1)

Rick Schumann 2 days ago

Not understanding why it deserves peoples' hate is even worse. Do you work for Google or something?
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Re: Agreed, pointless and stupid (+1)

toddestan 2 days ago

I agree. Even Internet Explorer needs some love!
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Re: Agreed, pointless and stupid (+1)

lactose99 a day ago

Mosaic or bust.
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Re: Agreed, pointless and stupid (+1)

transporter_ii a day ago

Pfft. I telnet to the site and compile the tags in my head.
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Technically it's not senseless. (+4, Insightful)

hey! 2 days ago

It definitely is *controversial*. There's a good chance it's wrong. It might even be stupid. But they have a justification for doing it that's worth thinking about: *for some people* a full URL obscures information they need by jumbling it with other information that's meaningless to them.
That doesn't mean *nobody* has a use for that information. But presumably people who benefit from all that detail would know enough to opt-in. People who don't have use for that information, when presented with it, will just see an address bar as full of gibberish and ignore it. People are really good at ignoring stuff that's right there in front of them.
Of course that argument cuts both ways; you can pare the address bar down so it only displays the most important thing for the non-technical user: the identity of the domain serving the data they're looking at. But it doesn't mean they'll pay any attention to it.
So here's one possible result: they mildly inconvenience a bunch of power users and benefit absolutely nobody. But we know that will happen for sure.
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Re: Technically it's not senseless. (+1)

Killall -9 Bash a day ago

People are really good at understanding things without knowing they understand them.

By changing the behavior of the address bar, they are fucking with an already only partially useful paradigm, the URL.

People barely understand the web they browse, and someone wants to give the plebs less data for their minds to crunch on in the background?

How long before Google hides the domain too? No, really, you can trust us, you're actually on Twitter, not a google look-alike. Would we lie?
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Re: Technically it's not senseless.

Anonymous Coward a day ago
Filtered due to preferences.

Re: Technically it's not senseless. (+1)

hey! 21 hours ago

A priori sure. But one thing I learned from decades of designing software for users is that a priori judgment is unreliable. Empirical data trumps handwaving arguments.
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Re: Technically it's not senseless. (+1)

gshegosh 8 hours ago
When Firefox does stupid things, at least usually you can disable them in about:config
Senseless or not, they should at least allow "power" users to turn it on/off.

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Good for hacking you (+1)

backslashdot 2 days ago

It's starting to look like they need that so that you keep getting hacked and are dependent on them. Without phishing attacks a whole bunch of application security folk would have less justification for their job and have to find another gig.
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Just colour the URL blue to the left of the domain (+1)

Ocker3 2 days ago

And then red to the right, or whatever colour scheme you want, to show people that there are different parts and they do different things. Tech support is hard enough without having to also tell people to click into the URL bar so they can actually see the specific page they're on! Removing things usually isn't the solution, sure, simplicity and elegance should be striven for, but here Context is what we need.
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Re: Just colour the URL blue to the left of the dom (+1)

clovis 2 days ago

And then red to the right, or whatever colour scheme you want, to show people that there are different parts and they do different things. Tech support is hard enough without having to also tell people to click into the URL bar so they can actually see the specific page they're on!
Removing things usually isn't the solution, sure, simplicity and elegance should be striven for, but here Context is what we need.
This.
And do it for both the URL bar and especially for the hover over url links.
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The end goal (+2)

backslashdot 2 days ago

For you to be Chrome-Locked. Guaranteed at some point they will make it a pain in the ass to copy and paste URLs outside of Chrome/Google and then eventually they will make you think everything --all content is "on Google".
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Re: The end goal

thegarbz a day ago
Filtered due to preferences.

Re: The end goal (+1)

Malays2 bowman 20 hours ago

I've lost track of how many times I had to remove all of the /amp/ garbage from links so I could post them* . And there seems to be a few different formats when it comes to /amp/.
*One reason is that Google is not seen as very trust worthy these days, so I post urls that are directed to the original page.
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AOL is back! (+1)
Malays2 bowman an hour ago

"eventually they will make you think everything --all content is "on Google"."

Meet the new AOL, same as the old AOL.

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This option needs to be hidden (+1)

Joe2020 2 days ago

Having an option is only good to intelligent people. This option needs to be hidden deep in the interface in about:config. We cannot let this option fall into the hands of dumb people, because giving dumb people the freedom of choice leads to bad outcomes (i.e. the election of the US president).
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Re: This option needs to be hidden (+1)

Killall -9 Bash a day ago

because giving dumb people the freedom of choice leads to bad outcomes


Why is it always people dumber than me having this elitist opinion? YUO NO SMRT, I AM TEH SMAART, YOU NO VOET, ONLI I AM VOOT.
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Re: This option needs to be hidden (+1)

Malays2 bowman an hour ago
And this kind of gatekeeping is going to ensure that the 'dumb' people remain that way.
This is like when certain Usenet groups were taken over and used as hangouts for uppity, elitist fucks (read: a bunch of awkward losers in their parents' basements who will never know what sex is like). That is, until they got flooded out by all of the penis enhancement spam. But before that, if you had a tech question, or whatever, these feces hurling monkeys would trash you for being a "newbie".
The gatekeeping you are proposing is just more of the same.

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There is a flag for that (+3, Interesting)

Midnight Thunder 2 days ago

A timely e-mail came into my mailbox today, since I had been watching an issue. Apparently there is a flag to go back to showing the full URL:
Comment #289 on issue 41467 by xx...@google.com: URL bar no longer shows http:///
https://bugs.chromium.org/p/ch...
This was fixed in Chrome 83:
- Enable chrome://flags/#omnibox-context-menu-show-full-urls
- Restart the browser
- Right-click the address bar, and check "Always show full URLs"
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Re: There is a flag for that (+1)
paul248 17 hours ago
Yes, that's the real news here. Chrome has been butchering URLs for several years, and the problem is finally solved.
Having a choice between "real URLs" and "kindergarten mode" is a massive improvement.

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Thank God for Microsoft Edge (+1)

mfearby 2 days ago

Did I just say that?! :-)
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Dumbing down. (+4, Insightful)

Camel Pilot 2 days ago

Is not this the same motivation behind hiding the file extension by default? Or hiding the actual hierarchical location of the "virtual folder" Documents, Downloads, etc?
Always pisses me off when you have to explain to a newbie where the photo they just download actually resides on their file system. By trying to make GUI interfaces easier (or dumber) the woke designers end up making it harder and more confusing.
Remember when Gates himself download Mozilla to show how easy it is to install another web browser and he couldn't find where the download directory was?
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Re: Dumbing down. (+2)

TJHook3r a day ago

Google is aiming for a UI that eventually looks like a smart TV! That said, I would rather it be Google mangling things than Microsoft - if they had their way, the Internet would be run on SharePoint and URLs would be meaningless garbage!
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They've tried less extreme approaches (+1)

The MAZZTer 2 days ago

I guess phishing is still a big problem?
The domain is bolded in the address bar, https:/// is hidden (so now the domain is the first thing you see next to the lock), the lock is more picky about when it appears, and extended SSL certs can contain company info that can be displayed next to the lock, making it easy for users to verify their website.
I can only assume there's still problems with users giving their passwords away to obvious phishing sites if Google feels they have to take this further, and honestly I can't think of any alternative steps they could take. I have to pity them as well since I am sure some users will blame Google when they carelessly share their password with a malicious third party. It really comes down to a lack of education I think. By the time someone is already clicking on an e-mail to open a phishing site in Google Chrome, there's only so much Google can do for them at that point.
I think this additional step is meant to address sites that might have a domain like "facebook.com.login.phishing.example.org" which may trick a user who doesn't understand domains. And in fairness, domains are backwards from the rest of the url in that they get more selective going to the left instead of the right. It's easy to see this could be confusing for someone who is used to looking to the left of a url for the domain.
I think I would also argue that if you need to go and edit the full url, read it, copy a piece of it, or otherwise do anything other than copy the full thing, it's a failure of the website rather than Chrome. While it is nice that it has been easy to do all these things, I would say the website should provide easy navigation that is faster than editing the url, and any text bits you want to read or copy should be made available in the page itself for ease of access.
That said I agree it's frustrating that this is changing. Thankfully most of the time I don't need to touch the address bar, Most of the time it's to clean up a URL I intend to share, and I would blame the site itself for putting garbage in the url and not offering a website button that cleans it up for me. But then most people don't care about cleaning up urls anyway...
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Re: They've tried less extreme approaches (+1)

tlhIngan a day ago

Similar.
It's because phishing sites have tried everything, including http://example.com/blah/blah/b...
The padding is there to basically scroll the URL - on many space constrained browsers, it's less useful to know the site you're on than the actual document path so they will generally scroll to the end (so the user sees "https/www.facebook.com/" in the URL bar. It's why mobile browsers started showing just the domain name now and hiding the URL itself (but the full URL is exposed if you tap on it to say, copy it).
Definitely controversial since it pits casual users against power users, and many "power" users are too casual and fall for the trick I showed above thinking they're immune and "I'm smart don't pretend I'm dumb" mode.
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Good news for yours truly (+1)

invalid_user a day ago

I use Firefox.
(Also, this is old news.)
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Does this apply to Chromium as well? (+1)

OneHundredAndTen a day ago

Hopefully not.
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phishing my backside (+3, Insightful)

Shaitan a day ago

This is about hiding tracking data they've encoded in the url
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Re: phishing my backside (+1)

Shaitan a day ago

Also this would let them automatically modify and censor certain data was contained in the url when you copy/paste.
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Re: phishing my backside (+1)

Malays2 bowman a few seconds ago

Which leads me to wonder if the programmers are not doing this because they want to. More control, more profits for the powers-to-be.
This song is getting very old.

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Chrome foot gun (+1)

LordWabbit2 21 hours ago

Another reason not to use Chrome, like I needed another. Used to love Chrome back in the day, back in the day when I thought I could trust google.
To be honest most browsers are cookie cutter versions of each other anyways.
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Re: Chrome foot gun (+1)

Malays2 bowman 4 minutes ago

Most other browsers use Chrome or Firefox as the "engine", with a different UI and some added features.

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Stories

Google Resumes Its Senseless Attack On the URL Bar, Hides Full Addresses On Chrome 85
from the overly-simplified dept.
Google is pressing on with new plans to hide all parts of web addresses except the domain name. Android Police reports:
A few new feature flags have appeared in Chrome's Dev and Canary channels (V85), which modify the appearance and behavior of web addresses in the address bar. The main flag is called "Omnibox UI Hide Steady-State URL Path, Query, and Ref" which hides everything in the current web address except the domain name. For example, "https://www.androidpolice.com/2020/06/07/lenovo-ideapad-flex-5-chromebook-review/" is simply displayed as "androidpolice.com." There are two additional flags that modify this behavior. One reveals the full address once you hover over the address bar (instead of having to click it), while the other only hides the address bar once you interact with the page. An issue page on the Chromium Bug tracker has also been created for keeping track of the changes, though there aren't any additional details there.

There's no public explanation yet for why Google is pressing ahead with these changes, but the company has said in the past that it believes showing the full address can make it harder to tell if the current site is legitimate. "Showing the full URL may detract from the parts of the URL that are more important to making a security decision on a webpage," Chromium software engineer Livvie Lin said in a design document earlier this year.
Google has since clarified how the experiment will work and what opt-out options will be available.

"We think this is an important problem area to explore because phishing and other forms of social engineering are still rampant on the web," a Chromium developer on the bug tracker for the change said, "and much research shows that browsers' current URL display patterns aren't effective defenses. We're implementing this simplified domain display experiment so that we can conduct qualitative and quantitative research to understand if it helps users identify malicious websites more accurately."

It was also confirmed that Google will keep the opt-out mechanism that is already present -- an 'Always show full URLs' setting that appears when you right-click the address bar. "We plan to support this opt-out option indefinitely," the same developer said.
Posted by BeauHD 2 days ago

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58 Comments

Malays2 bowman 21 hours ago

hey! a day ago

A priori sure. But one thing I learned from decades of designing software for users is that a priori judgment is unreliable. Empirical data trumps handwaving arguments.
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Re: Technically it's not senseless. (+1)

gshegosh 9 hours ago

Malays2 bowman 21 hours ago

Malays2 bowman a few seconds ago

Having a choice between "real URLs" and "kindergarten mode" is a massive improvement."

Why is there even a need for a "kindergarten mode" in the first place? Are the inexperienced really in that much of shock and awe if they see a long, complicated URL? The "why" is sorely missing from this, other than maybe a cheap attempt at content control (making it hard to copy+paste urls).
Why must we keep setting the bar lower and lower, trying to make the ignorant more ignorant? This is nuts.

Malays2 bowman 26 minutes ago

Which leads me to wonder if the programmers are not doing this because they want to. More control, more profits for the powers-to-be.
This song is getting very old.
Reply Share
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Chrome foot gun (+1)

LordWabbit2 a day ago

Another reason not to use Chrome, like I needed another. Used to love Chrome back in the day, back in the day when I thought I could trust google.
To be honest most browsers are cookie cutter versions of each other anyways.
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Re: Chrome foot gun (+1)

Malays2 bowman 29 minutes ago

Most other browsers use Chrome or Firefox as the "engine", with a different UI and some added features.
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To put it simply, there is no justice or freedom when a group is made out to be subhuman.

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Another accomplishment for Replublicans.

Anonymous Coward 2 days ago

Republicans:
Freed the slaves.
First black politicians.
Women voting rights.
Civil Rights Act.
Expanded rights for LGTPQ+++
Trump, the first president for gay marriage and has passed laws protecting them world wide -- yeah, not enforceable, but still.

Democrats:
Had slaves, were the Confederates, and then formed the KKK.
Used the KKK to suppress the vote of blacks and keep them down for decades, then blamed Republicans.
... Women didn't want the right to vote, because it came with required duties and the draft ...
Voted mostly against the Civil Rights act, then lied to the brainwashed MORONS that they and the Republicans switched sides.
Use the LGTPQ++ community just like Blacks, for vote harvesting.
No president other than Trump supported gay marriage prior to their election. Most democrats are in bed with Islam...

The left has gone fucking insane! Where are all the screeching crybabies go, that were clawing on the Supreme Court door when Kavanaugh was made justice. They were screaming the SKY IS FALLING! Fucking ignorant fools!! All you do is throw tantrums like pathetic children. Then some of you MORONS have the gull to turn around and act as if it's the conservatives that are doing something wrong. You're a bunch of fucking frauds and hypocrites. Selfish diaper wearing looser.

Conservatives are normal, mostly centered, but you simple minded fools have this fanatical view of things that really do not line up with reality. I'm a liberal -- which is why I rant, but I've had to move towards conservatism, since they're the rational based crowd.
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Re: Another accomplishment for Replublicans. (+1)

Malays2 bowman 2 days ago

"Conservatives are normal"
Wow, I love that word "normal". It lets you dehumanise others in a rather soft way.
The moment somebody trots out the word "normal", their cred goes to shit.
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Re: Another accomplishment for Replublicans. (+1)

Malays2 bowman 2 days ago

Normal - a way to say that the "normal" person is deserving of respect, while the other group is deserving of being spat upon, thrown into the streets, and murdered.

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Re: Another accomplishment for Replublicans. (+1)
ebvwfbw a day ago
Who's being spat upon? Who is being thrown into the streets? It's not the democrats, they're the ones doing the spitting, they're the ones destroying, they're the ones throwing conservatives into the street and even other democrats that they think don't agree with them. Sometimes all it takes is one minor infraction and they'll try to kill you. OMG, You're really _______________.
George Floyd - meth head, armed robber. Unfortunately gets killed by police. Black community - YAY, he's great! Throw him 3 funerals. Do a painting with angel wings on him. He was alley trash who in all likelihood would have died that day anyway due to the drugs already in his system. Any other community would be - he's alley trash. Cardboard coffin, potters field. BTW, something should be done about police training.
Conservatives as always - this is horrible. Even though he's alley trash we have to stop that from happening if it happens to anyone. If it happens there eventually it'll be at everyone's door step.
democrats/left - how can we make this political. We don't give a rip about GF. How can we step on his dead carcass to benefit. Show up and act like we care. Lying is what the left does best.

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Re: Another accomplishment for Replublicans. (+1)

Malays2 bowman 18 hours ago
"Who's being spat upon? Who is being thrown into the streets? "
LGBT kids, because their parents believe in a "god" that calls them an abomination, destined for hell, etc... And we have idiots like Trump trying to dehumanize them even further, making them more of a target.
Trump really seems to hate transgenders. I wonder if he is a closet case himself. Most phobes are.

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Re: Another accomplishment for Replublicans. (+1)

ebvwfbw 17 hours ago
Surprised you feel this way. Kids should not be doing this. Let them live some. I remember college experiments where we asked 100 5th graders if they could switch sexes, would they? Over half of them said yes. Back then it was just a silly experiment, it was the 1970s.
So now we in fact have kids that bought into this due to gay people pushing an agenda and now they have irreparable damage done to their bodies. They have a messed up life. Why are we allowing this? Most kids don't even know what they want to be when they graduate from high school. Why allow kids and sometimes they're not even in school to make such a decision. That's child abuse. Life's hard enough as it is.
I know people that have transitioned. Both after they already had a family. I supported them of course. One of the few that did. They both thought it was the greatest thing since sliced bread. For a while. Both of them have since tried to commit suicide multiple times that I know of. The hospital that pioneered SRS stopped doing it for that reason. They were better off as they were. Just too much trouble wherever they work, their college degrees, neighbors, family, etc. One of them does modelling. As long as he's in his female voice it's fine. If he slips into being a guy again - now the eyebrows go up. WTF? You never really switch into your new gender. So from time to time the lie shows up. What's funny is he says he's hit on all the time by democratic politicians trying to get him in bed. Even when another politician is in the news for doing that!
I think they're crazy and really need to stay as they were. With this trans- crap it can be very bad. There's a case where a "trans-man" presented to the emergency room. Abdominal pains. Where it happened they're not allowed to ask if they're really a woman because of that pronoun crap, or something. So they subjected a baby to all kinds of radiation to find out this "man" was really a woman and she was in labor. TL;DR. So that brings up a question - why was "he" having sex? Short answer - that woman's crazy. No matter what you do you can't change your genetics. Dumbass should have said he was really a she. It gets absurd.
I don't think he's a phobe. In business you kind of get use to it. Back in the 1990s I was a bit shocked. Chick turned out to have a penis. I didn't find it, a "romeo" did LOL. She was fine. Continued to work just fine. She'd just try to get any man coming in to go down the road to a motel. Her business, not mine. I've come across others. Besides, have you seen Trump's wife? OMG. That's a hot babe. Best first lady ever. She should be on the cover of many mags.
However if you get older, you're an adult and you just can't stand to be a male/female - go for it. Just make sure you're really sure of what you're doing. Is this really what you want? Why are you doing this, is that a good reason? Talk to someone else about it. Maybe it'll change your life for the better, maybe you just threw your life away. I hope anyone doing it improves their life and it was a good decision.
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Re: Another accomplishment for Replublicans. (+1)

Malays2 bowman a few seconds ago

"Surprised you feel this way. Kids should not be doing this. Let them live some"
Beating them up and throwing them out into the streets to be preyed upon by some evil, sick bastards who know all of their vulnerabilities is NOT the way to handle this. But this is exactly what is going on, and it's still happening NOW. This is one of the worst examples of child abuse.
I'm not going to go into some long spiel about how kids should be raised, but throwing an underage kid out into the world, a kid with no experience or real knowledge of how it works is beyond criminal. In a more just world, those parents would be sent to prison for a very long time, and kept in ad-seg because the moment they step into general-pop, it's curtains for them. I would really like to see these 'parents' thrown to the wolves, but that's just me.
I suffered child abuse as a kid, though for different reasons, and I see child abusers as the lowest of the lowest scum.
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One thing I've noticed about the right wing (+1)

Malays2 bowman 18 hours ago

They have to bully groups they see as weak and can't fight back. They always need people to feel superior over.
I wonder what happens when they run out of victims to bully?

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Errors in original post's headline and its text (+1)
brec 15 hours ago
(1) "U.S. Supreme Court Endorses Gay, Transgender Worker Protections"
The Court did not "endorse" the protections because it did not evaluate whether the 1964 Civil Rights law was a good or bad law. The Court found that the law provides the protections, and that (theoretically) it has done so since it was enacted. The Court interpreted the

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#triggered #karen #PublicFreakouts

🤬 Top 5 KARENS Getting TRIGGERED! 🤬
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plateshutoverlock

#2 - the cure for a boner that won't go away
1 second ago



Pinned by Rekt Videos
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100k subs and I'll get a Karen haircut.
1 month ago
824
69


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Danny Gautama
Wishing someone’s kids get cancer is the definition of EVIL.
2 weeks ago
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I was married to a Karen once. If I ever hear, "I need to speak to the manager" again, I will throw up.
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MysticKoolaid808
"Ma'am? Jesus Christ just called me. He said he doesn't need your help either."
1 week ago
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who else is addicted to watching karens and laughing at their stupidity lmaooooooo
just me? okay
1 week ago
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There's a lot of undiagnosed mental illness in the world.
1 week ago
457
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steve garcia
Damn for the lady trying to convince a person to Christ shes got such a vulgar mouth she definitely is on something or is ill with mental illness
1 week ago
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Amy Thompson
In all fairness, some of these people are mentally ill.
1 week ago
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I am so mad the she called everyone a sinner when the was cussing like a sailor right in front of kids
4 days ago
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Peter Chase
Many of these people seem to have psychological problems.
1 week ago
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The women preaching Jesus seems to be demon possessed.
2 weeks ago
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That is NO way to spread the gospel I fell sorry for the Christians in that store.
1 week ago

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If walmart Karen really had jesus in her heart she woudlnt be talking like that...
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people aren’t seeing the mental illness involved
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What is there to be outraged about at the dollar tree? Everything’s a dollar. You should expect that walking in
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does that woman's camel toe take debit or credit?
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The woman in the boots is quite possibly having a psychotic episode
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Thanks Sherlock
Clearly the old lady in walmart has mental illness. Religious delusions of grandeur.
1 week ago
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That so called "Christian" has got to get back on her meds because she is too proud to allow the DIVINE LOVE of the Jesus she obviously, doesn't know to come onto her heart.🥺😢
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Bubba Sue 52
That last Karen was totally demonic. "Demon Karen"
1 week ago
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3

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Comments • 462

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plateshutoverlock

Back in the 80s, my class had a party at Chuck E Cheese.

