New brekkie place...

[John Williamson]

A new Oatcake shop has just opened near my gaff, Called Oatbakes. About
200 yards from the Trent and Mersey at Longport. Open Wednesday to Sunday.

Not bad at all.

For those not in the know, Staffordshire oatcakes are like a pancake,
but made using oatmeal flour, and are nothing like the Scottish or Wocab
ones.

Anyone near Longport in Stoke on Trent look for Oatbakes, sort of semi
hidden down a side street near the station. No website yet...

As always, the BBC make a major production of the recipe, but if you
ignore the waiting time as the batter matures, to make the basic
oatcakes takes about ten minutes to mix, and less than five to cook on a
griddle. I roll 'em up and fill mine with cheese, and also like them
with a just a smear of butter and Marmite. Bacon and sossidges are also
a good way to fill 'em.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/food/recipes/staffordshireoatcake_92371
--
Tciao for Now!

John.

[Tease'n'Seize]

John Williamson wrote:

> A new Oatcake shop has just opened near my gaff, Called Oatbake s.

^
looks like you dropped this R

[John Williamson]

Nope. The shop is called Oatbakes. I suspect a pune, or play on worms,
as they make and sell oatcakes.

[RustyHinge]

I trust the 'R' doesn't suggest 'swot goes in a bait-station?

--
Rusty Hinge
To err is human. To really foul things up requires a computer and the BOFH.

[John Williamson]

On 22/09/2021 11:08, RustyHinge wrote:
> On 22/09/2021 10:15, John Williamson wrote:
>> On 22/09/2021 10:11, Tease'n'Seize wrote:
>>> John Williamson wrote:
>>>
>>>> A new Oatcake shop has just opened near my gaff, Called Oatbake s.
>>> ^
>>> looks like you dropped this R
>>>
>> Nope. The shop is called Oatbakes. I suspect a pune, or play on worms,
>> as they make and sell oatcakes.
>>
> I trust the 'R' doesn't suggest 'swot goes in a bait-station?
>

There were no "raisins" visible on site...

[Tease'n'Seize]

Hmm, I searched GWGL maps for longport, and without any mention of oatcakes etc,
it highlighted a shop called "Oatbakers Ltd", maybe it has a sneaky peek at
companies house?

<https://find-and-update.company-information.service.gov.uk/company/13004378>

[John Williamson]

On 22/09/2021 14:46, Tease'n'Seize wrote:

> Hmm, I searched GWGL maps for longport, and without any mention of
> oatcakes etc, it highlighted a shop called "Oatbakers Ltd", maybe it has
> a sneaky peek at companies house?
>
> <https://find-and-update.company-information.service.gov.uk/company/13004378>
>
>

Be's impressed.

Most places like that start as sole traders.

[Kerr-Mudd, John]

It's time a branch opened in Oatengates.

--
Bah, and indeed Humbug.

[RustyHinge]

I was looking at the wrong end of the worm since you hfrq a capital -
Ratbake...

[John Williamson]

On 22/09/2021 18:04, RustyHinge wrote:
> On 22/09/2021 12:43, John Williamson wrote:
>> On 22/09/2021 11:08, RustyHinge wrote:
>>> On 22/09/2021 10:15, John Williamson wrote:
>>>> On 22/09/2021 10:11, Tease'n'Seize wrote:
>>>>> John Williamson wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> A new Oatcake shop has just opened near my gaff, Called Oatbake s.
>>>>> ^
>>>>> looks like you dropped this R
>>>>>
>>>> Nope. The shop is called Oatbakes. I suspect a pune, or play on worms,
>>>> as they make and sell oatcakes.
>>>>
>>> I trust the 'R' doesn't suggest 'swot goes in a bait-station?
>>>
>> There were no "raisins" visible on site...
>>
> I was looking at the wrong end of the worm since you hfrq a capital -
> Ratbake...
>

Furry snuff, but no dwarves are involved.

[Nicholas D. Richards]

In article <ir09ls...@mid.individual.net>, John Williamson
<johnwil...@btinternet.com> on Wed, 22 Sep 2021 at 10:00:41 awoke
Nicholas from his slumbers and wrote

I have not had these particular oatcakes. Personally I like to make my
own and you do not even have to get dressed. Additionally my own has no
milk in it (being lactose intolerant). Mix the dry ingredients the night
before, adding liquids as soon as you are awake. Leave for an hour, for
the yeast to work, while you wash yourself, get the bacon ready, make
the coffees and warm a little Golden Syrup. Beoootiful and you are still
warm and dry.
--
0sterc@tcher -

"Oů sont les neiges d'antan?"

[John Williamson]

Allegedly, these came back with soldiers from India who had been given
Naan breads?, adapted to suit the local grain.

The BBC recipe seems to be adapted for home making, the ones they sell
in the shops use batter made by the gallon, prepared at stupid o'clock
in the morning, and there is about two ounces of batter per oatcake. The
shops all have their own recipes and cooking times, so they are all
slightly different.

The griddles they use cook them about 50 at a time, and the operator is
kept busy turning them over, as they only take a couple of minutes to
cook. The gas pipe is about two inches in diameter...

[RustyHinge]

On 24/09/2021 10:12, John Williamson wrote:

/flapjack oatcakes/

>>
> Allegedly, these came back with soldiers from India who had been given
> Naan breads?, adapted to suit the local grain.
>
> The BBC recipe seems to be adapted for home making, the ones they sell
> in the shops use batter made by the gallon, prepared at stupid o'clock
> in the morning, and there is about two ounces of batter per oatcake. The
> shops all have their own recipes and cooking times, so they are all
> slightly different.
>
> The griddles they use cook them about 50 at a time, and the operator is
> kept busy turning them over, as they only take a couple of minutes to
> cook. The gas pipe is about two inches in diameter...

When I left jbex at the Stag Bakery in Stornowy in another life after
the baking of industrial quantities of bread, the orning shift were
making pancakes on a hootering-great long table with a top molished of
inch (or more) thick cast iron, ground flat, someone would be scooping
batter from a big bin with their bare hands and squeezing a dollop onto
the hot surface, then, as you describe, flipping them, removing and
stacking them, beginagin.

Dunno how much that griddle weighed, but it must have approached a ton.

[John Williamson]

Dat's da bunny. The oatcake shops now have a machine to dispense the batter.

[Sam Plusnet]

On 24/09/2021 10:12, John Williamson wrote: (of oatcakes)

>>
> Allegedly, these came back with soldiers from India who had been given
> Naan breads?, adapted to suit the local grain.
>

I shall file this alongside the statement that Worcestershire sauce was
a home made substitute for those who had become fond of soy sauce.

[John Williamson]

<Grin>

[Andrew Marshall]

On 24/09/2021 20:14, Sam Plusnet wrote:

<chuckle> Yesterday I received a parcel containing a plentiful new
supply of my favourite Indonesian sweet soy sauce (kecap manis) of which
I had nearly run out, and of which I found a supplier from which I could
order over the phone.

I don't like Worcs. sauce at all, but I do very much like kecap manis,
which I use as a table sauce on meats (both hot and cold), fish, chips
and hash browns.

--
Regards,
Andrew.

[Ben Newsam]

Andrew Marshall wrote, though the Organization header says "Y Ddraenog
Goch":

>I don't like Worcs. sauce at all

I don't think that Worcs. sauce is something that one "likes" exactly,
but certain things, like a Bloody Mary or even just plain tomato
juice, wouldn't be quite the same without it.

From Three Men In a Boat:
"If Harris’s eyes fill with tears, you can bet it is because Harris
has been eating raw onions, or has put too much Worcester over his
chop."
--
Ben

[Andrew Marshall]

On 25/09/2021 08:42, Ben Newsam wrote:
> Andrew Marshall wrote, though the Organization header says "Y Ddraenog
> Goch":
>> I don't like Worcs. sauce at all

> I don't think that Worcs. sauce is something that one "likes" exactly,
> but certain things, like a Bloody Mary or even just plain tomato
> juice, wouldn't be quite the same without it.

As I cannot abide tomatoes, that's not something I could comment on. I
certainly wouldn't want it on/in other comestibles, though.

> From Three Men In a Boat:
> "If Harris’s eyes fill with tears, you can bet it is because Harris
> has been eating raw onions, or has put too much Worcester over his
> chop."

Kecap manis goes very nicely for me with chops, but Worcester would ruin
them.

--
Regards,
Andrew.

[Tease'n'Seize]

Andrew Marshall wrote:

> Yesterday I received a parcel containing a plentiful new supply of my favourite
> Indonesian sweet soy sauce (kecap manis) of which I had nearly run out, and of
> which I found a supplier from which I could order over the phone.

'tis available at Sainsers ...

[RustyHinge]

On 25/09/2021 08:42, Ben Newsam wrote:

'chop', of course, in the West African sense of food?

