Torture - American style
j.rennie1
February 11, 2005
OP-ED COLUMNIST
Torture, American Style
By BOB HERBERT
Maher Arar is a 34-year-old native of Syria who emigrated to Canada as a
teenager. On Sept. 26, 2002, as he was returning from a family vacation in
Tunisia, he was seized by American authorities at Kennedy Airport in New
York, where he was in the process of changing planes.
Mr. Arar, a Canadian citizen, was not charged with a crime. But, as Jane
Mayer tells us in a compelling and deeply disturbing article in the current
issue of The New Yorker, he "was placed in handcuffs and leg irons by
plainclothes officials and transferred to an executive jet."
In an instant, Mr. Arar was swept into an increasingly common nightmare,
courtesy of the United States of America. The plane that took off with him
from Kennedy "flew to Washington, continued to Portland, Maine, stopped in
Rome, Italy, then landed in Amman, Jordan."
Any rights Mr. Arar might have thought he had, either as a Canadian citizen
or a human being, had been left behind. At times during the trip, Mr. Arar
heard the pilots and crew identify themselves in radio communications as
members of "the Special Removal Unit." He was being taken, on the orders of
the U.S. government, to Syria, where he would be tortured.
The title of Ms. Mayer's article is "Outsourcing Torture." It's a detailed
account of the frightening and extremely secretive U.S. program known as
"extraordinary rendition."
This is one of the great euphemisms of our time. Extraordinary rendition is
the name that's been given to the policy of seizing individuals without even
the semblance of due process and sending them off to be interrogated by
regimes known to practice torture. In terms of bad behavior, it stands side
by side with contract killings.
Our henchmen in places like Syria, Egypt, Morocco, Uzbekistan and Jordan are
torturing terror suspects at the behest of a nation - the United States -
that just went through a national election in which the issue of moral
values was supposed to have been decisive. How in the world did we become a
country in which gays' getting married is considered an abomination, but
torture is O.K.?
As Ms. Mayer pointed out: "Terrorism suspects in Europe, Africa, Asia and
the Middle East have often been abducted by hooded or masked American
agents, then forced onto a Gulfstream V jet, like the one described by Arar.
... Upon arriving in foreign countries, rendered suspects often vanish.
Detainees are not provided with lawyers, and many families are not informed
of their whereabouts."
Mr. Arar was seized because his name had turned up on a watch list of terror
suspects. He was reported to have been a co-worker of a man in Canada whose
brother was a suspected terrorist.
"Although he initially tried to assert his innocence, he eventually
confessed to anything his tormentors wanted him to say," Ms. Mayer wrote.
The confession under torture was worthless. Syrian officials reported back
to the United States that they could find no links between Mr. Arar and
terrorism. He was released in October 2003 without ever being charged and is
now back in Canada.
Barbara Olshansky is the assistant legal director of the Center for
Constitutional Rights, which is representing Mr. Arar in a lawsuit against
the U.S. I asked her to describe Mr. Arar's physical and emotional state
following his release from custody.
She sounded shaken by the memory. "He's not a big guy," she said. "He had
lost more than 40 pounds. His pallor was terrible, and his eyes were sunken.
He looked like someone who was kind of dead inside."
Any government that commits, condones, promotes or fosters torture is a
malignant force in the world. And those who refuse to raise their voices
against something as clearly evil as torture are enablers, if not
collaborators.
There is a widespread but mistaken notion in the U.S. that everybody seized
by the government in its so-called war on terror is in fact somehow
connected to terrorist activity. That is just wildly wrong.
Tony Blair knows a little about that sort of thing. Just two days ago the
British prime minister formally apologized to 11 people who were wrongfully
convicted and imprisoned for bombings in England by the Irish Republican
Army three decades ago.
Jettisoning the rule of law to permit such acts of evil as kidnapping and
torture is not a defensible policy for a civilized nation. It's wrong. And
nothing good can come from it.
Exador
@ntlworld.com says...
The CO-WORKER of a man whose BROTHER was a SUSPECTED terrorist? Shit,
better start packing for Syria, it could be any one of us next.
>
> "Although he initially tried to assert his innocence, he eventually
> confessed to anything his tormentors wanted him to say," Ms. Mayer wrote.
>
> The confession under torture was worthless. Syrian officials reported back
> to the United States that they could find no links between Mr. Arar and
> terrorism. He was released in October 2003 without ever being charged and is
> now back in Canada.
>
> Barbara Olshansky is the assistant legal director of the Center for
> Constitutional Rights, which is representing Mr. Arar in a lawsuit against
> the U.S. I asked her to describe Mr. Arar's physical and emotional state
> following his release from custody.
>
> She sounded shaken by the memory. "He's not a big guy," she said. "He had
> lost more than 40 pounds. His pallor was terrible, and his eyes were sunken.
> He looked like someone who was kind of dead inside."
>
> Any government that commits, condones, promotes or fosters torture is a
> malignant force in the world. And those who refuse to raise their voices
> against something as clearly evil as torture are enablers, if not
> collaborators.