We had the fun house where you could sneak under the turnstile instead of usung up your tokens.

Years later, my sister figured out a way to mechanically hack the pool table to get unlimited plays. Good times.
1 second ago


Captain Obvious
Here comes Shane Dawson fans
1 year ago
469
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Tbone680
I’m having my 18th birthday at Chuck E. Cheese’s. I don’t care what anyone thinks. I’m gonna have a good time
1 year ago
215
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Maruko Sama 99
I've heard rumors that their pizza tasted better back in the 80's, is this true?
9 months ago
46
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DickHead4432
0:11 DANGGGGG HOW MANY CHEESE YOU PUT ON THAT PIZZA
1 year ago
58
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Rblx Plyr
Early 2000s one was my childhood
1 year ago
28

SMG5 // SuperMarioGlitchy5
How was 80s Chuck able to take his hat off?
1 year ago
55
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Mickey Mouse
Fnaf fans be ruining Chuck E Cheese for everyone.
11 months ago
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Lil Bee Doggy
Chuck E scares me and Im 11.
Song: you can smile!
Me: no
1 year ago
33
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Alex Wood
How did I get here?
I just clicked on a music video and now I’m here...
2 years ago
14
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chuck e cheeses is awsome flugga
I remember when i was a kid in 1977 i liked how crusty did expressions
2 years ago
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Hunter Jones
About the first commercial, "brand new pizza" = old pizzas combined.
1 year ago
5

Ultimate Charizard
I smell some pizza... I mean, YTP material here!
10 months ago
5

CaRcypher
This was lit for an 80's kid, which is me.
1 year ago (edited)
12

Minecraft Longplays
2:02 that one is fake
11 months ago
9
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Chuck E Cheese Fan's
I like chuck e cheese.
2 years ago
14

Grapy_19
I love the song “ smile America,with Chuck E. Cheese”
I literally started singing it everywhere xD
5 months ago
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1 year ago
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RgRuinz Yt
The fun that makes the magic my nargas bro HELL NO
1 year ago
3

Christina h
Where are the Shane fans 🤬idc I still go here the pizza just gonnna have to kill me
1 year ago
5
1


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idk lol
Leave a like if u watching in 2018
1 year ago
104
10

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Gaby -_-
pLEnTy oF CHeEsE
3 months ago
3


RTL The Musician
That’s Chucky’s special, it has human skin and flesh in the pizza
1 month ago
1


Adonis Farhat
RTL The Musician It is a creepypasta, the author said himself "it is not real".
1 month ago
3


RTL The Musician
Adonis Farhat I’m playing along with the damn creepypasta
4 weeks ago


Yukichu OwQ
@RTL The Musician gross
3 weeks ago


Sebastian Ressler
i mean the place is called chuck e CHEESE
2 weeks ago


Funtime Little Bon The Bunny
@Yukichu OwQ It's Not Real


-The Author
2 weeks ago


plateshutoverlock
It's kind of like the fast food burger you see on TV, but don't actually get in real life.
1 second ago

[blinking...@gmail.com]

plateshutoverlock
Interesting point about that is a lot of the food you see in ads is not food at all, but an inedible mock-up meant to look good in pictures.

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Trump's life deserves to be a superphy$ical one.
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The Prison Code - Louis Theroux: Miami Mega Jail - BBC
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Comments • 2,136

Add a public comment...

plateshutoverlock

Put Trump in there
1 second ago


Go home and get your shine box
Girlfriend : What's the code for your phone?
Me : The code is the code, I can't tell you the code, you gotta know the code...🤐🤐
1 year ago (edited)
2.6K
71


Young Rozay
😂😂😂
1 year ago
32


Young Rozay
That part literally came on soon as I was reading the comment 🤣
1 year ago
40


Jose Luis Avila
That was funny
1 year ago
17

Bogdan Neculai
The code is like religion: doing things just because somebody told you to do. No questions.
1 year ago
15

Joe Woodard
Dope!
1 year ago
1

S D
Go home and get your shine box bro you had me 😂😂😂😂
11 months ago
8

bee em
Crazy shyt .. I wouldn't wanna be in the paint with him ..
11 months ago
2

bee em
He look about 6 foot 2 210 pounds . Like if I was only white guy in that cell .. and he said we just wanna see what you about.. . I'd not box.. I'd go for grappling match .. single leg take down . Start throwing elbows when he triedget up. I'd be able to keep him down . Just from high school wrestling practices alone ..

READ MORE
11 months ago
2

chanel benton
😂😂😂😂😂😂🙅
11 months ago
2

Unknown Ways
Facts In Life In General no snitches no 🐀
11 months ago
2


SHOW MORE REPLIES

Esteban Molina
Guy on top bunk is just like PLEASE stop asking me question 😥🤕

“I choose to be on the top bunk” 🤥🤥🤕🤕
1 year ago
2.5K
98


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IG Sky.Dweller
He answered that 'are you a real n' question with his chest. what do you think Louis damn near told the guy to test it haha.
2 years ago (edited)
2.4K
77


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Set Phasers To Stun
Louis would be sleeping on the floor.
2 years ago
1.5K
72


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THESEASONS
He asking questions that can get people killed
2 years ago
3K
76


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locks69
If they ever make a film based on Louis Theroux's life they should call it "Louis Theroux: The Real N*****"
2 years ago
1.7K
21


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Mitchell Bahamas
'YOU A REAL NICCA'? what do u think? LMAAOOOO!!!
2 years ago
1.1K
25


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Soulburner420
He's real for going up in there and asking questions like that lol
2 years ago
870
30


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Forest Whitaker's Eye
Louie slapped that dude off camera for looking him in the eyes.
5 months ago
109
2


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JiveAt5
When he said "What do you think?" the dude unconsciously backd up like Woah! we got a live one here lol
2 years ago
402
13


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green street
What do you think? Cuts away and white dude shanks the prisoner
2 years ago
616
18


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Manny Ribera
I dont mind the fighting but there should be some weight ranks.
2 years ago
682
48


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Dougal McGuire
loved how he just looked right at him and said "what do you think?". you ice cold louis. ice cold
1 year ago
112
3


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Janoy Cresva
0:15 "ma main man right there, he he right there my main main, ma main man, the main man were like give the main man the bottom" HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAH
1 year ago
230
15


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Tahi 01
If he ever ended up in there, Louis would sleep standing
1 year ago (edited)
92
10


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Zamboni Guy
Louis’ Troll Game is out of this world.
2 years ago
142
3


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whois wat
Louis is an expert is such interviews, playing it so lowkey and innocent while he knows everything they are saying.
2 months ago
13

TGP 777
I know the code. it's 66502.
2 years ago
415
16


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Walls of Jericho
His reaction when Louis asked why he didn't want the top bunk lolz.....
2 years ago
325
37


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contactkeithstack
"What do you think?" Lol. Damn, Louis ready to throw them hands.
2 months ago
15

[blinking...@gmail.com]

4:14
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5:06





Video shows suspect drive through crowd of protesters in Seattle
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Comments • 342

Add a public comment...

plateshutoverlock

Where is Homeland Security? We had terrorist attacks by drivers in Europe.
1 second ago


Corey Clancy
Show the full video...where they swarm his car and he pops one and they all back off...being disingenuous. But that's mainstream
1 week ago
271


chris cost
Why don't they show the part were the guy was hitting him and trying to pull him out of the car?
1 week ago
254


plateshutoverlock
When a terrorist uses a car to attack people, it's a brave though very risky thing to stop him.

We already had several terrorist attacks by car during the protests, yet Homeland Security does nothing. Maybe they think all terrorists shout "Allah Ackbar!" or something. :\
1 second ago


Rose Red
That's called self defence. MSM is full of lies.
1 week ago
135


Bob Flendorg
Left-biased reporting as usual by mainstream media. Clearly self defense on the part of the driver.
1 week ago
150


Alter Egos
He didn’t try to hit anyone, they rushed his car! They should have shown the whole thing! Good job manipulating to suit your narrative!
1 week ago
267

Kroynom
When are we going to start seeing real news again?
1 week ago (edited)
173
6


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pocketevolution
You can clearly see that the car was attacked even before the dude speeds up for a second. Did not hit anyone. Comes to a stop. Get's violently attacked again. What is he supposed to do, just take the beating?
1 week ago
72
13


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Connor M
Misleading title
1 week ago
331
2


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MaikUniversum
Show full video! He was attacked by protesters!
1 week ago
112
5


SHOW MORE REPLIES
Ashley S.
I will no longer be watching the false narratives coming from KING5.
UNSUBSCRIBED!
1 week ago
213
3


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S2
The driver deserves a medal.
1 week ago
247
13


SHOW MORE REPLIES
Coramelimane
Ok, let's break down what happened in this clip.
Driver was following the city speed limit.
He initally slowed down so that people on the street can see him and move.
Protesters begin throwing things at his windshield to purposefully break it.
Man attempts to speed up to get away.
Protesters bring out a barricade and manage to block him from escaping with it and their bodies.
One protesters proceeds to reach into the car, assault the driver and try to pull him out for good old mob beatings.
Driver shoots Protester in self defense (both not shown because King 5 is a liberal news channel and needs to follow narrative)
Protesters flee armed driver.
Driver makes a bee line for police protection... and is arrested for defending himself.

READ MORE
1 week ago (edited)
85
2


SHOW MORE REPLIES
First name Last name
First they block the road and pretend you are the bad guy for going somewhere. Then a mob surrounds your car, pounding on the windows, wildly shaking it, and they are surprised someone thinks to hit the gas pedal in an attempt to flee the chaos.

I have no pity for stupidity.
1 week ago
64
1


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MARK PERRY
That's self defence if I've ever seen it.
1 week ago
145
8


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Milo82
Looks like self defence
1 week ago
53
2


SHOW MORE REPLIES
InFerno
I watched the full video several times and I did not see a car plow through people. It was coming down the road fast it slowed down and stopped he did not hit one single person.
So wheres the plow ?
If anything as soon as he stopped he was surrounded by people and was being pulled out of the car.
1 week ago (edited)
22

Rohit Thakur
Why they were trying to beating the driver and running behind the car .
I can see driver already stopped the car and mob trying to beat him , he defend himself
1 week ago (edited)
185
20


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Tanguo
How dare he drive his car at a reasonable speed and stop to avoid protesters! Definitely worthy of a mob lynching.
1 week ago
79

Rasputin Czar
What a load of nonsense King 5! You should really be ashamed! The video shows a lynch mob attacking a lone white guy who is trying to save his life. You ve also edited the video at 1:31 to enhance the opposite cause/effect.
Dispeakable King 5.
1 week ago
24

Jason Thanks
Our hero thank you driver and shooter we need more people like you
1 week ago
54
1

[blinking...@gmail.com]

1:08
/
1:13




#NBC #NBCLA

Mini Cooper Drives Through Crowd of Protesters in Newport Beach | NBCLA
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Comments • 2,141

Add a public comment...

plateshutoverlock

When a terrorist uses a car to attack people, it's a brave though very risky thing to stop him. This is the kind of attack that was seen in Europe. Where is DHS?

We already had several other terrorist attacks by car during the protests, yet Homeland Security does nothing. Maybe they think all terrorists shout "Allah Akbar!" or something. :\
1 second ago


Ghostly Theater
STOP BRINGING CHILDREN TO PROTESTS!!!
1 week ago
207
15


SHOW MORE REPLIES
Mickey Doolittle
Note to self, when protesting, stay out of road & don’t bring children.
1 week ago
199
2


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Paul cruz
You got to be the stupidest person to do that, cps needs to look at this person that took a child to a riot, unbelievable
1 week ago
151
9


SHOW MORE REPLIES
Jack Steele
to late to honk the horn... AND WHO TF BRINGS A CHILD TO A PROTEST?!

1 week ago
48
3


SHOW MORE REPLIES

Drake Sabbidge
You learn when you're A little kid
Not to play in the road.
1 week ago
127
4


SHOW MORE REPLIES
Walker Killer #1 Wainwright
Why take your kids to a protest when you know it could go violent at anytime.
1 week ago
144
11


SHOW MORE REPLIES
Nicksperiments
Mom to child: make sure you look both ways when crossing the street, always stay out of the road.
Also mom: brings child to stand in the middle of the road
1 week ago
102
1


SHOW MORE REPLIES
Ditso Kar
Child protection services wants to know her location
1 week ago
15
2


SHOW MORE REPLIES
Just listen
Post modern bowling?
1 week ago
25
2


SHOW MORE REPLIES
gpfreak1
Yea bring kids the dogs and just make it a family outing
1 week ago
47
1


SHOW MORE REPLIES
Sunem Family
American logic: bring your child to the protest! These people are strange and sick?
1 week ago
13

L.A. Rican
"Ok, honey I'm headed to the protest for that 1 guy who died Gene Boyd I think his name was there is the potential for chaos and maybe violence so I'm going to take the kids"
1 week ago (edited)
38
3


SHOW MORE REPLIES
Scott Stevens
Who else loves the 2nd Amendment more than ever now?
1 week ago

42
4


SHOW MORE REPLIES

Papa Bear
What ever happened to covid 19 is on vacation or what???🤔🤔🤔
1 week ago
294
53


SHOW MORE REPLIES
angelo urena
What kind of morons take their kids to a protest.
1 week ago
117
12


SHOW MORE REPLIES
Greg Diprinzio
Don't forget to release the driver like you do the looters.
1 week ago
37
6


SHOW MORE REPLIES
GAMEBOYSLEEPYD 427
Well, what do you think is going to happen when you block the roads?
1 week ago
35
3


SHOW MORE REPLIES
Debra Moses
Enough protest. Go home or at least have the sense to get a babysitter. Unreal.
1 week ago
103
6


SHOW MORE REPLIES
Nicholas Huss
U probably robbed and looted the drivers business for the past 6 nights. I’d b pissed to about ur so called peaceful protest...
1 week ago
27
4


SHOW MORE REPLIES
Kevin Jones
All I saw was a car driving down a road.
1 week ago
50
2

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Rant Rampage
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TRUMPIE S CAR SEAT MEMORIES
Start Typing Rant!
TRUMPIE S CAR SEAT MEMORIES

Trumpie Wiggles Crumpleballs misses the days when he had to ride in the oversized 'baby seat' when he was 17 years old. He misses being strapped down in the all points harness, the tight crotch strap, the locked buckle very close to his neck that kept the shoulder straps together and wrist+ankle restraints and all of the straps being double locked tight with a key ensuring complete immobility. He misses the black hood that was put over his head so he couldn't see, and the gag that was put into his mouth so his mother and father could listen to the Mein Kampf audiobook in peace.
anonymous Other May 07, 2020 at 3:00 pm 2 0

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Vehicle Restraint
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Comments • 9

Add a public comment...

plateshutoverlock

They should lock all criminals this way.
1 second ago

plateshutoverlock
Jail=the evil version of hospital
4 years ago
1

wmontero1971
nice harness
5 years ago
3

plateshutoverlock
Nice! The crotch strap should be snug tho.
4 months ago

mjmrestraints
If you watch the video again, you will notice there are no locks involved. Removal of the restraint is as easy as pushing the seatbelt latch and lifting it over his head. He is the safest person in the car.

6 years ago

David Berquist
looks
6 years ago

David Berquist
is this harness portable so it can be used on a plane for example a over seas extradition
3 years ago

David Berquist
looks good but what ff he pulls on handcuffs if high hurs hm self your actors did good job demastratng
6 years ago

Kyle Bill
Lap belt should be placed on the LAP not over the stomach.
6 years ago

Kyle Bill
Lap belt should be placed on the LAP not over the stomach.
6 years ago

[blinking...@gmail.com]

The BodyBelt Control & Restraint System

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CARMS
40 subscribers

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Published on Mar 31, 2015
Hello this is the BodyBelt Control & Restraint System.

This product provides a safe, effective and affordable solution for the long term control of high risk detainees, vulnerable patients or subjects.

The system has been developed with the assistance of staff from the Police, Border control and Immigration, Custodial and secure Patient services. It has therefore been designed to meet the needs of staff across all of these disciplines.

Unfortunately during restraint especially prolonged restraints there are risks sometimes with unfortunate and even fatal consequences.

This system provides a safe, humane and Human Rights complaint form of prolonged mechanical restraint therefore reducing the risk to both staff and subjects.

The BodyBelt Control & Restraint System is entirely manufactured in the UK allowing us to respond to customer’s individual requirements.

Please watch the video which demonstrates how the system works, identify the numerous benefits of the system and hopefully show you why we think it is the best alternative currently available on the market.
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Comment • 1

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plateshutoverlock

Put Trump in that thing.
18 seconds ago

[blinking...@gmail.com]

PoliceHobble.com - Training Video - The Best Police Hobble in Law Enforcement

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Comments • 11

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plateshutoverlock

Put Trump in the Police Hobble
1 second ago

EDDIE LEAL
Not so easy when the suspect is fighting back on drugs.adrenaline, craziness
1 year ago (edited)
2


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9 91
Bc the suspect is going to be ever so cooperative with putting this on... if it comes to the point of needing leg restraints it’s because they are being combative in the first place lol.... whoever designs this shit isn’t in LEO ...
8 months ago
1


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Richard Limon
This position is frowned upon these days due to the liability issues resulting in death by excited delirium and the 'I cant breathe effect'. I believe if you use this and the suspect dies, get ready to be sued.
9 months ago
1


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Bryan Roye
So police are trained to hold down the head by the neck. This controls the suspect. Which also killed Gorge Floyd.
2 weeks ago
1
3

[blinking...@gmail.com]

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Comments • 158

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plateshutoverlock

I would've have liked to take an M-16 and gun down those smiling shitheads at 2:10 . You can see the pure evil in those smiles >:(
1 second ago


Timothy Muldoon
When it shows Hitler as a baby the time stamp is his DOB... Well done
3 weeks ago

27
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мяёCняоиїC918
The pinnacle of Soviet cinema. If only we had more movies like this...
2 years ago
163
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Jason
I personally love this film because it truly tells you that world war 2 had no real meaning to it. It was just an act of chaos out of pure hatred for humanity
5 months ago
165
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Thane Mac
I've always thought that Russians are some of the best filmmakers.
1 year ago
107
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Natedawg38
I saw this when I was going through my ww2 phase after saving private ryan came out and introduced the war to a whole new generation - medal of honor video games, band of brothers mini series etc. Oh dear what a big mistake. This took all the Hollywood romanticism out of it and as a teenager just puts a whole darker unwanted perspective on it.

It takes a lifetime to understand ww2 and this is probably the only film you should wait to watch until you're in your 30s. It's THAT strong.
1 month ago
40
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DJ Mutt
This enraged his father, who punished him severely.
3 days ago
7
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jj h
My grandfather went to one of these camp he was a young boy told me a story about it. And show me the tattoo he have for life.. Lucky he survive .. And went on to go to fight the Vietnam war.. But i could only imgaine if it was different.. How life would turn out

READ MORE
2 weeks ago (edited)
8

Shchors
Hollywood would never have the guts to make a movie like this. They should leave war films (especially ones about ww2, the eastern front and nazi war crimes) to the ones who experienced it first hand, to the ones who saw their cities destroyed, their women and children raped and slaughtered in cold blood, to the ones who saw everything around and everything they loved and knew crumble and burn around them, yet stood up to the foe and rebuilt life as they knew it. These people showed courage, heroism and determination that America could never know and never replicate in Hollywood.
10 months ago (edited)
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masterzombie161
4:23

The moment you realize in “Earthbound” you are killing a baby to prevent countless Deaths.
3 weeks ago
8

R E
Dear wehraboos, this is what your "honorable" soldiers are responsible for. Not the SS, not the Nazis. Your heros were nothing more then killers in uniforms, following orders they could opt out of. Instead the willingly went along with genocidal aims and didn't much care.
6 months ago
68
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Nabil Leal
Camera looks up to "god" at the end.
1 year ago
53
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Andrew Morrissey
What's so terrifying about this is that this all happened.
21 hours ago
1

Patrick Burns
Always loved this. It's like he caught himself fantasizing about similar atrocities to the ones he just witnessed. Eerily similar to the beliefs held by the Ukrainian during his speech.
3 months ago
13

vostrosablin
an actor who was raw, an SS major, served in the Latvian SS Legion. His name was Victor Lorenz. After the war, spent some time in the filtration camp. In 1947 he graduated from high school. He studied at the University of Latvia - USSR. and at the VGIK Institute of Cinematography in Moscow.
5 months ago
16

Kyle Shiflet
Seen this movie twice can't bring myself to watch it again it is so emotionally straining but that's what makes this movie so powerful it's one of my favorite movies and I believe one of the most important films ever made
2 months ago
8

Symone White
I really came here because some guy on TikTok included this movie in one of his videos
1 month ago
10
1


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Scott McCoy
I love the song in the end
1 year ago

23
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Nacket Donut
It's just so hard to look at...
1 week ago

Scott McCoy
Is there DVD available with Eng sub
1 year ago
6
3


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zerokomma
Τεραστια ταινια!
11 months ago
2

[blinking...@gmail.com]

Stories

A Medical Device Maker Threatens iFixit Over Ventilator Repair Project
from the don't-you-have-better-things-to-do dept.
STERIS Corporation, a company that makes sterilization and other medical equipment, sent a letter to iFixit claiming their online database of repair manuals for ventilators and medical equipment violates their copyrights. Motherboard reports:
"It has come to my attention that you have been reproducing certain installation and maintenance manuals relating to our products, documentation which is protected by copyright law," the letter said. The letter then went on to tell [Kyle Wiens, CEO of iFixit] to remove all Steris copyrighted material from the iFixit website within 10 days of the letter. As Motherboard reported in March, major manufacturers of medical devices have long made it difficult for their devices to be repaired through third party repair professionals. Manufacturers have often lobbied against right to repair legislation and many medical devices are controlled by artificial "software locks" that allow only those with authorization to make modifications.

