SCUBA TANK FOR AIR
Bear
I am curious as to what regulater would be needed.
I want to paint as quietly as possible and I get free air fills for my
tank. I just need an inexpensive way to regulate.
Thanks
Bear
Anthony Correa
scuba tank is very highly compressed, surely more than the 80 psi you'd
get in a standard compressor, so it's going to have to be a good
(expensive) one. Also, you're going to get a lot of moisture in your
hoses, cause the air in a scuba tank probably isn't dehydrated, and the
more it's compressed, the more water you get. The expense you'll incur by
redoing ruined artwork might be more than you would by renting a CO2 tank
and buying a CO2 regulator (70 bucks at Dixie Art in New Orleans). CO2
has NO moisture in it, and it's not too expensive; I refill a 20 lb tank
for $25. Ultimately, the cheapest way about it is to get yourself a
silent compressor; just make sure you get one that's powerful enough for
the type of work you do. I do T-shirts; a Sil-Air Terry Hill model paid
for itself in a couple of weeks.
E. Stafford
you start using gasses other than compressed air you need a regulator
specifically for that type of gas. For mobile jobs where I can't take my
compressor I use a welders tank filled with nitrogen ( it is dryer than
compressed air and has less condensation and water build up ). All gasses
have different "weights" and therefore need to be regulated and fitted
specifically. Using non-specific equipment, you could be flirting with
disaster and putting yourself in harms way. cost for my nitrogen regulator
was $60, welding tank I lease for $55 per year (you can also purchase one),
tank refills $11 (nitrogen is cheaper than compressed air). I don't think
it would be worth all the trouble or money to properly modify and fit a
scuba tank for airbrushing. You may also risk damaging or altering somepart
of the tank making it unusable and hazardous for diving. In my opinion a
few extra dollars is worth avoiding a serious risk.
E. Stafford
RAT-HED Illustration & Design
http://www.geocities.com/soho/atrium/2328
--
E. Stafford
Michael Sawyer
>Being a scuba diver, lets straighten out some problems...
>
>SCUBA tank air is usually between 2,200 and 3,000 PSI...or more,
>depending on the tank, ASSUMING it is filled by a dive shop. The
>compressor is a 4 stage unit...
>
>THE AIR IS ABSOLUTELY DRY...
Plus, especially if you dive non-air mizes sometimes, completly
oil-free, which you are unlikely to get from any conventional
compressor. Not sure how big of a deal a tiny amount of oil would be,
though.
>It is run through condensers etc to dry all possible moisture out of
>it. That's a requirement. and BTW, pure Oxygen at certain pressures
>becomes a deadly poison....you don't hit those pressures at normal
>land levels. Only deep diving...these tanks DO NOT CONTAIN pure oxygen
>as filled by a dive shop, only compressed air. DRY, but compressed.
Well, if they DO contain pure oxygen (I've got a couple SCUBA tanks
full of oxygen now) they should be WELL marked as such. Of course, if
you have a SCUBA tank, you ought to know what's in it at any time.
>The regulator to handle THAT pressure is the equivalent to what is
>required on top of a gas welding outfit, specifically the OXYGEN
>tank.., dropping that pressure is a lot of fun.. they do it in a 2
>stage regulator,, output pressure is usually in to 40psi range..or
>less..
Actually, there is a really easy way to handle it, which is what I
use. Most dive shops have little things you plug into one of the
hoses on the SCUBA regulator (the so-called power-inflator hose) which
then have tire chucks on them, so you can fill tires off the SCUBA
tanks. This hose is already regulated to around 120 to 140 psig, and
you can take apart the thing you buy at the shop, to reveal an
off-the-shelf air chuck and an adaptor which goes from the power
inflator fitting to a standard MPT connector. I put a standard
industrial air fitting on that, then have a small, cheap variable
regulator with the male industrial fitting on it (but could have
screwed it into the power-inflator adaptor directly, just as easily),
that I can set anywhere from 0 to 80 psig, which is more than
acceptable. Using the industrial fitting, I can then take the small
regulator to the lab I work in, which has a central compressed air
system, and plug into that instead of the SCUBA tank only changing
quick-connect fittings.