Indeed. Was this not also Churchill's point in another context?
> There is a widespread but mistaken notion in the U.S. that everybody seized
> by the government in its so-called war on terror is in fact somehow
> connected to terrorist activity. That is just wildly wrong.
>
> Tony Blair knows a little about that sort of thing. Just two days ago the
> British prime minister formally apologized to 11 people who were wrongfully
> convicted and imprisoned for bombings in England by the Irish Republican
> Army three decades ago.
>
> Jettisoning the rule of law to permit such acts of evil as kidnapping and
> torture is not a defensible policy for a civilized nation. It's wrong. And
> nothing good can come from it.
Absolutely correct. The Seppoes are very keen for an authoritarian
regime and good luck to them, but only if they stay in their own country
so the rest of us know to stay away. Fucking wankers.
>
>
>
>
>
--
Cheers,
Craig
Mr Q. Z. Diablo
Exador <vdf...@bgdfgb.com> wrote:
[snip horrifying article]
> Absolutely correct. The Seppoes are very keen for an authoritarian
> regime and good luck to them, but only if they stay in their own country
> so the rest of us know to stay away. Fucking wankers.
Someone tell me that it's not true. Please.
--
Mr Q. Z. D.
j.rennie1
"Exador" <vdf...@bgdfgb.com> wrote in message
news:MPG.1c77a9e9d846f4b39897dc@news-server...
> In article <UI7Pd.1779$ss....@newsfe1-gui.ntli.net>, j.rennie1
> @ntlworld.com says...
>> From the New York Times:
>>
>> February 11, 2005
>> OP-ED COLUMNIST
>> Torture, American Style
>>
>> By BOB HERBERT
>>
>> Jettisoning the rule of law to permit such acts of evil as kidnapping and
>> torture is not a defensible policy for a civilized nation. It's wrong.
>> And
>> nothing good can come from it.
>
> Absolutely correct. The Seppoes are very keen for an authoritarian
> regime and good luck to them, but only if they stay in their own country
> so the rest of us know to stay away. Fucking wankers.
>
> --
> Cheers,
> Craig
Moral considerations aside, didn't you find the Syria tie-up very
peculiar. We aren't told much, us little people.
Exador
@ntlworld.com says...
Not especially. It's another piece of Guantnamo Bay hypocrisy I suspect.
> We aren't told much, us little people.
>
And asked even less.
>
--
Cheers,
Craig
Juergen
"Mr Q. Z. Diablo" <sa...@dodo.com.au> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
news:satan-C1555D.06563912022005@localhost...
Well, Lucifer, that article was quite hung news.
Juergen
j.rennie1
It is special and it explains why Syria wasn't included in the Axis of
whatever
it was. Mind you four doesn't consititute an axis more of a taxis.
j.rennie1
"Mr Q. Z. Diablo" <sa...@dodo.com.au> wrote in message
news:satan-C1555D.06563912022005@localhost...
Can't do that, Mr D. Here is the full
NewYorker article:
http://www.newyorker.com/online/content/?050214on_onlineonly01
Earl Evleth
"j.rennie1" <j.re...@ntlworld.com> wrote:
I am curious as whether our "full support for Bush" people on this
NG will comment.
I have brought up a number of torture related articles over the months
and was the first, here, to object to hooding of prisoners saying
that this was torture and other things would follow as a result.
Richard defended the practice of hooding.
I also commented once that "once you start down the road of torture there
are no stop signs" and you end up going all the way.
Right now I am reading Lorna Rhodes book "Total Confinement, Madness
and Reason in the Maximum Security Prison". The beginning of the
torture road in America began in its prison system. There are no
stop signs so Guantanamo and Abu Ghurayb.
By the way, Barry has been transferred from Clairvaux back to Fresnes
in preparation to go to Caen. They did not mask the prisoners as
Barry indicated would happen. It does happen but did not this time.
The windows of the bus were painted so the prisoners could not look
at at the country side. He was lucky since he was seated behind the driver
and could see some of the world passing. First time in 5 years.
Earl
Al
> I am curious as whether our "full support for Bush" people on this
> NG will comment.
Sure. OK.
> I have brought up a number of torture related articles over the months
> and was the first, here, to object to hooding of prisoners saying
> that this was torture and other things would follow as a result.
> Richard defended the practice of hooding.
Hooding? Ow mah gawd. Real Marquis de Sade kinda stuff here, Cosmo.
Perhaps the PRISONERS should be afforded all of the luxuries fit for a
king... no... wait... dictator... yeah... that's the ticket. Give them
what Sadaam Hussein took from them. Hooding? Chicken Shit. You DO
understand Chicken Shit, right Jaques?
> I also commented once that "once you start down the road of torture there
> are no stop signs" and you end up going all the way.
And we all know, once YOU say something, that's the definitive word.
Don't take yourself so seriously Earl... we don't. Oh, but wait a minute.
I might be all alone here. OK. I don't.