"I'm disappointed that Steris is resorting to legal threats to stop hospitals from having access to information about how to maintain critical sterilization equipment during a pandemic," Wiens told Motherboard in an email. "No manufacturer should be stopping hospitals from repairing their equipment," Wiens said. "The best way to ensure patient safety is to make sure that equipment is being maintained regularly using the manufacturer's recommended procedures. The only way to do that is if hospitals have up to date manuals." With regards to the letter sent by Steris, Wiens said iFixit has not removed any material from its website. "We explained to Steris that what we did is a lawful and protected fair use under the U.S. Copyright act," Wiens said.
"iFixit is protected by Section 512 of the Digital Millennium Copyright Act, which allows online platforms to host content contributed by users provided they comply with the Act's requirements, which iFixit does," a letter to Steris from the Electronic Frontier Foundation on behalf of iFixit said.
Posted by BeauHD 5 hours ago

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Funny
Profits over lives (+1)

Malays2 bowman a few seconds ago

I wonder how they sleep at night?
Oh yeah, on a mattress stuffed with $100 bills. >:(
One day, something really bad will happen because of all of this reckless disregard for human lives, profits over people, and thousands will die.
Then we may see a violent revolition.
Reply Share
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Good.
Gravis Zero 5 hours ago
Filtered due to preferences.
Re: Good. (+1)
fabriciom 4 hours ago
But but but, think about their ROI. No one thinks about the ROI...
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Re: Good. (+2)
dgatwood 3 hours ago
The ROI is dead. Long live the ROI.
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Re: Good. (+1)
currently_awake 4 hours ago
They are a corporation, not a non-profit. Of course they put money before patients, the law requires that. The interests of the people are supposed to be protected by the government- but both Republican parties (D and R) have chosen to priortize profits.
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Re: Good. (+2)
Stolovaya 4 hours ago
Of course they put money before patients, the law requires that.
No. No it doesn't. See: https://www.nytimes.com/roomfo...
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Re: Good. (+1)
rattaroaz 3 hours ago
It's bizarre how many people think that though. It's just a way for people to be scumbags and not feel bad about it. For some reason, it's hard for people to admit that if some people have to suffer and die for them to make money, then people need to suffer and die. Instead, just blame the made up law that says they have to make money, and blame that very same law when others suffer and die.
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Re: Good. (+1)
sg_oneill 2 hours ago
Thats good to know. I always took it as more a "The laws an ass and should be ignored or defied" thing.
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Re: Good. (+1)
Stolovaya 2 hours ago
It is. Some people probably just genuinely think that, based on what they've seen around us (how a lot of people put profit over all). And then some, yeah, are just kind of assholes and use that "not law" to justify profits above all else.
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Re: Good. (+1)
sjames 3 hours ago
the law requires that
Absolutely not. Please quit helping unethical people cover their tracks. It is nothing more or less than a poor excuse for people who want to put their monetary gain above and beyond all other concerns but don't want to pay the social price for that.
Although little enforced, any corporation's existence is required first and foremost to be in the public interest. The Rs and the Ds have made the enforcement lax, but profit uber alles is still not required.
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Re: Good. (+1)
ufgrat 3 hours ago
Except of course, Steris moved their HQ to Dublin, so as to not pay American taxes.
Screw 'em.
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Re: Good. (+1)
rtb61 2 hours ago
As a corporation, they have to prioritise the interest of the board and their major investors, what ever those board members and major investors choose it to be ie this company https://www.sanitarium.com.au/. They have been routinely attacked by loobyists from American cereal company, their responce to those US corporations, hey want the economic advantages we have, become a NON-profit just like us (I do enjoy the cereal, https://www.sanitarium.com.au/... with cocoa made with water and a dash of milk, (oh age demands sensible eating but it need not taste bad).
You do not have to be a psychopath to run a corporation but many are and their insane psychopathic eat humanity for feed greed business principles reflect that. Major Multinational corporations will kill you to generate more profits if the penalties are less than the profits, no maybe, definitely. Things need to fucking change and all psychopaths need to be removed from positions of governance, control or influence.
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Re: Good. (+2)
fustakrakich 4 hours ago
Liability, man. Somebody fucks up, the company gets sued.
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Re: Good. (+1)
sjames 3 hours ago
FUD. FUD put out as a weak argument for doing the thing that "just happens" to make them a few extra barrels of cash.
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Re: Good. (+1)
fustakrakich 2 hours ago
Doesn't matter if it's "weak". The threat only has to exist.
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Re: Good. (+1)
sjames an hour ago
You can get sued for wearing a solid colored tee shirt that someone doesn't like. The argument is weak in the sense that I (and many others) aren't buying it.
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Re: Good. (+1)
sg_oneill 2 hours ago
Bullshit, if the ventilator breaks down because some install guy broke it, a judge isn't even going to even hear it beyond the initial conference. Its a "whats the actual legal theory here?" thing.
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Re: Good. (+1)
juniorkindergarten an hour ago
It's their manuals! If they are publishing wrong shit then they deserve to get sued. If their manual says to remove the widget from the henway valve exposing the fluberflix so it can be flushed with cleaner then so be it. If you have a replacement widget and there is a procedure to follow as outlined in the manual to properly replace it, then what's the problem? You're following the same procedure that a "factory qualified" technician is doing.
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What about mom? (0, Troll)
AndyKron 5 hours ago
Filtered due to preferences.
Re: What about mom? (+1)
Anonymous Coward 5 hours ago
Do you want your mom to die because the authorized dealer can't fix it in time to save her life?
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Re: What about mom? (+1)
Euler 3 hours ago
False choice. I want a healthcare system with mandates to have the capacity in place to avoid the whole problem in the first place. No, I don't want people touching a machine unless they are factory-certified, including FDA-approval of that training program.
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Re: What about mom? (+1)
HiThere 2 hours ago
Well, that's not the US health system. My wife had problems with her pacemaker and the company didn't answer their phones (calls made by the hospital) for over 8 hours. They did answer eventually, and she didn't quite die, but it was debilitating. She ended up staying in the hospital a month that time.
That said, I don't think an on-line manual would have helped. They HAD the manuals. But the manuals didn't include all the needed information.
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Re: What about mom? (+3, Informative)
Rick Schumann 5 hours ago
There's a whole career track just for being a biomedical equipment technician, probably for similar reasons that there's a difference between a common auto mechanic and an aircraft mechanic.
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Re: What about mom? (+1)
PPH 3 hours ago
Hurry up and jump in my car, mom. I'll take you to the hospital. I just finished the brake job.
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Grey area (+5, Insightful)
Rick Schumann 5 hours ago
Having worked previously for a medical device manufacturer (ophthalmic ultrasound machines), I can say that since they're regulated by the FDA, even repair of them is a touchy subject since unauthorized repairs, if done incorrectly, might cause a malfunction that could harm a patient either directly or indirectly, therefore medical device manufacturers are generally speaking going to do whatever they can to discourage unauthorized persons from repairing their products.
That being said the current circumstances are way out of the ordinary and in some places rather dire, therefore this becomes a less clear-cut matter.
The smart thing for this manufacturer to do is to step up in some way or other to close the 'repair gap' if there are damaged machines of theirs out there that are standing in the way of patient care. Getting litigious about it isn't helping anyone.
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Indeed Steris is being assholes. EFF is questionab (+4, Insightful)
raymorris 5 hours ago
I can certainly understand they don't want the liability when someone who has never worked on one of these machines screws up. (They can't prove who worked on it.) They do have a legitimate interest in having only properly trained people mess with the medical equipment they make and are liable for.
But as you said the right response to that would be to put out free training material or something. Maybe offer training videos and after you complete the free videos you can save a copy of the manual. Something that solves the need.
After reading the EFF's legal arguments, I find them not entirely convincing as a matter of *law*. This putting aside the issue of "doing the right thing" and just looking at it as a legal argument. I'm not saying their argument is garbage, but it's also not a particularly strong legal position. They took the entire manual, not snippets. They are distributing it for the same purpose as the manufacturer distributes it; it's not like they cut it up and made it into a work of art or something.
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Re: Indeed Steris is being assholes. EFF is questio
Anonymous Coward 3 hours ago
Filtered due to preferences.
Re: Indeed Steris is being assholes. EFF is questio (+1)
Euler 3 hours ago
That is a different issue and already solved.
No one is suggesting they should be held liable for modifications or craftsmanship not their own.
So since "and are liable for" resolves to false, the entire statement is without point.
That's exactly what people are suggesting.
Until the day the lawyers bugger off (which is never), the blame will be pointed at the manufacturer. Whoever attempts to fix that machine off-the-books is going to deny anything or not be known to the case at all and unless you have forensic evidence of their involvement, then it will look like a 'product defect' or 'improper training' of the previous time it was serviced. Both of which blame the company. Maybe there could be super-secret "void" seals or something clever that a non-trained person would not be aware of, that would be helpful to showing that a non-trained person tried to fix it.
When the manufacturer lands in court, at least they can say they tried to prevent the situation. It probably isn't very expensive to file copyright infringement cases, so that is cheap insurance.
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Steris wrote the copyright act? (+1)
raymorris 2 hours ago
Steris, a medical sterilization company, wrote the Copyright Act of 1976? Wow that's amazing.
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Re: Indeed Steris is being assholes. EFF is questio (+1)
Rick Schumann 2 hours ago
I don't necessarily disagree with you, but my experience at the ultrasound company taught me one thing: you can document something to the Nth degree, and in many case it still won't be enough to do the job properly. The people working in the probe department needed years of training in assembling, setting up, and calibrating the probes, which were very precise instruments. From the docs alone you could put one together, but it wouldn't be anywhere near the quality of a probe constructed by someone experienced. That, I think, is what they're concerned about.
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Re: Grey area (+2)
NoNonAlphaCharsHere 4 hours ago
I would tend to agree with you, were it not for the fact that STERIS is acting exactly like (and using the same legal tools) that John Deere is using to prevent farmers from changing the oil on tractors they (the farmers) OWN. Somehow, the FAA has come up with a method for airplane owners to change their own oil, or even replace their engines without paying an exclusive tribute to Cessna as the original manufacturer. Perhaps, in the midst of a pandemic, we could find a way to say to the STERIS lawyers and their ilk: "Fuck you! Shut the fuck up!".
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Re: Grey area (+2)
currently_awake 4 hours ago
If the brakes in your car fail because of "Repairs" by some back yard mechanic, it's not the car company at fault. Putting tamper seals on the ventilator will show if unauthorized repairs occured.
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Re: Grey area (+3, Insightful)
jbeaupre 3 hours ago
Coincidentally, I design ultrasonic surgical equipment. There's a huge difference between maintenance, field repair, and factory repair. There is no one-size-fits-all solution. Any comparison to fixing your phone or a tractor or planes needs to factor in many things unique to medical equipment
We'd be happy to let hospitals do as much maintenance as possible. We make money with the disposable product used with it. But between having custom power components and surface mount electronics, it's all to likely a repair can make things worse. Sort of like trying to repair a motherboard ... with injury or death possible if you screw it up. Same with modifying software.
Simply put, I design them and even I wouldn't dare repair them. Too risky. There are a few company technicians I might trust, because they build them and have the special test equipment and procedures. They can certify it was done right. But it would never make sense to train and certify a hospital technician. Why spend weeks learning to fix a $5,000 piece of equipment that have a failure rate of 5% over 10 years (and no hazardous failure that I'm aware of).
So we offer cheap/free "repair" service. In reality, we do some testing and replace the faulty subsystem. New motherboard or power supply or LED screen. Or just a whole new unit.
And to anyone who thinks "well, just put a tamper seal": that's not going to protect the manufacturer from a lawsuit. Lawyers sue everyone with deep pockets in any way affiliated with an injury or death regardless of cause. Totally innocent companies will still pay tens of thousands of dollars in settlement to avoid legal bills 10X as much. And if they go to trial, juries often will still give the plaintiff money because, hey, the company can afford it and these people deserve something.
So medical device companies figure "Screw That!" and avoid putting their fate in the hands of some hospital technician, no matter how competent.
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Re: Grey area (+1)
bill_mcgonigle 3 hours ago
> So we offer cheap/free "repair" service. In reality, we do some testing and replace the faulty subsystem.
This makes total sense. Normally.
But now say there's some major even happening where every patient needs ultrasonic surgical equipment and there's not enough and you don't have a supply chain that can keep up with components, even if equipment is FedEx'ed overnight back and forth, and if these things aren't working, people are dying.
So, do you want somebody near the hospital who is competent with microelectronic repairs to try to get them working again, or just "nah".
I'm not suggesting the latter, merely pointing out that we don't get to pick the perfect in every one of these scenarios - only what's slightly better of poor choices.
Still, the FDA has been completely out to lunch on everything coronavirus, so I wouldn't even be surprised if, in this case, they sent an enforcement letter to the manufacturer about the iFixIt documents.
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This brings back memories. (+1)
Random361 5 hours ago
https://www.youtube.com/watch?... That already been said, people working on these machines need to be specifically qualified. This has nothing to do with publishing maintenance manuals.
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Just like John Deere Farm Equipment (+1)
GregMmm 5 hours ago
Same thing. You can't fix your own stuff. You must wait for and "authorized" repair person to show up, even if alot of the fixes can be done by the farmer.
What would it be like if you couldn't fix your own car, or home appliance?
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Re: Just like John Deere Farm Equipment (+5, Interesting)
caseih 4 hours ago
Not quite. John Deere doesn't have any problems with farmers fixing their own machines physically, and selling them parts. For some reason, however, they have it in their mind that the digital, electrical domain is different, though. Intellectual property. And all companies seem to not want to sell service manuals. John Deere really thinks it is the Apple of heavy machinery companies. I don't think this all about protecting dealer networks. I'm really at a loss as to explain John Deere's paranoia and insecurity.
But this is different from the medical device world. Medical device manufacturers, for a variety of liability and legal reasons, don't want customers to even crack the box open.
A few companies have tried to DRM common household appliances, but they've been rebuffed pretty strongly by consumers. Besides, they've already managed to convince us to buy disposable appliances that never need to be repaired.
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Re: Just like John Deere Farm Equipment (+4, Interesting)
quonset 4 hours ago
What would it be like if you couldn't fix your own car, or home appliance?
Don't worry, at the rate things are going, that's exactly what will happen. Remember how easy it used to be to change your oil or replace a headlight bulb? Manufacturers have now made it difficult, if not impossible, for you to change your oil without specialized equipment. And forget about bulbs. More and more are moving to led lights which require the entire assembly be replaced (at high cost no less).
Sure, you can change your wiper blades or rotate your tires, but more and more it's becoming difficult to do much more. There was an article on here a while back about a car manufacturer which was considering making a car whose hood you could never open. It would have been one giant sheet of metal and the only way to service the car would have been to take it to a dealer. Don't be surprised if that doesn't happen in your lifetime. Can't find the article, but someone with a bit more search foo should be able to bring it up.
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Re: Just like John Deere Farm Equipment (+1)
toddz 4 hours ago
Dare I say a majority of people can't fix their own car or home appliance. And the person hired to fix them may not be qualified either.
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Re: Just like John Deere Farm Equipment (+1)
sjames 3 hours ago
OTOH, going to the dealer doesn't guarantee that the person working on it has a clue either.
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The hood has already been half locked down (+1)
aberglas 2 hours ago
By making the windscreen really flat, which is the universal fashion that must be followed, getting to the rear of an engine has become very difficult. It is virtually impossible to change the rear spark plugs on many six cylinder cars.
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Poorly researched letter (+2)
yakatz 4 hours ago
This letter loses all credibility when in the first paragraph they refer to Marketplace as an NPR program. Marketplace is played on many NPR affiliated radio stations, but is actually produced and distributed by American Public Media (not to be confused with the TV program Marketplace from the Canadian Broadcasting Company). If the lawyers can't get simple things like that right, why would the reader be confident that they got complicated legal precedent right.
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They've done worse (+1)
rsilvergun 22 minutes ago
not sure if it was this supplier (I've lost track of the names) but during the Obama administration there were plans for increasing the national stockpile of ventilators in preparation for a pandemic like the one we're in now.

The plan was to buy them cheaply at around $3k/each from a newer supplier. One of the established players (who sold them for $10k/each) didn't like this. They bought up the new guy on the block and shut down the program. And, well, here we are.

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Tornado Video Classics - Volume One
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Comments • 324

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NateFeff
0:52 “You got this on camcorder?” “Yeah”

Love that 90s lingo
1 year ago
56
3



Hayley’s Comet
I miss it tbh.
1 month ago


imhoooks
@Hayley’s Comet I miss the 90s just about every day. Such a great time.
1 month ago
1

Hayley’s Comet
@imhoooks Agreed.
1 month ago


Jeremy Lewis
Man: "Oh my goodness"


Kid: "What is that?!"


Man: "That's a cloud"


Me: LMAO!

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1 year ago
16
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rsfarris86
OMGGGGG I made my mom order this for me when I was a little kid in the early 90s, I was absolutely obsessed with tornadoes. Watching this is giving me MAJOR déjà vu!!!
1 year ago
10
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Rob J
The Warner Robbins 1953 tornado looks absolutely ferocious. Insane motion.
1 year ago
18


Treyton Zoss
"Faster? No-yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah, lots faster, lots faster!" The most classic line in the movie xD
2 years ago

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Dan Ross
This is awesome. Seems like more recent tornado documentaries are much less informative, and focused more on the human drama rather than the science. I'd love to see a new documentary as informative as this one depicting the history and progress of tornado science up to the present day. Anymore they always rapid fire quick cut shots of tornado video and you can't even get a chance to really watch it. I suppose that's done for "dramatic effect", as if the most violent windstorms on the planet aren't dramatic enough to begin with!
3 years ago
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chainlightning58
I used to borrow these Tornado Video Classics videos from the library all the time as a kid. The old movie/camcorder footage seems even more eerie today. Thanks for posting this!
4 years ago

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brock kirtley
“oh my goodness look at that!”
“Whats dat?”
“dats a cloud”
1 year ago
4
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Travis Trantham
I had the vhs version of this.. :)
4 years ago
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SchwiftedBear
Holy crap, I used to have all 3 VHS tapes of the Tornado Video Classics series. Probably watched all 3 at least 50 times as a kid
2 years ago
18


EdwardoNorton
"I'm 10 feet away from the Tornado... I'm 10 feet away from the Tornado...(Even though the video shows it about a couple hundred yards away)." That guy had some serious depth perception problems. Probably walleye vision issues.
4 years ago
31
5


plateshutoverlock
He might have been IN the tornado. The actual tornadic winds extend pretty far outside the visible funnel.
1 second ago


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Chives5150
That Gull Lake video will always be one of my favorites. Drunk guys going "Get away from the windows!".
3 years ago

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Treyton Zoss
The music is so nostalgic to me..!
2 years ago
9

Poyekhali919
This video was one of the big reasons I became interested in studying tornadoes and severe weather. It was definitely one of most informative and well-made tornado documentaries of its time, and, best of all, presents everything in a way that isn't scary or sensationalized. It also covers several topics that even modern tornado docs don't mention much, such as how multiple vortices form and how early tornado research led to the creation of Doppler radar.

I like how, of all the tornado films and videos included, the video in the title sequence is of a tornado over Lake Norman in North Carolina (where I'm from!). "Ah, that's bad news right there."

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5 years ago
35
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Katie Furlan
"Oh what a classic!" 1:05:35 I remember (fondly) this particular segment from a NatGeo feature on tornadoes that came out around this time when I was a kid. And I think Howie Bluestein has little tornadoes on his T-shirt?
1 year ago (edited)
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Sac'o'frise
70 80 90 are best because of
#1 video quality
#2 crazy footage
#3 commentary
3 years ago

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Jacob Wallingford
OHHHHH I HOPE SHE'S IN HER BASEMENT
3 years ago
9

Michael Wiley
love the old vhs footage. just looks so much more eerie and ominous than the crystal clear vids of today
2 years ago
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Alex Lubbers
i like these old classics because the people shooting them act so casual, its easy to imagine them as if its sunny and a light breeze sipping beers and sodas, not like nowadays where everyone is like" OMG A TORNADO WOW LOOK AT THAT!!!!!!!! "versus " hey look its a tornado, where's it goin?

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4 years ago
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Rob J
I love these old tornado videos. People seemed a lot more collected and less frenetic and less distracting.
1 year ago
13

[blinking...@gmail.com]

Michael Ross
He was drunk.
4 years ago
4


Joyce Norton
EdwardoNorton: lmao on your comment.
2 years ago
1


israybil32980
Lmao
1 year ago


Mark Symbala
As long as we're aquainted don't call me mark call me marco
1 year ago


David Young
I always thought that was so funny!
4 months ago

plateshutoverlock
He might have been IN the tornado. The actual tornadic winds extend pretty far outside the visible funnel.

56 seconds ago

Chives5150
That Gull Lake video will always be one of my favorites. Drunk guys going "Get away from the windows!".
3 years ago
31
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Treyton Zoss
The music is so nostalgic to me..!
2 years ago
9


Poyekhali919
This video was one of the big reasons I became interested in studying tornadoes and severe weather. It was definitely one of most informative and well-made tornado documentaries of its time, and, best of all, presents everything in a way that isn't scary or sensationalized. It also covers several topics that even modern tornado docs don't mention much, such as how multiple vortices form and how early tornado research led to the creation of Doppler radar.

I like how, of all the tornado films and videos included, the video in the title sequence is of a tornado over Lake Norman in North Carolina (where I'm from!). "Ah, that's bad news right there."

Zawmbbeh
Michael Wiley it’s because cameras back then captured more dark color, thus tornadoes stick out wonderously. Tape also warps the audio over time, which gives it that uneasy feeling.
2 years ago
17

Alex Lubbers
i like these old classics because the people shooting them act so casual, its easy to imagine them as if its sunny and a light breeze sipping beers and sodas, not like nowadays where everyone is like" OMG A TORNADO WOW LOOK AT THAT!!!!!!!! "versus " hey look its a tornado, where's it goin?

4 years ago
43
12

FireDevel
+Alex Lubbers

I totoally agree with you on that one.
4 years ago
3


Alex Lubbers
ikr if i eversee a tornado in the distance i would not scream, id tell my family there's a tornado and make us some popcorn and soda to watch the show. then take cover if the tornado get's too close.
4 years ago
8


4j25
+Alex Lubbers It's probably because they think if they act crazy and unruly their video will end up being more popular.

Now, if I did ever see one, I would be going crazy, as tornadoes are one of my favorite weather phenomena.

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4 years ago

5


Alex Lubbers
me too
4 years ago


Alex Lubbers
ill have a look! Sounds interesting!
4 years ago


FireDevel
+Alex Lubbers
i want the soundtracks they used on this time, they are freaking awesome. XD
4 years ago
2


Alex Lubbers
yeah me too. frankly i think everything was awesome in the 70s-90s era. tornado videos, music,movies and star wars, commercials, cars, neon lights, and food.
4 years ago
7


Eggs And cheese
Alex Lubbers I agree with you :)
3 years ago
2


Michael Wiley
Alex Lubbers i agree 1000%. as others have mentioned, I think it's because nowadays in the internet era, the people filming want to grandstand the Tornado and become the star of the video. it results in some very obnoxious videos, Joplin being a prime example

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2 years ago
3


Joshua Corley
Stop judging
2 years ago


plateshutoverlock
Californian sees tornado: "OMG, IT'S THE END OF THE WORLD!"