[RustyHinge]

On 25/09/2021 09:18, Andrew Marshall wrote:
> On 25/09/2021 08:42, Ben Newsam wrote:
>> Andrew Marshall wrote, though the Organization header says "Y Ddraenog
>> Goch":
>>> I don't like Worcs. sauce at all
>
>> I don't think that Worcs. sauce is something that one "likes" exactly,
>> but certain things, like a Bloody Mary or even just plain tomato
>> juice, wouldn't be quite the same without it.
>
> As I cannot abide tomatoes, that's not something I could comment on. I
> certainly wouldn't want it on/in other comestibles, though.

Have you tried a really good tomato like 'Shirley', 'Alicante', or
similar, picked fresh and ripe and still warm from the sun?

>>  From Three Men In a Boat:
>> "If Harris’s eyes fill with tears, you can bet it is because Harris
>> has been eating raw onions, or has put too much Worcester over his
>> chop."
>
> Kecap manis goes very nicely for me with chops, but Worcester would ruin
> them.

Must remember that. Wodjer say? Kneecap mania? I'm a little hard of
hearing you know.

[VictoriaB]

~~~
Hello Andrew, excuse me for butting in, but I also
love sweet soy sauce and make my own. If you ever
run out, try it:

Ingredients (into sauce pan)
1 cup soy sauce
1 cup brown sugar, packed
1 tsp Allspice
2 garlic cloves, crushed
1 inch piece of ginger root, sliced
1 tsp whole black peppercorns

Stir until sugar is dissolved, simmer on low until
thickened, stirring occasionally. Strain into
glass jar when cooled. Keeps forever in fridge.

v - makes a lot of fried rice using it
--
https://www.thefarside.com/

[Ben Newsam]

VictoriaB wrote, though the Organization header says "Aioe.org NNTP
Server":

>Ingredients (into sauce pan)
>1 cup soy sauce
>1 cup brown sugar, packed
>1 tsp Allspice
>2 garlic cloves, crushed
>1 inch piece of ginger root, sliced
>1 tsp whole black peppercorns

That sounds intriguing. I might try it. When I have some spare jars or
bottles, that is...
--
Ben

[Andrew Marshall]

Thanks. It's a long time since I went into a Sainsers, but should the
Current Circs. improve to the extent that I feel safe to go out shopping
again, I'll have a look; I currently get my shopping delivered by
another supplier.

As the parcel contained ten 600ml bottles, though, that might be some
time in any case.

--
Regards,
Andrew.

[Andrew Marshall]

On 25/09/2021 10:41, RustyHinge wrote:
> On 25/09/2021 08:42, Ben Newsam wrote:
>> Andrew Marshall wrote, though the Organization header says "Y Ddraenog
>> Goch":
>>
>>> I don't like Worcs. sauce at all
>>
>> I don't think that Worcs. sauce is something that one "likes" exactly,
>> but certain things, like a Bloody Mary or even just plain tomato
>> juice, wouldn't be quite the same without it.
>>
>>  From Three Men In a Boat:
>> "If Harris’s eyes fill with tears, you can bet it is because Harris
>> has been eating raw onions, or has put too much Worcester over his
>> chop."

> 'chop', of course, in the West African sense of food?

Na fine chop dis beef...

--
Regards,
Andrew.

[Andrew Marshall]

On 25/09/2021 11:14, VictoriaB wrote:

> Andrew Marshall wrote:

>> I don't like Worcs. sauce at all, but I do
>> very much like kecap manis, which I use as a
>> table sauce on meats (both hot and cold),
>> fish, chips and hash browns.

> Hello Andrew, excuse me for butting in,

Hello v. 's OK; I'm always interested in tasty-sounding recipes.

> but I also
> love sweet soy sauce and make my own. If you ever
> run out, try it:

> Ingredients (into sauce pan)
> 1 cup soy sauce
> 1 cup brown sugar, packed
> 1 tsp Allspice
> 2 garlic cloves, crushed
> 1 inch piece of ginger root, sliced
> 1 tsp whole black peppercorns
>
> Stir until sugar is dissolved, simmer on low until
> thickened, stirring occasionally. Strain into
> glass jar when cooled. Keeps forever in fridge.

Many thanks for the recipe - duly saved. I'll bear it in mind if my
source dries up. I might even be tempted to add a spot more garlic,
being rather fond of the stuff.

--
Regards,
Andrew.

[Nicholas D. Richards]

In article <WcSdndoc-cahc9P8...@brightview.co.uk>,
Tease'n'Seize <tease-and-seize@invalid.?> on Sat, 25 Sep 2021 at
10:39:04 awoke Nicholas from his slumbers and wrote

Also at aWitrose, in fact eyesore it this am. They sell it as Cooks'
Ingredients Ketjap Manis, 1.20 of our GB Zus for .005 of a firkin.

[VictoriaB]

~~~
You are very welcome, and I agree about the garlic.
v

--
https://www.thefarside.com/

[VictoriaB]

~~~~
Welcome to my garage where I have a yuge shelf of
shiny pint-size wide-mouthed glass jars, I
scrubbed them clean, even used Goo-Be-Gone to get
rid of label glue. They held my favorite pickles,
sour and sweet, also peanut butter. I use them for
so many things - especially my homemade sauces and
salad dressings. They're great for storing half a
raw onion, or pieces of other raw veggies.... and
leftovers.

I store ginger root in a little one, keeps in the
freezer forever.

Don't get me started, I have trouble throwing any
glass jar away. It may be a mental promble....
(eye twitches).

;)

--
https://www.thefarside.com/

[RustyHinge]

On 26/09/2021 11:03, VictoriaB wrote:

> Don't get me started, I have trouble throwing any
> glass jar away. It may be a mental promble....
> (eye twitches).

I itches too.

[Ben Newsam]

VictoriaB wrote, though the Organization header says "Aioe.org NNTP
Server":

>I store ginger root in a little one, keeps in the
>freezer forever.

I have some ginger growing in a couple of pots on the upstairs landing
windowsill. Now *that's* fresh!
--
Ben

[Sn!pe]

VictoriaB <prair...@privacy.com> wrote:

> Welcome to my garage where I have a yuge shelf of
> shiny pint-size wide-mouthed glass jars, I
> scrubbed them clean, even used Goo-Be-Gone to get
> rid of label glue. They held my favorite pickles,
> sour and sweet, also peanut butter. I use them for
> so many things - especially my homemade sauces and
> salad dressings. They're great for storing half a
> raw onion, or pieces of other raw veggies.... and
> leftovers.
>

I don't think I've ever seen a demi-On!on chez Sn!pe;
IMO the Noble On!on is like the atom: indivisible; use
a whole one every time. Better yet, use On!on2;
like H2, N2 or O2, it's more stable.

Top Tip: To remove label glue, a smear of veggie oil
on a fingertip works really well.

--
^Ï^ <https://youtu.be/_kqytf31a8E>

My pet rock Gordon just is.

[VictoriaB]

~~~
Oooh I'm so jealous, I've never had any luck with
that.
v

--
https://www.thefarside.com/

[VictoriaB]

Sn!pe wrote:
> VictoriaB <prair...@privacy.com> wrote:
>
>> Welcome to my garage where I have a yuge
>> shelf of shiny pint-size wide-mouthed glass
>> jars, I scrubbed them clean, even used
>> Goo-Be-Gone to get rid of label glue. They
>> held my favorite pickles, sour and sweet,
>> also peanut butter. I use them for so many
>> things - especially my homemade sauces and
>> salad dressings. They're great for storing
>> half a raw onion, or pieces of other raw
>> veggies.... and leftovers.
>>
>
> I don't think I've ever seen a demi-On!on chez
> Sn!pe; IMO the Noble On!on is like the atom:
> indivisible; use a whole one every time.
> Better yet, use On!on2; like H2, N2 or O2, it's
> more stable.
>

~~~
;) But but these yellow ones that I like -
Vidalia, mild and sweet - are enormous. The other
day I caramelized one in a 10" skillet and it
filled the whole thing... until it cooked down of
course.

My Gran taught me to choose a flatter shaped
On!on, like a spinning top, rather than a round
one, shaped like a globe. It was so long ago that
I can't remember why, but I still do that just to
honor her memory.
~~~