Since, if you already have a SCUBA tank, you probably have a SCUBA
regulator also, basically all you have to spend it $10 or $15 for the
little fitting (or less if you can find a dive shop willing to order
you just the fitting without the air chuck), then (by memory) $25 or
$30 for the low-pressure regulator, and you have a good source of
well-regulated air which lasts quite a while on a single fill.
Mike
--
Michael Sawyer - My opinions are mine, not necessarily UH's, NSF's, or NASA's
University of Hawaii Physical Oceanography/Satellite Remote Sensing
PGP Key Fingerprint: 87 AA A5 58 0C D4 CB 3E FF 88 0E F6 AB F4 95 34
Kelvin
last under light to moderate use for airbrushing?
Best Regards,
Kelvin
John
allows you to use a car time as a source, I don't see why you couldn't do
a scuba tank.
Any regulator would likely work. Mating the fittings would be the
challenge.
Cal Anderson
get a manifold block that would accept the outlet end of one of the low
pressure
hoses (2nd stage, octopus, buoyancy compansator) and join it to a standard
air
pressure regulator. A good fill on an Alum.80 c.f. is in excess of 3000
lbs.. so it
should last a good long time. As to dangers. If it's a tank that's being
used for
SCUBA and is being filled by a SCUBA dealer then it most be inspected
yearly, hydrostaticly tested every 5 years. Seems safe to me. I'd say if
it's
safe enough to strap to my back and act as my sole supply of air while at
depth, then it's safe to use as an airbrush air source.
On the other hand SCUBA equipment is spendy and needs to be well
maintained.
Air fills around here are $5.00. So unless your fills are free and you got
the equipment
I'd opt for other gases.
About 95% of the time SCUBA tanks are filled with just regular air. The
rest of the time
they will have some additional gases mixed in to provide a diver with a more
suitable
(than standard earth air) breathable gas for the situation in which they are
diving.
However all these gases are BREATHABLE and pose no risks other than the high
pressure at which they are stored.
If you needed too you could hook up your airbrush regulator to the
bouyance compansation
hose. Put on your goggles. Pop the SCUBA regulator in your mouth And youd'
be breathing
fresh air during the whole airbrush session. Hopefully you have proper
ventilation so you won't
require measures this drastic.
Brush away
Cal
John wrote in message <369637EC...@nations.net>...
Kelvin
system that includes clean breathing air! Just throw it on your back and
away you go! Just add a utility belt for storing different paints and a
place to hang you airbrush when not in use. :-)
I could just imagine someone dressed up like this working on a mural
somewhere. Imagine the looks you'd get. Be good for business though I'll
bet! :-)
He he he...
Best Regards,
Kelvin
Smitty
>
> Hmmm... you just came up with a simple, and totally portable airbrushing
> system that includes clean breathing air!
I like the Idea .. but in my part of the country you need to be a
certified diver to buy air ...darn. Any other Ideas for a portable tank.
How long can you paint from one of those 5-6 gal air tanks for sale at
Wal-mart etc.?
Kelvin
Doing light to moderate airbrushing with acrylic paints at around 25 psi
(had a regulator hooked up to it of course), the air would last for 1/2 an
hour if I was lucky. I live in Canada and winters are very cold here. If
you plan on refilling the tank from the local air hose at gas stations, it
can be very hard to find one that isn't frozen up. I tried converting it
into a silent compressor setup using a refrigerator compressor with very
limited success. It only lasted about a month, but I didn't really know
what I was doing.
Best Regards,
Kelvin
Smitty wrote in message <369B71...@sternrubber.com>...
Norvell Maples
> >
> >I like the Idea .. but in my part of the country you need to be a
> >certified diver to buy air ...darn. Any other Ideas for a portable tank.
> >How long can you paint from one of those 5-6 gal air tanks for sale at
> >Wal-mart etc.?