Midwesterner sees tornado: "Meh, this will probally look good on Youtube"

1 second ago


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[blinking...@gmail.com]

Ty Boviys
Hell yeah where everyones like its right there it is right there ugh SMH
1 year ago


Intraterrestrial
Blame Reed for that recent scourge of bad behavior
1 year ago
1

plateshutoverlock
Californian sees tornado: "OMG, IT'S THE END OF THE WORLD!"

Midwesterner sees tornado: "Meh, this will probally look good on Youtube"

2 minutes ago

Rob J
I love these old tornado videos. People seemed a lot more collected and less frenetic and less distracting.
1 year ago
13

plateshutoverlock
The hype is the product of an increasingly overstimulated and neurotic society.
1 second ago

[blinking...@gmail.com]

1BrAGGN
Never get under an overpass
3 years ago
40
9


plateshutoverlock
Here are the reasons why these parricular ones survived:

-The tornado was rather weak
- It veered off to the side instead of a direct hit
- The overpass itself was an unusual design for the Midwest, with spaces to crawl in.

Had any of these 3 been different, they would have sustained some very bad injuries or death.

That particular video has lead to a misperception that overpasses are safe, when in reality they are extremely dangerous in a tornado. The winds are much higher under an overpass because it acts as a highly pressurized tunnel, funneling strong winds and debris. Many people were killed because of this.

1 second ago


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spaghettibender
Imagine this narrator reading a bed time story....lol
2 months ago
4


Anakin Vincent
The overpass is my favorite
1 year ago
6


24 QuorthonSchuldiner
It is my opinion that this is the best video on Tornadoes there is. This along with Vol.2 and 3.
3 years ago
8

TexanerinLondon
I bought this video on VHS way back in the day when we used to get a lot more tornadoes than we do today. Classic slow mo "Geeeet unnnnder theeee girrrrrders".
2 years ago
6

Melissa Knowles
Thank you so much for posting this! My mom bought the 3 tape boxed set for me out of a magazine in the early 90s and I watched the videos repeatedly as a child. It's so precious to be able to watch it again.
2 years ago
7
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mindlessgonzo
oh god, it's the same guy from Twister Nature's Fury and Twister: Fury On The
Plains, and i mean this on both announcer, producer, writer and archive help.
4 years ago
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paco2012av
I still have this VHS tape since it first came out!!
2 years ago
5

carp bear
The best of tornado porn...
4 years ago

23
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David Schlotterback
Wow, I haven't watched this in a very long time. Thanks for posting!
2 years ago
5

Anakin Vincent
I have the second one on VHS
1 year ago
5

Dale Tiger
Understatement of the year, that's bad news right there....
4 years ago
7

Mat Demaz
These old videos are terrifying, but really awesome.

Most of these I've seen on countless documentaries growing up; so, it's really nostalgic. My only gripe is that there's no date or location on a lot of these clips, because I wanted to find better quality/full versions of the clips. Oh well... I found a few of them.

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3 years ago
4

Zach Leach
The "probably Dallas, Texas tornado of 1957" at 12:35 actually was the Xenia, OH tornado from the Super Outbreak of April 1974. I'd seen that video before the dude filming was a college student at the time using an 8mm camera to film it. There was a documentary a couple years ago for the 40th Anniversary of the Super Outbreak & I remember seeing it.

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4 years ago

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THEdjpluto
13:55 Yet the Westboro Baptist Church survives unscathed.
1 year ago
4

three person couch
Never been a better collection. In all my years, this reigns Supreme!

I grew up madly obsessed with these forces of nature and all it took was being in one (the Tuscaloosa) to never want to see another. Now if I could stop watching these videos...I dunno

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3 years ago
6

Don Fields
I suppose the intensity of bieng close to those storms is just too much for most professionals to stay calm during, although a few notable exceptions are out there recently.
1 year ago
5

Travis Eastwood
Tornadoes looked more frightening back then for some reason
7 months ago
8

David Reyz
I saw dust devil tornadoes when my dad, my sister, and I were driving from the Grand Canyon.
5 years ago
3
1


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Chas S
34:06: Oh'p, missed again.
10 months ago
3

[blinking...@gmail.com]

Stories

Racism Is Rampant on Reddit, and Its Editors Are in Open Revolt
from the closer-look dept.
An anonymous reader shares a report:
The volunteer moderators of Reddit's r/blackladies community -- an online message board that currently has over 40,000 members -- wrote an open letter outlining their frustrations with the popular website in August 2014. They had pitched their message board, known as a subreddit, as a safe space for Black women, but were being deluged with hateful comments and links to racist content from anonymous accounts. "They are relentless, coming in barrages," the moderators wrote. "We have a racist user problem and Reddit won't take action." Several months later Alexis Ohanian, one of Reddit's co-founders, joined a comment thread on r/blackladies discussing the letter. Ohanian, who had recently returned to the company as its executive chairman, said protecting communities like theirs from abuse was a "top priority." He solicited suggestions on how to do it, and expressed interest in an "ongoing dialogue with all of the mods who signed onto the open letter."

Reddit user TheYellowRose, a r/blackladies moderator who helped write the letter said in a recent phone interview that Ohanian's promised dialogue never materialized. To TheYellowRose, who asked to be identified only by her screen name because she is still regularly subjected to racist abuse and fears physical violence if her identity is revealed, Ohanian's initial enthusiasm for the idea seemed like just another example of the company's leaders trying to say the right things without seriously confronting the ways their site harbored extremists and gave them a place to organize. Reddit has faced several potential inflection points in its approach to racism in the six years since then, but has never undertaken a full enough reckoning to satisfy its critics. It's facing another big moment in the aftermath of the killing of George Floyd. Once again, the pressure is coming in part from the volunteers who moderate Reddit's countless message boards. On June 1, Steve Huffman, another co-founder who has been chief executive since 2015, sent a note to Reddit employees voicing support for the Black Lives Matter movement. "We do not tolerate hate, racism, and violence, and while we have work to do to fight these on our platform, our values are clear," he wrote.
Posted by msmash 10 hours ago

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Not new at all (+1)

Malays2 bowman a few seconds ago

I've seen this in unmoderated forums and Usenet for decades now.
There was an AOL chat pit scroller back in the 90s that did the same thing for little kids to use with their stolen/fake accounts to make them feel all big and badass.
Go on X-box live or some other online gaming services, and you hear the same garbage from the mouths of babes.
Now the question is, how much of it is just 12 year olds trolling and running their little shock and awe campaign, and how much is it from true, actual racists?
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makotech222 10 hours ago
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Re: Yup
msmash200 10 hours ago
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how is reddit a thing in 2020?!?
Anonymous Coward 10 hours ago
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Seriously? (+1)
Anonymous Coward 9 hours ago
As long as large amounts of stupid people keep posting pictures and videos Reddit will be around.
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TheYellowRose

Anonymous Coward 5 hours ago

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Re: TheYellowRose
Anonymous Coward 4 hours ago
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Re: how is reddit a thing in 2020?!?
Anonymous Coward 9 hours ago
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Re: how is reddit a thing in 2020?!? (+1)
Riceballsan 7 hours ago
What's the current alternative? I mean I'm a redditor and I'd love to jump ship to something with less blatent manipulation and control by governments and large corporations, random censorship etc... but I haven't seen anything come up.... Obviously slashdot is a puny community by 2020 standards, a massive shell of even it's old self, So small that the blatent troll posts are now a good 25% (more due to a lack of real posts, than an increase in troll ones I think). Facebook and twitter suck on their own rights of course.
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Re: how is reddit a thing in 2020?!? (+1)
leptons 7 hours ago
I tried notabug.io for a while, but wow, the racists are all over it already. I stopped going there after a few weeks.

Reddit is awful, but it's a small minority of people there that are racists, and they seem to spend all of their time saying racist things.

But this is what we get for electing a racist as President - they feel emboldened. And it's not just here, there are other countries that have similar "strongmen" that embolden racists everywhere.

Stop empowering racists, and they will crawl back under their rocks. Stop accepting "alternative facts" and we'll start having less assholes running around spouting nonsense as if it were truth.
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Re: how is reddit a thing in 2020?!?
Anonymous Coward 6 hours ago
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Anonymous Coward 8 hours ago
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Re: Yup (+3, Insightful)
Penguinisto 10 hours ago
Last I checked, the conservative crowd was kicked off Reddit (they even went out and built their own, with blackjack and hookers), so I doubt it's them.
Also, without examples of this alleged racism, it's hard to say if it's actual Kluxer-speak, or if it's just stuff that gets said which hurt some poor flower's feelings. If the former, there's also no indication if it's just the usual bullshit trolling that every website forum on the planet has to put up with (we see it here with the GNAA bullshit), or...?
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Re: Yup (+4, Informative)
jacks smirking reven 10 hours ago
That idea that they left for a new site is just wishful thinking. The moderators of "the_donald" subreddit pretty much threw their hands up and purposefully tanked it to try and move people to that new site to really lay on the grift pretty hard. All movements to move folks to a non-redit site have failed (remember voat?) the users just scattered to a new set of sub-reddits.
Conservatives are hardly without places to discuss, they still have r/conservative r/asktrumpsupporters r/conspiracy r/soyboys etc etc.
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Re: Yup (+2)
Killall -9 Bash 8 hours ago
Um, no.

T_D's mods "threw their hands up" after the sub was:
1. quarantined
2. Locked down so that only one single user (Tom Fitton) could make posts
3. half the mods were arbitrarily shit-canned
4. shit-canned mods were replaced with new mods chosen by Reddit with no community input

And after all of that, the ONLY thing the mods did in response, was put a link to thedonald.win on the sidebar.
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Re: Yup (+1)
weilawei 7 hours ago
Reddit is a large business. Are you surprised that the corporate masters of our corporatocracy are in support of the divisive racism and slave system that enabled them to take power?
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Re: Yup (+1, Insightful)
Killall -9 Bash 7 hours ago
Honestly, what in this post earned a -1? I recounted, LITERALLY what happened, with no snarky editorializing.... and get a -1??? Fuck off.
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ilguido 6 hours ago
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Anonymous Coward 5 hours ago

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Anonymous Coward 6 hours ago
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reanjr 2 hours ago
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Re: Yup
makotech222 10 hours ago
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Re: Yup (+3, Insightful)
Penguinisto 10 hours ago
So... they're not monolithic, but they are monolithic? Can't have that both ways.
By the by, yeah, conservatives are a wide and varied group, just like progressives are.
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Re: Yup

Anonymous Coward 3 hours ago
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Re: Yup (+2, Insightful)
Rick Schumann 8 hours ago
So-called 'conservatism' doesn't even come close to meaning what it meant, say, 40 years ago. Back then it was more about a set of morals and ethics and practices. Today it's all about 'sticking it to the liberals' and if that means burning the country down to the ground just to get their 'revenge' for policies social liberal legislators and voters have embraced, then that's fine with them, and of course today being 'conservative' also seems to mean 'get rid of all the black and brown people by any means necessary'. If you consider yourself to be a 'conservative' the consider this: your 'party' has been invaded and co-opted by a bunch of violent racist assholes pretending to be 'conservatives' so they'll be taken seriously enough to get some political power; you sure you want ally yourself with those kinds of people?
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Re: Yup (+5, Insightful)
BoB235423424 8 hours ago
It's funny seeing someone decry racism by projecting prejudice. Most of us conservatives could care less what color someone's skin is. People are people. It's the left that's so obsessed with skin color and other superficial traits. Always placing various groups in to buckets that require special care and rules. Yes, many conservatives are against leftist policy that gives benefits to a specific group. Not because we have some sort of hatred for that "protected class", but because we believe everyone should be treated the same. We don't believe that righting a past wrong should be done by treating someone special and creating new wrongs in the name of social justice. Yet we get called racist for being against such policy.
If you'd get past the electoral political talking points, you'd see that most of us (conservatives and liberals) want the same end results, it's just that we greatly differ on the means of getting there. It's just politically adventitious to call people that disagree with with race based policies racist and all the leftest lemmings that don't want to be called racist go right along with it.
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Re: Yup
Anonymous Coward 7 hours ago
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Re: Yup (+4, Insightful)
dgatwood 7 hours ago
What's ironic is that although the percentage of people affected by these societal problems differs by race, nearly all of the problems exist across all races. For example, poverty affects African Americans disproportionately, but it's still a problem for some Caucasians. And a lot of the crime in inner city neighborhoods ultimately stems from poverty. For example, people (of all races) deal drugs because you can get money quickly that way. (Of course, the ability to make money quickly that way is a side effect of a poorly thought out drug policy, and could easily be fixed, but that would still leave other crimes, such as theft, i.e. changing that is mostly fixing a symptom, rather than the root cause.)
Even the police violence issues ultimately stem from poverty. As a percentage of interactions, IIRC, African Americans are actually shot slightly less often than Caucasians, which means that the higher level of deaths per capita is likely entirely caused by them interacting with police a lot more. And although some of that increased interaction is probably caused by racism, a lot of that difference likely stems from minorities not having enough money to move out of high-crime neighborhoods. So although you can largely fix any racism by cops by ensuring that police officers have a similar racial makeup to the neighborhoods that they are policing, but if you don't fix the underlying poverty, any improvements in the numbers are likely to be short-lived.
Unfortunately, neither the left nor the right is doing anything to fix the fundamental problem of poverty, or even talking about ways to do so, with the exception of socialists like Sanders. IMO, any real fix for poverty has to start by limiting the gap between the wealthiest people and the poorest, bringing the poor up to a level where they don't feel desperate. That means providing more services to help people find jobs, providing more free job training, mandating employer-provided child care for working parents, tripling the minimum wage and permanently indexing it to inflation, and in all likelihood, providing a universal basic income paid for by taxes on any capital gains over some annual cap.
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Re: Yup (+1)
rho 2 hours ago
Unfortunately, neither the left nor the right is doing anything to fix the fundamental problem of poverty
I agree with pretty much all of your post. Crime is definitely correlated with poverty, but I suspect it's more complicated than "if they're not poor they won't commit crime." But your fundamental point that I quoted is 100% on the mark.
The right tends to point out that even the poorest Americans have it a hell of a lot better than the poor around the world, but that's true while also being meaningless. You might as well say that a guy with a $28K/year job is rich compared to the rest of the world as well. The fact is that we have somehow built a society so lopsided that the most wealthy and the most connected have an outsized say in how the country is run. The two parties remain in power through divisive means whereby they turn Americans against Americans to hide the fact that they are really pretty shit at doing their job of running the country for the benefit of all Americans.
This should be where the press steps in and levels the playing field, but the media is so converged and compromised--where it isn't actually complicit and corrupted--that it only serves to further divide the country.
There are solutions that can be tried, but I fear that the only path forward is to (figuratively) kill our heroes and start over. The people in power now will only fight to keep their power, not push through needed changes.
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Re: Yup (+1)
reanjr 2 hours ago
Police enforcement is strongly correlated with poverty. Crime is not.
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Re: Yup (+1)
dgatwood an hour ago
Actually, yes it is. First, poor people are much more likely to be victims of crimes because so many can't afford to leave high-crime areas. Second, poverty causes some people to commit crimes out of desperation. Third, increased criminal activity leads to jobs leaving an area, which leads to increased unemployment and increased poverty. It's a complex relationship, not a simple cause-and-effect thing, but there is a correlation.
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Re: Yup (+1)
dgatwood an hour ago
I agree with pretty much all of your post. Crime is definitely correlated with poverty, but I suspect it's more complicated than "if they're not poor they won't commit crime." But your fundamental point that I quoted is 100% on the mark.
Oh, way more complicated. Some percentage of people will commit crime anyway. There are crimes of opportunity, crimes of passion, and crimes of desperation. Reducing poverty will reduce the last category, might reduce the first, and will have no effect on the second. But the more important thing is that reducing poverty will also make it possible for the previously poor people to get out of neighborhoods when they turn into gangland, which at least will get them out of harm's way.
The right tends to point out that even the poorest Americans have it a hell of a lot better than the poor around the world, but that's true while also being meaningless.
It's worse than meaningless if you're getting kicked out of your apartment because you can't pay the rent; it's downright insulting. The poor being rich compared with someone in a third-world country would only be meaningful if they decided to move to that third-world country where the cost of living is less. Otherwise, they're still competing for limited resources like housing with people who are making a lot more than they do. That's where a universal basic income could come in really handy — or perhaps a universal basic housing allowance that can be directly used to pay a portion of your rent if you rent, or converted into a UBI if you own your own home.
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Re: Yup (+1)
BringsApples an hour ago
I like what you said. But Rather than looking at this like it's a white or black situation (no pun intended there, I'm just trying to say that the issue isn't 'this or that', but rather it's on a spectrum), look at it like it's a spectrum where on one side you have the ones that try-in-life and on the other end you have the ones that don't-give-a-shit-in-life. I know, from experience, that in schools, some folks try and some don't. Those that don't try in school, don't usually grow up to try in their adult life either. This has NOTHING to do with skin color, and EVERYTHING to do with the culture in your home environment that you're raised in.
The problem with what I said above is that there ARE black people that live here, whos family started out in a sort of forced poverty situation, just breaking away from being a slave and that. This caused the culture in their home to be very different than that of the white Americans around them. It's never balanced out because of stupidity and a lack of living along the lines of any sort of spiritual teachings. Until this balances out, there will be tension to various degrees. I live in Alabama, and things here are pretty chill, because a lot of this has already been 'gone thru'. I think that whites and blacks in Alabama get along pretty well, when compared to other, even Northern, states. Which one would be quick to think odd, due to the fact that it was primarily Northerners that fought to the death to end slavary. But according to my understanding, it makes sense. We've already had a lot of tension 'gone thru' here. You know how you might hate someone to the point that you want to punch them, so you do, and you two fight it out, and then afterwards, you suddenly feel better and y'all go out and get a beer and then you're great friends? Yeah, just like that. That's happening now on a large scale, and it's for the good.
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Re: Yup (+1)
vlad30 an hour ago
a lot of that difference likely stems from minorities not having enough money to move out of high-crime neighborhoods.
I deal with in one business people who come into money I find a interesting phenomena, Just because people get money and lots of it they generally don't move from where they grew up they strangely make an enclave in that poor crime ridden area with very expensive houses well and truly over capitalized we are talking 10-30 times the build spend and in one case the house is so big it looks more like a shopping mall and with more security than most houses in extremely rich "crime free" areas. Either because their wealth is tied to the area or their friends/family still live there. sadly this leaves their children to grow up in that area.
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Re: Yup (+1)
eclectro 4 minutes ago
Excellent post, and exactly what I have been thinking as well. Unfortunately everyone is being distracted by racism issues that are being pushed by far leftists (let's start being honest - Marxists) and the Democrats are letting themselves be swept up in it.
Rather than address core issues around poverty. One which would be access to education. I personally think this would be a great start to overhaul education generally especially in the new "no groups" online setting we face.
As it is, there is nothing from democrats on this. Instead there are groups forcing us to talk about removing statues and whether a black woman can be on a syrup bottle. That's where we're at collectively, sadly.
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Re: Yup (+1, Insightful)
leptons 6 hours ago
If racists didn't specifically pick on people of color, then there wouldn't be a need to even the playing field by enacting laws that protect people of color and give them some slight benefit that helps them move upward.

You're completely ignoring the source of the problem to demonize the solution. You seem like a typical racist right-wing dumbfuck who doesn't really understand why and how we're in the current situation that your right-wing racist friends have caused.
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Re: Yup
Anonymous Coward 4 hours ago
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most conservative LED to this situation (+1)
aepervius 6 hours ago
For the last 50 years conservative could have done something agaisnt racism, especially the one encountered in the south. What did they do ? They flirted with it, seduced it, and are nowadays fucking with it overtly. Look every time you dig some infrastructural racism, like, voter suppression or surprise the worst gerrymandering, who is behind ? Conservative. When there is obvious racism in police infrastructure PROOVED by a report like the one a few years ago for fergusson, who decried the reprot and did not want a reform ? Conservatism. Who find "fine people" on both side ? Conservatism. Who yelled against a player kneeling down, but nowadays pretend riot/protest is not the way , But HEY kneeling is not a good way either ? Do I need to tell ?

You may be one of the rare guy on the right political side not caring about skin color.... But it is pretty obvious the majority of the right DO care. Otherwise they would make everything to clean their rank of racism. But they don't. Remember : fine people.
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Re: most conservative LED to this situation (+1)
Alypius 6 hours ago
It occurs to me that the cities and states with the highest levels of "institutional racism" are places where one party has had veto-proof majority power for decades. Care to guess which party that is? Better yet, care to guess why they've done nothing to improve things since 1970?
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Re: Yup

Rick Schumann 5 hours ago

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Anonymous Coward 4 hours ago
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Darinbob 4 hours ago
Part of the issue here is that, practically speaking, you cannot be color blind and have equality at the same time. Color blind means you don't even notice that someone is in a different racial or ethnic group, and will assume naively that beacuse none of these groups exist that they cannot therefore have any historical grievances to be redressed. If you're white and color-blind and you're not scared of the police because you've never had a negative experience with police, you might naively think only neurotics would be afraid of the police. But stop being color-blind and look around and you'll realize that this attitude comes from actual experience. Being color blind assumes everyone is already as equal as is possible, and therefore no further effort is needed to improve equality.
Sometimes it seems as if the color-blind viewpoint is that because Jim Crow laws no longer exist that therefore we are now all equal. This was a mistake also made after the 13th and 14th amendments were passed, and history showed that the the two-tier system remained in place and grew to be entrenched as official policies of many states despite being illegal. It was a naive view back then and it is a naive view today.
Instead of being color blind, one should open their eyes, notice the races, and notice that those who are minorities are being systematically treated differently by government entities and society.
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Re: Yup (+1)
BringsApples 2 hours ago
Most of us conservatives could care less what color someone's skin is.
Grammar is so important here. The "normal" phrase is "I couldn't care less." meaning that you don't care at all. What you said, indicates that you do care about people's skin color. We're so confused.
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Re: Yup (+2)
catmistake an hour ago
It's funny seeing someone decry racism by projecting prejudice.
I'm not looking to pick a fight. There's a lot of decent comments here (yours is not one, and I will explain why), so I thought long and hard before posting.