> Right now I am reading Lorna Rhodes book "Total Confinement, Madness
> and Reason in the Maximum Security Prison". The beginning of the
> torture road in America began in its prison system. There are no
> stop signs so Guantanamo and Abu Ghurayb.
Have you ever been to a maximum security prison? I have. Not a pretty
place. Ya really don't want these sick bastards EVER to get out. These
Yo's really need torture. Since they don't get it they get to act like
the animals they are.
> By the way, Barry has been transferred from Clairvaux back to Fresnes
> in preparation to go to Caen. They did not mask the prisoners as
> Barry indicated would happen. It does happen but did not this time.
> The windows of the bus were painted so the prisoners could not look
> at at the country side. He was lucky since he was seated behind the driver
> and could see some of the world passing. First time in 5 years.
Poor Barry. Didn't miss much. I heard it was Interstate highway most of
the way. Not too much to see.
Al
>
> Earl
>
>
>
Jim Noles
accused of actually committing that torture, the idea of sending him
to Syria seems grotesque to me, since he held a valid Canadian
passport, and could have simply been put on a plane to Canada if
deportation was seen necessary, thus allowing Canada to deal with
him if they wished to do so. These are the kinds of instances that
give fodder to those who would argue it is endemic to U.S. responses
since 9/11.
JN
Jim Noles
and see the results. 25,300 hits, dating back at least to Nov 2003.
It happened on Sep 26, 2002. And he was held in Syria for 10 months
before being released to return to Canada. While there is strong
evidence of complicity from Canadian authorities in respect to what
took place. This in no way excuses ANYONE involved in this. See --
http://www.wsws.org/articles/2003/nov2003/can-n18.shtml
JN
Earl Evleth
MPG.1c773bdd4...@news-server.jam.rr.com, "Al" <a...@aohell.com>
wrote:
> In article <BE32DC94.5533D%evl...@wanadoo.fr>, evl...@wanadoo.fr says...
>
>
>> I also commented once that "once you start down the road of torture there
>> are no stop signs" and you end up going all the way.
>
> And we all know, once YOU say something, that's the definitive word.
> Don't take yourself so seriously Earl... we don't. Oh, but wait a minute.
> I might be all alone here. OK. I don't.
Some take torture seriously, apparently others do too.
>
>> Right now I am reading Lorna Rhodes book "Total Confinement, Madness
>> and Reason in the Maximum Security Prison". The beginning of the
>> torture road in America began in its prison system. There are no
>> stop signs so Guantanamo and Abu Ghurayb.
>
> Have you ever been to a maximum security prison?
Yes.
> I have. Not a pretty place.
That is the point, it makes people worse.
> Ya really don't want these sick bastards EVER to get out.
A large number eventually get released, still sick.
Read something and report back.
>> He was lucky since he was seated behind the driver
>> and could see some of the world passing. First time in 5 years.
>
> Poor Barry. Didn't miss much. I heard it was Interstate highway most of
> the way. Not too much to see.
>
Which route are you talking about? It is not an "interstate", no such
road types exists in France, we have autoroutes, nationals and
departmentals.
The route from Clairvaux into the the Parisian region is A5 for about
2 hours, another hour to Fresnes, south of Paris. The A5 route is
pretty, although less so in the winter with most of the trees without
leaves. However, unlike the northern regions of the US, Northern France
has green ground cover. Along A5 one sees a number of birds, including
hawks and crows. it is not devoid of visual interest.
From the Clairvaux prison cells one can see the surrounding forested
country side. From an American supermax, no windows give a view of the sky
or the surroundings. Total isolation. All lighting is artificial Even
the American supermax exercise yards are covered.
Clairvaux is one of the two top high security prisons in France. There
are no supermax facilities in France. I don`t no of any in Europe.
Why Is that?
Perhaps you can try and make a funny statement about that? Ha Ha??
Earl
Donna Evleth
> From: Al <a...@aohell.com>
> Organization: Road Runner High Speed Online http://www.rr.com
> Newsgroups: alt.activism.death-penalty
> Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2005 04:04:03 GMT
> Subject: Re: Torture - American style
>
> Have you ever been to a maximum security prison? I have. Not a pretty
> place. Ya really don't want these sick bastards EVER to get out. These
> Yo's really need torture. Since they don't get it they get to act like
> the animals they are.
Barry was in a maximum security prison, one of the three in France. We
visited him there every two weeks for six years. In the visiting room
everyone was together, all the prisoners, all the visitors, no glass walls
between prisoners and visitors. We never met anybody who looked like he
needed torture (please describe these for me, so I will recognize them the
next time I am in a prison visiting room). There were, however, a number of
babies conceived in the visiting room. Maybe maximum security prisons in
France are different. I don't know. You tell me about your experience so I
can relate.