> Top Tip: To remove label glue, a smear of
> veggie oil on a fingertip works really well.
>

~~~
If only, because I've tried that, even left it to
soften overnight, but it was still sticky. But my
family knows I'm weird and whoever draws my name
gives me big bottles of Goo-Gone for Xmas. They
think it's funny, but it's fine with practical me.

v
--
https://www.thefarside.com/

[Ben Newsam]

VictoriaB wrote, though the Organization header says "Aioe.org NNTP
Server":

>Ben Newsam wrote:
>> VictoriaB wrote, though the Organization header says "Aioe.org NNTP
>> Server":
>>
>>> I store ginger root in a little one, keeps in the
>>> freezer forever.
>>
>> I have some ginger growing in a couple of pots on the upstairs landing
>> windowsill. Now *that's* fresh!
>>
>~~~
>Oooh I'm so jealous, I've never had any luck with
>that.

That windowsill is just above the "uncontrolled" radiator on my
central heating, so the key to success woulld seem to be lots of heat.
That, and patience when the leaves die down and it just sits there
apparently lifeless.
--
Ben

[RustyHinge]

Dead easy. Buy ~ (or otherwise obtain) a small, hard knob of a ginger
rhizome, place it on the surface of damp compost, keep the compost warm
moist, and just try to stop it!

Same goes for turmeric.

[VictoriaB]

Ben Newsam wrote:
> VictoriaB wrote, though the Organization
> header says "Aioe.org NNTP Server":
>
>> Ben Newsam wrote:
>>> VictoriaB wrote, though the Organization
>>> header says "Aioe.org NNTP Server":
>>>
>>>> I store ginger root in a little one,
>>>> keeps in the freezer forever.
>>>
>>> I have some ginger growing in a couple of
>>> pots on the upstairs landing windowsill.
>>> Now *that's* fresh!
>>>
>> ~~~ Oooh I'm so jealous, I've never had any
>> luck with that.
>
> That windowsill is just above the
> "uncontrolled" radiator on my central heating,
> so the key to success woulld seem to be lots
> of heat. That, and patience when the leaves
> die down and it just sits there apparently
> lifeless.
>

~~~
Hmmm, how big was the piece that you first rooted,
and was it in water or dirt? Probably dirt. I grew
a beautiful plant from a whole sweet potato in
water, toothpicks keeping it off the bottom of the
jar... which filled with roots. It grew over 5 ft.
so I had to sit it on top of my fridge.

I like to grow avocado trees from the seed held in
water with toothpicks... makes a pretty house plant.

v
--
https://www.thefarside.com/

[VictoriaB]

RustyHinge wrote:
> On 27/09/2021 10:57, VictoriaB wrote:
>> Ben Newsam wrote:
>>> VictoriaB wrote, though the Organization
>>> header says "Aioe.org NNTP Server":
>>>
>>>> I store ginger root in a little one,
>>>> keeps in the freezer forever.
>>>
>>> I have some ginger growing in a couple of
>>> pots on the upstairs landing windowsill.
>>> Now *that's* fresh!
>>>
>> ~~~ Oooh I'm so jealous, I've never had any
>> luck with that. v
>>
> Dead easy. Buy ~ (or otherwise obtain) a small,
> hard knob of a ginger rhizome, place it on the
> surface of damp compost, keep the compost warm
> moist, and just try to stop it!
>
> Same goes for turmeric.
>

~~~
Ah, on the surface. Thanks. I don't recall seeing
turmeric rhizomes in grocery stores here... I
guess I could ask. I use a lot of ground turmeric
in cooking. It's very healthy you know.

v
--
https://www.thefarside.com/

[Ben Newsam]

VictoriaB wrote, though the Organization header says "Aioe.org NNTP
Server":

>Hmmm, how big was the piece that you first rooted,
>and was it in water or dirt? Probably dirt.

Yes, soil in a pot. The piece I planred originally was about 2 inches
long I suppose. You know how when you buy ginger it consists of
knobbles connected together? Well, there were about three in a row. It
grows by sending a shoot up at one end of the row of knobbles, and the
base of the shooth thickens to form a new knobble. Sometimes it
branches, but always more or less on the surface. When I dug it up to
divide and repot, there were thick rhizomous roots going straight down
as well as the ones going along the surface. When it has a mind to, it
grows really fast. At the moment, it seems dormant, but I suspect it
will start up again once the heating comes on towards the winter!

Now, let's see if this works:
http:/www.bennewsam.co.uk/images/Ginger1.jpg
http:/www.bennewsam.co.uk/images/Ginger2.jpg
--
Ben

[RustyHinge]

On 27/09/2021 11:45, VictoriaB wrote:
> Ben Newsam wrote:
>> VictoriaB wrote, though the Organization
>> header says "Aioe.org NNTP Server":
>>
>>> Ben Newsam wrote:
>>>> VictoriaB wrote, though the Organization header says "Aioe.org NNTP
>>>> Server":
>>>>
>>>>> I store ginger root in a little one, keeps in the freezer forever.
>>>>
>>>> I have some ginger growing in a couple of pots on the upstairs
>>>> landing windowsill. Now *that's* fresh!
>>>>
>>> ~~~ Oooh I'm so jealous, I've never had any luck with that.
>>
>> That windowsill is just above the "uncontrolled" radiator on my
>> central heating, so the key to success woulld seem to be lots
>> of heat. That, and patience when the leaves
>> die down and it just sits there apparently lifeless.
>>
> ~~~

> Hmmm, how big was the piece thatI think I might have a trif you first rooted,

> and was it in water or dirt? Probably dirt. I grew
> a beautiful plant from a whole sweet potato in
> water, toothpicks keeping it off the bottom of the
> jar... which filled with roots. It grew over 5 ft.
> so I had to sit it on top of my fridge.
>
> I like to grow avocado trees from the seed held in
> water with toothpicks... makes a pretty house plant.

just looked at the first avocado stone I started fairly recently, to see
how much water to give it.

In two days the sneaky stone has poked a tongue out of the corner of its
mouth, and it's at least ½" long. I think I might have a triffid here,
so I'd best be caref^h^h^h^aaaargh! <gasp!> grooogh! <choke!>

(Watch this space for funereal arrangements. Donations to Over Eighties'
Nudist Hang-gliders Association Benevolent Fund. Triffie)

[VictoriaB]

~~~
Thanks, I had no idea that it grew in little
knobby rows. I'm tempted to try again, but with a
fresh piece, not the one in the freezer.

I have a 4 ft apple tree in my back yard that I
started from seed in a cup of dirt. And a peach
tree from fruit that my aunt ate and just stuck
the pit in the ground... I've harvested lots of
peaches from it over the years, but nothing during
the last two. They don't last forever, and I've
started a new tree the same way.

v
--
https://www.thefarside.com/

[VictoriaB]

RustyHinge wrote:
> On 27/09/2021 11:45, VictoriaB wrote:

[..]

>> I like to grow avocado trees from the seed
>> held in water with toothpicks... makes a
>> pretty house plant.
>
> just looked at the first avocado stone I
> started fairly recently, to see how much water
> to give it.
>
> In two days the sneaky stone has poked a
> tongue out of the corner of its mouth, and it's
> at least ½" long. I think I might have a
> triffid here, so I'd best be
> caref^h^h^h^aaaargh! <gasp!> grooogh! <choke!>
>
> (Watch this space for funereal arrangements.
> Donations to Over Eighties' Nudist
> Hang-gliders Association Benevolent Fund.
> Triffie)
>

~~~
;D You're so silly. Were you a comedian in a past
life?

v

--
https://www.thefarside.com/

[RustyHinge]

On 28/09/2021 09:59, VictoriaB wrote:

> I have a 4 ft apple tree in my back yard that I
> started from seed in a cup of dirt. And a peach
> tree from fruit that my aunt ate and just stuck
> the pit in the ground... I've harvested lots of
> peaches from it over the years, but nothing during
> the last two. They don't last forever, and I've
> started a new tree the same way.

Don't give up on the peac. I'd fork in some bonemeal round the roots and
rake in multi-purpose fertiliser on top, and keep the tree well-watered.

The apple will outlive ou, still bearing fruit.

[Mike Fleming]

On 26/09/2021 11:03, VictoriaB wrote:
>

> Don't get me started, I have trouble throwing any
> glass jar away. It may be a mental promble....
> (eye twitches).

I keep plastic ice cream tubs and lidded plastic containers used for
takeaways to store electronic and hardware items in. Strangely, the more
containers I accumulate, the more items that will go into containers I
find. Perhaps I should build a few of my part-completed projects, then I
could take them out of the containers...

[Adrian]

In message <irhklo...@mid.individual.net>, Mike Fleming
<mi...@tauzero.co.uk> writes

>I keep plastic ice cream tubs and lidded plastic containers used for
>takeaways to store electronic and hardware items in.

Don't we all ?

Adrian
--
To Reply :
replace "bulleid" with "adrian" - all mail to bulleid is rejected
Sorry for the rigmarole, If I want spam, I'll go to the shops
Every time someone says "I don't believe in trolls", another one dies.

[VictoriaB]

RustyHinge wrote:
> On 28/09/2021 09:59, VictoriaB wrote:
>
>> I have a 4 ft apple tree in my back yard that
>> I started from seed in a cup of dirt. And a
>> peach tree from fruit that my aunt ate and
>> just stuck the pit in the ground... I've
>> harvested lots of peaches from it over the
>> years, but nothing during the last two. They
>> don't last forever, and I've started a new
>> tree the same way.
>

> Don't give up on the peach. I'd fork in some

> bonemeal round the roots and rake in
> multi-purpose fertiliser on top, and keep the
> tree well-watered.
>

> The apple will outlive you, still bearing
> fruit.
>
~~~
Thank for the advice, that's a good tip. A guy wot
knows trees said the apples I'll get might be
bitter crab apples, because all the best apples
are grafted from 2 trees. And one apple tree needs
another apple buddy to pollinate.