First of all, what are you referring to? You're speaking as though everyone reading your comment knows and has seen what you have seen, you have your finger on the pulse of the nation, and this is some all too common occurrence.

More importantly, not sure if so but in case you are confused about these terms, they are not the same thing, even if some use them interchangeably, they are making a category mistake.

Prejudice is preconceived opinion that is not based on reason or actual experience. Prejudice is when a person negatively pre-judges another person or group without getting to know the beliefs, thoughts, and feelings behind their words and actions. A person of any racial group can be prejudiced towards a person of any other racial group. There is no power dynamic involved.

Racism is prejudice, discrimination, or antagonism directed against a person or people on the basis of their membership of a particular racial or ethnic group, typically one that is a minority or marginalized, and/or racism is the belief that different races possess distinct characteristics, abilities, or qualities, especially so as to distinguish them as inferior or superior to one another. Racism is the system that allows the racial group that’s already in power to retain power. Since arriving on U.S. soil white people have used their power to create preferential access to survival rights and resources (housing, education, jobs, voting, citizenship, food, health, legal protection, etc.) for white people while simultaneously impeding Blacks and other people of color’s access to these same rights and resources. Though “reverse racism” is a term sometimes heard, it has never existed in America. White people are the only racial group to have ever established and retained power in the United States.

There is a clear distinction here, and it is not subtle. A prejudiced person is not necessarily a racist person, and though racist person is very likely also prejudiced, that is incidental and not because racism is a subset of prejudice.

Most of us conservatives could care less what color someone's skin is. People are people.
I see this attitude a lot, disclaimer here, I happen to very much love a person who is a Trumper, but more than that, she is fringe Right, attracted to the conspiracy theories, uses the term "libterd," and if she lived 120 years ago, she's be a robber baron, and if she lived 200 years ago, she'd have been a slave trader. She's fucking nuts, but I love her, and you would too. I do not love her for her politics and unrecognized, unorganized racism, but because she has other qualities that make her exceptional, and we have other things in common and have shared enough experience together that I can't not care about her, though the things that come out of her mouth are sometimes shockingly horrible, and she is oblivious to it.

But let me explain something. Other than having a finite number of political views that coincide, and really this is going to be a very short list, you have no idea how other conservatives feel, and that you think you do is delusion, not deep delusion, just unexamined and unrecognized delusion. You know you and a precious few people close to you, maybe a handful, maybe a dozen, unlikely many more but maybe twice that, and you do not know anyone else from Adam, not even those that share all your political views. Arguing this notion that what most conservatives feel or think is an instance of fallacy known as Argumentum ad populum , an appeal to the people, or an appeal to popularity, which concludes that a proposition must be true because many or most people believe it. Although in some cases this argument can provide inductive or empirical evidence for its truth, to say that many people believe a statement is not a proof that the statement is true.

It's the left that's so obsessed with skin color and other superficial traits. Always placing various groups in to buckets that require special care and rules.
This mischaracterization and insinuation is technically both ad hominem fallacy and a straw man. You're both attacking the left of you without justification, and twisting their argument into something it has never been. Liberals are not racist; they are tolerant. The "obsession" (a mischaracterization) or far more accurately, attention and import is with equality, to make everyone the same, not with race or distinguishing peoples. If there is systemic inequality for a group, that group must be made equal, not with mere lip service, but with active adjustment to the system to recognize their inequality, and the implementation is not necessarily perfect, but it is better than empty words claiming they are equal when they are clearly not due to such unfortunate realities such as institutional racism.


Yes, many conservatives are against leftist policy that gives benefits to a specific group. Not because we have some sort of hatred for that "protected class", but because we believe everyone should be treated the same. We don't believe that righting a past wrong should be done by treating someone special and creating new wrongs in the name of social justice. Yet we get called racist for being against such policy.
See my last paragraph, and also, more gratuitous amounts of Argumentum ad populum. Honestly, do you really want some other conservative speaking for you the way you are speaking for them? The racism is there, btw, it is just subtle, not overt, and at the same time, you are begging the question, petitio principii, fallaciously assuming that there is no institutional racism, there is no problem. That is, in fact, racist, even if it is self-blind racism. Racism is not binary, but 512 shades of grey and it gets far worse, because there's 40 different shades of black. There are a plethora of public counter-examples, an embarrassing number of them, even in the last 3 weeks to prove that racism is alive and well in America. You are likely choosing not to recognize the instances as racism, but I can't say for certain, only you could know. A Black man simply does not have the opportunities that you have or have had, (and I am not trying to limit him, but I do see the problem, and I don't have the best answer, not a sociologist here, not a political scientist, not a nation-builder, not much of anything, really), and he likely never will, and it is because he is Black, not because he is lazy or stupid or criminal. Let's assume my hypothetical Black man is far better looking, far more talented, and 10 times as smart as you, even then, we still have more opportunity because we are not Black. If you refuse to recognize this as at least unfortunate fact, that something that should be changed somehow, then you will remain stuck in the delusion that you are correct, and see no fault for saying empty and blind statements like "I just think everyone should be equal," while turning a blind eye, or actually being blind, not seeing the problem therefore it isn't broke so don't fix it. You are grossly and ignorantly incorrect, Sir.
p>If you'd get past the electoral political talking points, you'd see that most of us (conservatives and liberals) want the same end results, it's just that we greatly differ on the means of getting there.
This is simply a false statement. Liberal is not conservative. Socialism is not small or no government. Regulation is not unrestrained capitalism. Spreading the wealth is not keeping all the wealth in the hands of a minuscule few. Heterogeneity is not homogeny. Secular is not religious. Toleration is not accountability to the sensitivity of the ruling group. The general welfare is not enterprise. Opportunity is not prevention. Disarming is not arming.

It's just politically adventitious to call people that disagree with with race based policies racist
No, it is racist, but again, you are flaming liberalism with your straw man mischaracterization, it is not "race-based politics," it is activism, and racism is not a binary condition in that you don't need to wear a white pointed hat and mask and burn crosses to have moderately racist ideas, which you do indeed have, and no offense intended, it is an easy mistake to make, however, you are diving into it, wearing it, and rubbing it all over yourself.

and all the leftest lemmings that don't want to be called racist go right along with it.
Ad hominem, hasty generalization, petitio principii and straw man.
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Re: Yup (+2, Insightful)
Killall -9 Bash 7 hours ago
Today it's all about 'sticking it to the liberals' and if that means burning the country down to the ground just to get their 'revenge' for policies social liberal legislators and voters have embraced, then that's fine with them

You realize it's not the republicans smashing, looting, and burning shit, right???



And by the way, your party has been coopted by radical socialists pretending to be progressives.
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Re: Yup
leptons 6 hours ago
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Rick Schumann 5 hours ago

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Re: Yup (+1)
Shotgun 6 hours ago
Uhm? What? It hasn't been conservatives burning and looting over the last few weeks.
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Rick Schumann 5 hours ago

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Anonymous Coward 3 hours ago
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Re: Yup (+2)
DNS-and-BIND 6 hours ago
One of the biggest problems we face today is the Left simply imagining what the Right believes, and then proceeding to bash them for what they imagined. The Left has *no idea* what the Right thinks, and doesn't care to find out.
In his remarkable book The Righteous Mind: Why Good People are Divided by Politics and Religion, scholar Jonathan Haidt recalls a telling experiment. He and his colleagues Brian Nosek and Jesse Graham sought to discover how well conservative and what Haidt terms 'liberal' (not liberal, actually leftist) students understood one another by having them answer moral questions as they thought their political opponents would answer them. "The results were clear and consistent," remarks Haidt. "In all analyses, conservatives were more accurate than liberals." Asked to think the way a liberal thinks, conservatives answered moral questions just as the liberal would answer them, but liberal students were unable to do the reverse. Rather, they seemed to put moral ideas into the mouths of conservatives that they don't hold. To put it bluntly, Haidt and his colleagues found that progressives don't understand conservatives the way conservatives understand progressives. This he calls the 'conservative advantage', and it goes a long way in explaining the different ways each side deals with opinions unlike their own. People get angry at what they don't understand, and an all-progressive education ensures that they don't understand.
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Re: Yup (+1)

Rick Schumann 5 hours ago

I'm not reading all your distracting bullshit.
We judge what you people apparently 'want' BY YOUR ACTIONS OR LACK THEREOF. Vis-a-vis: Senate Republicans proposed bill to reform police in this country: All it is, is paying lip service to the real problems and won't change a fucking single thing. You don't like my judgement of you? Then elect representatives of who you claim to be who actually represent your values and concerns, not the asshat clowns with their own agendas that you have in there now!
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Re: Yup (+1)
Zirnike 4 hours ago
I doubt very much this is a problem with the left. The problem is that the right has let the very worst examples of their side be the most obvious and vocal members of their community, with no pushback. So all available information to the majority of people on the left is massive asshats like hannity, rush, or alex jones. And reasonable conservatives are very rarely, if ever, shown on places like fox news, which are supposed to be representing conservatism. It's a self inflicted wound from the right.
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Re: Yup (+1)
Darinbob 4 hours ago
They have indeed redefined what conservative means, even the meaning from 5 years ago.
Both parties though seem to redefine constantly though. I think this is because of the goofball political system of winner-takes-all making it such that only two parties will gain enough votes to matter, and those two parties then jockey to make sure every single issue, large or petty, is split between them. It naturally leads to an adversarial relationship - if you're for X then I am automatically opposed to X. Bipartisan agreements are rare and only occur when there's a large currently active public outcry (such as police reform). So in that atmosphere, the parties are always redefining themselves to keep a rough 50/50 split, and each new political topic compels them to take opposing stances.
So "conservative" doesn't mean what it used to mean in the past because the important issues have changed. What it mostly means is roughly aligning with Republicans instead of Democrats. And as those parties redefine themselves then so does American conservatism. If the parties had a strong set of ideals to align with then it might be different, but instead the chief ideal seems to be to win at any cost.
Even things like "preferring small government" are an American-only ideal anyway, grown out of the state's rights movement meant to protect slavery and segregationism, but that ideal extends only to getting rid of federalism and is in no way about making state government smaller. Around the world there are plenty of large government conservatives. Then the ideal of "freedom is key" (which incorrectly tries to imply that any opponent hates freedom) isn't followed; it's freedom for us, but please restrict people who are not like us; don't allow gay marriage, keep marijuana a federal offense, put as many people as possible in jail, don't let kids know about birth control, make our religion more prominant than any other, etc. One of the original ideals was "keep things that work, and get rid of things that don't" is subverted into keeping around failed programs and failed policies and refusing to consider any new way of doing things (this is a topic that seems to upset the old school intellectual conservatives who are the ones trying to hardest to hang on to the ideals).
You can see that is changing by the way that anyone with the old style or who is not fervently pro-Trump is laughed at and insulted. I hear, "those moderates were just a bunch of tea drinking conservatives", which to me seems to be trying to label them as elitists (why tea is elite I dunno) and defining modern conservatives as simple folk with simple values and not much money or something weird like that. McCain gets lambasted as not being a real conservative, which is an absurd idea. It's the old No True Scotsman fallacy. It's as if because the old conservative guard didn't fix all the problems that they've been defined out of the picture. And maybe not as suprisingly as I once thought, the old guard just follows along, kisses asses, and joins the new definition rather than splitting off, because the US system does not allow for a viable third party.
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conservatives not kicked off of reddit [Re:Yup] (+1)
Anonymous Coward 10 hours ago
Last I checked, the conservative crowd was kicked off Reddit
no, they weren't. Not sure why you think this. Reddit is very lightly moderated (in some subreddits, "lightly" means "pretty much not". Really nobody gets "kicked off" unless you're doing stuff that gets you arrested, and even then, maybe or maybe not.
(they even went out and built their own, with blackjack and hookers)
Yep one subreddit decide to leave. Out of 138,000 active subreddits.
It was a pretty toxic one; not sad to see it go. But one subreddit leaving, out of a hundred thousand, is not "conservatives were kicked off of reddit."
Also, without examples of this alleged racism, it's hard to say if it's actual Kluxer-speak, or if it's just stuff that gets said which hurt some poor flower's feelings.
Knowing Reddit, I'd say it's probably death threats and graphic depictions of rape. I'll also say that it is also probably 0.1% of the participants. But that gets a little disturbing when you are the one being the target of graphic rape scenarios.
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Re: conservatives not kicked off of reddit [Re:Yup] (+1)
Rick Schumann 8 hours ago
Reddit is a fucking mess, a shithole as bad if not worse than 4chan or any of the other *chans are. I can't see how a relatively normal person could possibly go there and have anything like a normal productive conversation about anything.
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Re: conservatives not kicked off of reddit [Re:Yup] (+1)
SirMasterboy 7 hours ago
Eh, the small specific technical subreddits seem fine to me.
For instance: https://www.reddit.com/r/zfs/
I only use reddit for technical subs such as this, and none of the ones I use seem to have any problems with racism nor are they a mess.
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Re: conservatives not kicked off of reddit [Re:Yup] (+1)
demonlapin 6 hours ago
Just stay away from default and explicitly political subreddits and there’s some decent stuff there.
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Re: conservatives not kicked off of reddit [Re:Yup] (+1)

Rick Schumann 5 hours ago

Even the layout is a total mess. It gives me a headache just looking at it.
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Re: conservatives not kicked off of reddit [Re:Yup] (+1)
vlad30 28 minutes ago
And yet I see more mainstream media referring to Reddit for news stories
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Re: Yup (+1)
Anonymous Coward 8 hours ago
Racism Is Rampant On *The Internet
Yes, we have many humans that are assholes, and after building a virtual reality where the septembers love open-mic night, are obsessed with socnets where they can spew their banality and watch a parade of everyone else's - after building such a thing, are we surprised a portion of the population will use their moment with the megaphone to be racist? A statistical group that was always there, just less celebrated by our worship of inane blabber.
Fix the fascination with people yelling into the void. I suppose they'd go back to kneeling before the TV altar, and brainlessly subjecting themselves to that megaphone arena instead, but it seems TFA is saying this is worse.
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Re: Yup (+1)
Anonyrnous 2 hours ago
I might be being naive, but at least the Internet opens up channels of communication where there were none before.
Prejudiced people of all persuasions can argue with the people they hate which initially looks as ugly, but hopefully eventually just becomes boring.
Looks at Slashdot and the cesspool of left vs right bullshit that it has devolved into over the last few years.
I'm hoping eventually start to realize that screaming insults at your enemy doesn't solve anything.
I'm hoping EVENTUALLY people will eventually stumble onto the idea of seeing things from the perspective of the person they hate and realize everyone generally has reasons, good or bad, for having the belief system they do.
I guess it will be an experiment to see how long people can keep their seething hatred going before waking up to themselves.
Time will tell.
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Re: Yup (+1)
Rick Schumann 8 hours ago
It doesn't matter if it's 'real' trolling or just a bunch of 2edgy4me kiddies with nothing better to do than parrot stupid shit they don't understand or care to understand, it stirs shit up that doesn't need to be stirred up, it's just destructive nonsense. If your kids acted in that spirit you'd discipline them (or at least I'd hope you would). Oh and by the way dismissing someone who complains about this sort of destructive behavior with ad hominen comments like calling them a 'poor flower' doesn't speak well of your character either, are you sure you want to use that tone here? Really, isn't it time everyone stopped treating this sort of thing with kid gloves, like it's just some harmless prank, and actually said 'enough is enough'? The Internet is not Kiddie Playtime anymore, hasn't been for quite some time, it's more like a loaded gun, and how you use it has grave impact on people's real-world lives. I suppose for small-minded, short-sighted people, it's Just Words On A Screen and they can divorce themselves from the implications, but go ask someone who has been doxxed for real and had violent assholes literally show up on their doorstep to harass or literally attack them how they felt about those 'words on a screen'. It's easy to say 'oh, this is not MY problem, why should *I* care?' until it IS 'your problem', and oh by the way it IS 'your problem' because the Internet permeates pretty much everything about our civilization now. You'd have to leave the planet entirely and never have contact with other humans ever again to not be affected.
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Anonymous Coward 5 hours ago

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Re: Yup (+1)
Rick Schumann 3 hours ago
Fuck off.
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Dread_ed 4 hours ago
Don't leave out the fake racism manufactured by people who want to make racism seem worse than it is. These people write, say, and do things anonymously or secretly to make the problem of racism seem larger than it is.
They are everywhere, and seem to be growing worse.
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Re: Yup (+1)
slasher999 2 hours ago
No, weâ(TM)re still on reddit. Generally hang out in subs about car repair, guns and ammo deals, and music - metal mostly. Generally avoid the politics and news subs, too depressing.
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Re: Yup (-1)
Austerity Empowers 10 hours ago
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Jamu 10 hours ago
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nnet 10 hours ago
So does american electorate.
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Re: Yup
Anonymous Coward 9 hours ago
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Re: Yup (+1)
OrangeTide 9 hours ago
There are more guns in America than people. I propose we enact Gun Socialism and redistribute them among the masses.
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Re: Yup (+1)
alvinrod 8 hours ago
Let me get this straight. The people without guns are going to try to take the guns from the people who have them?

That doesn't sound like a good idea.
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Re: Yup (+1)
OrangeTide 8 hours ago
The proposal is still a work-in-progress. The experts on gungrabbing only want to destroy the guns, so their gestapo resources will be of no help here.
More seriously, it would help if we lifted the racist "Saturday Night Special" laws and the reformed the current misogynist tainted process for conceal carry permits. Black single mothers in high crime areas can't access a gun, but a middle class white guy in the suburbs can. An avid gun hobbyist can get a concealed carry permit, but a woman that has reported multiple complaints on a restraining order and fears for her life cannot get one.
The system is no good if it is not equally applied. Either everybody gets guns or nobody gets guns.
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Re: Yup (+1)
goose-incarnated 8 hours ago
The proposal is still a work-in-progress. The experts on gungrabbing only want to destroy the guns, so their gestapo resources will be of no help here.
More seriously, it would help if we lifted the racist "Saturday Night Special" laws and the reformed the current misogynist tainted process for conceal carry permits. Black single mothers in high crime areas can't access a gun, but a middle class white guy in the suburbs can. An avid gun hobbyist can get a concealed carry permit, but a woman that has reported multiple complaints on a restraining order and fears for her life cannot get one.
The system is no good if it is not equally applied. Either everybody gets guns or nobody gets guns.
That's weird - which specific piece of legislation stops the woman in your example getting a CCP?
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Re: Yup (+1)
JeffOwl 7 hours ago
It isn't an actual overarching policy that does it. It is the local government that causes the problem in those cases. Local governments for high crime areas tend to restrict access to firearms.
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Re: Yup (+1)
dgatwood 7 hours ago
Which ironically removes firearms from the people least likely to use them inappropriately (because getting a CCP presumably requires some vetting), while doing nothing to prevent ownership by actual criminals. It's a great example of a poorly thought out law making things worse.
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Re: Yup (+1)
alkurta 5 hours ago
OP might be engaging in a little bit of hyperbole. Google fails me and does not tell me how things currently stand, but there were additional hoops that Chicago residents (that the aforementioned Black single mother might reside) were required to jump through, that suburban counterparts did not have to jump through.
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Anonymous Coward 5 hours ago

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Re: Yup (+1)
OrangeTide 3 hours ago
Priorities make this complicated, sometimes people have to pick daycare over guns. Besides we can't trust politicians to follow through on their promises, unless we're their top campaign donor.
Single black women in my state have no problem getting a CCW permit.
Typically refused in my state. Approval is at the discretion of the county sheriff. Each county has different standards, and apparently the unwritten rule is to not let poor people, black people, or women get them. If you know a cop, he can fast track your CCW application with a simple phone call. I'm sure there is an applicable quote about pigs and equality somewhere...
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Re: Yup (+1)
slasher999 2 hours ago
The rest of us count on that.
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TimothyHollins 10 hours ago
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Let me tell you this: (+1)
snarfies 9 hours ago
r/Drama is one of the most malevolent, cruel, coldhearted online communities you'll ever find, and even as a supporter of free speech it appalls me that Reddit would allow such a vile, festering hub of bigotry and sadism to exist. You think [slur]town was bad?
That subreddit, if you pick up on the dog-whistles (and many don't even bother with that-- say want you want about Stormfront, at least it bans "n[slur]"), will reveal itself to you as Reddit's number one hub for the web's most hardened Nazis, Klansmen, Fascists, and Gamergaters.
You'll notice on the sidebar that it encourages members to be as dramatic as possible. That's intentional. They encourage arguments in the comments section. That's intentional.
You know the Three Minute Hate (it's from this underrated book 1985, give it a read, it's scary how much it parallels our society)? It's like that, they want to stoke the flames of reactionary rage so they continue to dogpile every progressive and minority who enters the subreddit, normalizing these evil feelings.
They brigade from subreddit to subreddit, having an entire cabal of mods spanning hundreds of communities, gaslighting lived experiences of the oppressed and unashamedly bolstering Reddit's homegrown white supremacy movement. They've kink-shamed hundreds of people too, some even... to death.
I fear that r/drama may be producing an entire army of Dylann Roofs and Elliot Rogers, and I highly suggest that nobody dares visit that horrible subreddit, lest you potentially fall victim to its corruptive aura.
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Re: Let me tell you this: (+1)
thejam 9 hours ago
I had to look up what kink-shaming even meant. I don't get how it's such a travesty that it goes on. The whole point of kinky is to be beyond the bounds of normality... so if people react, then what, crime of crimes? Should there be no shame at all?
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Re: Let me tell you this: (+1)
Pascoea 6 hours ago
Should there be no shame at all?
The point of kink, at least the vast majority of it, is that it's consensual for everyone involved. Bounds are established and respected, and measures are taken to ensure everyone's safety. Most groups dedicated to (or generally supportive of) kink have strictly enforced "kink shaming" rules.
I say the first part to lead into the actual point: Of course there should be such a thing as shame, but it should be reserved for things that are outside of the bounds of legality, not things that are outside of social norms. The fact that I enjoy [insert whatever sexual depravity] is no different than you liking something like Star Trek. I don't agree with you on Star Trek, I think it sucks, but I'm not going to shame you for liking it. I'm not going to let three guys run a train on me, but it's none of my business if you do. The gist of kink-shaming: Everyone has a kink, your kink may not be my kink, and there's nothing wrong with that so don't make fun of it.
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Re: Let me tell you this: (+1)
LenKagetsu 9 hours ago
I fear that r/drama may be producing an entire army of Dylann Roofs and Elliot Rogers, and I highly suggest that nobody dares visit that horrible subreddit, lest you potentially fall victim to its corruptive aura.
Let me quote an excerpt from Mein Kampf: A Translation Controversy.
It is important to understand that reading anti-Semitic passages or passages on race will not turn anyone into an anti-Semite. You do not have to worry about being filled with hatred simply by reading Mein Kampf; it is not a magic tome. Some people have so little faith in their own beliefs that they fear any exposure to Mein Kampf might twist them into something evil. If their beliefs are so fragile, so easily twisted, then they are already evil
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Re: Let me tell you this: (+1)
Pascoea 5 hours ago
Reading a book is different than participating in a group. It's one thing to read a book on the KKK and another hang out with a bunch of skinheads all the time. Participation is the key.
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Re: Let me tell you this: (+1)
Aristos Mazer 7 hours ago
Off by one error, I think. The famous book is "1984" by George Orwell. Unless there's some other book that you're citing?
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Re: Let me tell you this:

Anonymous Coward 5 hours ago

Filtered due to preferences.
Re: Yup (+3, Insightful)
Evtim 9 hours ago
Racism such as 'all lives matter'? Ok.
https://www.thedailybeast.com/...
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Re: Yup (+1)
LenKagetsu 8 hours ago
The problem is that the people screaming "All lives matter" are sending a message that the BLM crowd are not hearing, and the BLM crowd instead of explaining it decide to just lash out and fly into a rage.
https://chainsawsuit.com/wp-co...
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Re: Yup (+1)
aSplash0fDerp 8 hours ago
One size does not fit all, with BLM being a BL thing. Selfworth gained by groups/peers is destined to fail and is specific to some cultures (but not others).