Donna Evleth
Al
Atlanta Federal Penetentiary
Atlanta, Georgia
I went INTO lockup, not some comfy VISITING room laid out with sofas and
chairs and pastel painted walls. It was 1978, almost thirty f_cking years
ago and the prisoners THEN acted as if they were in Africa swinging from
tree to tree with what little room they had. I cannot, for the life of
me, imagine what that hell hole is like today. If it IS any worse, THAT
is my reasoning for some sort or mild form of torture. I think our
society is owed that kind of justice, for there are psychopaths living in
this country going unchecked and treated as though their crimes were as
insignificant as Jaywalking. Some cry out that we "are a civilized
society" and we shouldn't bring ourselves to the level of the criminal by
harming "him" in any way. That's EXACTLY why our countries are in the
shape they are. "We" coddle the criminal as if what he did or who he is,
is not necessarily "his" fault. BULLSHIT!
Al
j.rennie1
"Al" <a...@aohell.com> wrote in message
news:MPG.1c7920732...@news-server.jam.rr.com...
Pleased to have you with us, Al. You're like breath of fresh air. Can't
make out what that supposed epithet 'f_cking' is though - is it facking, or
focking? Surely you don't mean fucking - if you did you're a c_nt!
Donna Evleth
> From: Al <a...@aohell.com>
> Organization: Road Runner High Speed Online http://www.rr.com
> Newsgroups: alt.activism.death-penalty
> Date: Sun, 13 Feb 2005 14:32:11 GMT
So tell us exactly what you saw in 1978. Details, please, details. While
waiting, let me tell you that you have told us little about the prisoners
you saw, but a lot about yourself.
You tell us that in 1978, the prisoners "THEN acted as if they were in
Africa swinging from tree to tree with what little room they had." This
comment could be construed by some as racist.
You think our society is owed some "mild form of torture." Nobody is owed
torture. Period. End of report. People who believe this are sticking a
knife right into the heart of democratic rule of law. Democracy and the
rule of law are what make our society great. Torture is not.
Your use of the term "coddling criminals" tells me about your right-wing
political opinions. I'm surprised you didn't come up with the usual whine
about prisoners having TV.
One final word. It would have been really nice if the visiting room at
Clairvaux had had sofas. The chairs were plastic, sometimes cracked, and
the walls, albeit once painted pastel, were peeling.
We have left the maximum security prison now, but are still visiting the
prisoner. Our current visiting conditions are in "comfy" cubicles, supplied
with backless stools, and although the rules allow for three visitors during
any one 45 minute visiting period, there is room for just two people, and
even that is very tight. No sofas, no chairs, no pastel paint (off-white,
very off-white). But this place, where we already visited six years ago,
has made a major improvement. There is now light in the visiting booths.
But do tell us about the details of your visit(s) to lockup in 1978. All
the gory details.
Donna Evleth
>
>
>
Mr Q. Z. Diablo
Donna Evleth <dev...@wanadoo.fr> wrote:
> You tell us that in 1978, the prisoners "THEN acted as if they were in
> Africa swinging from tree to tree with what little room they had." This
> comment could be construed by some as racist.
Let's not mince words, Donna - it _was_ racist. Sweet Jebus, you are
giving this odious little waste of skin far more of your valuable time
than he deserves.
> You think our society is owed some "mild form of torture." Nobody is owed
> torture. Period. End of report. People who believe this are sticking a
> knife right into the heart of democratic rule of law. Democracy and the
> rule of law are what make our society great. Torture is not.
And it is _not_negotiable_ if said democratic society is to continue to
function as a viable democracy.
Al
j.re...@ntlworld.com says...
The pleasure is all mine, I'm sure. I really don't mean to be a breath of
fresh air. You're too kind. I'm hoping to be the nastiest morning-breath
after a night on the town. You know the smell... Merlot, then escargot,
then oral sex with a prostitute from a ghetto in Paris.
No, I don't mean fucking. Fucking is a present tense verb. I really meant
facking. I apologize. Nah... I don't. I AM a cunt, pure and simple.
Hopefully, I breathe some more nastiness and you can come up with another
colorful metaphor for me.
Al
Mr Q. Z. Diablo
Al <a...@aohell.com> wrote:
I AM a cunt, pure and simple.
Cunts are quite nice.
You're a trailer-dwelling, sister-shagging spastic.
he_who_spanks_nazi_scum
>Why, Jon ? So that you can continue to believe naÃvely that the United
>States is in some way a 'great country', and that really, the horrific,
>revolting and shameful abuses of human rights that we've seen are the
>exception and not the rule ?
>
>Disabuse yourself of such a notion, my friend. Abuses are not being
>exposed now because they are only happening now. They are being brought to
>the attention of the public because public access to mass media such as the
>Internet is at a never-before attained level.
>
>The United States is an empire, and a belligerent one at that. Empires
>violate their victims' human rights, which in the case of the United States
>is no more than we expect anyway from the 'civilised' world's most flagrant
>and unremorseful executor of child offenders, the mentally retarded, and
>innocent members of racial minorities.
>
>In short, these abuses are not happening in spite of 'American' (sic)
>values, but _because_of_them_ . These _are_ 'American' (sic) values, and
>the ideas cherished by all too many Anglo-Saxons that the United States is
>really 'good', but that occasionally they go off the tracks, is
>fundamentally wrong. The real 'evil empire' is the United States.