v
--
https://www.thefarside.com/

[VictoriaB]

Mike Fleming wrote:
> On 26/09/2021 11:03, VictoriaB wrote:
>>
>> Don't get me started, I have trouble throwing
>> any glass jar away. It may be a mental
>> promble.... (eye twitches).
>
> I keep plastic ice cream tubs and lidded
> plastic containers used for takeaways to store
> electronic and hardware items in.

~~~
A man after my own heart. I, too, collect plastic
containers of larger sizes to store odds and
ends... then I use masking tape to label what's in
'em.
~~~

Strangely, the more
> containers I accumulate, the more items that
> will go into containers I find.

~~~
;) I hear you brother.
~~~

> Perhaps I should build
> a few of my part-completed projects, then I
> could take them out of the containers...
>

~~~~
Ah but a creative mind always has several things
going.

v

--
https://www.thefarside.com/

[RustyHinge]

The apple will not be a crab because it came from a pip which came from
a 'type' apple, not from the rootstock, which isn't always a crab in any
case.

I can't recall the 'M' number tree ('M' for Malling) I used to get fruit
from: the graft had been broken off and the rootstock sprouted, flowered
and fruited after a while. The apples were smallish, rather oblong,
green but quite juicy and sweet, so *that* ^ supposition doesn't follow,
either.

The apple may resemble the fruit the pip came from or its pollinator, or
a mixture, or an ancestor - there's no knowing until SIAS (suck it and
see) [Gregor Mendel- q.v.]

It will take quite a while before you get fruit though. Quick 'payback'
with most trees can only be got by grafting or budding from an already
fruiting tree.

I planted a lemon pip but didn't persevere with cultivating the young
tree because citrus rom seed may not grow to type and could take up to
35 years before fruiting...

[Kerr-Mudd, John]

Can citrus trees grow in this country (UK)? Maybe in 35 years they will, given Global Warming..

> --
> Rusty Hinge
> To err is human. To really foul things up requires a computer and the
> BOFH.

--
Bah, and indeed Humbug.

[RustyHinge]

Some lemons especially can be grown here: this I presume because someone
I know used to live in the foothills of the Drakensberg mountains in
Sith Effrica, where snow is (was?) an annual event, and there was a big
fruiting lemon tree in the yard.

Because of the cold it lost all its leaves each year (citrus trees are
evergreen, but).

There's a variety of ornge which is fully hardy too, and much used as a
prickly hedging shrub.

[Ahem A Rivet's Shot]

On Wed, 29 Sep 2021 13:02:29 +0100
"Kerr-Mudd, John" <ad...@127.0.0.1> wrote:

> Can citrus trees grow in this country (UK)? Maybe in 35 years they will,
> given Global Warming..

I gather that according to some models Global Warming can be
expected to shut down the Gulf Stream/North Atlantic Drift leaving these
parts rather cooler than they are now.

--
Steve O'Hara-Smith
Odds and Ends at http://www.sohara.org/

[Kerr-Mudd, John]

On Wed, 29 Sep 2021 14:01:30 +0100
Ahem A Rivet's Shot <ste...@eircom.net> wrote:

> On Wed, 29 Sep 2021 13:02:29 +0100
> "Kerr-Mudd, John" <ad...@127.0.0.1> wrote:
>
> > Can citrus trees grow in this country (UK)? Maybe in 35 years they
> > will, given Global Warming..
>
> I gather that according to some models Global Warming can be
> expected to shut down the Gulf Stream/North Atlantic Drift leaving
> these parts rather cooler than they are now.
>

Oh. Dear. Still I guess the Holocene's had a good innings.

[Nick Norman]

Not so much GW as a Grand Solar Minimum /a la/ Maunder /et al/

Avpx


--
'Never trust a ruler who puts his faith in tunnels and bunkers
and escape routes. The chances are that his heart isn't in the
job.' (Guards! Guards!)
Wed 10256 Sep 17:45:01 BST 1993
17:45:01 up 3 days, 6:41, 11 users, load average: 1.06, 0.73, 0.65

[Ben Newsam]

Ahem A Rivet's Shot wrote, though the Organization header says "A
noiseless patient Spider":

>On Wed, 29 Sep 2021 13:02:29 +0100
>"Kerr-Mudd, John" <ad...@127.0.0.1> wrote:
>
>> Can citrus trees grow in this country (UK)? Maybe in 35 years they will,
>> given Global Warming..
>
> I gather that according to some models Global Warming can be
>expected to shut down the Gulf Stream/North Atlantic Drift leaving these
>parts rather cooler than they are now.

If the Gulf Stream fails, as seems possible at the very least, it
would mean very cold winters indeed. You have to remember that parts
of the UK are further North than Anchorage in Alaska.
--
Ben

[Nick Norman]

Indeed, good-bye maritime climate

Avpx


--
"Growl, growl." - Gaspode the wonder dog
(Terry Pratchett, Moving Pictures)
Wed 10256 Sep 19:30:01 BST 1993
19:30:01 up 3 days, 8:26, 11 users, load average: 0.11, 0.23, 0.31

[VictoriaB]

~~~
Lemon tree very pretty, and the lemon flower is
sweet... but the fruit of the poor lemon won't
grow here for poor me.

Re my apple tree - I was told by the guy who grows
apple trees (and you seem to think doesn't know
wot he's talkin' about), that it might be about 6
yrs. before mine will bear fruit. His dwarf apples
bear fruit in 3 yrs. ... as did my peach tree.

The apple I was eating was a beautiful sweet
crunchy Pink Lady, not a dwarf... I don't think.

v

Brekkie today - blueberries, green grapes, Gala
Apples, dried cranberries and walnuts in vanilla
yogurt drizzled wiv honey and sprinkled wiv
granola... and black coffee.

--
https://www.thefarside.com/

[John Williamson]

On 30/09/2021 11:02, VictoriaB wrote:

> Re my apple tree - I was told by the guy who grows
> apple trees (and you seem to think doesn't know
> wot he's talkin' about), that it might be about 6
> yrs. before mine will bear fruit. His dwarf apples
> bear fruit in 3 yrs. ... as did my peach tree.
>
> The apple I was eating was a beautiful sweet
> crunchy Pink Lady, not a dwarf... I don't think.
>

You can make just about any type of apple tree a dwarf tree. Dwarfing of
apple trees is normally done by grafting the scion onto a dwarfing
rootstock. You can pick the height by changing the rootstock. You don't
plant them for you, you plant them for the kids or whoever buys the place.

https://www.waimeanurseries.co.nz/how-to-guide/about-apple-rootstocks/

Going a bit further up thread, to bear fruit, you need a compatible tree
within bee range, or a compatible tree you can get to and a dedicated
person with a ladder, a small paint brush and a small jar for pollen at
each end.

--
Tciao for Now!

John.

[RustyHinge]

Doesn't scan - I rather disagree with the original lyrics (I used to
peel lemons, segment them and take them to school as a refresher) so it
*isn't* impossible to eat..

> Re my apple tree - I was told by the guy who grows
> apple trees (and you seem to think doesn't know
> wot he's talkin' about), that it might be about 6
> yrs. before mine will bear fruit. His dwarf apples
> bear fruit in 3 yrs. ... as did my peach tree.

Dwarf apple trees are grafted or budded onto a dwarfing rootstock - they
don't grow from a pip. If you bud or graft from an established tree, it
*might* flower the next year. It wouldn't do the tree much good to let
it fruit for a year or two.

>
> The apple I was eating was a beautiful sweet
> crunchy Pink Lady, not a dwarf... I don't think.

Don't like Pink Lady - insubstantial. Try a proper Cox's Orange Pippin -
not the thing they sell in horridmarkets, or try a Worcester or a
Charles Ross...

> Brekkie today - blueberries, green grapes, Gala
> Apples, dried cranberries and walnuts in vanilla
> yogurt drizzled wiv honey and sprinkled wiv
> granola... and black coffee.
>

Coffee - UAB, yog-UGH!-T - Gala - rubbish apple. *If* you can get hold
of one, Charles Ross. That and Bramley are my delights - oh, and codlin
- I could go on: Devonshire Quarenden... Handy apple: firm and crisp
while unripe, firm, crisp, sweet and fragrant when ripe, soft and sweet
when (IMO) past its best.

[Andrew Marshall]

On 30/09/2021 13:22, RustyHinge wrote:
> *If* you can get hold
> of one, Charles Ross.

They are indeed excellent apples. The C/R tree in our small
orchard[5786] has not produced as many fruit this year as in the last
few, but they are very good. I had to pick them early, as the local
birds had started to peck at them; the two we've had as baked apples so
far were very good eating. I hope the others will keep for a while yet.