China is a good example of a "one size fits all culture", but that has no place in the 1st world and not a demand that you want to be associated with.
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Re: Yup (+1)
Aristos Mazer 7 hours ago
We *know* all lives matter. That's the whole point of saying Black Lives Matter: a huge number of individuals in our society are valuing all lives EXCEPT the lives of people of color. Reminding people that black lives matter has to be done because those are the ones that are typically left out of the "all lives matter" list. The rest of the lives don't need the same boosting.
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Re: Yup (+1)
c6gunner 7 hours ago
We *know* all lives matter. That's the whole point of saying Black Lives Matter: a huge number of individuals in our society are valuing all lives EXCEPT the lives of people of color.
I don't know which country you live in, but it certainly isn't a place in the western world. I've been to some places in Africa which could be characterised that way I suppose .... they were very protective of us white visitors, but didn't seem to mind slaughtering each other much. I suspect it was largely because they saw as as green lives, though; the colour of our money was much more important than the colour of our skin.
Reminding people that black lives matter has to be done because those are the ones that are typically left out of the "all lives matter" list. The rest of the lives don't need the same boosting.
Anyone who truly believes that black lives matter should be calling for increased police budgets and expansion of powers to disrupt gang activity. If you're calling for defunding police, you don't give two shits about black lives (or white lives for that matter). Those of us who care about all lives tend to be opposed to that.
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Re: Yup (+2)
leptons 6 hours ago
You had to depart and take the discussion to AFRICA?!

Let me explain this to you, because you seem to be unwilling or unable to understand

Black people in AMERICA feel as if their lives don't matter, due to pervasive racism from police and others in our country.

Black Lives Matter is there to remind those people who are racist, that Black Lives Matter just as much as any other, which is something people like you seem to willingly forget.
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Re: Yup (+1)
c6gunner 5 hours ago
Black people in AMERICA feel as if their lives don't matter, due to pervasive racism from police and others in our country.
How are their feelings at all relevant to what's true?
Black Lives Matter is there to remind those people who are racist, that Black Lives Matter just as much as any other, which is something people like you seem to willingly forget.
That's idiotic; if anything racists are likely to care even less about black lives after watching BLM antics. To suggest that racists will suddenly realize that black lives matter because of a BLM march is like suggesting that black people will suddenly realise that white power is important because of a KKK march.
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Re: Yup (+1)
Aristos Mazer 4 hours ago
The goal is not to convince the racists. You're right -- that's a no-win case. The goal is to convince everyone else to stop being silent when the racists speak/act and help push the racists out of their positions of authority. The goal is to discourage the "it's not hurting me so I'm not getting involved" folks to get involved.
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Re: Yup (+1)
c6gunner an hour ago
The goal is to convince everyone else to stop being silent when the racists speak/act and help push the racists out of their positions of authority. The goal is to discourage the "it's not hurting me so I'm not getting involved" folks to get involved.
If that's the goal then they should probably limit their activism to incidents in which racism clearly played a role. Screaming "black lives matter" for incidents which seem unrelated to racism seems rather counterproductive. It's doubly stupid in incidents like the one which started the movement, where the cop clearly not only wasn't racist but was completely justified in killing the guy who was attacking him. In those cases yelling "black lives matter" mainly communicates an unspoken "other lives don't".
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Re: Yup (+1)
LenKagetsu 7 hours ago
The point of BLM is that blacks are being targeted by possible white supremacist movements in the police. It is true there is a huge amount of black-to-black violence but corrupt police are a threat to an entire nation.
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Re: Yup (+1)
Shotgun 6 hours ago
Then the point of BLM is asinine by every study of the matter ever done.
If you look at what BLM publishes on their website and look at where donations to that website go, it becomes clear that the point of BLM is to raise money for Democrats and leftist causes. There isn't enough police corruption to merit this amount of turmoil, and if there were it begs the question of why the people collecting money to end it didn't do anything for the 50yrs they've had control of local and state governments where it is occurring?
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Re: Yup
Anonymous Coward 6 hours ago
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Dropbox is a Total Mess
from the closer-look dept.
Veteran journalist Om Malik, writing on his blog:
I was reading Nikita Prokopov's blog this morning and came across his very visual damnation of what is wrong with Dropbox. Like me, he too had thought that "in the beginning, Dropbox was great, but in the last few years, they started to bloat up." He visually shows that as an existing customer, you need to jump through a dozen hoops to get Dropbox going on a new machine. And if you are just signing up, add another five steps. His sentiments reflect my feelings about Dropbox, as well. When I fell in love with Dropbox, it had not even launched. It was simple and elegant. It was nothing like anything I had experienced before. And I wasn't alone. The company was one of the fastest-growing companies in Silicon Valley, because of customers appreciated their simplicity and ease of use. Their revenues and userbase grew at an astonishing speed. For nearly a decade, I stayed loyal to the service, but like Prokopov, I too felt the bloat was getting too much. [...] I don't blame Dropbox going the way they have -- they are less about the individual customers and more focused on teams and corporations. That's where the money is -- and when you go public, you are all about the "quarterly goals." You don't go public without knowing that Wall Street owns you.

Posted by msmash 10 hours ago

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They do have to make money at some point (+5, Insightful)
AmazingRuss 10 hours ago
We've all been benefiting from 'free' stuff funded by investors for the last 20 years. I suppose it can go on for as long as the investors keep piling in.
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Re: They do have to make money at some point (+2)
xxdelxx 10 hours ago
Well, yes. But surely there's a way to monetization that doesn't involve wrecking the user experience. My Dropbox usage dropped off over the last few years due to the increasing difficulty of using it. To the point that they sent me an email recently saying "we notice you haven't used the service. If you don't use it we'll remove your user id". I decided that nothing of value was lost.
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Re: They do have to make money at some point (+1)
Presence Eternal 9 hours ago
I use Dropbox to sync Joplin and that's about it, so I haven't had any meaningful problems with using them. To a large extent I don't "use" them at all. Maybe they'll kill their api or whatever, but they're easily replaced at no cost if that comes to pass. Actual data goes with Amazon Drive, since that still syncs phone and computer automatically.
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Re: They do have to make money at some point (+1)
youngone an hour ago
I got that email too, last week I think.
Since I started running my own Nextcloud instance I have no use for Dropbox, which as noted, has been getting worse for years.
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Re: They do have to make money at some point (+1)
backslashdot 10 hours ago
That's a hell of a thing. Imagine a friend Bob invites you to move to an island and to bring all your stuff. Another of your friends, Jim, tells you of his own island under construction but tells you that you will have to pay. But you want to save money, so you move to Bob's island with all your stuff. However, after the first week Bob suddenly tells you that he's are going to charge you rent. By the way you've already quit your job, and Jim's is bankrupt -- he could not even get his business off the ground and sold the land to Bob.
Bob's locked you in and it isn't very fair play, is it?
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Re: They do have to make money at some point (+1)
NagrothAgain 10 hours ago
That analogy makes no sense. The island doesn't have ongoing requirements for you to live there, it's not going to suddenly vanish if the power gets shut off or the disk arrays burn out. But your cloud storage will.
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Re: They do have to make money at some point (+1)
sg_oneill 7 hours ago
Yeah it does. It wasnt that long ago that dropbox suddenly decided I had to start paying rent or I'd have to unlink most of my machines.
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Re: They do have to make money at some point (+1)
Barabul 8 hours ago
What about Alice?
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Re: They do have to make money at some point (+2)
backslashdot 7 hours ago
Ran away with Carol.
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Excellent!

Anonymous Coward 7 hours ago

and Bill and Ted?
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Re: They do have to make money at some point (+1)
AmazingRuss 3 hours ago
Such are the wages of being a cheap grabass.
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They were/are making money (+3, Informative)
SuperKendall 10 hours ago
We've all been benefiting from 'free' stuff funded by investors for the last 20 years.
Yes but this was not one of those cases.
DropBox has a very reasonable fee for increased storage, and they worked well enough for sync there was a great reason to want a larger bucket to keep things in.
I've been paying for DropBox for years, so have many others... it is the paying customers that are complaining about changes.
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Re: They were/are making money (+1)
Zelucifer 9 hours ago
I've paid for years, and my experience has gotten significantly worse. Almost every feature that I used has either been deprecated or reduced to mobile only. I'll eventually take my business elsewhere, but I haven't invested the time yet to look for a reasonable replacement.
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Re: They do have to make money at some point (+3, Insightful)
aaarrrgggh 9 hours ago
No. That isn’t their problem.
They are trying to de-commoditize a commodity. I pay Apple, Microsoft, and Google for cloud storage already (along with a few lesser-known names). The service they offer has some value... but it is also a mess and at least marginally better solved by one of my other providers for different use-cases.
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Re: They do have to make money at some point
Anonymous Coward 2 hours ago
No. That isn’t their problem.
They are trying to de-commoditize a commodity. I pay Apple, Microsoft, and Google for cloud storage already (along with a few lesser-known names). The service they offer has some value... but it is also a mess and at least marginally better solved by one of my other providers for different use-cases.
This. Dropbox quietly changed their terms a little over a year ago to limit the number of devices to "3":

https://venturebeat.com/2019/0...



I share a common cloud storage with my SO. We have roughly 10 devices between us which use the service. I was willing to pay Dropbox to keep the service. Lowest tier available - $10/month. No - absolutely not. $1/month - sure, $10/month - no - I am not getting that kind of value out of DropBox. Spent 2 hours switching to a competitor. Cost of the competitor - free.



Pro tip - its not trivial to design features for both user consumer + enterprise user bases. Its even more difficult to fundamentally change your entire software strategy to shift between the user bases. They managed to piss off a good portion of their original user base - consumers. I hope they are doing well with their shift in strategy to enterprise space - they have a lot of entrenched competition to overcome (read - OneDrive).
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Re: They do have to make money at some point (+5, Insightful)
TimothyHollins 9 hours ago
We've all been benefiting from 'free' stuff funded by investors for the last 20 years. I suppose it can go on for as long as the investors keep piling in.
I am paying for the service.
My problem is not that they charge, but that the service is consistently getting worse. I liked having a small unintrusive storage module, but that is no longer offered. Instead I get all kinds of "look at how much I can help you" crap when I don't want it. I don't want to click off a "DropBox can help you save word documents" every time I open Word. I don't want a non-integrated DropBox explorer window whenever I access my files that I have to click through. I don't need stars, personalization, predicted usage, extra window panes with notifications and changes. All I want is a place to store files that I can access from all my devices without hassle + a backup, which incidentally is what DropBox used to offer before they went rogue on the features list.
90% of DropBox has become a bag on the side. It is the Clippy of cloud storage.
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Re: They do have to make money at some point (+1)
b0bby 6 hours ago
Amen to this! When they introduced their own explorer window I thought "uh-oh". I'm still looking for the perfect replacement, if such a thing exists.
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Re: They do have to make money at some point (+1)
Swampash 3 hours ago
Paid user for over a decade. Cancelled my account about 6 months ago.
Dropbox went from being a lightweight sync tool with no competition to being just another company doing a Slackesque workplace collaboration tool.
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Have you tried OneDrive? (+2)
Fippy Darkpaw 10 hours ago
Maybe they've simplified it lately but when I tried it a few years back the interface was an unintuitive atrocity.
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Re: Have you tried OneDrive? (+1)
Joe2020 10 hours ago
Have I tried?! I've tried to remove it from my PC once! ... It needs a small admin team to get rid of this thing.
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These services should focus on standard protocols

Anonymous Coward 10 hours ago

If any one of them just supported rsync, instead of making you use whatever their crap is, I'd be happy to use it.
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Re: Have you tried OneDrive? (+1)
darkain 10 hours ago
Yes, because clicking "uninstall" in "add or remove programs" is so complicated and unintuitive. The part of the OS that is entirely dedicated to uninstalling software has a one-click uninstaller for OneDrive.
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Re: Have you tried OneDrive? (+1)
Joe2020 10 hours ago
No, I'm afraid it's not that simple. Microsoft doesn't allow you to remove it with some versions of Windows. If you got yours through an OEM channel chances are they've been forced to make it uninstallable, but not everyone is this lucky.
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Re: Have you tried OneDrive? (+1)
thevirtualcat 10 hours ago
From what I remember, there's a magical PowerShell incantation that makes it go away until the next biannual upgrade hits. (Same with the "Get Office 365" app and a few other bundled advertising apps.)
Maybe that's changed in the last couple versions, though.
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Re: Have you tried OneDrive? (+1)
nashv 8 hours ago
Uhh. It is not uninstallable easily on any Consumer/Subsidized/Free version of Windows. It is entirely uninstallable on any Professional/Enterprise version of Windows.
Notice how the free stuff comes with riders ? Yeah. If you case about such things, you care enough to get the correct version of Windows in the first place.
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Re: Have you tried OneDrive? (+1)
Joe2020 8 hours ago
You looked more competent without the bullshit. Throwing money at Microsoft for a problem they've created doesn't mean you care for it. It means you fell for it. What you do is you get the version you believe serves you best and then work it out from there. That's how people have learned how to remove it despite Microsoft's efforts to stop you from removing it.
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Re: Have you tried OneDrive? (+1)
sound+vision 8 hours ago
It seems like Microsoft has at least 2 add/remove program interfaces in the new version of Windows 10 that I got with my new laptop this month. That's not including the Microsoft Store, which seems like it might work in conjunction with that, or maybe in parallel... hard to say just looking at it real quick.
There are definitely UI issues with this aspect of Windows 10. It doesn't help that it seemingly changes every time Windows Update runs. So there is a consistency issue as well, the "same" OS should function mostly the same, except where upgrades are needed. Microsoft trying to charge me $20 for open source/freeware like Hexchat in their store is not an upgrade.
All that said, I didn't have much of a problem removing OneDrive and some other crapware (but not all of it!) after messing around with the new Windows 10 install for an evening. But on the W10 PCs I used at work, it seemed totally impossible to remove OneDrive. I'm pretty sure it wasn't any of the company's GPOs either - we didn't use OneDrive, and they didn't really lock down the Windows installs either, I added and removed software all the time. Just could never figure out how to get OneDrive off.
So, I guess it depends on how Microsoft is feeling today. Who remembers "Where do you want to go today?"... What do we want to bundle today? Bundling's good right? Sell a bundle! I mean, save a bundle! Just like with Comcast.
With all this shitty UI and month-to-month inconsistency, now Windows has Windows problems, AND Linux problems. If I didn't have to contemplate configuring multiple GPUs, I'd be running Linux now...
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Re: Have you tried OneDrive? (+1)
93 Escort Wagon 10 hours ago
When I tried OneDrive on my work Mac - admittedly several years ago - I found it had problems with certain file extensions. I don't recall what they were; but the experience wasn't frictionless and it needed to be.
Problem is, I don't trust Dropbox. They seemed to keep asking for permissions they really didn't need.
I've used Sync, which overall I like. It doesn't let me edit files on a mobile device, though - just view them. So that's also not ideal.
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Re: Have you tried OneDrive? (+1)
Swampash 2 hours ago
When I tried OneDrive on my work Mac - admittedly several years ago - I found it had problems with certain file extensions.
Using it now. It's awful. Slow, buggy, resource hog, but since I'm already paying for 365 to get domain email and doc editing it's free and I'm on a tight budget.
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Re: Have you tried OneDrive? (+3, Funny)
LostMonk 8 hours ago
Maybe that should be DropBox line... "We're a bloated mess, but still not an unintuitive atrocity!"
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Yes, let's just store my data on PasteBin. (-1)

Anonymous Coward 10 hours ago

I'll keep my 2fa and safety features. Until there's a time there are no longer malicious actors or dumbasses that throw data into open elastic search buckets in this world, I'd prefer keep my security features. Thanks.
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Honestly only have it for file sharing (+2)
SuperKendall 10 hours ago
At this point, really the only reason I use DropBox is because I can share links to large files over the web.
If iCloud started offering that, I would remove Dropbox.
It's a shame because I think DropBox did, and still kind of does, a really great job in terms of core syncing ability. But they are going in directions I do not care to go.
Maybe if they wise up soon enough, they'll offer aDropBox light which is just core sync services?
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Re: Honestly only have it for file sharing (+5, Interesting)

jacks smirking reven 10 hours ago

I agree, I think Dropbox is just orphaned with no where to go. When it launched it was novel and showed people how easy and useful cloud syncing could be but they don't have any opportunity to tie it into a larger suite of services like the larger players can and people don't generally like too many services that don't talk to eachother.
Google can offer Drive directly with Docs and Sheets and it's built into the core of your Android phone now. If you are a business you get Drive space with your Google Business accounts so it's a fairly friction-less process to use it.
Same thing with Microsoft. Do you pay for Office365, either personally or for your business? Then it's an easy sell to just use OneDrive.
Have an iPhone? iCloud makes perfect sense as it's built right in and will tie all your photos videos and files into one easy service. You already have an Apple account to use the phone.
Even for large mass file sharing does Dropbox offer something better than a service like Sendspace, which has a direct focus on that core feature?
Unfortunately I think Dropbox is a case of where the innovator of an idea is unable to make a business case for it and the harder they try to they veer from the core idea and drive many users away.
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Re: Honestly only have it for file sharing (+1)
Bigbuzzman 9 hours ago
Have you look at Sync.com? Switched about a year ago and it reminds me of the old DropBox. Just a simple cloud file sync with a few good features.
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Re: Honestly only have it for file sharing

Anonymous Coward 8 hours ago

I use iDrive, they had a deal for 3TB (yes, TB!) for a year for $5.
Renewal is ~$69 a year after the first year and I may decide to go for it.
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Re: Honestly only have it for file sharing (+1)
flink 9 hours ago
You could buy some storage from AWS for pennies a month and just drop the file into an S3 bucket.
Or for a little more control you can buy a shell account from a web hosting company and have your own virtual web host you can ftp files up to. The one I use is about $100/yr and has no hard data cap as long as you don't abuse it.
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Apple Tried Acquiring Them (+4, Interesting)
Vandil X 10 hours ago
In the past, Steve Jobs had the Dropbox team visit Apple and said they wanted to acquire Dropbox. Eventually an offer was made. Dropbox refused.

iCloud was Apple's response.
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Re: Apple Tried Acquiring Them (+5, Insightful)
pneill 10 hours ago
Steve told DropBox, they're a feature and not a business. He was right, but they're trying to overcome this by adding more and more features - hence the boat. Unfortunately, it feels like they're turning into a product that's looking for a problem to solve.
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Dropped it years ago