Just as long as you are speaking subjectively. Since everyone knows
you don't have a brain in your head.
JN
>
>--
>D...@zeouane.org
>Jewish and Proud of It
You're not Jewish, Desmond. John Rennie, who knows you personally,
has stated that you told him you are not Jewish. And who could possibly
believe YOU... against John Rennie? Especially after your first words to
him were that he had no "right" to reveal you are not Jewish, and then
attack him in claiming he had previously used "blackmail" on you. I
believe you rather let the cat out of the bag, in not actually denying his
comment, but insisting that he had no "right" to expose your lie. See --
http://groups-beta.google.com/group/alt.activism.death-penalty/msg/9e297a0656d18734
he_who_spanks_nazi_scum
>j.rennie1 <j.re...@ntlworld.com> wrote:
>
>> From the New York Times:
>>
>> February 11, 2005 OP-ED COLUMNIST Torture, American Style
>>
>> By BOB HERBERT
>>
>> Maher Arar is a 34-year-old native of Syria who emigrated to Canada as a
>> teenager. On Sept. 26, 2002, as he was returning from a family vacation
>> in Tunisia, he was seized by American authorities at Kennedy Airport in
>> New York, where he was in the process of changing planes.
>>
>> Mr. Arar, a Canadian citizen, was not charged with a crime. But, as Jane
>> Mayer tells us in a compelling and deeply disturbing article in the
>> current issue of The New Yorker, he "was placed in handcuffs and leg
>> irons by plainclothes officials and transferred to an executive jet."
>>
>> In an instant, Mr. Arar was swept into an increasingly common nightmare,
>> courtesy of the United States of America. The plane that took off with
>> him from Kennedy "flew to Washington, continued to Portland, Maine,
>> stopped in Rome, Italy, then landed in Amman, Jordan."
>>
>> Any rights Mr. Arar might have thought he had, either as a Canadian
>> citizen or a human being, had been left behind. At times during the trip,
>> Mr. Arar heard the pilots and crew identify themselves in radio
>> communications as members of "the Special Removal Unit." He was being
>> taken, on the orders of the U.S. government, to Syria, where he would be
>> tortured.
>
>Hmm ... I can't see any comment from Shit-For-Brains on this.
>
>Come on, Super-Retard ... this is the 'America' (sic) that you believe is
>'superior' [1]. Let's hear what you have to say about it.
See --
http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/world/la-fg-unsex12feb12,1,308473.story?coll=la-headlines-world&ctrack=1&cset=true
What's your opinion of Didier Bourguet? Oh... I forgot... you see
nothing wrong with sex with children not yet considered adults in
International law.
JN
Alley
says...
Al
Alley
says...
deemocracy, senor. Eet eez a Republic.
Al
David Haley
scribe:
Ohhhh, so it's ok to torture people and ignore fundamental liberties, then.
*smacks head* Why didn't I figure that out myself?
--
~david-haley
david-...@the-haleys.com
(no unmunging necessary)
---------------------------
Exador
use...@the-haleys.com says...
--
Cheers,
Craig
Mr Q. Z. Diablo
Alley <a...@aohell.com> wrote:
She prefers Homo sapiens to Pan troglogdytes so it looks like you're
plumb out of luck, redneck. Perhaps you'd like to fuck my neighbour's
dog? More your thing, I'm sure.
Alley
> In article <MPG.1c7dcc43c...@news-server.jam.rr.com>,
> Alley <a...@aohell.com> wrote:
>
> > In article <satan-042395.07530114022005@localhost>, sa...@dodo.com.au
> > says...
> > > In article <MPG.1c7977ad4...@news-server.jam.rr.com>,
> > > Al <a...@aohell.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > I AM a cunt, pure and simple.
> > >
> > > Cunts are quite nice.
> > >
> > > You're a trailer-dwelling, sister-shagging spastic.
> > >
> > >
> > I don't have a sister. Yours available? I treat her real good.
>
> She prefers Homo sapiens to Pan troglogdytes so it looks like you're
> plumb out of luck, redneck. Perhaps you'd like to fuck my neighbour's
> dog? More your thing, I'm sure.
It's so hilarious to see how brain washed your people are. Watched any
good movies lately... perhaps Deliverance? Maybe TV is your bag. Any
Dukes of Hazzard fans out there? Puhleaze. Mindless dweeeb. Get a mind of
your own and quit listening to self-hating, low self esteem liberals.
Al
Alley
Too eezy... but can't reezeest. You are a Scheißekopf. So fun trolling
for dummies. I've got plenty of bait left. Reel em in boys.
Al
David Haley
scribe:
I guess I should give you what you ask for, then.
*plonk*
Cerberus
snip
Alley said of Mr Q.Z.Diablo
> Get a mind of your own and quit listening to self-hating, low self esteem liberals.
That's fucking well torn it.
In addition to Mr Q. (who is exactly as you say, Alley), may I
introduce you to Exador, who is another well known liberal.