> That and Bramley are my delights

Our Bramley has quite a few on it this year, but quite a lot of them
have been affected by some sort of scab/cracking.

We also have a Cox's, which has produced nowt but a few golf-ball-sized
fruit, and a Russet which has done much the same.

There are a few decently-sized Comice pears, but the Williams produced
but two fruit this year, and the Conference none at all.

[5786]planted by Dad in the late '50s.

--
Regards,
Andrew

[VictoriaB]

~~~~~
Ah Rusty, you have just a touch of the Contrarian. LOL

In the USA some of our Great Plains Indian tribes
have an odd character called a Contrarian. He -
usually a male - speaks and acts in an opposite
way than the rest of the tribe. The Sioux call
them "hey-yo-kah."

From wiki-do: "....The Heyókȟa is thought of as
being backwards forwards, upside-down, or contrary
in nature. This manifests by their doing things
backwards or unconventionally—riding a horse
backwards, wearing clothes inside-out, or speaking
in a backwards language. For example, if food is
scarce, a heyókȟa may sit around and complain
about how full he is; during a baking hot heat
wave, a heyókȟa might shiver with cold and put on
gloves and cover himself with a thick blanket.
Similarly, when it is freezing he might wander
around naked, complaining that it is too hot. ....

Their behavior poses questions as do Zen koans. By
reading between the lines, the audience is able to
think about things not usually thought about, or
to look at things in a different way. [...]"

Just kidding, I still think you are a nice helpful
fellow. ;)
v
--
https://www.thefarside.com/

[RustyHinge]

Do you prune? If so, any chance of a couple of whips of Charles Ross and
one of Cox? I've a 'family tree' (ohled because in the nursery the label
said: Charles Ross, Discovery, James Grieve.) J.G is a good apple, the
one which shouldnhave been C.R. was, I think a Blenheim (ok apple, but
doesn't keep), and the Discovery I cut off. I'd like to add a C.R and/or
a Cox to the tree, but root a C.R. whip.

Pretty Please, but after the leaves have dropped.

[RustyHinge]

On 22/09/2021 10:00, John Williamson wrote:

> For those not in the know, Staffordshire oatcakes are like a pancake,
> but made using oatmeal flour, and are nothing like the Scottish or Wocab
> ones.

I got something very similar (by my mistake) from a Scottish bakery.

[Adrian]

In message <sj4a5u$4ui$1...@dont-email.me>, RustyHinge
<rusty...@foobar.girolle.co.uk> writes

>Don't like Pink Lady - insubstantial. Try a proper Cox's Orange Pippin
>- not the thing they sell in horridmarkets, or try a Worcester or a
>Charles Ross...
>

The last but one resident here was a keen gardener (unlike the current
incumbent). The lasting legacy of that is a Cox's in the front garden,
which produces anything between nothing and 20 small - medium sized
apples a year, but never very big (but tasty never the less). This
year, I managed to recover 3 of them before the beasties got at them.
The good news is that the horridmarket does sell them at certain times
of the year (hopefully soon). Currently I'm on Braeburns

[Andrew Marshall]

On 30/09/2021 17:36, RustyHinge wrote:
> On 30/09/2021 16:14, Andrew Marshall wrote:
>> On 30/09/2021 13:22, RustyHinge wrote:
>>> *If* you can get hold of one, Charles Ross.
>>
>> They are indeed excellent apples. The C/R tree in our small
>> orchard[5786] has not produced as many fruit this year as in the last
>> few, but they are very good. I had to pick them early, as the local
>> birds had started to peck at them; the two we've had as baked apples
>> so far were very good eating. I hope the others will keep for a while
>> yet.
>>
>>> That and Bramley are my delights
>>
>> Our Bramley has quite a few on it this year, but quite a lot of them
>> have been affected by some sort of scab/cracking.
>>
>> We also have a Cox's, which has produced nowt but a few
>> golf-ball-sized fruit, and a Russet which has done much the same.
>>
>> There are a few decently-sized Comice pears, but the Williams produced
>> but two fruit this year, and the Conference none at all.
>>
>> [5786]planted by Dad in the late '50s.
>
> Do you prune?

Those two trees haven't been touched since July 1974, when Mother and
Dad moved down to the South Hams leaving us here. One or two others
have, though, but only when absolutely necessary (dead/dodgy branches).

> If so, any chance of a couple of whips of Charles Ross and
> one of Cox?

I'll ask my brother G., as he's Head Gardener, so to speak, and will
need to OK it. I wouldn't know, myself, what, where or when to cut,
anyway. Presumably the whips (cuttings?) would be small enough and
sturdy enough to be sent by post/courier{263] (which would have to be
done in a Covid-safe way, so might well not be for some time).

> I've a 'family tree' (ohled because in the nursery the label
> said: Charles Ross, Discovery, James Grieve.) J.G is a good apple, the
> one which shouldnhave been C.R. was, I think a Blenheim (ok apple, but
> doesn't keep), and the Discovery I cut off. I'd like to add a C.R and/or
> a Cox to the tree, but root a C.R. whip.

> Pretty Please, but after the leaves have dropped.

I'll ask G. and let you know. More by email.

[263]I don't actually know whether the Post Office would accept such
items. Presumably a courier would, but that would take quite some
arranging in the Current Circs.

--
Regards,
Andrew.

[RustyHinge]

On 30/09/2021 18:01, Adrian wrote:
> In message <sj4a5u$4ui$1...@dont-email.me>, RustyHinge
> <rusty...@foobar.girolle.co.uk> writes
>> Don't like Pink Lady - insubstantial. Try a proper Cox's Orange Pippin
>> - not the thing they sell in horridmarkets, or try a Worcester or a
>> Charles Ross...
>>
>
> The last but one resident here was a keen gardener (unlike the current
> incumbent).  The lasting legacy of that is a Cox's in the front garden,
> which produces anything between nothing and 20 small - medium sized
> apples a year, but never very big (but tasty never the less).  This
> year, I managed to recover 3 of them before the beasties got at them.
> The good news is that the horridmarket does sell them at certain times
> of the year (hopefully soon).  Currently I'm on Braeburns

Braeburns OK - horridmarket Coxs are not Cox's Orange Pippin, but
derived from same. A proper Cox is a late ripener, which is why they are
a 'Christmas' apple. It's always a small apple. (Unlike Charles Ross,
which is coloured somewhat similarly, similar shape, but *HYOOGE* -
sometimes as big as a grapefruit.

[Adrian]

In message <sj4s6k$ngr$1...@dont-email.me>, RustyHinge
<rusty...@foobar.girolle.co.uk> writes

>Braeburns OK - horridmarket Coxs are not Cox's Orange Pippin, but
>derived from same. A proper Cox is a late ripener, which is why they
>are a 'Christmas' apple. It's always a small apple. (Unlike Charles
>Ross, which is coloured somewhat similarly, similar shape, but *HYOOGE*
>- sometimes as big as a grapefruit.
>

Mine are always ready in September, so perhaps they are not a 100% Cox.

[RustyHinge]

Cut when the twigs are dormant, preferably. Whips tend to grow straight
up from mature wood, and it's easiest to get them from a fairly
horizontal branch - you'd prune those off normally anyway.

>> I've a 'family tree' (ohled because in the nursery the label said:
>> Charles Ross, Discovery, James Grieve.) J.G is a good apple, the one
>> which shouldnhave been C.R. was, I think a Blenheim (ok apple, but
>> doesn't keep), and the Discovery I cut off. I'd like to add a C.R
>> and/or a Cox to the tree, but root a C.R. whip.
>
>> Pretty Please, but after the leaves have dropped.
>
> I'll ask G. and let you know. More by email.

Ta

>
> [263]I don't actually know whether the Post Office would accept such
> items. Presumably a courier would, but that would take quite some
> arranging in the Current Circs.
>

If you seall them in a plastic bag with something damp* and put the bag
in a cardboard tube (from kitchen towels or similar) who would know they
weren't really sticks of dynamite?

*moss is favourite, cloff or paper would suffice. AFAIK the only
restriction is sending abroad. I gooved you sometimes come this way
anyway, doncher? (Bunwell)

[RustyHinge]

On 30/09/2021 18:43, Adrian wrote:
> In message <sj4s6k$ngr$1...@dont-email.me>, RustyHinge
> <rusty...@foobar.girolle.co.uk> writes
>> Braeburns OK - horridmarket Coxs are not Cox's Orange Pippin, but
>> derived from same. A proper Cox is a late ripener, which is why they
>> are a 'Christmas' apple. It's always a small apple. (Unlike Charles
>> Ross, which is coloured somewhat similarly, similar shape, but
>> *HYOOGE* - sometimes as big as a grapefruit.
>>
>
> Mine are always ready in September, so perhaps they are not a 100% Cox.

They are usually ready by then, but Cox's improve with keeping, when the
flesh goes a bit yellower and sort-of pliable.

We had 36 fruit trees in the garden, some of them rather obscure, but I
do remember the Cox and where it was, and some of the other trees. There
was one pear that we could never guess the use of. The'd still be lying
under the tree in the spring, untouched by rot, bird, slug or
especially, cooks. Anyone with a cannon of the right bore would find a
use for them. We think they were probably planted for their huge
snow-white flowers.

[Mike Fleming]

On 30/09/2021 16:38, VictoriaB wrote:
>
> In the USA some of our Great Plains Indian tribes
> have an odd character called a Contrarian. He -
> usually a male - speaks and acts in an opposite
> way than the rest of the tribe. The Sioux call
> them "hey-yo-kah."
>
> From wiki-do: "....The Heyókȟa is thought of as
> being backwards forwards, upside-down, or contrary
> in nature. This manifests by their doing things
> backwards or unconventionally—riding a horse
> backwards, wearing clothes inside-out, or speaking
> in a backwards language. For example, if food is
> scarce, a heyókȟa may sit around and complain
> about how full he is; during a baking hot heat
> wave, a heyókȟa might shiver with cold and put on
> gloves and cover himself with a thick blanket.
> Similarly, when it is freezing he might wander
> around naked, complaining that it is too hot. ....
>
> Their behavior poses questions as do Zen koans. By
> reading between the lines, the audience is able to
> think about things not usually thought about, or
> to look at things in a different way. [...]"

Sounds like the devil's advocate, a concept originating in the Catholic
church.

Or a troll, of course.

[Andrew Marshall]

Ah; so that's what a whip is. I'll look at the trees and see whether
there are any on them.

>
>>> I've a 'family tree' (ohled because in the nursery the label said:
>>> Charles Ross, Discovery, James Grieve.) J.G is a good apple, the one
>>> which shouldnhave been C.R. was, I think a Blenheim (ok apple, but
>>> doesn't keep), and the Discovery I cut off. I'd like to add a C.R
>>> and/or a Cox to the tree, but root a C.R. whip.
>>
>>> Pretty Please, but after the leaves have dropped.
>>
>> I'll ask G. and let you know. More by email.
>
> Ta
>>
>> [263]I don't actually know whether the Post Office would accept such
>> items. Presumably a courier would, but that would take quite some
>> arranging in the Current Circs.
>>
> If you seall them in a plastic bag with something damp* and put the bag
> in a cardboard tube (from kitchen towels or similar) who would know they
> weren't really sticks of dynamite?
>
> *moss is favourite, cloff or paper would suffice. AFAIK the only
> restriction is sending abroad.

I'll look on their wibble and see what's allowed.

I gooved you sometimes come this way
> anyway, doncher? (Bunwell)

The closest I've been is when we met when I went to the whisky
distillery some years back. That won't happen again, as I now
permanently eschew all alcoholic drinks.

Apart from that, we used to go to Suffolk each autumn, but even that
won't happen again until we consider it's safe to do so, which might be
quite some time.

In any case, I will not be doing any non-local travelling until the
Current Circs. greatly improve. The only vehicles currently on the road
here aren't practical for other than local trips, and I won't be staying
anywhere overnight for the foreseeable future.

--
Regards,
Andrew.

[RustyHinge]

On 01/10/2021 08:51, Andrew Marshall wrote:

> Ah; so that's what a whip is. I'll look at the trees and see whether
> there are any on them.

Ta muchly.

> The closest I've been is when we met when I went to the whisky
> distillery some years back. That won't happen again, as I now
> permanently eschew all alcoholic drinks.

Oh, shame.

> Apart from that, we used to go to Suffolk each autumn, but even that
> won't happen again until we consider it's safe to do so, which might be
> quite some time.
>
> In any case, I will not be doing any non-local travelling until the
> Current Circs. greatly improve. The only vehicles currently on the road
> here aren't practical for other than local trips, and I won't be staying
> anywhere overnight for the foreseeable future.

Ah well, I just got the impression that you cumbye yar from time to
time. Unforget there'll always be a welcome in the - er - jungle,
there'll be a welcome 'mong the bales...

[VictoriaB]

John Williamson wrote:
[..]

>
> Going a bit further up thread, to bear fruit,
> you need a compatible tree within bee range,