Anonymous Coward 10 hours ago

There was too big a jump up to the paid tiers, and a bunch of annoying things about it. I use Resilio Sync to host my own data these days, and OneDrive for work via Office 365.
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I had a paying account for years (+5, Insightful)
bradley13 10 hours ago
Not even because I needed it, at first anyway, but I paid because Dropbox was worth it. Transparent sync, cross platform, almost zero effort.
After seversl years, some bright idiot decided to EOL the support for common Linux file systems. Even though there was no obvious reason to do so, since it had worked for years and was utterly stable. Probably a bright MBA type with no actual clue.
I moved to Owncloud, which makes me feel better about security anyway. Aside from the initial set up effort, it works as easily as Dropbox ever did.
I saw a tshirt I like: "There is no 'cloud'. There is only someone else's computer".
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Re: I had a paying account for years (+1)
fuzznutz 9 hours ago
Same thing here. A buddy of mine dropped them when he got locked out of his account after their big hack. The email address he had used to create his account disappeared when the company hosting it went under. Dropbox told him "tough shit" when he tried to recover his account. He switched to OwnCloud. I switched to NextCloud.
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Re: I had a paying account for years (+2)
ccool 8 hours ago
I am suprised not to see more Nextcloud/owncloud post here.
Like you, I switched to Nextcloud, they have a very nice snap package that updates automatically. Works prefectly for me.
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Re: I had a paying account for years (+2)
thegarbz 7 hours ago
since it had worked for years and was utterly stable
That's not a valid reason to keep supporting something. That's a valid reason for becoming an Amish farmer. Dropbox nixed support for filesystems that didn't support attributes for their new syncing mechanisms which greatly improved the response of syncing in real-time. The workarounds to get it working on old filesystems which "proved" that Dropbox did it for no reason massively dropped performance compared to the updated requirements, for obvious reasons.
Now frankly I don't like Dropbox, but I will defend their desire to not limit themselves based on a small user base. After the initial drop for everything other than ext4 you'll notice they included support for a lot of other modern filesystems, ones that actually allowed them to do what they were doing on ext4 as well.
Mind you I'm fully beside you about hosting your own system. I tried Owncloud and ran it happily for years until I accidentally broke something during an OS upgrade, that gave me a brief opportunity to look around and I settled on Seafile which was a bit more lightweight and suited the crappy underpowered hardware I had at the time.
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I Have Corrupted Dropbox (+1)
BrendaEM 10 hours ago
Some time back, I had been doing experiments to see if I could have a Firefox Scrapbook on Dropbox. The situation is: many small files are changed. This corrupted Dropbox 3 times before I gave up. I've experienced "Conflicted" files several times, aside from that. Always back up your Dropbox. Trust it like a cheap airplane.
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DroppedBox (+1)
bugmenot151 10 hours ago
I ended up dropping dropbox completely in 2018, it just got to be too much and it wasn't meeting my needs anymore, I switched to Mega Pro and have been quit happy since. Mega isn't perfect, but it does suite my needs much better than dropbox did. plus with dropbox dropping support for all linux file-systems except for unencrypted ext4, it became all but useless.
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That's not an excuse (+5, Informative)
thegarbz 9 hours ago
Teams and corporations does not necessarily mean insanely complex interface that's impossible to use. Everyone is jumping on the team work and commercial bandwagon, yet somehow Dropbox these days have the most bloated software and the most confusing interface.
You can't tell me that this is all for the good of the Team when I get an email saying a shared folder is updated (I don't use Dropbox much) so I log in and proceed to spend over 5 minutes trying to figure out where the damn shared folders are.
I don't like to post without checking to see what I say is true, so let's try:
1. www.dropbox.com
2. Click login
3. Enter my details.
4. Enter my details again, apparently I need to solve a CAPTCHA which didn't pop up the first time.
5. Advertisement page. Apparently the Dropbox I never use is "out of space". I can upgrade, I can learn about Dropbox Pro, or Dropbox Plus, Or I can choose my plan.
6. Click the carefully chosen white on white with light grey border to go back to my account.
7. Close the popup message to try Dropbox for Business.
8. I'm at my account settings page now and I see a big upgrade button in the middle of my screen. FUCK THE FUCK OFF!
9. Click Home
10. And now what? How do I find shared folders?
11. Click files
12. Click the shared folder.
13. Yes there's a 13, because apparently the default sort when sharing files is to give the oldest file for some 15 years ago at the very top. So change the sorting to date descending.
Oh and as to my Dropbox being full, apparently I'm using 10GB out of my 8GB allowance. What is actually making up those 10GB? Who knows, Dropbox doesn't show file or folder sizes.
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Re: That's not an excuse (+1)
fph il quozientatore 9 hours ago
If you don't know how to visualize folder sizes, I am afraid we will have to revoke your nerd card.
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Re: That's not an excuse (+2)
rot16 7 hours ago
For your method to work he would have to sync the folders to his computer. Just like google drive, the is no way to tell from online interface.
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Re: That's not an excuse (+4, Interesting)
thegarbz 7 hours ago
Well that's it isn't it. I need a fucking nerd card to figure out how to see folder sizes on my Dropbox account. Clearly it's still in beta and not ready for end users yet if they need to be a certified nerd to do something so basic.
Let me try and see if I can figure out how to visualise folder sizes on my seafile account.
1. http://www.redacted.com/seafil...
2. Enter my details, I'm already at the login screen, no sign up needed.
That was easy, a complete list of all my folders including a column called "size" which isn't shown on the Dropbox page that took 11 steps to get to.
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Re: That's not an excuse (+5, Informative)
djm 8 hours ago
Dropbox double-counts quotas (actually N-counts). Files that other people have shared with you count toward your quota as well as theirs.
I had to upgrade to a paid account just because someone else shared a large folder with me, using up all of my quota.
Here's that policy:
https://help.dropbox.com/accounts-billing/space-storage/storage-space
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Re: That's not an excuse (+1)
thegarbz 7 hours ago
Wow, that's fucked. I honestly thought I may at some point have had 20GB and they reduced it to 8GB and I ignored their emails or something. I just thought they were sleazy like that.
But holy shit I had no idea just how damn sleazy!
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Re: That's not an excuse (+1)
rho 5 hours ago
This is my big beef with Dropbox, the double-dipping on quotas. If one team shares a big folder with 3 other teams, that big folder counts against ALL teams' quotas. There is no technical reason for this. It is simply a way to force you out of the free tier and into a paid one.
As the article says, Dropbox moved on from satisfying users to satisfying their financiers and shareholders.
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Dropbox reader sucks (+1)
mveloso 9 hours ago
Once they started using their own reader instead of just opening the file with the real app, I started not using them. Boy that's fucking annoying.
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I was a paying customer for years. (+4, Interesting)
RitchCraft 9 hours ago
It was a super convenient way for me to share my files between work and home. I created many school based on-line learning sites (I was a K12 teacher) using links back the resources I stored in my 1TB dropbox account. That all changed when dropbox decided to break the links between files in my dropbox folder with the literally thousands of sites and tools I created around dropbox to help me with my workload and teaching over an 8 year period. I now roll my own and will never trust a service like dropbox again.
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Re: I was a paying customer for years. (+1)
RitchCraft 9 hours ago
Correction ... 100GB dropbox account.
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FTP (+1, Interesting)
DogDude 9 hours ago
Call me crazy, but I just FTP stuff to and from one of my servers. It's free, private, and easy.
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Re: FTP (+1)
pierceelevated 9 hours ago
Grandpa here. I, too, got burned too many times by this sort of thing and just use FTP. Wouldn't scale, but for just me it's fine.
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Re: FTP (+1)
thegarbz 6 hours ago
Grandpa here. I, too, got burned too many times by this sort of thing and just use FTP. Wouldn't scale, but for just me it's fine.
I too got burnt, but realise there's no need to give up on the benefits of modern technology just because you don't want to rely on some company.
Checkout Seafile, or Owncloud as two great self hosted cloud services that you can use to decommission your 80s era museum pieces.
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Re: FTP (+2)
Major_Disorder 9 hours ago
Please stop using FTP. SCP is the minimum as far as I am concerned.
I know there are cases where it is still fit for purpose, but as long as FTP servers still exist foolish people will put things on FTP that do not belong there.
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Re: FTP (+1)
DogDude 8 hours ago
Why shouldn't I use FTP?
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Re: FTP

Anonymous Coward 7 hours ago

The same reason you shouldn't use telnet.
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Re: FTP (+2)
JustAnotherOldGuy 7 hours ago
Why shouldn't I use FTP?
Unless I'm mistaken, credentials for FTP are sent in the clear. SFTP is kinda the fix for that.
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Re: FTP (+1)
rot16 6 hours ago
He probably is concerned because FTP is plain text, even the password is sent in clear. On the other hand (except for over public wifi) most people who can read your password can also perform a MITM.
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Re: FTP (+1)
thegarbz 6 hours ago
Crazy isn't the word. There are plenty of other words I could use but instead I just have to ask why? Why would have something so old-fashioned without any support for modern working methods? No syncing, realtime history management, ... you didn't write an FTP client to automatically update your camera phone photos* to your FTP server did you?
There are many open source self hosted options available. Owncloud, Seafile (a basic but lightweight system), and Nextcloud just to name a few that let you enjoy a modern convenience without selling your soul to some corporate devil.
*Wait you still use FTP, do you own a phone with a camera?
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Re: FTP (+1)
organgtool 5 hours ago
I completely agree - I upload stuff to your FTP server all the time and I've never had any issues!
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mod 3own (-1)

Anonymous Coward 9 hours ago

lube is wi4ed 0ff
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Misleading article (+1)
GlobalEcho 9 hours ago
I don't personally use Dropbox (though I still have an account I think), but I will defend them anyway. As I look at Propokov's complaints, many are about security notices and other warnings that we know all too well are there to prevent malware infections and boneheaded user mistakes.
Propokov admires Syncthing, which is seems to be a distributed rsync. It's a program you run with admin privileges from the command line. That's great, but leaves out a lot of very good use cases for the more complete services, and bypasses a lot of security.
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Re: Misleading article (+1)
spire3661 8 hours ago
I dont need Dropbox nannying my files/actions. I get annoyed at the sudo warning, so this shit is jsut plain diminutive to me. If you need rails on everything you do, maybe slashdot isnt the place for you.
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Re: Misleading article

Anonymous Coward 8 hours ago

That's something everyone hears before a production service like t-mobile goes out impacting millions of users.
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Re: Misleading article (+1)
chmod a+x mojo 7 hours ago
If you need rails on everything you do, maybe slashdot isnt the place for you.
Well, thank god there is slashdot, and some company that only markets to 10 users and 600 trolls left here.
Oh wait, most companies market to normal people, not us ubernerds with no other tech oriented social site to go to.
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Dropbox a mess (+1)
Residentcur 9 hours ago
Maybe, but it doesn't cost very much and you can still get it to look like it isn't a big bloated bunch of biz apps. They came close to losing it not long ago, but still provided settings to put things back the way they were. I'll keep my eyes open, though.
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If you don't like it, (+1)
delirious.net 8 hours ago
don't use it. and yes, they will find out. eventually.
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Dropbox was great, until... (+4, Interesting)
Pig Hogger 8 hours ago
I have had Dropbox at the very beginning, and it worked fine.

Then one day, they changed their TOS to prohibit storing encrypted files. Fuck that.

I did not even bother closing my account with them, let them keep the little shit I put there...
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Good luck with that (+4, Informative)
Impy the Impiuos Imp 8 hours ago
"in the beginning, Dropbox was great, but in the last few years, they started to bloat up." He visually shows that as an existing customer, you need to jump through a dozen hoops to get Dropbox going on a new machine.
In the 1970s, someone wrote a famous book, "Why Nothing Works". The poster child was a case study of Xexox, showing how what was once a quick, fast-moving new industry shaper had become a bloated, bogged down bureaucratic corporation that needed something like 57 manager and vp signatures to make a small feature change to a copier.
People not only don't learn from history before making the same mistakes, they don't even learn from history that they should learn from history!
Here's another book to help out: The Inmates Are Running The Asylum, or why programmers, who think product design is throwing wrappers around system APIs, should be kept well away from product design, among other problems.
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Noticed the slowdown too (+2)
kingbilly 8 hours ago
A few years ago, the moment I added something to the dropbox folder I could right-click and copy the URL and it would be virtually instantaneous. Then about two years ago, something changed. It now takes a second and a half, or more, to actually complete. This has lead to me pasting whatever was on my clipboard beforehand, and then sending it to a coworker via instant message.

I reported it a while back and they said they would look into it. They never did it seems. Or couldn't revert the regression.
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Dropbox is born out of Windows's inferiority (+4, Insightful)
BAReFO0t 6 hours ago
On Unix-like OSes (Linux, macOS, Android, BSD, ...), you can just use FUSE to mount some remote storage to some sub-directory. A basic Apache server that lists the files in that directory, for other people you want to share them with, or only allows access, and you're done. Access control lists come standard with file systems nowadays, and allow as fine-grained permissions as you like. There are simple web interfaces for it. Any computer-savy buddy of your can whip up a better Dropbox in a single evening. I know because I did. Twice. (As it was easier to make a new one, than to migrate the old one. Not because the latter was hard.)
It is an entire non-issue. Just like 85% of the system tool apps for Windows or mobile OSes out there.
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Re: Dropbox is born out of Windows's inferiority (+2)
organgtool 5 hours ago
This is such an old-fashioned solution to the problem. A more modern solution would be to set up OwnCloud or NextCloud to provide a platform specifically tailored for hosting files in a cloud environment that you control. It's open source, supports WebDAV, multiple users, quotas, etc.

I'm all for rolling my own solution but there are some cases where it's just easier to use a dedicated, well-maintained solution to the problem.
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Re: Dropbox is born out of Windows's inferiority (+3, Informative)
chx496 5 hours ago
On Unix-like OSes (Linux, macOS, Android, BSD, ...), you can just use FUSE to mount some remote storage to some sub-directory. A basic Apache server that lists the files in that directory, for other people you want to share them with, or only allows access, and you're done. Access control lists come standard with file systems nowadays, and allow as fine-grained permissions as you like. There are simple web interfaces for it.
Seriously? No. I like GNU/Linux, and use it as my primary OS, both at work and at home, but both network filesystems and ACLs are something that Windows does way better than any other OS I've seen so far.
ACLs: POSIX ACLs are way more limited than the ACLs Windows provides in their filesystems, both local and on networks. The main missing feature in POSIX ACLs is the ability to delegate stuff: on Windows you can easily say "user X who doesn't have global admin rights has the ability to be effectively an admin for this subtree here" -- most notably because ACLs have settings for "this user may change ownership of the file" and "this user may change permissions of the file" (which simply don't exist in POSIX ACLs at all), plus ACL inheritance rules (other than default ACLs) that -- while quite complex -- allow a specific user to take control of a subtree again even if other users change permissions underneath it.
There have been some ideas of improving ACLs on *nix, NFSv4 for example specifies a better set of ACLs, but as there's no backing FS that holds these (on Linux at least), they don't work. (There have been attempts to get a "Rich ACL" patch into the Linux kernel, but that hasn't gone anywhere.)
Network filesystems: Windows handles network filesystem failures way better than Linux does. On Windows well-written programs that use "Overlapped I/O" can easily cancel I/O operations when they detect that something takes too long or the user clicks on "Cancel" or something - on *nix systems stuff will just hang until the kernel runs into some kind of timeout. Sure, you can delegate I/O to different threads, but the threads are often not killable until a kernel timeout (which can be VERY long) is reached because they are stuck in the dreaded "uninterruptible sleep" ("D" state in ps) occurs. Of course there are situations where even Windows doesn't handle failures in network filesystems very well, but my impression is that -- in general -- Windows is designed in such a way that they expect I/O to fail in some way at some point, while *nix systems tend to be designed with assumptions in mind low-level stuff tends to be reliable, and that when that does fail, it's basically an irrecoverable error. Is this universally true? No. Is there badly written software on Windows that can't cope with I/O failures well? Sure. But as a tendency I think one can easily say that Windows is much better at handling failures than *nix is - starting with the kernel API for I/O.
Sure, you don't have the filesystem variety on Windows that you have on Linux, but if your goal is just to "easily set up something", Windows supports trivial mounting of SMB/CIFS filesystems (so basically every other Windows system on the network) as well as WebDAV.
And I'm not saying all is great in Windows, its I/O scheduler is utter garbage in my opinion, especially when coping with a lot of small files (even NTFS is much faster on Linux via NTFS-3g/FUSE than on Windows in my experience in that situation, and Windows's (apparent lack of) metadata caching is purely awful), so when it comes to performance I very much prefer Linux -- and if you CAN guarantee a certain level of reliability of the server (e.g. NFS exported via a Pacemaker cluster with automatic failover) then the network filesystem works much smoother on Linux than on Windows -- I'm just saying that in a lot of everyday use cases Windows provides a much better user experience related to network filesystems, when compared to Linux.
But I think the main reason your argument here is flawed is that Dropbox doesn't actually want to replace network filesystems. They want to provide a synchronized copy of a directory tree that is stored on your local system, so you can access it even if you don't have connectivity. I don't know of any FUSE filesystem that did that back when Dropbox was first introduced (and if you can point something like that out, it was very niche, as I can't even think of any one of these today). This is a completely different use case than a network filesystem. Furthermore it provides implicit file versioning (no typical network filesystem provides this out of the box), and a split-brain resolution algorithm (which doesn't exist for network filesystems, because split-brain can't happen there in the same sense).
There are plenty of alternatives to Dropbox you can set up yourself: Nextcloud or Owncloud, Seafile, Syncthing, heck, even git-annex might fit the bill. But they are a different beast than plain network storage.
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If it isn't growing, it isn't profitable (+2)
Chewbacon 4 hours ago
Being in sales for a while now, it's never enough to just maintain what you got. Every C-level wants to make more money and the shareholders want returns. It didn't take much for me to move on from Dropbox and go to the trouble of running my own Nextcloud.
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Terrible User Experience (+1)
speedingant 4 hours ago
I stopped paying for DropBox ($150 a year, 1TB with versions) when I continually got spammed with internal advertisements within their native macOS app, telling me I needed to upgrade to a more expensive plan (I had 600GB stored, there was no reason why I should change). This seriously offended me. Then they introduced a terrible Electron style app for managing my files, which launched at login when I didn't want it to. At that point DropBox lost me. It was a huge hassle moving all these files to another Cloud Provider (ended up with OneDrive), but they drove me to it. It was a nice and simple file cloud sync app with great Finder integration. It then turned into a bloated application with a terrible user experience. Why would anyone pay for that?
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If you want to kill off your business (+1)

Malays2 bowman a few seconds ago

"Dropbox was great, but in the last few years, they started to bloat up." He visually shows that as an existing customer, you need to jump through a dozen hoops to get Dropbox going on a new machine"
Awesome way to get rid of all of those pesky customers and have them run to your competition. I thought they would have been wiser than this. :\
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Trump had to spend the night locked up in the basement because he smelled so bad, and he was sad and blue because his parents didn't read him a bedtime story from Mein Kampf
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Trump and Putin got into a little tiff. "I dominate you!" screamed Putin, as he jammed his hand on Trump's upper leg. "No, I dominate you!" yelled Trump, as he pushed Putin's hand away, and jammed his hand down onto Putin's upper leg. This went back and forth, until Putin jammed both of his feet into Trump's crotch and said "No, Trump, I dominate YOU! And I am your lord and master, UNDERSTAND? Putin jammed all of his fingers into Trump's mouth and Trump could only muffle out a Uhhuh.
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Lol this was sexy. Trump and Putin sandwich Xi Jinping in the corner wanking (that's from some weird TV show, cept the modern age replacing the meeing at Yalta)

I wish our leaders would get together and have orgies. I hope the UN is like that cept, I'd feel bad for the janitors
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This is normal skull and bones behaviour. You really think hot butt seks does NOT go on in Bohemian Grove? LOL!
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21st July 1970: Hell's Angels kissing at a free pop concert held in Hyde Park, London in 1970. (Photo by Evening Standard/Getty Images)

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The Hell's Angels, the world's most famous biker gang, are known for their hyper-masculine image. Famous for drug busts, biker chicks, and taking out a hit on Mick Jagger, the gang has become an icon for outlaw behavior. They also have a surprising history of fluid sexuality and homoerotic behavior. The Angels differentiated themselves from society by kissing each other on the mouth as a greeting and an opportunity to shock passers-by.

Hell's Angels and other outlaw biker gangs rebelled against the rigid social norms of the 1950s and 1960s. They loved Harley Davidson bikes, hard-drinking, and fighting. "Being in an outlaw motorcycle club, the biker lifestyle back then, was definitely counterculture," says Ed Winterhalder, a former Bandido, author, and producer of several television shows about biking. "It was 100 percent the opposite direction that mainstream society was going in." Hell's Angels and other outlaw gangs proudly called themselves "one percenters," a riff on the head of the American Motorcycle Association's statement that 99 percent of bikers were law-abiding citizens and one percent caused trouble

Read more: Boy George Is Back

The bikers' kisses became immortalized in Hunter S. Thompson's book Hell's Angels: A Strange and Terrible Saga. '[Kissing] is a guaranteed square-jolter, and the Angels are gleefully aware of the reaction it gets," he wrote. "The sight of a photographer invariably whips the Angels into a kissing frenzy."

Life photographer Bill Ray witnessed the Angels' attention grabbing display. After capturing a photograph of two men in a deep embrace in 1965, he said, "That's the sort of thing they would do all the time, just to freak people out. As if to say, 'What're you looking at? You got a problem with this?'"

The hyper-masculine atmosphere of male biker clubs might have allowed for more sexual fluidity and expression amongst the Angels. "If you look at the last century and a half, all-male subcultures that were particularly hypermasculine are often the subcultures that also allow men more flexibility in their gender behavior," says Randy McBee, a professor at Texas Tech and author of Born to Be Wild: The Rise of the American Motorcyclist. "Because these men participate in very aggressive, physical and masculine behavior they can participate in other behaviors that are not typically viewed as masculine, or in some cases heterosexual. Men in sports can be very aggressive on the field and be very competitive, but can also slap each other on the ass and be very emotional after a victory or a loss—behaviors that are less common in a middle-class, white collar office setting."


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Trump endorses concentration camps. [URL]
Jun 17a322x1n
<https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/five-bombshells-about-trump-from
-bolton-s-book/ar-BB15CVqQ?ocid=msedgdhp>

<https://tinyurl.com/y9yqojpo>

I knew Trump was bent, but I didn't think he was this bent!

Jun 18Pat
- show quoted text -
bolton was fired by trump.
hillery lost. get over it.

Jun 18a322x1n
Pat <BARK...@gmail.com> wrote in
news:47kmefhqu3deke8vf...@4ax.com:
- show quoted text -
<https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/five-takeaways-from-john-boltons
-memoir/ar-BB15EzhF?ocid=DE_20200618_ENUS_daily_1>

<https://tinyurl.com/ybkqls5h>

Trump and the Republicans have raped America. When the election is
over, and the Democrats own the White House and both houses of Congress,
there will be retrubution for what has been done to America and its
people. And, you'll get used to it, and over it.

Jun 18Pat
- show quoted text -
What do you expect the dems to do to screw up America?
Do you have any examples?
Besides open borders, free trade, giving illegalsthe right to drive
and vote and collect social security? Defund the police? Hire
social workers to answer 911 calls? defund the military? Vote so
that every person has a $24,000 annual income? Free education for all
except whites? Take away the corporate America? 90 Percent taxation
on all those who make over $40,000?

What else will you "FIX?"
I didn't hear you, ass wipe!

Jun 18Melania Drumpf
Pat wrote on 2020-06-18 10:48 AM:
> On Thu, 18 Jun 2020 13:55:04 GMT, a322x1n <vo...@void.void> wrote:
>
>> Pat <BARK...@gmail.com> wrote in
>> news:47kmefhqu3deke8vf...@4ax.com:
>>
>>> On Thu, 18 Jun 2020 00:44:24 GMT, a322x1n <vo...@void.void> wrote:
>>>
>>>> <https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/five-bombshells-about-trump-fr
>>>> om -bolton-s-book/ar-BB15CVqQ?ocid=msedgdhp>
>>>>
>>>> <https://tinyurl.com/y9yqojpo>
>>>>
>>>> I knew Trump was bent, but I didn't think he was this bent!
>>>
>>> bolton was fired by trump.
>>> hillery lost. get over it.
>> <https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/five-takeaways-from-john-boltons
>> -memoir/ar-BB15EzhF?ocid=DE_20200618_ENUS_daily_1>
>>
>> <https://tinyurl.com/ybkqls5h>
>>
>> Trump and the Republicans have raped America. When the election is
>> over, and the Democrats own the White House and both houses of Congress,
>> there will be retrubution for what has been done to America and its
>> people. And, you'll get used to it, and over it.
> What do you expect the dems to do to screw up America?
> Do you have any examples?
>

My fat fuck husband has kill 120,000 Americans with his coronavirus and
increased the national debt by $7 trillion after three years into his
term of office. Can the Dems beat that?