Hummm
There may be a way around all that... I play paintball as well as airbrush and
I know for a fact that I can take one of those Scuba tanks to my local
Paintball field and have it filled with Nitrogen... (breathable air is mostly
Nitrogen anyway) and I don't have to be a certified anything.... most Scuba
tanks should hold up to 3 or 4 thousand psi... witch should last a while
spraying at 25psi.....
NorvMan
Cal Anderson
to see your certification card. In fact if you take your tank in to
someplace
where they can fill with nitrogen they will require you to mark
(paint,sticker,
or other semi-permanent ) your tank as to contents. The hydro inspection
will have to be up to date, and most places wont have the proper yoke at
there nitrogen fill station to fit the SCUBA tank. Unless you've gotten
lucky at a garage sale the hassles of going this way are so high that I can
not imagine why you'd want to persue this. A leased nitrogen cylinder + a
suitable reg. will be so much cheaper and easier. Sure you will not be able
to
supply yourself with my previously suggested fresh air source (I was only
kidding),
but for some more dollars you could try Helium and than if what you are
working on
looks bad you could cheer yourself up by just talking to yourself.
As for old fridge compressors, when running in a fridge they have an oil
that circulates
with the refrigerant. When you try to use one of these without that oil
source they will
eventually run dry. And we all know what happens next.
Norvell Maples wrote in message <369D337C...@arn.net>...
Robert Swinson
with the freon to lube the compressor.
Anthony Correa
safest, most effective solution is: buy an airbrush compressor. I'm not rich;
with two kids and a lot of bills, it was one of the biggest purchases I ever
made (cost more than my '87 Cutlass Jalopy), but I had a reliable,
trouble-free air source that paid for itself quickly. There's no such thing as
a free lunch; the time spent in building one yourself, repairing it every
other day, stiching time when the tank ruptures and opens up your leg, could
be better spent painting. Am I right?
Sean McCaskey
need it for painting many items. I had zero equipment and after some
research and talking to a few folks found the answer for me was a soda
CO2 tank and regulator to drive the brush. The tank and regulator me
very little. (about $80) and refills to about 700psi are about $7.50.
This allows me to paint in the garage with out making much noise and
should last me many months per charge.
Sean
Robert Swinson
refill the tanks when I was a kid working at a drive in theater though I
don't remember the pressure, it was quite high. I'll have to look into that
option here in Florida.
How about temperature of the CO2. Isn't it pretty cold coming out, similar
to CO2 fire extinguishers? I'm working on body painting, that might be too
much for my girl friend to endure for my art/hobby. Also, what effect would
it have on the different paints?
----------
f.ca...@virgin.net
not very artistic unfortunately.
For my air supply I modified an old fire exstinguisher. I stripped it down
modified the top so I can fill it with compressed air using the compressor at
work or an auto tyre pump at the local garage. I have a guage to tell me how
much air pressure is in the cylinder and also a regulator and guage so I can
regulate how much air goes to the air brush. It seem to work fine at present.
Reagrds to all
FRANK
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Sean McCaskey
of the compressed gas coming out, though I do not body paint. I have
use acrylics and some solvent based paints with no problems from the
temp that I can tell. I have sprayed it on my hand and it does not seem
that cold at 25psi... Maybe at HIGH pressure the rate of expansion might
cause it to get really cold. To this point, no ill effects on paint.
Nice thing is CO2 is DRY! No need for moisture trap at all. I suppose
I could have the same tank charged with Nitrogen if I so desired. That
might even be better. I hear it is more temp stable but don't know that
from experience.
All in all, the take is EXACTLY what I need for painting. Your mileage
may vary.
Sean
Anthony Correa
than air and doesn't disperse quickly. Make sure that you have an effective
ventilation system-even if youre using a scuba tank. And wear a mask.
Rich
Best of luck! Be sure to post your results here or at alt.art.bodypainting.
Rich Diltz
The People Painters
www.peoplepainters.com