~~~
That's what the apple guy told me, and I don't
know of any apple trees in my area.
~~~

> or a compatible tree you can get to and a
> dedicated person with a ladder, a small paint
> brush and a small jar for pollen at each end.
>

~~~
LOL... I didn't need a ladder, but I used to cross
pollinate my African Violets with a teeny-tiny
brush, after slitting pollen sacs open with
teeny-tiny manicure scissors... but success was rare.

v

--
https://www.thefarside.com/

[VictoriaB]

~~~
Yes, exactly. Since the beginning of time we
Humans seem to have developed the same basic
instincts, no matter our culture... finding ways
to reveal greater truths about ourselves and the
world... enhancing our ability to learn and cope.

~~~~

> Or a troll, of course.

~~~
:-/

--
https://www.thefarside.com/

[RustyHinge]

On 01/10/2021 11:27, VictoriaB wrote:
> John Williamson wrote:
> [..]
>>
>> Going a bit further up thread, to bear fruit, you need a compatible
>> tree within bee range,
> ~~~
> That's what the apple guy told me, and I don't
> know of any apple trees in my area.

Some apple trees are ver fuss about 'partners', but IIRC some are not.
There may be ones wic will self-pollinate. I dunno. I've forgotalot.

>
>> or a compatible tree you can get to and a dedicated person with a
>> ladder, a small paint brush and a small jar for pollen at each end.

A lot easier to deterine wat *is* a good pollinator and get (from
somewhere like Wilco/Wilkinson's) a cheap tree (in season) and plant
that. You'd get a lot of elp here:
https://heritagefruittreenursery.com/shop/apples/dessert/malling-kent-3/

> ~~~
> LOL... I didn't need a ladder, but I used to cross
> pollinate my African Violets with a teeny-tiny
> brush, after slitting pollen sacs open with
> teeny-tiny manicure scissors... but success was rare.

Or wholesale with a feather duster?

[VictoriaB]

;) Didn't have that many. Tell me about your years
of taking care of trees. You seem to have learned
a lot.

I love trees, and it makes me sad as I drive
through my neighborhood seeing them broken and
scraggly... still not recovered from a terrible
ice storm a few years ago.

"When great trees fall,
rocks on distant hills shudder,
lions hunker down
in tall grasses,
and even elephants
lumber after safety.

When great trees fall
in forests,
small things recoil into silence,
their senses
eroded beyond fear."
[Maya Angelou]

v

--
https://www.thefarside.com/

[RustyHinge]

Where do I start?

> I love trees, and it makes me sad as I drive
> through my neighborhood seeing them broken and
> scraggly... still not recovered from a terrible
> ice storm a few years ago.

Ah. From 1955 I was a Rover Scout and our Crew did a lot of tree
husbandry, and we cleared-up many, many wind-felled trees, elms mostly,
cut them up, split the logs and sold them as firewood. As Rover Scouts
were knocked on the head, we became Service Auxilleries, then when
*those* were abolished we joined the Scout Supporters Association.

Some envious Scout Leaders objected to us giving the money we earned to
our old Scout Group as we didn't belong to it any longer, and as members
of the SSA we 'should put any money nwe made into the District coffers,
so we coffed, waved two fingers at SSA and became a partnership and
earned money in the usual way, and did with it what we wanted.

Howsomedever, we didn't do much on fruit trees, but I did a bit at home,
where we had 36 fruit trees in the garden, mainly apples, but also
pears, a greengage, a damson and a peach. I learned a lot from my
grandfather, who was an expert in almost everything he touched, and he
taught me how to graft and bud hardwoods. (His expertise lay mainly in
roses, but the principle's the same.)

My garden (sadly neglected now I'm laid-up) boasts a 'family tree' of
apples: James Grieve and I think, Blenheim, onto which I intend
graftingseveral other varieties to replace the Discovery I cut off
(rubbish apple, though pretty). There is one remaining apricot I grew
from a stone, and which has given me one decent crop, a hunza apricot
which has lived in a big planter for over a dozen years and not even
flowered yet - this from a stone too, some soft fruit, a damson, a
Bramley which some vandal snapped in two while outside the shop and
which I bought from Wilco for a squid, oh and a *NUGE* Black Hamburg
grape vine which I bought a long time ago as a wee thin stick-in-a-pot,
and another smaller Muscat vine bought as a similar stick-in-a-pot.

I also have a large Chinese gooseberry vine grown from seed, and which
has just grown and looked decorative, but never produced fruit. I
reckoned that the commercial ones would be from male+female vines, but
obviously, Iwas wrong.

Just got a parcel, so, see yer later...

I've grown a lt of fruit trees from seed/pips/stones and seen only a few
bear fruit. Peaches and apricots fruit relatively quickly on maturing,
but some others are for your children or childrens' children to benefit from

> "When great trees fall,
> rocks on distant hills shudder,
> lions hunker down
> in tall grasses,
> and even elephants
> lumber after safety.
>
> When great trees fall
> in forests,
> small things recoil into silence,
> their senses
> eroded beyond fear."
> [Maya Angelou]
>
> v
>



--

[VictoriaB]

RustyHinge wrote:
> On 02/10/2021 12:16, VictoriaB wrote:
>>>

>> [...] Tell me about your years of taking care

>> of trees. You seem to have learned a lot.
>
>
> Where do I start?
>
>> I love trees, and it makes me sad as I drive
>> through my neighborhood seeing them broken
>> and scraggly... still not recovered from a
>> terrible ice storm a few years ago.
>
> Ah. From 1955 I was a Rover Scout and our Crew
> did a lot of tree husbandry, and we cleared-up
> many, many wind-felled trees, elms mostly, cut
> them up, split the logs and sold them as
> firewood. As Rover Scouts were knocked on the
> head, we became Service Auxilleries, then when
> *those* were abolished we joined the Scout
> Supporters Association.
>
> Some envious Scout Leaders objected to us
> giving the money we earned to our old Scout
> Group as we didn't belong to it any longer, and
> as members of the SSA we 'should put any money
> nwe made into the District coffers, so we
> coffed, waved two fingers at SSA and became a
> partnership and earned money in the usual way,
> and did with it what we wanted.
>