These two gentlemen (well, boys they are actually), I am sure will be
delighted to engage in intercourse with you. In fact, I suspect that
they would be willing to engage in intercourse with anybody.
Just to give you a small insight into their respective backgrounds I
have to say that both of them are failed Labour voters.
Now do you see what I mean? Need I say any more? Can you believe it?
With that sort of history hanging over their heads, can we blame them
for being insipid, flaccid, self-hating, low self esteem liberals? Yes
of course we can....and I want to hear you do it to them.
Any way I just wanted to say that I agree with you and I think that
both of these gentlemen deserve a right royal seeing-to, and I think
you are just the gel to do it to them. After you play with them for a
while and give them the public thrashing they so clearly deserve, I
have a few more of similar bent that I can introduce you to. These
vermin infect our European chapter and go by the names of Rennie,
Coughlan and dirtdog. Rabid liberals they are and they need someone
strong to stand up to them, and to explain to them the error of their
ways.
By the way, I have switched on the special privacy feature or cloaking
device of my browser, and you and I are the only ones that can see
this message. Just be careful that you don't respond to this message
otherwise everyone will see it, and our little plot will be undone.
Just email me if you need any further info, or just post a new thread
with the subject line containing the words 'Message Received'.
Good luck Alley, and God bless.
Your friend and secret admirer,
Cerby
--
WooF w00f WooF
Mr Q. Z. Diablo
Alley <a...@aohell.com> wrote:
> In article <satan-C506A2.07231618022005@localhost>, sa...@dodo.com.au
> says...
> > In article <MPG.1c7dcc43c...@news-server.jam.rr.com>,
> > Alley <a...@aohell.com> wrote:
> >
> > > In article <satan-042395.07530114022005@localhost>, sa...@dodo.com.au
> > > says...
> > > > In article <MPG.1c7977ad4...@news-server.jam.rr.com>,
> > > > Al <a...@aohell.com> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > I AM a cunt, pure and simple.
> > > >
> > > > Cunts are quite nice.
> > > >
> > > > You're a trailer-dwelling, sister-shagging spastic.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > I don't have a sister. Yours available? I treat her real good.
> >
> > She prefers Homo sapiens to Pan troglogdytes so it looks like you're
> > plumb out of luck, redneck. Perhaps you'd like to fuck my neighbour's
> > dog? More your thing, I'm sure.
>
> It's so hilarious to see how brain washed your people are. Watched any
> good movies lately... perhaps Deliverance? Maybe TV is your bag. Any
> Dukes of Hazzard fans out there? Puhleaze. Mindless dweeeb. Get a mind of
> your own and quit listening to self-hating, low self esteem liberals.
I guess that's a "yes". You going in from behind or don't you want to
miss out on the kissing?
David Haley
to scribe:
>On Sat, 19 Feb 2005 02:22:40 GMT, Alley <a...@aohell.com> wrote:
>
>snip
>
>Alley said of Mr Q.Z.Diablo
>
>> Get a mind of your own and quit listening to self-hating, low self esteem liberals.
>
>
>That's fucking well torn it.
>
>In addition to Mr Q. (who is exactly as you say, Alley), may I
>introduce you to Exador, who is another well known liberal.
>
>These two ge
That's funny - this message showed up in my reader but most of it seems to be
missing... I wonder if the nntp server is having troubles... :)
John Rennie
"Cerberus" <ce...@hades.org> wrote in message
news:73nd11tke6kkje4va...@4ax.com...
snip
>These
> vermin infect our European chapter and go by the names of Rennie,
> Coughlan and dirtdog. Rabid liberals they are
You go too far, Cerby. I'm a failed communist
and don't you forget it.
Alley
> In article <MPG.1c805e6a5...@news-server.jam.rr.com>,
> Alley <a...@aohell.com> wrote:
>
> > In article <satan-C506A2.07231618022005@localhost>, sa...@dodo.com.au
> > says...
> > > In article <MPG.1c7dcc43c...@news-server.jam.rr.com>,
> > > Alley <a...@aohell.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > > In article <satan-042395.07530114022005@localhost>, sa...@dodo.com.au
> > > > says...
> > > > > In article <MPG.1c7977ad4...@news-server.jam.rr.com>,
> > > > > Al <a...@aohell.com> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > I AM a cunt, pure and simple.
> > > > >
> > > > > Cunts are quite nice.
> > > > >
> > > > > You're a trailer-dwelling, sister-shagging spastic.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > I don't have a sister. Yours available? I treat her real good.
> > >
> > > She prefers Homo sapiens to Pan troglogdytes so it looks like you're
> > > plumb out of luck, redneck. Perhaps you'd like to fuck my neighbour's
> > > dog? More your thing, I'm sure.
> >
> > It's so hilarious to see how brain washed your people are. Watched any
> > good movies lately... perhaps Deliverance? Maybe TV is your bag. Any
> > Dukes of Hazzard fans out there? Puhleaze. Mindless dweeeb. Get a mind of
> > your own and quit listening to self-hating, low self esteem liberals.