Jun 18Jack Shit
- show quoted text -
This is all the left has to fight back...LOL

Jun 18Siri Cruise
In article <6fLGG.19488$DO2....@fx45.iad>,
Melania Drumpf <"Trophy Wife"@The Real Mango Fat Fuck.gov>
wrote:

> My fat fuck husband has kill 120,000 Americans with his coronavirus and
> increased the national debt by $7 trillion after three years into his
> term of office. Can the Dems beat that?

Melanie, Melanie, Melanie. 120.000 is small potatoes compared to
what he will do with chinese missiles if we don't elect him
Presidente por Life.

--
:-<> Siri Seal of Disavowal #000-001. Disavowed. Denied. Deleted. @
'I desire mercy, not sacrifice.' /|\
The first law of discordiamism: The more energy This post / \
to make order is nore energy made into entropy. insults Islam. Mohammed

Jun 18a322x1n
Pat <BARK...@gmail.com> wrote in
news:ocvmefh7i5t8vh3g0...@4ax.com:
- show quoted text -
And not one of those has any basis in fact. Go dream up more lies.

Jun 18a322x1n
Jack Shit <ne...@invalid.invalid> wrote in
news:kodnefd1djtj6h18h...@4ax.com:
- show quoted text -
> So you morons lied when you said you wanted open borders?

No one ever said any such thing. Stop lying.

Posting on the Usenet is so easy when you can make up your own
facts.

Jun 18Pat
On Thu, 18 Jun 2020 10:54:58 -0400, Melania Drumpf <"Trophy Wife"@The
Real Mango Fat Fuck.gov> wrote:

- show quoted text -
The dems are the ones who voted for thoise spending bills.
Trump can't spend a nickel without their allocating the funds.

Jun 18a322x1n
Pat <BARK...@gmail.com> wrote in
news:cpjnefd7qo21qpqh9...@4ax.com:

> On Thu, 18 Jun 2020 16:47:59 GMT, a322x1n <vo...@void.void> wrote:
>
>>Pat <BARK...@gmail.com> wrote in
>>news:ocvmefh7i5t8vh3g0...@4ax.com:
>>
>>> On Thu, 18 Jun 2020 13:55:04 GMT, a322x1n <vo...@void.void> wrote:
>>>
>>>>Pat <BARK...@gmail.com> wrote in
>>>>news:47kmefhqu3deke8vf...@4ax.com:
>>>>
>>>>> On Thu, 18 Jun 2020 00:44:24 GMT, a322x1n <vo...@void.void> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>><https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/five-bombshells-about-trum
>>>>>>p- fr om -bolton-s-book/ar-BB15CVqQ?ocid=msedgdhp>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> <https://tinyurl.com/y9yqojpo>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>I knew Trump was bent, but I didn't think he was this bent!
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> bolton was fired by trump.
>>>>> hillery lost. get over it.
>>>>
>>>><https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/five-takeaways-from-john-bol
>>>>to ns -memoir/ar-BB15EzhF?ocid=DE_20200618_ENUS_daily_1>
>>>>
>>>> <https://tinyurl.com/ybkqls5h>
>>>>
>>>>Trump and the Republicans have raped America. When the election is
>>>>over, and the Democrats own the White House and both houses of
>>>>Congress, there will be retrubution for what has been done to
>>>>America and its people. And, you'll get used to it, and over it.
>>>
>>> What do you expect the dems to do to screw up America?
>>> Do you have any examples?
>>> Besides open borders, free trade, giving illegalsthe right to drive
>>> and vote and collect social security? Defund the police? Hire
>>> social workers to answer 911 calls? defund the military? Vote so
>>> that every person has a $24,000 annual income? Free education for
>>> all except whites? Take away the corporate America? 90 Percent
>>> taxation on all those who make over $40,000?
>>>
>>> What else will you "FIX?"
>>> I didn't hear you, ass wipe!
>>
>> And not one of those has any basis in fact. Go dream up more lies.
>
> Not my dreams.
> Those are the dem's talking points.

No, they're not. It's reached the point where you can't even figure
out the best way to present a lie. Go back to propaganda school.

Jun 18M I Wakefield
"Pat" wrote in message news:enjneftkedr3e9dl0...@4ax.com...

> The dems are the ones who voted for thoise spending bills.
> Trump can't spend a nickel without their allocating the funds.

If only there was another branch of Congress, controlled by the Republicans,
that could have reigned in the Democrats. Or failing that, a way for the
President to block a spending bill.

I guess we'll never know ...


Jun 18Melania Drumpf
Pat wrote on 2020-06-18 4:31 PM:
On Thu, 18 Jun 2020 10:54:58 -0400, Melania Drumpf <"Trophy Wife"@The
Real Mango Fat Fuck.gov> wrote:

Pat wrote on 2020-06-18 10:48 AM:
On Thu, 18 Jun 2020 13:55:04 GMT, a322x1n <v...@void.void> wrote:

Pat <BARK...@gmail.com> wrote in
news:47kmefhqu3deke8vf...@4ax.com:

On Thu, 18 Jun 2020 00:44:24 GMT, a322x1n <v...@void.void> wrote:

<https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/five-bombshells-about-trump-fr
om -bolton-s-book/ar-BB15CVqQ?ocid=msedgdhp>

<https://tinyurl.com/y9yqojpo>

I knew Trump was bent, but I didn't think he was this bent!
bolton was fired by trump.
hillery lost. get over it.
<https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/five-takeaways-from-john-boltons
-memoir/ar-BB15EzhF?ocid=DE_20200618_ENUS_daily_1>

<https://tinyurl.com/ybkqls5h>

Trump and the Republicans have raped America. When the election is
over, and the Democrats own the White House and both houses of Congress,
there will be retrubution for what has been done to America and its
people. And, you'll get used to it, and over it.
What do you expect the dems to do to screw up America?
Do you have any examples?

My fat fuck husband has kill 120,000 Americans with his coronavirus and
increased the national debt by $7 trillion after three years into his
term of office. Can the Dems beat that?
The dems are the ones who voted for thoise spending bills.
Trump can't spend a nickel without their allocating the funds.

Mango fat fuck's stupidity caused the collapse of the economy and thus the record amount of spending. The US National Debt is now $26.150 today, June 18, 2020. It will be $27 trillion in July. The mango fat fuck is a national disaster.

https://usdebtclock.org/








Jun 18Melania Drumpf
- show quoted text -

You will never know because you are as stupid as my mango fat fuck.

My mango fat fuck's stupidity caused the collapse of the economy and thus the record amount of spending. The US National Debt is now $26.150 today, June 18, 2020. It will be $27 trillion in July. The mango fat fuck is a national disaster.

https://usdebtclock.org/




Jun 18me
I would not pit it past Herr Trumpf.

Jun 18Olrik
- show quoted text -
:-D

6:12 AMMango Fat Fuck
Jack Shit wrote on 2020-06-19 8:51 AM:
On Thu, 18 Jun 2020 19:18:13 -0400, Melania Drumpf <"Trophy Wife"@The
Real Mango Fat Fuck.gov> wrote:

- show quoted text -
- show quoted text -
The dems are the ones who voted for thoise spending bills.
Trump can't spend a nickel without their allocating the funds.
Mango fat fuck's stupidity caused the collapse of the economy and thus
the record amount of spending. The US National Debt is now $26.150
today, June 18, 2020. It will be $27 trillion in July. The mango fat
fuck is a national disaster.

https://usdebtclock.org/






My life hasn't changed, has yours?

Not yet. I am not done fucking you over yet.




11:57 AMme
"Trump told Xi he approved of building Chinese concentration camps for Uighur citizens
Another excerpt published by the Journal deals with conversations between Trump and Xi about the construction of concentration camps for China’s largely Muslim Uighur minority, whose loyalty to Beijing is considered suspect by the regime. “At the opening dinner of the Osaka G-20 meeting in June 2019, with only interpreters present, Xi had explained to Trump why he was basically building concentration camps in Xinjiang,” Bolton wrote. “According to our interpreter, Trump said that Xi should go ahead with building the camps, which Trump thought was exactly the right thing to do. The National Security Council’s top Asia staffer, Matthew Pottinger, told me that Trump said something very similar during his November 2017 trip to China.”

What's sad is that Trumpf is far from alone
in doing stuff like this. Don't think any of the world
'leaders' are your friend, they're not. They will
pull this kind of shit if it means feathering their
own nests, and to hell with anybody else.
After all, it's not they that will be put in those
camps, but "other people".

The coming New World Order is more of the same, amplified greatly.
This time, there will be no where to run.

blinking...@gmail.com - Switch accounts - Desktop

[blinking...@gmail.com]

WX
-- JJS
KW13 - JJC/DETROIT/JERSEY
KW1B - BENTONVILLE
KW2B - BENETTVILLE
KW1W - WESTMINSTER
KW2W - WINSOR
KW1P - PHILADELPHIA
KW1V - VIRGINA CITY
KW1F - CITY OF THE FUTURE

-- NBS
KW12 - NEW BOSTON
KW1C - CHARLESTON
KW1A - ALABAMA CITY
KW1S - SALEM

KW1N - NEWPORT

-- MLS
KW1M - MIDLAND CITY

-- NNS

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Stories

'Into the Wild' Bus Removed From Alaska Backcountry For Public Safety
from the safety-first dept.
An anonymous reader quotes a report from NBC News:
An abandoned bus in the Alaska backcountry, popularized by the book "Into the Wild" and movie of the same name, was removed Thursday, state officials said. The decision prioritizes public safety, Alaska Natural Resources Commissioner Corri Feige said. The bus has long attracted adventurers to an area without cellphone service and marked by unpredictable weather and at-times swollen rivers. Some have had to be rescued or have died. Christopher McCandless, the subject of the book and movie, died there in 1992. The rescue earlier this year of five Italian tourists and death last year of a woman from Belarus intensified calls from local officials for the bus, about 25 miles from the Parks Highway, to be removed.

The Alaska Army National Guard moved the bus as part of a training mission "at no cost to the public or additional cost to the state," Feige said. The Alaska National Guard, in a release, said the bus was removed using a heavy-lift helicopter. The crew ensured the safety of a suitcase with sentimental value to the McCandless family, the release states. It doesn't describe that item further. Feige, in a release, said the bus will be kept in a secure location while her department weighs various options for what to do with it.
Posted by BeauHD an hour ago

Close Ad

15 Comments
Help
All
Outstanding
Funny
"Safety is the #1 Priority" (-1)
Anonymous Coward 44 minutes ago
Not rights, not personal choice, not your ability to assess and take risks -- your safety is the number one priority. Your constitutional, and other, rights will come second.
BTW, there is no second in the face of Safety.
Reply Share
Flag
Re: "Safety is the #1 Priority" (+3, Interesting)
weilawei 35 minutes ago
Yeah, this bus totally killed all those people, not the fact that they went into the backcountry unprepared like McCandless did in the first place.
Stupid people will invent a reason to stupid.
Reply Share
Flag
Re: "Safety is the #1 Priority"
Anonymous Coward 18 minutes ago
Tyrants will always find "reasons" (really excuses) to take rights away from others, usually covering their insidious actions under the guise of righteousness.
If these people aren't taken to task when they overstep their bounds, people will eventually have no rights at all.
Reply Share
Flag
Re: "Safety is the #1 Priority"
Anonymous Coward 10 minutes ago
Evil don't get rights.
Reply Share
Flag
Re: "Safety is the #1 Priority"
Anonymous Coward 6 minutes ago
If only that were true, but "thou shalt not murder" doesn't seem to apply to those tasked with enforcing our laws.
When you pervert your authority, and thereby your country, and thereby the human beings of your country, in that manner, you are truly evil.
Reply Share
Flag
Re: "Safety is the #1 Priority" (+1)

Malays2 bowman a few seconds ago

Welcome to the New World Order where you are just a peon who exists to make others very rich.
We can't have our peons dying on us, now can we? There is money to be milking! So we need to turn this world into a no fun hell hole in the name of "safety".
Yes, I don't believe for one damn second that these 'do-gooders' are doing this out of the kindness of their hearts. Mod as you will, but this is how I see things.
Reply Share
Flag
in Soviet Russia, bus removes you (+1)
Anonymouse Cowtard 41 minutes ago
(see above)
Reply Share
Flag
It's the last straw! (+1)
CajunArson 37 minutes ago
The last straw for the bus came when a detailed search of it's twitter history showed that it might have been once been driven by a segregated bus driver in 1954. Destroying this highly visible symbol of oppression will surely solve all of our problems.
Reply Share
Flag
The bus was a Darwin Award magnet
Anonymous Coward 32 minutes ago
Similar to people taking selfies on the edge of a cliff or not wearing a seat belt.
Clorox for the gene pool.
Reply Share
Flag
Stupid will always find a reason (+2)
Viol8 26 minutes ago
If they didn't head for this bus theyd head for an equally dangerous to reach mountain/lake/ravine/cave just to boast that theyd done it.
Reply Share
Flag
Re: Stupid will always find a reason (+1)
slack_justyb 6 minutes ago
And if while reaching that other thing they call for rescue, teams will be deployed just the same as they were for this bus. Don't know what to tell you. Idiots are a pretty big cost to tax payers in a lot of regards. The National Guard picked up the cost of moving the thing as part of a training mission so the money was already earmarked for training, they just made the bus part of the mission.
As far as how do we reduce the number of times we rescue idiots doing idiotic things? Good luck on figuring that out.
Reply Share
Flag
Should have left it
Anonymous Coward 23 minutes ago
Do we believe in evolution or not?
Stop trying to thwart natural selection, I say.
Should add more buses in even more remote places, maybe near grizzly nests.
Reply Share
Flag
On the bright side... (+1)
RyanFenton 20 minutes ago
They did recreate the flying magic school bus that lots of kids loved in the 90's.
That was a weird show.
Ryan Fenton
Reply Share
Flag
Re: On the bright side... (+1)
93 Escort Wagon 16 minutes ago
My daughter adored that show.
Reply Share
Flag
Stupidity finds a way
Anonymous Coward 17 minutes ago
I'm sure every dumbass intent on making a pilgrimage to a bus in the middle of nowhere where one dumbass killed himself will find some other way to hasten the end of their own life.
Reply Share
Flag
If you thought ... (+3)
PPH 14 minutes ago
... a lot of people died looking for the bus before, how many do you think will now that you've hidden it?

Reply Share
Flag
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↰ alt.politics
Not Very Good People
Jun 5PolicySpy
A candidate for president has said that 10% to 15% of Americans are not very good people.

Well, a statement like that could be a foundation of the development of secret-police-networks.

For instance, a secret-police-network identifies troublesome people and then fabricates reasons for surveillance of those people. Then the SPN develops effective responses against those people short of prosecution because actual prosecution would involve the oversight of a court and would be risky and difficult.

SPN responses could include slander and including suspicion of crimes, false reports of credit problems, false reports of behavioral problems, and slander of title. Responses could include employment discrimination, housing discrimination, banking discrimination, and so on.

What are some examples of SPN's ? All societies have SPN's. A person's rights can be guaranteed at the same time that a SPN is working against them. The differences between SPN's is just a matter of degree.

Of course each political party will support it's own type of SPN but can limit degree of application. However, a SPN could also work against or for any and all political party interests. That's a sociological response, rather than a political response, and is an example of wide-ranging reaches for control within a society but hopefully with limits of degree of application.

At this point, relatively legitimate organizations can simply have responses directed by loose-cannon individuals. Degree of application is limited but not effectively controlled.

So now, the book "1984" could be representative of most all societies by changing the degree-of-application.






Jun 5me
"So now, the book "1984" could be representative of most all societies by changing the degree-of-application. "


It's just the New World Order being built,
brick by brick.

I feel real sorry for those being born today.
They will never know freedom, only micromanagement,
generated fear, and crawling on their bellies to their masters'
tables hoping and waiting for a scrap to fall
from it. "Generation Z" may be the last generation
to have at least gotten a taste of freedom.

Of course, more manufactured bullshit such as
"mark of the beast" ensures that the people
warning about what is to come will be seen as
nothing more than cammo-wearing kooks who play
GI-Joe in the woods, or religious zealots.

This is just another power grab, like evert other
in history, only it's the biggest ever, and it
will suck the heart and soul out of the world, and make life
as bland as a saltine cracker devoid of the salt,
while at the same time make people look for monsters
hiding behind every bush.

The archetects of the NWO learned from past mistakes,
so don't look for tanks in the street, not
anytime soon at least. Instead this invasion is being done
through the schools, through manufactured fear and neuosis,
through cheap one liners like "Won't someone
PLEEEEEEEZZZZZEEEE think of the children!", through
pitting groups against each other, through
the creation of 'special snowflakes' that hold other students
and employees in the grip of fear, leading to more
rules and regulations, through watering
down and removing everything
that makes life worth living. I can go
on, but you get the point.

Jun 5PolicySpy

- show quoted text -

Well, in a totalitarian government a single secret-police-network is likely located within the government. But in a democratic society, SPN's are likely to be located elsewhere. A SPN could be political, sociological, activist, or corporate. This wide ranging of SPN's is how the viewpoint of "1984" is oversimplified.

A SPN is a SPN because of intent and because of a network of logistical connections or contacts. An individual can defend themselves with civil litigation unless the SPN is able to keep itself secret.

It's a strange subject but I continued with it. For instance, what is the point of declaring 15% of the people to be substandard unless responses are being developed against them ? Of course simply asking for voters to vote against a particular political party is a reasonable. Giving tax breaks for particular personal or business practice is reasonable. So reasonable polices are not an intent that identifies a SPN.

Jun 5PolicySpy

Well, in a totalitarian government a single secret-police-network is likely located within the government. But in a democratic society, SPN's are likely to be located elsewhere. A SPN could be political, sociological, religious, activist, or corporate. This wide ranging of SPN's is how the viewpoint of "1984" is oversimplified. I would't call a mafia a SPN because most of the contacts of a mafia are just its victims.

A SPN is a SPN because of intent and because of a network of logistical connections or contacts. An individual could defend themselves with civil litigation unless the SPN is able to keep itself secret. A SPN could be prosecuted with RICO laws unless it is able to keep itself secret.

It's a strange subject but I continued with it. For instance, what is the point of declaring 15% of the people to be substandard unless responses are being developed against them ? Of course simply asking for voters to vote against a particular political party is a reasonable. Giving tax breaks for particular personal or business practice is reasonable. So reasonable political polices are not an intent that identifies a SPN.

It could then seem that a SPN, even if targeting a class of people, is an organization that ultimately reaches the point of actions against individuals.

Jun 5PolicySpy
Well, in a totalitarian government a single secret-police-network is likely located within the government . But in a democratic society, SPN's are likely to be located elsewhere . A SPN could be political, sociological, religious, activist, or corporate . This wide ranging of SPN's is how the viewpoint of "1984" is oversimplified .

I would't call a mafia a SPN because most of the contacts of a mafia are just its victims . So a SPN is likely an organization that has more members than victims.

A SPN is a SPN because of intent and because of a network of logistical connections or contacts . An individual could defend themselves with civil litigation unless the SPN is able to keep itself secret . A SPN could be prosecuted with RICO laws unless it is able to keep itself secret .

It's a strange subject but I continued with it . For instance, what is the point of declaring 15% of the people to be substandard unless responses are being developed against them? Of course simply asking for voters to vote against a particular political party is a reasonable . Giving tax breaks for particular personal or business practice is reasonable . So reasonable political polices are not an intent that identifies a SPN .

It would then seem that a SPN, even if targeting a class of people or targeting an issue, is an organization that ultimately reaches the point of actions against individuals.

Jun 7PolicySpy

Well, in a totalitarian government a single secret-police-network is likely located within the government. But in a democratic society, SPN's are likely to be located elsewhere . A SPN could be government, political, sociological, religious, activist, or corporate . This wide ranging of SPN's is how the viewpoint of "1984" is oversimplified.

I would't call a mafia a SPN because most of the contacts of a mafia are just its victims . So a SPN is likely an organization that has more members than victims.

A SPN is a SPN because of intent and because of a network of logistical connections or contacts . An individual could defend themselves with civil litigation unless the SPN is able to keep itself secret . A SPN could be prosecuted with RICO laws unless it is able to keep itself secret .

It's a strange subject but I continued with it . For instance, what is the point of declaring 15% of the people to be substandard unless responses are being developed against them? Of course simply asking for voters to vote against a particular political party is a reasonable . Giving tax breaks for particular personal or business practice is reasonable . So reasonable political polices are not an intent that identifies a SPN .

It would then seem that a SPN, even if targeting a class of people or targeting an issue, is an organization that ultimately reaches the point of actions against individuals.

This attempt to academically identify secret-police-networks is awkward but I'll try to sum-up. A SPN has issues, has members, has contacts or agents or logistical connections, but targets individuals with a prior intent and without the legal standard of probable cause. A SPN likely has more current members than current victims but historical victims could add-up. A SPN doesn't necessarily bring cases to courts.

Then I wonder about small-secret-police-networks.

For instance a law-office combined with a private-detective agency could have activities against an individual in a situation not yet in front of a court. (One example, a person's employer cooperates with the SPN operation such that SPN knows that the person is not supervising their child because the person's employer is keeping the person at work for twelve hours a day. That's three logistical connections with the goal of making a case against a situation that was logistically fabricated. Actually, that's four logistical connections because someone hired the law office to act on their claims of reasons for cause. The activities of a SPN can begin with a false report of a problem.)

Or real-estate agents could help property speculators harass residents out of a property that the speculators want to buy.

Or a special police unit could be a SPN within logistical advantages of the regular police force. The SPN can justify surveillance of a person based on a false report from a cooperating unattached agent.

2:54 PMme
"A candidate for president has said that 10% to 15% of Americans are not very good people."

This has shades of the "superpredator" craze back
in the 1990s. By their predictions, our cities
should be looking like the movie "Escape from New York"
or the opening scenes of "Demolition Man" right now.

Ooops, that didn't happen. But the generated moral panic
got a lot of youth offenders slammed hard with sentences
that were unjust and out of line with their charges.

It seems like they are trying the same trick, but a new method.

These assholes won't be happy until they see the SS
goosestepping down the streets of major American
cities.