~~~
Rover Scouts. What a great program for young
adults... sounds like you learned a lot.

From wiki-do: "Rovers often participate in
adventurous activities like mountain climbing,
white water rafting, or para-sailing. Rovers also
help their local communities by running service
activities such as food drives, park clean-ups,
and tree plantings. Rovers meet in a group called
a Crew."

"[...]... it can provide an environment in which
each young person can undertake personal searches
and life decisions with the support of his/her
peers and other more experienced persons."

So it's sort of like our Boy Scouts (who also
plant trees and river raft) and Girl Scouts (who
do a lot more than sell cookies).

~~~

> Howsomedever, we didn't do much on fruit trees,
> but I did a bit at home, where we had 36 fruit
> trees in the garden, mainly apples, but also
> pears, a greengage, a damson and a peach. I
> learned a lot from my grandfather, who was an
> expert in almost everything he touched, and he
> taught me how to graft and bud hardwoods. (His
> expertise lay mainly in roses, but the
> principle's the same.)
>

~~~
Bless those dear grandfathers who love us and
teach us. Mine knew everything there was to know
about horses... taught me how to make a poultice
from a weed we call Dock to heal everything from
open wounds to nettle stings.
~~~

> My garden (sadly neglected now I'm laid-up)
> boasts a 'family tree' of apples: James Grieve
> and I think, Blenheim, onto which I intend

> grafting several other varieties to replace the

~~~
Thank you for all that, I understand you better
now... and wish you could be out taking care of
your trees and vines again.

v

--
https://www.thefarside.com/

[RustyHinge]

On 03/10/2021 12:13, VictoriaB wrote:
>
> Bless those dear grandfathers who love us and
> teach us. Mine knew everything there was to know
> about horses... taught me how to make a poultice
> from a weed we call Dock to heal everything from
> open wounds to nettle stings.
>

Dock, family of plants. Alkaline sap, good for (acidic) bee and ant
stings as well as nettles. Wopses have alkaline stings, so an acid leaf
or similar is required. Best remedy is to cut an On!on across and rub it
on the sting entry. Works for hornets TAAAW.

I used to brew a remedy for colds, which I invented. One of my fiends
had a streaming cold and nothing the doctor or chemist could provide
dented it. I told him "Come back tomorrow..."

I consulted my Culpepper and several other tomes and concocted an
evil-smelling liquid containing everything I could find that was
indicated as a specific against colds, flu, etc. I can't unforget
everything, but it included lots of garlic, On!on, hips, haws, mallow
root, apple, lemon, unpasteurised honey, blackcurrant, willow bark,
brandy, etc.

Horrid yellow-ochre thick gunge with a smell worse than a dead ferret
resulted. I told him: "Hold your nose and take a tablespoon of it.
Repeat if necessary."

It wasn't - whatever it was it didn't want to meet another dose, and it
had gorn by the next morning.

When he went overland to India some time later I made him another batch,
bottled it in a medicine bottle and using indian ink (indelibubble,
see...) made a label including all the contents using their latin names
- tinc, this, ol. that (eg. Tinc Malva, Ol. Allium). Customs worldwide
seldom question medicines.

I call the remedy "Dr. Struckoff's Universal Panacea"

[RustyHinge]

On 03/10/2021 12:13, VictoriaB wrote:
>

> So it's sort of like our Boy Scouts (who also
> plant trees and river raft) and Girl Scouts (who
> do a lot more than sell cookies).

So your BOy Scouts are rather like our Boy Scouts (name now just
'Scouts) founded by Robert Baden Powell in 1907 in this country, from
where the movement has spread throughout the world.

Originally Boy Scouts, followed by Wolf Cubs, then Rover Scouts, then
Senior Scouts, and messed-with continuously since.

Now, girls who don't want to be a Girl Guide can join the Scouts.
<Sniff> I woz borned before my time innit,

[Ahem A Rivet's Shot]

On Sun, 3 Oct 2021 16:23:10 +0100
RustyHinge <rusty...@foobar.girolle.co.uk> wrote:

> Originally Boy Scouts, followed by Wolf Cubs, then Rover Scouts, then
> Senior Scouts, and messed-with continuously since.

Indeed in my day it was Cubs then Scouts and there were Eagle and
Venture Scouts but I disunforget which of the two was senior. The girls had
Brownies then Girl Guides and I have no idea what else there may have been
for them by the time the Eagles Ventured forth in search of a new adventure.

--
Steve O'Hara-Smith
Odds and Ends at http://www.sohara.org/

[Andrew Marshall]

Thank 'ee kindly. If and when the Circs. again permit, I may start
travelling about again, but until then, I'm not going out anywhere
unless I have to (e.g. to have a booster vaccination).

--
Regards,
Andrew.

[Ben Newsam]

RustyHinge wrote, though the Organization header says "Diss
Organisation":

>I call the remedy "Dr. Struckoff's Universal Panacea"

"Snibbo, the universal nostrum", from the world of Beachcomber, by
J.B.Morton
--
Ben

[VictoriaB]

RustyHinge wrote:
> On 03/10/2021 12:13, VictoriaB wrote:
>>
>> So it's sort of like our Boy Scouts (who
>> also plant trees and river raft) and Girl
>> Scouts (who do a lot more than sell
>> cookies).
>
> So your BOy Scouts are rather like our Boy
> Scouts (name now just 'Scouts) founded by
> Robert Baden Powell in 1907 in this country,
> from where the movement has spread throughout

> the world. [..]

~~~
Yes, I saw that while researching - most said the
Boy Scout movement was founded in Great Britain in
1908 - the first Boy Scout was a British Baron.
The Boy Scouts of America was founded in Feb. 1910.

I also found out that US newspaperman, W.R. Hearst
founded his own youth organization in May 1910 -
the American Boy Scouts (ABS). His group went on
outdoor trips and volunteered just like the BSA,
but they also carried firearms. They had mock
battles and drills, and the boys shot at each
other with blanks!

My word! Thank goodness that BSA sued the
gun-totin' counterpart and received an injunction
preventing them from using the terms "Boy Scouts"
or "scouting" in any way, shape or form.

I was never a Girl Scout, but was a member of the
4-H Club - a farm group. I won blue ribbons in
baking and horse show competitions.

v

--
https://www.thefarside.com/

[RustyHinge]

4-H - that's quite a hard pencil... And I trust you won the blue ribbon
as rider/groom/ w.h.y? and not as one of the hosses?

[VictoriaB]

RustyHinge wrote:
> On 03/10/2021 12:13, VictoriaB wrote:
>>
>> Bless those dear grandfathers who love us
>> and teach us. Mine knew everything there was
>> to know about horses... taught me how to make
>> a poultice from a weed we call Dock to heal
>> everything from open wounds to nettle
>> stings.
>>
> Dock, family of plants. Alkaline sap, good for
> (acidic) bee and ant stings as well as
> nettles. Wopses have alkaline stings, so an
> acid leaf or similar is required. Best remedy
> is to cut an On!on across and rub it on the
> sting entry. Works for hornets TAAAW.
>

~~~
We used the Dock paste on horses, people from
miles around would bring their sick horses to my
grandpa, who knew all sorts of "natural" remedies.
~~~

~~~
You are a regular shaman!

Aunties in my family used to send me to gather
this tall weed called Yarrow (white flowers),
which they would hang upside down in the barn to
dry. Then they'd grind the flowers into a powder
and make a tea that would fight colds.