>
> I guess that's a "yes". You going in from behind or don't you want to
> miss out on the kissing?
>
>
All I ask for is a good reach around.
Al
Alley
Don't flatter yourself. You plonking ANYONE doesn't make you some
omnipotent being. Besides, just because you write the word *plonk*
EVERYONE knows that you will still be waiting with baited breath to see
how I respond to this "plonking". Well, I for one, also know that you
will forever look forward to my postings because you need me. Your little
world would just not be complete unless you were arguing or responding to
someone responding to that liberal shit you write. That's the rub here. I
think you liberals write or say the shit you do JUST to get a response,
for it somehow validates your pathetic insignificant existence...
otherwise, who would give a shit about you and your ideals... your mama?
Sorry, she don't wanna breast feed you no more neither(been called a
redneck... might as well write like one). BTW, the "you's" and "your's"
were editorial... I'm covering all "you" liberals.
Al
Mr Q. Z. Diablo
Alley <a...@aohell.com> wrote:
> Don't flatter yourself. You plonking ANYONE doesn't make you some
> omnipotent being. Besides, just because you write the word *plonk*
> EVERYONE knows that you will still be waiting with baited breath to see
> how I respond to this "plonking".
You flatter yourself, you trailer-dwelling mutant. As soon as people
get bored with mocking you, they killfile you and pay you no heed ever
again. That's your fate. Live with it, you nobody.
AlleyCat
says...
Here's me an my sister/wife. I'm not a nobody to her, mister.
Al
Jim Noles
Now you've gone and given Desmond a woody... you should be ashamed
of yourself.... I imagine that Desmond will use that picture as his new
screen saver. He loves violence... and especially violence portrayed
against women. He's a Muslim at heart... you have any Muslim in
you, tough guy?
JN
> Al
Donna Evleth
> From: Alley <a...@aohell.com>
> Organization: Road Runner High Speed Online http://www.rr.com
> Newsgroups: alt.activism.death-penalty
> Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 03:37:20 GMT
> Subject: Re: Torture - American style
>
If it is a Republic why does its President, Mr. Bush, keep talking all the
time about democracy? Are you trying to tell us that you can't have
democracy in a Republic? Would you like to repeat that to President Bush?
I'm sure he would be delighted to hear one of his loyal followers spouting
such a line.
Another thing you are is a disgusting racist. Can the phony Spanish accent.
Donna Evleth
Donna Evleth
Alley
Eet eez you, ma'am, that eez thee raceest. Who said anytheeng about
Spanish? If by reeding thees, you deeduce that eet eez Spaneesh, maybee
eet eez you who needs to look witheen and change your preedilections.
I meerly stateed that we leeve in a Republic. That eez thee form of
governmeent. You can be haveeng democracee in a Republeek, senora. You
have been trolled again, you must like ceegar minnows.
Al
> Donna Evleth
>
> Donna Evleth
>
>
Donna Evleth
> From: Alley <a...@aohell.com>
> Organization: Road Runner High Speed Online http://www.rr.com
> Newsgroups: alt.activism.death-penalty
> Date: Sun, 20 Feb 2005 16:55:52 GMT
*Plonk*
Donna Evleteh
Mr Q. Z. Diablo
Alley <a...@aohell.com> wrote:
[snip unilateral claim of victory combined with "I trolled you"
stupidity]
My neighbour's dog informs me that you had a small cock and came too
quickly.
--
Mr Q. Z. D.
Remove luncheonmeat (truncheon) to reply.
Exador
satan.not...@dodo.com.au says...
> In article <MPG.1c827c395...@news-server.jam.rr.com>,
> Alley <a...@aohell.com> wrote:
>
> [snip unilateral claim of victory combined with "I trolled you"
> stupidity]
>
> My neighbour's dog informs me that you had a small cock and came too
> quickly.
>
>
--
Cheers,
Craig
Alley
> Alley <a...@aohell.com> wrote:
>
> [snip unilateral claim of victory combined with "I trolled you"
> stupidity]
>
> My neighbour's dog informs me that you had a small cock and came too
> quickly.
>
>
The bitch was a Great Dane. Anyone would have been smallish to her... the
big mouth. And I have YOU to thank for such a lousy time, setting me up
with a nut like that. Thanks a lot.
Al
Alley
Well, just like a good liberali, she ducks and runs. At least she didn't
attack me on a personal level like most libs do ;)
Al
Mr Q. Z. Diablo
Alley <a...@aohell.com> wrote:
> Well, just like a good liberali, she ducks and runs. At least she didn't
> attack me on a personal level like most libs do ;)
Are you aware of why you are "[attacked]...on a personal level" by "most
libs"?
It is, purely and simply, because you offer nothing by way of argument
and are just a plaything.
Being a nobody is difficult to accept. The rest of us managed it a
while ago. I suggest that you try to do the same.
John Rennie
"Mr Q. Z. Diablo" <satan.not...@dodo.com.au> wrote in message
news:satan.notinnedmeat-0DE67F.12314222022005@localhost...