And if we kids were getting a sore throat - they'd
make us take big spoonfuls of a syrup made from
boiled wild onions and honey. Yucky, but it worked.

v

--
https://www.thefarside.com/

[VictoriaB]

~~~
LOL... Well Mr. Smartypants, we rode our horses
around the arena, stopped, left turn, right turn,
backed up, then forward at a gallop. Horses were
judged by their performance, riders by
horsemanship. And we were both groomed to the nth
degree.
v
--
https://www.thefarside.com/

[RustyHinge]

I know how to make it rain, too. Gather 22 people and dress them in
white, Distribute 11 of them around 6 sticks knocked into the ground, in
a pair of groups a chain apart. Add two judges, one at either end of the
chain, and then take two of the remaining 11 and equip them with a
willow plank with a handle, and deploy them so they can defend their 3
sticks against a leather-covered bamboo ball,bamboo-root ball hurled by
one of the 11 white-clad half.

Change hurler every six deliveries. If it's not raining immediately, run
for cover - it will very shortly.

> Aunties in my family used to send me to gather
> this tall weed called Yarrow (white flowers),
> which they would hang upside down  in the barn to
> dry. Then they'd grind the flowers into a powder
> and make a tea that would fight colds.
>
> And if we kids were getting a sore throat - they'd
> make us take big spoonfuls of a syrup made from
> boiled wild onions and honey. Yucky, but it worked.

Oh aye:
Dr Struckoff's Panacea contained yarrow TAAAW. There was more, but I
disunforget the exact list - it was, after all, around 1970.

[Ben Newsam]

VictoriaB wrote, though the Organization header says "Aioe.org NNTP
Server":

>
>And if we kids were getting a sore throat - they'd
>make us take big spoonfuls of a syrup made from
>boiled wild onions and honey. Yucky, but it worked.

I remember you gave us the recipe for that. I actually made some. As
you say, yucky, lol
--
Ben

[Ahem A Rivet's Shot]

On Mon, 4 Oct 2021 14:00:29 +0100
RustyHinge <rusty...@foobar.girolle.co.uk> wrote:

> I know how to make it rain, too. Gather 22 people and dress them in
> white, Distribute 11 of them around 6 sticks knocked into the ground, in

There is another method, but it has to take place in certain
hallowed grounds with several instances of the ceremony going on at once
for best results - even then it can take several days in the height of
summer when it is usually performed.

It involves stretching a waist high net across a finely mowed lawn
marked out with carefully measured white lines and having two people (one
on each side of the net) in short white clothing use oversized fly-swatters
to propel a small, bouncy ball backwards and forwards over the net obeying
complex rules about where it may bounce with respect to the white lines. A
number of extras are required for maximum effect including some children to
fetch stray balls, someone with a finger on the net to detect impact and a
number of observers along the lines and one on a (very) high chair making
final decisions on scoring.

[Adrian]

In message <20211004150344.b35e...@eircom.net>, Ahem A
Rivet's Shot <ste...@eircom.net> writes

Ah, is this the right place for this ?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JmLI7gmy7y8

[Ben Newsam]

Ahem A Rivet's Shot wrote, though the Organization header says "A
noiseless patient Spider":

Much easier just to wash one's car.
--
Ben

[VictoriaB]

~~~
I had forgotten all about that! Do you remember if
it helped? My folks used to say 'for every disease
of man, nature has a remedy.'

Example: The bark of the Pacific Yew tree in
Calif. produces a drug used in the treatment of
breast, lung, and ovarian cancer... shrinks
tumors, etc. So the lumber companies should leave
them alone.

Also this: "The tree that could help stop the
pandemic - <https://www.theatlantic.com › Oct
21, 2020 — The rare Chilean Soapbark tree produces
compounds that can boost the body's reaction to
vaccines."

Rare because they're cutting down Chile's rain
forests.

v - gets down off soapbox, goes to scramba eggs

--
https://www.thefarside.com/

[VictoriaB]

Ben Newsam wrote:
> Ahem A Rivet's Shot wrote, though the
> Organization header says "A noiseless patient
> Spider":
>
>> On Mon, 4 Oct 2021 14:00:29 +0100 RustyHinge
>> <rusty...@foobar.girolle.co.uk> wrote:
>>
>>> I know how to make it rain, too. Gather 22
>>> people and dress them in white, Distribute
>>> 11 of them around 6 sticks knocked into the
>>> ground, in
>>
>> There is another method, but it has to take
>> place in certain hallowed grounds with
>> several instances of the ceremony going on at
>> once for best results - even then it can take
>> several days in the height of summer when it
>> is usually performed.
>>
>> It involves stretching a waist high net
>> across a finely mowed lawn marked out with
>> carefully measured white lines and having two
>> people (one on each side of the net) in short
>> white clothing use oversized fly-swatters to
>> propel a small, bouncy ball backwards and

>> forwards over the net...[...]

>
> Much easier just to wash one's car.
>

~~~
Or plan an outdoor wedding.
v

--
https://www.thefarside.com/

[Mike Fleming]

On 03/10/2021 18:05, Ahem A Rivet's Shot wrote:
> On Sun, 3 Oct 2021 16:23:10 +0100
> RustyHinge <rusty...@foobar.girolle.co.uk> wrote:
>
>> Originally Boy Scouts, followed by Wolf Cubs, then Rover Scouts, then
>> Senior Scouts, and messed-with continuously since.
>
> Indeed in my day it was Cubs then Scouts and there were Eagle and
> Venture Scouts but I disunforget which of the two was senior. The girls had
> Brownies then Girl Guides and I have no idea what else there may have been
> for them by the time the Eagles Ventured forth in search of a new adventure.

WhenIwerealad it was Cubs, Scouts, Ventures, and Brownies, Guides,
Rangers. The Venture Scouts allowed girls in the year after I left to go
to university (1976).

[Ahem A Rivet's Shot]

On Tue, 5 Oct 2021 18:39:37 +0100
Mike Fleming <mi...@tauzero.co.uk> wrote:

> WhenIwerealad it was Cubs, Scouts, Ventures, and Brownies, Guides,
> Rangers. The Venture Scouts allowed girls in the year after I left to go

Ah Rangers that were it.

> to university (1976).

Only a couple of years before me (and I took most of a year out
between A levels and university), but no Eagle scouts ?

[Kerr-Mudd, John]

On Tue, 5 Oct 2021 18:39:37 +0100
Mike Fleming <mi...@tauzero.co.uk> wrote:

[]
> go to university (1976).


I went back recently (virtually, using Google Streetview) and about
half of it is different!

(Esp sad to see old boozing haunts demolished).

--
Bah, and indeed Humbug.

[Adrian]

In message <20211006092229.34fc...@127.0.0.1>,
"Kerr-Mudd, John" <ad...@127.0.0.1> writes

>On Tue, 5 Oct 2021 18:39:37 +0100
>Mike Fleming <mi...@tauzero.co.uk> wrote:
>[]
>> go to university (1976).
>
>
>I went back recently (virtually, using Google Streetview) and about
>half of it is different!
>

Sadly, I think mine is pretty much as it was when I left it. It was a
dump then, and the best part of 40 years later, it won't have improved
much.

[Ahem A Rivet's Shot]

On Wed, 6 Oct 2021 09:22:29 +0100
"Kerr-Mudd, John" <ad...@127.0.0.1> wrote:

> On Tue, 5 Oct 2021 18:39:37 +0100
> Mike Fleming <mi...@tauzero.co.uk> wrote:
> []
> > go to university (1976).
>
>
> I went back recently (virtually, using Google Streetview) and about
> half of it is different!

I went back physically a couple of years ago after thirty years
away from the town where I grew up and went to university[1].

The colleges were of course almost completely unchanged[2], thirty
years is an eyeblink to them ... except that it was no longer possible to
walk in and out freely, the gates were almost all either closed with a card
scanner or guarded by porters - who were at least willing to take my word
that I was an old member. Once within the colleges there were prescribed
routes for tourists and sections that were off limits in some colleges.

I did check a number of the informal traditions and found that they
were all still being kept up - again an eyeblink.

The town had grown suburbs over the fields I used to play in, a lot
of gates and barriers on what were once simple cul-de-sacs or loop roads
and a *lot* more people and cars. Very few of the old shops remained
(even some of the venerable[3] pubs were gone), although I did talk to the
(middle aged) children who had taken over a coffee stall that I remember
being started by a young man (their father). There was a tacky monument to
one much loved street character, but nothing for the two equally loved
contemporaries including the only tramp[4] to have an entry in a tourist
guide.

All in all the place was a lot less pleasant than it was when I
left, but then the trends were in motion when I left and were part of the
reason for leaving so I shouldn't have been surprised and I wasn't, just
saddened.

[1] Cambridge
[2] Let's gloss over the controversial conversion of third court lawn into
something vaguely Japanese. It seems I am not alone in preferring the lawn
that had been there for a very long time.
[3] Not venereal! Put Frank's glarses back.
[4] Old Trevor.

[Ben Newsam]

Ahem A Rivet's Shot wrote, though the Organization header says "A
noiseless patient Spider":

>[4] Old Trevor.

What about Snowy, with the mouse running round his hat?
--
Ben