The rest of us? Maybe you, Donna and me. The rest have some way to go.
Alley
satan.not...@dodo.com.au says...
> In article <MPG.1c84434f7...@news-server.jam.rr.com>,
> Alley <a...@aohell.com> wrote:
>
> > Well, just like a good liberali, she ducks and runs. At least she didn't
> > attack me on a personal level like most libs do ;)
In this statement I was being very facetious. She HAS attacked me, but I
am not complaining, really.
>
> Are you aware of why you are "[attacked]...on a personal level" by "most
> libs"?
>
> It is, purely and simply, because you offer nothing by way of argument
> and are just a plaything.
I do have very much to offer. I had a brother that was murdered back in
1993. I DO have an opinion on the death penalty. Most of what I was
acting the troll on, was off-topic items.
>
> Being a nobody is difficult to accept. The rest of us managed it a
> while ago. I suggest that you try to do the same.
I am not a nobody, and I'm not saying that with righteous indignation. I
really AM somebody. Of course it would be asinine to reveal myself. I may
have given myself no chance of any form of dialog with anyone here, but
that is my problem... I can accept that.
Al
Mr Q. Z. Diablo
Alley <a...@aohell.com> wrote:
> In article <satan.notinnedmeat-0DE67F.12314222022005@localhost>,
> satan.not...@dodo.com.au says...
> > In article <MPG.1c84434f7...@news-server.jam.rr.com>,
> > Alley <a...@aohell.com> wrote:
> >
> > > Well, just like a good liberali, she ducks and runs. At least she didn't
> > > attack me on a personal level like most libs do ;)
>
> In this statement I was being very facetious. She HAS attacked me, but I
> am not complaining, really.
>
> >
> > Are you aware of why you are "[attacked]...on a personal level" by "most
> > libs"?
> >
> > It is, purely and simply, because you offer nothing by way of argument
> > and are just a plaything.
>
> I do have very much to offer. I had a brother that was murdered back in
> 1993. I DO have an opinion on the death penalty. Most of what I was
> acting the troll on, was off-topic items.
>
> >
> > Being a nobody is difficult to accept. The rest of us managed it a
> > while ago. I suggest that you try to do the same.
>
> I am not a nobody, and I'm not saying that with righteous indignation. I
> really AM somebody.
No you are not. You are a nobody, just like the rest of us.
> Of course it would be asinine to reveal myself.
Asinine it may be but that would not be at odds with your current
behaviour.
> I may
> have given myself no chance of any form of dialog with anyone here, but
> that is my problem... I can accept that.
You have hurt your chances rather badly; let's just put it that way.
John Rennie
"Alley" <a...@aohell.com> wrote in message
news:MPG.1c8584e3...@news-server.jam.rr.com...
When you realise that you ARE a nobody then you might have a slender chance
to be a real somebody. We have potential Head-of-State who doesn't realise
that he is a nobody so you've got company.
David Haley
<jo...@rennie69.wanadoo.co.uk> saw fit to scribe:
>
>"Alley" <a...@aohell.com> wrote in message
>news:MPG.1c8584e3...@news-server.jam.rr.com...
>> In article <satan.notinnedmeat-0DE67F.12314222022005@localhost>,
>> satan.not...@dodo.com.au says...
>>> In article <MPG.1c84434f7...@news-server.jam.rr.com>,
>>> Alley <a...@aohell.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> > Well, just like a good liberali, she ducks and runs. At least she
>>> > didn't
>>> > attack me on a personal level like most libs do ;)
>>
>> In this statement I was being very facetious. She HAS attacked me, but I
>> am not complaining, really.
>>
>>>
>>> Are you aware of why you are "[attacked]...on a personal level" by "most
>>> libs"?
>>>
>>> It is, purely and simply, because you offer nothing by way of argument
>>> and are just a plaything.
>>
>> I do have very much to offer. I had a brother that was murdered back in
>> 1993. I DO have an opinion on the death penalty. Most of what I was
>> acting the troll on, was off-topic items.
>>
>>>
>>> Being a nobody is difficult to accept. The rest of us managed it a
>>> while ago. I suggest that you try to do the same.
>>
>> I am not a nobody, and I'm not saying that with righteous indignation. I
>> really AM somebody. Of course it would be asinine to reveal myself. I may
>> have given myself no chance of any form of dialog with anyone here, but
>> that is my problem... I can accept that.
Starting out as a nutty troll certainly isn't the best way to show oneself as
having a glimmer of intelligence. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and
remove you from my killfile but if you're only out to troll, don't expect 'any
form of dialog' from me.
>When you realise that you ARE a nobody then you might have a slender chance
>to be a real somebody. We have potential Head-of-State who doesn't realise
>that he is a nobody so you've got company.
In any case trying to be 'somebody' while posting anonymously is plainly and
simply ridiculous. It's bad enough trying to be somebody as is much less if
you're just one anonymous screen name amongst all the others.
Oh yeah, I forgot to tell y'all before, I'm actually somebody really important
in 'real life'... so dontcha'll be messing with me!